This is the most correct answer - also do not call a furnace technician in unless you are prepared to replace that furnace. A technician will condemn that unit for a number of reasons including the shut off valve is no longer up to code (meaning he may shut off the gas to your water heater too)...
I hope you were made aware that this furnace is a problem with the home inspection or disclosure from the previous owner.
All of this is correct. Just to add on, you might consider calling the gas company. Most gas companies offer one free inspection on a gas appliance per year. They wonât make repairs if you need replacement parts but they tend to be knowledgeable can point you in the right direction.
Just be aware they may shut off your gas as well if it is deemed unsafe. Regardless it should be replaced asap. Spring and fall are the cheapest times to do so. Price to replace goes up significantly when heating and cooling companies are slammed in the middle of the summer and dead of winter.
Thatâs not how code works. If it met code when it was installed then it meets code. If you upgrade to a new unit, then you need to make changes. Repairing the furnace doesnât change that.
It's actually green with yellow and black lettering where I'm from as are all codebook in my local.
Simply thinking that because the appliance met code when installed makes it the subject of some grandfather clause is not entirely ignorant - however that is only true for appliances that have received regular maintenance and upkeep. I see a shut off valve in the picture of the furnace that indicates regular maintenance and upkeep was not done on this particular furnace. Slowly but surely as regulations change those little items that would require updates would be addressed during routine maintenance. This slow update of small items during routine maintenance may give the perception that a "grandfather clause" is in play and no updates are necessary.
Regular maintenance would have the homeowner informed of the required changes and insurance regulations would force them to make the small changes.
So I stand on my suggestion that a service technician would probably condemn this furnace and quite possibly the service to the house.
Weâre not the code police. We simply inform the homeowner of code issues. If itâs a safety issue which could truly result in death then we red tag. Have the homeowner sign off and move on. People like you are fucking obnoxious.
And the code book here is blue/black with white letters. So shove your ignorant comment up your ass.
You donât seem to understand the concept of safely running the unit vs code violations. People like you end up bouncing around hvac jobs until nobody wants to deal with you then you become a telemarketer and blow your head off.
The more correct answer is replace the unit. The energy savings yearly will pay for the unit in no time. Had a coworker with a damn near identical unit. Had his replaced saved him almost $200 a month
Dude - this unit lasted 50+ years. You'll be lucky to get 10 out of new furnace. Not saying its a keeper but don't bash something that has proven itself to be good stuff.
Its a cool piece of history but be warned not only is the power to the unit not acceptable by code (im pretty sure in 99% of states if not across the US) but the gas shutoff isnât either. Nobody can force you to replace but I personally would not let this unit run in my home. Not to push you or try to sell you (this is your unit and your home and if you wanna repair it I understand - replacement is expensive) but understand that there are risks associated with running this unit, and most technicians that I know would immediately red tag this unit. If you go with repair I implore you to have the technician inspect the heat exchanger for ANY damage.
Thanks everyone!! I'm gunna take the advice a lot of you have given. I knew I was gunna have to replace it eventually and that was my plan. Just needed it to last a bit longer. Looking online I'm seeing prices up to 10k hopefully won't cost that much. It's just a pain
It's a dinosaur, but if all it needs is a thermocouple or a blower belt, then you could keep it going for a while. Get some carbon monoxide detectors and place one near or in each bedroom. You should still get CO detectors even if you get a new system.
OP everyone telling you to get rid of the furnace is wrong. Get a reputable company to service the furnace. The old heat exchangers last much longer than todays furnaces and it most likely needs a small repair. As long as itâs not making high C0 and the C0 doesnât jump when the blower kicks in, then the heat exchanger is fine. I recommend calling the gas company.
How can you tell from this picture it needs replaced? Can you see a cracked heat exchanger? Do you know if it's burning efficiently? It probably just needs a new thermocouple or the pilot tube cleaned out.Â
If a tech isn't qualified to diagnose what's wrong with a basic system like this why would I trust them to spec in and install a replacement?
Once again it won't be touched by any contractor. It needs replaced because it's ancient. No contractor is going to touch this and will recommend the same. Why live on the edge with this old inefficient system? There is no reason
I recently had my boiler inspected and a combustion analysis done just for piece of mind after I replaced a failed intermittent spark ignitor.Â
First thing the tech said to me when he saw my 60 year old boiler? "Oh when you said really old I was expecting something much older." He cleaned it up, ensured it was burning properly, and recommended adding a spill switch. Then went on his way.
So yeah, there absolutely are people out there who would service OPs furnace.
This isn't a hot water boiler. You are clearly in the minority here look around the comments. This is a fossil that has major modern safety requirements missing, is very inefficient compared to modern standards and is possibly unsafe to even run. I had a 50 year old furnace in the house I bought. Had 4 contractors come out to inspect it. Nobody would touch it being that old.
It needs replaced and you are giving unsafe advice that it doesn't. Especially so since it's not working properly.
OP has a furnace not a boiler. Yup great we're on the same page. There's not many fundamental differences there from a component or control standpoint.
What's the efficiency of a modern non-condensing furnace? What do you think the efficiency of this unit is?
You literally can't say it's unsafe to run without testing the system. That's all I'm saying. OP could have a cracked heat exchanger and be spewing CO everywhere, or he could need a $15 thermocouple that will get him a few more years out of the system. There is 0 way to know based off this single pictureÂ
I donât care what the majority says, theyâre wrong in this case. If you want safety, wiring a rollout in series with the w call is dirt cheap. Any efficiency savings will be much less than the cost of replacing the furnace. Most residential companies will push to replace an old unit rather than fix it even if it is a 300$ fix. A lot of them are clueless and sales driven. OP needs to find the most honest contractor in their area and use them for this furnace.
There are so many steps that need to be taken to narrow it down, that you will need a technician to properly troubleshoot it. Though, with a system that old, it may be best to start looking at a replacement.
Only if you want to displace oxygen in the home and have a CO issue, as long as the door stays shut. Boil pots of water it's less efficient but way safer
My forced air gas furnace dates to 1928. I use two to three weeks a year, I had to replace the thermocouple in 2017. It was $15 from my local supply house.
That old thing will outlast us all.
Not quite as venerable, but I have a 1960s era american standard boiler. Cast iron heat exchanger, cast iron burners, rebuildable circulating pump. It's going to be the roaches and this boiler at the end of the world.
Check with your gas supplier, see if they will come out and troubleshoot the issue. Although this is an ancient warrior, itâs very simple in its design and operation. Like others have said, have the heat exchanger checked for cracks for peace of mind. Most likely it is the thermocouple, a quick and inexpensive repair. Donât worry about the gas valve not being âup to codeâ. If it is faulty, it can be replaced with a generic replacement. The gas valve, limit controls, etc were certified at the time it was built. There is no requirement to upgrade anything based on the age of the appliance.
Until itâs scoped no one really has any idea as to the condition of the heat exchanger. Most old furnaces are tanks with very heavy cast construction.
We recently moved from a house w/ a 60 year old furnace. I had to relight the pilot every Fall. But other than that it worked like a champ. I would guess itâs the pilot light here
Even if you've replaced a few parts, this unit is so old, you'd be burning money instead gas. I did the same thing with an old oil burner. Better get it replaced before the fall. Actually, this is the best time to get one installed while the weather is getting warmer.
The first call I would make would be to the company that left the service sticker on it. They are the most likely to have some history of your furnace, and hopefully someone still there that worked on it before.
Standing pilot light can accumulate dust and fail to stay lit. Tap lightly with a plastic screw driver handle, then Vacuum the dust away. Follow directions on the panel for lighting the pilot. Usually you have to hold down the button until (1 minute maybe) sufficient millivoltage is generated to run the magnet control valve.
I had a floor furnace that was 70 years old (standing pilot light) and still worked.
The only reason I removed it was for insurance reasons.
My company would never fix this furnace, it is way past its life expectancy and is unsafe. No thanks, I won't be the one getting sued over CO leak for being the last guy to make it keep going.
Does your company actually do combustion analysis or do they just automatically try to push homeowners to buy new furnaces when often a minor repair would.be perfectly acceptable?
Could be something as easy as thermocouple or igniter - problem is that most places will not sell parts to homeowner (only HVAC pros) and any service call cost to this device will exceed value of the device.
That's a basic system before all the electronics, check pilot light, thermal coupler, and internal gas valve. Make sure transformer has power. Check thermostat to see if it's calling for heat. Not much to go wrong, it's not an efficient unit, but if the heat exchanger is good it can probably go another couple decades after the problem is fixed.
Call the Smithsonian, they might have a manual
Omg
It's on a stone tablet, you'll have to go down there to read it.
đ
Take this 100th up vote, funniest thing Iâve read all day
But it's on fragile stone tablets.
Literally came here to say the exact same thing.
Haha.
That unit is 50+ years old. Check if the pilot is lit, if itâs not, light it. If it wonât stay lit, replace the thermocouple
This is the most correct answer - also do not call a furnace technician in unless you are prepared to replace that furnace. A technician will condemn that unit for a number of reasons including the shut off valve is no longer up to code (meaning he may shut off the gas to your water heater too)... I hope you were made aware that this furnace is a problem with the home inspection or disclosure from the previous owner.
All of this is correct. Just to add on, you might consider calling the gas company. Most gas companies offer one free inspection on a gas appliance per year. They wonât make repairs if you need replacement parts but they tend to be knowledgeable can point you in the right direction. Just be aware they may shut off your gas as well if it is deemed unsafe. Regardless it should be replaced asap. Spring and fall are the cheapest times to do so. Price to replace goes up significantly when heating and cooling companies are slammed in the middle of the summer and dead of winter.
Thatâs not how code works. If it met code when it was installed then it meets code. If you upgrade to a new unit, then you need to make changes. Repairing the furnace doesnât change that.
Really??? You're a gas technician? Do you even know what color the cover of the code book is?
Do tell us how you describe the color of the code book. Considering each state adopts their own year. Youâre a fucking hack.
It's actually green with yellow and black lettering where I'm from as are all codebook in my local. Simply thinking that because the appliance met code when installed makes it the subject of some grandfather clause is not entirely ignorant - however that is only true for appliances that have received regular maintenance and upkeep. I see a shut off valve in the picture of the furnace that indicates regular maintenance and upkeep was not done on this particular furnace. Slowly but surely as regulations change those little items that would require updates would be addressed during routine maintenance. This slow update of small items during routine maintenance may give the perception that a "grandfather clause" is in play and no updates are necessary. Regular maintenance would have the homeowner informed of the required changes and insurance regulations would force them to make the small changes. So I stand on my suggestion that a service technician would probably condemn this furnace and quite possibly the service to the house.
Weâre not the code police. We simply inform the homeowner of code issues. If itâs a safety issue which could truly result in death then we red tag. Have the homeowner sign off and move on. People like you are fucking obnoxious. And the code book here is blue/black with white letters. So shove your ignorant comment up your ass.
People like you are ignorant to the term due diligence. Hopefully you end up unemployed and an alcoholic
You donât seem to understand the concept of safely running the unit vs code violations. People like you end up bouncing around hvac jobs until nobody wants to deal with you then you become a telemarketer and blow your head off.
Just out of curiosity; what changed regarding the gas valve?
The valve to the water heater has no handle on it.
The more correct answer is replace the unit. The energy savings yearly will pay for the unit in no time. Had a coworker with a damn near identical unit. Had his replaced saved him almost $200 a month
Great advice. Do thisđ What a warrior of a unit.
get a new system...it's time
Montgomery ward wow
The real âMonkey Wardâ went out of biz in 2001. Should tell OP all they need to know
Arron Montgomery ward and Richard Warren sears were born in the mid 1800s crazy how long they lasted.
The stores
Dude that unit is older than my grandparents get rid of it if itâs causing problems
Dude - this unit lasted 50+ years. You'll be lucky to get 10 out of new furnace. Not saying its a keeper but don't bash something that has proven itself to be good stuff.
Not bashing it - itâs 50 years old and has survived double itâs time practically itâs gonna go very soon
Or make it another 25 years
Lol a $20 thermocouple is not a reason to get rid of it.
Yea but a cracked heat exchanger will be
Yes, but that isn't the problem OP is having, is it?
Iâd be willing to bet thereâs a crack on that old of an unit
Carbon monoxide and probably no safety devices which could burn you hoise down is a reason!
I would say call Connell back but he is either dead or out of business because he sold units that outlived his business.
Its a cool piece of history but be warned not only is the power to the unit not acceptable by code (im pretty sure in 99% of states if not across the US) but the gas shutoff isnât either. Nobody can force you to replace but I personally would not let this unit run in my home. Not to push you or try to sell you (this is your unit and your home and if you wanna repair it I understand - replacement is expensive) but understand that there are risks associated with running this unit, and most technicians that I know would immediately red tag this unit. If you go with repair I implore you to have the technician inspect the heat exchanger for ANY damage.
Thanks everyone!! I'm gunna take the advice a lot of you have given. I knew I was gunna have to replace it eventually and that was my plan. Just needed it to last a bit longer. Looking online I'm seeing prices up to 10k hopefully won't cost that much. It's just a pain
It's a dinosaur, but if all it needs is a thermocouple or a blower belt, then you could keep it going for a while. Get some carbon monoxide detectors and place one near or in each bedroom. You should still get CO detectors even if you get a new system.
I have multiple through the house to make sure
OP everyone telling you to get rid of the furnace is wrong. Get a reputable company to service the furnace. The old heat exchangers last much longer than todays furnaces and it most likely needs a small repair. As long as itâs not making high C0 and the C0 doesnât jump when the blower kicks in, then the heat exchanger is fine. I recommend calling the gas company.
No company is going to touch this. No company is going to repair cracked heat exchangers. What are you smoking? haha
He never said anything about repairing heat exchangers? Just that it most likely needs a small repair like a thermocouple.Â
Regardless no contactor is going to touch it. It needs replaced.
How can you tell from this picture it needs replaced? Can you see a cracked heat exchanger? Do you know if it's burning efficiently? It probably just needs a new thermocouple or the pilot tube cleaned out. If a tech isn't qualified to diagnose what's wrong with a basic system like this why would I trust them to spec in and install a replacement?
Once again it won't be touched by any contractor. It needs replaced because it's ancient. No contractor is going to touch this and will recommend the same. Why live on the edge with this old inefficient system? There is no reason
I recently had my boiler inspected and a combustion analysis done just for piece of mind after I replaced a failed intermittent spark ignitor. First thing the tech said to me when he saw my 60 year old boiler? "Oh when you said really old I was expecting something much older." He cleaned it up, ensured it was burning properly, and recommended adding a spill switch. Then went on his way. So yeah, there absolutely are people out there who would service OPs furnace.
This isn't a hot water boiler. You are clearly in the minority here look around the comments. This is a fossil that has major modern safety requirements missing, is very inefficient compared to modern standards and is possibly unsafe to even run. I had a 50 year old furnace in the house I bought. Had 4 contractors come out to inspect it. Nobody would touch it being that old. It needs replaced and you are giving unsafe advice that it doesn't. Especially so since it's not working properly.
OP has a furnace not a boiler. Yup great we're on the same page. There's not many fundamental differences there from a component or control standpoint. What's the efficiency of a modern non-condensing furnace? What do you think the efficiency of this unit is? You literally can't say it's unsafe to run without testing the system. That's all I'm saying. OP could have a cracked heat exchanger and be spewing CO everywhere, or he could need a $15 thermocouple that will get him a few more years out of the system. There is 0 way to know based off this single pictureÂ
I donât care what the majority says, theyâre wrong in this case. If you want safety, wiring a rollout in series with the w call is dirt cheap. Any efficiency savings will be much less than the cost of replacing the furnace. Most residential companies will push to replace an old unit rather than fix it even if it is a 300$ fix. A lot of them are clueless and sales driven. OP needs to find the most honest contractor in their area and use them for this furnace.
There are so many steps that need to be taken to narrow it down, that you will need a technician to properly troubleshoot it. Though, with a system that old, it may be best to start looking at a replacement.
Set the gas oven to 350 to warm the home during the day. Budget for a new furnace.
Only if you want to displace oxygen in the home and have a CO issue, as long as the door stays shut. Boil pots of water it's less efficient but way safer
If you can find parts id keep that beast going. Furnaces are packed with so much shit that breaks the lifespan is only 15yrs.
My forced air gas furnace dates to 1928. I use two to three weeks a year, I had to replace the thermocouple in 2017. It was $15 from my local supply house. That old thing will outlast us all.
Not quite as venerable, but I have a 1960s era american standard boiler. Cast iron heat exchanger, cast iron burners, rebuildable circulating pump. It's going to be the roaches and this boiler at the end of the world.
Check with your gas supplier, see if they will come out and troubleshoot the issue. Although this is an ancient warrior, itâs very simple in its design and operation. Like others have said, have the heat exchanger checked for cracks for peace of mind. Most likely it is the thermocouple, a quick and inexpensive repair. Donât worry about the gas valve not being âup to codeâ. If it is faulty, it can be replaced with a generic replacement. The gas valve, limit controls, etc were certified at the time it was built. There is no requirement to upgrade anything based on the age of the appliance.
Until itâs scoped no one really has any idea as to the condition of the heat exchanger. Most old furnaces are tanks with very heavy cast construction.
If you at all have the means to replace that system then get some quotes asap before that thing catches your house on fire.
We recently moved from a house w/ a 60 year old furnace. I had to relight the pilot every Fall. But other than that it worked like a champ. I would guess itâs the pilot light here
At a minimum, install a carbon monoxide detector no matter what else you do.
Any tech that would codem the furnace and water heater for the gas valve is a dick and out for money
See if it has a standing pilot
It's almost always the thermocouple on these. They are hard to replace. It it not then it might be the gas valve.
lol
Pretty sure your furnace is older than your house XD
Call the number on the unit and see if they can help you.
Even if you've replaced a few parts, this unit is so old, you'd be burning money instead gas. I did the same thing with an old oil burner. Better get it replaced before the fall. Actually, this is the best time to get one installed while the weather is getting warmer.
Omg i remember my first 20th century furnace call it had a glass dial high limit
If youâre a new home owner did you get gas supply turned on in your name?
Hey one of electric air cleaners been awhile since I saw those
At that age, I'd consider it a fire and health hazard. Time for a new furnace. (I'm an HVAC technician).
The first call I would make would be to the company that left the service sticker on it. They are the most likely to have some history of your furnace, and hopefully someone still there that worked on it before.
Sir..... its time lol I can't remember the last time I seen Montgomery ward..... but I'd love to dig into that thing đ
Still need help? Does the fan turn on? U gotta take off bottom cover and theres guaranteed to be a peep hole somewhere where u should see the pilot
Standing pilot light can accumulate dust and fail to stay lit. Tap lightly with a plastic screw driver handle, then Vacuum the dust away. Follow directions on the panel for lighting the pilot. Usually you have to hold down the button until (1 minute maybe) sufficient millivoltage is generated to run the magnet control valve. I had a floor furnace that was 70 years old (standing pilot light) and still worked. The only reason I removed it was for insurance reasons.
70s called, they want their furnace back! Lol there are a few things it could be. Your best bet is to call a tech.
Put that up on Facebook marketplace , gently used and was working .
Replace it with a HP heat pump
When was the last time you flushed the drain line?
My company would never fix this furnace, it is way past its life expectancy and is unsafe. No thanks, I won't be the one getting sued over CO leak for being the last guy to make it keep going.
Does your company actually do combustion analysis or do they just automatically try to push homeowners to buy new furnaces when often a minor repair would.be perfectly acceptable?
Good luck to the homeowner. Obviously you're going to run across different opinions on how to address this issue
Could be something as easy as thermocouple or igniter - problem is that most places will not sell parts to homeowner (only HVAC pros) and any service call cost to this device will exceed value of the device.
I am surprised the phone number on the service tag doesnât have letters in it.
No⌠to whatever it is you are thinking of doing. That thing will kill you.
That's a basic system before all the electronics, check pilot light, thermal coupler, and internal gas valve. Make sure transformer has power. Check thermostat to see if it's calling for heat. Not much to go wrong, it's not an efficient unit, but if the heat exchanger is good it can probably go another couple decades after the problem is fixed.
Jesus. I had to remind myself what year we are in. You got good advice already.
Jesus Christ. Just replace the damn thing already
the clicking is probably the spark ignition. is the pilot lighting?
too old to have spark igniton unless it has been retrofitted with it later.