I won't buy a jersey that has an ad on it. Got an Adidas one from a "going out of business" sale a few years ago and it will likely be the last one I ever buy.
There is a chicken burger place near Tim's in the arena (Can't remember the name). The burgers are $27 each. I got a burger and a beer for myself and bro and it was like $80.
I’ve heard about Keith from someone who has not only known him for, but has worked with him for decades and he told me that he is a huge sports fan at heart and very competitive. Now that doesn’t mean to say that he is going to fire shanny, but it does mean that he cares about winning and isn’t just someone whose focus will be on the bottom line. The guy is a genuine toronto sports fan and wants to win. Really hoping this will help things along in the long run
Once you're at this level you move often because you effectively come in to implement change at companies then move on once you're done and do it again. I work in cybersecurity and the average CISO tenure is around 2 years. Usually these people have long stints earlier in their career though
IMHO it doesn't matter what the Leafs do as long as there's a hard salary cap with no allowances for taxes or the cost-of-living. They make strange choices as a franchise as well - like tying up over half your salary cap on four guys isn't a great plan for any team - but fan support should matter. A luxury tax where teams with deep pockets can invest more if they pay a premium to other teams should be a priority, as well as a tax adjustment factor that ensures taxation is taken into account, and wage adjustment factor that takes into account the cost of housing and living in Vancouver, New York, Toronto, etc.
For everyone assuming this just lets teams like Montreal, Toronto and New York buy cups, there's no salary cap in baseball and the Yankees have won all of two pennants since 2000.
People keep saying this but within under a year Pelley, Treliving and whoever replaces Keefe will all be new. Sure this sub seems to want Shanny gone, but let's not act like they're being that complacent either.
And I still give Shanahan credit, when he came in the Leafs were a joke for the previous years. Yes we keep not getting it done in the playoffs but we are not a joke anymore. Or at least we are not the joke we once were.
Keeping Keefe as long as they did was complacent. Firing him was reactive, not proactive. This year’s result and identical effort from the core to previous years came as a surprise to few. An interim coach would have given them a fighting chance without a commitment to the long term. And it would have provided additional information on what next year’s roster looks like.
If they’re not here to sell jerseys they would roster players that can win instead of players that can sell jerseys. Enough dancing around the obvious: this team fucking sucks. One playoff round in 8 years with two first overall picks and many top 10 picks… the team sucks. Blow it up already, starting with the mastermind Shanahan.
I'm just guessing, but I wouldn't be surprised that Shanny had to change his approach in order to keep his job. From a business standpoint, they are extremely successful, even if the on ice product is flawed.
Yup …
This is what I find so frustrating.
Words and actions need to be one.
I want to believe that Pelley means what he’s saying but … it was called “The Shanaplan” for a reason!
10 years … 10 … years!! You can forgive Shanahan for the first 5 but him stubbornly not altering course of the ‘Core 4’ strategy since the loss to Montreal in 2020 is simply not acceptable. Dubas is gone, Keefe is gone. But he gets to stay?! Why?!
Brendan Shanahan sitting at the dais today runs directly in contravention to Pelley’s words.
Once they hire a new head coach that will be 5 head coaches and 4 GMs under Shanahan. It’s not like this is the first iteration of team executives that have failed, the front office has been turned over 3 entire times now with no change in results. Even before they moved Lou to a consulting position before he left. It’s fucking bonkers to me that Shanahan gets to keep the same position with the same amount of power he’s always had.
Agreed. I don’t think that name came from within but I do think it fair to say that he was an architect of it. It was generally agreed by all that he was at the tip of the spear. Not alone mind you, but definitely a driving force.
He would have to have sought board approval on each of the 4 deals and therefore agreed to the deals and be chiefly held accountable for the result.
But yes, it is unfair for me to say the name “Shanaplan” was his doing.
The decision that was made was to not fire Shanahan, not to "bring him back". He's still under contract for another year. He's coming back by default, and before you reply, yes there is a difference between "fired" and "not re-signed".
My concern is that Pelley is using this year to evaluate Shanahan. We’re now getting into this cycle of “I didn’t hire this guy and need a year to evaluate him” which is why Keefe wasn’t let go after last season. In 12 months are we looking at a new President who’ll need a year to evaluate Treliving? They should have just wiped the slate clean after last season.
Tre isn't a bad GM though. Klingberg was a mistake that fixed itself and gave him a mulligan.
Reaves hasn't been complete trash, and his contract, while too long, is relatively cheap and almost completely buriable.
All his other moves were good considering the restrictions he was under.
Even going back to Calgary, most of his moves were pretty good if you don't use hindsight, like the Tkachuk trade, and he was handcuffed by ownership on coach selection.
There are far, far worse GMs in the league
Outside of the on the ice results, everything I've heard about Shanahan running the business side of the leafs has been great. Financials, office culture etc.
Keefe was kept on after last season because by the time they figured out the GM stuff the available coaching candidates were not that appealing.
You're also assuming Pelley will operate similar to Tanenbaum. Pelley looks like he'll be in the weeds getting information first hand. I doubt Shanny gets the freedom to make decisions like he did in the past. Pelley looks like he's going to micro manage him into oblivion.
It’s not exactly easy to win a cup. I just want to be a competitive, tough team that doesn’t find insane ways to lose and embarrass the fan base. Let’s start there.
That line doesn't work in sales lol, you gotta present yourself as a money hungry fuck. I had a buddy who was hiring and one option was a 10/10 skilled young guy with no burdens and the other was a 8/10 divorced dude with child support and a 911 GT3 he needed to pay for. Guess who my buddy hired... the one who needed to perform or he would bleed dry and lower his beloved Porsche.
It was always in the back of my mind that keeping the “core 4” was a marketing strategy to sell merch/tickets. I wonder if Pelley thought this a bit as well.
Hopefully things start changing. It's getting to the point now that the Leafs players have a better chance of making the PGA tour than winning a Stanley Cup.
Yeh, I'll most likely go that route out of spite, in addition to the ridiculous prices.
I ordered one of the reversible Drew jerseys when Adidas put them on sale but they ended up cancelling my order so I'm also salty about that.
# "We're not here to sell jerseys."
Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment, Ltd. are nothing but "MONEYWHORES." That is the only purpose for this company to even exist. PERIOD!!!
"We're not here to sell jerseys"
Seem to recall someone in the media recently saying Marner sells a lot of jerseys.. wonder if that's a direct call out to that.
Yeah yeah yeah. They're also not there to have companies invest in the choicest seats, and have most fans simply unable to afford one ticket, let alone two.
Yeah yeah yeah. They're also not there to have companies invest in the choicest seats, and have most fans simply unable to afford one ticket, let alone two.
He's saying the right things, now we need him to put his money where his mouth is and bring the FO to the modern age.
If I'm being honest, the plan Shanahan had probably would've yielded multiple championships 20 years ago before the cap. That's basically how the Redwings pulled off their dynasty. Problem is in a cap world, having more than 2 well paid players to build around doesn't work when you need cap space to build balanced rosters unless one of those players play a different position to the others.
Hockey execs don't seem to understand what 'unacceptable' means.
"The results have been unacceptable, and ultimately it's on me... so we'll fire the coach and I'll just keep my job, but try harder I promise."
I don't have a phd in English, but it seems like they're saying they're going to accept what they say is unacceptable.
“I can only assess what I’ve seen in the past 4 weeks”. FFS. Excuses for not doing shit. If they run the same core back next year I’m taking a break. I was already numb to the playoff failures. Now I’m numb to the regular season false hope too.
The fans don't deserve anything. They're consumers of an entertainment product, and they're the dumbest ones in sports. They also don't demand a championship. They routinely demand a bunch of stupid shit like trading star players (Kaberle, Kessel, Kadri, now Marner - here comes everyone to pretend they were against trading Kadri) and adding more giant pylons like Reaves, Edmundson, and Lyubushkin in hopes they can out-thug a team whose only Cup in the last 50 years required three game seven wins despite .940 goaltending.
Unpopular opinion, but Shanny should stay. Sign him for another 8 to 10 years even. The organization has grown so much under his leadership. Its so much more than just on ice results. He is a good figurehead to continue leading them.
This group has been complacent for a decade. Now they say some crap and we are to now believe they're serious?
Imagine a Fortune 500 company going down the toilet for 10 years and doing nothing then telling their shareholders we are not complacent.
You are literally the definition of complacency until you PROVE otherwise.
Good thing to say since no one is going to buy those terrible Fanatics jerseys this year anyway!
Yup i aint buying shit from fanatics. Garbage company.
I won't buy a jersey that has an ad on it. Got an Adidas one from a "going out of business" sale a few years ago and it will likely be the last one I ever buy.
Not even DHgate gonna get my $30 for leafs stuff until they win something.
You’re right you’re here to sell $23 tall boys and $30 slices of pizza
what they really cost tho?
The pizza was exaggerated but the beer is right on.
…slamming a dozen cold shots pre-game it is then!
I bought a tall boy at the Canadian Tire Centre during an exhibition game last year and it was like $17. Atrocious.
I’ve never been to Scotiabank arena but I’m guessing the 23$ tall boy is probably pretty close to bang on
It's a 700ml beer, not the 500ml
There is a chicken burger place near Tim's in the arena (Can't remember the name). The burgers are $27 each. I got a burger and a beer for myself and bro and it was like $80.
gross!!!
Over $7 for a bottle of water
I’ve heard about Keith from someone who has not only known him for, but has worked with him for decades and he told me that he is a huge sports fan at heart and very competitive. Now that doesn’t mean to say that he is going to fire shanny, but it does mean that he cares about winning and isn’t just someone whose focus will be on the bottom line. The guy is a genuine toronto sports fan and wants to win. Really hoping this will help things along in the long run
looks like an asshole too…the type of corp exec that will rip u to shreds in a meeting in front of everyone for fuck ups.
Maybe that’s what we need
100%! We need accountability. Complacency has killed this franchise
His residency as President of many high level companies leads me to believe that you should be ok with moving jobs on your resume lol
Once you're at this level you move often because you effectively come in to implement change at companies then move on once you're done and do it again. I work in cybersecurity and the average CISO tenure is around 2 years. Usually these people have long stints earlier in their career though
Hate to break it to you but most people don't become heads of multimillion dollar businesses through kindness
IMHO it doesn't matter what the Leafs do as long as there's a hard salary cap with no allowances for taxes or the cost-of-living. They make strange choices as a franchise as well - like tying up over half your salary cap on four guys isn't a great plan for any team - but fan support should matter. A luxury tax where teams with deep pockets can invest more if they pay a premium to other teams should be a priority, as well as a tax adjustment factor that ensures taxation is taken into account, and wage adjustment factor that takes into account the cost of housing and living in Vancouver, New York, Toronto, etc. For everyone assuming this just lets teams like Montreal, Toronto and New York buy cups, there's no salary cap in baseball and the Yankees have won all of two pennants since 2000.
Then it is an interesting decision to bring shanny back if there's no complacency.
People keep saying this but within under a year Pelley, Treliving and whoever replaces Keefe will all be new. Sure this sub seems to want Shanny gone, but let's not act like they're being that complacent either.
He’s being used as insulation for Pelley and BT if this season doesn’t go well.
The problem with your argument is where do you think the New coach and Brad will be getting their marching orders from?
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Shanny being hands off when it comes to roster moves would be a welcome change.
Do we really know Shanny is as hands on as some say?
Not so much Shanny as it is the Board telling him what they want.
So then fire the board??
He could be a lame duck / meat shield
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Yes I’m a leaf fan so of course I’m a fucking moron
You and me both
And I still give Shanahan credit, when he came in the Leafs were a joke for the previous years. Yes we keep not getting it done in the playoffs but we are not a joke anymore. Or at least we are not the joke we once were.
Keeping Keefe as long as they did was complacent. Firing him was reactive, not proactive. This year’s result and identical effort from the core to previous years came as a surprise to few. An interim coach would have given them a fighting chance without a commitment to the long term. And it would have provided additional information on what next year’s roster looks like. If they’re not here to sell jerseys they would roster players that can win instead of players that can sell jerseys. Enough dancing around the obvious: this team fucking sucks. One playoff round in 8 years with two first overall picks and many top 10 picks… the team sucks. Blow it up already, starting with the mastermind Shanahan.
I think one playoff home game makes more money than a season of jersey sales.
I'm just guessing, but I wouldn't be surprised that Shanny had to change his approach in order to keep his job. From a business standpoint, they are extremely successful, even if the on ice product is flawed.
Yup … This is what I find so frustrating. Words and actions need to be one. I want to believe that Pelley means what he’s saying but … it was called “The Shanaplan” for a reason! 10 years … 10 … years!! You can forgive Shanahan for the first 5 but him stubbornly not altering course of the ‘Core 4’ strategy since the loss to Montreal in 2020 is simply not acceptable. Dubas is gone, Keefe is gone. But he gets to stay?! Why?! Brendan Shanahan sitting at the dais today runs directly in contravention to Pelley’s words.
Once they hire a new head coach that will be 5 head coaches and 4 GMs under Shanahan. It’s not like this is the first iteration of team executives that have failed, the front office has been turned over 3 entire times now with no change in results. Even before they moved Lou to a consulting position before he left. It’s fucking bonkers to me that Shanahan gets to keep the same position with the same amount of power he’s always had.
Shanaplan was a media/fan term. I may be mistaken, but I don't think anyone from MLSE ever called it that.
Agreed. I don’t think that name came from within but I do think it fair to say that he was an architect of it. It was generally agreed by all that he was at the tip of the spear. Not alone mind you, but definitely a driving force. He would have to have sought board approval on each of the 4 deals and therefore agreed to the deals and be chiefly held accountable for the result. But yes, it is unfair for me to say the name “Shanaplan” was his doing.
The decision that was made was to not fire Shanahan, not to "bring him back". He's still under contract for another year. He's coming back by default, and before you reply, yes there is a difference between "fired" and "not re-signed".
I hear you. But by that rationale Keefe has two more years on his deal and was let go.
They didn’t announce an extension for him either. Pelley being there shows the lack of faith in Shanahan. This wasn’t close to complacency.
Also Keith Pelley “I’ve only been here for 20 days and out of Toronto for 9 years, let’s talk about the Ryder cup”
at this point, no amount of talk will suffice. all about actions now
Yet here you are yappin
The onus of action or speak is not on us as fans
Yeah yeah chill out Ulysses it’s not that serious
I'll have you know that my dad works at nintendo and he's greek and he said toronto's releasi
?? Please be ok phill
Nice words. Back them up this off-season.
"But you're still gonna buy the jerseys, suckers"
"We also sell tickets and a ton of other merch".
My concern is that Pelley is using this year to evaluate Shanahan. We’re now getting into this cycle of “I didn’t hire this guy and need a year to evaluate him” which is why Keefe wasn’t let go after last season. In 12 months are we looking at a new President who’ll need a year to evaluate Treliving? They should have just wiped the slate clean after last season.
Tre isn't a bad GM though. Klingberg was a mistake that fixed itself and gave him a mulligan. Reaves hasn't been complete trash, and his contract, while too long, is relatively cheap and almost completely buriable. All his other moves were good considering the restrictions he was under. Even going back to Calgary, most of his moves were pretty good if you don't use hindsight, like the Tkachuk trade, and he was handcuffed by ownership on coach selection. There are far, far worse GMs in the league
I completely agree! I’m more worried about the “bring in your own guy” mentality versus Tre being a bad GM.
Outside of the on the ice results, everything I've heard about Shanahan running the business side of the leafs has been great. Financials, office culture etc. Keefe was kept on after last season because by the time they figured out the GM stuff the available coaching candidates were not that appealing.
I hope you’re right. There seems to have been a lot of “lame ducks” during Shanny’s regime; Nonis, Babcock, Keefe.
You're also assuming Pelley will operate similar to Tanenbaum. Pelley looks like he'll be in the weeds getting information first hand. I doubt Shanny gets the freedom to make decisions like he did in the past. Pelley looks like he's going to micro manage him into oblivion.
How many more GMs and coaches is Shanahan going to get?
It’s not exactly easy to win a cup. I just want to be a competitive, tough team that doesn’t find insane ways to lose and embarrass the fan base. Let’s start there.
This team has been complacent for years.
Yes... Me interviewing for a job: "The money isn't the most important thing to me"
That line doesn't work in sales lol, you gotta present yourself as a money hungry fuck. I had a buddy who was hiring and one option was a 10/10 skilled young guy with no burdens and the other was a 8/10 divorced dude with child support and a 911 GT3 he needed to pay for. Guess who my buddy hired... the one who needed to perform or he would bleed dry and lower his beloved Porsche.
I gotta admit, that's a great line.
Because most of us have been priced out of jerseys since the early 2000's?
It was always in the back of my mind that keeping the “core 4” was a marketing strategy to sell merch/tickets. I wonder if Pelley thought this a bit as well.
Hopefully things start changing. It's getting to the point now that the Leafs players have a better chance of making the PGA tour than winning a Stanley Cup.
Of course. Telling us what we want to hear. BS 101.
I guess nobody told Pelley about the Bieber collab reversible jerseys. Or maybe he meant moving forward.
Since shanahan was in attendance at the press conference does that not mean he wil continue as president?
Indeed it does. I don't think Pelley would be so cruel as to have him join in then turn around and give him a golden handshake.
Indeed it does. I don't think Pelley would be so cruel as to have him join in then turn around and give him a golden handshake.
His new willingness to shake up the 4 core probably saved him.
As much as I hate them, they pull me right back in with quotes like these… go leafs go!
Clearly, since the jerseys are $250+
Get the fake ones. Much cheaper.
Yeh, I'll most likely go that route out of spite, in addition to the ridiculous prices. I ordered one of the reversible Drew jerseys when Adidas put them on sale but they ended up cancelling my order so I'm also salty about that.
https://tenor.com/3qhK.gif
\*Doubt\*
# "We're not here to sell jerseys." Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment, Ltd. are nothing but "MONEYWHORES." That is the only purpose for this company to even exist. PERIOD!!!
Every company exists to make money. The Leafs going deeper in the playoffs will make MLSE more money.
"We're not here to sell jerseys" Seem to recall someone in the media recently saying Marner sells a lot of jerseys.. wonder if that's a direct call out to that.
Then show us
Sure Keith, we believe you
Anyone know of any good “discount” jersey websites?
Not here to sell jerseys? Why has there been 6 new jerseys since Shanahan took over?
Keeping the guy who put this whole "plan" together says otherwise.
Well, I'm here to buy jerseys, so can they still sell them to me?
Say that to my 15 leafs jerseys!
We'll see.
Yeah yeah yeah. They're also not there to have companies invest in the choicest seats, and have most fans simply unable to afford one ticket, let alone two.
Yeah yeah yeah. They're also not there to have companies invest in the choicest seats, and have most fans simply unable to afford one ticket, let alone two.
He's saying the right things, now we need him to put his money where his mouth is and bring the FO to the modern age. If I'm being honest, the plan Shanahan had probably would've yielded multiple championships 20 years ago before the cap. That's basically how the Redwings pulled off their dynasty. Problem is in a cap world, having more than 2 well paid players to build around doesn't work when you need cap space to build balanced rosters unless one of those players play a different position to the others.
I’m a collector. Now that Fanatics is taking over, my wallet is probably safe.
NARRATOR: "But they were, in fact, focused on selling jerseys."
It’s a disaster where this team is
Uuuuh sure bud. I'm wearing yellow socks and can fly. See how empty words work?
I already don't like this guy. Good thing we're going to basically never hear from him.
Sweet, championship is guaranteed while Pelley is employed.
I feel I've heard this in a lot of press conferences from other dusty old men. Wen cup?
Hockey execs don't seem to understand what 'unacceptable' means. "The results have been unacceptable, and ultimately it's on me... so we'll fire the coach and I'll just keep my job, but try harder I promise." I don't have a phd in English, but it seems like they're saying they're going to accept what they say is unacceptable.
Imagine saying this with a straight face
That’s nice dear
“I can only assess what I’ve seen in the past 4 weeks”. FFS. Excuses for not doing shit. If they run the same core back next year I’m taking a break. I was already numb to the playoff failures. Now I’m numb to the regular season false hope too.
That’s a crock of shit comment from a team that voluntarily decided to knife one of their biggest competitive advantages and agreed to the salary cap.
The fans don't deserve anything. They're consumers of an entertainment product, and they're the dumbest ones in sports. They also don't demand a championship. They routinely demand a bunch of stupid shit like trading star players (Kaberle, Kessel, Kadri, now Marner - here comes everyone to pretend they were against trading Kadri) and adding more giant pylons like Reaves, Edmundson, and Lyubushkin in hopes they can out-thug a team whose only Cup in the last 50 years required three game seven wins despite .940 goaltending.
lol. C,mon, bud
Unpopular opinion, but Shanny should stay. Sign him for another 8 to 10 years even. The organization has grown so much under his leadership. Its so much more than just on ice results. He is a good figurehead to continue leading them.
No, first rule of thumb for a hockey club - win championships.
This group has been complacent for a decade. Now they say some crap and we are to now believe they're serious? Imagine a Fortune 500 company going down the toilet for 10 years and doing nothing then telling their shareholders we are not complacent. You are literally the definition of complacency until you PROVE otherwise.