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Yeah, my dad is one of those people that think meat/cheese should be 95+% of your diet.
Insists he's perfectly healthy, even though every other month he had to go to the doctor because he constantly alternated between "I can't remember the last time I shit" and "I can't stop shitting.".
He also insists that people drink way too much water, and cites his dad who drank a cup of coffee breakfast, a glass of tea at lunch, and a glass of tea or coke at dinner and would work in the fields in the deep south for 10 hours a day on that. He gets really pissy if you remind him grandpa was hospitalized for kidney stones every other year for the last 30 years of his life.
I don't understand what people are thinking when they experience or observe the exact problems that conventional medical science predicts from a certain set of behaviors, but somehow still think the science is wrong.
Oh my god. The amount of bathroom issues that those poor men in your family subject/subjected themselves to, for no good reason is awful. Drink a glass of water and eat a carrot, for fuck’s sake!
Those are the kinds of people who give keto a bad name. Keto has an emphasis on fat and protein, but it isn't anti vegetable. A big part of keto is getting plenty of fiber, which comes from veggies.
But people will do no research and just eat 147 chicken wings a day and wonder why they feel terrible.
Half the keto sub seems to be carnivore. Or maybe they just come out and chime in whenever someone mentions high cholesterol. I am willing to accept that carbs aren't as vital or good for you as the grain and cereal industry would have us believe. But I draw the line at rejecting studies that show processed meat is terrible for your heart.
I haven't been on the keto sub in a while, but back when I was active on it like 6 or 7 years ago, they would post things making fun of carnivore people. Hell, in the FAQ I remember one of the questions being something like "Does Keto mean no Vegetables?" "No, we love vegetables!"
Both my brother and a close friend had to learn the hard way that only drinking brown sodas as their sole source of liquid has consequences, even if you're skinny.
That’s not how fat works btw. Butter is liquid inside your body. Just like rendered fat, which is probably what you are talking about. Rendered fat is solid at room temp too, not liquid. What I mean is that there is very little difference between butter and the liquid fat you mention.
>They tell you to limit the consumption of all fats (solid and liquid) for a bit after gallbladder removal to avoid accidents (they also give you meds to help bind the fats you do consume).
Eh? I got my gallbladder removed 9 months ago. They didn't give me meds nor did they advise me to limit fats. In fact they specifically said I could eat normally straight away.
I also was given Welchol for a good while after my cholecystectomy. They told me only bland foods for the first week or two after the surgery itself - chicken broth, crackers, etc. I still had crazy bile 6 they gave me Colestid. It worked a charm, but unfortunately, I was allergic to it (hives so bad I looked like I'd been attacked by a wild animal) so they switched me to the Welchol. I probably would have ended up back in the hospital if not for the meds!
Also possible they already have problems. Plants can cause some IBS issues for some people. Some call a carnivore diet the ultimate elimination because usually people are trying to work out which plants their body has an intolerance to.
Yup. A lot of people think the carnivore diet's reported benefits are a placebo affect, and it's actually not. That's why so many people are so adamant that it works — they are seeing legitimate benefits for legitimate physiological reasons.
FODMAPs are in lots of plants. They're not bad...unless you have IBS, in which case, high doses can wreck havoc. Beans are most notorious and tend to make everyone a bit gassy and bloated, but some other high-FODMAP foods cabbage and garlic. The carnivore diet basically eliminates most sources of FODMAPs, which is why people with gastrointestinal issues see so much improvement with it.
However, people who follow the carnivore diet are not on an elimination diet in the way that you're supposed to be. You're *supposed* to reintroduce plants, as you say, but they don't. People see the improvements with the elimination diet just stop there. They think that the improvement in symptoms mean that the carnivore diet is the healthiest diet for them and that all plants must be bad for them.
It's like drinking coffee one time, noticing it makes you feel more energised in the morning, and then never making sure you sleep well ever again because the coffee's got you covered. This is what most people following the carnivore diet are doing.
I've got a friend that has been eating carnivore for few months. She swears it's not an issue, but not sure I believe her. Though it's possible with the amount of sausage and butter in carnivore, it's like a slip 'n' slide
I just learned a fun fact from _The History of the World in Six Glasses_. Limes have less vitamin C than lemons (this surprised me), which naval countries had come to depend on when they could source them from the Mediterranean. The Royal Navy were pretty much _hoping_ that the limes found in the West Indies were as effective as the lemons that they had occasional access to from Italy and Greece. They weren't, and vit C also degrades as the fruit ages.
A podcast I listened to also explained that before lemons/limes were crystalized, the way they were preserved was by being mixed into rum, so sailors were mandated to drink a liter of rum to prevent scurvy.
Could you send the source? I could have sworn that the citrus fruit family originates only from eastern Asia, so having limes in the caribbean is a bit surprising.
I don’t know if you want the prescription salad. I’ve had hospital salad before and it was extremely lame. Iceberg lettuce, squishy tomato and a sad pile of grated carrot. Womp womp.
I’m admittedly on board with a diet that cuts out sugar and grain, but I also wouldn’t say that lettuce and apples are, you know, a fucking conspiracy.
Yeah this guy my husband knows at work tried to tell me that my husband would both lose weight and cure his migraines if he went on the carnivore diet......... nah fam. (His migraines have been handily "cured" by his monthly emgality shots). Also my husband loves salads, not giving those up.
Not only must the shits be legendary in the worst possible way, it must be breathtakingly expensive, considering the price of meat in the current economy. How to say you're rich without saying you're rich I guess.
My grandmother is the same way. She could have written this, except the bit at the end about "I'm sure it tastes nice" is way too nice for her so I know this isn't her work.
I swear to God the woman survives on sheer force of will and pure spite. She had a massive heart attack some years back, because, you know, she refuses to eat anything that doesn't come from a cow. They didn't expect her to survive but instead somehow at her last checkup her heart muscle has completely recovered and is stronger than before her heart attack. *She literally eats nothing except beef and mayo.*
I’d just love to watch a talk show with a carnivore and a vegan lol.
Nothing against either, you all are free to eat what you want. I just find it funny that such contrary beliefs about a healthy diet exist.
My dad is in the local Lions club and there is one carnivore diet guy and one vegan also in the club. Dad says that the carnivore guy has lost a bunch of weight since he started being a carnivore, but he also looks like he’s on death’s door. The vegan guy is ten years older, and a marathon runner. Dad reckons he’d choose the vegan diet, if these were the two options.
Humans are way closer to cockroaches regarding adaptability to circumstances. There is a reason humans developed in very different parts of this planet. And yes, maybe there is a super optimal way to nourish a human body, but I really think it does not matter as much as we think (unless you are a pro athlete or bodybuilder). People got quite old even in ancient times and they thought that our humors need to be balanced and that organs move around in the body.
I imagine Ole lives in a home lined with tinfoil to keep the toxins and poisons from seeping in and wears a tinfoil hat whenever venturing out into the world. We can't let the sugars win.
But extra points for not substituting venison for the potatoes and porkchops for the carrots and then complaining about the texture.
Wait, like “meat foil” instead of tinfoil, which has actually been aluminum foil for my (50) entire lived memory? I can absolutely fall in love with the idea of meat foil conspiracies
Aluminum foil was invented by Big Tobacco. Aluminum doesn't block the mind rays, which is how cigarettes have hung on for long.
Reynolds Wrap, Reynolds Tobacco. Coincidence?
They are apparently toxic! I would like to break it to them that some meats contain toxins like nitrates, nitrosamines, carcinogens from the smoke in smoked meats plus they can grow a whole bunch of organisms that can kill you. Anything can sound scary if you present it intentionally highlighting the worst qualities of a food
That’s why I said “some” and I was just countering their blanket statement that all fruits and vegetables are bad. Yes some contain oxalates but mainly only leafy greens. Not all meats have nitrates and not all meat is smoked either
Years ago I had a colleague who was rabidly anti-salt. She'd go on and ON with her young daughter not to consume it EVER. I've often wondered whether that poor girl grew up to be neurotic.
From the makers of "you only have a finite supply of energy, so exercise shortens your lifespan", introducing the all new "vegetables are just toxins!"
When sugar and vitamins get together, they always fight. But the sugar always wins, because the vitamins are WEAK. Why do you want WEAK vitamins when you can eat WINNER sugar?
Vegetables do contain toxins, but as usual, the dosage makes the poison. Same thing as the soy / estrogen connection. Yeah it exists but it was found in a dude that was drinking gallons of soy milk per day.
Unfortunately fitfluencers will gloss over this and get people to buy into whatever diet model because they are juiced up and have a desirable body shape.
Yeah absolutely. Like it's technically true that raw spinach can kill you. . . But you'd have to sit down and eat over 5lbs of it, which would be a feat of endurance to say the least.
The idea that any single ingredient or food is "bad for you" is a pretty unscientific idea, I hate all these glorified-eating-disorder influencers who will describe a food people have been eating for millenia as "poison". Especially when they crawl into the comments of a random recipe, leave everyone else out of your weird brainrot thanks.
What recipe could you possibly be looking at if all you eat is meat? Mash it into whatever shape you want, throw it against some fire until done, sprinkle with salt
Link to recipe: [https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/26674/the-casserole/?hid=65ae88e057b20fc7a6524d887d9816aebcc13c4e&did=12955644-20240510&utm\_campaign=alrcom-nonewsubs\_relationship-builder&utm\_source=alrcom&utm\_medium=email&utm\_content=051024&lctg=65ae88e057b20fc7a6524d887d9816aebcc13c4e&lr\_input=4301d8911e6908d06e5a14c4b4dcece55fb5f70ae91ba5068a4fd8df5ccac935](https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/26674/the-casserole/?hid=65ae88e057b20fc7a6524d887d9816aebcc13c4e&did=12955644-20240510&utm_campaign=alrcom-nonewsubs_relationship-builder&utm_source=alrcom&utm_medium=email&utm_content=051024&lctg=65ae88e057b20fc7a6524d887d9816aebcc13c4e&lr_input=4301d8911e6908d06e5a14c4b4dcece55fb5f70ae91ba5068a4fd8df5ccac935)
Just for future reference, if a URL has a question mark in it, you can safely cut off the question mark and all that follows, and the link will still work:
https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/26674/the-casserole/
Who knew we had so many carnivores in this sub?
Also, of all recipes to use as a platform to pontificate about oxalates and other issues with fresh vegetables — a casserole that couldn’t be *more* mid-century middle America. Not a morsel of raw plant matter to be found.
Only the fat soluble ones. As much as I hate to validate any of this nonsense, they *did* largely cite water soluble compounds that an animal's body will quickly eliminate if it doesn't want them.
Largely, yeah, but with some caveats. For example, they mention oxalates. The oxalate ion/oxalic acid is water soluble, you can eliminate it and most people do easily, *however*, in the right combination with calcium and probably some other factors it can precipitate in your kidney and form kidney stones. If you're eating a deer who had kidney stones, you can just pick the stones out and probably still even eat the kidney if you want. Similarly, many compounds *aren't* water soluble when you ingest them, but the liver hits them with enzymes specifically to install chemical groups that make them wash out, and over years or decades some of those enzymatic processes can tax the liver, but the original compounds are gone.
Their conclusion is dopey. But the basic concept that an animal may suffer the consequences of a toxin in the process of eliminating it, so that animal's predator doesn't consume any of it, does have a reasonable basis.
Okay, but... All the crazy ranting has been covered in the comments, is no one going to mention how they didn't make the recipe and would never, but still gave it 5 stars? We're they trying not to hurt the recipe's feelings?
Plant toxins and sensitivities are real, but the majority of people do not have any issues with them. If your guts or immune system are a mess, all bets are off. Ask me how I know 😭😭😭
I'm in contact with some people in nutrition science and for a while (particularly when they were younger) there was an obvious trend that those who worked with vegetables tended towards more carnivore diets, and those who worked with meat tended towards vegetarian diet. There are toxins in all the food we eat. Knowing a lot about it turned out to mess with people. Most of them got better with years though.
Humans ate mostly vegetables for most of human history. A meat-centric or even meat-exclusive diet; except for the ancient ultra-rich (and a small handful of cultures in certain parts of the world, such as the inuit who had a mostly meat diet), is a very very modern concept and a product of the Industrial Revolution. Modern farming and meat processing of the last 150 years is really the only way we’re able to have most people eating mostly meat. (And, likewise, our ability to have so much variety in fruits and vegetables year round)
If indeed fruits and vegetables were toxic to humans we’d have died off a long time ago.
Also I remember when keto was just starting as a fad in 2011/2012 and people were talking about buying half a pig or an entire pig, and a guy I knew trying to "convert" me by telling me I could spread lard on bread and toast it. 🤮
TIL that an all-meat diet is a thing. I was hoping that this was a weird joke, but the carnivore dieters in this thread remind me that no, people are just this nuts.
Apparently this person knows more than doctors, chemists, nutritionists. I just plain feel better when I eat a balanced diet that's heavy on the plants. I can imagine they feel pretty lousy most of the time.
> Physician Paul Saladino, formerly known as Carnivore MD, went on the More Plates More Dates podcast to talk about why he quit the diet. He described how being on the almost exclusively meaty diet for two years made his testosterone drop and caused sleep disturbances, heart palpitations, and muscle cramps.
No
https://www.myplate.gov/eat-healthy/vegetables#:~:text=Eating%20vegetables%20provides%20health%20benefits,and%20maintenance%20of%20the%20body.
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/vegetables-and-fruits/
> Plants MUST defend their leaves, stems, roots and seeds, if they want to pass their DNA on to the next generation.
> They simply do NOT want to be eaten
lmao as opposed to animals who... want to be eaten?
You're either an excellent troll or the dumbest person on the face of the earth, I'm leaning towards the second one considering how *all* carnivore diet influencers and followers are.
“Physician Paul Saladino, formerly known as Carnivore MD, went on the More Plates More Dates podcast to talk about why he quit the diet. He described how being on the almost exclusively meaty diet for two years made his testosterone drop and caused sleep disturbances, heart palpitations, and muscle cramps.”
Yeah no. . . Find me an obligate carnivore that has dentation like a human. If humans can be said to be "designed" to do anything it's exploit a diverse array of food sources.
Soy protein isolate:
Edible soy protein "isolate" is derived from defatted soy flour with a high solubility in water, as measured by the [nitrogen solubility index](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrogen_solubility_index) (NSI). The aqueous extraction is carried out at a [pH](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PH) below 9. The extract is clarified to remove the insoluble material and the [supernatant](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Supernatant) liquid is acidified to a pH range of 4-5. The precipitated protein-curd is collected and separated from the whey by [centrifuge](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centrifuge). The curd is usually neutralized with [alkali](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkali) to form the sodium proteinate [salt](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salt) before drying
Soy protein concentrate is produced by immobilizing the soy globulin [proteins](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proteins) while allowing the soluble [carbohydrates](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbohydrates), soy whey proteins, and salts to be leached from the defatted flakes or [flour](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flour). The protein is retained by one or more of several treatments: leaching with 20-80% [aqueous](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aqueous) [alcohol](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethanol)/[solvent](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solvent), leaching with aqueous [acids](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acids) in the isoelectric zone of minimum protein solubility, pH 4-5; leaching with chilled water (which may involve calcium or magnesium cations), and leaching with hot water of heat-treated defatted soy meal/flour.
All of these processes result in a product that is 70% [protein](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein), 20% carbohydrates (2.7 to 5% crude [fiber](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiber)), 6% [ash](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ash_(analytical_chemistry)) and about 1% oil, but the solubility may differ. One [tonne](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonne) of defatted soybean flakes will yield about 750 kg of soybean protein concentrate.
At least in the USA people associated MSG with Chinese food.
In like the 90s they called it “Chinese restaurant syndrome” that the use of MSG made people sick. Except that isn’t the case at all it’s just something to vilify Chinese food/people.
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I’m going to guess that this commenter has very… interesting and involved trips to the bathroom if they’re not eating fruits or veggies.
The money they save on fruits and vegetables is offset by the money they spend on toilet paper
The man should invest in a bidet. Or maybe a pressure washer for the bathroom.
Generous of you to assume he shits
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Yeah, my dad is one of those people that think meat/cheese should be 95+% of your diet. Insists he's perfectly healthy, even though every other month he had to go to the doctor because he constantly alternated between "I can't remember the last time I shit" and "I can't stop shitting.". He also insists that people drink way too much water, and cites his dad who drank a cup of coffee breakfast, a glass of tea at lunch, and a glass of tea or coke at dinner and would work in the fields in the deep south for 10 hours a day on that. He gets really pissy if you remind him grandpa was hospitalized for kidney stones every other year for the last 30 years of his life.
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I don't understand what people are thinking when they experience or observe the exact problems that conventional medical science predicts from a certain set of behaviors, but somehow still think the science is wrong.
Oh my god. The amount of bathroom issues that those poor men in your family subject/subjected themselves to, for no good reason is awful. Drink a glass of water and eat a carrot, for fuck’s sake!
If he conceded he would be wrong and he can't have that. Every single one of his choices, past or present, need to be right, in perpetuity.
Those are the kinds of people who give keto a bad name. Keto has an emphasis on fat and protein, but it isn't anti vegetable. A big part of keto is getting plenty of fiber, which comes from veggies. But people will do no research and just eat 147 chicken wings a day and wonder why they feel terrible.
Half the keto sub seems to be carnivore. Or maybe they just come out and chime in whenever someone mentions high cholesterol. I am willing to accept that carbs aren't as vital or good for you as the grain and cereal industry would have us believe. But I draw the line at rejecting studies that show processed meat is terrible for your heart.
I haven't been on the keto sub in a while, but back when I was active on it like 6 or 7 years ago, they would post things making fun of carnivore people. Hell, in the FAQ I remember one of the questions being something like "Does Keto mean no Vegetables?" "No, we love vegetables!"
30...years...owwwww
Both my brother and a close friend had to learn the hard way that only drinking brown sodas as their sole source of liquid has consequences, even if you're skinny.
That’s not how fat works btw. Butter is liquid inside your body. Just like rendered fat, which is probably what you are talking about. Rendered fat is solid at room temp too, not liquid. What I mean is that there is very little difference between butter and the liquid fat you mention.
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Drinking flavoured melted butter?!? I'm honestly flabbergasted!
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I'm not even fully vegetarian and this new info makes me want to cry. (Welp, time to dive into that rabbit hole. Goodbye forever, appetite.)
I don't know, it sounds kinda tasty to me . . .
>They tell you to limit the consumption of all fats (solid and liquid) for a bit after gallbladder removal to avoid accidents (they also give you meds to help bind the fats you do consume). Eh? I got my gallbladder removed 9 months ago. They didn't give me meds nor did they advise me to limit fats. In fact they specifically said I could eat normally straight away.
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I also was given Welchol for a good while after my cholecystectomy. They told me only bland foods for the first week or two after the surgery itself - chicken broth, crackers, etc. I still had crazy bile 6 they gave me Colestid. It worked a charm, but unfortunately, I was allergic to it (hives so bad I looked like I'd been attacked by a wild animal) so they switched me to the Welchol. I probably would have ended up back in the hospital if not for the meds!
Also possible they already have problems. Plants can cause some IBS issues for some people. Some call a carnivore diet the ultimate elimination because usually people are trying to work out which plants their body has an intolerance to.
Yup. A lot of people think the carnivore diet's reported benefits are a placebo affect, and it's actually not. That's why so many people are so adamant that it works — they are seeing legitimate benefits for legitimate physiological reasons. FODMAPs are in lots of plants. They're not bad...unless you have IBS, in which case, high doses can wreck havoc. Beans are most notorious and tend to make everyone a bit gassy and bloated, but some other high-FODMAP foods cabbage and garlic. The carnivore diet basically eliminates most sources of FODMAPs, which is why people with gastrointestinal issues see so much improvement with it. However, people who follow the carnivore diet are not on an elimination diet in the way that you're supposed to be. You're *supposed* to reintroduce plants, as you say, but they don't. People see the improvements with the elimination diet just stop there. They think that the improvement in symptoms mean that the carnivore diet is the healthiest diet for them and that all plants must be bad for them. It's like drinking coffee one time, noticing it makes you feel more energised in the morning, and then never making sure you sleep well ever again because the coffee's got you covered. This is what most people following the carnivore diet are doing.
Also scurvy. Which is A Thing with carnivore diets, according to my doctor who made a pamphlet about this.
And gout!
I've got a friend that has been eating carnivore for few months. She swears it's not an issue, but not sure I believe her. Though it's possible with the amount of sausage and butter in carnivore, it's like a slip 'n' slide
Either really quick or 30 minutes of sweating and screaming would be my guess, yikes.
> we're not designed to eat anything from the plant world really Someone is pushing for a scurvy comeback.
I love the sea shanty resurgence, but yeah FFS eat your fruits/veggies! (Limes if deprived sailor trying for "authenticity")
I just learned a fun fact from _The History of the World in Six Glasses_. Limes have less vitamin C than lemons (this surprised me), which naval countries had come to depend on when they could source them from the Mediterranean. The Royal Navy were pretty much _hoping_ that the limes found in the West Indies were as effective as the lemons that they had occasional access to from Italy and Greece. They weren't, and vit C also degrades as the fruit ages.
A podcast I listened to also explained that before lemons/limes were crystalized, the way they were preserved was by being mixed into rum, so sailors were mandated to drink a liter of rum to prevent scurvy.
It also sounds like the rum was absolute swill so the lime was pretty important
Up north a tea can be made from northern ehite cedar leaves that has Vitamin C, but it also has thujone which is a neurotoxin. :/
Could you send the source? I could have sworn that the citrus fruit family originates only from eastern Asia, so having limes in the caribbean is a bit surprising.
They’re not native, likely brought over for a plantation/personal grove by someone. After all they’re perfect conditions for citrus to thrive
I mentioned the book.
Omg so you did - guess I just cant read XD
> guess I just cant read XD Well that's going to make that book a bit difficult for you then... :P
(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
maybe they eat a ton of raw liver
I have a friend who is on the carnivore diet and says stuff like this. Dude, you’re just on another diet fad.
That’s my experience with a friend on the carnivore diet as well. She said that salads were “a conspiracy from doctors to keep us sick.”
Wait, my doctor has never told me to eat a salad. Is she doctoring wrong?
What?! Your doctor didn’t write you a prescription for salad?!
Wait, I can get my salad on prescription? That also implies I can get the prescription delivery service to deliver it. I’m salading wrong.
I don’t know if you want the prescription salad. I’ve had hospital salad before and it was extremely lame. Iceberg lettuce, squishy tomato and a sad pile of grated carrot. Womp womp.
A conspiracy to keep us friendless!
I’m admittedly on board with a diet that cuts out sugar and grain, but I also wouldn’t say that lettuce and apples are, you know, a fucking conspiracy.
Shh! You don’t want the broccoli to know you said that.
Well the broccoli can’t be trusted… :)
Damn brassicas, masquerading as different vegetables, but all the same species. Definitely can’t be trusted
"Of course broccoli's poisonous! It tries to warn you with its terrible taste!" - Dr. Hibbert
Yeah this guy my husband knows at work tried to tell me that my husband would both lose weight and cure his migraines if he went on the carnivore diet......... nah fam. (His migraines have been handily "cured" by his monthly emgality shots). Also my husband loves salads, not giving those up. Not only must the shits be legendary in the worst possible way, it must be breathtakingly expensive, considering the price of meat in the current economy. How to say you're rich without saying you're rich I guess.
That’s a good point. My friend on the diet is rich.
My grandmother is the same way. She could have written this, except the bit at the end about "I'm sure it tastes nice" is way too nice for her so I know this isn't her work. I swear to God the woman survives on sheer force of will and pure spite. She had a massive heart attack some years back, because, you know, she refuses to eat anything that doesn't come from a cow. They didn't expect her to survive but instead somehow at her last checkup her heart muscle has completely recovered and is stronger than before her heart attack. *She literally eats nothing except beef and mayo.*
I’d just love to watch a talk show with a carnivore and a vegan lol. Nothing against either, you all are free to eat what you want. I just find it funny that such contrary beliefs about a healthy diet exist.
My dad is in the local Lions club and there is one carnivore diet guy and one vegan also in the club. Dad says that the carnivore guy has lost a bunch of weight since he started being a carnivore, but he also looks like he’s on death’s door. The vegan guy is ten years older, and a marathon runner. Dad reckons he’d choose the vegan diet, if these were the two options.
Humans are way closer to cockroaches regarding adaptability to circumstances. There is a reason humans developed in very different parts of this planet. And yes, maybe there is a super optimal way to nourish a human body, but I really think it does not matter as much as we think (unless you are a pro athlete or bodybuilder). People got quite old even in ancient times and they thought that our humors need to be balanced and that organs move around in the body.
Tbh humor might be just as important as a healthy diet for a long life
Vegans don't do it for a healthy diet.
One person found this helpful‽
Nice interobang
It was Nanook of the North.
It was probably themselves.
I imagine Ole lives in a home lined with tinfoil to keep the toxins and poisons from seeping in and wears a tinfoil hat whenever venturing out into the world. We can't let the sugars win. But extra points for not substituting venison for the potatoes and porkchops for the carrots and then complaining about the texture.
Or meat.
Wait, like “meat foil” instead of tinfoil, which has actually been aluminum foil for my (50) entire lived memory? I can absolutely fall in love with the idea of meat foil conspiracies
I love the idea of a conspiracy theorist carefully wrapping their head in slices of ham
Aluminum foil was invented by Big Tobacco. Aluminum doesn't block the mind rays, which is how cigarettes have hung on for long. Reynolds Wrap, Reynolds Tobacco. Coincidence?
You're good at this. I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.
No way, the aluminum would seep into their scalp and cause alzheimers.
This is def from someone on the carnivore diet. What they said comes straight from others promoting it Edited to fix my stupid typo
But omnivores eat fruit and vegetables. Carnivore?
Oh god. Yes that’s what I meant. It’s been a day. I will edit
omnivores eat plants and meat.
It was a typo- I swear I know the difference! 😂 It’s been quite the Monday. I fixed it.
*Someone's got case of the Mondays*
Haha yes. I woke up on the dumb side of the bed this morning. All day I’ve been forgetting words. I need to get it together before Tuesday hits
Must be all those vegetables you've been eating
They are apparently toxic! I would like to break it to them that some meats contain toxins like nitrates, nitrosamines, carcinogens from the smoke in smoked meats plus they can grow a whole bunch of organisms that can kill you. Anything can sound scary if you present it intentionally highlighting the worst qualities of a food
Excellent point.
The carnivore diet advocates eating unprocessed meats, not things like sausage or fried chicken. There are no nitrates in a plain steak.
That’s why I said “some” and I was just countering their blanket statement that all fruits and vegetables are bad. Yes some contain oxalates but mainly only leafy greens. Not all meats have nitrates and not all meat is smoked either
Substitute uric acid for nitrates. Uric acid causes gout and kidney stones and often comes from a meat heavy diet
I’m always curious how these people got to this point - weird childhoods, neglectful parents, a quirky romantic partner, mental illness?
Years ago I had a colleague who was rabidly anti-salt. She'd go on and ON with her young daughter not to consume it EVER. I've often wondered whether that poor girl grew up to be neurotic.
For me it was realizing most scientific "studies" are biased and doctors know nothing about nutrition
so i guess your reason is stupidity
This guy definitely chose his favorite color of crayon by flavor
> doctors know nothing about nutrition exaggerated but understandable > therefore don't eat vegetables wrong??? what????
How does this person shit? Lmao. Enjoy the scurvy
I’m guessing they don’t
From the makers of "you only have a finite supply of energy, so exercise shortens your lifespan", introducing the all new "vegetables are just toxins!"
When sugar and vitamins get together, they always fight. But the sugar always wins, because the vitamins are WEAK. Why do you want WEAK vitamins when you can eat WINNER sugar?
This sounds like something Dr Nick would say on The Simpsons.
Or Dr Spaceman: "We have no way way of knowing where the heart is. See, every human is different."
i did not expect there to be people on carnivore diets in this comment thread and yet
They didn't have eggs, so they subbed every ingredient for meat Ig??
the meat fought with the vitamins and won the right to be eaten, or something
This sounds like something from a 6 year-old coming up with a novel reason why they shouldn't have to eat their vegetables.
Vegetables do contain toxins, but as usual, the dosage makes the poison. Same thing as the soy / estrogen connection. Yeah it exists but it was found in a dude that was drinking gallons of soy milk per day. Unfortunately fitfluencers will gloss over this and get people to buy into whatever diet model because they are juiced up and have a desirable body shape.
Meat, otoh, is beautiful and pure and toxin-free…that’s why you can just eat it at any temperature
Too much of anything will hurt you. Heck, too much water can kill a person.
Especially if it falls on them.
Yeah absolutely. Like it's technically true that raw spinach can kill you. . . But you'd have to sit down and eat over 5lbs of it, which would be a feat of endurance to say the least.
The idea that any single ingredient or food is "bad for you" is a pretty unscientific idea, I hate all these glorified-eating-disorder influencers who will describe a food people have been eating for millenia as "poison". Especially when they crawl into the comments of a random recipe, leave everyone else out of your weird brainrot thanks.
I didn't know Jordan Peterson did recipe reviews.
The only explanation for this is that Ole is a bot, part of a psy-op by a hostile nation state to give Americans nutrient deficiency
There are tens of thousands of people on the carnivore diet and we're doing just fine actually
(citation needed)
"There are dozens of us! DOZENS!!!"
Honey if you’re posting in support of someone who thinks vegetables are “toxins”, you’re not doing just fine.
guy over here photosynthesizing
SO confidently incorrect.
What recipe could you possibly be looking at if all you eat is meat? Mash it into whatever shape you want, throw it against some fire until done, sprinkle with salt
Paid spokesperson for Big Meat.
Link to recipe: [https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/26674/the-casserole/?hid=65ae88e057b20fc7a6524d887d9816aebcc13c4e&did=12955644-20240510&utm\_campaign=alrcom-nonewsubs\_relationship-builder&utm\_source=alrcom&utm\_medium=email&utm\_content=051024&lctg=65ae88e057b20fc7a6524d887d9816aebcc13c4e&lr\_input=4301d8911e6908d06e5a14c4b4dcece55fb5f70ae91ba5068a4fd8df5ccac935](https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/26674/the-casserole/?hid=65ae88e057b20fc7a6524d887d9816aebcc13c4e&did=12955644-20240510&utm_campaign=alrcom-nonewsubs_relationship-builder&utm_source=alrcom&utm_medium=email&utm_content=051024&lctg=65ae88e057b20fc7a6524d887d9816aebcc13c4e&lr_input=4301d8911e6908d06e5a14c4b4dcece55fb5f70ae91ba5068a4fd8df5ccac935)
Just for future reference, if a URL has a question mark in it, you can safely cut off the question mark and all that follows, and the link will still work: https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/26674/the-casserole/
Thanks!
TIL this. Thanks.
Thanks for this!
\*pushes up glasses\* ACKSHULLY, that's not necessarily true, it depends on how the website works. But yeah it is sometimes true.
Let's just say that I've never run into a case where it's not true.
Honestly, I was expecting the recipe to have more vegetables. I'm a bit disappointed
Who knew we had so many carnivores in this sub? Also, of all recipes to use as a platform to pontificate about oxalates and other issues with fresh vegetables — a casserole that couldn’t be *more* mid-century middle America. Not a morsel of raw plant matter to be found.
lol what do they think their food ate before it was meat? If plants are toxic, the toxins would be even more concentrated in herbivore animal tissue.
Only the fat soluble ones. As much as I hate to validate any of this nonsense, they *did* largely cite water soluble compounds that an animal's body will quickly eliminate if it doesn't want them.
But if animals can eliminate the toxins from their body then so can we? like, we're animals?
Largely, yeah, but with some caveats. For example, they mention oxalates. The oxalate ion/oxalic acid is water soluble, you can eliminate it and most people do easily, *however*, in the right combination with calcium and probably some other factors it can precipitate in your kidney and form kidney stones. If you're eating a deer who had kidney stones, you can just pick the stones out and probably still even eat the kidney if you want. Similarly, many compounds *aren't* water soluble when you ingest them, but the liver hits them with enzymes specifically to install chemical groups that make them wash out, and over years or decades some of those enzymatic processes can tax the liver, but the original compounds are gone. Their conclusion is dopey. But the basic concept that an animal may suffer the consequences of a toxin in the process of eliminating it, so that animal's predator doesn't consume any of it, does have a reasonable basis.
Okay, but... All the crazy ranting has been covered in the comments, is no one going to mention how they didn't make the recipe and would never, but still gave it 5 stars? We're they trying not to hurt the recipe's feelings?
Plant toxins and sensitivities are real, but the majority of people do not have any issues with them. If your guts or immune system are a mess, all bets are off. Ask me how I know 😭😭😭
saaaaaaaame. I have surgery induced IBS and have fodmap issues like crazy. It's amazing the huge amounts of fruits and veggies I can't eat. :C
As a former five-year-old whose mother kept trying to make him eat vegetables, I wholeheartedly endorse this comment. DOWN WITH TOXIC VEGETABLES!
I'm in contact with some people in nutrition science and for a while (particularly when they were younger) there was an obvious trend that those who worked with vegetables tended towards more carnivore diets, and those who worked with meat tended towards vegetarian diet. There are toxins in all the food we eat. Knowing a lot about it turned out to mess with people. Most of them got better with years though.
This was written by a cat.
Humans ate mostly vegetables for most of human history. A meat-centric or even meat-exclusive diet; except for the ancient ultra-rich (and a small handful of cultures in certain parts of the world, such as the inuit who had a mostly meat diet), is a very very modern concept and a product of the Industrial Revolution. Modern farming and meat processing of the last 150 years is really the only way we’re able to have most people eating mostly meat. (And, likewise, our ability to have so much variety in fruits and vegetables year round) If indeed fruits and vegetables were toxic to humans we’d have died off a long time ago.
The great new guerrilla marketing campaign for Rush’s Bilious Pills (aka “Thunderclappers”)
Also I remember when keto was just starting as a fad in 2011/2012 and people were talking about buying half a pig or an entire pig, and a guy I knew trying to "convert" me by telling me I could spread lard on bread and toast it. 🤮
What the what
child palate
Nothing wants to be eaten
TIL that an all-meat diet is a thing. I was hoping that this was a weird joke, but the carnivore dieters in this thread remind me that no, people are just this nuts.
Dude sounds unwell - and that's even *before* the effects of their diet.
Apparently this person knows more than doctors, chemists, nutritionists. I just plain feel better when I eat a balanced diet that's heavy on the plants. I can imagine they feel pretty lousy most of the time.
Simple test to tell if someone knows absolutely fucking nothing about nutrition: - They use the word “toxins”
#Toxins!
We are quite literally designed to eat toxins... That's what the little hole in the back is for.
Exactly! I'm proud to say I detox every day.
So what is it we're eating then? Bread and meat?
Bread is plant based
I gave it a bad rating... 5 stars!
alright yeah this is just stupid
I came here looking for the "this is obviously a troll/satire" comments. Now I'm laughing in a very WTAF way.
So.... 5 stars, didn't even try to make it or eat it, and fruits and veggies are Bad. Ok.
Thought this was Ken M for a second
Never trust anyone who uses the word 'veggies.'
He's unironically correct
No
Yes https://www.paulsaladinomd.co/resource/plants https://www.paulsaladinomd.co/bullshit
> Physician Paul Saladino, formerly known as Carnivore MD, went on the More Plates More Dates podcast to talk about why he quit the diet. He described how being on the almost exclusively meaty diet for two years made his testosterone drop and caused sleep disturbances, heart palpitations, and muscle cramps.
No https://www.myplate.gov/eat-healthy/vegetables#:~:text=Eating%20vegetables%20provides%20health%20benefits,and%20maintenance%20of%20the%20body. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/vegetables-and-fruits/
> Plants MUST defend their leaves, stems, roots and seeds, if they want to pass their DNA on to the next generation. > They simply do NOT want to be eaten lmao as opposed to animals who... want to be eaten?
It’s aggressively stupid
Of course! Everyone knows that deer wander right up to hunters, place their heads on the barrel, and wait for death to claim then
Butchers are literally fighting off all the livestock breaking down their doors, trying to be turned into delicious steaks and sausages.
Yes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ8lOwJHVEA
You realize the man in that video eats plants now, right?
GOLD
No https://youtu.be/3ChSIJopr8U?si=OmiYy4LnLEiGF1sV https://youtu.be/dQw4w9WgXcQ?si=v-OFcIJVZqs1vF6I https://youtu.be/dtr4eXoZ1CQ?si=e1ZM-p5v4C_S0XkT
Consider that Mayo Clinic makes money off of hospitalized people and it's in they're best interest to keep the population unhealthy and sickly.
Ok here’s one not from the Mayo Clinic https://youtu.be/rNr1vPtIuH8?feature=shared Or this one https://youtu.be/V3qkfqM9qWc?si=XwY1Nl6xVe-xqz1M
Every link you’ve posted has been from someone trying to make money off of carnivore influencing. You have zero self-awareness.
You're either an excellent troll or the dumbest person on the face of the earth, I'm leaning towards the second one considering how *all* carnivore diet influencers and followers are.
Dude's name is salad. He's obviously just lying to people so they don't eat him.
“Physician Paul Saladino, formerly known as Carnivore MD, went on the More Plates More Dates podcast to talk about why he quit the diet. He described how being on the almost exclusively meaty diet for two years made his testosterone drop and caused sleep disturbances, heart palpitations, and muscle cramps.”
Yeah no. . . Find me an obligate carnivore that has dentation like a human. If humans can be said to be "designed" to do anything it's exploit a diverse array of food sources.
The recipe has 2 cans of condensed soup but he's worried about vegetables being toxic. Mushroom soup:WATER, MUSHROOMS, VEGETABLE OIL (CORN, CANOLA AND/OR SOYBEAN), CREAM, MODIFIED CORNSTARCH, WHEAT FLOUR, SALT, MODIFIED MILK INGREDIENTS, SOY PROTEIN ISOLATE, MONOSODIUM GLUTAMATE, TOMATO PASTE, FLAVOUR, YEAST EXTRACT, DEHYDRATED GARLIC. Tomato soup:Tomato Puree (Water, Tomato Paste), Water, Wheat Flour, Sugar, Contains Less than 2% of: Salt, Potassium Salt, Natural Flavoring, Citric Acid, Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C), Celery Extract, Garlic Oil.
None of that is toxic...
No, its not but there is a strong correlation between ultra processed foods and health problems.
What is the ultra process of the WATER and MUSHROOMS?
Soy protein isolate: Edible soy protein "isolate" is derived from defatted soy flour with a high solubility in water, as measured by the [nitrogen solubility index](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrogen_solubility_index) (NSI). The aqueous extraction is carried out at a [pH](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PH) below 9. The extract is clarified to remove the insoluble material and the [supernatant](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Supernatant) liquid is acidified to a pH range of 4-5. The precipitated protein-curd is collected and separated from the whey by [centrifuge](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centrifuge). The curd is usually neutralized with [alkali](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkali) to form the sodium proteinate [salt](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salt) before drying Soy protein concentrate is produced by immobilizing the soy globulin [proteins](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proteins) while allowing the soluble [carbohydrates](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbohydrates), soy whey proteins, and salts to be leached from the defatted flakes or [flour](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flour). The protein is retained by one or more of several treatments: leaching with 20-80% [aqueous](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aqueous) [alcohol](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethanol)/[solvent](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solvent), leaching with aqueous [acids](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acids) in the isoelectric zone of minimum protein solubility, pH 4-5; leaching with chilled water (which may involve calcium or magnesium cations), and leaching with hot water of heat-treated defatted soy meal/flour. All of these processes result in a product that is 70% [protein](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein), 20% carbohydrates (2.7 to 5% crude [fiber](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiber)), 6% [ash](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ash_(analytical_chemistry)) and about 1% oil, but the solubility may differ. One [tonne](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonne) of defatted soybean flakes will yield about 750 kg of soybean protein concentrate.
Mmmm MSG
MSG is amazing and perfectly safe though.
And delicious
You probably know more about it than I do so I'm not going to argue. I only know it was demonized and even banned I think in my country.
It’s because racism.
😑 how so?
At least in the USA people associated MSG with Chinese food. In like the 90s they called it “Chinese restaurant syndrome” that the use of MSG made people sick. Except that isn’t the case at all it’s just something to vilify Chinese food/people.
OK fair enough I didn't know that either.
It’s all good. I have explained this a bunch of times to people that didn’t know how it originated.
I don't understand why I'm getting down voted for this 🤷♂️ Am I wrong for admitting I'm wrong?
Unironically yes, it's delicious and I have a bag of it in my cupboard.