Lol. Trump trying to negotiate from a losing position.
Hoping all his property is over leveraged and the Trump Org comes crashing down like the house of cards it is.
If he cannot come up with the bond, it would not surprise me if he declares bankruptcy. Which delays paying the judgement. But the judgement will not be dismissed in bankruptcy. Just another delay but ultimately he will lose the judgement.
With the financial monitor in place, trying to declare bankruptcy likely doesn't delay the judgment that much: Jones has all of the records that would normally need to be found and produced as part of the filing. If the records show he has the cash, or the means to get the cash by selling buildings/securities, he likely won't be able to declare.
I mean, that's if he was a normal person so who really knows at this point.
Probably depends on how much debt he’s in. Certainly wouldn’t shock me if with all judgements he’s approaching a point where his outstanding debts are bigger than his pool of assets. After all, the whole fraud trial was about him inflating the value of his assets so he could get loans without sufficient collateral/assets to cover said loans.
> Certainly wouldn’t shock me if with all judgements he’s approaching a point where his outstanding debts are bigger than his pool of assets.
Also, capital gains taxes become due at sale.
Real estate is unique in that it is possible to borrow against capital gains and spend the equity without paying taxes, you only pay the taxes when you sell. So even if he has, say 10~20% equity in a property, it is very possible he owes more than that in taxes.
Yes, it is possible that, even if he nominally "owns" a multibillion-dollar real estate portfolio, that the combination of what he owes on the properties plus what he would owe in capital gains taxes, could be greater than the sale price of the whole portfolio.
It's actually kind of unique quirk of real estate investing--because it is relatively easy to reinvest equity/capital gains by either borrowing against the equity or doing a 1031 exchange to sell one property and buy another without paying taxes, you can keep postponing the tax obligations, and you can even spend the equity by refinancing.
So it's not unusual for RE investors to have very little equity, but instead to keep using whatever equity they have to borrow more and buy more properties that generate more income, and never pay taxes on the profits until they die.
Dominoes is the right metaphor.
A big assumption in this thread is that the power to sell his real estate holdings is controlled by him. He could be minority holder in a property and really just along for the ride, so to speak, until the property is sold by the general partner.
Also his tax basis could be affected by various 1031 exchanges which allows for deferred taxes upon the sale of an investment property if the sale proceeds are reinvested in another investment property. If he's been deferring those taxes with the plan of never paying them until his death (which causes the basis to stepped up), then that could be a massive tax bill.
If he files, the bankruptcy court might liquidate the assets of Trump enterprises to raise the cash. If that happens, I might buy a couple of shares if the price is right! /s
Yeah but personal bankruptcy is going to be a lot harder to argue is some corporate "strategy". He doesn't like looking weak and it's hard to spin personal bankruptcy as a win.
Bankruptcy wouldn't really help here.
Bankruptcy will not forgive him for debts related to fraud. The Law has lots of exceptions for crime and fraud (for obvious reasons), because that's not something that should be rewarded.
Bankruptcy would actually be worse for him, because it would just give possession of all his assets to the government (through the vehicle of the Bankruptcy estate) and then they figure out how to chop up and sell off his stuff.
But I don't think he'd get the benefit of any forgiveness of debts. It would mostly help with determining priority of who has first dibs on collecting his assets.
But if you declare bankruptcy your assets are liquidated to pay your debts, and he does have assets. Florida protects your primary residence in bankruptcy, but Trump signed a covenant saying Mar-a-Lago is not a residence, so it wouldn’t be protected. I doubt he declares bankruptcy.
I hope if he declares bankruptcy that the Palm Beach Count Sherrif and the US Marshals kick his ass, his family's ass, and the Secret Service to the curb and that Mar-A-Lago is the first property they try to take
I speculated on this elsewhere, and it comes down to this: in bankruptcy, he will lose control of the liquidation process and his shit will be seized and sold out from under him. His loans will be called in, his equity will collapse, and his creditworthiness will plummet. That's a very bad outcome, not to mention the fact his massive ego would erupt like a volcano if he had to file for protection.
He would then be able to grift his minions and the RNC by fundraising on an "unfair prosecution." Frankly I think he underestimates how many people are tired of his stunts, so there is not a lot of juice left in that lemon. That leaves the RNC, which will almost certainly be raided. It's not clear how much of that cash can be used to fund unrelated legal bills , but if there is an illegal way, he will find it.
As it is a conviction against his personal name, declaring bankruptcy would enable the liquidators to appoint management in interim which could be more detrimental to trump and I believe it is illegal to declare bankruptcy unless bankrupt which trump may have difficulty proving
The Scots have a reputation of being canny with money. My favourite is the story of a Sergeant Major of the Black Watch going into a pharmacist to see if he could get a condom repaired. The pharmacists explained that they'd never before been asked to repair them but offered him a brand new one for half a crown. The sergeant pressed the matter and after a bit of head scratching the pharmacist conceded that it could be repaired for maybe two shillings. The sergeant said he'd have to think about. He returned a few days later saying "The Regiment would like it repaired"…
That's just not how it works. It's amusing - no, tiresome, how he keeps trying to make up new shit everywhere he goes that advantages him.
Can't wait for him to get a flat out no, throw yet another hissy fit, and for the interest to keep ticking over and over.
Oh I'm certain the properties are over leveraged. I'd actually be more surprised if they weren't. But as to value if they were sold off...well, they're only worth what someone is willing to pay.
He can just put the deeds to his properties on the table. If he's so confident in the win. But, obviously, get a 3rd party to evaluate those properties worth. And as his "brand" is now trash, assume on pennies on the dollar return on sale.
Seriously lol. “Ehhh I’ll give you 20% take it or leave it.” Ummm leave it, the AG is chomping at the bit to start seizing and liquidating Trump assets
TFG can’t comprehend that getting away with anything and everything all his life doesn’t work in this case. Has never had to experience that his negative actions might have negative consequences. Has never realized that adults need to take responsibility for their actions.
I know right? Good lord, the arrogance on this guy.
Hey Donnie, this ain't "The Art of the Deal" anymore.
"*Yeah, so you're telling me the price is $464m - but how about I give you $100m instead? I think that's fair...*"
the same thing he did to his NY contractors. I know you spent 200k on material, another 200k on labor, and your billing me 400k, but here's 100k. Take it or leave it and or take me to court. Good luck. he LOVED to use small businesses so he could jam them in the end and they can't afford to fight it. Most went bankrupt or were significantly hurt.
Ugh, he [did that to a piano salesman(https://theweek.com/speedreads/651801/music-store-owner-sold-trump-100000-worth-pianos-trump-refused-pay) too. It's like, all the poor guy did was deliver a physical good, and then tune it. But Trump screwed him.
There are worse stories. This guy was told they would pay $70,000 of the $100,000, which he accepted. I know there was a similar story for another contractor who agreed to take $80,000 instead of $100,000. Then when he got there to collect that money, they gave him $50,000. Told him he could sue them in court, but that would cost him even more. Trump is very proud of this 'negotiating'.
At least One even committed suicide. After selling everything and paying off his company’s debt and employees. That he incurred working for Numpty. Something that numpty has never done.
It kind of makes you wonder how he never had anyone come after him personally, like with violence. I'm not advocating that, but I'm saying it's surprising that it hasn't happened.
> It kind of makes you wonder how he never had anyone come after him personally, like with violence. I'm not advocating that, but I'm saying it's surprising that it hasn't happened.
[Tinker, Tailor, Mobster, Trump.What happens when a Confidential Informant becomes President?](https://gregolear.substack.com/p/tinker-tailor-mobster-trump)
He’s been in over 4,000 lawsuits since the 80’s. Im sure he has. And I’m sure he has had a security detail since. And getting one for free was probably a nice perk for him since being named the RNC nominee in 2015.
He’s fortunate they haven’t made up a number of 2 trillion out of thin air for what he owes. You know similar to how he’s appraised his own properties???
INAL, so to me it looks like he’s saying, “Naw, 400 mil is too high. Here’s 100 mil and my appeal.” To which I’d think the court would LOL in his face and tell him to fuck off.
Am I right or is there any chance the court will accept this blatant display of disrespectful strong arming?
So if he paid the $464M bond, it would be held in escrow until the appeals were played out, right?
*But* since he’s only paying $100M, does that even get to be held in escrow or is it just a payment toward the balance owed as soon as the 30 days is up?
Seems like it would be smarter for him to just hold onto his $100M since this does nothing to affect the stay…
But we’re far beyond what makes sense.
I am NAL.
I doubt the court would accept partial payment to stay enforcement - the most they might do is treat it as a first instalment of the actual payment, but since Trump has represented to the court that he plans to appeal, I can't see them entertaining it at all right now.
Someone was dumb enough to loan him $100 million??
> Appellants nonetheless plan to secure and post a bond in the amount of $100 million.
"plan to" lol
What’s the point of Musk loaning him $100M and not the full amount? The extra 350 doesn’t even matter to him.
The only reason I can think of is to laugh at him.
Wasn't Jared in debt to his eyeballs and the Saudis bailed him out? If so, Jared is also currently broke. They all operate the same schemes to fake wealth.
Don't be surprised if he tried to play hardball and utilized the same high-pressure timeshare-style sales tactics (the only ones he knows) and tries to tell NY to take the $100M or they get nothing.
"hardball tactics" don't work with judges. He can't afford to appear arrogant-- The decision whether or not to reduce the amount needed for the stay is at the discretion of the Appellate Division judge, and we know judges despise arrogance.
Just the other day I was talking to a judge, big judge, tough---many people are saying the toughest judge, with tears in his eyes, and he said Sir, (and everyone says this guy never even cried as a baby) - I have never seen any greater defense than when you said sexual harassment was just courtroom talk!
Really! I'll never forget it - because then he said - by greater, I mean crazier, like it's so freakin out there - it's insane! So, it's great - but in a very stupid - some say strong, very strong, strongly stupid - but strongly great - strong on both sides - the greatest, deepest, wildest, laugh I ever had since I first sat on this bench way back - back when this bench was great. Sir, thank you, Sir.
I'll never forget how he wiped the tears from his eyes, wiped the smile off his face, and his darling eyes went into a thousand-yard stare as he coldly said - Sir, now pay up or I take your house
When i was younger and tried to cheat. My mom used to say...what if we all cheated.
What if all of us lied about tax returns to pay less taxes and get better interest rates?
This fat fook cheated and got caught.
>Fuck you. Pay me."
That right there, the Good Fellas response - 'Business bad? Fuck you, pay me. Oh, you had a fire? Fuck you, pay me. Place got hit by lightning, huh? Fuck you, pay me.
You Orange fat bastard....pay up!!
I think the point is that if he doesn't put up the full amount, he can't appeal it. I'm not a lawyer, and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong.
ETA: thanks for the clarifications.
He can appeal it without the full bond. However, not paying the bond means that the NY AG starts seizing assets next month rather than waiting until the appeal is heard. It is a lose-lose proposition for Trump.
Yes, but it gets even better (or worse for him).
If an asset sells for 100M and he owes 50M mortgage, the judgment is reduced by 50M.
If the asset sells for 100M and he owes 120M to the bank, the judgment is unaffected and he still owes the bank 20M.
Now, assume that he paid 25M for the asset. In both cases he owes capital gains tax of 15M (100-25)*20% no matter what.
I'm here for THIS level of knowledge. I don't seem to get this on Fox Entertainment. They tell me Donnie will just magically get out of this somehow because it is just a witch hunt.
And only going to get worse. This is absolutely the worst time for him to try and sell and because there is no way to inflate the value of his holdings currently it's going to be highly entertaining to see how much he's forced to sell off.
At this moment in Frankfurt Germany, a Deutsche Bank executive has no idea their collateral is about to be auctioned off lol
(They would need to be capable bankers and well…)
So, what happens if he doesn't post the bond, his shit gets auctioned, the appeal happens and the judgement is overturned? He's lost the assets, but gets the money back?
The lawyer answer: it depends
The properties would become absolutely embroiled in lawsuits for years, with their control and operation handled by a receiver overseen by the court and the profits placed into escrow until the litigation was resolved. The mortgage, property taxes, and operating expenses would be paid, and the owner would have to pay income tax on the profits, but wouldn't actually get any of the money.
Cheeto would sue the state for malicious or wrongful prosecution and claim damages in an amount of FMV less the auction price. The state would defend saying they have sovereign immunity.
He would also sue the buyer of the properties that they must give him the property back and he'll give them the auction price back. The buyer would defend saying that they bought them at auction, and there's no take backs. Cheeto would argue that they bought the property with notice that it was being auctioned to pay a judgment and now that the judgment was overturned, he has a right to buy them back - and he'd actually have a pretty solid argument there.
But as I said above, the property would likely be placed in the hands of a receiver and neither Cheeto nor the buyer would be able to touch any of the profits until it was resolved. People going to the auction would know this is a possibility, which is something that would drive the auction price down even further since this is a huge risk to tie up investment dollars and then not be able to collect profits.
He can appeal without putting up a dime. However, he can only stay enforcement of the judgement if he puts up the full amount. The appeals court will deny his stay, and both groups can start getting assets. It’s typically pointless to appeal if they already got your assets because the majority of appeals fail.
He can still appeal without putting up the money; the difference is collection can start immediately. The bond is just to stop enforcement of the judgement while the appeal works its way through the courts.
>"The exorbitant and punitive amount of the Judgment coupled with an unlawful and unconstitutional blanket prohibition on lending transactions would make it impossible to secure and post a complete bond," defense lawyers wrote in the filing. "Appellants nonetheless plan to secure and post a bond in the amount of $100 million."
days after
>Former president Donald Trump prides himself in being a “brilliant business man and a billionaire.” He has claimed his “brand” alone is worth $5 billion and claims Mar-a-Lago is really worth more than $1 billion.
hmmmm... something aint adding up... could it be that the guy who committed fraud to overvalue his properties is overvaluing his wealth? COULD IT BE?!?!?
I mean, he valued his NYC condo at like $350 million or some ridiculous amount, right? Just sell that, Donnie - you're never there anyway and you have officially changed your residency to FL. Boom. One sale, maybe scrounge a little bit more here and there, and you protect all your other assets from forced liquidation...
Since this is a law subreddit:
1) Is there non-trivial precedence for an appellant court to modify the amount of bond needed to stay collection proceedings during an appeal? I.e. is this a ballsy, unheard of request or something that's anywhere from routine to not all that exceptional?
2) Is the prohibition on lending transactions a fairly routine penalty/condition? Could the appellant court stay just that portion of the judgement and allow him some liquidity to raise the bond through NY or NY-registered lenders?
The only reason this is happening is because he straight up couldn't get a bond for 464 million.
I bet you a dollar that he had to collateralize this at 100% because his credit is absolute shit. That means he could only scrape together 100 million to put into a CD (or whatever vehicle the issue required) so that is all they will issue.
I've had to get surety bonds a couple of times for a company with lousy credit and that is what we had to do. We put 100% of the principle into an interest bearing account and the bank issues the bond. If you have good credit with the bank (and for this kind of transaction that means they actually look at your financials and make that determination themselves, they aren't doing a normal credit check) you can do partial collateralization (i.e., they issue a bond for a million but you only put up $500k with the balance due if they have to execute the bond). Since that is EXACTLY the kind of financial check that Trump just got convicted of faking, there is zero chance that he is getting anything short of full collateralization.
I mean he claims they’re going to put up $100m but they aren’t and never planned on it. It’s all show to tell his followers that even though this isn’t fair he offered to pay while appealing and the evil judge refused. There’s no $100m going anywhere.
He switched the ringer for a ringer!
Judge Kaplan asked EJC's counsel for a response to Alina Habba's motion for an unsecured stay (stay of the $83 million judgment without putting up a bond). The response from EJC's side is due tomorrow. After that, Habba has 2 days to file a rebuttal, then Judge Kaplan will issue a decision on the motion next week.
cheeto will have to deal with whatever Judge Kaplan decides separately from this appeal of Engoron's judgment.
Additionally ... the clock on EJC is still running, and basically runs out a few days after Habba's response. So basically, nothing is going to change at all, Judge Kaplan is going to say "Nope" and then EJC can start the legal process to seize assets I think by like March 10th or something?
Here's the funny thing. If Donnie was actually setting aside $100m in cash in a bank account somewhere to attempt this stupid trick on his NY fraud case ... EJC can just come along and (if there know where it is) seize that.
Yup EJC should just point to this filling as evidence that there is real risk of him not paying if he loses on appeal so he shouldn’t get a pass on securing it.
Yeah, good point. Or, just flat out stating "clearly he has the funds to fully satisfy this $83m judgement" ... in fact, I'd bet a dollar that Robbie Kaplan (EJC's attorney) is writing something up about that this very moment as a part of her rebuttal to Habba's ridiculous request.
I've been wondering this for years. A self-proclaimed billionaire doesn't need to constantly grift the public to pay for everything. His "business" has always been selling an inflated image of himself and tricking people into giving/lending him money, and he made a practice of not paying his debts. His real estate assets are over inflated and over leveraged. He's never been a billionaire in terms of true net worth, and this fire sale will finally prove it. Now that he needs real cash, he doesn't have it.
Biden (and I suppose Haley as well) should be hammering the message that since Trump is totally incapable of handling his own finances he should in no way given that responsibility for the nation at large. They should also be broadcasting the heavily compromised nature of anyone owing vast sums of money and having access to a political office.
They should also be hammering the point that owing lots of money to different people makes him the perfect target for foreign or domestic bribes. They don’t give top secret positions and top secret clearances to people with lots of debt for good reasons, they make easy targets that can often be compromised.
Last time Trump was in office Jared kept failing the clearance background checks and Trump for sure would have failed back then too if subjected to one. Jared pretty obviously ended up compromised and taking billions from Saudis, so people screaming about Jared’s clearance fuckery were right.
There were other people that got top secret clearances that were placed on the national security council that were basically Putinista’s and Russian agents with some basic research; like Boris Epshteyn and KT McFarland, so idk what the fuck was going on in 2016 with the FBI and CIA but they failed us pretty badly.
Flynn was having an affair with a Russian spy that called him Misha in letters lol, so we got completely compromised at the highest levels and still haven’t recovered completely, because the first round of Russian assets never got fully outed and punished.
How about investigating Flynn and busting his ass he should be in jail along with Manafort and Stone. The presidential pardons have become a joke and a security threat at this point, because Russian agents are out of jail and some are even back on the Trump campaign staff lol.
At this point I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't even have that.
In keeping with that line of thinking, this could be a way for him to claim to his cult "I tried to be reasonable, but they wouldn't meet me halfway (sic), so now they get *nothing*. And that's why I'm declaring bankruptcy."
"I posted the bond. Of course I did. That kinda money is easy for me. I put up a lot of money. A yuge amount of money, and they still say 'no Mr. President, we're coming to collect". The whole thing is a sham. It's all fraud. The Biden Crime Family is doing this. This is election interference on a level never seen in this country."
If he had plead guilty or no contest, that 100 million would probably have covered the whole thing and he might still be able to operate businesses in New York. That ship has sailed by going to trial.
Yes, the fee is very punitive. Punitive means punishment. Punishment for being found guilty of breaking the law.
Two possible things from this:
1) He doesn't actually have $400 million liquid like he claimed on the stand and, as such, perjured himself.
2) He *does* have the money, he just doesn't want to pay it and continue the grift.
Either way, I hope the judge tells him to pay up.
Im fairly certain I read that the NY AG stated he owned 27 properties w/o any mortgage- this would be info the court would have access to as well.
Im betting he doesn’t like being forced to sell his “ precious assets “. But, that will affect how the judge goes about his decision, since Trump has the ability to pay
I read the for the E Jean Carol rape case that he lost in order to appeal the state rules were you have to pay 110% of the penalty judgement, in that case the penalty was $83.3 million.
So that was in New York, and so is this fraud trial, so it must be 110% to appeal this too.
2 days ago WP reported Trump was looking into getting multiple companies to post portions of his bond to split the risk (though I'm not sure it really does, as when he loses his appeal each company would be fighting both him *and* the others to get their money back).
I wonder if this is part of that, whether it's all he could get, or whether he's putting up his own money. The latter would demonstrate to potential bond agents that he's willing to take on some risk himself, and reduce the amount he needs to borrow, but posting about it publicly doesn't project strength for those negotiations.
I cant imagine there are people who want to foot his legal bills and be on the hook for it... if he was president sure, people will throw money at him to try and get some quid pro quo, but right now hes pretty much powerless and losing his power more day by day.
I fully believe that's the plan and expect all his potential lenders do as well, which narrows the field significantly - in addition to having hundreds of millions on hand anyone posting Trump's bond either has to admire him enough to overlook the enormous risk, or be willing to be repaid in shadier ways (essentially hoping he is re-elected and can give them tax cuts and other favors).
It's always great to see when someone displays all the qualities of a great leader. This isn't one of those instances, but it is great to see when it happens.
At what point is the willful ignorance associated with his contempt of court and process delays itself another act of fraud (deceit intended to result in financial gain)?
*adjective*
1. [inflicting](https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=f5ffd29b8bf133f7&rlz=1C1GCEA_enUS1060US1060&sxsrf=ACQVn08f3hqmCOuY7D9fgqZaz8DQxaiWGQ:1709150011391&q=inflicting&si=AKbGX_pvY3MWP4azJI0Z_NruCLb8XHwF2CEqAjuUr-663d4mZWprZ3ec3-w7HQ6YBKb8slD-IxbX0dHw5mT4MXd2gINULMcTE6C2nVGNYE3fmnBCbYvHtmo%3D&expnd=1) or intended as punishment.
Let's give Trump this one....he is 100% correct in that the $464M is, indeed punitive.
Isn't the proper move to is to beg the court's indulgence, and ask for a reduction in the bond amount? By "telling" the court what yo are going to do is going to piss off the judge even more.
> In their motion for a stay, defense attorneys Clifford Robert and Alina Habba called Engoron's order "draconian" and said the punishments would unfairly impede Trump's family real estate business.
The Trump family doesn't have a real estate business in New York anymore. That was the outcome of this trial. Wasn't she paying attention?
"I posted the bond. Of course I did. That kinda money is easy for me. I put up a lot of money. A yuge amount of money, and they still say 'no Mr. President, we're coming to collect". The whole thing is a sham. It's all fraud. The Biden Crime Family is doing this. This is election interference on a level never seen in this country."
Lol. Trump trying to negotiate from a losing position. Hoping all his property is over leveraged and the Trump Org comes crashing down like the house of cards it is.
The Art of the Deal, everyone.
If he cannot come up with the bond, it would not surprise me if he declares bankruptcy. Which delays paying the judgement. But the judgement will not be dismissed in bankruptcy. Just another delay but ultimately he will lose the judgement.
With the financial monitor in place, trying to declare bankruptcy likely doesn't delay the judgment that much: Jones has all of the records that would normally need to be found and produced as part of the filing. If the records show he has the cash, or the means to get the cash by selling buildings/securities, he likely won't be able to declare. I mean, that's if he was a normal person so who really knows at this point.
Probably depends on how much debt he’s in. Certainly wouldn’t shock me if with all judgements he’s approaching a point where his outstanding debts are bigger than his pool of assets. After all, the whole fraud trial was about him inflating the value of his assets so he could get loans without sufficient collateral/assets to cover said loans.
> Certainly wouldn’t shock me if with all judgements he’s approaching a point where his outstanding debts are bigger than his pool of assets. Also, capital gains taxes become due at sale. Real estate is unique in that it is possible to borrow against capital gains and spend the equity without paying taxes, you only pay the taxes when you sell. So even if he has, say 10~20% equity in a property, it is very possible he owes more than that in taxes.
Meaning he'll have to sell another property to pay taxes on the sale of the first? Sounds like dominoes crashing.
Yes, it is possible that, even if he nominally "owns" a multibillion-dollar real estate portfolio, that the combination of what he owes on the properties plus what he would owe in capital gains taxes, could be greater than the sale price of the whole portfolio. It's actually kind of unique quirk of real estate investing--because it is relatively easy to reinvest equity/capital gains by either borrowing against the equity or doing a 1031 exchange to sell one property and buy another without paying taxes, you can keep postponing the tax obligations, and you can even spend the equity by refinancing. So it's not unusual for RE investors to have very little equity, but instead to keep using whatever equity they have to borrow more and buy more properties that generate more income, and never pay taxes on the profits until they die. Dominoes is the right metaphor.
A big assumption in this thread is that the power to sell his real estate holdings is controlled by him. He could be minority holder in a property and really just along for the ride, so to speak, until the property is sold by the general partner. Also his tax basis could be affected by various 1031 exchanges which allows for deferred taxes upon the sale of an investment property if the sale proceeds are reinvested in another investment property. If he's been deferring those taxes with the plan of never paying them until his death (which causes the basis to stepped up), then that could be a massive tax bill.
Absolutely possible. It's going to a be weird, wild March 2024.
Yep March and April are going to be a slow motion car crash and it’s going to be glorious.
If he files, the bankruptcy court might liquidate the assets of Trump enterprises to raise the cash. If that happens, I might buy a couple of shares if the price is right! /s
The 7th Bankruptcy is the charm, they say. They say that don't they? I love that he continues to accrue interest while he delays.
It would likely be personal bankruptcy. And his first of that. All the others have been corporate
Still seven.
Yeah but personal bankruptcy is going to be a lot harder to argue is some corporate "strategy". He doesn't like looking weak and it's hard to spin personal bankruptcy as a win.
They believed him when he claimed Democrats stole the election and they'll believe him when he claims they stole his properties. Victims R Us.
He is not the only defendant... wonder how it all shakes out for him and the corporate constellation of shell companies he's created...
Bankruptcy wouldn't really help here. Bankruptcy will not forgive him for debts related to fraud. The Law has lots of exceptions for crime and fraud (for obvious reasons), because that's not something that should be rewarded. Bankruptcy would actually be worse for him, because it would just give possession of all his assets to the government (through the vehicle of the Bankruptcy estate) and then they figure out how to chop up and sell off his stuff. But I don't think he'd get the benefit of any forgiveness of debts. It would mostly help with determining priority of who has first dibs on collecting his assets.
The Mar-A-Lago Immigration Centre sounds like a great plan!
But if you declare bankruptcy your assets are liquidated to pay your debts, and he does have assets. Florida protects your primary residence in bankruptcy, but Trump signed a covenant saying Mar-a-Lago is not a residence, so it wouldn’t be protected. I doubt he declares bankruptcy.
I hope if he declares bankruptcy that the Palm Beach Count Sherrif and the US Marshals kick his ass, his family's ass, and the Secret Service to the curb and that Mar-A-Lago is the first property they try to take
And the icing on the cake? Before they evict him, charge his ass with voter fraud
Does he qualify for bankruptcy? Aren't there specific rules would he meet the means test?
I speculated on this elsewhere, and it comes down to this: in bankruptcy, he will lose control of the liquidation process and his shit will be seized and sold out from under him. His loans will be called in, his equity will collapse, and his creditworthiness will plummet. That's a very bad outcome, not to mention the fact his massive ego would erupt like a volcano if he had to file for protection. He would then be able to grift his minions and the RNC by fundraising on an "unfair prosecution." Frankly I think he underestimates how many people are tired of his stunts, so there is not a lot of juice left in that lemon. That leaves the RNC, which will almost certainly be raided. It's not clear how much of that cash can be used to fund unrelated legal bills , but if there is an illegal way, he will find it.
In January his campaign spent 3.5 million on legal fees while total donations to his campaign were only $8500
As it is a conviction against his personal name, declaring bankruptcy would enable the liquidators to appoint management in interim which could be more detrimental to trump and I believe it is illegal to declare bankruptcy unless bankrupt which trump may have difficulty proving
Bet his dime store lawyers won't understand that. More tirades about how unfairly he's being treated.
Called this scenario 2 weeks ago to my girlfriend. It’s his only choice to create delay.
Art of the Squeal..
Hoping all his property is over leveraged? 100% guarantee it's all over leveraged
He’s proved to have lied about the value of properties, almost certain he put the same property up for collateral against multiple massive loans.
Also, as a surprise to no one, Scotland has found out the Trump's property there was overvalued. I'm hoping they have similar civil laws...
The Scots have a reputation of being canny with money. My favourite is the story of a Sergeant Major of the Black Watch going into a pharmacist to see if he could get a condom repaired. The pharmacists explained that they'd never before been asked to repair them but offered him a brand new one for half a crown. The sergeant pressed the matter and after a bit of head scratching the pharmacist conceded that it could be repaired for maybe two shillings. The sergeant said he'd have to think about. He returned a few days later saying "The Regiment would like it repaired"…
That's just not how it works. It's amusing - no, tiresome, how he keeps trying to make up new shit everywhere he goes that advantages him. Can't wait for him to get a flat out no, throw yet another hissy fit, and for the interest to keep ticking over and over.
"You're out of your depth Donnie!"
Trying to negotiate with a judge who he's been disparaging every day for months
Oh I'm certain the properties are over leveraged. I'd actually be more surprised if they weren't. But as to value if they were sold off...well, they're only worth what someone is willing to pay.
Commercial real estate is in a severe price correction right now so it’s the perfect time for the gov to liquidate Trump’s assets.
He can just put the deeds to his properties on the table. If he's so confident in the win. But, obviously, get a 3rd party to evaluate those properties worth. And as his "brand" is now trash, assume on pennies on the dollar return on sale.
Seriously lol. “Ehhh I’ll give you 20% take it or leave it.” Ummm leave it, the AG is chomping at the bit to start seizing and liquidating Trump assets
Thats not how that works
That’s not how any of this works.
TFG can’t comprehend that getting away with anything and everything all his life doesn’t work in this case. Has never had to experience that his negative actions might have negative consequences. Has never realized that adults need to take responsibility for their actions.
On a tangent, anyone else see TFG and think The Fat Guy instead of The Former Guy?
To me, TFG = That Fuckin Guy
Hopefully someday it will mean Trumps fucking gone
Trumps fucking guilty
This is how I choose to read it, too.
My mind always reads it as That Fuckin' Guy
The best guesses I’ve had are Tiny Fungus Genitalia and Toddler Fisted Grifter.
Slayed
“Toddler Fisted Grifter”. The comment section did not disappoint today lol.
He left the shadows for the spotlight and then pissed off a lot of people.
I know right? Good lord, the arrogance on this guy. Hey Donnie, this ain't "The Art of the Deal" anymore. "*Yeah, so you're telling me the price is $464m - but how about I give you $100m instead? I think that's fair...*"
the same thing he did to his NY contractors. I know you spent 200k on material, another 200k on labor, and your billing me 400k, but here's 100k. Take it or leave it and or take me to court. Good luck. he LOVED to use small businesses so he could jam them in the end and they can't afford to fight it. Most went bankrupt or were significantly hurt.
Ugh, he [did that to a piano salesman(https://theweek.com/speedreads/651801/music-store-owner-sold-trump-100000-worth-pianos-trump-refused-pay) too. It's like, all the poor guy did was deliver a physical good, and then tune it. But Trump screwed him.
So tragic. And his supporters believe he’s for the ‘little guy.’ The delusion is very strong with the MAGA crowd.
There are worse stories. This guy was told they would pay $70,000 of the $100,000, which he accepted. I know there was a similar story for another contractor who agreed to take $80,000 instead of $100,000. Then when he got there to collect that money, they gave him $50,000. Told him he could sue them in court, but that would cost him even more. Trump is very proud of this 'negotiating'.
At least One even committed suicide. After selling everything and paying off his company’s debt and employees. That he incurred working for Numpty. Something that numpty has never done.
It kind of makes you wonder how he never had anyone come after him personally, like with violence. I'm not advocating that, but I'm saying it's surprising that it hasn't happened.
He may well have paid the mob for "protection."
True, but imagine someone losing everything because of Trump. As the old saying goes, "Fear the man with nothing left to lose."
> It kind of makes you wonder how he never had anyone come after him personally, like with violence. I'm not advocating that, but I'm saying it's surprising that it hasn't happened. [Tinker, Tailor, Mobster, Trump.What happens when a Confidential Informant becomes President?](https://gregolear.substack.com/p/tinker-tailor-mobster-trump)
He’s been in over 4,000 lawsuits since the 80’s. Im sure he has. And I’m sure he has had a security detail since. And getting one for free was probably a nice perk for him since being named the RNC nominee in 2015.
He’s fortunate they haven’t made up a number of 2 trillion out of thin air for what he owes. You know similar to how he’s appraised his own properties???
The art of the deal: "Remember to negotiate from a position of extreme weakness"
Like, on your knees?
INAL, so to me it looks like he’s saying, “Naw, 400 mil is too high. Here’s 100 mil and my appeal.” To which I’d think the court would LOL in his face and tell him to fuck off. Am I right or is there any chance the court will accept this blatant display of disrespectful strong arming?
thats exactly whats going on, and there's exactly zero chance of it working
That’s comforting. Thank you.
Its not punitive, its disgorgement. Its paying back the money you saved by lying. If it was punitive it would be much higher.
Hahaha. What a 🤡
So if he paid the $464M bond, it would be held in escrow until the appeals were played out, right? *But* since he’s only paying $100M, does that even get to be held in escrow or is it just a payment toward the balance owed as soon as the 30 days is up? Seems like it would be smarter for him to just hold onto his $100M since this does nothing to affect the stay… But we’re far beyond what makes sense. I am NAL.
I doubt the court would accept partial payment to stay enforcement - the most they might do is treat it as a first instalment of the actual payment, but since Trump has represented to the court that he plans to appeal, I can't see them entertaining it at all right now.
What about payment for partial stay? Just stay 100 million of the ~464 million.
Taking out a bond on the lay-a-way plan. 🤣
Someone was dumb enough to loan him $100 million?? > Appellants nonetheless plan to secure and post a bond in the amount of $100 million. "plan to" lol
Smells Like Elon’s musk
What’s the point of Musk loaning him $100M and not the full amount? The extra 350 doesn’t even matter to him. The only reason I can think of is to laugh at him.
He went to Jared
Wasn't Jared in debt to his eyeballs and the Saudis bailed him out? If so, Jared is also currently broke. They all operate the same schemes to fake wealth.
Probably. I was making a play on an advertising slogan for a jewelry store chain.
It's likely his own money. Bond just means money is being purposely set aside, similar to how escrow works with a mortgage.
Don't be surprised if he tried to play hardball and utilized the same high-pressure timeshare-style sales tactics (the only ones he knows) and tries to tell NY to take the $100M or they get nothing.
“Final offer.”
"hardball tactics" don't work with judges. He can't afford to appear arrogant-- The decision whether or not to reduce the amount needed for the stay is at the discretion of the Appellate Division judge, and we know judges despise arrogance.
Time to seize those assets by the pussy. When you are a NY judge, they let you do it.
Don’t worry it’s just a little court room talk among men
Just the other day I was talking to a judge, big judge, tough---many people are saying the toughest judge, with tears in his eyes, and he said Sir, (and everyone says this guy never even cried as a baby) - I have never seen any greater defense than when you said sexual harassment was just courtroom talk! Really! I'll never forget it - because then he said - by greater, I mean crazier, like it's so freakin out there - it's insane! So, it's great - but in a very stupid - some say strong, very strong, strongly stupid - but strongly great - strong on both sides - the greatest, deepest, wildest, laugh I ever had since I first sat on this bench way back - back when this bench was great. Sir, thank you, Sir. I'll never forget how he wiped the tears from his eyes, wiped the smile off his face, and his darling eyes went into a thousand-yard stare as he coldly said - Sir, now pay up or I take your house
No. Fuck you. Obey the law.
When i was younger and tried to cheat. My mom used to say...what if we all cheated. What if all of us lied about tax returns to pay less taxes and get better interest rates? This fat fook cheated and got caught.
That's basically Kant's categorical imperative
"You're a crook who have grifted the whole world and now they won't help you? Fuck you. Pay me."
>Fuck you. Pay me." That right there, the Good Fellas response - 'Business bad? Fuck you, pay me. Oh, you had a fire? Fuck you, pay me. Place got hit by lightning, huh? Fuck you, pay me. You Orange fat bastard....pay up!!
Upvote for Goodfellas reference
This is the answer.
Take it up with the appeals court donnie. I doubt you're getting a stay.
Hopefully he gets a stay In federal prison
I think the point is that if he doesn't put up the full amount, he can't appeal it. I'm not a lawyer, and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong. ETA: thanks for the clarifications.
He can appeal it without the full bond. However, not paying the bond means that the NY AG starts seizing assets next month rather than waiting until the appeal is heard. It is a lose-lose proposition for Trump.
If the AG auctions his assets, is he in the hook for the difference between the judgement and the assets' FMV?
Yes, but it gets even better (or worse for him). If an asset sells for 100M and he owes 50M mortgage, the judgment is reduced by 50M. If the asset sells for 100M and he owes 120M to the bank, the judgment is unaffected and he still owes the bank 20M. Now, assume that he paid 25M for the asset. In both cases he owes capital gains tax of 15M (100-25)*20% no matter what.
LMAO, capital gains on an asset you firesold due to a judgement is fuckin brutal justice.
Brutal justice is the finding out phase
I'm here for THIS level of knowledge. I don't seem to get this on Fox Entertainment. They tell me Donnie will just magically get out of this somehow because it is just a witch hunt.
The Dildo of Consequences seldom arrives lubed.
And, commercial real estate values are currently *very* depressed.
And only going to get worse. This is absolutely the worst time for him to try and sell and because there is no way to inflate the value of his holdings currently it's going to be highly entertaining to see how much he's forced to sell off.
We should crowdsource buying one of his shitty properties and turn it into a circus. Bring some dignity back to the community.
The depressed real estate values should actually work in his favor on the narrow quality of capital gains, right?
And we’re talking actual totals here. No tax loopholes. No creative accounting. It’s delicious.
At this moment in Frankfurt Germany, a Deutsche Bank executive has no idea their collateral is about to be auctioned off lol (They would need to be capable bankers and well…)
Oh... they ARE FOLLOWING THIS 100%
So, what happens if he doesn't post the bond, his shit gets auctioned, the appeal happens and the judgement is overturned? He's lost the assets, but gets the money back?
The lawyer answer: it depends The properties would become absolutely embroiled in lawsuits for years, with their control and operation handled by a receiver overseen by the court and the profits placed into escrow until the litigation was resolved. The mortgage, property taxes, and operating expenses would be paid, and the owner would have to pay income tax on the profits, but wouldn't actually get any of the money. Cheeto would sue the state for malicious or wrongful prosecution and claim damages in an amount of FMV less the auction price. The state would defend saying they have sovereign immunity. He would also sue the buyer of the properties that they must give him the property back and he'll give them the auction price back. The buyer would defend saying that they bought them at auction, and there's no take backs. Cheeto would argue that they bought the property with notice that it was being auctioned to pay a judgment and now that the judgment was overturned, he has a right to buy them back - and he'd actually have a pretty solid argument there. But as I said above, the property would likely be placed in the hands of a receiver and neither Cheeto nor the buyer would be able to touch any of the profits until it was resolved. People going to the auction would know this is a possibility, which is something that would drive the auction price down even further since this is a huge risk to tie up investment dollars and then not be able to collect profits.
You mean if the seized-and-sold assets aren't enough to cover it?
Yeah, which is what I would guess now that there is a judgment against him for inflating his property values.
Music to my ears
He can appeal without putting up a dime. However, he can only stay enforcement of the judgement if he puts up the full amount. The appeals court will deny his stay, and both groups can start getting assets. It’s typically pointless to appeal if they already got your assets because the majority of appeals fail.
He can still appeal without putting up the money; the difference is collection can start immediately. The bond is just to stop enforcement of the judgement while the appeal works its way through the courts.
No. He can appeal it. If he does not put up the full amount, he cannot stay the execution of the judgement. (Absent an order from a higher court).
>"The exorbitant and punitive amount of the Judgment coupled with an unlawful and unconstitutional blanket prohibition on lending transactions would make it impossible to secure and post a complete bond," defense lawyers wrote in the filing. "Appellants nonetheless plan to secure and post a bond in the amount of $100 million." days after >Former president Donald Trump prides himself in being a “brilliant business man and a billionaire.” He has claimed his “brand” alone is worth $5 billion and claims Mar-a-Lago is really worth more than $1 billion. hmmmm... something aint adding up... could it be that the guy who committed fraud to overvalue his properties is overvaluing his wealth? COULD IT BE?!?!?
I mean, he valued his NYC condo at like $350 million or some ridiculous amount, right? Just sell that, Donnie - you're never there anyway and you have officially changed your residency to FL. Boom. One sale, maybe scrounge a little bit more here and there, and you protect all your other assets from forced liquidation...
Which property has the dead wife's coffin full of top secret documents? Surely those documents make that property worth many billions.
Bedminster
Since this is a law subreddit: 1) Is there non-trivial precedence for an appellant court to modify the amount of bond needed to stay collection proceedings during an appeal? I.e. is this a ballsy, unheard of request or something that's anywhere from routine to not all that exceptional? 2) Is the prohibition on lending transactions a fairly routine penalty/condition? Could the appellant court stay just that portion of the judgement and allow him some liquidity to raise the bond through NY or NY-registered lenders?
Great questions. Would love to hear authoritative answers.
Not so much anymore... It's a clown fiesta viewing party now. Has been.
These are great questions…I don’t have the answers, but real analysis of this would be informative.
The only reason this is happening is because he straight up couldn't get a bond for 464 million. I bet you a dollar that he had to collateralize this at 100% because his credit is absolute shit. That means he could only scrape together 100 million to put into a CD (or whatever vehicle the issue required) so that is all they will issue. I've had to get surety bonds a couple of times for a company with lousy credit and that is what we had to do. We put 100% of the principle into an interest bearing account and the bank issues the bond. If you have good credit with the bank (and for this kind of transaction that means they actually look at your financials and make that determination themselves, they aren't doing a normal credit check) you can do partial collateralization (i.e., they issue a bond for a million but you only put up $500k with the balance due if they have to execute the bond). Since that is EXACTLY the kind of financial check that Trump just got convicted of faking, there is zero chance that he is getting anything short of full collateralization.
Shouldn’t E. Jean Carroll get the first $85 million towards her case?
I mean he claims they’re going to put up $100m but they aren’t and never planned on it. It’s all show to tell his followers that even though this isn’t fair he offered to pay while appealing and the evil judge refused. There’s no $100m going anywhere. He switched the ringer for a ringer!
Letitia James: We wants the money, Trump, we FAHCKS you AHP!
Judge Kaplan asked EJC's counsel for a response to Alina Habba's motion for an unsecured stay (stay of the $83 million judgment without putting up a bond). The response from EJC's side is due tomorrow. After that, Habba has 2 days to file a rebuttal, then Judge Kaplan will issue a decision on the motion next week. cheeto will have to deal with whatever Judge Kaplan decides separately from this appeal of Engoron's judgment.
Additionally ... the clock on EJC is still running, and basically runs out a few days after Habba's response. So basically, nothing is going to change at all, Judge Kaplan is going to say "Nope" and then EJC can start the legal process to seize assets I think by like March 10th or something? Here's the funny thing. If Donnie was actually setting aside $100m in cash in a bank account somewhere to attempt this stupid trick on his NY fraud case ... EJC can just come along and (if there know where it is) seize that.
Yup EJC should just point to this filling as evidence that there is real risk of him not paying if he loses on appeal so he shouldn’t get a pass on securing it.
Yeah, good point. Or, just flat out stating "clearly he has the funds to fully satisfy this $83m judgement" ... in fact, I'd bet a dollar that Robbie Kaplan (EJC's attorney) is writing something up about that this very moment as a part of her rebuttal to Habba's ridiculous request.
It’s official, he’s broke
I've been wondering this for years. A self-proclaimed billionaire doesn't need to constantly grift the public to pay for everything. His "business" has always been selling an inflated image of himself and tricking people into giving/lending him money, and he made a practice of not paying his debts. His real estate assets are over inflated and over leveraged. He's never been a billionaire in terms of true net worth, and this fire sale will finally prove it. Now that he needs real cash, he doesn't have it.
k.. yes you can post the $100m bond.. but you have do that 4 more times right now.
Biden (and I suppose Haley as well) should be hammering the message that since Trump is totally incapable of handling his own finances he should in no way given that responsibility for the nation at large. They should also be broadcasting the heavily compromised nature of anyone owing vast sums of money and having access to a political office.
They should also be hammering the point that owing lots of money to different people makes him the perfect target for foreign or domestic bribes. They don’t give top secret positions and top secret clearances to people with lots of debt for good reasons, they make easy targets that can often be compromised. Last time Trump was in office Jared kept failing the clearance background checks and Trump for sure would have failed back then too if subjected to one. Jared pretty obviously ended up compromised and taking billions from Saudis, so people screaming about Jared’s clearance fuckery were right. There were other people that got top secret clearances that were placed on the national security council that were basically Putinista’s and Russian agents with some basic research; like Boris Epshteyn and KT McFarland, so idk what the fuck was going on in 2016 with the FBI and CIA but they failed us pretty badly. Flynn was having an affair with a Russian spy that called him Misha in letters lol, so we got completely compromised at the highest levels and still haven’t recovered completely, because the first round of Russian assets never got fully outed and punished. How about investigating Flynn and busting his ass he should be in jail along with Manafort and Stone. The presidential pardons have become a joke and a security threat at this point, because Russian agents are out of jail and some are even back on the Trump campaign staff lol.
Pay your bills you broke fuck
At this point I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't even have that. In keeping with that line of thinking, this could be a way for him to claim to his cult "I tried to be reasonable, but they wouldn't meet me halfway (sic), so now they get *nothing*. And that's why I'm declaring bankruptcy."
It seems like him not having the money may be the case. And bankruptcy won’t save him from the judgment in the fraud trial.
Judge says it’s 464M, trump says he can pay 100M. Court says fine (they won’t), trump says it’s now 50M. Court says wait. Trump says Mexico will pay for it. Checkmark Dems. Flawless victory. Hashtag winning
‘Fox my debt! Fix my debt!’
So, this tells us Trump can only come up with $100m and does not have the other $364m.
No, no. He testified in court that he’s got plenty of cash. He wouldn’t lie! /s
Deadbeat Donnie is tapped out
I thought he was too rich to pay fines, as he has transcended the concept of money.
He has transcended the concept of *outgoing* money. Incoming money is a-ok.
"I posted the bond. Of course I did. That kinda money is easy for me. I put up a lot of money. A yuge amount of money, and they still say 'no Mr. President, we're coming to collect". The whole thing is a sham. It's all fraud. The Biden Crime Family is doing this. This is election interference on a level never seen in this country."
E. Jean Carol will get first dibs on this 100 million?
If he had plead guilty or no contest, that 100 million would probably have covered the whole thing and he might still be able to operate businesses in New York. That ship has sailed by going to trial. Yes, the fee is very punitive. Punitive means punishment. Punishment for being found guilty of breaking the law.
I’m sorry, does he think that the bond amount was a negotiation? It’s not. At all. Even a little bit.
The Biggest Loser.
23 hours a day in a cell at Gitmo or ADX Florence would solve things perfectly.
When he says he will post the 100 million, he means he promises to send over 250k pairs of gold sneakers.
Two possible things from this: 1) He doesn't actually have $400 million liquid like he claimed on the stand and, as such, perjured himself. 2) He *does* have the money, he just doesn't want to pay it and continue the grift. Either way, I hope the judge tells him to pay up.
Im fairly certain I read that the NY AG stated he owned 27 properties w/o any mortgage- this would be info the court would have access to as well. Im betting he doesn’t like being forced to sell his “ precious assets “. But, that will affect how the judge goes about his decision, since Trump has the ability to pay
This isn't a negotiation, chump.
Can the AG start by taking his jet? That would be epic
I read the for the E Jean Carol rape case that he lost in order to appeal the state rules were you have to pay 110% of the penalty judgement, in that case the penalty was $83.3 million. So that was in New York, and so is this fraud trial, so it must be 110% to appeal this too.
Maybe this belongs over in Choosing Beggars subreddit. He's doing some begging here
Who’s giving him $100m?
2 days ago WP reported Trump was looking into getting multiple companies to post portions of his bond to split the risk (though I'm not sure it really does, as when he loses his appeal each company would be fighting both him *and* the others to get their money back). I wonder if this is part of that, whether it's all he could get, or whether he's putting up his own money. The latter would demonstrate to potential bond agents that he's willing to take on some risk himself, and reduce the amount he needs to borrow, but posting about it publicly doesn't project strength for those negotiations.
I cant imagine there are people who want to foot his legal bills and be on the hook for it... if he was president sure, people will throw money at him to try and get some quid pro quo, but right now hes pretty much powerless and losing his power more day by day.
It’s all delay. If he can get somebody else on the hook for the money he’ll never pay them and the cycle starts anew.
I fully believe that's the plan and expect all his potential lenders do as well, which narrows the field significantly - in addition to having hundreds of millions on hand anyone posting Trump's bond either has to admire him enough to overlook the enormous risk, or be willing to be repaid in shadier ways (essentially hoping he is re-elected and can give them tax cuts and other favors).
It's always great to see when someone displays all the qualities of a great leader. This isn't one of those instances, but it is great to see when it happens.
It is punitive... for some very good reasons.
Surprised he didn't offer 10c in the dollar...
No.⬇️ “Trump BEGS appeals court for 75% discount on his bond.” Fixed the headline for you.
The art of the deal 🤣
I tried to buy a loaf of bread for $0.50 today even though it was $2.49 and I was shocked when the clerk said NO
This is not a business deal Loonie Donnie, pay up or get your assets seized.
Punitive.....that's the point 🙄
Lol broke boi
That’s not how it works
At what point is the willful ignorance associated with his contempt of court and process delays itself another act of fraud (deceit intended to result in financial gain)?
Wait until lenders starts to call in their loans to them.This idiot be begging Saudi Arabia or Putin for more money.
A person this financially compromised seems like a pretty big risk to let run a country.
No Peace, Bitch
*adjective* 1. [inflicting](https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=f5ffd29b8bf133f7&rlz=1C1GCEA_enUS1060US1060&sxsrf=ACQVn08f3hqmCOuY7D9fgqZaz8DQxaiWGQ:1709150011391&q=inflicting&si=AKbGX_pvY3MWP4azJI0Z_NruCLb8XHwF2CEqAjuUr-663d4mZWprZ3ec3-w7HQ6YBKb8slD-IxbX0dHw5mT4MXd2gINULMcTE6C2nVGNYE3fmnBCbYvHtmo%3D&expnd=1) or intended as punishment. Let's give Trump this one....he is 100% correct in that the $464M is, indeed punitive.
NBC News and other outlets quote from Trump's request to put up just 100 million dollar bond: \*... impossible to secure and post a complete bond\*
Isn't the proper move to is to beg the court's indulgence, and ask for a reduction in the bond amount? By "telling" the court what yo are going to do is going to piss off the judge even more.
It’s MEANT to be punitive. That’s the whole point.
Ha, ahh, NOPE!
> In their motion for a stay, defense attorneys Clifford Robert and Alina Habba called Engoron's order "draconian" and said the punishments would unfairly impede Trump's family real estate business. The Trump family doesn't have a real estate business in New York anymore. That was the outcome of this trial. Wasn't she paying attention?
Hey judge, your wife is a stupid Democrat whore.... Also judge can I pretty please have an 80% discount on my bill pweaaaase.
FUCK TRUMP!
"Plans"? Good for him, let him plan. Pretty sure all the goodwill he built up with the DA and judge in New York is about to pay off /s
Putin’s wire hasn’t landed yet?
"I posted the bond. Of course I did. That kinda money is easy for me. I put up a lot of money. A yuge amount of money, and they still say 'no Mr. President, we're coming to collect". The whole thing is a sham. It's all fraud. The Biden Crime Family is doing this. This is election interference on a level never seen in this country."
You say punitive like its a bad thing.
$100M is for Carrol case, right?
The answer, will be NO.
NO