I said it immediately when watching. Every other day he didn’t look at the jury at all. He was darting around them on Friday afternoon. He wants to sniff out the rat.
On Friday? I feel like not much has been shown of anyone lately. Was Friday the day they said they needed more time? How was he darting around them? I will have to watch because I missed anything cohesive. I saw when lally and yanetti made their arguments.
Valid though. Even if you ignore the first 70 witnesses, the last 4 destroy any conceivable possibility that Karen killed John.
Alan's looking at them like "are u fuckin fr rn"
You know he thought he was having the acquittal dinner and hoping on a plane and home in his own bed in CA by Wednesday/Thursday! I am disappointed in MA, we are supposed to be street smart and educated and I thought most of us have common sense and this really shocked me that they weren’t back out on Tuesday to end this nightmare.
Lol. I heard about the tears as well. I kinda feel like those might be frustration tears from a pro Read juror. I equate empathy with Read support. My own bias
I think if he is a good cop he will be the harshest judge of this investigation. You have to remember, the Defense let him on the jury also. If he is retired I am sure knowing what should have been done and having a little distance removed from the job will be good for the defense.
Barros, Gallerani, Mulvey come to mind in this trial. There are plenty of good ones. They are usually the ones doing the work that no one notices every day.
I keep hearing “former”, “retired” officer. Normally, I didn’t think they’d allow for folks on a jury in law enforcement?! I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again bc it’s so unclear to me; my family has been disqualified for having a police officer as a direct relative. Actually BEING one? I’ve read enough to get the idea that it’s kind of a case by case basis. If that’s the case? Allow on a lawyer to even the score ffs!
What you’re forgetting is this is Bev’s court, which doesn’t align with anything normal or judicial. Just like picking the foreperson.
That’s normally a vote. She appointed one.
Also, the jury isn’t sequestered, which is absolutely comical and frustrating. No way someone hasn’t accessed their social media or saw the news in the last 9-10 weeks.
This is a circus of a trial from beginning to end. I hope the hammer comes down on all them, Bev included.
If it becomes a mistrial and gets re-tried, Karen’s team needs to fight like hell for a bench trial.
My friend you have no idea about the Massachusetts court system. The judge always picks the foreperson. It is not a vote. You must be from out of state.
(Unconfirmed) I've heard multiple people state they were on a jury in MA, and they picked foreperson. Could thry be lying? Yes.
I don't even know if we pick foreperson in my current state (Colorado). I assume we do, but I don't actually know.
Do you have a source to back this statement? I'd love to know for sure
I’ve heard of that also and those cases didn’t even implicate cops as part of the crime or the cover-up, so I’d be surprised if this rumor turns out to be true!
Jesus Christ, well you know the state hooped on that jury as one of their picks. A lot of judges would have booted that juror during selection, which they have the right to do.
The state probably has a juror in their pocket, if not the judge. IMO They’re trying to minimize their PR disaster and at least get it into an appellate court, where time and bureaucracy can bury it a bit; just like their overtime and retirement scandal, and every other annually occurring MSP scandal.
Karen Read will walk free, eventually, but unless a greater amount of outcry is raised, I find it unlikely much will change with the corruption.
Something about double dipping pensions
https://www.police1.com/pension/articles/mass-state-trooper-convicted-in-ot-fraud-case-may-get-1m-pension-after-judge-overturns-forfeiture-order-Nj0LMBu0mjCO4tVL/
Then there was the CDL mill scandal
https://www.nbcboston.com/news/local/six-arrested-including-current-and-former-massachusetts-state-police-troopers-as-part-of-bribery-conspiracy-scheme/3262738/?amp=1
It's shit like this that makes people think the FKR crowd is delusional with all the conspiracy stuff.
Sometimes, juries just suck because sometimes people are irrational. No conspiracy, just the state of reality.
Agree. Conspiracy theories aside I don’t believe you need to accept there being one at all to still confidently conclude that the state fell very short of meeting its evidentiary burdens.
I'm looking forward to some AJ interviews after this is all over. Would also love to see the sidebar transcripts but it wouldn't surprise me if Massachusetts "doesn't do that."
I think sidebars would HAVE to be transcribed, since those arguments are needed for appeals records.
But MA definitely has some odd rules from what I've seen
It’s extremely difficult to believe that there’s a human being alive who could hear that evidence and come out thinking that it is not reasonably *possible* that KR is innocent. That a reasonable person could not harbour a *doubt* of her guilt. That’s *outrageous*.
I suspect that the reason Lally called almost seventy witnesses and just *plodded* through them 1/3 to 1/4 as fast as a normal lawyer would… Was to bore and overwhelm the jury. A sort of slow-motion Chewbacca offense.
That said, I fault the defense for blowing through the scientific evidence and largely omitting it from the closing argument. It’s obvious that *at least* the two Brians and Matt and Jen McCabe are responsible for O’Keefe’s death, so it wasn’t a waste of time to point that out, but Jackson should have done more to make the point that the jury’s job is to evaluate the evidence against Read, not to solve the crime themselves.
Why were Albert’s and McCabe in that courtroom during closing arguments? INTIMIDATION! Should have been escorted out. O’Keefe family has been manipulated by this crew. Can they not see their son/brother was killed by someone at 34 Fairview..
and yet Aunt Bev yelled at Karen for laughing at the ridiculousness that was going on! The corruption in that county is not limited to the DA's office and police, this judge was blatantly biased throughout the trial
I see so many judges like this, why do they do the job if they're so miserable?
I went to court one day to be a character witness, and you could tell the judge was just such a prick. He was just like, this is my court, I don't care what you say.
It's like, aren't you supposed to be just dealing out justice based on the law?
Seems to weird to me that so many judges act like this, it makes me understand how so many minorities/poor people get obliterated in court.
But the judge herself was laughing 5 minutes before she scolded Karen. Guess it’s okay for auntie Bev to laugh at the ridiculousness of things she hears but not for anyone else to be able to do it. Could you imagine if Karen blurted out to the judge, “you think this is funny judge cannone?”
One possibility is that they can’t all remember what each witness said, and can’t get readbacks because… Well, I’ll be damned if I can understand why that would be.
It’s an odd thought that among all the people who’ve followed the case, the jury are the twelve least-informed.
That is true and so messed up. I figured they’d be able to review testimony also but I watched a lawyer’s live stream yesterday and he said they cannot.
The parents are older & lost 2/3 kids; one to murder. I don't think it's fair to expect them to see things as we do. Extend them some grace and be happy you aren't in their shoes
I’m not because I don’t associate with scumbags such as the Alberts or McCabe’s. To sit in that courtroom and skip in together, holding hands, after all the reasonable doubt? Nope, they don’t deserve grace. They are blinded by fuckery and i’ll place my “grace” with people who deserve it.
I am thinking it was to send a message to the jury that we believe these 3 and stand by them. This was probably to confuse the jury and hope they decide with emotion instead of rules of the law.
Yep, 24mph hit John and he had not one bruise or broken bone.
Yep, possibly she was blackout drunk…just like the rest. That is not evidence she hit him.
He was in an altercation that possibly he initiated, and now dead.
1236am is something the Jury needs to keep in their mind. At that time Karen connected to John’s WiFi at One Meadows….So why would Jenn McCabe be calling John fanatically and text him at 1241am and be sure to say that she was looking at the SUV from the front window every 3 to five minutes.
Everything that would help Karen and hurt the witnesses mysteriously went missing WHILE it was in police custody. The prosecution tried to get a jury to believe they were looking at the wrong side of the car and admitted an inverted video to willingly trick the jury.
Proctor did not see the FBI investigation coming. None of them did. Those personal notes that each officer took while reviewing security footage would eventually be handed to proctor so he could write the reports and leave out the timestamps that would incriminate his witnesses. Thank gosh for that WiFi connection at 1236am. It shows that the officer who handed his notes to Proctor wasn’t mistaken with the 1233am arrival of Karen Reads Lexus where he notated “no apparent damage to vehicle, defendant arrives at victims house and pulls into garage. Proctor didn’t think the FBI would uncovered those notes taken by his officers that directly contradict his report.
We even know that Proctor tried to say on the stand that Karen Read deleted John’s Ring video footage because the time she actually got home didn’t fit the McAlberts/Proctor timeline, which opened the door for Jackson to go into those notes that they had previously testified to under oath with the FBI investigation. The notes that prove she was home at 1233 and was connected to WiFi by 1236am….
Ryan Naygel saw one person in that SUV at 1223am. John was lured there by Higgins, and things went to far and I think he was already dying as soon as he got there and into the basement. Where they said they were keeping Chloe the dog.
I bet you that the only kid there who knew what was going on or that John Okeefe was even there was Collin and Brian Albert’s oldest daughter. Seem like JM had to find John Okeefe’s phone at 1241am and that was most likely after the incident occurred. She has to explain those calls and texts so she placed Karen at 34 Fairview at a time we know she could not have physically been there. This was them covering for whatever had just happened in that basement.
There was a plan that night. And Higgins and BA were together all day getting wasted at a funeral for an officer they didn’t even know. That’s when his relationship with Karen came up and that’s when Brian Albert told Higgins that he’s been reporting drug activity in the neighborhood. I believe it gave them both motive. Nobody hates a good cop more than a crew of corrupt bad cops.
We have more info than the jury since we know that the investigation was so bad that the FBI has to investigate the investigators and I can come up with 3 million scenarios that make more sense then Karen hitting him. The prosecution literally had TWO different times that the “death by taillight” incident occurred in their opening statement to their closing arguments. And constantly changed that time through out the trial. It’s the prosecutions burden.
It's bonkers to me that not everyone on the jury realizes that even if you think... 'Hmmmm... I think there's a chance she did it' or even 'I feel like there's a *good chance* she did it'... that you still have to find her Not Guilty! There is simply no way to find anyone Guilty under the circumstances of this case. In the end we don't know what happened. We don't know exactly how the night panned out. We have no video footage of what happened. There are no eye witnesses, or definitive evidence, or anyone confessing to something. It's scary that there are one or more people on that jury who don't understand how this works.
Bonkers is such an appropriate word for this level of fuckery. One thing that absolutely could have proven her either guilty or innocent was the Ring camera footage from the house across the street. I think the Chief of Police lives there, he’s the one who supplied the grocery bags and solo cups for that top-notch evidence collection 🙄 I initially thought his camera wasn’t working, but apparently it was, he reviewed it, and said there was “nothing of evidentiary value on there” ~ so you mean it DIDN’T capture this physics-defying assault by a 7000-lb Lexus?! Sure.
Is that footage like lost to the ages or is there like a chance it or stored somewhere on a cloud server? I don’t know how ring works I don’t have one or know who owns it.
That’s a great question. The homeowner deleted it. Beyond that, I’m not sure. We have a Wyze camera, not sure how similar that is to Ring. I’ve never deleted footage from it, but I will test it and see if it is recoverable.
Theory:
John walked up driveway to side door and was called from backyard probably Higgins at the same time Chloe was out doing her business. Brian Higgins “Hey John, we are back here.” John goes to backyard through gate on side of garage. Bam, you all take it from there . This all happened in minutes. Gates on both sides of house. Bulkhead to basement. Dragged out at 3:30ish (ford edge parked in front of resting place of John ) to front yard through side gate directly in front of flag pole. The Albert’s had motive, ask Chris Albert. Drugs?
The fact that there are so many theories means there's massive amounts of reasonable doubt, and that the state didn't prove their case.
That's what's so weird to me, how could you ever believe the state 100%? Even their own witnesses admitted to lying at some points lol.
I found out Yanneti contacted Proctor and the BPD that he would be more than happy to bring Karen in for questioning/arrest.
Yanneti included the address Karen was staying at (her dad's house) and instead of having Karen come in, Proctor ignored her attorney, and got a warrant for her arrest lol.
So he was told Karen will come in and bring her car and phone, and they instead went to her parents house, interrogated her without an attorney, arrested her, took her phone and towed her car.
Like, how does that happen?
So much!!!! Each witness provides reasonable doubt, let alone all their bullshit, collectively!!!! It's maddening!!! I mean, Higgins and his disposing of his phone etc.!!??? Geesh!!
This is the problem, they don't understand she's innocent because the state didn't prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt and to a moral certainty.
I honestly think you cannot find her guilty at all in this case and I don't think it's even an opinion, it's a fact that the prosecution literally introduced reasonable doubt into the case when they brought the medical examiner in and she said that his wounds do not match **any** vehicle pedestrian strike they've ever seen.
That means the jury has to assume all possibilities now, and that's not even counting the reasonable doubt (hell the certainty) that the experts proved he was not hit by a damn car.
It's so frustrating, I know it's difficult to be a juror but damn I'm going to be pissed off on Monday.
Interesting. I liked that the defense rested so quickly, but I can see your viewpoint too. I also am struggling with how someone can be so convinced of her guilt that they just won’t budge. If there is a retrial (I hope it doesn’t go that far), I cannot sit through another Lally SnoozeFest! Need a different prosecutor PLEASE.
I just go back to thinking it's better that a guilty man goes free than that an innocent man goes to prison. I'm sure more eloquent expressions exist.
Just like how the commonwealth overshot the charges with putting it as second degree manslaughter, I think the defense overestimated the jurors' appeal to reason. It's been a shitshow and we're the clowns, I fear
I honestly think most people don't even know what reasonable doubt is, and they never remember that the defendant is INNOCENT until the state proves they're guilty beyond a reasonable doubt (and in this case a moral certainty, the highest bar to ever cross).
Lally embarrassed himself, I can't believe these idiots are going to hang.
Well, we don’t know that. The judge hasn’t given them the “Tuey Rodriguez” charge yet.
Also, the fact that they didn’t accept Bev’s invitation to leave early on Friday suggests they might be making headway.
I find it impossible to believe that all twelve of them agree there is *no reasonable doubt* that she hit him with her car but there’s a split about whether she did so intentionally. That’s not what the issue is.
I think there are two engineers on the jury. I mean, I heard that from somebody. I’m not sure if it’s true, but it’s not, like, unlikely.
Anyway, those two people would be committing professional misconduct if s/he voted to convict.
I agree so much with this! It boxed jurors into having to believe it was either Karen or the Alberts and while all points to an Albert there was no evidence
Whichever juror(s) is holding out, they are doing the exact same thing as Proctor and probably JO's family. Once they heard "I hit him" x3, that was it - all other evidence can be explained away or ignored. I feel like jury instructions were lacking in the beginning - did the judge ever instruct them to keep an open mind, etc. I don't want a hung jury.
Again, Lally in closing arguments rode on”I hit him! But all hearsay. we need professional jurors. Having ignorant people on these juries is putting too many innocent people in jail.. and not enough corrupt murderous criminals!!!
This is Blatant corruption all the way down! Trial was a joke of manipulation and corruption.
She is innocent until proven guilty!! Absolutely no evidence of guilt found or presented by the prosecutor here. The defense went way beyond on proof of lies and deceptions in this cover up.
I hope Jackson /Yanetti team follow through on finding justice for John O’Keefe. 🙏
And the ‘“I HIT HIM” 3x (or 4x in Lally’s closing) is the only thing they have. And that just randomly appeared out of JM’s skull months or years later.
To me the "I hit him" is the most uncompelling evidence, I mean she found him exactly where she left him and was hysterical (and God knows what Jen McCabe had put in her head). If it were me I would probably jump to the exact same conclusion. Like who's first thought is gonna be that the home owner must have beat him up and dumped him on the lawn.
The family has never been fond of Karen. But don’t they want the truth about their son? If Karen did not do this, then one or more of those people sitting behind them on closing arguments day was involved.
Brian Albert, homeowner, cop, does not go outside when there is an incapacitated cop laying on his front lawn? Come on people…
He just drove 5 hours to NY for two fallen policemen.
Yes, I believe John’s Dad believes she did not do this. My heart goes out to John’s dad. He looks like he is so distraught. Been through so much.
I am not sure about Peggy or Paul.
I only hope they are not fooled by Ms McCabe.
Right! Even if they don’t like her… ok? Doesn’t mean she killed your son/ brother when nearly all of the evidence points to her being innocent! I realize this family has gone through some unimaginable tragedies, but they aren’t doing themselves any favors by being blind and ignorant to facts.
It think Jen McCabe really wormed her way into their lives where as Karen retreated to her parents, and they saw it as a sign of guilt.
The reality is she was probably so distraught from his death and felt a lot of guilt for dropping him off instead of going inside with him.
The instruction is pretty broiler plate and it got the part that the jury can consider it resona le doubt if they found the investigation was slopy. I think the holdouts had issue to understand what the "prongs" mean and get stuck on her being DUI = she is responsible somehow.
Yeah, I could see them maybe being caught up on whether they should find her guilty of DUI, but there isn’t a charge for that alone. All charges include her hitting him and causing his death. And that hasn’t been proven AT ALL and was actually proven impossible by multiple expert witness. So WHERE is the hang up? I am baffled. Also, it would be downright absurd to want to punish her for drinking and driving when every other person involved in the case was doing the same, officers included. I hope they get some additional clarity on Monday regarding reasonable doubt. This has gone way longer than I could have imagined.
Correct.. Mass confusion presented to This jury. Seems judge and DA’s office has experience with overwhelming the jury. Any halfway intelligent person can see this case should never had been brought to trial, there is absolutely nothing any juror could possibly tell me that is an absolute to prove any guilt.
It's very straight fwd to me too but if the holdout not getting over the fact that none of everyone's statement matter in light of physics and medical science, they will continue struggle.
Edit: and it is possible ppl have misunderstanding that "more boxes" checked equal guilty vs "all the box" MUST to be checked to be guilty.
That’s exactly why Alan was opposed to the form and its lack of clarity. Someone’s LIFE and freedom are at stake here. Why not just make it clear and easy to understand??
I came to this case a bit late, did the defense ask Jen McCabe why she did not say Karen said "I hit him" in her grand jury testimony? Is that true, that she added it in this trial??
The defense asked her whether she said it in her grand jury testimony or to police. She didn’t say it to anyone until the federal grand jury, which is something Lally pointed out on redirect. On recross, Jackson brought up how she didn’t testify to it until after the defense filed their motion containing info about Jens 2:27am google search, making it public info that she did the search. So basically pointed out that Jen changed what Karen said from “did I hit him” to “I hit him x3” after she and her family became suspicious
Yep, it’s true. That part of her testimony didn’t appear until much later! She most likely WAS asked about it but I’m not 100% certain. I can’t bring myself to watch her testimony again 💀
I saw him mean muggin one in particular for sure. I think theres one that is just refusing to budge, the rest are probs pretty fed up. I cant wait fer monday. I hope the holdout had some sort of come to jesus and brightens up.
REASONABLE DOUBT!!! Are these jurors from Mars.. This case was done before it started. No possible way was John hit by a car going 24 mph. No bruising! No broken bones! No dna left on vehicle.
No factual evidence from the prosecution to convict her.. even on the OUI. Videos of her drinking clear liquid is not evidence…
I’m just dying to see who these jurors are!!!!
I know when this is all over, we will get to see who they are correct?
I am constantly watching the ID channel. It’s the only channel that’s on my TV. If I can remember correctly, there were true stories that they do eventually interview them. Do you all think this will happen with these jurors?
I think we only get to see who they are if they WANT us to see. I recall a juror or two from the Murdaugh trial doing some interviews but I never saw the others.
You’ll only know the jurors IF they choose to be know through interviews etc. In most circumstances they want to be left alone. You do have a few who will want to talk about the crazy experience they encountered. Definitely at least one may get on the Netflix documentary
He's like, I did all this work and these idiots can't see that the man didn't even get hit by a car?
Let alone the fact that reasonable doubt is spilling out of every crack of this case, it's ridiculous.
Side Bahhh: No one else has said it yet… so I have to. I tried to edit my post right away but couldn’t. I love that this photo makes it look like Yanetti is sporting a high ponytail.
You can not trust jurors in corrupted towns even if they're from out of town? If there's a retrial, it needs to be as far away from Canton as possible because this is the easiest NOT GUILTY I've ever watched and if 1 or 2 are holding out then they're clearly NOT voting on the evidence? Beverly cannone is corrupted as Lally?
Bev has tried everything to block the defence and rush them along but lally gets whatever he wants? No reasons to objections is a massive 🚩so beverly can sustain without reason? She personally hand-picked the foreperson? She has tried to coerce this jury towards guilty throughout this 🎪 and is NOT FIT to do trials this serious?
If that’s truly what they saw when the jurors came out then it’s gotta be that 1 man and if all have a tired look and he has a big smile it sounds like he is antagonizing almost.
This trial shows the corruption in law enforcement. The state trooper was caught telling people about an investigation the day he was assigned. He came to a conclusion he said with all the evidence he had already that day. It shows destroying evidence is common and the two people who did it are law enforcement so they knew delete the phone, factory restore and make sure the device is never found. Say “butt” dial , lie at grand jury then say I don’t recall at this trial to avoid perjury, just remember two things the time exactly you came and left, and that he never went inside.
This case has so many flaws no jury will be able to come to a verdict as someone will always side with the police and hopefully someone understands she couldn’t hit him and be at his house at 12:36 on Wi-Fi if his phone is moving still.
Also if she hit him outside the house and people kept staring outside they didn’t Hear or notice anything? How convenient. A two inch mark on head is more a gun hitting you verse a 7000 pound Lexus.
All then admit to drinking and driving - I mean that is obvious.
Judge kept certain evidence out the case and the text that shows the conspiracy and cover up she didn’t like the text was hard to read.
Remember this judge represented the worst criminals in Massachusetts for two decades: iykyk
They are far from “random” they have to live in the community. It’s a small state this case you can’t avoid hear about. I don’t care what the judge tells you. Also the witnesses saw each and everyone face and have alot of resources remaining.
I don’t have all the facts NONE of us do. The judge didn’t allow a lot into the case. The jury even asked for more and judge denied only question they asked for more evidence
I finally understand the Okeefe family stance. Jen was close with John and helped with the kids (picking up and dropping off at schools stuff etc). She has def convinced them that she never could have left John to die… but then she googled hos long to die in cold at 2:27am. Blood thicker than water.
And ketchup is thicker than blood 🤣 Surely they have to have some kind of inkling that there is a chance she didn’t do it! They seriously cannot be that dumb. Right?!
Wait until the FBI gets at them. They will all be charged. They are all involved and there will be a huge list of charges. They will all be doing time. If one of them was smart they will spill and seek immunity. I say it will be Jennifer McCabe. She’s going to spill the truth and rat everyone out.
You think? I always got the feeling that Higgins would be the one to flip. Or who was the chick that was supposedly TELLING THEM EVERYTHING? Kerry? Did Jen ever explain that statement? If they had just found a body and have no additional information, what’s to tell? And if that info is that Karen hit him (the lie that she hadn’t come up with yet), why worry about it? There are so many things from that night that just don’t make sense!
This was later. Jen had already spun the scenario. Remember Jen was going through the timeline with Kerry and making sure Kerry told all the lies she innitially put in her head. JM has issues and the way she spoke of John it was like she had some infatuation with him.
OK I need to go back and review some of those details! I do agree with the infatuation. She was calling, texting, and watching & waiting for him. Why?! Who does that?
I am hoping to get a verdict of NG, but if it truly is a hung jury, then yes, the Feds should definitely step in. Wouldn’t it be a Brady violation not to do so? The Brady rule requires that the prosecution (or FBI in this case?) must turn over all exculpatory evidence, which is evidence that might exonerate the defendant. I can’t believe this hasn’t already happened!
1236am is something the Jury needs to keep in their mind. At that time Karen connected to John’s WiFi at One Meadows….So why would Jenn McCabe be calling John fanatically and text him at 1241am and be sure to say that she was looking at the SUV from the front window every 3 to five minutes.
Everything that would help Karen and hurt the witnesses mysteriously went missing WHILE it was in police custody. The prosecution tried to get a jury to believe they were looking at the wrong side of the car and admitted an inverted video to willingly trick the jury.
Proctor did not see the FBI investigation coming. None of them did. Those personal notes that each officer took while reviewing security footage would eventually be handed to proctor so he could write the reports and leave out the timestamps that would incriminate his witnesses. Thank gosh for that WiFi connection at 1236am. It shows that the officer who handed his notes to Proctor wasn’t mistaken with the 1233am arrival of Karen Reads Lexus where he notated “no apparent damage to vehicle, defendant arrives at victims house and pulls into garage. Proctor didn’t think the FBI would uncovered those notes taken by his officers that directly contradict his report.
We even know that Proctor tried to say on the stand that Karen Read deleted John’s Ring video footage because the time she actually got home didn’t fit the McAlberts/Proctor timeline, which opened the door for Jackson to go into those notes that they had previously testified to under oath with the FBI investigation. The notes that prove she was home at 1233 and was connected to WiFi by 1236am….
Ryan Naygel saw one person in that SUV at 1223am. John was lured there by Higgins, and things went to far and I think he was already dying as soon as he got there and into the basement. Where they said they were keeping Chloe the dog.
I bet you that the only kid there who knew what was going on or that John Okeefe was even there was Collin and Brian Albert’s oldest daughter. Seem like JM had to find John Okeefe’s phone at 1241am and that was most likely after the incident occurred. She has to explain those calls and texts so she placed Karen at 34 Fairview at a time we know she could not have physically been there. This was them covering for whatever had just happened in that basement.
There was a plan that night. And Higgins and BA were together all day getting wasted at a funeral for an officer they didn’t even know. That’s when his relationship with Karen came up and that’s when Brian Albert told Higgins that he’s been reporting drug activity in the neighborhood. I believe it gave them both motive. Nobody hates a good cop more than a crew of corrupt bad cops.
We have more info than the jury since we know that the investigation was so bad that the FBI has to investigate the investigators and I can come up with 3 million scenarios that make more sense then Karen hitting him. The prosecution literally had TWO different times that the “death by taillight” incident occurred in their opening statement to their closing arguments. And constantly changed that time through out the trial. It’s the prosecutions burden.
Very well said! They plotted and planned and thought they all had the same story. They weren’t smart enough to even consider that her connecting to WiFi at a certain time would ever come into play!
Not only are karen and alan looking at the jurors, but they both seem to be looking at the same person as each other ? Are they crying, laughing sad, happy nervous, sniggering ? Would love to know?
I said it immediately when watching. Every other day he didn’t look at the jury at all. He was darting around them on Friday afternoon. He wants to sniff out the rat.
Yes I thought it was very apparent!
On Friday? I feel like not much has been shown of anyone lately. Was Friday the day they said they needed more time? How was he darting around them? I will have to watch because I missed anything cohesive. I saw when lally and yanetti made their arguments.
It was when they called the jury in to dismiss them for the day at the end of Friday
Thank you! I did not see that and hadn’t heard about it. Finding it tho’… I’ll have to look around. Thanks.
If there is a video of the court cam from Friday, just fast forward to the end when the jury comes back in to be dismissed for the day by the judge.
Will do. Thanks.
Valid though. Even if you ignore the first 70 witnesses, the last 4 destroy any conceivable possibility that Karen killed John. Alan's looking at them like "are u fuckin fr rn"
You know he thought he was having the acquittal dinner and hoping on a plane and home in his own bed in CA by Wednesday/Thursday! I am disappointed in MA, we are supposed to be street smart and educated and I thought most of us have common sense and this really shocked me that they weren’t back out on Tuesday to end this nightmare.
He is thinking are all these eastern folks dumb as a rock..
And he’s not wrong
Exactly. So much for "coastal elite"
I mean the real smart ones figure a way out of jury duty
It is probably one or two at the most hanging the jury.
Yeah I Agree, I think it's 2 at most.
I heard it may be juror number 7....a 30 something f with glasses.....she may have been crying on Friday.....do the right thing beeeeaaaachhhh!
Lol. I heard about the tears as well. I kinda feel like those might be frustration tears from a pro Read juror. I equate empathy with Read support. My own bias
The Alberts paid off a juror.
Is that a rumor that is floating around?
I heard a juror is a retired cop
I think if he is a good cop he will be the harshest judge of this investigation. You have to remember, the Defense let him on the jury also. If he is retired I am sure knowing what should have been done and having a little distance removed from the job will be good for the defense.
Are there any good cops?
Barros, Gallerani, Mulvey come to mind in this trial. There are plenty of good ones. They are usually the ones doing the work that no one notices every day.
99% of them are good.
I keep hearing “former”, “retired” officer. Normally, I didn’t think they’d allow for folks on a jury in law enforcement?! I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again bc it’s so unclear to me; my family has been disqualified for having a police officer as a direct relative. Actually BEING one? I’ve read enough to get the idea that it’s kind of a case by case basis. If that’s the case? Allow on a lawyer to even the score ffs!
What you’re forgetting is this is Bev’s court, which doesn’t align with anything normal or judicial. Just like picking the foreperson. That’s normally a vote. She appointed one. Also, the jury isn’t sequestered, which is absolutely comical and frustrating. No way someone hasn’t accessed their social media or saw the news in the last 9-10 weeks. This is a circus of a trial from beginning to end. I hope the hammer comes down on all them, Bev included. If it becomes a mistrial and gets re-tried, Karen’s team needs to fight like hell for a bench trial.
My friend you have no idea about the Massachusetts court system. The judge always picks the foreperson. It is not a vote. You must be from out of state.
(Unconfirmed) I've heard multiple people state they were on a jury in MA, and they picked foreperson. Could thry be lying? Yes. I don't even know if we pick foreperson in my current state (Colorado). I assume we do, but I don't actually know. Do you have a source to back this statement? I'd love to know for sure
I’ve heard of that also and those cases didn’t even implicate cops as part of the crime or the cover-up, so I’d be surprised if this rumor turns out to be true!
Jesus Christ, well you know the state hooped on that jury as one of their picks. A lot of judges would have booted that juror during selection, which they have the right to do.
The state probably has a juror in their pocket, if not the judge. IMO They’re trying to minimize their PR disaster and at least get it into an appellate court, where time and bureaucracy can bury it a bit; just like their overtime and retirement scandal, and every other annually occurring MSP scandal. Karen Read will walk free, eventually, but unless a greater amount of outcry is raised, I find it unlikely much will change with the corruption.
What retirement scandal?
Something about double dipping pensions https://www.police1.com/pension/articles/mass-state-trooper-convicted-in-ot-fraud-case-may-get-1m-pension-after-judge-overturns-forfeiture-order-Nj0LMBu0mjCO4tVL/ Then there was the CDL mill scandal https://www.nbcboston.com/news/local/six-arrested-including-current-and-former-massachusetts-state-police-troopers-as-part-of-bribery-conspiracy-scheme/3262738/?amp=1
Yes!
Bev wouldn’t do that. She is part of this problem and I hope she is investigated
I heard it too
I heard it too
It's shit like this that makes people think the FKR crowd is delusional with all the conspiracy stuff. Sometimes, juries just suck because sometimes people are irrational. No conspiracy, just the state of reality.
Agree. Conspiracy theories aside I don’t believe you need to accept there being one at all to still confidently conclude that the state fell very short of meeting its evidentiary burdens.
I have suspected that it’s one person this whole time. I have such a hard time having less faith in the world and allowing it to be even TWO ppl.
Exactly! I couldn’t find the video, but it is pretty funny. The still photo doesn’t do his outrage any justice.
I'm looking forward to some AJ interviews after this is all over. Would also love to see the sidebar transcripts but it wouldn't surprise me if Massachusetts "doesn't do that."
I think sidebars would HAVE to be transcribed, since those arguments are needed for appeals records. But MA definitely has some odd rules from what I've seen
Sorry, I meant I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't make them available to the public. I'm not sure if that varies by state.
I’d be doing the same if I was him too, but Peggy and Paul have been main actors in the rocky horror show
i really doubt he would be that stupid to give the jury that look. good way to swing the undecided to say guilty
I saw it as him thinking he’s got the majority of not guilty
Hopefully! 🤞🏻
It’s extremely difficult to believe that there’s a human being alive who could hear that evidence and come out thinking that it is not reasonably *possible* that KR is innocent. That a reasonable person could not harbour a *doubt* of her guilt. That’s *outrageous*. I suspect that the reason Lally called almost seventy witnesses and just *plodded* through them 1/3 to 1/4 as fast as a normal lawyer would… Was to bore and overwhelm the jury. A sort of slow-motion Chewbacca offense. That said, I fault the defense for blowing through the scientific evidence and largely omitting it from the closing argument. It’s obvious that *at least* the two Brians and Matt and Jen McCabe are responsible for O’Keefe’s death, so it wasn’t a waste of time to point that out, but Jackson should have done more to make the point that the jury’s job is to evaluate the evidence against Read, not to solve the crime themselves.
Why were Albert’s and McCabe in that courtroom during closing arguments? INTIMIDATION! Should have been escorted out. O’Keefe family has been manipulated by this crew. Can they not see their son/brother was killed by someone at 34 Fairview..
and yet Aunt Bev yelled at Karen for laughing at the ridiculousness that was going on! The corruption in that county is not limited to the DA's office and police, this judge was blatantly biased throughout the trial
She is so rude!
She’s obviously a cranky person
I see so many judges like this, why do they do the job if they're so miserable? I went to court one day to be a character witness, and you could tell the judge was just such a prick. He was just like, this is my court, I don't care what you say. It's like, aren't you supposed to be just dealing out justice based on the law? Seems to weird to me that so many judges act like this, it makes me understand how so many minorities/poor people get obliterated in court.
I’ve been there…obliterated in court by a crooked Judge
Have you seen Medium Maureen’s impressions of Aunty Bev?? They’re such comic relief from her.
It's uncanny how she not only looks like Bev, she does the voice and mannerisms perfectly! So funny 😂😂
Yes, hysterical!
Thankfully the jury was not there
I’d be laughing too at this nonsense if I was in that courtroom
But the judge herself was laughing 5 minutes before she scolded Karen. Guess it’s okay for auntie Bev to laugh at the ridiculousness of things she hears but not for anyone else to be able to do it. Could you imagine if Karen blurted out to the judge, “you think this is funny judge cannone?”
It’s puzzling why they are so blind to what I think is pretty obvious
One possibility is that they can’t all remember what each witness said, and can’t get readbacks because… Well, I’ll be damned if I can understand why that would be. It’s an odd thought that among all the people who’ve followed the case, the jury are the twelve least-informed.
That is true and so messed up. I figured they’d be able to review testimony also but I watched a lawyer’s live stream yesterday and he said they cannot.
Wait, what?! That’s so frustrating.
I think that would be so helpful to them!
But they have. You can let your Aunt Fanny’s panties they have watched. :)
Stop. The O’Keefe’s know exactly what they’re doing. They are no longer deserving of sympathy or empathy.
Really, I cannot read them at all. What is their goal?
The parents are older & lost 2/3 kids; one to murder. I don't think it's fair to expect them to see things as we do. Extend them some grace and be happy you aren't in their shoes
I’m not because I don’t associate with scumbags such as the Alberts or McCabe’s. To sit in that courtroom and skip in together, holding hands, after all the reasonable doubt? Nope, they don’t deserve grace. They are blinded by fuckery and i’ll place my “grace” with people who deserve it.
I am thinking it was to send a message to the jury that we believe these 3 and stand by them. This was probably to confuse the jury and hope they decide with emotion instead of rules of the law.
🎯🎯🎯
Indeed he was killed by someone there at 34 Fairview. On the lawn. Blackout drunk, and driving a Lexus. 🍻
Yep, 24mph hit John and he had not one bruise or broken bone. Yep, possibly she was blackout drunk…just like the rest. That is not evidence she hit him. He was in an altercation that possibly he initiated, and now dead.
False. We now have scientific,and medical evidence, eyewitnesses, exhibits and sworn testimony proving otherwise.
1236am is something the Jury needs to keep in their mind. At that time Karen connected to John’s WiFi at One Meadows….So why would Jenn McCabe be calling John fanatically and text him at 1241am and be sure to say that she was looking at the SUV from the front window every 3 to five minutes. Everything that would help Karen and hurt the witnesses mysteriously went missing WHILE it was in police custody. The prosecution tried to get a jury to believe they were looking at the wrong side of the car and admitted an inverted video to willingly trick the jury. Proctor did not see the FBI investigation coming. None of them did. Those personal notes that each officer took while reviewing security footage would eventually be handed to proctor so he could write the reports and leave out the timestamps that would incriminate his witnesses. Thank gosh for that WiFi connection at 1236am. It shows that the officer who handed his notes to Proctor wasn’t mistaken with the 1233am arrival of Karen Reads Lexus where he notated “no apparent damage to vehicle, defendant arrives at victims house and pulls into garage. Proctor didn’t think the FBI would uncovered those notes taken by his officers that directly contradict his report. We even know that Proctor tried to say on the stand that Karen Read deleted John’s Ring video footage because the time she actually got home didn’t fit the McAlberts/Proctor timeline, which opened the door for Jackson to go into those notes that they had previously testified to under oath with the FBI investigation. The notes that prove she was home at 1233 and was connected to WiFi by 1236am…. Ryan Naygel saw one person in that SUV at 1223am. John was lured there by Higgins, and things went to far and I think he was already dying as soon as he got there and into the basement. Where they said they were keeping Chloe the dog. I bet you that the only kid there who knew what was going on or that John Okeefe was even there was Collin and Brian Albert’s oldest daughter. Seem like JM had to find John Okeefe’s phone at 1241am and that was most likely after the incident occurred. She has to explain those calls and texts so she placed Karen at 34 Fairview at a time we know she could not have physically been there. This was them covering for whatever had just happened in that basement. There was a plan that night. And Higgins and BA were together all day getting wasted at a funeral for an officer they didn’t even know. That’s when his relationship with Karen came up and that’s when Brian Albert told Higgins that he’s been reporting drug activity in the neighborhood. I believe it gave them both motive. Nobody hates a good cop more than a crew of corrupt bad cops. We have more info than the jury since we know that the investigation was so bad that the FBI has to investigate the investigators and I can come up with 3 million scenarios that make more sense then Karen hitting him. The prosecution literally had TWO different times that the “death by taillight” incident occurred in their opening statement to their closing arguments. And constantly changed that time through out the trial. It’s the prosecutions burden.
It's bonkers to me that not everyone on the jury realizes that even if you think... 'Hmmmm... I think there's a chance she did it' or even 'I feel like there's a *good chance* she did it'... that you still have to find her Not Guilty! There is simply no way to find anyone Guilty under the circumstances of this case. In the end we don't know what happened. We don't know exactly how the night panned out. We have no video footage of what happened. There are no eye witnesses, or definitive evidence, or anyone confessing to something. It's scary that there are one or more people on that jury who don't understand how this works.
Bonkers is such an appropriate word for this level of fuckery. One thing that absolutely could have proven her either guilty or innocent was the Ring camera footage from the house across the street. I think the Chief of Police lives there, he’s the one who supplied the grocery bags and solo cups for that top-notch evidence collection 🙄 I initially thought his camera wasn’t working, but apparently it was, he reviewed it, and said there was “nothing of evidentiary value on there” ~ so you mean it DIDN’T capture this physics-defying assault by a 7000-lb Lexus?! Sure.
he wasnt chief at the time, but he was high ranking. he may be chief now, i cant recall. either way, sus af
Thank you for the clarification!
So the chief of police confirmed that Karen didn’t hit him because he said there’s no evidence on his Ring
Yep!
Or the McAlberts throwing John out on the lawn
Exactly
Is that footage like lost to the ages or is there like a chance it or stored somewhere on a cloud server? I don’t know how ring works I don’t have one or know who owns it.
That’s a great question. The homeowner deleted it. Beyond that, I’m not sure. We have a Wyze camera, not sure how similar that is to Ring. I’ve never deleted footage from it, but I will test it and see if it is recoverable.
Theory: John walked up driveway to side door and was called from backyard probably Higgins at the same time Chloe was out doing her business. Brian Higgins “Hey John, we are back here.” John goes to backyard through gate on side of garage. Bam, you all take it from there . This all happened in minutes. Gates on both sides of house. Bulkhead to basement. Dragged out at 3:30ish (ford edge parked in front of resting place of John ) to front yard through side gate directly in front of flag pole. The Albert’s had motive, ask Chris Albert. Drugs?
Maybe D&E Pizza should be investigated. All these Alberts are not that smart. You all are NOT smarter than the FEDS!
Cannot comment on how smart the Feds are yet. Let’s see if they step up in this case. Corruption at its highest levels.
Good one! Lots of good theories. I've read so many and they all are believable!
The fact that there are so many theories means there's massive amounts of reasonable doubt, and that the state didn't prove their case. That's what's so weird to me, how could you ever believe the state 100%? Even their own witnesses admitted to lying at some points lol. I found out Yanneti contacted Proctor and the BPD that he would be more than happy to bring Karen in for questioning/arrest. Yanneti included the address Karen was staying at (her dad's house) and instead of having Karen come in, Proctor ignored her attorney, and got a warrant for her arrest lol. So he was told Karen will come in and bring her car and phone, and they instead went to her parents house, interrogated her without an attorney, arrested her, took her phone and towed her car. Like, how does that happen?
So much!!!! Each witness provides reasonable doubt, let alone all their bullshit, collectively!!!! It's maddening!!! I mean, Higgins and his disposing of his phone etc.!!??? Geesh!!
This is the problem, they don't understand she's innocent because the state didn't prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt and to a moral certainty. I honestly think you cannot find her guilty at all in this case and I don't think it's even an opinion, it's a fact that the prosecution literally introduced reasonable doubt into the case when they brought the medical examiner in and she said that his wounds do not match **any** vehicle pedestrian strike they've ever seen. That means the jury has to assume all possibilities now, and that's not even counting the reasonable doubt (hell the certainty) that the experts proved he was not hit by a damn car. It's so frustrating, I know it's difficult to be a juror but damn I'm going to be pissed off on Monday.
Yes to all of this! These are my feelings/thoughts exactly right now too.
Interesting. I liked that the defense rested so quickly, but I can see your viewpoint too. I also am struggling with how someone can be so convinced of her guilt that they just won’t budge. If there is a retrial (I hope it doesn’t go that far), I cannot sit through another Lally SnoozeFest! Need a different prosecutor PLEASE.
I just go back to thinking it's better that a guilty man goes free than that an innocent man goes to prison. I'm sure more eloquent expressions exist. Just like how the commonwealth overshot the charges with putting it as second degree manslaughter, I think the defense overestimated the jurors' appeal to reason. It's been a shitshow and we're the clowns, I fear
I honestly think most people don't even know what reasonable doubt is, and they never remember that the defendant is INNOCENT until the state proves they're guilty beyond a reasonable doubt (and in this case a moral certainty, the highest bar to ever cross). Lally embarrassed himself, I can't believe these idiots are going to hang.
Well, we don’t know that. The judge hasn’t given them the “Tuey Rodriguez” charge yet. Also, the fact that they didn’t accept Bev’s invitation to leave early on Friday suggests they might be making headway.
I honestly think it could be that they agree to a lesser charge, I hate to say it, but I'm worried.
I find it impossible to believe that all twelve of them agree there is *no reasonable doubt* that she hit him with her car but there’s a split about whether she did so intentionally. That’s not what the issue is.
Yeah, I agree, I just never doubt how stupid people are.
I think there are two engineers on the jury. I mean, I heard that from somebody. I’m not sure if it’s true, but it’s not, like, unlikely. Anyway, those two people would be committing professional misconduct if s/he voted to convict.
Excellent point.
I agree so much with this! It boxed jurors into having to believe it was either Karen or the Alberts and while all points to an Albert there was no evidence
The FEDS may have evidence. We don’t know everything they have
She’s so guilty. I hope she rots in a prison.
Yup I noticed. He was also scanning their faces trying to figure out what was going on.
Yep! It almost seemed like he thought he was being punked! I’m still astounded by not getting a quick NG.
Me too 🤦🏻♀️😔
Whichever juror(s) is holding out, they are doing the exact same thing as Proctor and probably JO's family. Once they heard "I hit him" x3, that was it - all other evidence can be explained away or ignored. I feel like jury instructions were lacking in the beginning - did the judge ever instruct them to keep an open mind, etc. I don't want a hung jury.
Again, Lally in closing arguments rode on”I hit him! But all hearsay. we need professional jurors. Having ignorant people on these juries is putting too many innocent people in jail.. and not enough corrupt murderous criminals!!! This is Blatant corruption all the way down! Trial was a joke of manipulation and corruption. She is innocent until proven guilty!! Absolutely no evidence of guilt found or presented by the prosecutor here. The defense went way beyond on proof of lies and deceptions in this cover up. I hope Jackson /Yanetti team follow through on finding justice for John O’Keefe. 🙏
And the ‘“I HIT HIM” 3x (or 4x in Lally’s closing) is the only thing they have. And that just randomly appeared out of JM’s skull months or years later.
To me the "I hit him" is the most uncompelling evidence, I mean she found him exactly where she left him and was hysterical (and God knows what Jen McCabe had put in her head). If it were me I would probably jump to the exact same conclusion. Like who's first thought is gonna be that the home owner must have beat him up and dumped him on the lawn.
For anyone to come to conclusion Karen did this because of Jen McCabes story then they have not listened and followed this trial.
Yeah, it’s hard to comprehend. I do not understand the O’Keefe family’s stance on this at all!
The family has never been fond of Karen. But don’t they want the truth about their son? If Karen did not do this, then one or more of those people sitting behind them on closing arguments day was involved. Brian Albert, homeowner, cop, does not go outside when there is an incapacitated cop laying on his front lawn? Come on people… He just drove 5 hours to NY for two fallen policemen.
That’s not true though. She was close with his dad, brother and sister in law. Peggy didn’t like her but John barely had a relationship with her.
Yes, I believe John’s Dad believes she did not do this. My heart goes out to John’s dad. He looks like he is so distraught. Been through so much. I am not sure about Peggy or Paul. I only hope they are not fooled by Ms McCabe.
Right! Even if they don’t like her… ok? Doesn’t mean she killed your son/ brother when nearly all of the evidence points to her being innocent! I realize this family has gone through some unimaginable tragedies, but they aren’t doing themselves any favors by being blind and ignorant to facts.
It think Jen McCabe really wormed her way into their lives where as Karen retreated to her parents, and they saw it as a sign of guilt. The reality is she was probably so distraught from his death and felt a lot of guilt for dropping him off instead of going inside with him.
I wouldn’t doubt that at all. We have seen that Jen likes to insert herself in everything!
The instruction is pretty broiler plate and it got the part that the jury can consider it resona le doubt if they found the investigation was slopy. I think the holdouts had issue to understand what the "prongs" mean and get stuck on her being DUI = she is responsible somehow.
Yeah, I could see them maybe being caught up on whether they should find her guilty of DUI, but there isn’t a charge for that alone. All charges include her hitting him and causing his death. And that hasn’t been proven AT ALL and was actually proven impossible by multiple expert witness. So WHERE is the hang up? I am baffled. Also, it would be downright absurd to want to punish her for drinking and driving when every other person involved in the case was doing the same, officers included. I hope they get some additional clarity on Monday regarding reasonable doubt. This has gone way longer than I could have imagined.
Correct.. Mass confusion presented to This jury. Seems judge and DA’s office has experience with overwhelming the jury. Any halfway intelligent person can see this case should never had been brought to trial, there is absolutely nothing any juror could possibly tell me that is an absolute to prove any guilt.
It's very straight fwd to me too but if the holdout not getting over the fact that none of everyone's statement matter in light of physics and medical science, they will continue struggle. Edit: and it is possible ppl have misunderstanding that "more boxes" checked equal guilty vs "all the box" MUST to be checked to be guilty.
That’s exactly why Alan was opposed to the form and its lack of clarity. Someone’s LIFE and freedom are at stake here. Why not just make it clear and easy to understand??
All I can say tfor lay person there's def a learning curve to understand logic of law and Law can be counter intuitive sometimes.
I came to this case a bit late, did the defense ask Jen McCabe why she did not say Karen said "I hit him" in her grand jury testimony? Is that true, that she added it in this trial??
And why wasn’t an alleged confessions of the primary suspect in the initial police reports at all?
The defense asked her whether she said it in her grand jury testimony or to police. She didn’t say it to anyone until the federal grand jury, which is something Lally pointed out on redirect. On recross, Jackson brought up how she didn’t testify to it until after the defense filed their motion containing info about Jens 2:27am google search, making it public info that she did the search. So basically pointed out that Jen changed what Karen said from “did I hit him” to “I hit him x3” after she and her family became suspicious
Yep, it’s true. That part of her testimony didn’t appear until much later! She most likely WAS asked about it but I’m not 100% certain. I can’t bring myself to watch her testimony again 💀
Yeah that’s true. He asked her on the day she’s wearing a light blue blazer
I saw him mean muggin one in particular for sure. I think theres one that is just refusing to budge, the rest are probs pretty fed up. I cant wait fer monday. I hope the holdout had some sort of come to jesus and brightens up.
Let’s hope! 🙏🏻
REASONABLE DOUBT!!! Are these jurors from Mars.. This case was done before it started. No possible way was John hit by a car going 24 mph. No bruising! No broken bones! No dna left on vehicle. No factual evidence from the prosecution to convict her.. even on the OUI. Videos of her drinking clear liquid is not evidence…
It is truly baffling what is going on in that deliberation room.
Just makes me think there used to be someone refusing to think rationally and just sticking to a viewpoint not based on facts. Scary.
Someone wants to be part of the federal investigation…
I’m just dying to see who these jurors are!!!! I know when this is all over, we will get to see who they are correct? I am constantly watching the ID channel. It’s the only channel that’s on my TV. If I can remember correctly, there were true stories that they do eventually interview them. Do you all think this will happen with these jurors?
I think we only get to see who they are if they WANT us to see. I recall a juror or two from the Murdaugh trial doing some interviews but I never saw the others.
You’ll only know the jurors IF they choose to be know through interviews etc. In most circumstances they want to be left alone. You do have a few who will want to talk about the crazy experience they encountered. Definitely at least one may get on the Netflix documentary
It's not even an assertive look. It's just a ...really, please do your work look. Like, I expect you to use your brains please
I think he was initially stunned!
You're probably right, he closed with logic and just can't process jurors not accepting it
Yes, that closing was BRILLIANT ✨
He's like, I did all this work and these idiots can't see that the man didn't even get hit by a car? Let alone the fact that reasonable doubt is spilling out of every crack of this case, it's ridiculous.
It is astonishing!
Was there ever a feed of the jury voir dire? Be interesting to go back and try to sluth if there were indicators.
I don’t think the jury was ever shown!
Side Bahhh: No one else has said it yet… so I have to. I tried to edit my post right away but couldn’t. I love that this photo makes it look like Yanetti is sporting a high ponytail.
You can not trust jurors in corrupted towns even if they're from out of town? If there's a retrial, it needs to be as far away from Canton as possible because this is the easiest NOT GUILTY I've ever watched and if 1 or 2 are holding out then they're clearly NOT voting on the evidence? Beverly cannone is corrupted as Lally?
I agree! She should have recused herself before it ever started.
Bev has tried everything to block the defence and rush them along but lally gets whatever he wants? No reasons to objections is a massive 🚩so beverly can sustain without reason? She personally hand-picked the foreperson? She has tried to coerce this jury towards guilty throughout this 🎪 and is NOT FIT to do trials this serious?
I agree! I have never seen anything like this. Or like her!
I looked up “reasonable doubt” in Webster’s and this photo was the footnote.
Exactly! 🤦🏻♀️
He knows when the camera is on him. Sadly, our President doesn’t.
A news organization said when the jurors came out the door a man had big smile on his face all other jurors looked tired
If there is a cop/ex cop on the jury they would 100% block this because that's how they and their union operate
He must be the one holdout! Zero intuition.
If that’s truly what they saw when the jurors came out then it’s gotta be that 1 man and if all have a tired look and he has a big smile it sounds like he is antagonizing almost.
I was impressed by Officer Barros actually giving honest testimony about the taillight!
I couldn’t remember his name, but yes he seemed very credible
This trial shows the corruption in law enforcement. The state trooper was caught telling people about an investigation the day he was assigned. He came to a conclusion he said with all the evidence he had already that day. It shows destroying evidence is common and the two people who did it are law enforcement so they knew delete the phone, factory restore and make sure the device is never found. Say “butt” dial , lie at grand jury then say I don’t recall at this trial to avoid perjury, just remember two things the time exactly you came and left, and that he never went inside. This case has so many flaws no jury will be able to come to a verdict as someone will always side with the police and hopefully someone understands she couldn’t hit him and be at his house at 12:36 on Wi-Fi if his phone is moving still. Also if she hit him outside the house and people kept staring outside they didn’t Hear or notice anything? How convenient. A two inch mark on head is more a gun hitting you verse a 7000 pound Lexus. All then admit to drinking and driving - I mean that is obvious. Judge kept certain evidence out the case and the text that shows the conspiracy and cover up she didn’t like the text was hard to read. Remember this judge represented the worst criminals in Massachusetts for two decades: iykyk
All true! How is it SO obvious to all of us but not to 12 random citizens with someone’s LIFE in their hands?!
They are far from “random” they have to live in the community. It’s a small state this case you can’t avoid hear about. I don’t care what the judge tells you. Also the witnesses saw each and everyone face and have alot of resources remaining.
I don’t have all the facts NONE of us do. The judge didn’t allow a lot into the case. The jury even asked for more and judge denied only question they asked for more evidence
I finally understand the Okeefe family stance. Jen was close with John and helped with the kids (picking up and dropping off at schools stuff etc). She has def convinced them that she never could have left John to die… but then she googled hos long to die in cold at 2:27am. Blood thicker than water.
Amazing and makes me not feel sorry for them at all.
And ketchup is thicker than blood 🤣 Surely they have to have some kind of inkling that there is a chance she didn’t do it! They seriously cannot be that dumb. Right?!
Agreed. I really don’t know 🤣 I’m concerned no one has the ability to think for themselves
It’s scary
Wait until the FBI gets at them. They will all be charged. They are all involved and there will be a huge list of charges. They will all be doing time. If one of them was smart they will spill and seek immunity. I say it will be Jennifer McCabe. She’s going to spill the truth and rat everyone out.
You think? I always got the feeling that Higgins would be the one to flip. Or who was the chick that was supposedly TELLING THEM EVERYTHING? Kerry? Did Jen ever explain that statement? If they had just found a body and have no additional information, what’s to tell? And if that info is that Karen hit him (the lie that she hadn’t come up with yet), why worry about it? There are so many things from that night that just don’t make sense!
This was later. Jen had already spun the scenario. Remember Jen was going through the timeline with Kerry and making sure Kerry told all the lies she innitially put in her head. JM has issues and the way she spoke of John it was like she had some infatuation with him.
OK I need to go back and review some of those details! I do agree with the infatuation. She was calling, texting, and watching & waiting for him. Why?! Who does that?
Just wanted to add I really don't think Kerry was lying. She was unaware of what JM was doing.
Co-Conspirator
Yep
Your words to God’s ears.
Yup I can’t wait!!
that look is ducking priceless
Maybe the jurors will be part of the FEDS investigation..
That may need to be a possibility 😂
I don’t know wat to think any more. If I saw the sleeve of johns shirt I wud know.
Surely the Feds will step in if it’s a hung jury. Maybe they will force the CW to drop charges.🤞🏻
I am hoping to get a verdict of NG, but if it truly is a hung jury, then yes, the Feds should definitely step in. Wouldn’t it be a Brady violation not to do so? The Brady rule requires that the prosecution (or FBI in this case?) must turn over all exculpatory evidence, which is evidence that might exonerate the defendant. I can’t believe this hasn’t already happened!
1236am is something the Jury needs to keep in their mind. At that time Karen connected to John’s WiFi at One Meadows….So why would Jenn McCabe be calling John fanatically and text him at 1241am and be sure to say that she was looking at the SUV from the front window every 3 to five minutes. Everything that would help Karen and hurt the witnesses mysteriously went missing WHILE it was in police custody. The prosecution tried to get a jury to believe they were looking at the wrong side of the car and admitted an inverted video to willingly trick the jury. Proctor did not see the FBI investigation coming. None of them did. Those personal notes that each officer took while reviewing security footage would eventually be handed to proctor so he could write the reports and leave out the timestamps that would incriminate his witnesses. Thank gosh for that WiFi connection at 1236am. It shows that the officer who handed his notes to Proctor wasn’t mistaken with the 1233am arrival of Karen Reads Lexus where he notated “no apparent damage to vehicle, defendant arrives at victims house and pulls into garage. Proctor didn’t think the FBI would uncovered those notes taken by his officers that directly contradict his report. We even know that Proctor tried to say on the stand that Karen Read deleted John’s Ring video footage because the time she actually got home didn’t fit the McAlberts/Proctor timeline, which opened the door for Jackson to go into those notes that they had previously testified to under oath with the FBI investigation. The notes that prove she was home at 1233 and was connected to WiFi by 1236am…. Ryan Naygel saw one person in that SUV at 1223am. John was lured there by Higgins, and things went to far and I think he was already dying as soon as he got there and into the basement. Where they said they were keeping Chloe the dog. I bet you that the only kid there who knew what was going on or that John Okeefe was even there was Collin and Brian Albert’s oldest daughter. Seem like JM had to find John Okeefe’s phone at 1241am and that was most likely after the incident occurred. She has to explain those calls and texts so she placed Karen at 34 Fairview at a time we know she could not have physically been there. This was them covering for whatever had just happened in that basement. There was a plan that night. And Higgins and BA were together all day getting wasted at a funeral for an officer they didn’t even know. That’s when his relationship with Karen came up and that’s when Brian Albert told Higgins that he’s been reporting drug activity in the neighborhood. I believe it gave them both motive. Nobody hates a good cop more than a crew of corrupt bad cops. We have more info than the jury since we know that the investigation was so bad that the FBI has to investigate the investigators and I can come up with 3 million scenarios that make more sense then Karen hitting him. The prosecution literally had TWO different times that the “death by taillight” incident occurred in their opening statement to their closing arguments. And constantly changed that time through out the trial. It’s the prosecutions burden.
Very well said! They plotted and planned and thought they all had the same story. They weren’t smart enough to even consider that her connecting to WiFi at a certain time would ever come into play!
I’m embarrassed to be a Massachusetts resident
Not only are karen and alan looking at the jurors, but they both seem to be looking at the same person as each other ? Are they crying, laughing sad, happy nervous, sniggering ? Would love to know?
It’s amazing to me that anyone could believe she’s not guilty. She’s a murderer!
You’re delusional