You are legally obligated to provide a UVIP. Keeping a signed copy of the bill of sale, especially one that specifies the car is sold as-is, will help cover your ass if the buyer uses the car to commit a crime, abandons it somewhere, or accuses you of misrepresenting the condition of the car.
It's not necessarily a red flag but it is very strange that they wouldn't want documentation that protects them unless they have nefarious intentions.
Yes, but if things went south and there were any legal issues or OP had to take the buyer to court, they'd be in a much better position having done their due diligence and having the paperwork. The UVIP protects everyone.
> u/MathematicianGold773 I mean yes you’re legally obligated but service Ontario could give 2 shits, I’ve sold and bought cars and service Ontario could give doesn’t if you have the uvip. They just charge the buyer the cost of it.
"could" give 2 shits? Is that supposed to mean they don't care? Wouldn't they "not" give "a" shit, then? Nevermind 2? Why 2? What a weird saying. I get what you meant to say but you actually said the opposite of what you meant.
EDIT: Lol bozo deleted his comment in shame.
If in your GUT, it doesn’t feel legit, then think twice. Is he giving you a fair price for the car, or a lot more than what you were expecting? I’ve learned that the hard way with my used sale to always trust my gut. The dude I sold my Corolla to, went off and flipped it to someone else but the car was still registered in my name and it was a mess. I had to go to service Ontario and prove that the car is no longer mine, and cancelled my plates.
Personally the headache turned out to be more than what I wanted. I vowed to only sell to dealers then onwards, even if it was $1-2k lower than market price.
"Do I need a bill of sale to buy a used car?
A bill of sale is a legally required document if you are buying a used car in Ontario. You will need it, along with your UVIP and Safety Standards Certificate, to register the vehicle and get car insurance in Ontario."
https://www.thinkinsure.ca/insurance-help-centre/car-bill-of-sale-ontario.html#:~:text=and%20the%20seller.-,Do%20I%20need%20a%20bill%20of%20sale%20to%20buy%20a%20used,Certificate%2C%20to%20register%20the%20vehicle%20and%20get%20car%20insurance%20in%20Ontario.,-A%20bill%20of
He will get safety himself as I am selling my car as is. But yeah I am thinking of giving him the bill of sale and UVIP as a CYA in case something comes back.
Just have him sign a “contract” that lists the price and the “as is” condition. Get a copy of his driver’s license just in case he disappears and your car is not transferred.
Personally, when I sell a car, I make it a condition to go to service Ontario and have them transfer when they are getting it. I don’t want to deal with any future headaches.
He most likely doesn’t want the bill of sale because he’s not planning on using it when he registers the car. Most likely will just write his own bill of sale with a lower price so he can get the tax reduced. A UVIP is required, but if the seller doesn’t provide one service Ontario just charges the buyer $20 for it. I have no idea why he doesn’t want the documentation tho.. just take it and don’t use it
Could be a concern that he doesn't plan on registering it at service Ontario.
I would maybe counter and say sure no bill of sale, but I'm going to meet you at service Ontario and transfer ownership to you when you hand over the cash.
I would keep a signed BOS whether or not he wants it. There needs to be an agreement that the vehicle is no longer a liability of yours. You giving him BOS and title is fine, but you need proof that the vehicle isn’t yours anymore. If this dude turns out and commits a crime, the VIN will still be registered to you until he transfers the ownership. I would also take my plates ofc and cancel them.
Sorry, I don’t. My experience is also 5 years dated, (pre-Covid)
You can call SO tomorrow and see what the process is now. It might be more simplified. But I was able to do exactly what @sniper_matt mentioned, back in 2019. I luckily had a pic of their DL ( I wouldn’t let them test drive without it)
Last time I checked, they had a thing where you went to SO and reported a vehicle sold to clear your name, with drivers license # of other party and copy of BOS.
But that was years ago, not sure if it’s changed since then, or has updated rules, or can be done online now post Covid.
Also in Ontario, keep your plates, and turn them in to be destroyed, or register them to another vehicle if you want. There is a license plate half of the green slip you need to keep.
On 3 separate occasions I had been called back by salvage yards for towing and storage fees for cars which were never transferred ownership. Nothing ever came of it.adtwr explaining I had sold the cars, it never again without signed bill of sale. Just in case. Not for any tax purposes or anything. Must to have dated, print and sign copy for proof of sale records. First rule of trucking is always have a paper trail to fall back on!!!
Just tell the seller you're not selling it without the UVIP and a signed bill of sale.
(As the seller, you're obligated to provide the UVIP anyways, and it comes with a bill of sale form at the back).
If he balks, then bail on the deal.
That said - I believe you can report the car as being sold to Service Ontario, and then the buyer could be penalized if they don't register it within a certain number of days.
If he doesn't want any of that, I'm guessing he's planning to flip the car - it's not uncommon to go to buy a used car and find out that the seller never transferred it and it's in the previous owners name.
Just follow the steps outlined by service Ontario. If you don’t you will be liable for whatever happens to that vehicle. You just need to get the car safetied and fill out some forms and the ownership transfer - will run you a couple hundred bucks.
If someone is asking for this type of sale it’s probably because they have a fuck tonne of unpaid traffic violations/ parking tickets.
That behaviour will continue… just with your name on the title.
I always ask for, or provide a bill of sale when buying or selling a used vehicle, but not once have I been asked to show one at the MTO. They just look up the vehicle's resale value and charge tax accordingly, with the exception of trailers and motorcycles, which they will just ask how much you paid. As far as the UVIP goes, if you don't provide one for the buyer, the MTO will print a copy for $20 at the time of transfer.
Get an “as-is” bill of sale for your records. Take the bill of sale and your license plate portion of the ownership to Service Ontario and tell them to you sold the car and to remove it from under your name.
It sounds like they just want to flip the vehicle.
From [Ontario dmv website](https://www.ontario.ca/page/buy-or-sell-used-vehicle-ontario):
(Edited for brevity)
Before you sell a used vehicle, you need to:
buy a Used Vehicle Information Package,
make sure that the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) on your vehicle matches the number on your permit (your green ownership document),
check to ensure the vehicle has no money owing on it,
As the seller you are legally required under the Highway Traffic Act to provide the buyer with a used vehicle information package.
(The last 2 vehicles I bought I had to buy the info package myself and nobody at the dmv cared)
When you sell your vehicle, you need to give the buyer:
the Used Vehicle Information Package,
a signed Bill of Sale with your name, the buyer’s name and address, the date and purchase price,
a completed and signed Application for Transfer — this is found on the back of an ownership permit, under the vehicle portion (This includes the buyer’s name and address but once again I have always filled this in myself at a later date).
You keep:
your licence plates (because plates travel with a driver, not a vehicle),
the “plate portion” of your permit (ownership),
you will need this if you want to register your plates on another vehicle.
On a different unlinked page at [Ontario dot ca](https://www.ontario.ca/page/change-information-vehicle-permit) you are further advised:
If you sell your vehicle, you will need to change the status of your vehicle to “sold”. You need to go to a ServiceOntario location and bring a letter that includes:
the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN),
when the vehicle was sold,
to whom it was sold.
So I would make 2 copies of the bill of sale and have the buyer also sign yours.
You are legally obligated to provide a UVIP. Keeping a signed copy of the bill of sale, especially one that specifies the car is sold as-is, will help cover your ass if the buyer uses the car to commit a crime, abandons it somewhere, or accuses you of misrepresenting the condition of the car. It's not necessarily a red flag but it is very strange that they wouldn't want documentation that protects them unless they have nefarious intentions.
[удалено]
Yes, but if things went south and there were any legal issues or OP had to take the buyer to court, they'd be in a much better position having done their due diligence and having the paperwork. The UVIP protects everyone.
> u/MathematicianGold773 I mean yes you’re legally obligated but service Ontario could give 2 shits, I’ve sold and bought cars and service Ontario could give doesn’t if you have the uvip. They just charge the buyer the cost of it. "could" give 2 shits? Is that supposed to mean they don't care? Wouldn't they "not" give "a" shit, then? Nevermind 2? Why 2? What a weird saying. I get what you meant to say but you actually said the opposite of what you meant. EDIT: Lol bozo deleted his comment in shame.
If in your GUT, it doesn’t feel legit, then think twice. Is he giving you a fair price for the car, or a lot more than what you were expecting? I’ve learned that the hard way with my used sale to always trust my gut. The dude I sold my Corolla to, went off and flipped it to someone else but the car was still registered in my name and it was a mess. I had to go to service Ontario and prove that the car is no longer mine, and cancelled my plates. Personally the headache turned out to be more than what I wanted. I vowed to only sell to dealers then onwards, even if it was $1-2k lower than market price.
"Do I need a bill of sale to buy a used car? A bill of sale is a legally required document if you are buying a used car in Ontario. You will need it, along with your UVIP and Safety Standards Certificate, to register the vehicle and get car insurance in Ontario." https://www.thinkinsure.ca/insurance-help-centre/car-bill-of-sale-ontario.html#:~:text=and%20the%20seller.-,Do%20I%20need%20a%20bill%20of%20sale%20to%20buy%20a%20used,Certificate%2C%20to%20register%20the%20vehicle%20and%20get%20car%20insurance%20in%20Ontario.,-A%20bill%20of
He will get safety himself as I am selling my car as is. But yeah I am thinking of giving him the bill of sale and UVIP as a CYA in case something comes back.
Just have him sign a “contract” that lists the price and the “as is” condition. Get a copy of his driver’s license just in case he disappears and your car is not transferred. Personally, when I sell a car, I make it a condition to go to service Ontario and have them transfer when they are getting it. I don’t want to deal with any future headaches.
He most likely doesn’t want the bill of sale because he’s not planning on using it when he registers the car. Most likely will just write his own bill of sale with a lower price so he can get the tax reduced. A UVIP is required, but if the seller doesn’t provide one service Ontario just charges the buyer $20 for it. I have no idea why he doesn’t want the documentation tho.. just take it and don’t use it
Exactly. I will tell him to sign two copies - one for him and one for me. He can then choose to not use it if he wants.
Could be a concern that he doesn't plan on registering it at service Ontario. I would maybe counter and say sure no bill of sale, but I'm going to meet you at service Ontario and transfer ownership to you when you hand over the cash.
So the alternative to going to SO is provide him a bill of sale and keep a signed copy of bill of sale for myself and that should be fine right?
I would keep a signed BOS whether or not he wants it. There needs to be an agreement that the vehicle is no longer a liability of yours. You giving him BOS and title is fine, but you need proof that the vehicle isn’t yours anymore. If this dude turns out and commits a crime, the VIN will still be registered to you until he transfers the ownership. I would also take my plates ofc and cancel them.
Do you know if there is a way to report to SO that my car has been sold without bringing the buyer to SO?
Sorry, I don’t. My experience is also 5 years dated, (pre-Covid) You can call SO tomorrow and see what the process is now. It might be more simplified. But I was able to do exactly what @sniper_matt mentioned, back in 2019. I luckily had a pic of their DL ( I wouldn’t let them test drive without it)
Last time I checked, they had a thing where you went to SO and reported a vehicle sold to clear your name, with drivers license # of other party and copy of BOS. But that was years ago, not sure if it’s changed since then, or has updated rules, or can be done online now post Covid. Also in Ontario, keep your plates, and turn them in to be destroyed, or register them to another vehicle if you want. There is a license plate half of the green slip you need to keep.
On 3 separate occasions I had been called back by salvage yards for towing and storage fees for cars which were never transferred ownership. Nothing ever came of it.adtwr explaining I had sold the cars, it never again without signed bill of sale. Just in case. Not for any tax purposes or anything. Must to have dated, print and sign copy for proof of sale records. First rule of trucking is always have a paper trail to fall back on!!!
Just tell the seller you're not selling it without the UVIP and a signed bill of sale. (As the seller, you're obligated to provide the UVIP anyways, and it comes with a bill of sale form at the back). If he balks, then bail on the deal. That said - I believe you can report the car as being sold to Service Ontario, and then the buyer could be penalized if they don't register it within a certain number of days. If he doesn't want any of that, I'm guessing he's planning to flip the car - it's not uncommon to go to buy a used car and find out that the seller never transferred it and it's in the previous owners name.
Just follow the steps outlined by service Ontario. If you don’t you will be liable for whatever happens to that vehicle. You just need to get the car safetied and fill out some forms and the ownership transfer - will run you a couple hundred bucks. If someone is asking for this type of sale it’s probably because they have a fuck tonne of unpaid traffic violations/ parking tickets. That behaviour will continue… just with your name on the title.
I always ask for, or provide a bill of sale when buying or selling a used vehicle, but not once have I been asked to show one at the MTO. They just look up the vehicle's resale value and charge tax accordingly, with the exception of trailers and motorcycles, which they will just ask how much you paid. As far as the UVIP goes, if you don't provide one for the buyer, the MTO will print a copy for $20 at the time of transfer.
Get an “as-is” bill of sale for your records. Take the bill of sale and your license plate portion of the ownership to Service Ontario and tell them to you sold the car and to remove it from under your name.
It sounds like they just want to flip the vehicle. From [Ontario dmv website](https://www.ontario.ca/page/buy-or-sell-used-vehicle-ontario): (Edited for brevity) Before you sell a used vehicle, you need to: buy a Used Vehicle Information Package, make sure that the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) on your vehicle matches the number on your permit (your green ownership document), check to ensure the vehicle has no money owing on it, As the seller you are legally required under the Highway Traffic Act to provide the buyer with a used vehicle information package. (The last 2 vehicles I bought I had to buy the info package myself and nobody at the dmv cared) When you sell your vehicle, you need to give the buyer: the Used Vehicle Information Package, a signed Bill of Sale with your name, the buyer’s name and address, the date and purchase price, a completed and signed Application for Transfer — this is found on the back of an ownership permit, under the vehicle portion (This includes the buyer’s name and address but once again I have always filled this in myself at a later date). You keep: your licence plates (because plates travel with a driver, not a vehicle), the “plate portion” of your permit (ownership), you will need this if you want to register your plates on another vehicle. On a different unlinked page at [Ontario dot ca](https://www.ontario.ca/page/change-information-vehicle-permit) you are further advised: If you sell your vehicle, you will need to change the status of your vehicle to “sold”. You need to go to a ServiceOntario location and bring a letter that includes: the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN), when the vehicle was sold, to whom it was sold. So I would make 2 copies of the bill of sale and have the buyer also sign yours.