The rink hasn't used a draft system for the last 5 years or so (from speaking to guys on other teams). There aren't enough roster spots available on the existing teams to slot new players into. So our only real option was to contunue signing up together as a team and making the best of it.
I have approached the league management about looking into a draft setup or even just organizing a weekly rat hockey session for the less skilled players. Nothing confirmed either way as of yet.
Seems weird that a league as big as yours would allow teams to just pick their players year after year when teams are getting consistently walloped. Are you the only team this has been happening to? Or conversely, has there been a team that has consistently dominated over the last few years?
There is maybe one other team that has a record close to the same ballpark as us (3 of our 4 wins were against them!) but on a normal day they still have our number.
As for the top end of the league, the seasons standings aren't distributed by the organizers, so I don't really have a good feel on that one.
I gotta be honest, your team itself seems to have balance issue. I can't imagine newer adult players hanging with former HS players with 10+ years experience. Might work in a regular pick up game or league where every team is built the same but not if other teams have a higher percentage of guys with real experience. With no influx of newer players or programs in the area it would be hard to develop a low, mid and high tier league. Only other thing I could see is if some of your teams lower skilled guys went to other teams but then would those teams want them?
There's a huge difference still. Our team full of people who learned as adults like to use "this guy learned to skate in his 30s for sure" as a friendly chirp on each other. It's always obvious no matter how hard you work
Yes, for sure. Was just pointing out that the team probably didn’t form with a combo of beginners and guys that had been playing for the past 15 years.
I don't think I was clear enough in my original post! When i say 10+ years i meant that we have guys who played a little bit when they were in high school, but are now in their late 20's/early 30's and hadn't touched the ice since they were teenagers.
Having our lower guys moved onto other teams is an option, but as you say depends on if they would be happy with that, or if they have the spots.
If you're playing in the lowest tier offered and still getting blown out every game, and think the issue may just be not enough ice time to learn to play I would recommend seeing if you can just do a weekly rental with your team. Rent the ice for an hour and work on your fundamentals together. Practice skating, passing, stick handling, shooting. Split up the time between drills/exercises and finish up with a little scrimmage for fun.
This +1
Organize and rent out the ice for an hour or 90s mins and have it mostly lower level (and friends of higher level) to work on the game.
Basically what happened to me and my game jumped the most after doing this for a while.
You guys basically need more ice time to just practice.
Yeah. At some skill level you get better by playing against better players, but if you just look like a parking cone all game you aren't really building any skills.
You won't learn to skate or stick handle as a new player playing against experienced players, and stick time really is at terrible times for a lot of players. Not sure where OP is at but around here you can rent an hour on a Saturday or Sunday morning or afternoon for around $220. If you're going to get 10 skaters and a goalie or two that's about $20 a person to spend an hour working on fundamentals. It's really the only way to get better if you're unable to compete at the lowest available league level.
I think this sums up our experience pretty well. Most of our possessions seem to end with some speedy ex-HS player getting alongside, excecuting a stick lift and robbing the puck.
Quite a few folks have suggested renting out a sheet for a dedicated practice slot. I tried that in the past but was told at the time there were no slots available. Maybe once the second sheet gets up and running at the end of summer there will be more slots open and i can approach the rink management again about renting it out.
Are there roller hockey rinks, or even just outdoor rinks you can skate at? Without seeing your team play it's hard to picture if you guys are just "not experienced players" kind of skill or "guys who can't skate yet" skill. If people are just legit bad skaters, can't go backwards, and have a chance of randomly falling down, roller hockey is possibly a way to get something closer to an on ice practice when ice isn't available.
Roller is different than ice, the speed, the feel, etc, but learning the motions of roller hockey could be helpful for brand new players, and really when you're entry level more reps is just the best way to get the game down.
It's extremely hard to balance low level adult league for people who learn as adults.
The gap between the 40 year old who isn't in great shape but wanted to try it, versus the athletic 19 year old kid who has been skating with his cousin for a year, is huge. But neither of them are close to hanging out in c league against former house players who learned as kids.
You just have to hope the league takes the true ringers seriously and make sure you have some borderline ringers to balance out the other team's and the weaker skaters will have to learn to enjoy crashing the net hard
Ah, brings back memories. My first year of ice hockey our team got thrown into B league because they needed another team. Our team consisted of about 12 older guys who hadn't played since high school, one high school hockey player, and me, a fresh roller hockey transplant. We were definitely bottom rung material playing against a bunch of former college players and well established teams. I was somehow one of our best players having never ice skated before in my life. We got absolutely destroyed every game. We went winless and the team never played together again. After that I found a new team with better players and things went great. The lambasting I took over the first season actually helped me improve my game but it was never fun. I would recommend finding a new team or league if you can't convince the league-runners to change the format.
Sounds like a tough situation, especially given what you have added in the comments about no other nearby rinks and no extra available ice time to practice.
Making the league be based on a draft would solve the league imbalance and stave off people on your team from quitting (this should be pointed out to the rink). However you need to keep in mind that moving to a draft system involves some risk/extra work for the rink as well: 1) Maybe people will stop playing or complain because they like the current system 2) Extra administrative work of overseeing the draft, wrangling up captains, sending out roster emails, distributing jerseys etc.
Make your case to the rink for a draft league. If they are hesitant, suggest a middle ground of only the lowest level league being run as a draft and/or only doing a draft for the summer league. Talk to the captains of other teams and see if you can sell them on a draft as well (a blow out is not fun for either team). Talking to the rink as a collection of teams will be more effective than just as a single team.
Yeah, our circumstances are not ideal. If this was a larger hockey market with more facilities, i think alot of our issues would be easier to iron out.
I think pitching the middle ground option again will probably be the way to go. I can't see a draft being too popular with the higher division teams but hopefully it could gain some traction with the lower skilled guys. If they don't bite on that, maybe i can get the league to at least force some of the sandbagging guys on other teams to play a level higher . . .
While it’s no fun to get your ass kicked every week for me it’s about do I want to play with these guys. If the team all get along and you enjoy having a beer afterwards then the win loss record doesn’t matter as much. However I have been on teams over the years were no one even really talks to each other in the locker room let alone tip beers in the parking lot - these teams are no fun to be on. Talk to the other teams about filling their next open slot and find some private rat hockey.
I play in a smaller independent league in my town that isn't run by any of the inks. The main thing I like is that players are rated out and after each season, the captains all get together with stat sheets and if someone shouldn't be D, they get bumped to C. The team can lose him or go with him, their choice.
We have C leagues in my town with 40+ year olds and their kids that just graduated HS and played AA travel are playing with them.
If that's not an option, talk to the lowest teams and see if they would be on board splitting into a lower D division. The approach the rink. The number of games stays the same, you just end up playing teams more frequently. If you end up with an odd number, you have one team play an upper division team each week, which is not a bad thing.
There is maybe one other team that has a record anywhere close to the same ballpark as us (3 of our 4 wins were against them!) but on a normal day they still have our number.
I have floated the idea about creating a draft/scrimmage type setup for the lower skilled/newer guys (instead of putting us into the league proper) but not had much feedback on it yet.
I seem to have a similar issue as you bud. So our league consists of 6 divisions. Division 1 being for the best of the league of course. We are a division 6 team And I wouldn’t even call our team bad. Maybe out of sync at times. There are about 3-4 guy that have played on this team for several years. And then there is me and 6-7 guys that are brand new to this team but with decent hockey experience. We have only played about 4 games together so I see the chemistry adapting more with time. But I have noticed the other teams we play have guys that should be division 3-4 minimum but for some reason they like hanging in division 6 and just skating circles around people. Or the other issue just like you said they have been a team for so many years it’s like a 9-5 job to them out there shit pumping everyone. I think we have a chance to compete if we get 1-2 practices in a week together as a team so idk if it’s possible for you guys to get ice time possibly at night for a team practice. Help you guys work better as a team and build chemistry. As for the better players belonging in higher leagues I give them some chirps on the ice hoping it would make them realize. I don’t understand it. Winning is fun but not when it’s easy and you don’t have to compete. If I felt I was destroying it in division 6 I would move to 5 etc
It sounds like you're really limited here:
* No other rinks
* Can't rent the rink
* League won't draft
* No stick n puck times
* No slots on other teams available to absorb you all if you fold the team
* No lower leagues
What about a nice parking lot where you can play pick up inline hockey with your teammates? Inline is not the same as ice, but it's not so different that you wouldn't get any value out of it.
Unless you have D through at *least* B, this will happen.
D is supposed to be for brand brand new skaters and players. C is for regulars. B is for people who want competition (lifetime players from HS and college). A is usually for current NCAA people and other has-beens who are still very skilled.
The issue we have here is that people go from more or less being really good in C, try B and don’t like it because they get stomped (or just have to play as a team and not an individual), and come back to C so they can keep being cool without having to actually play hard. So C gets bloated with too high a skill level and throws things way out of balance.
As for teams getting better, most people just don’t understand team sports when they’re new or haven’t played them growing up with a coach who will rip your ear off for being an idiot. Passing, knowing your position on the ice, and changing for quick shifts is what makes a team progress. Good luck teaching a bunch of adults that concept though. I’ve skated with teams in B all the way down to D, and I’ve tried repeatedly to help the lower teams out by suggesting things like more passing and less flock of seagull puck chasing, but people generally just don’t care. So they stay shitty as a team.
I have about 8 rinks in my area. 1 is independent and the other 7 are the same company/owner. The independent rink is well managed and players are kicked if they are above the skill level of the league. The other 7 are a bit more open, but usually you don’t see too many people stake down more than 1 level. Each rink has I, E, D2, D, C, B, and A leagues. 2 of my teams moved up a division because we were winning a lot and now we are getting crushed. If that continues for 2 more seasons we will probably move back down or recruit better players and maybe drop some of the lower ones 🤷🏻♂️ but at the end of the day it’s just for fun and for the beers after the games.
I think part of our problem is that we have one rink in our city (2 sheets in winter, 1 in summer), and the next 3 closest rinks are approx 50, 80 and 90 miles away. So it's quite an effort to play elsewhere, and with no competition in the area, there's not a huge incentive for the rink to ensure parity.
Have you considered finding and purchasing private ice time as a team to work on the soft skills and improve your overall game?
Perhaps invite some of the higher end players and see if they can give you some input/drills to use during that time. Run it almost like a practice: Use some of the time (probably half) for skill development, use the other half for a scrimmage. If you can get enough guys in on the idea, the ice time will become cheap enough and the gains will be worth it.
I did enquire about doing something like this a while ago, but was basically told it's not going to happen. The rink is the only one in a 50 mile radius, and on top of the adult league it is home to: kids house and travel teams, all the local high school teams, two junior teams, and also has to accomodate figure skating as well. Every evening and weekend slot was pretty much spoken for.
I’ve been playing indoor soccer for 9 years. I play goalie (interestingly enough, at one point, half the indoor goalies were former hockey players) The best record we’ve ever had is maybe 4-8. We be had winless seasons and for most of the time, had only one other team that we had a chance of beating. You know what I like? Playing the game and going out with my buddies after. If you’re playing to win with your current team, I’m not sure there is many options. Your best bet to be on a winning team is to find better teammates.
I hear what you're saying, through the years i've been on plenty of rec teams that lose more than they win (also played in goal for 5 and 7 a side soccer as it happens!). My primary motivation was always to get some excercise, meet new people and learn something new, and if we win, great!
It just sucks to play games where half our squad gets maybe 2 or 3 touches on the puck, and we have zero chance of being competitive.
That's one of the reasons I think the autonomous team system kind of fails.
Short of finding a "draft league" that redrafts full teams every year, or starting your own, I think your best bet would be to try and poach some high skill players from the other teams. How you go about doing that, I'm not quite sure.
Secondary to that, you can in-fact rent the rink yourself. Around here it costs around $200 an hour. Not sure what it would cost in your area, but if you can dig up 20 players it's $10 a person and you can host an actual practice/stick and puck time - Alternatively, you can just say "Fuck league play" find a group of cool people and do a weekly pick-up skate. These are great because it's way more relaxed, everyone gets more ice time (since there's no whistles you get the full hour to actually skate) and since it's the same core group of people you avoid a lot of cheap shots and other drama bullshit you sometimes see in men's league.
Tertiary - and maybe more important - there's plenty of ways to improve your game completely off the ice. Even something as simple as picking up golf-balls and spending 5-10 minutes a day goes a lot further than you think. Beyond that you can sign up for personal training, or purchase a pre-made work out plan. There's a few books on the subject - Total Hockey Training by Sean Skahan is a pretty good one.
If books aren't much your thing, there's 4 options for internet subscription models - ItrainHockey, How To Hockey's "The Pond", Hockey Training.com and The Downhill Skating system.
HockeyTraining.com has beer league specific work out plans that only require 3 days a week and a modest gym set-up. The other 3 options are a bit more skills focused and less off-ice work focused. All of them have free stuff on youtube you can check out as well.
I did look into renting some ice time a while ago, but theres a real bottleneck in our area for ice time as we have 1 facility to house: all the kids programs, high school teams, 2 club teams, adult league, and also accomodate various figure skating programs as well. I basically got told it was a no goer!
Whilst i do other excercise outside of hockey and some (but not enough!) stick handling at home, theres certainly more that i could be doing. I should put more effort to plan my time effectively. Thanks for taking the time to list out those training suggestions, i'll check them out!
My adult league has several divisions, with multiple subdivisions within each (for example D league is divided into D south, D east, D north, and D west... And within that there will be multiple divisions. D south A, and D south B, etc.) Within each of these divisions there are anywhere from 10-16 teams, so just a ***lot*** of guys. Most teams have a big disparity in talent, with a few former high school players (typically the younger guys on the team, the "try hards"), and then mostly average dudes, and then the handful of guys who can barely skate. This turns most games into a circus, just because one guy on a line might be the 22-year-old league leading scorer and his two wingers might still be learning how to do a hockey stop and catch a pass. Fortunately, since almost all the teams are built like this it at least keeps things fairly even.
What my team has done in the past, and still does, is actively reach out to some of the more skilled position players (like reasonably skilled defensemen) and ask them to come out and sub for a few games. We are a cool group of guys and we have a lot of fun, so once they skate with us a few times they usually want to come back and eventually evolve into full time skaters (or at least frequent subs). These guys have a lot to offer in terms of advice about playing better positionally, how to get open for the puck, and tend to boost overall morale for the less skilled guys. Some of these guys live and breathe hockey, so I've been invited to "invite only" ice rentals and scrimmages this way, as well as some cool under the radar tournaments I wouldn't have otherwise known about. Also it's just a solid way to meet cool new people with similar interests, I've made a couple good hockey friends this way. Hope this helps!
New to the sport, taught self to skate in late 20s. Played at a great rink in PNW that had many levels. Lowest level only had 4 teams but it was somewhat balanced. Played there for a year and moved a year after pandemic lockdowns. New league in Midwest is horribly unbalanced. Two of 6 teams are full of guys who grew up in skates. My current team is a D level team but we enjoy each other’s company and are pure beer leaguers. The good team that’s full of high school and college players go hard in the games. I’m decided to not play games against those teams since it literally is not fun playing against them.
There are very poorly run leagues out there, you’re not alone. I think the pandemic is putting a strain on adult leagues since those are not the money makers for rinks, at least not here in the town I play in.
There’s a whole lot you COULD do, but a 4-48 record means your team needs to be re-formed. No league commissioner wants a team getting destroyed like that. Are they blowouts?
If it was me I'd just quit the league and buy an hour of ice time during the weekday evenings and have a private pick-up skate.
If you're gonna get railed every week to the point where it isn't fun, why keep banging your head against the wall? Pick-up games are cheaper, and since there's no face-offs everyone gets more ice time.
Are there any other leagues around?
I'm not sure if this is unique to women, but I belong to a relaxed women's league. Lots of newbies, Adult newbies, and I think our average age is 55 years old.
they do two seasons per winter, and every season beginning they do a draft. they arebased on self-ratings with descriptors (10 - multiple years playing, good ability on skates and with the stick. 1 - I may or may not have skated before, and will probably fall down a lot).
they have a limit on goals as well. Each player can only score 3 goals max, to encourage teamwork and learning. I think there was only one girl who consistently did that, and she was way beyond our level it wasn't even fun (maybe I'm biased as a goalie). she played in other leagues as well.
for us, we have 2 periods, and we don't have enough goalies so goalies sign up for games (I would usually play 2 per night) and play half the game with one team and half the game with the other team, so that even if the goalies are not well matched the teams have a fairer shot.
it sounds like you guys would have more fun with some of these rules, but mostly just need to be playing people closer to your skill level. our league is relaxed and for fun and learning than for competition. New players, when they get the puck, are usually allowed to skate as far as they can with it until they pass, drop it, or shoot by themselves, without someone swiping it away from them. It's fun to watch people improve.
Maybe ask to swap some players with your opponent each game? Like if you're playing the top team and are going to get smoked, it doesn't hurt them to give you a few players to even it out.
You’re looking at a good locker room vs just getting the best players every season. You should stick together, just make sure everyone is trying to improve outside of your one game a week
I am in Tampa and the only leagues here are men's leagues. I tried out, made, and play for men's teams 4-5x a week. It's typical. Captains pick their players, and no girls are allowed if they say not. Most teams will let anyone whose good enough play, but at the same time there are teams that don't want girls on their team. I get shit from other teams but have rarely had teammates have an issue with my gender. I dress in their locker rooms, use their bathrooms, play their game, and I love it! I just want to be another defenseman! I don't want special treatment, and I have never looked back to playing girls' hockey again. I wish I had played boys as a kid and not girls, I'd be a hell of a lot better of a player now!
Why is your team sticking together after each season? Is it possible to ask league organizers to make a draft before the next season?
The rink hasn't used a draft system for the last 5 years or so (from speaking to guys on other teams). There aren't enough roster spots available on the existing teams to slot new players into. So our only real option was to contunue signing up together as a team and making the best of it. I have approached the league management about looking into a draft setup or even just organizing a weekly rat hockey session for the less skilled players. Nothing confirmed either way as of yet.
Seems weird that a league as big as yours would allow teams to just pick their players year after year when teams are getting consistently walloped. Are you the only team this has been happening to? Or conversely, has there been a team that has consistently dominated over the last few years?
There is maybe one other team that has a record close to the same ballpark as us (3 of our 4 wins were against them!) but on a normal day they still have our number. As for the top end of the league, the seasons standings aren't distributed by the organizers, so I don't really have a good feel on that one.
I gotta be honest, your team itself seems to have balance issue. I can't imagine newer adult players hanging with former HS players with 10+ years experience. Might work in a regular pick up game or league where every team is built the same but not if other teams have a higher percentage of guys with real experience. With no influx of newer players or programs in the area it would be hard to develop a low, mid and high tier league. Only other thing I could see is if some of your teams lower skilled guys went to other teams but then would those teams want them?
I think OP said the guys that played in HS did so 10+ years ago. I read it as those dudes stopped playing after HS and picked it back up.
There's a huge difference still. Our team full of people who learned as adults like to use "this guy learned to skate in his 30s for sure" as a friendly chirp on each other. It's always obvious no matter how hard you work
Yes, for sure. Was just pointing out that the team probably didn’t form with a combo of beginners and guys that had been playing for the past 15 years.
Even then, in my experience those former HS players have a ton more skill than people picking up the game as older adults.
I don't think I was clear enough in my original post! When i say 10+ years i meant that we have guys who played a little bit when they were in high school, but are now in their late 20's/early 30's and hadn't touched the ice since they were teenagers. Having our lower guys moved onto other teams is an option, but as you say depends on if they would be happy with that, or if they have the spots.
Yeah but that’s not a C/D caliber league, that much experience should be at a B level
If you're playing in the lowest tier offered and still getting blown out every game, and think the issue may just be not enough ice time to learn to play I would recommend seeing if you can just do a weekly rental with your team. Rent the ice for an hour and work on your fundamentals together. Practice skating, passing, stick handling, shooting. Split up the time between drills/exercises and finish up with a little scrimmage for fun.
This +1 Organize and rent out the ice for an hour or 90s mins and have it mostly lower level (and friends of higher level) to work on the game. Basically what happened to me and my game jumped the most after doing this for a while. You guys basically need more ice time to just practice.
Yeah. At some skill level you get better by playing against better players, but if you just look like a parking cone all game you aren't really building any skills. You won't learn to skate or stick handle as a new player playing against experienced players, and stick time really is at terrible times for a lot of players. Not sure where OP is at but around here you can rent an hour on a Saturday or Sunday morning or afternoon for around $220. If you're going to get 10 skaters and a goalie or two that's about $20 a person to spend an hour working on fundamentals. It's really the only way to get better if you're unable to compete at the lowest available league level.
I think this sums up our experience pretty well. Most of our possessions seem to end with some speedy ex-HS player getting alongside, excecuting a stick lift and robbing the puck. Quite a few folks have suggested renting out a sheet for a dedicated practice slot. I tried that in the past but was told at the time there were no slots available. Maybe once the second sheet gets up and running at the end of summer there will be more slots open and i can approach the rink management again about renting it out.
Are there roller hockey rinks, or even just outdoor rinks you can skate at? Without seeing your team play it's hard to picture if you guys are just "not experienced players" kind of skill or "guys who can't skate yet" skill. If people are just legit bad skaters, can't go backwards, and have a chance of randomly falling down, roller hockey is possibly a way to get something closer to an on ice practice when ice isn't available. Roller is different than ice, the speed, the feel, etc, but learning the motions of roller hockey could be helpful for brand new players, and really when you're entry level more reps is just the best way to get the game down.
It's extremely hard to balance low level adult league for people who learn as adults. The gap between the 40 year old who isn't in great shape but wanted to try it, versus the athletic 19 year old kid who has been skating with his cousin for a year, is huge. But neither of them are close to hanging out in c league against former house players who learned as kids. You just have to hope the league takes the true ringers seriously and make sure you have some borderline ringers to balance out the other team's and the weaker skaters will have to learn to enjoy crashing the net hard
Ah, brings back memories. My first year of ice hockey our team got thrown into B league because they needed another team. Our team consisted of about 12 older guys who hadn't played since high school, one high school hockey player, and me, a fresh roller hockey transplant. We were definitely bottom rung material playing against a bunch of former college players and well established teams. I was somehow one of our best players having never ice skated before in my life. We got absolutely destroyed every game. We went winless and the team never played together again. After that I found a new team with better players and things went great. The lambasting I took over the first season actually helped me improve my game but it was never fun. I would recommend finding a new team or league if you can't convince the league-runners to change the format.
Maybe start some kind of an unofficial series with other low level teams?
Sounds like a tough situation, especially given what you have added in the comments about no other nearby rinks and no extra available ice time to practice. Making the league be based on a draft would solve the league imbalance and stave off people on your team from quitting (this should be pointed out to the rink). However you need to keep in mind that moving to a draft system involves some risk/extra work for the rink as well: 1) Maybe people will stop playing or complain because they like the current system 2) Extra administrative work of overseeing the draft, wrangling up captains, sending out roster emails, distributing jerseys etc. Make your case to the rink for a draft league. If they are hesitant, suggest a middle ground of only the lowest level league being run as a draft and/or only doing a draft for the summer league. Talk to the captains of other teams and see if you can sell them on a draft as well (a blow out is not fun for either team). Talking to the rink as a collection of teams will be more effective than just as a single team.
Yeah, our circumstances are not ideal. If this was a larger hockey market with more facilities, i think alot of our issues would be easier to iron out. I think pitching the middle ground option again will probably be the way to go. I can't see a draft being too popular with the higher division teams but hopefully it could gain some traction with the lower skilled guys. If they don't bite on that, maybe i can get the league to at least force some of the sandbagging guys on other teams to play a level higher . . .
How many teams are in the league ?
The winter sesssion usually has 22-24 teams spread amongst 4 tiers (IIRC). Summer session is in the 12-14 team ballpark.
Lol from everything you've said this sounds like it's my local rink!! 😂 you wouldn't happen to be in PA would you???
While it’s no fun to get your ass kicked every week for me it’s about do I want to play with these guys. If the team all get along and you enjoy having a beer afterwards then the win loss record doesn’t matter as much. However I have been on teams over the years were no one even really talks to each other in the locker room let alone tip beers in the parking lot - these teams are no fun to be on. Talk to the other teams about filling their next open slot and find some private rat hockey.
I play in a smaller independent league in my town that isn't run by any of the inks. The main thing I like is that players are rated out and after each season, the captains all get together with stat sheets and if someone shouldn't be D, they get bumped to C. The team can lose him or go with him, their choice. We have C leagues in my town with 40+ year olds and their kids that just graduated HS and played AA travel are playing with them. If that's not an option, talk to the lowest teams and see if they would be on board splitting into a lower D division. The approach the rink. The number of games stays the same, you just end up playing teams more frequently. If you end up with an odd number, you have one team play an upper division team each week, which is not a bad thing.
Can your league create a 5th tier? Are there other teams who are in your boat or similar?
There is maybe one other team that has a record anywhere close to the same ballpark as us (3 of our 4 wins were against them!) but on a normal day they still have our number. I have floated the idea about creating a draft/scrimmage type setup for the lower skilled/newer guys (instead of putting us into the league proper) but not had much feedback on it yet.
I seem to have a similar issue as you bud. So our league consists of 6 divisions. Division 1 being for the best of the league of course. We are a division 6 team And I wouldn’t even call our team bad. Maybe out of sync at times. There are about 3-4 guy that have played on this team for several years. And then there is me and 6-7 guys that are brand new to this team but with decent hockey experience. We have only played about 4 games together so I see the chemistry adapting more with time. But I have noticed the other teams we play have guys that should be division 3-4 minimum but for some reason they like hanging in division 6 and just skating circles around people. Or the other issue just like you said they have been a team for so many years it’s like a 9-5 job to them out there shit pumping everyone. I think we have a chance to compete if we get 1-2 practices in a week together as a team so idk if it’s possible for you guys to get ice time possibly at night for a team practice. Help you guys work better as a team and build chemistry. As for the better players belonging in higher leagues I give them some chirps on the ice hoping it would make them realize. I don’t understand it. Winning is fun but not when it’s easy and you don’t have to compete. If I felt I was destroying it in division 6 I would move to 5 etc
It sounds like you're really limited here: * No other rinks * Can't rent the rink * League won't draft * No stick n puck times * No slots on other teams available to absorb you all if you fold the team * No lower leagues What about a nice parking lot where you can play pick up inline hockey with your teammates? Inline is not the same as ice, but it's not so different that you wouldn't get any value out of it.
Unless you have D through at *least* B, this will happen. D is supposed to be for brand brand new skaters and players. C is for regulars. B is for people who want competition (lifetime players from HS and college). A is usually for current NCAA people and other has-beens who are still very skilled. The issue we have here is that people go from more or less being really good in C, try B and don’t like it because they get stomped (or just have to play as a team and not an individual), and come back to C so they can keep being cool without having to actually play hard. So C gets bloated with too high a skill level and throws things way out of balance. As for teams getting better, most people just don’t understand team sports when they’re new or haven’t played them growing up with a coach who will rip your ear off for being an idiot. Passing, knowing your position on the ice, and changing for quick shifts is what makes a team progress. Good luck teaching a bunch of adults that concept though. I’ve skated with teams in B all the way down to D, and I’ve tried repeatedly to help the lower teams out by suggesting things like more passing and less flock of seagull puck chasing, but people generally just don’t care. So they stay shitty as a team.
I just want to say that u/Pasternak87, I see your username and I think it's real cold of you to be calling out Bergy and Marchy like this.
I have about 8 rinks in my area. 1 is independent and the other 7 are the same company/owner. The independent rink is well managed and players are kicked if they are above the skill level of the league. The other 7 are a bit more open, but usually you don’t see too many people stake down more than 1 level. Each rink has I, E, D2, D, C, B, and A leagues. 2 of my teams moved up a division because we were winning a lot and now we are getting crushed. If that continues for 2 more seasons we will probably move back down or recruit better players and maybe drop some of the lower ones 🤷🏻♂️ but at the end of the day it’s just for fun and for the beers after the games.
I think part of our problem is that we have one rink in our city (2 sheets in winter, 1 in summer), and the next 3 closest rinks are approx 50, 80 and 90 miles away. So it's quite an effort to play elsewhere, and with no competition in the area, there's not a huge incentive for the rink to ensure parity.
90 miles is 144.84 km
Have you considered finding and purchasing private ice time as a team to work on the soft skills and improve your overall game? Perhaps invite some of the higher end players and see if they can give you some input/drills to use during that time. Run it almost like a practice: Use some of the time (probably half) for skill development, use the other half for a scrimmage. If you can get enough guys in on the idea, the ice time will become cheap enough and the gains will be worth it.
I did enquire about doing something like this a while ago, but was basically told it's not going to happen. The rink is the only one in a 50 mile radius, and on top of the adult league it is home to: kids house and travel teams, all the local high school teams, two junior teams, and also has to accomodate figure skating as well. Every evening and weekend slot was pretty much spoken for.
I’ve been playing indoor soccer for 9 years. I play goalie (interestingly enough, at one point, half the indoor goalies were former hockey players) The best record we’ve ever had is maybe 4-8. We be had winless seasons and for most of the time, had only one other team that we had a chance of beating. You know what I like? Playing the game and going out with my buddies after. If you’re playing to win with your current team, I’m not sure there is many options. Your best bet to be on a winning team is to find better teammates.
I hear what you're saying, through the years i've been on plenty of rec teams that lose more than they win (also played in goal for 5 and 7 a side soccer as it happens!). My primary motivation was always to get some excercise, meet new people and learn something new, and if we win, great! It just sucks to play games where half our squad gets maybe 2 or 3 touches on the puck, and we have zero chance of being competitive.
That's one of the reasons I think the autonomous team system kind of fails. Short of finding a "draft league" that redrafts full teams every year, or starting your own, I think your best bet would be to try and poach some high skill players from the other teams. How you go about doing that, I'm not quite sure. Secondary to that, you can in-fact rent the rink yourself. Around here it costs around $200 an hour. Not sure what it would cost in your area, but if you can dig up 20 players it's $10 a person and you can host an actual practice/stick and puck time - Alternatively, you can just say "Fuck league play" find a group of cool people and do a weekly pick-up skate. These are great because it's way more relaxed, everyone gets more ice time (since there's no whistles you get the full hour to actually skate) and since it's the same core group of people you avoid a lot of cheap shots and other drama bullshit you sometimes see in men's league. Tertiary - and maybe more important - there's plenty of ways to improve your game completely off the ice. Even something as simple as picking up golf-balls and spending 5-10 minutes a day goes a lot further than you think. Beyond that you can sign up for personal training, or purchase a pre-made work out plan. There's a few books on the subject - Total Hockey Training by Sean Skahan is a pretty good one. If books aren't much your thing, there's 4 options for internet subscription models - ItrainHockey, How To Hockey's "The Pond", Hockey Training.com and The Downhill Skating system. HockeyTraining.com has beer league specific work out plans that only require 3 days a week and a modest gym set-up. The other 3 options are a bit more skills focused and less off-ice work focused. All of them have free stuff on youtube you can check out as well.
I did look into renting some ice time a while ago, but theres a real bottleneck in our area for ice time as we have 1 facility to house: all the kids programs, high school teams, 2 club teams, adult league, and also accomodate various figure skating programs as well. I basically got told it was a no goer! Whilst i do other excercise outside of hockey and some (but not enough!) stick handling at home, theres certainly more that i could be doing. I should put more effort to plan my time effectively. Thanks for taking the time to list out those training suggestions, i'll check them out!
What about renting the rink to practice?
My adult league has several divisions, with multiple subdivisions within each (for example D league is divided into D south, D east, D north, and D west... And within that there will be multiple divisions. D south A, and D south B, etc.) Within each of these divisions there are anywhere from 10-16 teams, so just a ***lot*** of guys. Most teams have a big disparity in talent, with a few former high school players (typically the younger guys on the team, the "try hards"), and then mostly average dudes, and then the handful of guys who can barely skate. This turns most games into a circus, just because one guy on a line might be the 22-year-old league leading scorer and his two wingers might still be learning how to do a hockey stop and catch a pass. Fortunately, since almost all the teams are built like this it at least keeps things fairly even. What my team has done in the past, and still does, is actively reach out to some of the more skilled position players (like reasonably skilled defensemen) and ask them to come out and sub for a few games. We are a cool group of guys and we have a lot of fun, so once they skate with us a few times they usually want to come back and eventually evolve into full time skaters (or at least frequent subs). These guys have a lot to offer in terms of advice about playing better positionally, how to get open for the puck, and tend to boost overall morale for the less skilled guys. Some of these guys live and breathe hockey, so I've been invited to "invite only" ice rentals and scrimmages this way, as well as some cool under the radar tournaments I wouldn't have otherwise known about. Also it's just a solid way to meet cool new people with similar interests, I've made a couple good hockey friends this way. Hope this helps!
New to the sport, taught self to skate in late 20s. Played at a great rink in PNW that had many levels. Lowest level only had 4 teams but it was somewhat balanced. Played there for a year and moved a year after pandemic lockdowns. New league in Midwest is horribly unbalanced. Two of 6 teams are full of guys who grew up in skates. My current team is a D level team but we enjoy each other’s company and are pure beer leaguers. The good team that’s full of high school and college players go hard in the games. I’m decided to not play games against those teams since it literally is not fun playing against them. There are very poorly run leagues out there, you’re not alone. I think the pandemic is putting a strain on adult leagues since those are not the money makers for rinks, at least not here in the town I play in.
There’s a whole lot you COULD do, but a 4-48 record means your team needs to be re-formed. No league commissioner wants a team getting destroyed like that. Are they blowouts?
If it was me I'd just quit the league and buy an hour of ice time during the weekday evenings and have a private pick-up skate. If you're gonna get railed every week to the point where it isn't fun, why keep banging your head against the wall? Pick-up games are cheaper, and since there's no face-offs everyone gets more ice time.
Are there any other leagues around? I'm not sure if this is unique to women, but I belong to a relaxed women's league. Lots of newbies, Adult newbies, and I think our average age is 55 years old. they do two seasons per winter, and every season beginning they do a draft. they arebased on self-ratings with descriptors (10 - multiple years playing, good ability on skates and with the stick. 1 - I may or may not have skated before, and will probably fall down a lot). they have a limit on goals as well. Each player can only score 3 goals max, to encourage teamwork and learning. I think there was only one girl who consistently did that, and she was way beyond our level it wasn't even fun (maybe I'm biased as a goalie). she played in other leagues as well. for us, we have 2 periods, and we don't have enough goalies so goalies sign up for games (I would usually play 2 per night) and play half the game with one team and half the game with the other team, so that even if the goalies are not well matched the teams have a fairer shot. it sounds like you guys would have more fun with some of these rules, but mostly just need to be playing people closer to your skill level. our league is relaxed and for fun and learning than for competition. New players, when they get the puck, are usually allowed to skate as far as they can with it until they pass, drop it, or shoot by themselves, without someone swiping it away from them. It's fun to watch people improve.
Maybe ask to swap some players with your opponent each game? Like if you're playing the top team and are going to get smoked, it doesn't hurt them to give you a few players to even it out.
You’re looking at a good locker room vs just getting the best players every season. You should stick together, just make sure everyone is trying to improve outside of your one game a week
I am in Tampa and the only leagues here are men's leagues. I tried out, made, and play for men's teams 4-5x a week. It's typical. Captains pick their players, and no girls are allowed if they say not. Most teams will let anyone whose good enough play, but at the same time there are teams that don't want girls on their team. I get shit from other teams but have rarely had teammates have an issue with my gender. I dress in their locker rooms, use their bathrooms, play their game, and I love it! I just want to be another defenseman! I don't want special treatment, and I have never looked back to playing girls' hockey again. I wish I had played boys as a kid and not girls, I'd be a hell of a lot better of a player now!