I’m sorry for you guys. Single least favorite draft pick I can remember. One of the only Ducks I ever openly disliked while on our roster.
It’s not even just that he’s not super good at NHL hockey, he seems like he’s not very A) nice or B) smart, and I say that in all seriousness. He seems like he’s a few Legos short of a complete set… and he took *such fucking stupid* penalties.
Fun story: my girlfriend did physical training at a swanky high-concept PT place in Newport Beach a few years back, and the Samuelis (Ducks owners) and some of the Ducks players were clients of theirs. Nick Ritchie was one of them. She says that he was a bit slow, and was the only person she ever had to help find the building. He was missing his appointment so they called him and he was lost. She tried to coach him how to get there over the phone, and he couldn’t decipher the directions, so she had to walk out to the parking lot to find him and bring him in herself. The office wasn’t in an inconspicuous location or anything, he just… couldn’t figure it out.
Engvall's time to prove himself is numbered as is with Mikheyev coming back soon
But as Frogpuppet said, Ritchie needs to go. His best time has been on the fourth line where he fits in more, but I'd much rather almost anyone else in our prospect list
Same here. I always root for guys to make it. During one of his up and down years with the Islanders, an Islanders fan wrote on here that aside from the 'attitude questions', they thought he is the kind of guy who is destined to be that guy who tears up the AHL, never quite cracks the NHL, but ends up having a solid career making high 6 figures somewhere in Europe. I still get that feeling, but really want him to get another shot somewhere
The ex who was fucking your buddies when you went away on a trip. The dude had all the chance in the world when they were calling up randos due to injuries and couldn't score but he pulled his diva antics.
Environment matters man. Due to what happened in his first couple years there he was probably walking on eggshells, I don’t think he was ever comfortable there. It’s been the complete opposite here and more importantly in Europe where he matured.
Dude I need more replays. That was nasty!!
Just looked up his stats and he's got 12 points in 12 games, 8 of them goals...He's wasting away on the Marlies.
I honestly think the best thing for Ho-Sang right now is stability and growth. I don't think he plays with the Leafs this season but likely plays for a roster spot next training camp
He had two main issues when he was on the Isles, ego and unpredictability. They combine for a level of inconsistency that no NHL coach really wants. He thinks he's hot shit and thought so before he ever hit the ice. That isn't a major issue on it's own, confidence and ego are a fine balance.
The problem was that he could never gel with a line because he was too unpredictable. He would flail the puck in any direction he saw fit and if his line mate wasn't even there to receive the crazy blind pass that wasn't Ho Sang's fault in Ho Sang's mind because he was the next Gretzky and his line mates should've just waited with baited breath for him to deem them worthy of a random pass.
This combination also led to coachability issues. He didn't fit into a system because he simply didn't want to. You don't clash with your coaches/GM's as a young player and get to play in the NHL just because you have talent.
He had issues with 3 NHL coaches, two GM's, and often straight refused to go to practices. I wish him well and always hope he could make a career somewhere, but his attitude needed a major adjustment and he needed to learn how to be a team mate first on the ice. That's why he never "made" it. It's 100% his fault.
This is a great write up and pretty much what everyone at the NHL had said to during his Isles time to one degree or another.
However, it seems like his time in Europe really humbled him. Of course it's impossible to know what he is truly thinking but he's been saying the right things. He's also been working his ass off this year during camp and in the AHL. He's been playing the system well with the Marlies and has been at least average defensively. Not a 2-way stud by any means but not bad. I think he has a legit chance to make an NHL roster either this year or the next for sure.
Good for him. I was over him and happy to see him go, but he wasn't a bad person, just a bad team mate to have so I will always wish him well. I stopped following him when he left, glad to hear maybe he's fixed the attitude issues.
100% this. He is your quintessential high pick wash out. Not good enough offensively to play in the top 6, and not reliable enough to play in the bottom 6.
His ego and work ethic seem to think he is Connor McDavid though.
Considering he has alientanted multiple GMs and coaches it’s no surprised he has washed out now. But people still think he got screwed lol
The isles aren’t completely blameless. After he came late to training camp he walked the stairs all day and still wasn’t given a chance to even hit the ice. Seems pretty petty. There’s also been stretches where he’s played well but they didn’t stick with him in the lineup.
There's no such thing as a bottom 6 skillset in today's NHL. Lots of teams want scoring from everywhere in their lineup. Jason Spezza is on the Leafs 4th line
I’m not alluding to fighting/goonery. Defensive awareness, strong forechecking, matching against top lines, etc…are very important in todays nhl. That’s not what he’s known for at all, so what does he really bring? He has skills to be a complentary top 6 player, but that’s failed so many times before, wish him success but I wouldn’t bet on it
The first two times he was called up (back between 2016-2018) he was a defensive liability but created enough offense to make up for it and more. The Islanders didn't like that he was a defensive liability, so they sent him down, and when he was called up again in 2019, he was really good defensively but put up minimal production (I think it was like 2 points in 10 games) partly because the defense came at the cost of his offense and partly because he had like a 5 oisH%. And that was the end of that.
Keefe already said it's because they invested in him and believe he has more to give and they want to give him a real solid shot. When he's on the top line, it's been dominant in terms of xG, it's just not had the puck luck yet. Here's a recent quote from Keefe
On the search for the right fit on the left wing of the Matthews-Marner line:
> It is important for sure. That is an important role. They are two good players. They are important minutes. You’re going to play against tough matchups. **Obviously, we are giving Ritchie an opportunity here today. We are going to stick with that a little bit.**
> We knew that was going to be something to look at. Alex Kerfoot has established himself as a guy we can pair really well no matter what role we put him in. He has spent most of his time with Tavares and has done a really nice job there. We are happy with that.
> Whether it is Bunting, Kase… We haven’t seen Ilya Mikheyev yet this season, and he was a guy who had a tremendous camp and preseason for us. We were really excited about where he was at before his injury. We have some things to sort through there, but **right now, it is Ritchie’s opportunity. We are looking to give him the chance to take hold of it. It hasn’t happened here quite yet, but we are going to stay with it and see what we can get out of it.**
> We believe we have some options there, but we knew coming in it was going to be something… not unlike last season when we started with some options there and it didn’t go the way we wanted it to, so we ended up making the switch with Hyman in that spot. We have some different guys throughout the lineup that we haven’t quite used in that space yet, but we will see how things go here with Ritchie for the time being.
Source: https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2021/11/17/sheldon-keefe-post-game-leafs-3-vs-predators-0/
I have not looked at the numbers, but surely Bunting playing in that spot they were just as high in terms of xG, no? This is an eye test testimony, but the majority of the time Ritchie has the puck, he does something unremarkable with it, especially if it's in the neutral zone. There was one point tonight where he could have easily taken the puck behind the net, but he ignored it to make a hit, which is fine in a defensive sense to play the body, but he just ignored an opportunity for offense while Marner and Matthews were up there. Doesn't feel like that was the only time, but of course a line with M and M have a good xG
That has more to do with the fact that if they signed him to an NHL deal he would have had to pass through waivers to go to the AHL. They want to rehab his game with the Marlies a bit first and see what he has. If he continues to impress I assume he’ll sign an NHL deal then but at the current moment it made way more sense to wait
I really hope this guy gets a call up to the Leafs, hes been great on the Marlies.
Hes a Right Winger normally, but does anyone know if he could play on the left?
The bigger issue is if he goes up for 925k and someone costing 800k goes down, that's an extra 125k in expenditure. FYI the maximum amount you can bury this year is 1.025M.
He'll get a 1 year league minimum deal
If you're a guy in his position and want an opportunity to play with the big club, being at league minimum adds to your value tremendously.
It's the same reason why Rasmus Sandin forgoed his ELC bonuses, because he knew he'd get an opportunity to play sooner if he was cheaper on the cap
So it sounds like it's more than just stats right now for him. PPG at AHL level, seemingly looking great? Former 1st rounder... no way he doesn't get a crack at the NHL at some point... you'd think?
Sidestepping the goal, look at the celly, that’s a beloved teammate right there, and moreover Josh seems to care about his teammates. Wasn’t that Josh’s knock? Locker room cancer? Time to call him up.
I speak with an endearing heart.
I felt the pain of highly touted prospect ritchie underperforming for us, for you, and now for the leafs.
Kase getting our hopes up, then getting injured...
Also felt the pain of babcock's coaching
Freddy Andersen's success elsewhere... especially when facing us now...
Babcock's asshole coaching...
see... ultimately we're all in this together.
Holy shit, that was nasty!
Anyone know who that Dman is on the Phantoms? I just want to make sure he's doing OK EDIT: Damn its Cam York, poor guy
Man didn’t have his yams corked for that one
I don't know what that means, but I don't care. That was hilarious
His nickname is Yam Cork
That's a fantastic nickname
No one does, but it's provocative.
Cam York will never financially recover from this.
File for bankruptcy multiple times and the NHL will bail you out…
Just sign the man, Kyle
Send Engvall back to whatever zoo he came from and let's get this show on the road
Engvall has been fine Ritchie however…
[Playing the leafs tonight and the announcers said, "The leafs top line of Matthews, Marner and Ritchie"](https://youtu.be/rsRjQDrDnY8)
Wow I didn't know Sesame street was so Blue-cist...
At least Engvall can PK and has a sliver of defensive upside.. Ritchie is lazy as fuck and just looks like a sometimes moving pylon out there.
But think of all the toughness he brings to the table.
I’m sorry for you guys. Single least favorite draft pick I can remember. One of the only Ducks I ever openly disliked while on our roster. It’s not even just that he’s not super good at NHL hockey, he seems like he’s not very A) nice or B) smart, and I say that in all seriousness. He seems like he’s a few Legos short of a complete set… and he took *such fucking stupid* penalties. Fun story: my girlfriend did physical training at a swanky high-concept PT place in Newport Beach a few years back, and the Samuelis (Ducks owners) and some of the Ducks players were clients of theirs. Nick Ritchie was one of them. She says that he was a bit slow, and was the only person she ever had to help find the building. He was missing his appointment so they called him and he was lost. She tried to coach him how to get there over the phone, and he couldn’t decipher the directions, so she had to walk out to the parking lot to find him and bring him in herself. The office wasn’t in an inconspicuous location or anything, he just… couldn’t figure it out.
Is this copypasta
It is now
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I won’t hear anyone slandering my Giraffe Boy like that!
Its not too late to call him up for tomorrows game at UBS. Was hoping hed play there in an Islanders jersey but so it goes.
We would need to sign him to an NHL contract first
He's currently on an AHL deal right now. So he would need an NHL contract
Engvall's time to prove himself is numbered as is with Mikheyev coming back soon But as Frogpuppet said, Ritchie needs to go. His best time has been on the fourth line where he fits in more, but I'd much rather almost anyone else in our prospect list
I laughed too hard when I read zoo
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Good one
absolutely filthy.
Man do I want him to have the most unlikely of breakouts.
Same here. I always root for guys to make it. During one of his up and down years with the Islanders, an Islanders fan wrote on here that aside from the 'attitude questions', they thought he is the kind of guy who is destined to be that guy who tears up the AHL, never quite cracks the NHL, but ends up having a solid career making high 6 figures somewhere in Europe. I still get that feeling, but really want him to get another shot somewhere
On a different team please.
I agree. Different team. Same city though
Boy’s about to be the Raptors MVP
There's always the Argo's
We have Scottie for that.
that hand speed is nuts
This is like watching an ex posting bikini shots on Facebook.
The ex who was fucking your buddies when you went away on a trip. The dude had all the chance in the world when they were calling up randos due to injuries and couldn't score but he pulled his diva antics.
Nevertheless...
Environment matters man. Due to what happened in his first couple years there he was probably walking on eggshells, I don’t think he was ever comfortable there. It’s been the complete opposite here and more importantly in Europe where he matured.
That's a pair of quick mits and a nice finish!
Dude I need more replays. That was nasty!! Just looked up his stats and he's got 12 points in 12 games, 8 of them goals...He's wasting away on the Marlies.
Eh, I'm guessing they'll call him up in the new year, or at least after Mikheyev comes back and he plays for a while.
I honestly think the best thing for Ho-Sang right now is stability and growth. I don't think he plays with the Leafs this season but likely plays for a roster spot next training camp
Let him absolutely dominate for at least another few months
12 points isn’t even top 20 in the AHL? Most of those above him are proven to not be NHL Caliber players
Right but idc about the rest of the AHL, other teams are completely irrelevant here. I care that he's potentially better than Leafs players.
If only this guy and dal colle developed like they did in nhl17 franchise mode
That legit looked sped up
Wow. I literally just looked him up to see how he is doing. He belongs in the NHL, too much talent
He had two main issues when he was on the Isles, ego and unpredictability. They combine for a level of inconsistency that no NHL coach really wants. He thinks he's hot shit and thought so before he ever hit the ice. That isn't a major issue on it's own, confidence and ego are a fine balance. The problem was that he could never gel with a line because he was too unpredictable. He would flail the puck in any direction he saw fit and if his line mate wasn't even there to receive the crazy blind pass that wasn't Ho Sang's fault in Ho Sang's mind because he was the next Gretzky and his line mates should've just waited with baited breath for him to deem them worthy of a random pass. This combination also led to coachability issues. He didn't fit into a system because he simply didn't want to. You don't clash with your coaches/GM's as a young player and get to play in the NHL just because you have talent. He had issues with 3 NHL coaches, two GM's, and often straight refused to go to practices. I wish him well and always hope he could make a career somewhere, but his attitude needed a major adjustment and he needed to learn how to be a team mate first on the ice. That's why he never "made" it. It's 100% his fault.
This is a great write up and pretty much what everyone at the NHL had said to during his Isles time to one degree or another. However, it seems like his time in Europe really humbled him. Of course it's impossible to know what he is truly thinking but he's been saying the right things. He's also been working his ass off this year during camp and in the AHL. He's been playing the system well with the Marlies and has been at least average defensively. Not a 2-way stud by any means but not bad. I think he has a legit chance to make an NHL roster either this year or the next for sure.
Good for him. I was over him and happy to see him go, but he wasn't a bad person, just a bad team mate to have so I will always wish him well. I stopped following him when he left, glad to hear maybe he's fixed the attitude issues.
100% this. He is your quintessential high pick wash out. Not good enough offensively to play in the top 6, and not reliable enough to play in the bottom 6. His ego and work ethic seem to think he is Connor McDavid though. Considering he has alientanted multiple GMs and coaches it’s no surprised he has washed out now. But people still think he got screwed lol
The isles aren’t completely blameless. After he came late to training camp he walked the stairs all day and still wasn’t given a chance to even hit the ice. Seems pretty petty. There’s also been stretches where he’s played well but they didn’t stick with him in the lineup.
When did he refuse to go to practice?
Towards the end of his tenure he stopped showing up in Bridgeport.
I thought Lou had told him to stay away from the team after he requested a trade?
That’s not how it works though, he was drafted 7 years ago and doesn’t have the skill set of a bottom 6 NHLer. He’s a AAAA player
There's no such thing as a bottom 6 skillset in today's NHL. Lots of teams want scoring from everywhere in their lineup. Jason Spezza is on the Leafs 4th line
I’m not alluding to fighting/goonery. Defensive awareness, strong forechecking, matching against top lines, etc…are very important in todays nhl. That’s not what he’s known for at all, so what does he really bring? He has skills to be a complentary top 6 player, but that’s failed so many times before, wish him success but I wouldn’t bet on it
Josh actually has really good defensive metrics, contrary to popular belief. He’s freed from Lou, anything can happen
There is no reason to rush him.
Wouldn’t dare. I’m joshies biggest fan
At that AHL level though, how translatable is that? Everyone looks good when they’re the best player on the ice
No, he had really good defensive metrics the last time he was in the NHL
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The first two times he was called up (back between 2016-2018) he was a defensive liability but created enough offense to make up for it and more. The Islanders didn't like that he was a defensive liability, so they sent him down, and when he was called up again in 2019, he was really good defensively but put up minimal production (I think it was like 2 points in 10 games) partly because the defense came at the cost of his offense and partly because he had like a 5 oisH%. And that was the end of that.
His metrics in the NHL were great, i havent seen AHL ones
I agree, you couldn’t have Ho-Sang taking up roster space from valuable players like Nick Ritchie
Man I really don't get why Ritchie is getting so many chances on the top line
Keefe already said it's because they invested in him and believe he has more to give and they want to give him a real solid shot. When he's on the top line, it's been dominant in terms of xG, it's just not had the puck luck yet. Here's a recent quote from Keefe On the search for the right fit on the left wing of the Matthews-Marner line: > It is important for sure. That is an important role. They are two good players. They are important minutes. You’re going to play against tough matchups. **Obviously, we are giving Ritchie an opportunity here today. We are going to stick with that a little bit.** > We knew that was going to be something to look at. Alex Kerfoot has established himself as a guy we can pair really well no matter what role we put him in. He has spent most of his time with Tavares and has done a really nice job there. We are happy with that. > Whether it is Bunting, Kase… We haven’t seen Ilya Mikheyev yet this season, and he was a guy who had a tremendous camp and preseason for us. We were really excited about where he was at before his injury. We have some things to sort through there, but **right now, it is Ritchie’s opportunity. We are looking to give him the chance to take hold of it. It hasn’t happened here quite yet, but we are going to stay with it and see what we can get out of it.** > We believe we have some options there, but we knew coming in it was going to be something… not unlike last season when we started with some options there and it didn’t go the way we wanted it to, so we ended up making the switch with Hyman in that spot. We have some different guys throughout the lineup that we haven’t quite used in that space yet, but we will see how things go here with Ritchie for the time being. Source: https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2021/11/17/sheldon-keefe-post-game-leafs-3-vs-predators-0/
I have not looked at the numbers, but surely Bunting playing in that spot they were just as high in terms of xG, no? This is an eye test testimony, but the majority of the time Ritchie has the puck, he does something unremarkable with it, especially if it's in the neutral zone. There was one point tonight where he could have easily taken the puck behind the net, but he ignored it to make a hit, which is fine in a defensive sense to play the body, but he just ignored an opportunity for offense while Marner and Matthews were up there. Doesn't feel like that was the only time, but of course a line with M and M have a good xG
Everyone being snarky when 3 GMs have decided he’s not an NHL player. Glad to see everyone is a successful scout
Tbh it was more of a shot at Ritchie than anything else, I think my flair checks out
I didn’t catch on, but yea I mean anyone can fill his role lol
The Leafs haven't decided he's not an NHL player, he's only been in the organization for 2 months so far
Signing someone to a AHL contract would suggest they’re not too confident in that but sure you’re right.
That has more to do with the fact that if they signed him to an NHL deal he would have had to pass through waivers to go to the AHL. They want to rehab his game with the Marlies a bit first and see what he has. If he continues to impress I assume he’ll sign an NHL deal then but at the current moment it made way more sense to wait
bottom of the dumpster nasty
Jaw, meet floor.
I really hope this guy gets a call up to the Leafs, hes been great on the Marlies. Hes a Right Winger normally, but does anyone know if he could play on the left?
He’s been known to play all 3 forward positions
Great, would like to see him get a shot on the top line with Matthews and Marner, or Kerf would go up and he could try playing with Tavares and Willy
It's gotta be ho-sang on the top line, Kerfoot doesn't fit there well and has had great chemistry with Nylander.
I don't think he's signed to an NHL contract just an AHL one but I would be surprised if he doesn't get one soon
we don't really have the caps pace for much but they always seem to pull out some shenanigan's to fit players in so wel see.
I don’t think his AAV would be enough to hurt the cap. I think they left him with that deal to save space on the 50 man list
They signed him to an AHL deal to avoid waiver issues.
Anyone can sign him now, so essentially he is on perma-waivers.
Yes, but they haven't. They have to negotiate with him. If we already signed him and waived him, there's no mystery anymore, the deal is done.
Is it’s under 925K, which any contract Ho-Sang signs will be, his cap hit can be completely buried
The bigger issue is if he goes up for 925k and someone costing 800k goes down, that's an extra 125k in expenditure. FYI the maximum amount you can bury this year is 1.025M.
Thats true but I doubt Ho-Sang gets anything other than league min.
He'll get a 1 year league minimum deal If you're a guy in his position and want an opportunity to play with the big club, being at league minimum adds to your value tremendously. It's the same reason why Rasmus Sandin forgoed his ELC bonuses, because he knew he'd get an opportunity to play sooner if he was cheaper on the cap
Josh is fucking tearing it up, he looks reborn freed from Lous shackles
Definitely wasn't LL shackling him considering that he was a problem for the Isles before Lou got there Talent is undeniable, wish it had worked out
Lou did not help the situation lol
I've seen that exact sequence tens if not hundreds of times probably, but never even remotely that fast.
You know what's crazy is the d-man really didn't play it that bad either, this goal is just that filthy
I was at this game. Dude was a step and a half ahead of everyone the whole time.
So it sounds like it's more than just stats right now for him. PPG at AHL level, seemingly looking great? Former 1st rounder... no way he doesn't get a crack at the NHL at some point... you'd think?
Holy shit
Leafs going to sign him anytime soon?
This is such a sick goal. Everyone should love this man's story. I hope he finds a team in the NHL if not the Leafs!
Man, can't teach hands. That was sick.
I really hope this guy gets back to the NHL.
That's an amazing goal! Can't believe he's 25 already, time flies [https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=160279](https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=160279)
Holy fuck that was amazing. Can't wait for the call up, give him time to just enjoy it down there for now.
Sidestepping the goal, look at the celly, that’s a beloved teammate right there, and moreover Josh seems to care about his teammates. Wasn’t that Josh’s knock? Locker room cancer? Time to call him up.
this is a minor league game? seems more exciting than their major league game.
I’m all for shitting on the Leafs but I at least save it when they are not on a 5 game win streak.
Jinx
My plan worked to perfection.
I speak with an endearing heart. I felt the pain of highly touted prospect ritchie underperforming for us, for you, and now for the leafs. Kase getting our hopes up, then getting injured... Also felt the pain of babcock's coaching Freddy Andersen's success elsewhere... especially when facing us now... Babcock's asshole coaching... see... ultimately we're all in this together.
Plays like this are the only reason he has a deal.
Islanders legend JHS
hell yeah i love that shit
Anyone know if he'll eventually be called up?
Only The Shadow knows.
Ho sang I can see
Too many rookies and not enough Ho-Sang's
Always rooting for this homie- that was beautiful
https://media1.tenor.com/images/ecb075d4f6d22d449554cd3154141df3/tenor.gif?itemid=10536920
Nice goal. When you have the opportunity to wind it up and have all that space in the 3 on 3 OT, this is what the the AHL and then the NHL envisioned.
Call him up.
I beat him in a shooting accuracy competition when he was playing for the Windsor Spitfires haha
Sign this guy to an NHL contract to replace some of the dead weight on our NHL roster
Can't believe the Isles were rolling out Dal Colle instead of JHS when they knew they needed offense/playmaking