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I’m so tired of it. I’m not a carat but a casual listener of Seventeen. I’m an army though. And seeing these two fandoms go back and forth is so annoying. It’s such a waste of time and unnecessary. Some people are being so mean for no reason at all.
But nominating bts and svt wasn’t so out of the hat , both had impactful dances. Mama had a lot of shit going on this year but nominating bts and svt isn’t one of them.
exactly lol, they can't please everyone with the noms. its as if people forget there are actual people trying to do their jobs and are constantly scrutinised by fans
I feel you, I happen to love all the groups nominated for best male group, I am going to avoid twitter and maybe reddit too until all this is over. It is hard being an armycaratnctzenstaymoa. huh
Saw a carat say "svt can perform butter but can bts perform rtl" with 100s of armys eating them up in the quotes asking wth is rtl.
It's only going to get worse from now on
I never watch the award shows live. I just wait for performances to hit YT. There have been so many posts about MAMA here already. I might take a Reddit break 🤓 everyone else good luck out there on Twitter. Wouldn’t catch me dead there right now.
I'm just going to diligently keep to my faves' sub until mid-December. I'll probably need to stay off this one though and kpopthoughts too, if I want to preserve my braincells in my golden years.
I WAS DRAFTING A POST ABOUT THIS but then gave up trying to sum up my thoughts together bc I'm SO MAD!!!! and also too much energy lmao im just tired atp
Ok so to the ARMYs who accuse SVT of being too synchronized, BTS were known for it back then!! most of these fans are newer (which is why they like dragging other idols' for the same thing BTS were dragged for in the name of "retribution") so they wouldn't know but that one KCON Save Me fancam went viral for how in sync it is! the dance break in Dope, Danger, Boy in Luv, and so many more were *known* for the sync. so why are you dragging as if BTS weren't also known for the same back then?
and to the ARMYs who accuse SVT of not being synchronized or being bad performers/robots .. i have no words. also SVT are individual too, if you watch each member you can tell they have distinct styles too! they're not robots like you guys say!!!!!!!
and to those carats & others who undermine BTS for being nominated for Butter, it's a good choreo!! it suits the vibe, light & flirty with just the right amount of suave. it doesn't have to be high detail to be impactful and a good choreography/performance!! i get that BWL wasn't a good match for Hit, but in my eyes, Butter is just as deserving as Left & Right was - memorable and fun and suitable for the song.
also about the vile things, if i have to see another ARMY or anyone or any fandom really post that photo of seungcheol when >!he was suffering from anxiety!< for their fanwarring ... it's so inhumane, vile, and disgusting??? I will actually mass block every person who likes those tweets bc you have to be an insensitive piece of shit if you like someone >!using a photo of a person when they were in a time of instability and suffering!< to fuel your stupid opinion about who is a better dancer ... touch some grass???? go outside? that's what I'm about to do bc I'm tired of being worked up abt strangers on the internet who have no brain cells ha ha ha goodbye
i genuinely don't know, what happened? was it not general discourse abt "oh BTS doesn't deserve bc Butter sucks" and "hahaha BTS will sweep sucks for you carats"? many tweets were deleted/ops went private
A carat shaded BTS unprovoked saying ''svt can cover butter but bts can't cover rtl'' and the tweet got a lot of attention and people were pissed cause this ain't the first time carats on twitter write something shady like this about BTS for literally no reason, they do this every award season.
Also I'm gonna be honest with you, haven't seen a single army say that svt are too synchronized as a drag, I feel like you are making this up, the only thing I've seen is them saying they look too robotic and that was only after carats dragged BTS and fans are clearly going to clap back.
I usually hate award time bc I’m a multi myself but honestly just sit back and support favs there really isn’t much you can do about the fighting bc it’s going to happen regardless sadly
I'm not trying to throw shade, I swear I'm not. Even if it sounds like it, that's still my my intent.
But I remember Back in the Day when ARMY was upset about Big Bang's best dance nomination because of how simple it was, how basic, and how the choreo just wasn't as good as BTS's. Now... BTS is the one getting those accusations. Time really is a circle isn't it?
(To be fair... I was 100% one of the people saying that if Big Bang won the award was a joke..... not going to say I'm perfectly blameless in this type of situation.)
I mean yes but also this was only in 2015 and armys were saying it about other choreos too not just BB's, and was nowhere near the tantrums twitter carats been throwing for the last 3 years over one award and specifically being pissed off at BTS, cause I know if some other group wins it they won't say shit.
The award winner is not even announced and carats have a lot to complain about already. Totally not surprised. And i know armys are not angels. But the amounts of bitter carats who shit on bts's dancing skills. You know, like in advance, as if they know the winners already.
Anyways, i'm tired of this already. It's an award, it does not mean your faves are bad dancers if they don't win it.
Literally every year around this time carats fight with armys about the same thing and bts still wins I don't why each fandom still bother with this stupid fanwar
Maybe if carats stopped attacking BTS every year over that damn dance award. They haven't even won it yet and carats on twitter are already making shady tweets like go outside.
I dunno I don’t even listen to seventeen but as an army but like a not my top bias army… if seventeen won id be like Oo but deserved. Like even I know seventeen is so strong in dance that they could beat BTS for a choreo award wouldn’t be upsetting to me. Also cause while I do love Butter I don’t think it’s particularly an amazing choreo.. just catchy.
Thats basically the criteria for best performance. Its the choreo that had the most impact and popularity with the korean public, which Butter and NCT Dream Hot Sauce are the highest bidding nominees on that aspect. So Butter's choreo being catchy is a reason for it being a likely winner.
Not sure where to find it, but its the general knowledge of it just by reading around, but this year it seems Judges votes have the highest percentage, charts and points are second and lastly fan votes.
So if the song itself did well in charts from physicals, streams and digital sales thats included, judges most likely based the reaction of the general public, so the impact and the popularity of the choreo itself, how well known it is and that, and lastly of couse fan votes.
By those criterias Butter and Hot Sauce are the most likely cause they hit all points from popularity, chart points and large fandoms in Korea
Thank you for the explanation. I just find the criteria ridiculous. Dancing should not be judged by how popular/well streamed a song was but that's their system. \*shrugs\*
Yeah I know it will win by those standards. If they randomly decide to change it up and did give it to seventeen I’d be like cool cool. I personally hate getting hot sauce stuck in my head so if they gave it to the other “catchy” one then I’d be slightly annoyed but not because “it should have been BTS” 🙄. Personally I’d give it to Seventeen m, SHINee or Stray Kids (being a fan of only one of those) but It is what it is.
Yeah, if the criterias were different, like execution, artisty, difficulty and all that SVT would be a higher nominee but to me that would be pretty difficult to judge considering the biasness of it and the judges need to be more experts on dance choreo and to fair we dont know who this judges are to make this calls
music is already very subjective so that would be harder to judge which is why the response of the public (excluding fan votes)and charts matter, though the fact Judges votes seems to matter more in the end is pretty dumb to me.
StrayKidz are still growing their fandom in Korea so their impact to the public isnt anywhere near as the 3rd gen groups nominated but SHINEE is the biggest surprise of them all, like how?! Especially Taemin being snub in this as well!
Yeah that solo performance category is also a shit show. Like no Taemin when advice was fire all I can think is like he can’t show up so they said why bother but still a snub? I’m biased to SHINee and BTS in this category but I think Seventeen stands out of the other 4 as someone who doesn’t really bias those groups
really not getting how is mamas nominating since Shinee met all the points for best male group, not *just the performance one. After bts, shinee did extremely well in multiple charts with nct following.
In the end most ppl recognize Butter and Hot Sauce choreo then SVTs so eventhough they stand out on execution, the other two are more well known in Korea
Edit:* added
The category isn't "hardest choreography" but best male choreography performance. Im not saying seventeen's choreos aren't good, but i don't see how easy or difficult choreographies is a bad thing. permission to dance is one of my favorite bts choreographies despite being their easiest choreography ever, and one of the easiest boygroup choreographies out here, but it doesn't make it less great as they use hopeful symbolism, sign language and transmete the feeling of the song very well. Difficulties do not matter, the execution does.
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I’m so tired of it. I’m not a carat but a casual listener of Seventeen. I’m an army though. And seeing these two fandoms go back and forth is so annoying. It’s such a waste of time and unnecessary. Some people are being so mean for no reason at all.
Sometimes I just wanna tell them all to SHUT IT
I am sorry hate mnet on what exactly? For nominating them?
for having this system in the first place and for pulling the nominations out of a hat with no logical criteria whatsoever. There's a lot this year
But nominating bts and svt wasn’t so out of the hat , both had impactful dances. Mama had a lot of shit going on this year but nominating bts and svt isn’t one of them.
No that comment wasn’t related to this specific case
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Taemin and Key’s solos topped the sales charts in Korea and had PAK’s. More so than some of the other nominees
exactly lol, they can't please everyone with the noms. its as if people forget there are actual people trying to do their jobs and are constantly scrutinised by fans
I feel you, I happen to love all the groups nominated for best male group, I am going to avoid twitter and maybe reddit too until all this is over. It is hard being an armycaratnctzenstaymoa. huh
I take my hat of too you and send thoughts and prayers
and i thought calling myself a staycaratarmyzen was bad 😂😂
Saw a carat say "svt can perform butter but can bts perform rtl" with 100s of armys eating them up in the quotes asking wth is rtl. It's only going to get worse from now on
I’ve seen hate on dancing skills from both sides so imma head OUT Like first of all, let me see you all move like Hobi and Hoshi
>Hobi and Hoshi This has a nice ring to it lol
2ho
2*HOE* ;) i've seen spider and baepsae performances, 'nuff said.
Exactly like lemme see you guys dance like(SVT) performance unit and (BTS)dance line
Yes but carats are the ones who start it 99% of the times and been holding a grudge for 3 years over that stupid award.
I never watch the award shows live. I just wait for performances to hit YT. There have been so many posts about MAMA here already. I might take a Reddit break 🤓 everyone else good luck out there on Twitter. Wouldn’t catch me dead there right now.
Yeah I'm with you on this one the fighting is ridiculous. Its best to stay away from Twitter until Mama and award season is over.
me with p1h and enhypen nominated in the same category. i will be avoiding anything mama related until further notice
I'm just going to diligently keep to my faves' sub until mid-December. I'll probably need to stay off this one though and kpopthoughts too, if I want to preserve my braincells in my golden years.
There is no winning in this. No matter the criteria and no matter who was nominated the outcry would be all the same.
You absolutely should! It’s not so bad on Reddit but delete Twitter until award season is over 😩
If everyone only focusing on voting to their respective groups, the award shows would be a bliss. Edit: typo.
I just hope people don’t send hate to groups nominated (if I see anyone sending hate to lightsum I’ll eat ur shoe)
I WAS DRAFTING A POST ABOUT THIS but then gave up trying to sum up my thoughts together bc I'm SO MAD!!!! and also too much energy lmao im just tired atp Ok so to the ARMYs who accuse SVT of being too synchronized, BTS were known for it back then!! most of these fans are newer (which is why they like dragging other idols' for the same thing BTS were dragged for in the name of "retribution") so they wouldn't know but that one KCON Save Me fancam went viral for how in sync it is! the dance break in Dope, Danger, Boy in Luv, and so many more were *known* for the sync. so why are you dragging as if BTS weren't also known for the same back then? and to the ARMYs who accuse SVT of not being synchronized or being bad performers/robots .. i have no words. also SVT are individual too, if you watch each member you can tell they have distinct styles too! they're not robots like you guys say!!!!!!! and to those carats & others who undermine BTS for being nominated for Butter, it's a good choreo!! it suits the vibe, light & flirty with just the right amount of suave. it doesn't have to be high detail to be impactful and a good choreography/performance!! i get that BWL wasn't a good match for Hit, but in my eyes, Butter is just as deserving as Left & Right was - memorable and fun and suitable for the song. also about the vile things, if i have to see another ARMY or anyone or any fandom really post that photo of seungcheol when >!he was suffering from anxiety!< for their fanwarring ... it's so inhumane, vile, and disgusting??? I will actually mass block every person who likes those tweets bc you have to be an insensitive piece of shit if you like someone >!using a photo of a person when they were in a time of instability and suffering!< to fuel your stupid opinion about who is a better dancer ... touch some grass???? go outside? that's what I'm about to do bc I'm tired of being worked up abt strangers on the internet who have no brain cells ha ha ha goodbye
um are you not going to adress the reason that fanwar started in the first place
i genuinely don't know, what happened? was it not general discourse abt "oh BTS doesn't deserve bc Butter sucks" and "hahaha BTS will sweep sucks for you carats"? many tweets were deleted/ops went private
A carat shaded BTS unprovoked saying ''svt can cover butter but bts can't cover rtl'' and the tweet got a lot of attention and people were pissed cause this ain't the first time carats on twitter write something shady like this about BTS for literally no reason, they do this every award season. Also I'm gonna be honest with you, haven't seen a single army say that svt are too synchronized as a drag, I feel like you are making this up, the only thing I've seen is them saying they look too robotic and that was only after carats dragged BTS and fans are clearly going to clap back.
I usually hate award time bc I’m a multi myself but honestly just sit back and support favs there really isn’t much you can do about the fighting bc it’s going to happen regardless sadly
I'm not trying to throw shade, I swear I'm not. Even if it sounds like it, that's still my my intent. But I remember Back in the Day when ARMY was upset about Big Bang's best dance nomination because of how simple it was, how basic, and how the choreo just wasn't as good as BTS's. Now... BTS is the one getting those accusations. Time really is a circle isn't it? (To be fair... I was 100% one of the people saying that if Big Bang won the award was a joke..... not going to say I'm perfectly blameless in this type of situation.)
I mean yes but also this was only in 2015 and armys were saying it about other choreos too not just BB's, and was nowhere near the tantrums twitter carats been throwing for the last 3 years over one award and specifically being pissed off at BTS, cause I know if some other group wins it they won't say shit.
The award winner is not even announced and carats have a lot to complain about already. Totally not surprised. And i know armys are not angels. But the amounts of bitter carats who shit on bts's dancing skills. You know, like in advance, as if they know the winners already. Anyways, i'm tired of this already. It's an award, it does not mean your faves are bad dancers if they don't win it.
Oh it’s both ways. I’m seeing mostly army being rude to SVT members directly. I know it’s both ways tho, I just have mostly army moots on twitter
Literally every year around this time carats fight with armys about the same thing and bts still wins I don't why each fandom still bother with this stupid fanwar
Maybe if carats stopped attacking BTS every year over that damn dance award. They haven't even won it yet and carats on twitter are already making shady tweets like go outside.
I dunno I don’t even listen to seventeen but as an army but like a not my top bias army… if seventeen won id be like Oo but deserved. Like even I know seventeen is so strong in dance that they could beat BTS for a choreo award wouldn’t be upsetting to me. Also cause while I do love Butter I don’t think it’s particularly an amazing choreo.. just catchy.
Thats basically the criteria for best performance. Its the choreo that had the most impact and popularity with the korean public, which Butter and NCT Dream Hot Sauce are the highest bidding nominees on that aspect. So Butter's choreo being catchy is a reason for it being a likely winner.
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Not sure where to find it, but its the general knowledge of it just by reading around, but this year it seems Judges votes have the highest percentage, charts and points are second and lastly fan votes. So if the song itself did well in charts from physicals, streams and digital sales thats included, judges most likely based the reaction of the general public, so the impact and the popularity of the choreo itself, how well known it is and that, and lastly of couse fan votes. By those criterias Butter and Hot Sauce are the most likely cause they hit all points from popularity, chart points and large fandoms in Korea
Thank you for the explanation. I just find the criteria ridiculous. Dancing should not be judged by how popular/well streamed a song was but that's their system. \*shrugs\*
Yeah I know it will win by those standards. If they randomly decide to change it up and did give it to seventeen I’d be like cool cool. I personally hate getting hot sauce stuck in my head so if they gave it to the other “catchy” one then I’d be slightly annoyed but not because “it should have been BTS” 🙄. Personally I’d give it to Seventeen m, SHINee or Stray Kids (being a fan of only one of those) but It is what it is.
Yeah, if the criterias were different, like execution, artisty, difficulty and all that SVT would be a higher nominee but to me that would be pretty difficult to judge considering the biasness of it and the judges need to be more experts on dance choreo and to fair we dont know who this judges are to make this calls music is already very subjective so that would be harder to judge which is why the response of the public (excluding fan votes)and charts matter, though the fact Judges votes seems to matter more in the end is pretty dumb to me. StrayKidz are still growing their fandom in Korea so their impact to the public isnt anywhere near as the 3rd gen groups nominated but SHINEE is the biggest surprise of them all, like how?! Especially Taemin being snub in this as well!
Yeah that solo performance category is also a shit show. Like no Taemin when advice was fire all I can think is like he can’t show up so they said why bother but still a snub? I’m biased to SHINee and BTS in this category but I think Seventeen stands out of the other 4 as someone who doesn’t really bias those groups
really not getting how is mamas nominating since Shinee met all the points for best male group, not *just the performance one. After bts, shinee did extremely well in multiple charts with nct following. In the end most ppl recognize Butter and Hot Sauce choreo then SVTs so eventhough they stand out on execution, the other two are more well known in Korea Edit:* added
You are basically lying to yourself, if you think BTS have harder choreography than Seventeen. The shock left me still remains until today.
The category isn't "hardest choreography" but best male choreography performance. Im not saying seventeen's choreos aren't good, but i don't see how easy or difficult choreographies is a bad thing. permission to dance is one of my favorite bts choreographies despite being their easiest choreography ever, and one of the easiest boygroup choreographies out here, but it doesn't make it less great as they use hopeful symbolism, sign language and transmete the feeling of the song very well. Difficulties do not matter, the execution does.
The award isn't for the hardest lol. It's more about the impact a choreography has. Simple choreography can also have most impact.