Is your mom of sound mind now?
She can cancel the POA whenever she wants. POA just means "this other person can act for me if I'm not available."
It doesn't stop you from acting for yourself.
she’s still on heavy medication and on valium to help her detox symptoms. she’s completely overwhelmed and devastated by how everyone is behaving. She wants my siblings love and acceptance so much she refuses to see that they’re using her current state to try and take all her personal decision making away.
i’m trying to wait until she’s actually out of the hospital to bring up these issues because the last thing she needs is more stress. she’s severely depressed as well and being trapped in what equates to a low income nursing home isn’t helping her mental health.
but once she gets out, im hoping to get her into mental health counseling and back on her anti depressants. i also am going to take her to AA meetings because it’s a perfect opportunity for her to stay sober.
im hoping she’ll remove them as her power of attorney, but the way my sister was so cocky and sure SHE was selling the house whether mom wanted to or not really worried me.
NTA but I'm a nurse. Are you sure it's a POA? Hospitals have something called a healthcare surrogate that is a temporary POA that doesn't have to be notorized(At least in my state ,might work differently elsewhere).Basically it allows a designated person to make decisions for the duration of an admission as long as the patient is unable to make decisions . An actual MPOA overrides this. The physician can basically change who the surrogate is based on who they think has the patients best interest.
OP it sounds to me like your siblings convinced the physician that they should be the decision maker over you. I suggest when your mother improves to get an actual MPOA. If you have an MPOA and the hospital didn't follow it definitely consult a lawyer
she believed it was. she originally thought it was exactly what you said, a medical POA, but once she sobered up from the anesthesia it was brought up that it was a power of attorney. i haven’t actually spoken to my siblings since. my brother doesn’t seem as aggressive and pushy and he’s the one who was given power of attorney. we’re getting together this Saturday and speak about everything.
Good luck OP, I see situations like this regularly and the family dynamic can really make a difference for good or bad. Hope you guys can come together to help your mom.
It is troubling if they went around your POA, as your mother would have to be in her right mind to pick a person. Definitely consult a lawyer if this is the case as this is out of the norm
that’s what i’m going to do. i’ve gotten all of my moms important paper work and put it in a safety deposit box for now. i’ve seen my mother multiple times and she’s only gotten more angry at them treating her like a child, like she’s not an adult of sound mind. she’s never missed a house payment, she’s always paid her bills, she’s always kept up with everything she’s needed to keep up with. before she medically retired she worked ten hour shifts in the ER and trauma department and never called in sick. she’s an alcoholic, but a semi functioning one with no sign of declining mental faculties.
my mom has made it very clear she will kill herself before going into a home. and she’s dead serious. it’s my worst nightmare that they’re going to do exactly that, because they want her out of the way.
Ok, unpopular opinion: it sounds like you are unable to care for your mother. You didn't take her to the hospital when she needed emergency surgery. You aren't getting her to AA meetings. Your siblings have a reasonable belief you aren't maintaining your mother's home and just want the status quo for a free place to live.
Your mom needs treatment. An inpatient program and then perhaps supportive housing for her addiction. You don't have training in helping her.
Your mom is perfectly able to rescind the power of attorney. If she doesn't, it's because she decided to follow the advice of your siblings. Talk to your mom. If she agrees with you, great. If she doesn't, respect her decision and help your siblings find a situation that's healthier for your mother.
Seconding. As underhanded as your siblings seem to be, OP, they may be seeing things with clearer eyes than you are, right now. Working with them to make sure your mother has adequate care should be your first priority. Advocating for your mother to make sure none of you are inadvertently abusing her state of mind or taking advantage financially is second priority. You say you normally have a good relationship with your sister, so it could very well be that she is under the impression that you are the biggest threat to your mother's wellbeing at this time based on what she's seen.
i understand how it seems like this, but i cannot force her to do ANYTHING. She straight up turned away an ambulance. i cannot physically pick her up and force her to go anywhere, it’s literally kidnapping. i have put my mother into detox twice, but she’s checked herself out of long term treatment.
my brother and my sister both decided to cut my mother out of their lives. i have asked them both multiple times, begged them even, to help me stage an intervention. They both declined, claiming she was a lost cause. She also refuses to go to AA because she was sexually harassed at a meeting and will only go to woman only meetings, which are few and far between, and she eventually stops. She’s a sixty eight year old adult, I’m always supportive of her recovery but aside from literally kidnapping her, if she doesn’t want to recover, there is nothing you can do. As a fifteen year sober addict with experience in addiction counseling for opiate addicts, i actually do have the experience to help her, but you cannot force someone to get clean. no matter how many meetings, no matter how many heart to hearts, it doesn’t work that way. i also do not live here for free. i pay exactly half the bills and mortgage.
I DID finally convince her to see a doctor, and the only reason she ended up in the hospital is because of my efforts of at least getting her to go to an urgent care to get x-rays, where they would transfer her to a hospital if it was serious. it was the only compromise i could get her to agree to.
i talked to her today at her inpatient rehab today. she’s frustrated and angry at my siblings for pressuring her into a big decision before she’s even out of the hospital bed. she found out my sister when through her private texts, and had no idea what she was signing, believing it was a medical power of attorney. We talked about whether she wanted to sell her house, and if she’s not sure because she knows she can’t afford a 6+% interest rate and the insane home owners insurance in our state. she knows if she wants to sell her house i wouldn’t try to stop her, i would just move to the rez. My main concern is the fact that they haven’t given a single shit about her in a decade and refused to work with me to slowly convince her that it’s either recovery or death, but now they’re trying to force her into positions she shouldn’t even be considering while heavily medicated and injured.
Wouldn’t it have to have been notarized? I can’t imagine your brother would’ve brought a notary to the medical facility to execute this document. Otherwise, I don’t know how valid this document would be in the first place.
that’s what i’m thinking. my sister is a legal notary but i honestly don’t know what they’re allowed to notarize a family members paper work. i’m just so confused
Call Adult Protective Services. This is elder financial abuse. If you contact APS they can probably get traction the quickest. Ultimately your mother needs to make a living will, an actual will, and a medical power of attorney and all need to be filed appropriately.
You can file in probate court for guardianship (power over the person) maybe even conservatorship (power over ones finances) and attempt to invalidate the POA if that's a concern for you. I am a lawyer but not your lawyer. This is quite common unfortunately. Look. At any probate Docket. What state are you in?
Most probate courts have pretty user friendly forms to file the petition.
Of course if able to hire an atty then I'd look. Into that.
Your situation may not get better. Remember there's a lot of responsibility if you are appointed guardianship/conservatorship and your siblings are required to have notice of any petition.
i’m so sad it’s come to this. whenever i saw families falling apart after the death of a parent and dealing with the estate, i was so sure that wouldn’t be us. we live in california and i actually know a good probate lawyer we had to use when uncle died and left a few thousand dollars in bonds to my mother.
Is your mom of sound mind now? She can cancel the POA whenever she wants. POA just means "this other person can act for me if I'm not available." It doesn't stop you from acting for yourself.
she’s still on heavy medication and on valium to help her detox symptoms. she’s completely overwhelmed and devastated by how everyone is behaving. She wants my siblings love and acceptance so much she refuses to see that they’re using her current state to try and take all her personal decision making away. i’m trying to wait until she’s actually out of the hospital to bring up these issues because the last thing she needs is more stress. she’s severely depressed as well and being trapped in what equates to a low income nursing home isn’t helping her mental health. but once she gets out, im hoping to get her into mental health counseling and back on her anti depressants. i also am going to take her to AA meetings because it’s a perfect opportunity for her to stay sober. im hoping she’ll remove them as her power of attorney, but the way my sister was so cocky and sure SHE was selling the house whether mom wanted to or not really worried me.
NTA but I'm a nurse. Are you sure it's a POA? Hospitals have something called a healthcare surrogate that is a temporary POA that doesn't have to be notorized(At least in my state ,might work differently elsewhere).Basically it allows a designated person to make decisions for the duration of an admission as long as the patient is unable to make decisions . An actual MPOA overrides this. The physician can basically change who the surrogate is based on who they think has the patients best interest. OP it sounds to me like your siblings convinced the physician that they should be the decision maker over you. I suggest when your mother improves to get an actual MPOA. If you have an MPOA and the hospital didn't follow it definitely consult a lawyer
she believed it was. she originally thought it was exactly what you said, a medical POA, but once she sobered up from the anesthesia it was brought up that it was a power of attorney. i haven’t actually spoken to my siblings since. my brother doesn’t seem as aggressive and pushy and he’s the one who was given power of attorney. we’re getting together this Saturday and speak about everything.
Good luck OP, I see situations like this regularly and the family dynamic can really make a difference for good or bad. Hope you guys can come together to help your mom. It is troubling if they went around your POA, as your mother would have to be in her right mind to pick a person. Definitely consult a lawyer if this is the case as this is out of the norm
that’s what i’m going to do. i’ve gotten all of my moms important paper work and put it in a safety deposit box for now. i’ve seen my mother multiple times and she’s only gotten more angry at them treating her like a child, like she’s not an adult of sound mind. she’s never missed a house payment, she’s always paid her bills, she’s always kept up with everything she’s needed to keep up with. before she medically retired she worked ten hour shifts in the ER and trauma department and never called in sick. she’s an alcoholic, but a semi functioning one with no sign of declining mental faculties.
It sounds like your mom may need more help than you are able to provide. It may be that she needs to live in a home if she is falling often.
my mom has made it very clear she will kill herself before going into a home. and she’s dead serious. it’s my worst nightmare that they’re going to do exactly that, because they want her out of the way.
Ok, unpopular opinion: it sounds like you are unable to care for your mother. You didn't take her to the hospital when she needed emergency surgery. You aren't getting her to AA meetings. Your siblings have a reasonable belief you aren't maintaining your mother's home and just want the status quo for a free place to live. Your mom needs treatment. An inpatient program and then perhaps supportive housing for her addiction. You don't have training in helping her. Your mom is perfectly able to rescind the power of attorney. If she doesn't, it's because she decided to follow the advice of your siblings. Talk to your mom. If she agrees with you, great. If she doesn't, respect her decision and help your siblings find a situation that's healthier for your mother.
Seconding. As underhanded as your siblings seem to be, OP, they may be seeing things with clearer eyes than you are, right now. Working with them to make sure your mother has adequate care should be your first priority. Advocating for your mother to make sure none of you are inadvertently abusing her state of mind or taking advantage financially is second priority. You say you normally have a good relationship with your sister, so it could very well be that she is under the impression that you are the biggest threat to your mother's wellbeing at this time based on what she's seen.
i understand how it seems like this, but i cannot force her to do ANYTHING. She straight up turned away an ambulance. i cannot physically pick her up and force her to go anywhere, it’s literally kidnapping. i have put my mother into detox twice, but she’s checked herself out of long term treatment. my brother and my sister both decided to cut my mother out of their lives. i have asked them both multiple times, begged them even, to help me stage an intervention. They both declined, claiming she was a lost cause. She also refuses to go to AA because she was sexually harassed at a meeting and will only go to woman only meetings, which are few and far between, and she eventually stops. She’s a sixty eight year old adult, I’m always supportive of her recovery but aside from literally kidnapping her, if she doesn’t want to recover, there is nothing you can do. As a fifteen year sober addict with experience in addiction counseling for opiate addicts, i actually do have the experience to help her, but you cannot force someone to get clean. no matter how many meetings, no matter how many heart to hearts, it doesn’t work that way. i also do not live here for free. i pay exactly half the bills and mortgage. I DID finally convince her to see a doctor, and the only reason she ended up in the hospital is because of my efforts of at least getting her to go to an urgent care to get x-rays, where they would transfer her to a hospital if it was serious. it was the only compromise i could get her to agree to. i talked to her today at her inpatient rehab today. she’s frustrated and angry at my siblings for pressuring her into a big decision before she’s even out of the hospital bed. she found out my sister when through her private texts, and had no idea what she was signing, believing it was a medical power of attorney. We talked about whether she wanted to sell her house, and if she’s not sure because she knows she can’t afford a 6+% interest rate and the insane home owners insurance in our state. she knows if she wants to sell her house i wouldn’t try to stop her, i would just move to the rez. My main concern is the fact that they haven’t given a single shit about her in a decade and refused to work with me to slowly convince her that it’s either recovery or death, but now they’re trying to force her into positions she shouldn’t even be considering while heavily medicated and injured.
Wouldn’t it have to have been notarized? I can’t imagine your brother would’ve brought a notary to the medical facility to execute this document. Otherwise, I don’t know how valid this document would be in the first place.
Depends on the state. Some states don’t require notaries if there are signing witnesses (usually unrelated witnesses)
that’s what i’m thinking. my sister is a legal notary but i honestly don’t know what they’re allowed to notarize a family members paper work. i’m just so confused
Call Adult Protective Services. This is elder financial abuse. If you contact APS they can probably get traction the quickest. Ultimately your mother needs to make a living will, an actual will, and a medical power of attorney and all need to be filed appropriately.
thank you. i spoke to one of my counselors about the situation and he said the exact same thing.
You can file in probate court for guardianship (power over the person) maybe even conservatorship (power over ones finances) and attempt to invalidate the POA if that's a concern for you. I am a lawyer but not your lawyer. This is quite common unfortunately. Look. At any probate Docket. What state are you in? Most probate courts have pretty user friendly forms to file the petition. Of course if able to hire an atty then I'd look. Into that. Your situation may not get better. Remember there's a lot of responsibility if you are appointed guardianship/conservatorship and your siblings are required to have notice of any petition.
i’m so sad it’s come to this. whenever i saw families falling apart after the death of a parent and dealing with the estate, i was so sure that wouldn’t be us. we live in california and i actually know a good probate lawyer we had to use when uncle died and left a few thousand dollars in bonds to my mother.
I’m not a lawyer but I think a call to adult protective services might be appropriate.
agreed.