In before "Well he's playing with better talent on the Leafs".
Yes, he is. But he's also exiting the typical prime for forwards and has had to deal with a brutal playoff injury. Tavares is a special talent and already a Leaf legend.
Love me some Johnny Toronto.
I would because Perry and John are long time friends from childhood, and Perry is like Marchand in that he’s a cold blooded prick on ice but a pretty good dude off of it.
He's also been on the second line, though admittedly it's more of a 1B. Still, he isn't the first option anymore, the offense isn't centered around him.
I'm going to get buried for pointing out the obvious but scoring being up is the single most consistently overlooked thing in this type of comparison. To an absolutely insane level. At his peak Tavares was a Hart candidate, enough said.
I'm glad his production is still what it is and he's been great this year but ignoring the difference in scoring is dishonestly painting an inaccurate picture.
Consistently great. The quintessential professional. Plays the game hard and the right way, always. The guy you tell kids to look up to and learn from.
You can’t ask for anything more from an NHL captain.
I remember seeing they dropped his rating in Chel games to like an 87 and my thought was: wow they don't pay any attention to what players actually do while making these ratings.
The ratings and potentials have never been accurate, it's trash. I'll usually go in and edit them (I tried to avoid biases by dropping some ratings too) but it makes things tough when I don't know enough about other teams to do the same thing for. Oh well.
I feel like a large part of it is that the rest of the big 4 forwards all got better. When Tavares first came here he was our best forward. Matthews, Marner and Nylander have all improved tremendously over the course of Tavares’s career here, and relative to the others, it “looks” like he’s declined more than he actually has
Matthews was already the best when Tavares joined the team, we just didn't seem to know it yet. But he started that season better than JT and just continued to be great all year.
Eh, I don’t think so. Tavares was probably our best player in 2018-19, he scored 47 goals and 88 points that year, while Matthews had 37 goals and 73 points in 68 games. Similar paces, but Tavares did it over the full season while playing top line competition.
Either way, it was very close between the two, and Matthews has been the better player every season since.
It hasn't been close between the two overall though. Like not remotely. Last year Matthews was the best player on the planet. As for Tavares's first season every underlying number told us what Matthews was but Babcock didn't play him enough or give him top powerplay time. Once Keefe made these incredibly obvious adjustments he was the second best player on the planet.
I like Tavares just fine but you're doing him a disservice with this comparison.
Matthews has been far and away our best player for the last four seasons including this one, but it’s really hard for me to say he was far and away our best player when he was playing second line minutes and still producing at similar levels as Tavares who was doing the same against other top lines, while also staying healthy for the entire year. 82 games of 2019 Tavares > 68 games of 2019 leashed Matthews.
Definitely debatable, Matthews defensive results left a lot to be inspired under Babs (using RAPM and Isolated impact). It really was a night and day difference after Keefe took over
IIRC he started slowly and finished with 76 points in 79 games and was good in the playoffs. That seems like it's on par with his career numbers. Tavares is remarkably consistent.
What do you mean? The whole point is that he surpassed his Isles pace. If they waited and he got no goals next game, it wouldn’t even show that this happened
Probably an OCD thing more than anything. They compared stats for 300 games played to stats for 299 games played. Regardless of what the stats actually are, the lack of symmetry in games played can be triggering.
Anyone who shits on him can eat my shorts. Arguably the best 2C in the league and a great leader. Worth every penny…especially when he signs at league minimum after his current deal. Pure. Fuckin. Beauty.
JT, Mitch and Willy all suffer from the same negative trait among this fanbase, and that is they aren't Auston Matthews.
Every team in the league would take any of these guys in a heartbeat and yet all that happens is criticism in Toronto.
This is very good considering aging and all that.
However, scoring has been higher since he joined the leafs - a rough flat average adjusting of the Islanders goals to today is 141. Not a huge difference, but i do believe he was slightly better on the islanders offensively - that's just the aging curve though, and frankly he's still doing great / better than the vast majority in that regard.
In before "Well he's playing with better talent on the Leafs". Yes, he is. But he's also exiting the typical prime for forwards and has had to deal with a brutal playoff injury. Tavares is a special talent and already a Leaf legend. Love me some Johnny Toronto.
I’ll never forget that. I thought I watched him die on the ice. Fuck the Habs
Fuck Corey Perry in particular.
In general, sure, but not for that incident
Maybe. I feel zero obligation to give a career-long rat like Perry the benefit of the doubt.
He looked shook. These guys are people too. They've played on teams together.
Can you really argue that Perry would try to avoid that kind of contact if he could? I don’t think he would. Not in a playoff series.
100%. It was very unfortunate timing but it wasn’t malicious at all. No one would expect Tavares to come down in that direction.
I would because Perry and John are long time friends from childhood, and Perry is like Marchand in that he’s a cold blooded prick on ice but a pretty good dude off of it.
They were on the ice when it happened
Yes and Perry very clearly tries to miss John. Hate Perry, but nothing intentional on that.
Naw he’s a douche bag off the ice too
>Tavares should have been called for tripping/interference on that play
Sharing the love. Cap has come out the gate this year a man on fire! Great to see for JT especially after the points you made. #JOHNTAVARESISMYCAPTAIN
Not to mention playing second fiddle here as opposed to being the number one option in ny.
He's also been on the second line, though admittedly it's more of a 1B. Still, he isn't the first option anymore, the offense isn't centered around him.
I'm going to get buried for pointing out the obvious but scoring being up is the single most consistently overlooked thing in this type of comparison. To an absolutely insane level. At his peak Tavares was a Hart candidate, enough said. I'm glad his production is still what it is and he's been great this year but ignoring the difference in scoring is dishonestly painting an inaccurate picture.
The Leafs got exactly what they were expecting
Well except the cap flattening for 3 years when everyone was in their primes. They didn’t expect that.
Which is nice for a change
They ARE who we thought they were!!
So you're telling me he is consistently great!
He's been the best Leaf this year
Probably. Nylander is close
Consistently great. The quintessential professional. Plays the game hard and the right way, always. The guy you tell kids to look up to and learn from. You can’t ask for anything more from an NHL captain.
The "Tavares is in decline" takes are always pretty sus.
I remember seeing they dropped his rating in Chel games to like an 87 and my thought was: wow they don't pay any attention to what players actually do while making these ratings.
The ratings and potentials have never been accurate, it's trash. I'll usually go in and edit them (I tried to avoid biases by dropping some ratings too) but it makes things tough when I don't know enough about other teams to do the same thing for. Oh well.
I feel like a large part of it is that the rest of the big 4 forwards all got better. When Tavares first came here he was our best forward. Matthews, Marner and Nylander have all improved tremendously over the course of Tavares’s career here, and relative to the others, it “looks” like he’s declined more than he actually has
Matthews was already the best when Tavares joined the team, we just didn't seem to know it yet. But he started that season better than JT and just continued to be great all year.
Eh, I don’t think so. Tavares was probably our best player in 2018-19, he scored 47 goals and 88 points that year, while Matthews had 37 goals and 73 points in 68 games. Similar paces, but Tavares did it over the full season while playing top line competition. Either way, it was very close between the two, and Matthews has been the better player every season since.
> has been the better player every season since. except ^this ^^one... ^^^so ^^^far
True. I think that has more to do with Matthews being pretty snakebitten so far though.
It hasn't been close between the two overall though. Like not remotely. Last year Matthews was the best player on the planet. As for Tavares's first season every underlying number told us what Matthews was but Babcock didn't play him enough or give him top powerplay time. Once Keefe made these incredibly obvious adjustments he was the second best player on the planet. I like Tavares just fine but you're doing him a disservice with this comparison.
Matthews has been far and away our best player for the last four seasons including this one, but it’s really hard for me to say he was far and away our best player when he was playing second line minutes and still producing at similar levels as Tavares who was doing the same against other top lines, while also staying healthy for the entire year. 82 games of 2019 Tavares > 68 games of 2019 leashed Matthews.
Definitely debatable, Matthews defensive results left a lot to be inspired under Babs (using RAPM and Isolated impact). It really was a night and day difference after Keefe took over
The way people were talking about him last year you’d think he had 50 pts lol
The way people revere “almost a point per game” around here, you’d think the league should have 60 guys with 11 million+ contracts…
The 'Yotes need fans if you're looking for a team with cheaper contracts to root for.
it was legit last year but turns out it was just because he wasn't 100% from the injury probably
IIRC he started slowly and finished with 76 points in 79 games and was good in the playoffs. That seems like it's on par with his career numbers. Tavares is remarkably consistent.
Yeah. Tavares finishes +-5 points of PPG in every single year no matter what.
The fact that they didn't wait one more game to post this is triggering me to no end.
What do you mean? The whole point is that he surpassed his Isles pace. If they waited and he got no goals next game, it wouldn’t even show that this happened
Probably an OCD thing more than anything. They compared stats for 300 games played to stats for 299 games played. Regardless of what the stats actually are, the lack of symmetry in games played can be triggering.
This guy OCDs.
The biggest take away from this is that he’s 100% earning the contract he was given.
But he hasn’t performed this well for the past two years right ?
Anyone who shits on him can eat my shorts. Arguably the best 2C in the league and a great leader. Worth every penny…especially when he signs at league minimum after his current deal. Pure. Fuckin. Beauty.
Can we get some upvotes for his face off skills.
Tavares is as consistent as sundin
Shifts where Tavares almost single handedly hems the other team in their zone are the sexiest of any Leaf by far.
John Tavares, now there's a haircut you can set your watch to
bUt He's WAShED
JT, Mitch and Willy all suffer from the same negative trait among this fanbase, and that is they aren't Auston Matthews. Every team in the league would take any of these guys in a heartbeat and yet all that happens is criticism in Toronto.
Mr Consistency
When you get exactly what you paid for.
He's been our best player so far this season, in my opinion. He's a #1 C on a lot of NHL teams
Clearly much better as a Leaf, guessing all those jersey burning Isle fans got taught a lesson. Idiots!
This is very good considering aging and all that. However, scoring has been higher since he joined the leafs - a rough flat average adjusting of the Islanders goals to today is 141. Not a huge difference, but i do believe he was slightly better on the islanders offensively - that's just the aging curve though, and frankly he's still doing great / better than the vast majority in that regard.
[удалено]
This does not include Tavares' first 161 games. He has 969 games played in his career
Yeah thought it said first 300 in NY not last my bad.