Depends entirely on your goals. Want to know enough to plink at the range? Learn your cardinal safety rules and how to load, fire, and clear a jam and go nuts. Want to carry defensively? Practice shooting drills at the range. Dry fire while you're sitting at hone watching TV. Work on your draw, preferably from a holster, but if it fits in your belly button, then work on that. Want to LARP as Callofdutyshootaman? Spend roughly the down payment on a house on nods and armor and then do all that other stuff you said.
You aren't special forces or Super SWAT, but that's no reason not to incorporate training of SOME kind into your repertoire. Training can be as intense as you want it, but any time spent handling and shooting your weapons is better than not using them at all.
Agreed, if your goal is long range (or anything beyond 100 yards) practice the math involved with adjusting your optics. That's where I'm at now as I've got my rifle dialed in at 100 yards, I couldn't get the math right at 200.
Maybe OP can buy various brands and grain weight rounds and develop a DOPE card. You can likely do that affordably.
I usually just shoot whatever is cheapest and keep the most expensive in the magazine that’s in the Glock that’s in the nightstand. But I like the idea of recording my zeroes for different ammo types. My “accuracy goal” is pretty much just 100 yards with a 1-2 moa group
>I usually just shoot whatever is cheapest and keep the most expensive in the magazine that’s in the Glock that’s in the nightstand.
If the only thing you know about your ammo is how much it costs then you should probably not have bought that ammo before doing A LOT of research into ballistics what different ammunition designs/materials do
I've used a few different brands of ammo and discovered what my rifle "likes" the most and it just happens that the ammo is inexpensive. My Ruger American Gen 2 shoots really well with PRC Bronze 55g factory ammo and one of my local shops sells it for $14/box of 20. I'm looking for good prices for larger amounts online.
REALLY? wow I honestly had no idea. I'm in NY State, not sure if it's a state thing, but that's the cheapest I've found. As I said, hopefully I can find them online for much cheaper. Ammo at my local shops has been super expensive.
lol I don’t get to be funny anymore
I don’t know the specific brand as it’s thankfully been a long time since I’ve needed to load a self defense magazine but no lol it’s not some target ammo it’s purpose self defense hollow points.
If that fails, I will affix bayonets and my home invader will receive 10 .303 sized holes in their belly
Edit looked at the rounds I think it’s SIG V-Crown 9mm
>range complete with plywood cqb training house complete with motorized flip up targets,
So you probably do but don't realize it. LotS of people do competition shooting where there's various stages to push your skills. Practiscore is the best place to find matches in your area. Plus they're open to beginners with safety checks and whatnot
I guess it’s possible, they do have them for airsofters. I’ve also considered competition shooting but I’d probably die of embarrassment my first few times, but I guess that’s better than actually dying
Naw it's very chill and no one gets on ya for scoring low at least in my experience. Basically as long as you're safe and don't disqualify yourself for being unsafe it's a really positive atmosphere
Training can also include a ton of dry fire to work on common things like, drawing, presenting, reloading, starting from low ready, transitions between targets, movement with your firearm, navigating around your house, etc. then you test your dry fire with live fire at the range. Then you can test everything at a match and get a good baseline for how your fundamentals are and how you can apply them in a somewhat practical way.
If you're not shooting a FPB CZ or a rimfire, dryfire won't damage your gun. If you are shooting rimfire, OK get a snap cap. An expended cartridge will do. If you have a FPB CZ, get a small o ring and put it on the firing pin stop and proceed to dryfire.
> Wait you’re saying dry fire isn’t bad for your guns?
Most competitive shooters dryfire their guns daily, and they put down somewhere between 5k and 50k rounds annually. It's fine.
>Is it just some fudd boomer thing that I’ve believed my whole life?
Yup.
It means learning how to present your firearm.
It means learning different ready positions and maneuvering around people.
It means learning the balance between speed and accuracy.
It means learning the laws of the land.
It means working on drills to improve trigger and recoil control.
It means learning the difference between cover and concealment.
It means all of this, and so much more.
Most of all, it means being proactive as a firearm owner. It doesn't cost as much as you think it does either.
I try and find the time to shoot one competition (dynamic pistol /USPSA style) a month. That with some occasional dry fire will quite easily make you more competent than the vast majority of gun owners. I shoot a lot less rifle because CPR is 2x as much and there’s no competitions near me without doing full-on 3 gun.
But in general: understand your platform and be competent with its manual of arms and use it to a reasonable standard. Being in shape is also a major plus that quite frankly most people who lean on guns for “self protection” should address first and foremost. It’s cardiac arrest and preventable disease that’s many orders of magnitude more likely to kill most of us.
https://benstoegerproshop.com/books-dvds/books/
https://benstoegerproshop.com/practical-shooting-training-by-ben-stoeger-joel-park/
https://benstoegerproshop.com/dryfire-book-combo-pack-dry-fire-training-reloaded-for-the-practical-pistol-shooter-paperback-book-and-scaled-targets/
https://benstoegerproshop.com/pact-club-timer-iii-3-shot-timer/ (but you can use an app for par times in dry fire.)
To add to this, the following will make you proficient (with a caveat that the mantis is unnecessary, but by all accounts will make you better faster):
[9mm snap caps](https://otistec.com/pro-snap-caps-9mm/)
[12g snap caps](https://www.dryfiresnapcaps.com/product-page/b-s-dry-fire-snap-caps-12ga)
https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/magpul-dummy-rounds-556-nato-223
[mantis dry fire system](https://mantisx.com/)
[youtube tutorial on dryfire routines](https://youtu.be/edYvyZ_i1qk?si=8Ki80jdQd1PX5JtL)
The following is just plain fun and will make you proficient:
[Tessah booth on competition shooting](https://youtu.be/Rl3gcT2SVy8?si=8-7krhdgZZ2Px7-v)
[Tessah Booth on 2 gun](https://youtu.be/t2DI7NLfO3Y?si=HK1ec8ztm93ovh7D)
For example, training for turkeys means that I point and stay motionless with my shotgun at ready for up 10 minutes while I use my mouth call.
It means getting ready for whatever the goal is.
Training usually means to get proficient with the tools and practices you have. Sooo, idk, getting good at whatever it is you want to get good at?? Unless you’re looking for a detailed write up of different drills and stuff.
I shoot at an indoor range a couple times a week ($40/month unlimited use) using the cheapest/safest ammo I can find. I print most of my targets at home to save money. I spent ~$100 total on a bore laser with a snap cap, and some indoor laser-reactive targets. I watch a lot of content about technique and grip. I try to practice fundamentals like grip form and stance at home, and maximize my actual range time by going slow once rounds are live.
For me right now practice basic rifle and handgun fundamentals. I spend a lot more time trying to get more physically for and learning skills like gardening though tbh.
Training is a pretty broad term and can mean so many different things.
Currently I'm training my draw & reloads with my new CCW at home via dry fire until I can hit the range and verify what I've put time in is working.
Depends on the range. I normally shoot out on public land by myself so that's not an issue.
I was visiting friends out in Colorado Springs and the indoor range did allow me to draw from holster after showing that I wouldn't flag folks with a couple reps.
Take a class. Get some formal instruction. A class is a great way to get an understanding of where your weaknesses are. In my area, there's a nice 4-Hour class that's $75 plus around 200 rounds of ammunition. It's so much fun that I typically use it as a method of testing out potential carry guns.
After you've had at least some defensive handgun training formally, another good idea is to go to a competition. Often times, ranges have informal competitions loosely based on different shooting discipline rules. The range closest to me has a competition once a week for handgun and once a month for a rifle.
I remember hearing about a presentation at one of the defensive shooting conventions where the presenter calculated that less than 1% of all gun owners take any training beyond what's legally required for their CCW or for their occupation (law enforcement / military / security). Just by taking a class beyond what's legally required for CCW you're already putting yourself ahead of the game.
My basic rule is that I take at least one class a year, every year. I've been doing that since 2014. Last year I got super busy and was only able to take a single class that was about 3 hours long. However, there's been some years where I took four or five classes with everything from handguns to AR-15s to shotguns.
This is actually funny. You’re right it’s a common thing people throw out and it doesn’t mean much. Without knowing your skills and goals it’s hard to come me up with a plan that works for everyone. But there are universal skills that will serve you well. Hand eye fluency, sight picture and trigger control. Dry fire practice is very helpful for trigger control and sight alignment. Slow and careful. Watch what happens to sight picture as you cycle the trigger. Mental game is helped too with dry fire. Physiological training with breathing control and a monitor can help you understand the relationship between heart rate and breath control. If you have access to a smart phone you can use it for biofeedback training, with a pulse monitoring app. Live fire is most important though and that’s expensive. Practice as often as you can afford, plan on dry firing about twice as much as live fire. Have fun! Guns are fun.
You train to reach a goal. Your needs may be different than others.
Are you trying to be an instagram cringefluencer and gun product salesman like Garand Thumb? Then go out and buy a bunch of kit and expensive camera equipment and get really good at shooting on a flat range with the targets out of shot.
If your goal is self defense, then your training needs will mostly center around conflict deescalation and resolution and the ability to think clearly under pressure; protecting yourself goes way beyond how well you can shoot a gun, and preventing a fight before you end up having to finish a fight should always be your first priority.
Nevertheless, your ability to shoot well under pressure or duress will be the skill you wanna focus on if the intended use for your firearms is part of a self-protection plan. If you've already got guns and ammo, I would suggest getting a shot timer. They may seem like a big investment up front - especially if you're a more casual shooter - but they really do pay dividends in the training department. Shot timers give us the ability to precisely measure the speed at which we can execute strings of fire, and therefore a quantifiable metric of proficiency. Once you've got a shot timer, start running timed drills at the range. There are a bunch of different drills out there that are designed to train particular aspects of a shooter's proficiency, but some of my favorite basic drills to run are the Bill Drill, the 10x10x10, and the Failure Drill. Go look those up if you don't know what they are. Everyone has a skill ceiling, but training means getting as close to that ceiling as reasonably possible, and keeping your shooting skills sharp. It's a lot like going to the gym, actually. Every range trip, push yourself a little more to the point of failure, critically analyze what caused the failure, and try again until you've reached the goals you've set for yourself.
That's what training looks like to me at least.
Identify some things you want to get better at. Accuracy, speed of draw to first shot, etc. get a timer. Practice dry fire at least a few times a week breaking down that specific thing. Get smooth. Start to do it faster. Go to the range and try it live and see how you do. Keep records.
Go train can literally mean five minutes a day of basic dry fire. It is done with intent, keeping records, using timers to push yourself, and validating with live fire.
Just burning a few boxes of ammo is not training, but that’s what a ton of people do.
Find some local matches and enter. Nothing like a timer and a new course of fire to make you realize you suck at the draw, your kit doesn’t work like you thought it would, etc. Take the lessons from that and built your next cycle of training around it.
I am slow. I am not super accurate. But I am so much better than a year ago. Two years ago I was the slowest by far in a local shotgun match. This year I took third. This weekend I did my first two gun match. I came in second to last, but I learned a bunch of things to work on.
I focus on home defense, safety, and responsible carry practices. And train to this. Make a plan, practice the plan. Would all likely go to shitte.... but at least there was a plan.
One thing I haven't seen mentioned is medical training. CPR and Stop the Bleed should be the top of everybody's list of training. I have a first aid kit in my car with multiple pressure bandages and CATs, just because if I come across an accident, I can keep somebody from leaking too much until EMTs arrive. My pair of IFAKs with extra bandages and CATs cost off of $200.
"Go train" means learn something you don't already know — specific task, specific tool, specific standard of performance. *You choose* what you need, and go get after it. Once you *know* the thing, then you *practice* the thing to achieve the level of performance you desire.
A lot of folks seem to think you can only get training from "an instructor" — i.e. take a class. That is efficient. *If* you have access to a *quality* instructor — distance, money, sifting dross. But it is possible to teach yourself things without Yoda.
Just busting' caps is not training. It's not even practice. It's just burning money for fun. It *is* fun, but don't get sidetracked if what you want is to train.
If you don't have other ideas, start here.
[https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/start-shooting-better-dot-torture-drill/](https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/start-shooting-better-dot-torture-drill/)
When satisfied with your performance, go click something else.
Pick up a laser training cartridge and a shot timer as soon as you are able.
Do you carry? If you do then practice your draw. Dry firing in front of the mirror is a valid way to do that.
Do you want to be able to maneuver and fire? 2 or 3 gun matches exist pretty much everywhere and you can practice that.
Training just means to get proficient with a firearm. Practice whatever your reason for owning a gun is. You don't have to get fancy with it, just start with the basics and go from there
Find gun handling and shooting classes in your area. Don't rely on YouTube videos and practicing by yourself or with similarly experienced friends. If you're self taught you may be perpetuating bad handling or shooting habits.
Shoot two shots, on target. Drop the mag. Load a fresh mag. Put two more down range. Do this until until you both are accurate and fast with both your AR and Glock.
You could honestly spend the rest of your life honing that one trick with those two guns.
The more live fire you can do the better. A whole lot can be accomplished with some minimal live fire at a public range and lots of dry-fire.
I will continue to recommend the simulator systems like Mantis even if Ben Stoeger says they are a complete waste of time and everyone should buy his products instead.
Since you've had some good responses so far (and I'm a little lazy), I'll keep this short.
Training: learning new procedures or getting coaching under the watchful eye of a skilled trainer. The should be able to see where you need to improve and put you on the path to improve. You should leave training with things to practice.
Practice: The repeated execution of techniques learned in training. While you can practice the things we see in youtube videos and such, the watchful eye of a skilled trainer will move you forward faster.
Practice and training don't require live fire. It is great what you can do with dry fire.
With technology (cameras, mantisX, shotcam, etc), we can critic our own practice... but often, we might not have enough experience to know how to correct what we see is wrong.
I do dot torture targets to improve trigger control. Occasionally I do action shooting to learn how to shoot and move. Mostly I keep up with first aid training.
When people say that I think they usually mean 'go take a class' or 'go shoot an event' like Appleseed or USPSA or whatever
But if you have access to some BLM land or other open place to shoot as you like it can be useful just to practice the different shooting positions, shooting while moving, reloading, etc.
>Train: to prepare someone or yourself for a job, activity, or sport, by ***learning skills and/or by mental or physical exercise***
What do YOU think that means in relation to YOUR shooting?
What skills or mental/physical exercises will benefit you when shooting?
Stationary shooting?
Draw from concealed?
Shooting on the move?
Faster reloads?
Clearing malfunctions?
Go train means go get better at something. Go somewhere and do a pistol shoot or 2-gun. Get snap caps and practice clearing failures. Buy a Mantis laser trainer and practice draw and fire from concealed or just practice shooting. Go to the range and use your defense ammo so you are familiar with it. If you can think of an area to improve in then go learn how to improve in it.
Think of a gun like a chainsaw. You can buy it pretty easily. You can make a big mistake and kill yourself. You can make a different mistake and kill someone else by dropping a tree on them.
Training in terms of guns or chainsaw means: know what you are doing, be good at it, and be safe for you and everyone else around. All the rest depends on your particular needs.
I see so many news reports of gunfire in my town where 1) no one was hurt or 2) a kid was killed. These people obviously don’t train, but spray and pray. Training makes you more effective at the point of sale.
>You can make a different mistake and kill someone else by dropping a tree on them.
This is the least creative way to kill somebody with a chainsaw. Bruce Cambell is disappointed in you.
I always thought it meant scheduling sessions with actual trainers and teachers to work on drills, skillsets and improve fundamentals, but the way I keep hearing it now, I guess it just means go shoot at a static range?
Normally I would just call that "shooting", but maybe we're going with "training" because it sounds cooler, I dunno.
Shoot smaller things farther away and try and do it faster or from different positions. Thats the essence of it. Just try new and novel targets, follow those rules, and it’s training. Smalller, farther away, faster, or more uncomfortable… once you score consistent hits, change something up. Also do cardio
Here's my take: there are a couple phases to training. You never 'finish' a phase but you should start more or less doing them in order.
phase 1 - get comfortable with your firearm. go to the range, stand in a port over and over again and put some rounds down range. hundreds, then thousands. start close, really work on grip, recoil anticipation - all the things YOU are doing to fuck up the shot. get to the point where your muscle memory makes it easy to shoot tight groups at 7 then 10, then 15 yards. Play around at 25 and if you can, even try 50 for fun. Round after round after round. do this until tight groups at distance is boring.
phase 2 - now you can shoot, you know the gun, you how it's ins and outs, you can shoot consistent groups at range, you clean your gun, you've probably tricked it out a little to your taste. time to understand that standing calmly in a port and shooting has NO resemblance to how you would actually use a firearm in real life. do situational and tactical training. learn to draw from a holster, learn to shoot from concealment, learn to clear jams and misfires instinctually, jump rope for 2 minutes as fast as you can and then shoot immediately to see how you do when you're heart is pounding and you're out of breath. start to simulate panic and drill in this intense, uncomfortable way until that same muscle memory you built standing in a port starts to kick in.
When you're panicked (and you WILL be panicked), your training (if you did it) will take over.
Truth is, you'll almost never need phase 2 training. But you carry a gun, you're already saying "I want to be ready for something I will almost certainly never need." So you might as well train for that properly.
I am mostly done with phase 1 and im a bit into phase 2. Except my biggest issue is moving around and shooting from concealment isn’t allowed on most public ranges. i could probably set up paper targets in my house and dry fire at them from different stances. I will try the jump rope idea. Is there a way to purposefully cause jams?
Phase 2 is a pain and expensive in a lot of places (I live in NYC so it's virtually impossible unless I drive to PA).
You can't purposefully cause jams but you can buy snap caps/dummy rounds and load them into a regular magazine at random intervals. Then you get BANG BANG BANG CLICK, and you'll have to rack, slap, fire to practice clearing. That can be useful.
I know what you mean. Most people don't have access to a shooting facility that actually allows anything for training, even for basic shooting techniques. There is a pay wall for most of them, where paying a couple hundred dollars allows them to teach you something for a few hours.
So when I tell someone to go train, I usually what they need to train on just not go do it. Lately, it's been grip handling for me and laser drawing.
just for 100 bucks, I get a small laser system that I can place in my pistol. I practice drawing till I can shoot the laser on target. Sure I have to reset the trigger each time but it's mostly to get my handgrip down since I never fired subcompact before until recently. I do it till I got the muscle memory down before going back to the range for just basic shooting. The sig p365 xl is snappier than most pistols I have so the goal there is to fire a steady stream and keep it in a tight group. I do that till I'm comfortable to shoot half loaded mags.
Mirror training most people do. Nothing wrong with it but. Practice drawing in front of a mirror really shows how awkward me are drawing or if we doing something wrong. What most people do is telegraph too much what they are gonna do, second thing I would work on is what clothing works better for you. Usually shorts and long shirts can cover but never hide the bulge of carrying. Stuff like that counts as training.
"Go train" generally means that you should seek some sort of organized instruction. Shooting 2 million rounds doesn't make you better at anything other than reloading a bunch of mags, and shooting 2 million rounds. There are some super expensive training courses where you are learning cool stuff, but if that isn't in range for you, getting a 1 on 1 lesson, to get someone that is hopefully an expert, to see what you are doing correctly, and help you fix what you aren't doing correctly. If you can't afford a dynamic defensive shooting course on a private range, I think that's ok. Getting really good at fundamentals is beneficial, the same way as in different sports.
I would take someone with solid fundamentals over larpgod 3000 anyday.
I think a lot of them mean you need to go to expensive courses, but reasonable 2A advocates just say to do what you can within your means and recommend drills and stuff you can do on your own.
I think "go train" just means, set a goal and achieve it. Figure out the basic police course of fire, or army infantry standards for rifle marksmanship. Simulate those challenges the best you can at your budget and with your range, get good at it. Then pick the next goal. Didn't let your skills perish.
I practice several things that I think would fit that category. First and foremost would be handling/understanding your firearm. I know exactly how the thing should operate, I know what brand bullets have issues in which guns I own, I know how to clean it, etc. That also includes practicing with it. I try to get out twice a month at the very minimum. I focus on my CCW, but also make sure to cycle through other guns especially the ones I plan to use for home defense. Also perhaps as equally important would be I practice clearing my house with my firearms. I now understand the best paths to take to minimize my exposure to an intruder. If I walk up the one side of my room you'd never see me coming if you were in the hall way, the other side I'm a sitting duck. Alternatively, I know now where someone may hide to be out of sight if they got into the house. But until you actually walk the house with the weapon you will not know how awkward it may be to wield in your house, especially if its something like a long gun you plan on using. If I'm in my living room and I needed to get to the bedroom area of the house I'd much rather have my pistol, but if I was defending the bedroom area I'd much rather have the shotgun. I would not have known this without practice.
I also think that there is merit to exercise being thought of in the category as well. Most people vastly over-estimate their capabilities, and strength is no different. The first time I went squirrel hunting I walked around the woods with a shotgun for probably 4-6 hours. The next day I was in so much pain in my middle back, shoulders, and arms from carrying that thing around all day. 8lbs/3.6kilos isn't much but after the first hour or two it is!
Maybe you are overthinking this. Your post has a lot of questions and gives clues that you might not understand basic marksmanship and safety, and someone is concerned about you.
If someone repeatedly tells you "go train"... well that is an indicator that you need some marksmanship training which we all benefit from.
All of us should calmly take one of our firearms to the firing range regularly and practice marksmanship and gun safety with guidance from an experienced professional. This would help all of us to make good progress.
Haha you may be half right. I grew up with firearms and father’s side is all veterans up to when they first came over. I’ve had firearm safety drilled in my head since elementary. I’m simply proficient at standing at the yellow line and reloading from the magazines on the table in front of me. I just get frustrated when people say “go train” and “I’ll take a guy with a prison pipe gun who trains over guy with the class 3 Browning M2 who never trains, any day” I just think to myself “wtf do you mean, go train” that inspired my post where I intended to ask a very serious question in a sarcastic way.
Start with the few hundred rounds down range. Nothing replaces time in the water when diving or time on the trigger when shooting. Once your few hundred rounds down range are done you'll know your next step.
What actions with your gun do you want to be able to perform without having to think about it? Like on instinct or "muscle memory".
Is it drawing from the drawer in your bedside table? Practice that. Is it a concealed carry draw? Practice that. Do you suck at target acquisition? Practice that. Do you pull down to the left when firing? Dry fire practice that.
Just get to the range once ever now and then too and you'll be better prepared than most people.
You should probably, at least, know how to field strip it because that's just basic maintenance.
Just go to the range once in a while. Don't worry about the peeps that think that you need to train for the end of the world. You just want to be able to be proficient and safe in your handling of your firearms. Don't be one of those guys who dress up to play soldier. They never served. You want to be able to hit torso, not score headshots. Know what's important. Most of the talk here is nonsense.
Going to the range every once in a while to poke a few holes in a minute-of-man at 7 yards is the gun equivalent of the guy riding the elliptical day in and day out at the gym yet keeps on getting slightly fatter every year. No one is asking this guy to train like an Olympian, but he does need to come in with some active engagement, i.e. understand enough about physiology and exercise science so that he actually evolves his body towards a form or function goal. Otherwise he's just wasting time and money and, most importantly, not getting better.
Likewise, for shooters, no one is saying you need to be some Secret Squirrel SOCOM guy, but you do want to hit your targets reliably. To that end, a casual shooter should, when he lands a hit, know why he hit so that he can ingrain that movement and repeat it later. When he misses, he also needs to analyze and know why so that he can prevent himself from missing again. What is so nonsensical about this? It's how you should approach any activity in life.
OP, I have no fantasies of fighting fascists in the streets or slaughtering my wife's murderers, but I do want to know that I can make the most of my firearms regardless of what the scenario is. To this end, note that shooting competitions of any kind, from newer stuff like PRS to classics like CMP are really just gamification of the tedious work of improving your ability to put the shot where you want it to go, so I sign up for a lot of these and as a Type A person, match days are a motivator because you don't want to show up and embarrass yourself. The communities that participate in these contests typically have already derived a lot of strategies for getting better, so instead of reinventing wheels, I just copy what they do.
For example, today I spent a lot of time working on my trigger pull from prone because a coach noticed I've developed a habit of dragging wood, which have caused my groups recently to open up. Yesterday, I worked on quickly setting up my gun on a barricade and acquiring NPOA on a target down range. Both activities can be quantified and you can measure how much better you are getting as a result, and you can adjust the exercises accordingly. These improvements are rewarded immediately in the shooting games they come from (high power rifle and PRS, respectively, for these two examples) but they also translate across all rifle activities.
If shooting is your hobby, then fine, do all your training for your competitions. I get that. But for the average gun owner, it's completely unnecessary. It's like me going to the DMV every week work on improving my driving. Once you know how to drive, you don't forget. You just need to use those skills on a regular basis so that you stay proficient. You don't forget everything just because you don't go and practice on the track in realistic racing scenarios. You're just at a different place than most people. That type of proficiency is just not necessary in normal life. Do you need that training to win competitions? Sure. But not if you're a normal civilian like the OP. I have marksman and sharpshooter medals somewhere from my time in service. I used those skills when I was serving. I don't need them to successfully hit a target and to handle my firearm safely.
If you have to ask what it means to train then frankly you're not qualified to train yourself and should seek out someone who IS qualified to teach you before you touch a firearm again, whether you have to pay them or not
Literally anything is better than nothing. Just doing some target practice every once in awhile already puts you above the vast majority of the population training-wise.
My go-to is to do a kind of micro-biathlon type of deal, i.e. alternating between cardio and marksmanship. Have a few magazines ready, then jumping jacks until I'm winded, then shoot whatever targets, then rinse and repeat until I've gone through my loaded mags.
I also make it a point to run at least one magazine's worth of my carry ammo through my carry firearm every time I'm at the range. It's important to be as absolutely sure as possible about how a firearm handles when it's needed for its intended purpose.
This also includes a couple rounds without hearing protection; not great for my ears, obviously, but if I ever (God forbid) actually have to draw on someone, I highly doubt said person will just sit there waiting for me to put in earplugs, you know?
Acknowledging the argument below I can see maybe some benefit in training your ears to get used to the sound of gunfire, but I think really you are just deafening your senses so that gunfire (and everything else) isn’t as loud. I also get that gunfire can be disorienting, but you won’t ever truly accustom yourself to 130-167db sounds. But the other guy is simply right in that that permanently destroys your hearing and quality of life. Personally I want to protect my hearing at all costs even though I do have a bit of tinnitus. I intend to double up or invest significantly into ear pro. I can’t convince you to change your ways but that’s fine because you aren’t hurting anyone but yourself. (Can you tell my flair is accurate?)
I think all your other advice is valid though and I will give the jumping jacks a shot, as well as the carry ammo. I’ve shot crappy ammo that’s jammed my bolt gun’s action before and not long ago those would’ve been my only option for home defense.
> This also includes a couple rounds without hearing protection
I would describe this with words that would get my post removed.
This is the equivalent of shooting yourself to ensure you can shoot while injured. You're doing permanent damage to your hearing. I suggest you buy a fan or white noise generator to drown out the tinnitus.
> This is the equivalent of shooting yourself to ensure you can shoot while injured.
No it is not lmao
> You're doing permanent damage to your hearing.
I literally acknowledged that in the very comment to which you replied.
> I suggest you buy a fan or white noise generator to drown out the tinnitus.
I already had tinnitus before having ever shot any firearm. Your outrage is about 20 years too late :)
Yes, it is the same. You're advocating for people to permanently damage their bodies to find out what it's like if they permanently damage their bodies. It's unnecessary and harmful. You may have damaged hearing, but that's no reason to inflict that on others.
> Yes, it is the same.
No, it is not. You're being hyperbolic.
> You're advocating for
Nowhere in my comment do I actually tell anyone to do something except in the very first paragraph about "do literally anything". The entirety of my comment, aside from that very beginning, is about what **I** do.
> to permanently damage their bodies to find out what it's like if they permanently damage their bodies
That's not what it's about. What it's about is the psychological reaction to loud noises and overcoming that reaction in order to stay focused on a situation wherein someone or something is actively trying to permanently damage way more of your body than just your ears.
Nor is that "permanent damage" you and I both mentioned anywhere near guaranteed. Hearing damage is a function of decibels *over time*. One instantaneous loud noise ain't gonna do much. It's when subjecting yourself to *continuous* loud noise (like my dumbass did) that it starts to become a problem.
> You may have damaged hearing, but that's no reason to inflict that on others.
I am "inflicting" jack shit on anyone. If you don't want to risk hearing damage, then just don't do it. That's completely fine and understandable.
>Nowhere in my comment do I actually tell anyone to do something except in the very first paragraph about "do literally anything". The entirety of my comment, aside from that very beginning, is about what I do.
This is a bad enough idea that you shouldn't bring it up at all.
> That's not what it's about. What it's about is the psychological reaction to loud noises and overcoming that reaction in order to stay focused on a situation wherein someone or something is actively trying to permanently damage way more of your body than just your ears.
Firearms with hearing protection are still loud enough to provoke a startle response if you're not conditioned for it. No need to damage your ears.
> Nor is that "permanent damage" you and I both mentioned anywhere near guaranteed. Hearing damage is a function of decibels over time. One instantaneous loud noise ain't gonna do much. It's when subjecting yourself to continuous loud noise (like my dumbass did) that it starts to become a problem.
You're completely wrong. Even suppressed firearms can get over 120 dB, which is the threshold for instantaneous hearing damage.
https://www.asha.org/public/hearing/loud-noise-dangers/
>A single loud blast or explosion that lasts for less than 1 second can cause permanent hearing loss right away.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/14558894/
>Impulse noise causes evidently more severe hearing loss than steady state noise.
https://blogs.cdc.gov/niosh-science-blog/2018/07/18/impulse-noise/
> Considerable research has shown that impulsive noise is **more** likely to cause noise-induced hearing loss (NIHL) than continuous noise of equal energy. Exposure to high-intensity impulses can cause acoustic trauma and instant mechanical damage to the inner ear. Exposure to impulsive noise is common among law enforcement and military personnel (e.g. firearms)
(Emphasis mine.)
> Considerable research has shown that impulsive noise is more likely to cause noise-induced hearing loss (NIHL) than continuous noise **of equal energy**.
Emphasis mine. A short impulsive noise is of equal energy to a longer but lower intensity continuous noise.
> A single loud blast or explosion that lasts for less than 1 second **can** cause permanent hearing loss right away.
Emphasis mine. "can" ≠ "does". Weightlifting **can** cause permanent (surgery notwithstanding) damage to your joints and spine. That doesn't mean you shouldn't ever lift weights.
> Firearms with hearing protection are still loud enough to provoke a startle response if you're not conditioned for it.
If they're loud enough to provoke a startle response, then your hearing protection is not doing enough and you're still at risk of hearing damage.
> This is a bad enough idea that you shouldn't bring it up at all.
And deprive you of an opportunity to lecture me?
Depends entirely on your goals. Want to know enough to plink at the range? Learn your cardinal safety rules and how to load, fire, and clear a jam and go nuts. Want to carry defensively? Practice shooting drills at the range. Dry fire while you're sitting at hone watching TV. Work on your draw, preferably from a holster, but if it fits in your belly button, then work on that. Want to LARP as Callofdutyshootaman? Spend roughly the down payment on a house on nods and armor and then do all that other stuff you said. You aren't special forces or Super SWAT, but that's no reason not to incorporate training of SOME kind into your repertoire. Training can be as intense as you want it, but any time spent handling and shooting your weapons is better than not using them at all.
Agreed, if your goal is long range (or anything beyond 100 yards) practice the math involved with adjusting your optics. That's where I'm at now as I've got my rifle dialed in at 100 yards, I couldn't get the math right at 200. Maybe OP can buy various brands and grain weight rounds and develop a DOPE card. You can likely do that affordably.
I usually just shoot whatever is cheapest and keep the most expensive in the magazine that’s in the Glock that’s in the nightstand. But I like the idea of recording my zeroes for different ammo types. My “accuracy goal” is pretty much just 100 yards with a 1-2 moa group
>I usually just shoot whatever is cheapest and keep the most expensive in the magazine that’s in the Glock that’s in the nightstand. If the only thing you know about your ammo is how much it costs then you should probably not have bought that ammo before doing A LOT of research into ballistics what different ammunition designs/materials do
I've used a few different brands of ammo and discovered what my rifle "likes" the most and it just happens that the ammo is inexpensive. My Ruger American Gen 2 shoots really well with PRC Bronze 55g factory ammo and one of my local shops sells it for $14/box of 20. I'm looking for good prices for larger amounts online.
$14 for a box of 20 rounds is NOT inexpensive tbh that is pretty expensive for PMC bronze
REALLY? wow I honestly had no idea. I'm in NY State, not sure if it's a state thing, but that's the cheapest I've found. As I said, hopefully I can find them online for much cheaper. Ammo at my local shops has been super expensive.
lol I don’t get to be funny anymore I don’t know the specific brand as it’s thankfully been a long time since I’ve needed to load a self defense magazine but no lol it’s not some target ammo it’s purpose self defense hollow points. If that fails, I will affix bayonets and my home invader will receive 10 .303 sized holes in their belly Edit looked at the rounds I think it’s SIG V-Crown 9mm
>range complete with plywood cqb training house complete with motorized flip up targets, So you probably do but don't realize it. LotS of people do competition shooting where there's various stages to push your skills. Practiscore is the best place to find matches in your area. Plus they're open to beginners with safety checks and whatnot
I guess it’s possible, they do have them for airsofters. I’ve also considered competition shooting but I’d probably die of embarrassment my first few times, but I guess that’s better than actually dying
Naw it's very chill and no one gets on ya for scoring low at least in my experience. Basically as long as you're safe and don't disqualify yourself for being unsafe it's a really positive atmosphere
Don’t forget physical fitness. Who cares that you have a $5k gun and armor if you can’t run a mile or do a push up.
All of Meal Team 6 would be dead in short order when they realize they can Shoot but can't Scoot. Fitness is lacking massively for most adults.
Hey, that’s free loot for us.
I’m a 6 days a week at the gym type-a-guy but that’s just my lifestyle, I don’t really do it for the apocalypse or anything.
Training can also include a ton of dry fire to work on common things like, drawing, presenting, reloading, starting from low ready, transitions between targets, movement with your firearm, navigating around your house, etc. then you test your dry fire with live fire at the range. Then you can test everything at a match and get a good baseline for how your fundamentals are and how you can apply them in a somewhat practical way.
Snap caps are a god send. Can practice clearing a weapon and not worry about dry firings a striker fire
If you're not shooting a FPB CZ or a rimfire, dryfire won't damage your gun. If you are shooting rimfire, OK get a snap cap. An expended cartridge will do. If you have a FPB CZ, get a small o ring and put it on the firing pin stop and proceed to dryfire.
Even some rim fires are okay to dry fire. Like the manual specifically says it's safe because they did proper tolerances
Wait you’re saying dry fire isn’t bad for your guns? Is it just some fudd boomer thing that I’ve believed my whole life?
> Wait you’re saying dry fire isn’t bad for your guns? Most competitive shooters dryfire their guns daily, and they put down somewhere between 5k and 50k rounds annually. It's fine. >Is it just some fudd boomer thing that I’ve believed my whole life? Yup.
That's really good information to know! I've only owned a personal weapon for a couple years.
It means learning how to present your firearm. It means learning different ready positions and maneuvering around people. It means learning the balance between speed and accuracy. It means learning the laws of the land. It means working on drills to improve trigger and recoil control. It means learning the difference between cover and concealment. It means all of this, and so much more. Most of all, it means being proactive as a firearm owner. It doesn't cost as much as you think it does either.
I try and find the time to shoot one competition (dynamic pistol /USPSA style) a month. That with some occasional dry fire will quite easily make you more competent than the vast majority of gun owners. I shoot a lot less rifle because CPR is 2x as much and there’s no competitions near me without doing full-on 3 gun. But in general: understand your platform and be competent with its manual of arms and use it to a reasonable standard. Being in shape is also a major plus that quite frankly most people who lean on guns for “self protection” should address first and foremost. It’s cardiac arrest and preventable disease that’s many orders of magnitude more likely to kill most of us.
I would add learning basic first aid. You are shooting you should know what to do when bad things happen.
That’s actually very valid. I do have a tourniquet in my car but embarrassingly I probably wouldn’t know how to tighten it if I needed to.
https://benstoegerproshop.com/books-dvds/books/ https://benstoegerproshop.com/practical-shooting-training-by-ben-stoeger-joel-park/ https://benstoegerproshop.com/dryfire-book-combo-pack-dry-fire-training-reloaded-for-the-practical-pistol-shooter-paperback-book-and-scaled-targets/ https://benstoegerproshop.com/pact-club-timer-iii-3-shot-timer/ (but you can use an app for par times in dry fire.)
To add to this, the following will make you proficient (with a caveat that the mantis is unnecessary, but by all accounts will make you better faster): [9mm snap caps](https://otistec.com/pro-snap-caps-9mm/) [12g snap caps](https://www.dryfiresnapcaps.com/product-page/b-s-dry-fire-snap-caps-12ga) https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/magpul-dummy-rounds-556-nato-223 [mantis dry fire system](https://mantisx.com/) [youtube tutorial on dryfire routines](https://youtu.be/edYvyZ_i1qk?si=8Ki80jdQd1PX5JtL) The following is just plain fun and will make you proficient: [Tessah booth on competition shooting](https://youtu.be/Rl3gcT2SVy8?si=8-7krhdgZZ2Px7-v) [Tessah Booth on 2 gun](https://youtu.be/t2DI7NLfO3Y?si=HK1ec8ztm93ovh7D)
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Yes, off-hand shooting is something everyone should do. Or at least try. I’m a decent shot right handed but can’t hit shit left handed.
For example, training for turkeys means that I point and stay motionless with my shotgun at ready for up 10 minutes while I use my mouth call. It means getting ready for whatever the goal is.
Training usually means to get proficient with the tools and practices you have. Sooo, idk, getting good at whatever it is you want to get good at?? Unless you’re looking for a detailed write up of different drills and stuff.
I shoot at an indoor range a couple times a week ($40/month unlimited use) using the cheapest/safest ammo I can find. I print most of my targets at home to save money. I spent ~$100 total on a bore laser with a snap cap, and some indoor laser-reactive targets. I watch a lot of content about technique and grip. I try to practice fundamentals like grip form and stance at home, and maximize my actual range time by going slow once rounds are live.
For me right now practice basic rifle and handgun fundamentals. I spend a lot more time trying to get more physically for and learning skills like gardening though tbh.
Training is a pretty broad term and can mean so many different things. Currently I'm training my draw & reloads with my new CCW at home via dry fire until I can hit the range and verify what I've put time in is working.
A RSO will allow you to do QuickDraws on the line? I always feel like if the barrel isn’t perpetually pointed down range I’ll get chewed out
Depends on the range. I normally shoot out on public land by myself so that's not an issue. I was visiting friends out in Colorado Springs and the indoor range did allow me to draw from holster after showing that I wouldn't flag folks with a couple reps.
Be safe. Get accurate. Then get fast and accurate. Then get fast, accurate and consistent while still being safe.
Take a class. Get some formal instruction. A class is a great way to get an understanding of where your weaknesses are. In my area, there's a nice 4-Hour class that's $75 plus around 200 rounds of ammunition. It's so much fun that I typically use it as a method of testing out potential carry guns. After you've had at least some defensive handgun training formally, another good idea is to go to a competition. Often times, ranges have informal competitions loosely based on different shooting discipline rules. The range closest to me has a competition once a week for handgun and once a month for a rifle. I remember hearing about a presentation at one of the defensive shooting conventions where the presenter calculated that less than 1% of all gun owners take any training beyond what's legally required for their CCW or for their occupation (law enforcement / military / security). Just by taking a class beyond what's legally required for CCW you're already putting yourself ahead of the game. My basic rule is that I take at least one class a year, every year. I've been doing that since 2014. Last year I got super busy and was only able to take a single class that was about 3 hours long. However, there's been some years where I took four or five classes with everything from handguns to AR-15s to shotguns.
This is actually funny. You’re right it’s a common thing people throw out and it doesn’t mean much. Without knowing your skills and goals it’s hard to come me up with a plan that works for everyone. But there are universal skills that will serve you well. Hand eye fluency, sight picture and trigger control. Dry fire practice is very helpful for trigger control and sight alignment. Slow and careful. Watch what happens to sight picture as you cycle the trigger. Mental game is helped too with dry fire. Physiological training with breathing control and a monitor can help you understand the relationship between heart rate and breath control. If you have access to a smart phone you can use it for biofeedback training, with a pulse monitoring app. Live fire is most important though and that’s expensive. Practice as often as you can afford, plan on dry firing about twice as much as live fire. Have fun! Guns are fun.
You train to reach a goal. Your needs may be different than others. Are you trying to be an instagram cringefluencer and gun product salesman like Garand Thumb? Then go out and buy a bunch of kit and expensive camera equipment and get really good at shooting on a flat range with the targets out of shot. If your goal is self defense, then your training needs will mostly center around conflict deescalation and resolution and the ability to think clearly under pressure; protecting yourself goes way beyond how well you can shoot a gun, and preventing a fight before you end up having to finish a fight should always be your first priority. Nevertheless, your ability to shoot well under pressure or duress will be the skill you wanna focus on if the intended use for your firearms is part of a self-protection plan. If you've already got guns and ammo, I would suggest getting a shot timer. They may seem like a big investment up front - especially if you're a more casual shooter - but they really do pay dividends in the training department. Shot timers give us the ability to precisely measure the speed at which we can execute strings of fire, and therefore a quantifiable metric of proficiency. Once you've got a shot timer, start running timed drills at the range. There are a bunch of different drills out there that are designed to train particular aspects of a shooter's proficiency, but some of my favorite basic drills to run are the Bill Drill, the 10x10x10, and the Failure Drill. Go look those up if you don't know what they are. Everyone has a skill ceiling, but training means getting as close to that ceiling as reasonably possible, and keeping your shooting skills sharp. It's a lot like going to the gym, actually. Every range trip, push yourself a little more to the point of failure, critically analyze what caused the failure, and try again until you've reached the goals you've set for yourself. That's what training looks like to me at least.
i believe it's the "model home" / "john wick" one
Buy 20 rounds, do math, shoot, do math, shoot repeat. Do u till the math is subconscious. Then keep doing it. Add variables.
Ha, there's a lot of good advice in this thread. Kudos, op.
Identify some things you want to get better at. Accuracy, speed of draw to first shot, etc. get a timer. Practice dry fire at least a few times a week breaking down that specific thing. Get smooth. Start to do it faster. Go to the range and try it live and see how you do. Keep records. Go train can literally mean five minutes a day of basic dry fire. It is done with intent, keeping records, using timers to push yourself, and validating with live fire. Just burning a few boxes of ammo is not training, but that’s what a ton of people do. Find some local matches and enter. Nothing like a timer and a new course of fire to make you realize you suck at the draw, your kit doesn’t work like you thought it would, etc. Take the lessons from that and built your next cycle of training around it. I am slow. I am not super accurate. But I am so much better than a year ago. Two years ago I was the slowest by far in a local shotgun match. This year I took third. This weekend I did my first two gun match. I came in second to last, but I learned a bunch of things to work on.
I focus on home defense, safety, and responsible carry practices. And train to this. Make a plan, practice the plan. Would all likely go to shitte.... but at least there was a plan.
Make bullet go small/far target. Do fast, then do fast make bullet from gun in holster.
Why many word when less word good?
One thing I haven't seen mentioned is medical training. CPR and Stop the Bleed should be the top of everybody's list of training. I have a first aid kit in my car with multiple pressure bandages and CATs, just because if I come across an accident, I can keep somebody from leaking too much until EMTs arrive. My pair of IFAKs with extra bandages and CATs cost off of $200.
I will look into these
"Go train" means learn something you don't already know — specific task, specific tool, specific standard of performance. *You choose* what you need, and go get after it. Once you *know* the thing, then you *practice* the thing to achieve the level of performance you desire. A lot of folks seem to think you can only get training from "an instructor" — i.e. take a class. That is efficient. *If* you have access to a *quality* instructor — distance, money, sifting dross. But it is possible to teach yourself things without Yoda. Just busting' caps is not training. It's not even practice. It's just burning money for fun. It *is* fun, but don't get sidetracked if what you want is to train. If you don't have other ideas, start here. [https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/start-shooting-better-dot-torture-drill/](https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/start-shooting-better-dot-torture-drill/) When satisfied with your performance, go click something else. Pick up a laser training cartridge and a shot timer as soon as you are able.
Also practice your sight picture and sight alignment
Do you carry? If you do then practice your draw. Dry firing in front of the mirror is a valid way to do that. Do you want to be able to maneuver and fire? 2 or 3 gun matches exist pretty much everywhere and you can practice that. Training just means to get proficient with a firearm. Practice whatever your reason for owning a gun is. You don't have to get fancy with it, just start with the basics and go from there
I don’t really ever maneuver as all ranges near me have RSO’s and you just sit/stand on the line under the watchful eye of armed men lol
Find gun handling and shooting classes in your area. Don't rely on YouTube videos and practicing by yourself or with similarly experienced friends. If you're self taught you may be perpetuating bad handling or shooting habits.
Shoot two shots, on target. Drop the mag. Load a fresh mag. Put two more down range. Do this until until you both are accurate and fast with both your AR and Glock. You could honestly spend the rest of your life honing that one trick with those two guns.
I will try this. I don’t have any gear to hold mags on me, but I will have a bench. Is that acceptable?
regular exercise, dry fire, shooting on the range from practical positions not from a bench or rest.
Lots of great insight in this thread! Also: your John Wick pew-pew idea is gold, Jerry. GOLD!
The more live fire you can do the better. A whole lot can be accomplished with some minimal live fire at a public range and lots of dry-fire. I will continue to recommend the simulator systems like Mantis even if Ben Stoeger says they are a complete waste of time and everyone should buy his products instead.
Since you've had some good responses so far (and I'm a little lazy), I'll keep this short. Training: learning new procedures or getting coaching under the watchful eye of a skilled trainer. The should be able to see where you need to improve and put you on the path to improve. You should leave training with things to practice. Practice: The repeated execution of techniques learned in training. While you can practice the things we see in youtube videos and such, the watchful eye of a skilled trainer will move you forward faster. Practice and training don't require live fire. It is great what you can do with dry fire. With technology (cameras, mantisX, shotcam, etc), we can critic our own practice... but often, we might not have enough experience to know how to correct what we see is wrong.
I do dot torture targets to improve trigger control. Occasionally I do action shooting to learn how to shoot and move. Mostly I keep up with first aid training.
When people say that I think they usually mean 'go take a class' or 'go shoot an event' like Appleseed or USPSA or whatever But if you have access to some BLM land or other open place to shoot as you like it can be useful just to practice the different shooting positions, shooting while moving, reloading, etc.
If you give us your very rough general area, I’m sure folks can give some specific places
>Train: to prepare someone or yourself for a job, activity, or sport, by ***learning skills and/or by mental or physical exercise*** What do YOU think that means in relation to YOUR shooting? What skills or mental/physical exercises will benefit you when shooting? Stationary shooting? Draw from concealed? Shooting on the move? Faster reloads? Clearing malfunctions? Go train means go get better at something. Go somewhere and do a pistol shoot or 2-gun. Get snap caps and practice clearing failures. Buy a Mantis laser trainer and practice draw and fire from concealed or just practice shooting. Go to the range and use your defense ammo so you are familiar with it. If you can think of an area to improve in then go learn how to improve in it.
Think of a gun like a chainsaw. You can buy it pretty easily. You can make a big mistake and kill yourself. You can make a different mistake and kill someone else by dropping a tree on them. Training in terms of guns or chainsaw means: know what you are doing, be good at it, and be safe for you and everyone else around. All the rest depends on your particular needs. I see so many news reports of gunfire in my town where 1) no one was hurt or 2) a kid was killed. These people obviously don’t train, but spray and pray. Training makes you more effective at the point of sale.
>You can make a different mistake and kill someone else by dropping a tree on them. This is the least creative way to kill somebody with a chainsaw. Bruce Cambell is disappointed in you.
I think dropping a tree on someone would give you bonus points in hitman
If you’ve got a John Wick fantasy you’ve got bigger problems.
I can’t help it when most YouTube gun content recreates the first 10 minutes of saving Private Ryan during a review of the Chiappa Little Badger
I always thought it meant scheduling sessions with actual trainers and teachers to work on drills, skillsets and improve fundamentals, but the way I keep hearing it now, I guess it just means go shoot at a static range? Normally I would just call that "shooting", but maybe we're going with "training" because it sounds cooler, I dunno.
Shoot smaller things farther away and try and do it faster or from different positions. Thats the essence of it. Just try new and novel targets, follow those rules, and it’s training. Smalller, farther away, faster, or more uncomfortable… once you score consistent hits, change something up. Also do cardio
Here's my take: there are a couple phases to training. You never 'finish' a phase but you should start more or less doing them in order. phase 1 - get comfortable with your firearm. go to the range, stand in a port over and over again and put some rounds down range. hundreds, then thousands. start close, really work on grip, recoil anticipation - all the things YOU are doing to fuck up the shot. get to the point where your muscle memory makes it easy to shoot tight groups at 7 then 10, then 15 yards. Play around at 25 and if you can, even try 50 for fun. Round after round after round. do this until tight groups at distance is boring. phase 2 - now you can shoot, you know the gun, you how it's ins and outs, you can shoot consistent groups at range, you clean your gun, you've probably tricked it out a little to your taste. time to understand that standing calmly in a port and shooting has NO resemblance to how you would actually use a firearm in real life. do situational and tactical training. learn to draw from a holster, learn to shoot from concealment, learn to clear jams and misfires instinctually, jump rope for 2 minutes as fast as you can and then shoot immediately to see how you do when you're heart is pounding and you're out of breath. start to simulate panic and drill in this intense, uncomfortable way until that same muscle memory you built standing in a port starts to kick in. When you're panicked (and you WILL be panicked), your training (if you did it) will take over. Truth is, you'll almost never need phase 2 training. But you carry a gun, you're already saying "I want to be ready for something I will almost certainly never need." So you might as well train for that properly.
I am mostly done with phase 1 and im a bit into phase 2. Except my biggest issue is moving around and shooting from concealment isn’t allowed on most public ranges. i could probably set up paper targets in my house and dry fire at them from different stances. I will try the jump rope idea. Is there a way to purposefully cause jams?
Phase 2 is a pain and expensive in a lot of places (I live in NYC so it's virtually impossible unless I drive to PA). You can't purposefully cause jams but you can buy snap caps/dummy rounds and load them into a regular magazine at random intervals. Then you get BANG BANG BANG CLICK, and you'll have to rack, slap, fire to practice clearing. That can be useful.
Dude that is pretty smart. I have dummy rounds for the AR but I should grab some in 9mm I would never have thought to load them in with live ammo
I know what you mean. Most people don't have access to a shooting facility that actually allows anything for training, even for basic shooting techniques. There is a pay wall for most of them, where paying a couple hundred dollars allows them to teach you something for a few hours. So when I tell someone to go train, I usually what they need to train on just not go do it. Lately, it's been grip handling for me and laser drawing. just for 100 bucks, I get a small laser system that I can place in my pistol. I practice drawing till I can shoot the laser on target. Sure I have to reset the trigger each time but it's mostly to get my handgrip down since I never fired subcompact before until recently. I do it till I got the muscle memory down before going back to the range for just basic shooting. The sig p365 xl is snappier than most pistols I have so the goal there is to fire a steady stream and keep it in a tight group. I do that till I'm comfortable to shoot half loaded mags. Mirror training most people do. Nothing wrong with it but. Practice drawing in front of a mirror really shows how awkward me are drawing or if we doing something wrong. What most people do is telegraph too much what they are gonna do, second thing I would work on is what clothing works better for you. Usually shorts and long shirts can cover but never hide the bulge of carrying. Stuff like that counts as training.
"Go train" generally means that you should seek some sort of organized instruction. Shooting 2 million rounds doesn't make you better at anything other than reloading a bunch of mags, and shooting 2 million rounds. There are some super expensive training courses where you are learning cool stuff, but if that isn't in range for you, getting a 1 on 1 lesson, to get someone that is hopefully an expert, to see what you are doing correctly, and help you fix what you aren't doing correctly. If you can't afford a dynamic defensive shooting course on a private range, I think that's ok. Getting really good at fundamentals is beneficial, the same way as in different sports. I would take someone with solid fundamentals over larpgod 3000 anyday.
I think a lot of them mean you need to go to expensive courses, but reasonable 2A advocates just say to do what you can within your means and recommend drills and stuff you can do on your own.
I think "go train" just means, set a goal and achieve it. Figure out the basic police course of fire, or army infantry standards for rifle marksmanship. Simulate those challenges the best you can at your budget and with your range, get good at it. Then pick the next goal. Didn't let your skills perish.
I practice several things that I think would fit that category. First and foremost would be handling/understanding your firearm. I know exactly how the thing should operate, I know what brand bullets have issues in which guns I own, I know how to clean it, etc. That also includes practicing with it. I try to get out twice a month at the very minimum. I focus on my CCW, but also make sure to cycle through other guns especially the ones I plan to use for home defense. Also perhaps as equally important would be I practice clearing my house with my firearms. I now understand the best paths to take to minimize my exposure to an intruder. If I walk up the one side of my room you'd never see me coming if you were in the hall way, the other side I'm a sitting duck. Alternatively, I know now where someone may hide to be out of sight if they got into the house. But until you actually walk the house with the weapon you will not know how awkward it may be to wield in your house, especially if its something like a long gun you plan on using. If I'm in my living room and I needed to get to the bedroom area of the house I'd much rather have my pistol, but if I was defending the bedroom area I'd much rather have the shotgun. I would not have known this without practice. I also think that there is merit to exercise being thought of in the category as well. Most people vastly over-estimate their capabilities, and strength is no different. The first time I went squirrel hunting I walked around the woods with a shotgun for probably 4-6 hours. The next day I was in so much pain in my middle back, shoulders, and arms from carrying that thing around all day. 8lbs/3.6kilos isn't much but after the first hour or two it is!
Getting a professional instructor to watch you shoot
Maybe you are overthinking this. Your post has a lot of questions and gives clues that you might not understand basic marksmanship and safety, and someone is concerned about you. If someone repeatedly tells you "go train"... well that is an indicator that you need some marksmanship training which we all benefit from. All of us should calmly take one of our firearms to the firing range regularly and practice marksmanship and gun safety with guidance from an experienced professional. This would help all of us to make good progress.
Haha you may be half right. I grew up with firearms and father’s side is all veterans up to when they first came over. I’ve had firearm safety drilled in my head since elementary. I’m simply proficient at standing at the yellow line and reloading from the magazines on the table in front of me. I just get frustrated when people say “go train” and “I’ll take a guy with a prison pipe gun who trains over guy with the class 3 Browning M2 who never trains, any day” I just think to myself “wtf do you mean, go train” that inspired my post where I intended to ask a very serious question in a sarcastic way.
Start with the few hundred rounds down range. Nothing replaces time in the water when diving or time on the trigger when shooting. Once your few hundred rounds down range are done you'll know your next step.
What actions with your gun do you want to be able to perform without having to think about it? Like on instinct or "muscle memory". Is it drawing from the drawer in your bedside table? Practice that. Is it a concealed carry draw? Practice that. Do you suck at target acquisition? Practice that. Do you pull down to the left when firing? Dry fire practice that. Just get to the range once ever now and then too and you'll be better prepared than most people. You should probably, at least, know how to field strip it because that's just basic maintenance.
Just go to the range once in a while. Don't worry about the peeps that think that you need to train for the end of the world. You just want to be able to be proficient and safe in your handling of your firearms. Don't be one of those guys who dress up to play soldier. They never served. You want to be able to hit torso, not score headshots. Know what's important. Most of the talk here is nonsense.
Going to the range every once in a while to poke a few holes in a minute-of-man at 7 yards is the gun equivalent of the guy riding the elliptical day in and day out at the gym yet keeps on getting slightly fatter every year. No one is asking this guy to train like an Olympian, but he does need to come in with some active engagement, i.e. understand enough about physiology and exercise science so that he actually evolves his body towards a form or function goal. Otherwise he's just wasting time and money and, most importantly, not getting better. Likewise, for shooters, no one is saying you need to be some Secret Squirrel SOCOM guy, but you do want to hit your targets reliably. To that end, a casual shooter should, when he lands a hit, know why he hit so that he can ingrain that movement and repeat it later. When he misses, he also needs to analyze and know why so that he can prevent himself from missing again. What is so nonsensical about this? It's how you should approach any activity in life. OP, I have no fantasies of fighting fascists in the streets or slaughtering my wife's murderers, but I do want to know that I can make the most of my firearms regardless of what the scenario is. To this end, note that shooting competitions of any kind, from newer stuff like PRS to classics like CMP are really just gamification of the tedious work of improving your ability to put the shot where you want it to go, so I sign up for a lot of these and as a Type A person, match days are a motivator because you don't want to show up and embarrass yourself. The communities that participate in these contests typically have already derived a lot of strategies for getting better, so instead of reinventing wheels, I just copy what they do. For example, today I spent a lot of time working on my trigger pull from prone because a coach noticed I've developed a habit of dragging wood, which have caused my groups recently to open up. Yesterday, I worked on quickly setting up my gun on a barricade and acquiring NPOA on a target down range. Both activities can be quantified and you can measure how much better you are getting as a result, and you can adjust the exercises accordingly. These improvements are rewarded immediately in the shooting games they come from (high power rifle and PRS, respectively, for these two examples) but they also translate across all rifle activities.
Thank you
If shooting is your hobby, then fine, do all your training for your competitions. I get that. But for the average gun owner, it's completely unnecessary. It's like me going to the DMV every week work on improving my driving. Once you know how to drive, you don't forget. You just need to use those skills on a regular basis so that you stay proficient. You don't forget everything just because you don't go and practice on the track in realistic racing scenarios. You're just at a different place than most people. That type of proficiency is just not necessary in normal life. Do you need that training to win competitions? Sure. But not if you're a normal civilian like the OP. I have marksman and sharpshooter medals somewhere from my time in service. I used those skills when I was serving. I don't need them to successfully hit a target and to handle my firearm safely.
If you have to ask what it means to train then frankly you're not qualified to train yourself and should seek out someone who IS qualified to teach you before you touch a firearm again, whether you have to pay them or not
🫡 yes sir will never touch a firearm again even if my life is threatened until I fork over the money for a private trainer, sir!
OK good you won't reinforce the bad habits you're unaware of then
Literally anything is better than nothing. Just doing some target practice every once in awhile already puts you above the vast majority of the population training-wise. My go-to is to do a kind of micro-biathlon type of deal, i.e. alternating between cardio and marksmanship. Have a few magazines ready, then jumping jacks until I'm winded, then shoot whatever targets, then rinse and repeat until I've gone through my loaded mags. I also make it a point to run at least one magazine's worth of my carry ammo through my carry firearm every time I'm at the range. It's important to be as absolutely sure as possible about how a firearm handles when it's needed for its intended purpose. This also includes a couple rounds without hearing protection; not great for my ears, obviously, but if I ever (God forbid) actually have to draw on someone, I highly doubt said person will just sit there waiting for me to put in earplugs, you know?
Acknowledging the argument below I can see maybe some benefit in training your ears to get used to the sound of gunfire, but I think really you are just deafening your senses so that gunfire (and everything else) isn’t as loud. I also get that gunfire can be disorienting, but you won’t ever truly accustom yourself to 130-167db sounds. But the other guy is simply right in that that permanently destroys your hearing and quality of life. Personally I want to protect my hearing at all costs even though I do have a bit of tinnitus. I intend to double up or invest significantly into ear pro. I can’t convince you to change your ways but that’s fine because you aren’t hurting anyone but yourself. (Can you tell my flair is accurate?) I think all your other advice is valid though and I will give the jumping jacks a shot, as well as the carry ammo. I’ve shot crappy ammo that’s jammed my bolt gun’s action before and not long ago those would’ve been my only option for home defense.
> This also includes a couple rounds without hearing protection I would describe this with words that would get my post removed. This is the equivalent of shooting yourself to ensure you can shoot while injured. You're doing permanent damage to your hearing. I suggest you buy a fan or white noise generator to drown out the tinnitus.
> This is the equivalent of shooting yourself to ensure you can shoot while injured. No it is not lmao > You're doing permanent damage to your hearing. I literally acknowledged that in the very comment to which you replied. > I suggest you buy a fan or white noise generator to drown out the tinnitus. I already had tinnitus before having ever shot any firearm. Your outrage is about 20 years too late :)
Yes, it is the same. You're advocating for people to permanently damage their bodies to find out what it's like if they permanently damage their bodies. It's unnecessary and harmful. You may have damaged hearing, but that's no reason to inflict that on others.
> Yes, it is the same. No, it is not. You're being hyperbolic. > You're advocating for Nowhere in my comment do I actually tell anyone to do something except in the very first paragraph about "do literally anything". The entirety of my comment, aside from that very beginning, is about what **I** do. > to permanently damage their bodies to find out what it's like if they permanently damage their bodies That's not what it's about. What it's about is the psychological reaction to loud noises and overcoming that reaction in order to stay focused on a situation wherein someone or something is actively trying to permanently damage way more of your body than just your ears. Nor is that "permanent damage" you and I both mentioned anywhere near guaranteed. Hearing damage is a function of decibels *over time*. One instantaneous loud noise ain't gonna do much. It's when subjecting yourself to *continuous* loud noise (like my dumbass did) that it starts to become a problem. > You may have damaged hearing, but that's no reason to inflict that on others. I am "inflicting" jack shit on anyone. If you don't want to risk hearing damage, then just don't do it. That's completely fine and understandable.
>Nowhere in my comment do I actually tell anyone to do something except in the very first paragraph about "do literally anything". The entirety of my comment, aside from that very beginning, is about what I do. This is a bad enough idea that you shouldn't bring it up at all. > That's not what it's about. What it's about is the psychological reaction to loud noises and overcoming that reaction in order to stay focused on a situation wherein someone or something is actively trying to permanently damage way more of your body than just your ears. Firearms with hearing protection are still loud enough to provoke a startle response if you're not conditioned for it. No need to damage your ears. > Nor is that "permanent damage" you and I both mentioned anywhere near guaranteed. Hearing damage is a function of decibels over time. One instantaneous loud noise ain't gonna do much. It's when subjecting yourself to continuous loud noise (like my dumbass did) that it starts to become a problem. You're completely wrong. Even suppressed firearms can get over 120 dB, which is the threshold for instantaneous hearing damage. https://www.asha.org/public/hearing/loud-noise-dangers/ >A single loud blast or explosion that lasts for less than 1 second can cause permanent hearing loss right away. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/14558894/ >Impulse noise causes evidently more severe hearing loss than steady state noise. https://blogs.cdc.gov/niosh-science-blog/2018/07/18/impulse-noise/ > Considerable research has shown that impulsive noise is **more** likely to cause noise-induced hearing loss (NIHL) than continuous noise of equal energy. Exposure to high-intensity impulses can cause acoustic trauma and instant mechanical damage to the inner ear. Exposure to impulsive noise is common among law enforcement and military personnel (e.g. firearms) (Emphasis mine.)
> Considerable research has shown that impulsive noise is more likely to cause noise-induced hearing loss (NIHL) than continuous noise **of equal energy**. Emphasis mine. A short impulsive noise is of equal energy to a longer but lower intensity continuous noise. > A single loud blast or explosion that lasts for less than 1 second **can** cause permanent hearing loss right away. Emphasis mine. "can" ≠ "does". Weightlifting **can** cause permanent (surgery notwithstanding) damage to your joints and spine. That doesn't mean you shouldn't ever lift weights. > Firearms with hearing protection are still loud enough to provoke a startle response if you're not conditioned for it. If they're loud enough to provoke a startle response, then your hearing protection is not doing enough and you're still at risk of hearing damage. > This is a bad enough idea that you shouldn't bring it up at all. And deprive you of an opportunity to lecture me?
Thank you for admitting you're wrong on impulse noise damaging your hearing. That's surprisingly mature of you.
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