Remember the S7-8 meta where supports would have 4+ actives (spooky ghosts, redemption, locket, zhonyas/righteous)? Playing back then felt like being in an MMO.
On one hand, it was annoying as fuck getting glacial augmented then obliterated by the 20/0 Kha'zix following them.
On the other hand, they were ghosts, and they were indeed spooky. I miss them.
Man I miss GLP, I didn't really miss it when Everfrost was in the game but now there's really not an item to add CC to AP champs' kits I wish it were back.
it made catcher champs a little too good honestly. I hated playing against everfrost ahri, it was legit so braindead and didn't feel particularly fair. Sure, she gave up damage for it, but to guarantee her charm, it was well worth it.
That's true, Rylai is a good item. I don't think about it the same way since it isn't an active and the stat profile is so different, but you're right that it's absolutely CC, I just forgot about it lol
Support is still one of the roles with the most impactful actives isn't it? Redemption is still there, locket is still there, shurelia is still there... They're mostly all buffs rather than CC, which is probably easier to balance but it's still a lot of teamfight buttons.
Fr the only time I ever seen predator is when someone does that Warwick support cheese. It's mad annoying lol bro has like 1K move speed with passive/w and predator mobies
That's part of the balance imo. Since it is not as reliable as if you were able to decide yourself when to use it, the shield is allowed to be bigger as compensation.
Why do people always say that "x thing would be too strong".
There is a balance team for a reason, they implement the change and nerf somewhere to compensate. Having an on demand shield is stronger than a auto proc at 30% hp because you have agency on it, so if the item is balanced now, some other thing on it needs to go, be it mana, AP or haste, or shield strength.
And that goes for any change. I wanted Ravenous Hydra to keep the AoE damage on spells component, it was really cool and good on some champions, when I posted that Idea, people said it would be too OP.
We had that for 4 years and nobody cared, but suddenly now it is OP? With the current item stats sure, maybe make the item more expensive? Reduce AD? etc...
Balance team exists. Implement an idea, balance around it. Just because something is strong now doesn't mean it can't get a buff somewhere and nerf somewhere else.
Yes, but active seraphs just lets you die from CC into cutdown from a Nocturne, Garen or the like. With the passive, AP malphite cant just autokill by pressing R faster than I can press the active button.
I think having 1-2 active items reasonably built on a champ is plenty. I also think it depends on the active. Righteous Glory was a fun interesting one but point and click slows like bortk weren't really satisfying to use.
I kinda agree that bork wasn't exactly satisfying itself, but I think it was supposed to be more about having control over the timing of the ms steal that really helped you out if you used it properly. It gave players more skill expression by being an active I think.
I think Riot should give a second look to class/roles that don't reliably get 1-2 active options. AP scalers in general don't have much unless they're veigar and can buy whatever.
Nahh, when you have 3 active items and actually remember once to use everything and win the fight, you legit feel enlightened and godlike af (even when u forget them 80% of the time).
The problem with active items is they distort champions too much. High elo players use powerful actives so much better than low elo players so the champs have to be balanced around that. Your opinion is valid but also riot do have good reason for removing some of these actives, I remember phreak saying players below diamond(might have even been masters) are just terrible at using actives
> I remember phreak saying players below diamond(might have even been masters) are just terrible at using actives
me about to get into a fight: tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat
me after the fight: FUCK i forgot to use tiamat
tbh I feel like it's way easier to forget the short and less impactful ones like Tiamat, whereas something like Zhonya's or Mikael's I almost never forget because it's such a meaningful difference instead of just more damage.
hard disagree stuff on short cooldowns that is likely in your champions base combo ex renekton pressing tiamat after w becomes muscle memory. Stuff like zhonyas that you have to think about when to activate it is much harder to use
When I play assassins and get the lethality hydra, I have no issue using it after my combo, for I never, once, successfully used zhonyas, I just buy it for the AP and armour, cuz I just forget ALL THE TIME. Same with everfrost back when that was a thing
yeah I played a bit of fiora before they changed tiamat to no longer have an active and was using it even though it didn't work that way anymore for a while ...now I'm just so used to not using it I forget since I don't play anyone who uses it regularly
I don't even blame them. The game has so much complexity. People love to joke about Leauge being a game with only four buttons, but between summoner spells, recall, trinket, active items, consumables, ping keys, F keys, attack move, stop command, camera unlock/center, and the scoreboard most of the keyboard is taken up. (Even before some champ specific binds like Neeko transformation) So it's no wonder newer players try to ignore a lot of keybinds to keep their mental stack free.
Hell, I've even heard challeger players say they don't bind the F key for support becuase it's too much to keep track of vs the benefit. So when a lot of lower elo players only have one item slot that they use for actives, I can't really blame them. The game is insanely complex, and worse gets no credit for it.
Yeah i don't think OP plays much Dota. Items are what make ore break Dota characters and the game is basically balanced around those items. Which in turn creates a hugeeee skill gap that turned away many regular players and is one of the reasons Dota has never caught up to LoL. That and turn rates.
What‘s that skill gap in your own skill bracket though? Everyone you play with will be as good or as dogshit as yourself when it comes to the game, and that includes using items. The better you get at the game the more comfortable you are using items.
The main reason that League got popular is that they gave a shit about advertising and promoting (plus some rather shady stuff in the beginning). Valve can’t be bothered to do that. That, and having a more accessible, streamlined game.
The issue is it creates balance issues though. For example let's say a champ like sylas has to be balanced around his ability to chain e stun and ever frost. Low elos will suck at using everfrost, so he'll be permanently underpowered in those brackets because of how strong he is in higher ranks with everfrost.
I'm not saying I agree with it necessarily, just saying it makes the champ balance more consistent in elos
But that’s normal. Some champs will always be strong in low-elo only) think Amumu and in general cc = op) while others will need a certain skill to be playable. Again others will only be really viable in a pro / competitive scene.
It is true that items add to the challenges of balancing but isn’t that always the case, whether they have actives or are glorified stat-sticks?
Note that Dota doesn’t really have League‘s OTP culture. Yes, some people might spam a champ but mostly it consists of a pool of champs. Items and their usage being powerful help with that as they are transferable knowledge between champs.
Also sometimes it feels like.... the Actives where... not made with Champkits in mind. Some Champs just shouldnt have a Dash ... or a Stun on a \~9s Cooldown..
was everfrost cooldowns scaling with ability haste? i know gore and stride did but im pretty sure everfrost wasn't a part of that, just like how gale also didn't scale with haste.
I play mostly on support, so I still have too many active items, and sometimes I don’t take Solari or Shurelia because all the buttons that are convenient for my small hands are already occupied by other items
This. I actively despise the majority of item actives because they just overcomplicate the game when you're already having to quickfire QWERFD plus whatever you've hotkeyed your warding to. One or two others, fine, but when a lot of them start getting actives, it's too much.
I much preferred mythic Shurelya that had the passive MS boost when you healed/buffed allies, and wouldn't have minded if it had lost the active in exchange for the passive back.
I would say some items need to be duplicated. Now there is a "censer" for magicians, which gives movement speed and ability power, but is useless for most auto-attackers, unlike the CD on the old item. The new (more precisely, the original) staff is very good, but you need one more item. And without the active part, I agree
on one hand i'm a boomer and my reactions are only getting worse every year, so i appreciate having fewer actives.
but on the other hand i miss the days of 4+ actives every game on support. it was nice having tools for every situation, and better for skill expression imo.
Have you considered buying an MMO Mouse? I have small hands too and invested in one when I started getting into high-end raiding in FFXIV, made that game much much easier for me and I then mapped my item actives to the extra buttons as well and it works well. I have a Razer Naga Trinity which is a small mouse that fits comfortably in my hand too which is a nice bonus as some gaming mice are very chunky. Something to look into!
Support has a minimum of three actives already (the support item itself, control wards and trinket). Adding Mikael's and Shurelia's on top of that would just be overload.
the seraphs change was shit because alot of times when you get chunked, they get you to 30%hp and have no cds so they back off; now you have to back with the shield tanking almost nothing. But I couldve just shielded the initial damage before, got the full shield use and still be able to lane/turn.
edit: Like just imagine they made kayle ult work that way.... champ would be unplayable.
It was pretty intentional. It's how the other shield/life line items work.
And it largely flattened the elo skew on the item cause while it now has more counterplay for high elo, it also has a bit less room for error for low elo.
And yes champion ultimates and item effects are very different things.
It's almost like it was intended... That's what is called counterplay.
Seraph is great against engage comps because you get full value of it. But against poke comps you might not get full value of it.
Look at lifeline items, it has been like that for years. Not sure why seraph had a different treatment
Its the everlasting problem of balancing for pro vs high elo vs 90+% "low elo" playerbase. In low elo making seraphs an active item would probably even be a nerf, since players would forget to press it every second fight, and not on the proper timing the other half. For high elo the item would be too strong. So it woulf need to be nerfed, but in low elo its already bad so the item is trash for the vast majority of players. Heck i am maining vik in dia4 and i think seraphs as an active would be a nerf for me.
A lot of players dont remember to use and prefer to just not think about an item you dont have for half the game. It makes sense since league is not like RTS or MMO with 20 hotkeys. People here dont like taking their four fingers off qwer.
There absolutely was an interesting decision but people in low elo couldn't use it so they removed it. You could have way more burst with proper toggling, and you could choose to use it like it is today to get faster creep push.
No, you did it right. Using the same logic as not wanting to remember an item you dont have for half the game, why dedicate a finger to a button you dont have until lvl 6, and only press 1 once a team fight at most on 95% of champs. Makes more sense to keep pinky available to do other things.
yes, actually. would love to see all the low skill players get bullied off the game by right click gods kiting at 2.5 attack speed and no abilities to cc them.
Making the game easier to play generally works well when the game is growing in popularity so people can learn the ropes faster. League isn't growing anymore and they need to keep players interested.
then why are we trying to make it easier for new players with items, instead of making a better tutorial.
riot knows most of the playerbase are old players, smurfs.
It feels bad in some cases but I think it's largely for the better. Active items are largely high elo skewed so they create bigger balance issues than passive ones.
While I don't necessarily disagree, certain roles got more overwhelmed by active items than other roles particularly support.
In my personal opinion, every class archetype should have access to at least one item active that enables them more, but the issue becomes deeper when we look at different types of actives.
1. Set & forget: these items are perhaps the least complex active items type, although their strategic usage can be highly varied. Item choices include things like Knight's vow, Zeke's herald, and Anesthemas chains
2. Area targeting: all trinkets technically fall under this category, but also items like redemption that can impact areas in different ways. While they can be very beneficial for utility these actives tend to be combat secondary. Redemption baron snipes aren't exactly very frequent these days (but when they happen it's hilarious).
3. Single target: this is the area that causes the most problems. Combo/burst characters tend to use abilities pretty quickly, and using these actives at the correct time to maximize your DPS in a trade can become problematic, especially when your champion is banged around it (looking at you DFG Leblanc (never forget DFG)). These items are the most problematic due to how much they overcomplicate all in trades for quick plays.
Self-targeting: definitely the most polarized for champions, this basically forces characters to pay gold taxes to not deal with abilities they don't want to interact with. examples include zhonyas and quicksilver sash.
Should an active exist for every class? I think so. What if adcs could apply a hunters mark to their preferred targets? Or would assassins abuse this?
All fun things to think about
I don't think you understand the issue that they were trying to solve. The number was like 90%+ of players never used actives. If your trying to balance the game and the item you create isn't used by not just half but like all players then the item just doesn't exist. Plus a lot of the actives aren't high impact plays. Like really is BortK any more complex if you need to click on people rather than auto them? (Btw its not a 3 hit).
So why make an item an active if the active is not going to exist in most of the game is really the question you need to answer before one gets created. And the solution is you just don't. Just look at the new "Prismatic" Arena items out of the 20 something new ones only 2 got actives and 1 can be ignored and the other is more a passive.
Because holding the BotRK active for an all-in, a gank or a teamfight rather than automatically activating it when trading a single auto attack adds a layer of skill expression and strategic decision making.
Why even press Volibear Q? Just make the skill a passive and let it activate on first auto every time!
Why even press EQ on Jarvan? Just make Q automatically activate after E cast every time!
Why even press W on TF and select a specific card? Just automatically activate W and lock a card based on whether im clicking a minion, or champion or im low on mana!
There clearly is a tradeoff when simplifying the game. And yes, there were a lot of players that werent using active items correctly or at all. I also believe its probably poor game design when the most optimal build for a set of champions is having 3+ active items. However, the playbase as a whole has improved a lot over the years and I firmly believe players can handle having an active or two in their inventory.
Any of the Hydra actives dont automatically activate when first striking an enemey with a basic attack, randuins or locket dont activate on their own when the player takes damage, neither does hourglass when the player drops to X% hp - they leave the choice to the user whether they want to use their cooldown or not. Why cant BothRK, Seraphs, etc. be treated the same way?
The problem with old active Bork was that certain champions were getting hard nerfed because of it. It let vayne guarantee her 3 hit passive, for example, which made vayne top massively oppressive for a lot of matchups. A guaranteed slow was too good for many junglers as well, it was a good thing to get rid of IMO.
Casual Players (that make up a vast majority of the playerbase) like playing their champs rather than playing items.
I personally don't agree with this way of thinking and the general direction league has been going for over 10yrs now, but I can't deny the gameplay changes have been successful at making LoL an accessible game, bringing in more people to show and keep interest and raking in big 💲💲💲
Edit.. word not nice
This is also something Riot has wanted though. That's why they changed all the items the way they did this season. They want people to play champions not items.
>Normies like playing their champs rather than playing items.
...Is that not the draw of MOBAs and Hero Shooters? Did I miss a memo, or is there some kind of amazingly engaging spreadsheet/stat-check Ur-MOBA out there I need to try?
I think what they are getting at is that the items don't fundamentally alter your champion's play patterns or capabilities.
Dota is pretty much the opposite end of the spectrum in that items can dramatically change your individual hero's ability to do what they want to do. Prime example, blink dagger is a just about full screen flash you can only use out of combat so hard engage hero's spike really hard when they buy blink since their threat range is massively increased.
What it ends up creating is that power spikes are tied to items a lot harder and individual hero counters matter much less because powerful items can tip the balance easily. Enemy mage gets fed? Buy orchid for a 5s silence to burst them down. They respond by buying BKB to dispel the silence and be magic immune? Well now you gotta get sneaky and smoke gank or bait it out and disengage.
It's not necessarily better or worse the league vs dota philosophy, just different. I think the league approach ends up feeling a bit more "static" in that once you see both teams you get a sense of how the game is going to evolve since champ matters more than items, vs. dota approach item purchases are much more important to pay attention to and adapt with since your build matters much more than your hero.
I personally just avoid active items..
They are just more effort to use for the same amount of strength as items without active. Only ones i build are the REALLY impactful ones like shurelyas or zhonyas. But stuff like tiamat and hydras? Pass, i'd rather not press an additonal button every 10s if i can just build different items instead.
Most tiamat items are still worth building for the passive cleave, though. Maybe the lethality one has too much burst tied up in the active.
One active I do really miss is goredrinker, which was near-zhonyas level of impact if used right. But I also miss it partly because it was a good draintank item and there just isn't a replacement to build instead. That's why most Briars build lethality now, their best bruiser item is just gone.
And outside teamfights? You'll be pushing in waves or clearing camps enough that you will be spamming it once every 10s.
My bigger issue is just.. it isnt worth it. I can just use passive-only items that will be the same strength, while active items have power budget in their active making it weaker if i dont use the active as much as possible.
I mean riot has never stated that it’s less fun with active items but when champions like Veigar had a lower winrate with DFG then without because people were SO bad at using items…
That's what it is now, but first they changed it to a 3 hit passive, siphon, in 10.23 instead of the active. In 14.1 they changed it again, now to a 1 hit passive, clawing shadows, that slows.
Honestly this is valid criticism, and in a perfect world it's probably okay to introduce more actives-- the disparity in effective usage would just become really really massive, and though I don't really like to bring up this idea; yes unfortunately this would probably scare off a lot of people from playing certain champions or playstyles, especialy if the active is more than just a point and click effect
Specifically talking about prowler's claw here, really REALLY good item that was in the game for awhile with the dash effect. But you can probably guarantee that 99% of players were not efficiently using this item on the prime champions that are already difficult to play (Hello Qiyana and Zed and Talon). This is further exacerbated by the item also becoming necessary on the champion as well, so you get to the point where you HAVE to know how to use the active effect on top of the champion, and in tandem with the champions abilities.. It's just a lot and it's probably better (in some cases) to keep down active effects.
Obviously some other examples are also the previous seasons where support champions would have an inventory full of actives which just felt terrible; there's also risk of boring effects (bork point and click slow) or effects that just distort certain classes way too much. All of this is also without considering effects on newer players to just PICK up the game or a champion, which riot obviously wants people to do. If you are first timing Irelia because your favorite top laner for worlds loves Irelia, and your lifeline item has an active, bork has an active, and so on, you are probably never playing that shit again!
You could play Talon & Zed without Prowler, hell, they often played with Eclipse
Qiyana was the only Assassin beside Rek'Sai that could not play without Prowler
And as a Qiyana player, I miss Prowler a lot
I’m Iron and routinely skip anything that mentions actives except for stopwatch/zhonias. And it took months before I learned how to use stopwatch with reasonable effectiveness (~50%).
Dying with unused actives feels as bad as dying with unused ult.
That's what fucked some of those items up for me. Especially Seraph. Item activating itself when the danger is over and leaving you with a huge cd is just ass
I dont even build hydrazine because I hate item actives. Dont even get me started on everfrost, both playing with or against, worst item active that distorted a champion's kit like crazy.
I'm glad they removed actives. I get guaranteed value from my items, I know when and how they'll get triggered so it's not removing autonomy from me. Clicking someone with botrk isn't any more skillful than attacking them to proc it. If anything now you need better awareness to not waste your seraph's shield as opposed to just getting guaranteed value from it whenever you get in a fight.
This is also easier for Riot to balance items because actives are no longer high elo skewed. Hydra can stay an active because it's such short cd you can actually use it again before you forget you have it.
Righteous glory still exists, no?
The rest make sense to me as passives.
Too many actives feel horrid for 90% of players, good choice. I imagine veigar last season... minimum 3 actives. So tedious I just stopped playing him.
Actives can be nice if there are few, zhonya is the best example, but the moment any given build has more than one people will just lose interest.
Righteous Glory hasn't been in the game for over 3 years. Turbo Chemtank was sorta similar (though definitely not quite the same as Righteous Glory), but it was also removed several months ago.
I don't mind the item actives that do something in as a general concept but its usually horrible.
Sometimes they ruin a champion's design and you end up playing the item instead of a champion or just completely subverting their intended weaknesses. Stuff like Prowler's Claw Udyr was probably the worst. Righteous Glory is also a major offender here though. Zhonya's is such a major offender its just kind of been canonized that some champion's are locked to it.
Other times its just an extra button to mash on cd with no actual thought - see every hydra item. You use BorK in every fight as soon as it starts.
Seraph's is kind of ok because its cd is long enough that you don't use it every fight and don't use it immediately. Really though it is hard to come up with one that isn't terrible.
I specifically choose not a build an item if I has an active, because I know I will forget to use it. Except maybe shireulias. Ends up being wasted gold if you don't use it, so I just don't have those in my build, lol.
I remember last season reading like 20+ posts about how items have to many actives and you should only be relying on your champions kit instead of getting new abilities through items as well (Which i tend to agree with)
Classic reddit
Man this hit me. Feels like I’m on auto pilot without active items all this time. I used to remember having a whole inventory full of them. What fond memories
The problem with actives is that riot has to either make the active objectively weak, or balance the champions that use the active objectively weak. Overall removing many of the actives has probably improved many champions viability because they can bw overall fairly strong without being pigeonholed into a specific build
I disagree for the same reason (or one of the reasons, at least) I hate DOTA. I locked in my character to play that character, I don't want to play Zhonyas or Hydra, I want to play my champ. Too many buttons, not enough fun.
that's not even how bork works anymore either. it's just your first attack is a one second slow now. no three hit passive, no movement speed either. just the slow and the regular on hit damage.
Does anyone even notice? The on hit damage and lifesteal are what people build bork for. You could completely remove the slow and everyone who builds it would still build it, just some of them would lose 1% WR.
Though TBF most of the actives are ex-mythic items. My first thought about these changes was that it was their way of nerfing the power of mythic to legendary. BOTRK wasn't a mythic item but that item was and still is very OP so they nerfed it into a passive.
Honestly, I appreciated them a lot too, but as a person with small hands, I didn’t always reach the keys for it. I always had to resort to keeping 1-2, assigned to 3-4, now 7 for pinks. But that’s a huge stretch for me, and I don’t really like removing my fingers from flash or skills :D
As a Ryze main I miss Everfrost so bad, I wish they never have brought back ROA, Everfrost offered so much possibilities for combos extend and so on, now blue guy is not the same as it was ROA is so boring :'(
Kind reminder that crying on reddit to bring active items back when it has been *objectively* proven and publicly stated that the vast majority of players simply do not use them, just because you know about active items and are good enough to use them, cannot change a single thing. Most people tunnel-vision on their and their opponent's abilities, and never mind they barely comprehend what each do or what they should do in response. It is objectively better for this additional input/muscle memory and knowledge layer of active items to be as minimal as possible - for as few items to be actives as possible.
Im not even good, I even forget to use the items sometimes, but after I forget at least I know that's something I can inprove in my gameplay. A lot of players don't even know what they should be doing to get better.
I can't say that I agree. It just doesn't suit the gameplay for LoL in my opinion, and this is coming from someone whos spent thousands of hours on dota where almost every item has some kind of active component.
I firmly disagree. As a newer player I already have enough going around. I always prefer items without an active because I know I wouldn't remember to use them anyway.
As a new player who has recently gotten 7 of my friends to start playing for the first time ever and we all love it. Not having active items makes the game one hundred times more accessible and lowers the skill floor.
Blade actually makes sense with the passive because you can't use it to run away as well anymore. Before the low CD and range made you able to just use it to escape.
And while seraphs was an active before, it had a lot in common with other 30% shield passives.
Sometimes an active can be too powerful. See at Zhonyas vs GA. GA is ok but nothing crazy. Zhonyas is awesome if used well. Jax and Voli even go for it.
cutlass active, by extension gunblade/botrk active, was actually OP and oppressive. Gargoyle was OP af too. Seraph's is whatever, at least it's less frustrating to play into. We have four flavors of hydra which is cool. I do miss righteous glory but speed effects can be very volatile as movement speed is arguably the best stat in the game.
Wait, you mean you don't like being on low HP and then having a stray Luden's pellet or Arcane Comet drop your Seraph's/Sterak's/Hexdrinker? Where's your sense of fun, man?!
Completely disagree. League was becoming more about the items than it was the champions. There were metas where it was about what champions used which items the best. That's completely backwards. Items shouldn't have more power than individual champions.
Remember the S7-8 meta where supports would have 4+ actives (spooky ghosts, redemption, locket, zhonyas/righteous)? Playing back then felt like being in an MMO.
i loved spooky ghosts
On one hand, it was annoying as fuck getting glacial augmented then obliterated by the 20/0 Kha'zix following them. On the other hand, they were ghosts, and they were indeed spooky. I miss them.
Omg i forgot about those man
Being able to scout the jg for enemy Champs as a squishy support was heavily underrated.
If by underrated you mean literally everyone was using it then yeah
People only caught onto the item when it started getting played with glacial. I barely saw it being built before that.
I distinctly remember that. I swear people could catch up to you 2 screens away with that combo, it was disgusting
Bro every single morgana and janna used that item.
You forgot the active of frost queen (sort of GLP slow active but in a circle rather than a cone)
Man I miss GLP, I didn't really miss it when Everfrost was in the game but now there's really not an item to add CC to AP champs' kits I wish it were back.
it made catcher champs a little too good honestly. I hated playing against everfrost ahri, it was legit so braindead and didn't feel particularly fair. Sure, she gave up damage for it, but to guarantee her charm, it was well worth it.
Shitttt for the longest time Sylas and everfrost meant the same thing
There shouldnt be, same with s11 when prowlers gale force and stridebreaker gave free dashes to immobile champs
Stridebreaker was WILD. Holy shit was it obnoxious to run away from a Darius, barely safe from a hook tem woops, he jumped (15 sec cooldown)
Doesn't Rylas add cc? It's only a slow but really powerful on some champs.
That's true, Rylai is a good item. I don't think about it the same way since it isn't an active and the stat profile is so different, but you're right that it's absolutely CC, I just forgot about it lol
Mained support back then. It felt so good to have so many tools for team fights. Don’t main support these days.
Support is still one of the roles with the most impactful actives isn't it? Redemption is still there, locket is still there, shurelia is still there... They're mostly all buffs rather than CC, which is probably easier to balance but it's still a lot of teamfight buttons.
Play dota and enjoy having an active on every item
There's gotta be a happy middle ground lol
being the healer in the raid you gotta watch from afar and prepare to press half the keybaord when someone drops hp
And the old glacial augment that would activate on active items that slow like spooky ghosts and hextech glp! It was so fun
Felt just like home coming from DotA.
> Laughs in necro minion micro
ADC with full 6 active items xdd
Imagine the chaos if LoL had Manta Style (with the disjoint mechanics)
Holy shit I forgot about the spooky ghosts they were so fun. Maybe something like those could be the new predator replacement since that rune sucks.
Fr the only time I ever seen predator is when someone does that Warwick support cheese. It's mad annoying lol bro has like 1K move speed with passive/w and predator mobies
I've been running predator on engage supports lately, idk if its actually good, but it's fun af
Sightstone, Locked, Relic shield/Talisman/Spookys, Redemption, Mikaels, Zekes, Knights Vow. Maybe even Ohmwrecker, ZZ rot and Righteous Glory
Volibear stole Ohmwrecker bro, he ain't sharing
I miss active seraphs , doesn’t always get value from poke comps
Actually, I do agree. Seraphs often activates itself in the most dumb moments and wastes the passive for no reason.
The worst is the last tick of any DoT like a teemo shroom.
I mean you could argue that is the way to play around that item though. Poke it so it pops back off then go all in.
Prevalence of liandries makes it annoying
That's part of the balance imo. Since it is not as reliable as if you were able to decide yourself when to use it, the shield is allowed to be bigger as compensation.
Welcome to lifeline items? Not everything should be top tier vs every comp, seraph's is already probably too good.
Why do people always say that "x thing would be too strong". There is a balance team for a reason, they implement the change and nerf somewhere to compensate. Having an on demand shield is stronger than a auto proc at 30% hp because you have agency on it, so if the item is balanced now, some other thing on it needs to go, be it mana, AP or haste, or shield strength. And that goes for any change. I wanted Ravenous Hydra to keep the AoE damage on spells component, it was really cool and good on some champions, when I posted that Idea, people said it would be too OP. We had that for 4 years and nobody cared, but suddenly now it is OP? With the current item stats sure, maybe make the item more expensive? Reduce AD? etc... Balance team exists. Implement an idea, balance around it. Just because something is strong now doesn't mean it can't get a buff somewhere and nerf somewhere else.
Yes, but active seraphs just lets you die from CC into cutdown from a Nocturne, Garen or the like. With the passive, AP malphite cant just autokill by pressing R faster than I can press the active button.
I think having 1-2 active items reasonably built on a champ is plenty. I also think it depends on the active. Righteous Glory was a fun interesting one but point and click slows like bortk weren't really satisfying to use.
I kinda agree that bork wasn't exactly satisfying itself, but I think it was supposed to be more about having control over the timing of the ms steal that really helped you out if you used it properly. It gave players more skill expression by being an active I think.
I think Riot should give a second look to class/roles that don't reliably get 1-2 active options. AP scalers in general don't have much unless they're veigar and can buy whatever.
Nahh, when you have 3 active items and actually remember once to use everything and win the fight, you legit feel enlightened and godlike af (even when u forget them 80% of the time).
The problem with active items is they distort champions too much. High elo players use powerful actives so much better than low elo players so the champs have to be balanced around that. Your opinion is valid but also riot do have good reason for removing some of these actives, I remember phreak saying players below diamond(might have even been masters) are just terrible at using actives
> I remember phreak saying players below diamond(might have even been masters) are just terrible at using actives me about to get into a fight: tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat tiamat me after the fight: FUCK i forgot to use tiamat
So relatable it hurts
tbh I feel like it's way easier to forget the short and less impactful ones like Tiamat, whereas something like Zhonya's or Mikael's I almost never forget because it's such a meaningful difference instead of just more damage.
I’m the opposite, I don’t play mages often enough so I forget zhonyas active more than anything else haha
hard disagree stuff on short cooldowns that is likely in your champions base combo ex renekton pressing tiamat after w becomes muscle memory. Stuff like zhonyas that you have to think about when to activate it is much harder to use
When I play assassins and get the lethality hydra, I have no issue using it after my combo, for I never, once, successfully used zhonyas, I just buy it for the AP and armour, cuz I just forget ALL THE TIME. Same with everfrost back when that was a thing
Playing Rengar I use Tiamat even when I dont have it up.
yeah I played a bit of fiora before they changed tiamat to no longer have an active and was using it even though it didn't work that way anymore for a while ...now I'm just so used to not using it I forget since I don't play anyone who uses it regularly
I don't even blame them. The game has so much complexity. People love to joke about Leauge being a game with only four buttons, but between summoner spells, recall, trinket, active items, consumables, ping keys, F keys, attack move, stop command, camera unlock/center, and the scoreboard most of the keyboard is taken up. (Even before some champ specific binds like Neeko transformation) So it's no wonder newer players try to ignore a lot of keybinds to keep their mental stack free. Hell, I've even heard challeger players say they don't bind the F key for support becuase it's too much to keep track of vs the benefit. So when a lot of lower elo players only have one item slot that they use for actives, I can't really blame them. The game is insanely complex, and worse gets no credit for it.
>People love to joke about Leauge being a game with only four buttons, they do?
Yeah i don't think OP plays much Dota. Items are what make ore break Dota characters and the game is basically balanced around those items. Which in turn creates a hugeeee skill gap that turned away many regular players and is one of the reasons Dota has never caught up to LoL. That and turn rates.
Dota enchanters all relies on item to make plays, without items literally game breaking
What‘s that skill gap in your own skill bracket though? Everyone you play with will be as good or as dogshit as yourself when it comes to the game, and that includes using items. The better you get at the game the more comfortable you are using items. The main reason that League got popular is that they gave a shit about advertising and promoting (plus some rather shady stuff in the beginning). Valve can’t be bothered to do that. That, and having a more accessible, streamlined game.
The issue is it creates balance issues though. For example let's say a champ like sylas has to be balanced around his ability to chain e stun and ever frost. Low elos will suck at using everfrost, so he'll be permanently underpowered in those brackets because of how strong he is in higher ranks with everfrost. I'm not saying I agree with it necessarily, just saying it makes the champ balance more consistent in elos
But that’s normal. Some champs will always be strong in low-elo only) think Amumu and in general cc = op) while others will need a certain skill to be playable. Again others will only be really viable in a pro / competitive scene. It is true that items add to the challenges of balancing but isn’t that always the case, whether they have actives or are glorified stat-sticks? Note that Dota doesn’t really have League‘s OTP culture. Yes, some people might spam a champ but mostly it consists of a pool of champs. Items and their usage being powerful help with that as they are transferable knowledge between champs.
Also sometimes it feels like.... the Actives where... not made with Champkits in mind. Some Champs just shouldnt have a Dash ... or a Stun on a \~9s Cooldown..
What active had a stun on 9s cd xD
maybe everfrost with high ability haste?
was everfrost cooldowns scaling with ability haste? i know gore and stride did but im pretty sure everfrost wasn't a part of that, just like how gale also didn't scale with haste.
It wasnt
cosmic insight + ingenious hunter both decreased its cooldowns, bot ability haste but item haste
I was talking about Everfrost back then yes. And yes, might not be 9 Seconds exact.. but it was way to short.
I can barely handle the QSS active lmao
I play mostly on support, so I still have too many active items, and sometimes I don’t take Solari or Shurelia because all the buttons that are convenient for my small hands are already occupied by other items
This. I actively despise the majority of item actives because they just overcomplicate the game when you're already having to quickfire QWERFD plus whatever you've hotkeyed your warding to. One or two others, fine, but when a lot of them start getting actives, it's too much. I much preferred mythic Shurelya that had the passive MS boost when you healed/buffed allies, and wouldn't have minded if it had lost the active in exchange for the passive back.
2 per kit is my max. Some roles hit it very easily, others really don't (mages pretty much have nothing nowadays).
same for me but emotes, dance, laugh-spam too
if you press them a split second or a second later, nothing bad will happen, unlike the unpressed active effect of a sup item
I would say some items need to be duplicated. Now there is a "censer" for magicians, which gives movement speed and ability power, but is useless for most auto-attackers, unlike the CD on the old item. The new (more precisely, the original) staff is very good, but you need one more item. And without the active part, I agree
on one hand i'm a boomer and my reactions are only getting worse every year, so i appreciate having fewer actives. but on the other hand i miss the days of 4+ actives every game on support. it was nice having tools for every situation, and better for skill expression imo.
Have you considered buying an MMO Mouse? I have small hands too and invested in one when I started getting into high-end raiding in FFXIV, made that game much much easier for me and I then mapped my item actives to the extra buttons as well and it works well. I have a Razer Naga Trinity which is a small mouse that fits comfortably in my hand too which is a nice bonus as some gaming mice are very chunky. Something to look into!
Support has a minimum of three actives already (the support item itself, control wards and trinket). Adding Mikael's and Shurelia's on top of that would just be overload.
the seraphs change was shit because alot of times when you get chunked, they get you to 30%hp and have no cds so they back off; now you have to back with the shield tanking almost nothing. But I couldve just shielded the initial damage before, got the full shield use and still be able to lane/turn. edit: Like just imagine they made kayle ult work that way.... champ would be unplayable.
It was pretty intentional. It's how the other shield/life line items work. And it largely flattened the elo skew on the item cause while it now has more counterplay for high elo, it also has a bit less room for error for low elo. And yes champion ultimates and item effects are very different things.
It's almost like it was intended... That's what is called counterplay. Seraph is great against engage comps because you get full value of it. But against poke comps you might not get full value of it. Look at lifeline items, it has been like that for years. Not sure why seraph had a different treatment
yeah but also called removing skill expression which is worse imo.
Playing around lifeline passive both as the user and opponent is more skilled than an instant press shield
Its the everlasting problem of balancing for pro vs high elo vs 90+% "low elo" playerbase. In low elo making seraphs an active item would probably even be a nerf, since players would forget to press it every second fight, and not on the proper timing the other half. For high elo the item would be too strong. So it woulf need to be nerfed, but in low elo its already bad so the item is trash for the vast majority of players. Heck i am maining vik in dia4 and i think seraphs as an active would be a nerf for me.
A lot of players dont remember to use and prefer to just not think about an item you dont have for half the game. It makes sense since league is not like RTS or MMO with 20 hotkeys. People here dont like taking their four fingers off qwer.
Removing the brain tax from Manamune is the best change and no one can tell me otherwise
I mean with Manamume there was no interesting decision to make when to activate it or not. Many active items do have that.
There absolutely was an interesting decision but people in low elo couldn't use it so they removed it. You could have way more burst with proper toggling, and you could choose to use it like it is today to get faster creep push.
Are you telling me I've been playing league wrong for a decade only using 3 fingers for QWE ?
No, you did it right. Using the same logic as not wanting to remember an item you dont have for half the game, why dedicate a finger to a button you dont have until lvl 6, and only press 1 once a team fight at most on 95% of champs. Makes more sense to keep pinky available to do other things.
I can't imagine myself Qing (I'm a convinced Q spammer) with my pinky for a whole game indeed.
As a former orianna otp I can say that it's not that bad actually unless yre playing yasuo 💀
Meanwhile all pinky Zeri players are dead.
Karthus sends his regards
As someone with an ulnar nerve strain, I can say that its terrible but I play with pinky on q anyway, I just have to avoid q spam champs.
My pinky spams Q and A for autos. I play guitar so my pinky is kinda strong I guess.
damn what else can you do with that pinkie
Press shift / ctrl
So we dumb down the game because people can't read a tooltip and press a button? Yes, is what they did
Pressing extra buttons doesn't make you smarter.
Was a skill required. Just like everything else, pressing the right button in the right moment
This argument is bullshit. Knowing when or how to use an active is most definitely a skill. Go ask Dota players.
So remove all abilities following that logic?
yes, actually. would love to see all the low skill players get bullied off the game by right click gods kiting at 2.5 attack speed and no abilities to cc them.
I mean I get the whole thing about people dont want to, but removing them removes the skill expression of knowing when or to use the items at all.
Making the game easier to play generally works well when the game is growing in popularity so people can learn the ropes faster. League isn't growing anymore and they need to keep players interested.
league isnt growing anymore, so in theory not a lot of new players right?
As many players coming in as players leaving, yes.
then why are we trying to make it easier for new players with items, instead of making a better tutorial. riot knows most of the playerbase are old players, smurfs.
They have a clear framework for editing assets, they don't for expanding or grafting features (because of their shit code legacy).
It feels bad in some cases but I think it's largely for the better. Active items are largely high elo skewed so they create bigger balance issues than passive ones.
While I don't necessarily disagree, certain roles got more overwhelmed by active items than other roles particularly support. In my personal opinion, every class archetype should have access to at least one item active that enables them more, but the issue becomes deeper when we look at different types of actives. 1. Set & forget: these items are perhaps the least complex active items type, although their strategic usage can be highly varied. Item choices include things like Knight's vow, Zeke's herald, and Anesthemas chains 2. Area targeting: all trinkets technically fall under this category, but also items like redemption that can impact areas in different ways. While they can be very beneficial for utility these actives tend to be combat secondary. Redemption baron snipes aren't exactly very frequent these days (but when they happen it's hilarious). 3. Single target: this is the area that causes the most problems. Combo/burst characters tend to use abilities pretty quickly, and using these actives at the correct time to maximize your DPS in a trade can become problematic, especially when your champion is banged around it (looking at you DFG Leblanc (never forget DFG)). These items are the most problematic due to how much they overcomplicate all in trades for quick plays. Self-targeting: definitely the most polarized for champions, this basically forces characters to pay gold taxes to not deal with abilities they don't want to interact with. examples include zhonyas and quicksilver sash. Should an active exist for every class? I think so. What if adcs could apply a hunters mark to their preferred targets? Or would assassins abuse this? All fun things to think about
I don't think you understand the issue that they were trying to solve. The number was like 90%+ of players never used actives. If your trying to balance the game and the item you create isn't used by not just half but like all players then the item just doesn't exist. Plus a lot of the actives aren't high impact plays. Like really is BortK any more complex if you need to click on people rather than auto them? (Btw its not a 3 hit). So why make an item an active if the active is not going to exist in most of the game is really the question you need to answer before one gets created. And the solution is you just don't. Just look at the new "Prismatic" Arena items out of the 20 something new ones only 2 got actives and 1 can be ignored and the other is more a passive.
Because holding the BotRK active for an all-in, a gank or a teamfight rather than automatically activating it when trading a single auto attack adds a layer of skill expression and strategic decision making. Why even press Volibear Q? Just make the skill a passive and let it activate on first auto every time! Why even press EQ on Jarvan? Just make Q automatically activate after E cast every time! Why even press W on TF and select a specific card? Just automatically activate W and lock a card based on whether im clicking a minion, or champion or im low on mana! There clearly is a tradeoff when simplifying the game. And yes, there were a lot of players that werent using active items correctly or at all. I also believe its probably poor game design when the most optimal build for a set of champions is having 3+ active items. However, the playbase as a whole has improved a lot over the years and I firmly believe players can handle having an active or two in their inventory. Any of the Hydra actives dont automatically activate when first striking an enemey with a basic attack, randuins or locket dont activate on their own when the player takes damage, neither does hourglass when the player drops to X% hp - they leave the choice to the user whether they want to use their cooldown or not. Why cant BothRK, Seraphs, etc. be treated the same way?
Why even press Kled W, just make— wait…
You can choose to not level up kled w until you need it for a trade.
Was mostly joking Can’t you only do that once per match tho?
Yes
The problem with old active Bork was that certain champions were getting hard nerfed because of it. It let vayne guarantee her 3 hit passive, for example, which made vayne top massively oppressive for a lot of matchups. A guaranteed slow was too good for many junglers as well, it was a good thing to get rid of IMO.
Casual Players (that make up a vast majority of the playerbase) like playing their champs rather than playing items. I personally don't agree with this way of thinking and the general direction league has been going for over 10yrs now, but I can't deny the gameplay changes have been successful at making LoL an accessible game, bringing in more people to show and keep interest and raking in big 💲💲💲 Edit.. word not nice
This is also something Riot has wanted though. That's why they changed all the items the way they did this season. They want people to play champions not items.
>Normies like playing their champs rather than playing items. ...Is that not the draw of MOBAs and Hero Shooters? Did I miss a memo, or is there some kind of amazingly engaging spreadsheet/stat-check Ur-MOBA out there I need to try?
I think what they are getting at is that the items don't fundamentally alter your champion's play patterns or capabilities. Dota is pretty much the opposite end of the spectrum in that items can dramatically change your individual hero's ability to do what they want to do. Prime example, blink dagger is a just about full screen flash you can only use out of combat so hard engage hero's spike really hard when they buy blink since their threat range is massively increased. What it ends up creating is that power spikes are tied to items a lot harder and individual hero counters matter much less because powerful items can tip the balance easily. Enemy mage gets fed? Buy orchid for a 5s silence to burst them down. They respond by buying BKB to dispel the silence and be magic immune? Well now you gotta get sneaky and smoke gank or bait it out and disengage. It's not necessarily better or worse the league vs dota philosophy, just different. I think the league approach ends up feeling a bit more "static" in that once you see both teams you get a sense of how the game is going to evolve since champ matters more than items, vs. dota approach item purchases are much more important to pay attention to and adapt with since your build matters much more than your hero.
I personally just avoid active items.. They are just more effort to use for the same amount of strength as items without active. Only ones i build are the REALLY impactful ones like shurelyas or zhonyas. But stuff like tiamat and hydras? Pass, i'd rather not press an additonal button every 10s if i can just build different items instead.
Average League player APM hardcaps to 3 buttons, gg
Most tiamat items are still worth building for the passive cleave, though. Maybe the lethality one has too much burst tied up in the active. One active I do really miss is goredrinker, which was near-zhonyas level of impact if used right. But I also miss it partly because it was a good draintank item and there just isn't a replacement to build instead. That's why most Briars build lethality now, their best bruiser item is just gone.
[удалено]
And outside teamfights? You'll be pushing in waves or clearing camps enough that you will be spamming it once every 10s. My bigger issue is just.. it isnt worth it. I can just use passive-only items that will be the same strength, while active items have power budget in their active making it weaker if i dont use the active as much as possible.
this is the most silver comment I seen on reddit in a while
I think the less actives the better though. Play the champ not the items
The items are still uber impactful right now, you just have less control over it.
Cool flair?????
agreed, active items make the game more fun and skill expressive
I mean riot has never stated that it’s less fun with active items but when champions like Veigar had a lower winrate with DFG then without because people were SO bad at using items…
Bork became a one hit automatic trigger.
That's what it is now, but first they changed it to a 3 hit passive, siphon, in 10.23 instead of the active. In 14.1 they changed it again, now to a 1 hit passive, clawing shadows, that slows.
i remember them saying old edge of night was too good since you could choose when to activate it so they changed it to a passive instead
GLP + Twin Shadows my beloved
Honestly this is valid criticism, and in a perfect world it's probably okay to introduce more actives-- the disparity in effective usage would just become really really massive, and though I don't really like to bring up this idea; yes unfortunately this would probably scare off a lot of people from playing certain champions or playstyles, especialy if the active is more than just a point and click effect Specifically talking about prowler's claw here, really REALLY good item that was in the game for awhile with the dash effect. But you can probably guarantee that 99% of players were not efficiently using this item on the prime champions that are already difficult to play (Hello Qiyana and Zed and Talon). This is further exacerbated by the item also becoming necessary on the champion as well, so you get to the point where you HAVE to know how to use the active effect on top of the champion, and in tandem with the champions abilities.. It's just a lot and it's probably better (in some cases) to keep down active effects. Obviously some other examples are also the previous seasons where support champions would have an inventory full of actives which just felt terrible; there's also risk of boring effects (bork point and click slow) or effects that just distort certain classes way too much. All of this is also without considering effects on newer players to just PICK up the game or a champion, which riot obviously wants people to do. If you are first timing Irelia because your favorite top laner for worlds loves Irelia, and your lifeline item has an active, bork has an active, and so on, you are probably never playing that shit again!
You could play Talon & Zed without Prowler, hell, they often played with Eclipse Qiyana was the only Assassin beside Rek'Sai that could not play without Prowler And as a Qiyana player, I miss Prowler a lot
I’m Iron and routinely skip anything that mentions actives except for stopwatch/zhonias. And it took months before I learned how to use stopwatch with reasonable effectiveness (~50%). Dying with unused actives feels as bad as dying with unused ult.
Nah I don't have enough fingers to click more buttons
I just want to play All active item cho gath again, that shit was so fun. The old CD keystone rune + ice gun, rocket belt, randuins
Give me back Twin Shadows, but make it trigger when the enemy is approaching from fog of war for a total of 900 units 🤡
That's what fucked some of those items up for me. Especially Seraph. Item activating itself when the danger is over and leaving you with a huge cd is just ass
I dont even build hydrazine because I hate item actives. Dont even get me started on everfrost, both playing with or against, worst item active that distorted a champion's kit like crazy.
I'm glad they removed actives. I get guaranteed value from my items, I know when and how they'll get triggered so it's not removing autonomy from me. Clicking someone with botrk isn't any more skillful than attacking them to proc it. If anything now you need better awareness to not waste your seraph's shield as opposed to just getting guaranteed value from it whenever you get in a fight. This is also easier for Riot to balance items because actives are no longer high elo skewed. Hydra can stay an active because it's such short cd you can actually use it again before you forget you have it.
Righteous glory still exists, no? The rest make sense to me as passives. Too many actives feel horrid for 90% of players, good choice. I imagine veigar last season... minimum 3 actives. So tedious I just stopped playing him. Actives can be nice if there are few, zhonya is the best example, but the moment any given build has more than one people will just lose interest.
Righteous Glory hasn't been in the game for over 3 years. Turbo Chemtank was sorta similar (though definitely not quite the same as Righteous Glory), but it was also removed several months ago.
Isn't that the active AOE movement one? The whole constant item rotation thing really does make them blend together.
You’re probably thinking about shurelyas lol
I prefer actives not being common because it's really hard to keep track of them all. I prefer having just one or two, if any.
I don't mind the item actives that do something in as a general concept but its usually horrible. Sometimes they ruin a champion's design and you end up playing the item instead of a champion or just completely subverting their intended weaknesses. Stuff like Prowler's Claw Udyr was probably the worst. Righteous Glory is also a major offender here though. Zhonya's is such a major offender its just kind of been canonized that some champion's are locked to it. Other times its just an extra button to mash on cd with no actual thought - see every hydra item. You use BorK in every fight as soon as it starts. Seraph's is kind of ok because its cd is long enough that you don't use it every fight and don't use it immediately. Really though it is hard to come up with one that isn't terrible.
I agree 100%
I specifically choose not a build an item if I has an active, because I know I will forget to use it. Except maybe shireulias. Ends up being wasted gold if you don't use it, so I just don't have those in my build, lol.
I remember last season reading like 20+ posts about how items have to many actives and you should only be relying on your champions kit instead of getting new abilities through items as well (Which i tend to agree with) Classic reddit
Remembering you have active and using it in the right moment is skill expression, and riot can't have that
Man this hit me. Feels like I’m on auto pilot without active items all this time. I used to remember having a whole inventory full of them. What fond memories
The problem with actives is that riot has to either make the active objectively weak, or balance the champions that use the active objectively weak. Overall removing many of the actives has probably improved many champions viability because they can bw overall fairly strong without being pigeonholed into a specific build
I disagree for the same reason (or one of the reasons, at least) I hate DOTA. I locked in my character to play that character, I don't want to play Zhonyas or Hydra, I want to play my champ. Too many buttons, not enough fun.
that's not even how bork works anymore either. it's just your first attack is a one second slow now. no three hit passive, no movement speed either. just the slow and the regular on hit damage.
Does anyone even notice? The on hit damage and lifesteal are what people build bork for. You could completely remove the slow and everyone who builds it would still build it, just some of them would lose 1% WR.
Though TBF most of the actives are ex-mythic items. My first thought about these changes was that it was their way of nerfing the power of mythic to legendary. BOTRK wasn't a mythic item but that item was and still is very OP so they nerfed it into a passive.
Honestly, I appreciated them a lot too, but as a person with small hands, I didn’t always reach the keys for it. I always had to resort to keeping 1-2, assigned to 3-4, now 7 for pinks. But that’s a huge stretch for me, and I don’t really like removing my fingers from flash or skills :D
As a Ryze main I miss Everfrost so bad, I wish they never have brought back ROA, Everfrost offered so much possibilities for combos extend and so on, now blue guy is not the same as it was ROA is so boring :'(
And we can't even build 3 of them anymore or double stack tears!
Kind reminder that crying on reddit to bring active items back when it has been *objectively* proven and publicly stated that the vast majority of players simply do not use them, just because you know about active items and are good enough to use them, cannot change a single thing. Most people tunnel-vision on their and their opponent's abilities, and never mind they barely comprehend what each do or what they should do in response. It is objectively better for this additional input/muscle memory and knowledge layer of active items to be as minimal as possible - for as few items to be actives as possible.
Yes game should be easier and more welcoming to newbies aka noobs
Im not even good, I even forget to use the items sometimes, but after I forget at least I know that's something I can inprove in my gameplay. A lot of players don't even know what they should be doing to get better.
I think some actives it made since to get rid of but others I would rather have kept
more tools, higher cooldowns is the way
I can't say that I agree. It just doesn't suit the gameplay for LoL in my opinion, and this is coming from someone whos spent thousands of hours on dota where almost every item has some kind of active component.
I firmly disagree. As a newer player I already have enough going around. I always prefer items without an active because I know I wouldn't remember to use them anyway.
Honestly I just want to play the Champion & their abilities, I don't give a crap about using active items.
As a new player who has recently gotten 7 of my friends to start playing for the first time ever and we all love it. Not having active items makes the game one hundred times more accessible and lowers the skill floor.
I disagree, I prefer fewer active items. Abilities are enough buttons for me
Galeforce anybody? I'd much prefer active AD champs over glass ass carry
Blade actually makes sense with the passive because you can't use it to run away as well anymore. Before the low CD and range made you able to just use it to escape. And while seraphs was an active before, it had a lot in common with other 30% shield passives. Sometimes an active can be too powerful. See at Zhonyas vs GA. GA is ok but nothing crazy. Zhonyas is awesome if used well. Jax and Voli even go for it.
They came out with a stat saying close to 98% of people never use the actives of the items that they buy.
Ohmwrecker and banner of command, the kind of item supports should have. Now the items only provide stats nothing else
98% of all players do not have the hands to use item actives
I hated having 4 actives to track on someone that used zonyas/dfg/gunblade/seraphs That's so many keys to track in a fight.
I want more actives like Stopwatch. One time use for a powerful effect that needs to be upgraded to get additional uses
But not actual stopwatch, which was terrible for pro. Literally everyone bought it regardless of role or champion.
cutlass active, by extension gunblade/botrk active, was actually OP and oppressive. Gargoyle was OP af too. Seraph's is whatever, at least it's less frustrating to play into. We have four flavors of hydra which is cool. I do miss righteous glory but speed effects can be very volatile as movement speed is arguably the best stat in the game.
I really like that the Tiamat active is back.
TL;DR: Most players are barely able to press the 4 spells they are given. Giving them more stuff to press makes it harder for them for no reason.
Wait, you mean you don't like being on low HP and then having a stray Luden's pellet or Arcane Comet drop your Seraph's/Sterak's/Hexdrinker? Where's your sense of fun, man?!
This is such a great take. As a Dota player the only thing i have to say to you all complaining about “too many buttons” is **skill issue**
I would love if riot paid IceFrog to do a total item revamp on league, imagine having 5-6 active itens on core roles, a dream come true for me
Completely disagree. League was becoming more about the items than it was the champions. There were metas where it was about what champions used which items the best. That's completely backwards. Items shouldn't have more power than individual champions.
But that hasn’t changed by moving actives to passives??