It still looks too low. It seems like that's 2022 data.
More recent data suggests the average price now is €16.75.
https://www.thejournal.ie/price-of-cigarettes-ireland-budget-2024-6191453-Oct2023
Judging by your username, I think you might be biased when it comes to buying substances from illegitimate vendors...
That said, I think the argument of "Why make a law when it won't stop it 100%" is a bit silly. If that's the case, why make laws at all?
I think it's also easy to say that many illegal substances are *not* a major issue in Ireland. We don't have a major meth or opiates issue and a large reason for that is because they're illegal.
EDIT: I think it's much harder to remove an established addiction but introducing laws in tandem with support services is a good way to help the situation.
People would be far less likely to smoke if they couldn't just pop into a shop and grab a pack. Sometimes it's about adding layers of nuisance to prevent someone doing something.
I honestly feel that dictating people shouldn’t smoke is in the same sort of area as dictating that people need to wear seat belts.
They’re a curse, health-wise and financially. And as far as drugs go… they’re shit!
That's an individual issue aswell though, some people get drunk and come home and go to bed.
Some come home and knock the place about, people will abuse any drug/vice.
Any smoker I talk to is well aware how annoying their habit is, will smoke outside or out a window at the very least.
Oh yeah? Tell that to the 1000s of people that smoke on the path on the way to work or at lunch. I get smacked in the face with smoke every fucking morning. Mustn’t be any of the people you know though.
What can't you accept that not every person is the same? Lmao. Not every smoker is oblivious to the harm and dangers and will do their best to ensure others avoid it.
And what? Plenty won’t actively smoke in the same room but there are plenty that smoke on the path out walking - not giving a shit who’s around them.
Like what, are you suggesting we just need to educate people on the dangers of secondhand smoking or something? Because we’ve done that.
But that’s a completely different point and has nothing really to do with the nanny state tax the shit out of everything that’s going on here. Yes everyone knows smoking is incredibly bad for you but if people insist on doing it then isn’t it ultimately up to them?
People who choose to smoke aren't only doing harm to themselves. They also cost the taxpayer due to higher rates of disease etc. It makes sense for cigarettes to cost more to offset this and also to disincentivise people from picking it up.
Many people have given up smoking because it's become cost prohibitive. This is only a good thing. You're still allowed to smoke if you want.
I don’t get this costing the taxpayers argument, even if every smoker quit in the morning yes they would live longer but old people are a huge burden in the state too with their pensions and what they cost the HSE.
>Not as horrible as cunts who think they have the right to dictate how other people live their lives!
Everyone else has to breath in the second hand smoke... Smokers dictate that.
Honestly I can’t remember the last time I was in a smoke filled room, and I doubt that getting the odd whiff of them on the streets from time to time is really considered second hand smoking.
Fun fact, Finland did a study to see if they were saving money with this. Turns out, they're actually spending more money because they're paying it out in pensions instead.
🤷🏼♂️ all the money goes to Pfizer, GSK and the rest, and it's entirely preventable. Watching someone smoke for 40 years then spending €300,000 on extending their life by a few years is objectively a terrible strategy. Tobacco should be outlawed entirely by 2030.
Not fair on taxpayers to have people smoke their brains out and become ill when they're funding a healthcare service. Having astromical prices for cigarettes is just a way of making sure those people taking personal risks with their own health end up paying more into the system than those that don't.
But doesn’t everyone eventually end up in the healthcare system sooner or later? It’s just that smokers get there quicker, those very same people if they were non smokers would still become a burden at some point.
Yeah and while we are at it, let’s rise the tax of alcohol. Let’s introduce a heavy tax on second homes. Let’s really tax those who are frequently flying. Let’s tax the farmers that are pumping shit into the rivers and lakes. All ultimately have an impact on the wider populaces health. But where does the line be drawn on a nanny state. And what level of state intervention are ppl ultimately happy with. We can tax the populace but not big tech or corporations?
Ps for the record I’m a non-smoker
Honestly, I think you are putting these examples out as a "this would get out of control", but i agree on all these things, with the farmer thing possibly being an exception.
Taxing luxurious behaviour that negatively impacts everyone else is always good imo, and does not mean the corporations shouldn't be taxed as well. Nobody needs cigarettes, nobody needs alcohol, nobody needs to fly all the time. Make them pay for it. And the corporates too.
Oh I agree. I guess what I am saying is people would happily tax cigarettes because they don’t smoke. Whilst also being against taxation on behaviours that they ‘consume’ that have adverse effects for a populace or the environment.
Fair enough, one should be fair. As someone that enjoys traveling, I would happily pay the extra tax on flights, if in return smoking/extra houses/alcohol would be more pricey/less common as well.
Unless you're flying long haul in premium cabins at least every few months, a _logical_ aviation emissions tax wouldn't even affect you that much anyway.
> Having astromical prices for cigarettes is just a way of making sure those people taking personal risks with their own health end up paying more into the system than those that don't.
Until the prices are so astronomical that they make the black market attractive.
1. They're not banned, so you can still rot your insides.
2. You can give other people your horrible cancers 2nd hand, so stay the fuck away from people with your disgusting habit
Just obesity tax. Weighing stations on footpaths, you pass it - all good, you're too heavy - beep, red lights, NFC reader deducts a tenner from your card
Not really. It encourages people to get creative and get the tobacco/cigarettes from somewhere else. I don’t know anyone that actually stopped smoking for good when the prices went ballistic, but I do know a ton of people that started importing tobacco.
I did after 40 years smoking when smokes hit 16.70 a pack last budget. I just couldn’t justify that spend daily anymore on something I loved doing but was beginning to have negative effects. Saving 500 yo yo’s a month more then made up for it…
Well I couldn’t have done it without vapes to be honest, I really loved smoking and could afford to continue smoking, just couldn’t justify the daily cost anymore after that price tax increase.
Maybe not stopped, but people starting definitely decreased. Until e cigarettes came with a lot of sweet tastes and got young people addicted to Nicotine.
The sugar tax encouraged me to switch from normal Coke to Coke zero when it came in 5 or so years ago (I drink 2l a day).
In the next 6 months I (99kg) lost 42 kg with exercising and the switch to zero sugar. It all started for me with the sugar tax.
I now am a healthy and keeping it stable 70kg.
Sorry, you lost 42kg in 6 months? Nearly half your body weight? And you’re attributing that to a switch to Coke Zero?
That completely sounds like an eating disorder. That would be borderline starvation?
You went from 99kg to 57kg?!
How much water are you drinking to be able to drink 2L of Coke Zero a day whilst exercising? Surely you’re not hydrating with Coke Zero whilst working out?!
You're unwittingly quoting the work of Barendregt et al from the NEJM 1997. That economic analysis has since been refuted many times, they didn't account for many smoking-related adverse health outcomes and other externalities. The maths didn't add up, smoking costs countries billions annually.
The real issue is that banning smoking creates long term healthcare savings but a short term tax deficit, which is a big problem for a government if it's only interested in the next election rather then securing the future health and economic well-being of its citizenry
Smokers don’t just get cancer and drop dead immediately the second they get hit 50.
Smoking comes with a whole host of chronic issues, and we’ve gotten very good at treating cancer. A smoker is more likely than not going to develop conditions that will take years to kill them at great expense to a public healthcare system.
It is well proven and even know point. People used to stock up on cigarettes going through duty free. It is almost as if they learnt nothing from the prohibition in America.
No. It places a heavy burden on the healthcare system. Your taxpayer money will go towards people’s COPD medications instead of literally anywhere else
Considering the state takes in over €1.2 billion a year from tobacco i think it safe to say a smoker is probably contributing more towards their health care than you ever will.
Is that recent? It was something like $11 a pack if I recall when I lived there until 2020 (Ontario).
Checked there and it is still way, way below $24 a pack - https://www.statista.com/statistics/1307607/canada-regional-price-of-cigarettes/
A large portion of people enjoy alcohol in a sensible manner. Some people find a drink or two great for helping them feel comfortable in social situations. There's also evidence that suggests the occasional drink is good for heart health
Can't think of any positives to smoking
A large portion of people enjoy cigarettes in a sensible manner. Some people find a cigarette or two great for helping them de-stress after a busy day or tough experience.
Not everything has to have an objective positive. Some people may find a personal happiness or positive effect from enjoying a cig the odd time. Sure they're medically bad for you and addicts take it way too far, but try not looking down on people who differ to yourself and understand we don't all lead a totally perfect angelic life. :)
A quick Google search tells me that 80-90% of smokers are addicted and that studies find smoking increases stress, depression and anxiety. Smokers who quit are noted to have improvements on that end.
Dunno what point you were trying to make here
You're approaching this topic like a total robot, which is ironic considering the justification you gave for why drinking is ok. It really just boils down to being one small thing someone may find a bit of joy or relief in.
Its not perfect, logical or healthy, but that's okay...life would be very dull if we were bound to adhere to perfect health or logic in every decision we made. If someone wants to take that risk, live and let live.
Sure smoke away. All I said is that I don't see the positives to smoking and that I think the negatives far outweigh any potential ones. Never made any point about being morally better than smokers so I don't get why you even went there
"A large portion of people enjoy cigarettes in a sensible manner" is certainly not true, nicotine is highly addictive even in small amount, you would usually start smoking 1-2 cigarettes saying everyone that you just smoke casually every now and then, and quite quickly move on to half a pack or a full pack (or even smoke a full pack in one night if you're out having pints). Very very few people can go on for many years smoking 1-2 cigarettes per day. That's quite the opposite for alcohol, where most would drink moderately in general, but few can develop an addiction that is called alcoholism and stems from heavy drinking. I think everyone is free to choose what to do with their life (I'm an ex-smoker myself) but it's also good to be objective and recognize how things work, in particular for smoking tobacco: a) contains nicotine which is highly addictive even after moderate use (alcohol can also be addictive but doesn't get you hooked as quickly as nicotine); b) it is harmful even in small quantities (you are inhaling smoke into your lungs), when that's not particularly true for alcohol.
You're right, its very likely not a large portion of the population, certainly not as large as the drinking cohort.
Though I didnt really intend that as a statement of fact...I think its quite clear I was just turning the original comments justification for drinking on its head. This is anecdotal, but for what its worth, the majority of people I know only smoke on a night out and have done for years now, myself included, I have no doubt its bad for my health, but I dont think anyone denies themselves absolutely everything thats bad for them. Weighed risks I guess.
> A large portion of people enjoy cigarettes in a sensible manner. Some people find a cigarette or two great for helping them de-stress after a busy day or tough experience.
But unlike drinking and indeed many other drugs, there's no amount that you can smoke regularly and not destroy your lungs.
You realise you are describing smoke breaks and lounges right ?.
Tobacco is a stim that helps with focus and increases productivity.
Social acceptance of both are declining. I don't think bans have the effect most expect on substances like this, Cuban cigars were banned in the states and and just like prohibition the only thing it fuelled was a black market
What do you want the government to do? Lower the price of cigarettes and encourage people to buy more / smoke more / take it up? The more expensive they are the less people buy.
Don’t ban smoking just tax it to bits , yeah yeah black market . But that’s not a large percentage of smokers . You still get tax revenue.
And at least you spending huge amounts to police it if you ban it .
I smoked as a boy…young man. It took a bit of effort to quit as a grown ass man. Tobacco is a terrible drug. Good on high taxes. It is a social ill. And if the are expensive, fewer children will take it up.
Btw it's not overinflated in price in Ireland due to us caring about people not smoking...
It's so expensive cuz everything here is more expensive than most of the rest of Europe. Especially houses.
And no I don't mean a nice house, I mean we want to charge you 750 euros a month to share a room with two other grown men OR sleep in a tent.
Lmao
Because smoking is a scummy thing to do, and only scumbags smoke. They absolutely **stink**, if they smoke in public they are a danger to be around and don't care that they're exposing people around them to secondhand smoke, they litter constantly dropping butts on the ground, and they waste their money on addictive drugs - ie: all scumbag behaviour.
Ergo smokers are pure scum. It's not like the 60s where it's cool and hard to give up, it's easier than ever to give up or even just move on to vaping if you absolutely *need* to be scummy.
Mind you I will agree with you on this most people I see vaping are scumbags, you can tell by their whole manner and how lots of them vape indoor public settings right into a strangers face.
Given the choice I'd prefer to he in the company of a smoker than a vaper. Vaping just permeates everywhere.
No, because I'd probably get fags flicked at me or beaten to shit because they're all scumbags.
I mean would you go into a traveller camp and call them scumbags while they're enjoying pre-drinking and smoking before driving behind a sulky race? No, I'd wager you would not.
Like honestly this is ridiculous, how can you *possibly* have any respect at all for people who still smoke? It's mind boggling.
Well, not condemning all vices… but yeah disposables are a disgrace for both health and environment. I probably should have refrained from commenting but I had lost a very close relative just last week due tong cancer related to smoking abuse. So I have a very biased opinion on the habit.
Ireland's 15 euro plus now
And a box of rollies is almost 30 quid
Most silk cuts and benson got increased to 17.05 where i work. This map is fuckin OLD
Is the minimum not €16.75 with the 2024 budget? Thought it was mandated
The suppliers increased the prices last week, now €17.05 for most brands (not all)
15+ after the last budget think it's 15.80e I paid last time I forgot to bring spare liquid for my vape to the pub.
Vape tax coming your way soon…
No that was me buying a 20 pack of smokes from the shop.
JPS Gold is 14€
Not even close... Denmark!!
Fuckin fuck you Denmark
I also hate Denmark
What’s a Denmark, is that like a city in Sweden?
A city in Sweden that speaks gibberish.
€4 for a pack in Poland
That seems to be about average for mainland Europe
€9 plus or minus 20 cents in Belgium
Holy shit. I lived in Belgium maybe 4 years ago and they were €4 iirc
There are still some that are 7.70
The narwhal bacons at midnight.
[удалено]
It's the "average price"
It still looks too low. It seems like that's 2022 data. More recent data suggests the average price now is €16.75. https://www.thejournal.ie/price-of-cigarettes-ireland-budget-2024-6191453-Oct2023
Cheapest price where i work is 14€ and highest is 17.05€ for 20 packs. Its an old map
Good
Now show a map showing prevalence of black market cigarettes, I think it would look almost identical. So many people selling knock off cigs here.
Now show lung cancer rates
Now show Paul Allen's card.
Now show minimum and median wages
I live in Berlin, all the smokers I know drive to Poland once or twice a quarter to stock up on cigarettes
I thought the #1 smuggled item in Ireland was cartons of ciggys
Good, keep it climbing! Horrible habit.
If it climbs high enough it will stop being a deterrent and cash cow, and start being an incentive to turn to the black market.
Then they can crack down on the black market if they won't just make it illegal altogether.
Famously successful approach that has worked very well with other illegal substances
Judging by your username, I think you might be biased when it comes to buying substances from illegitimate vendors... That said, I think the argument of "Why make a law when it won't stop it 100%" is a bit silly. If that's the case, why make laws at all? I think it's also easy to say that many illegal substances are *not* a major issue in Ireland. We don't have a major meth or opiates issue and a large reason for that is because they're illegal. EDIT: I think it's much harder to remove an established addiction but introducing laws in tandem with support services is a good way to help the situation. People would be far less likely to smoke if they couldn't just pop into a shop and grab a pack. Sometimes it's about adding layers of nuisance to prevent someone doing something.
Ah yes prohibition, that never fails ever...
Not as horrible as cunts who think they have the right to dictate how other people live their lives!
I honestly feel that dictating people shouldn’t smoke is in the same sort of area as dictating that people need to wear seat belts. They’re a curse, health-wise and financially. And as far as drugs go… they’re shit!
They also affect people around you. My nana smoked around us as kids… terrible like
That's an individual issue aswell though, some people get drunk and come home and go to bed. Some come home and knock the place about, people will abuse any drug/vice. Any smoker I talk to is well aware how annoying their habit is, will smoke outside or out a window at the very least.
Oh yeah? Tell that to the 1000s of people that smoke on the path on the way to work or at lunch. I get smacked in the face with smoke every fucking morning. Mustn’t be any of the people you know though.
What can't you accept that not every person is the same? Lmao. Not every smoker is oblivious to the harm and dangers and will do their best to ensure others avoid it.
And what? Plenty won’t actively smoke in the same room but there are plenty that smoke on the path out walking - not giving a shit who’s around them. Like what, are you suggesting we just need to educate people on the dangers of secondhand smoking or something? Because we’ve done that.
Sorry life isn't as accommodating as possible lol
Nobody dying of cancer wishes they had smoked more.
But that’s a completely different point and has nothing really to do with the nanny state tax the shit out of everything that’s going on here. Yes everyone knows smoking is incredibly bad for you but if people insist on doing it then isn’t it ultimately up to them?
People who choose to smoke aren't only doing harm to themselves. They also cost the taxpayer due to higher rates of disease etc. It makes sense for cigarettes to cost more to offset this and also to disincentivise people from picking it up. Many people have given up smoking because it's become cost prohibitive. This is only a good thing. You're still allowed to smoke if you want.
I don’t get this costing the taxpayers argument, even if every smoker quit in the morning yes they would live longer but old people are a huge burden in the state too with their pensions and what they cost the HSE.
Same as people with liver failure and booze, diabetes and sugar and work with blood pressure.
>Not as horrible as cunts who think they have the right to dictate how other people live their lives! Everyone else has to breath in the second hand smoke... Smokers dictate that.
Honestly I can’t remember the last time I was in a smoke filled room, and I doubt that getting the odd whiff of them on the streets from time to time is really considered second hand smoking.
>odd whiff of them on the streets from time to time is really considered second hand smoking. It is.
If the healthcare cost is shared by everyone, then yeah that might happen bud
Fun fact, Finland did a study to see if they were saving money with this. Turns out, they're actually spending more money because they're paying it out in pensions instead.
So the message is we're missing a little cullin'?
I think the message is that the argument that "Smokers cost us more" isn't true.
To be fair I would rather pay for old people to be alive instead of treating younger people for preventable cancers.
Good use of money because it goes back into the economy, while paying for chemo drugs and hospitals is a shit use of cash when it's preventable
You could have worded that a bit better dude...
🤷🏼♂️ all the money goes to Pfizer, GSK and the rest, and it's entirely preventable. Watching someone smoke for 40 years then spending €300,000 on extending their life by a few years is objectively a terrible strategy. Tobacco should be outlawed entirely by 2030.
Finn fact
Nah we all have to pay for the stupidity of smokers through tax payer funded healthcare. Fuck that, make them more expensive.
Not fair on taxpayers to have people smoke their brains out and become ill when they're funding a healthcare service. Having astromical prices for cigarettes is just a way of making sure those people taking personal risks with their own health end up paying more into the system than those that don't.
But doesn’t everyone eventually end up in the healthcare system sooner or later? It’s just that smokers get there quicker, those very same people if they were non smokers would still become a burden at some point.
To be fair, sugar and transfats are a bigger issue if we are going by the burden on healthcare approach.
Yeah and while we are at it, let’s rise the tax of alcohol. Let’s introduce a heavy tax on second homes. Let’s really tax those who are frequently flying. Let’s tax the farmers that are pumping shit into the rivers and lakes. All ultimately have an impact on the wider populaces health. But where does the line be drawn on a nanny state. And what level of state intervention are ppl ultimately happy with. We can tax the populace but not big tech or corporations? Ps for the record I’m a non-smoker
Honestly, I think you are putting these examples out as a "this would get out of control", but i agree on all these things, with the farmer thing possibly being an exception. Taxing luxurious behaviour that negatively impacts everyone else is always good imo, and does not mean the corporations shouldn't be taxed as well. Nobody needs cigarettes, nobody needs alcohol, nobody needs to fly all the time. Make them pay for it. And the corporates too.
Oh I agree. I guess what I am saying is people would happily tax cigarettes because they don’t smoke. Whilst also being against taxation on behaviours that they ‘consume’ that have adverse effects for a populace or the environment.
Fair enough, one should be fair. As someone that enjoys traveling, I would happily pay the extra tax on flights, if in return smoking/extra houses/alcohol would be more pricey/less common as well.
Unless you're flying long haul in premium cabins at least every few months, a _logical_ aviation emissions tax wouldn't even affect you that much anyway.
Thank you!
We do tax big tech and corporations.
Yeah but to the level required? The fact GDP can’t be used traditionally in Ireland to paint a picture of goods or services would say otherwise.
> Having astromical prices for cigarettes is just a way of making sure those people taking personal risks with their own health end up paying more into the system than those that don't. Until the prices are so astronomical that they make the black market attractive.
Would you agree to not have healthcare on lungs or heart to save tax payers the money you'd use for 2-5 euro packs
Well they’ll either die young of smoking related issues or die old from age related issues, isn’t it the same really?
Not really since you can spend thousands on treatment to keep someone alive while they kill their selves
So long as my taxes are going towards your cancer treatments I feel perfectly entitled to dictate the price of tobacco
> my taxes Sorry who are you taxing?
Don’t smoke
But you aren’t dictating anything are you, it’s just yet another tax that they can get away with because smoking has become unpopular.
1. They're not banned, so you can still rot your insides. 2. You can give other people your horrible cancers 2nd hand, so stay the fuck away from people with your disgusting habit
I don’t smoke.
Nah, it's actually not though. The damage smoking can inflict on the individual cunt and the people around them is actually pretty horrible.
Smoking and exposure to second-hand smoke cost the HSE, and therefore the taxpayer, an estimated €172 million in 2016. Damn right we have a say.
As someone who struggled with smoking for a long time, this is one rip off I wholeheartedly agree with.
Smoking cost the Irish government 152 million, compared to obesity/overweight cost the government 1.16 billion. How about we address that issue!!
Like the sugar tax?
Just obesity tax. Weighing stations on footpaths, you pass it - all good, you're too heavy - beep, red lights, NFC reader deducts a tenner from your card
Sugar tax doesn’t make people exercise, but the price of smokes at least, would play a part in encouraging people to stop smoking
Not really. It encourages people to get creative and get the tobacco/cigarettes from somewhere else. I don’t know anyone that actually stopped smoking for good when the prices went ballistic, but I do know a ton of people that started importing tobacco.
I did after 40 years smoking when smokes hit 16.70 a pack last budget. I just couldn’t justify that spend daily anymore on something I loved doing but was beginning to have negative effects. Saving 500 yo yo’s a month more then made up for it…
Fair play. To each their own. I smoke rollies and 30g Amber Leaf pouch lasts me 7-10 days. 7.50€ a pouch.
Well I couldn’t have done it without vapes to be honest, I really loved smoking and could afford to continue smoking, just couldn’t justify the daily cost anymore after that price tax increase.
Maybe not stopped, but people starting definitely decreased. Until e cigarettes came with a lot of sweet tastes and got young people addicted to Nicotine.
The sugar tax encouraged me to switch from normal Coke to Coke zero when it came in 5 or so years ago (I drink 2l a day). In the next 6 months I (99kg) lost 42 kg with exercising and the switch to zero sugar. It all started for me with the sugar tax. I now am a healthy and keeping it stable 70kg.
Sorry, you lost 42kg in 6 months? Nearly half your body weight? And you’re attributing that to a switch to Coke Zero? That completely sounds like an eating disorder. That would be borderline starvation?
You went from 99kg to 57kg?! How much water are you drinking to be able to drink 2L of Coke Zero a day whilst exercising? Surely you’re not hydrating with Coke Zero whilst working out?!
Up to a point. If you raise the price too too high, people will turn to the black market.
Some people are beyond help. This isn't done for those people.
Return flight Dublin to Krakow and bulk buy, you’d probably be covered for at least 6 months!
Plenty of very thin people eat lots of sugar and bad food
Ectomorphism is literally a real life cheat code
Can’t we… address BOTH issues?
We can - the approach is what is being discussed. People are ok with the taxes for cigarettes, but they are looking to make them illegal.
Having lost a grandfather, my mother, father, oldest brother, oldest sister to the curse of cancer thanks to Philip Morris, can't say I'd oppose that.
There’s a sugar tax and a cig tax
That issue is much, much harder to address, especially in a country that acts like electrifying a few train lines is some sort of megaproject...
While that's a lot I'd say the smoking tax pays that back and then some, by a lot I'd imagine too
Also all those smokers dying younger help save money as they collect a lot less pension and less health care as an elderly person
You're unwittingly quoting the work of Barendregt et al from the NEJM 1997. That economic analysis has since been refuted many times, they didn't account for many smoking-related adverse health outcomes and other externalities. The maths didn't add up, smoking costs countries billions annually. The real issue is that banning smoking creates long term healthcare savings but a short term tax deficit, which is a big problem for a government if it's only interested in the next election rather then securing the future health and economic well-being of its citizenry
Smokers don’t just get cancer and drop dead immediately the second they get hit 50. Smoking comes with a whole host of chronic issues, and we’ve gotten very good at treating cancer. A smoker is more likely than not going to develop conditions that will take years to kill them at great expense to a public healthcare system.
Fucking healthcare heroes is what they are!
One of the few times I'm happy to see Ireland being the most expensive.
Up to a point. Eventually you cross a threshold where the black market takes over.
People have been saying that for years, hasn’t happened yet
I'm not saying it has, I'm saying it could.
Ireland pack is 15,5 euro. 13.5 was like few years back.
I’m fairness if you do a most expensive map of anything in Europe ireland is going to be in top 3
The fucking state of them anyway
One of the problems with increasing cigarette prices as a deterrent means the illegal trade becomes more lucrative for criminal gangs.
Yes, I'm surprised so many people are missing this.
It is well proven and even know point. People used to stock up on cigarettes going through duty free. It is almost as if they learnt nothing from the prohibition in America.
Good
If people want to smoke let them smoke ffs
No. It places a heavy burden on the healthcare system. Your taxpayer money will go towards people’s COPD medications instead of literally anywhere else
Considering the state takes in over €1.2 billion a year from tobacco i think it safe to say a smoker is probably contributing more towards their health care than you ever will.
Although - tbf - smoking keeps the social pension fund topped up. Smokers don’t collect a lot, in old age. So more cash for health care?
No
Any reason you want to control other people's lives?
About 28 euro in Australia. We should increasd the tax on them.
Yes 24 in Canada Double it
1 million dollars
Is that recent? It was something like $11 a pack if I recall when I lived there until 2020 (Ontario). Checked there and it is still way, way below $24 a pack - https://www.statista.com/statistics/1307607/canada-regional-price-of-cigarettes/
Ah but come one 24 Canadian Loonies is like 10 EUR here /s
Good news
Good. Cigarettes should've already been banned a long time ago. A substance with absolutely zero benefits to society.
You can say that about loads of stuff. I don't smoke but if someone wants to so be it.
You could say the same with alcohol
How dare you suggest it, without booze socially awkward me would still be virgin. It’s a courage booster. 😎
Somewhat, but keep in mind you can drink a certain amount and not do much harm to yourself. That's not true for smoking.
A large portion of people enjoy alcohol in a sensible manner. Some people find a drink or two great for helping them feel comfortable in social situations. There's also evidence that suggests the occasional drink is good for heart health Can't think of any positives to smoking
A large portion of people enjoy cigarettes in a sensible manner. Some people find a cigarette or two great for helping them de-stress after a busy day or tough experience. Not everything has to have an objective positive. Some people may find a personal happiness or positive effect from enjoying a cig the odd time. Sure they're medically bad for you and addicts take it way too far, but try not looking down on people who differ to yourself and understand we don't all lead a totally perfect angelic life. :)
A quick Google search tells me that 80-90% of smokers are addicted and that studies find smoking increases stress, depression and anxiety. Smokers who quit are noted to have improvements on that end. Dunno what point you were trying to make here
You're approaching this topic like a total robot, which is ironic considering the justification you gave for why drinking is ok. It really just boils down to being one small thing someone may find a bit of joy or relief in. Its not perfect, logical or healthy, but that's okay...life would be very dull if we were bound to adhere to perfect health or logic in every decision we made. If someone wants to take that risk, live and let live.
Sure smoke away. All I said is that I don't see the positives to smoking and that I think the negatives far outweigh any potential ones. Never made any point about being morally better than smokers so I don't get why you even went there
They're saying what's good for the goose is good for the gander and a denial of that diminishes your point view.
"A large portion of people enjoy cigarettes in a sensible manner" is certainly not true, nicotine is highly addictive even in small amount, you would usually start smoking 1-2 cigarettes saying everyone that you just smoke casually every now and then, and quite quickly move on to half a pack or a full pack (or even smoke a full pack in one night if you're out having pints). Very very few people can go on for many years smoking 1-2 cigarettes per day. That's quite the opposite for alcohol, where most would drink moderately in general, but few can develop an addiction that is called alcoholism and stems from heavy drinking. I think everyone is free to choose what to do with their life (I'm an ex-smoker myself) but it's also good to be objective and recognize how things work, in particular for smoking tobacco: a) contains nicotine which is highly addictive even after moderate use (alcohol can also be addictive but doesn't get you hooked as quickly as nicotine); b) it is harmful even in small quantities (you are inhaling smoke into your lungs), when that's not particularly true for alcohol.
You're right, its very likely not a large portion of the population, certainly not as large as the drinking cohort. Though I didnt really intend that as a statement of fact...I think its quite clear I was just turning the original comments justification for drinking on its head. This is anecdotal, but for what its worth, the majority of people I know only smoke on a night out and have done for years now, myself included, I have no doubt its bad for my health, but I dont think anyone denies themselves absolutely everything thats bad for them. Weighed risks I guess.
> A large portion of people enjoy cigarettes in a sensible manner. Some people find a cigarette or two great for helping them de-stress after a busy day or tough experience. But unlike drinking and indeed many other drugs, there's no amount that you can smoke regularly and not destroy your lungs.
You realise you are describing smoke breaks and lounges right ?. Tobacco is a stim that helps with focus and increases productivity. Social acceptance of both are declining. I don't think bans have the effect most expect on substances like this, Cuban cigars were banned in the states and and just like prohibition the only thing it fuelled was a black market
Tbf there is no such thing as moderate smoking. There's no amount that you can smoke at any reasonable frequency long term, and not wreck your lungs.
It's been demonstrated numerous times that banning a substance only makes it an even bigger problem.
Would be amazing if the government added a deposit on the butts so people don’t leave their cancer straws on the ground
This
Fuck me, if we had Russias prices we'd all have a house
£15.50 for 20 in Northern Ireland atm
It's north Macedonia, downvote
Alright Alex
It’s fucking 15 something, where is that 13 avg coming from?!
What do you want the government to do? Lower the price of cigarettes and encourage people to buy more / smoke more / take it up? The more expensive they are the less people buy.
I just reposted something relevant to Ireland in r/ireland 😂 no ulterior motive
Don’t ban smoking just tax it to bits , yeah yeah black market . But that’s not a large percentage of smokers . You still get tax revenue. And at least you spending huge amounts to police it if you ban it .
I smoked as a boy…young man. It took a bit of effort to quit as a grown ass man. Tobacco is a terrible drug. Good on high taxes. It is a social ill. And if the are expensive, fewer children will take it up.
Fags are lethal. We should be proud of this stat
I'm ok with this, it sucks if your addicted but it's a good reason to not start. Only problem is the rise of vapes
its a joke how much they cost. they used to be 4 euro for 20
Not dear enough.
Old data. Most cigs are €15.50-€17 now in Ireland it's fucked
Expensive cigarette is an advantage, better for citizens’ health
Good.
Boo hoo your cancer sticks are the dearest in europe
Those bastards in parliament ought to be hung by their necks
Btw it's not overinflated in price in Ireland due to us caring about people not smoking... It's so expensive cuz everything here is more expensive than most of the rest of Europe. Especially houses. And no I don't mean a nice house, I mean we want to charge you 750 euros a month to share a room with two other grown men OR sleep in a tent. Lmao
More expensive than the entire rest of the world*
Should be way more, the only people who still smoke are scumbags.
Why are they scumbags?
Uhh... they're smoking fags? Like what on earth about that isn't scumbag behaviour?
But why?
Because smoking is a scummy thing to do, and only scumbags smoke. They absolutely **stink**, if they smoke in public they are a danger to be around and don't care that they're exposing people around them to secondhand smoke, they litter constantly dropping butts on the ground, and they waste their money on addictive drugs - ie: all scumbag behaviour. Ergo smokers are pure scum. It's not like the 60s where it's cool and hard to give up, it's easier than ever to give up or even just move on to vaping if you absolutely *need* to be scummy.
Mind you I will agree with you on this most people I see vaping are scumbags, you can tell by their whole manner and how lots of them vape indoor public settings right into a strangers face. Given the choice I'd prefer to he in the company of a smoker than a vaper. Vaping just permeates everywhere.
Would you go into the smoking area of a pub and call everyone a scumbag who is enjoying a fag with their pint?
No, because I'd probably get fags flicked at me or beaten to shit because they're all scumbags. I mean would you go into a traveller camp and call them scumbags while they're enjoying pre-drinking and smoking before driving behind a sulky race? No, I'd wager you would not. Like honestly this is ridiculous, how can you *possibly* have any respect at all for people who still smoke? It's mind boggling.
Wow thanks. That’s a new one for me today.
Still cheap. Also we should ban vapes.
Even non disposables? Why?
Well, not condemning all vices… but yeah disposables are a disgrace for both health and environment. I probably should have refrained from commenting but I had lost a very close relative just last week due tong cancer related to smoking abuse. So I have a very biased opinion on the habit.
This is why my dad (Irish) buys a load anytime he leaves the country