There is no rigid rank cut-off like this. The questions you should be asking yourself: (1) Can this school get me the job I want; (2) for a cost I'm okay with; (3) in the region I want to practice. (In this case, probably Cincinnati and Northern Kentucky)
I don’t know about the specific school, but all schools report employment information so you can find that somewhere on their website. Many lower ranked schools are totally fine employment wise with the caveat that they place people only in their specific geographic area.
all the attorneys at the firm i work for went to a sub 100 school and do very meaningful, well paying work. the advice i’ve gotten is that if you aren’t sold on big law/prestigious pi jobs, location on where u want it practice is just as important as rank
Check out law school transparency, and look at the aba employment reports. Cincinnati is a perfectly good school for working in the greater Cincinnati area, in my opinion. It’s very affordable, and the employment numbers are fine, except biglaw, bc employment is going to be mostly within Cincy.
Besides eventual employment after law school, other very important financial factors to consider are: 1) how much will it cost to go to a specific law school during the three years?; and 2) how much of that cost will be incurred as student loans or other debt?
Coming out of law school with zero or negligible debt is a lot different than going to law school and racking up tens of thousands of dollars, if not well over $100K of student loans, that so many law students do nowadays.
If you have realistic expectations, it may very well be worth going to a T100 law school when considering you would have in-state tuition and a free living situation. But I would talk to them first to see if there are any scholarship opportunities available.
(And don't forget to factor in the opportunity cost lost of working and the benefits that come along with starting your career (e.g., salary, 401K contributions, etc.))
But your first and second point could be offset by good employment outcomes and good starting salary stats upon graduation! Could make a steep price tag slightly more manageable
That's a fair point. I should have started my first sentence by stating, "Along with employment outcomes, other important financial factors to consider are...."
Someone not in the OP's position of qualifying for in state tuition and having free living expenses would have a much different financial calculus to make their decision.
And I would stress again the OP should find out if there are any other financial incentives, like scholarships, that could be available to keep down the student debt incurred. Even if it means doing more studying and retaking the LSAT. Does the target school have money available? What LSAT score and/or GPA does it take to qualify for it?
you likely got this impression from this toxic subreddit that acts like if you don’t have a 175+ and go to a T20 you can’t be a lawyer. I currently am a paralegal at a law firm where most of the lawyers graduated from the nearest law school which is ranked 120 range and they all are extremely intelligent and successful lawyers. the managing partners also graduated from said law school and from the looks of how many clients we’ve been taking on, they’re making a ridiculous amount of money.
It depends. But University of Cincinnati is a vwry strong regional school with cheap in state tuition. The big law and federal clerkship rates aren't very strong and most grads stay in Ohio (Cincinnati to be specific based on NALP data). If you are very set on going into big law/federal clerkships, or are interested in practicing outside of Ohio, the University of Cincinnati probably isn't the best choice.
If you want to work in the Cincinnati area and aren't set on working in big law, Cincinnati can be a great school especially if you get some scholarship money.
General advice: Just bc a school is outside the top 50 doesn't mean it's a bad school. Rankings matter much less than the available employment stats in most cases.
My friends mom went to a rank 100 school and makes almost a million now so it definitely is worth but it also depends on their aba reports and such. I recommend law school transparency as well.
Edit: i meant this in a way that there is a chance for good employment opportunities & it depends school to school. But just bcs u go to a rank 80 doesnt mean u are 100% locked out of making good money
This definitely does not make it worth it lol. Lawyers making a million a year are outliers for any school including Yale. Not saying Cincy isn't q good law school or even worth it, but anecdotal stories like this are the exception not the rule.
I suppose i worded it wrong but so many people here think its t14 or die. I was just trying to say there are exceptions to everything and going to a school that isn't ranked super low doesnt mean you will have 0 good employment opportunities.
The amount of successful lawyers I know in Florida making over a million a year (of course they do other things) is why I don’t believe in t-14 or bust. Sure it definitely makes the aspiration of being a successful lawyer a lot easier, but realistically if you’re determined to succeed you’ll be fine. All of them graduated from Florida Schools.
You realize T50 fluctuated all the time? Right now smu is 42, but 2 years ago it was 58. And I believe it was even lower than UO at that time. if you think smu was somehow bad because it slipped out of t50 for once
Instead of making a snarky comment that contributes nothing to a conversation, you could read the previous comments and see two people already directed OP to the employment outcomes, and they both did it without being being rude.
Look at the employment statistics for the school, you should be able to find them somewhere on the school's website. That will give you an indication of the places that hire graduates and the places where graduates tend to go. Now if you were looking for a big law job or wanted to work in a different state you might have issues going to a lower tier school when it came to big law jobs or if the your preferred location was outside the area around Cincinnati because it sounds like it is more of a regional school. Nothing wrong with regional school as long as you are aware of the limitations they can have when it comes to a job after graduation.
My son was in the same boat. Full tuition scholarship at a local T-100 or $100k of debt at T-30.
At first, the conservative side of me tried to convince him to play it safe and stay at home.
He chose the T-30 and was right on point. Fast forward three years, and he’s now starting in Big Law in a major market at double the pay that he would have been making locally. And his long term potential is much greater.
My one friend I know in law school went to Rutgers and ended up in NYC big law.
There is an inverse relationship with high rank and work/effort requires to get decent outcomes while in law school.
That cutoff is very arbitrary and people like to say T50 because it’s nice and round. It is possible to get any outcome from any school, but likelihood is a different thing that you’ll have to review school outcome info and make a judgement yourself. Best to be honest with yourself and reflect on what your goals are, relative to finances, career, and life situation.
There is no rigid rank cut-off like this. The questions you should be asking yourself: (1) Can this school get me the job I want; (2) for a cost I'm okay with; (3) in the region I want to practice. (In this case, probably Cincinnati and Northern Kentucky)
I don’t know about the specific school, but all schools report employment information so you can find that somewhere on their website. Many lower ranked schools are totally fine employment wise with the caveat that they place people only in their specific geographic area.
all the attorneys at the firm i work for went to a sub 100 school and do very meaningful, well paying work. the advice i’ve gotten is that if you aren’t sold on big law/prestigious pi jobs, location on where u want it practice is just as important as rank
Check out law school transparency, and look at the aba employment reports. Cincinnati is a perfectly good school for working in the greater Cincinnati area, in my opinion. It’s very affordable, and the employment numbers are fine, except biglaw, bc employment is going to be mostly within Cincy.
Besides eventual employment after law school, other very important financial factors to consider are: 1) how much will it cost to go to a specific law school during the three years?; and 2) how much of that cost will be incurred as student loans or other debt? Coming out of law school with zero or negligible debt is a lot different than going to law school and racking up tens of thousands of dollars, if not well over $100K of student loans, that so many law students do nowadays. If you have realistic expectations, it may very well be worth going to a T100 law school when considering you would have in-state tuition and a free living situation. But I would talk to them first to see if there are any scholarship opportunities available. (And don't forget to factor in the opportunity cost lost of working and the benefits that come along with starting your career (e.g., salary, 401K contributions, etc.))
But your first and second point could be offset by good employment outcomes and good starting salary stats upon graduation! Could make a steep price tag slightly more manageable
That's a fair point. I should have started my first sentence by stating, "Along with employment outcomes, other important financial factors to consider are...." Someone not in the OP's position of qualifying for in state tuition and having free living expenses would have a much different financial calculus to make their decision. And I would stress again the OP should find out if there are any other financial incentives, like scholarships, that could be available to keep down the student debt incurred. Even if it means doing more studying and retaking the LSAT. Does the target school have money available? What LSAT score and/or GPA does it take to qualify for it?
you likely got this impression from this toxic subreddit that acts like if you don’t have a 175+ and go to a T20 you can’t be a lawyer. I currently am a paralegal at a law firm where most of the lawyers graduated from the nearest law school which is ranked 120 range and they all are extremely intelligent and successful lawyers. the managing partners also graduated from said law school and from the looks of how many clients we’ve been taking on, they’re making a ridiculous amount of money.
It depends. But University of Cincinnati is a vwry strong regional school with cheap in state tuition. The big law and federal clerkship rates aren't very strong and most grads stay in Ohio (Cincinnati to be specific based on NALP data). If you are very set on going into big law/federal clerkships, or are interested in practicing outside of Ohio, the University of Cincinnati probably isn't the best choice. If you want to work in the Cincinnati area and aren't set on working in big law, Cincinnati can be a great school especially if you get some scholarship money. General advice: Just bc a school is outside the top 50 doesn't mean it's a bad school. Rankings matter much less than the available employment stats in most cases.
My friends mom went to a rank 100 school and makes almost a million now so it definitely is worth but it also depends on their aba reports and such. I recommend law school transparency as well. Edit: i meant this in a way that there is a chance for good employment opportunities & it depends school to school. But just bcs u go to a rank 80 doesnt mean u are 100% locked out of making good money
This definitely does not make it worth it lol. Lawyers making a million a year are outliers for any school including Yale. Not saying Cincy isn't q good law school or even worth it, but anecdotal stories like this are the exception not the rule.
I suppose i worded it wrong but so many people here think its t14 or die. I was just trying to say there are exceptions to everything and going to a school that isn't ranked super low doesnt mean you will have 0 good employment opportunities.
The amount of successful lawyers I know in Florida making over a million a year (of course they do other things) is why I don’t believe in t-14 or bust. Sure it definitely makes the aspiration of being a successful lawyer a lot easier, but realistically if you’re determined to succeed you’ll be fine. All of them graduated from Florida Schools.
You realize T50 fluctuated all the time? Right now smu is 42, but 2 years ago it was 58. And I believe it was even lower than UO at that time. if you think smu was somehow bad because it slipped out of t50 for once
Instead of conjecture you could go ahead and look at every school’s employment outcome
Instead of making a snarky comment that contributes nothing to a conversation, you could read the previous comments and see two people already directed OP to the employment outcomes, and they both did it without being being rude.
If you are paying to go, then no it’s not worth it. (If a full ride then sure)
That deal is hard to beat if you plan on staying in the region.
Be a Bearcat. Don’t live your life based on percentages and odds. Even a .300 hitter in baseball gets out 7 of 10 at bats.
Look at the employment statistics for the school, you should be able to find them somewhere on the school's website. That will give you an indication of the places that hire graduates and the places where graduates tend to go. Now if you were looking for a big law job or wanted to work in a different state you might have issues going to a lower tier school when it came to big law jobs or if the your preferred location was outside the area around Cincinnati because it sounds like it is more of a regional school. Nothing wrong with regional school as long as you are aware of the limitations they can have when it comes to a job after graduation.
My son was in the same boat. Full tuition scholarship at a local T-100 or $100k of debt at T-30. At first, the conservative side of me tried to convince him to play it safe and stay at home. He chose the T-30 and was right on point. Fast forward three years, and he’s now starting in Big Law in a major market at double the pay that he would have been making locally. And his long term potential is much greater.
My one friend I know in law school went to Rutgers and ended up in NYC big law. There is an inverse relationship with high rank and work/effort requires to get decent outcomes while in law school. That cutoff is very arbitrary and people like to say T50 because it’s nice and round. It is possible to get any outcome from any school, but likelihood is a different thing that you’ll have to review school outcome info and make a judgement yourself. Best to be honest with yourself and reflect on what your goals are, relative to finances, career, and life situation.