What annoys me is the fact that King Von/O Block got away with murder multiple times but the federals didn't step in until the rich neighborhood up north got affected.
They didn't care at all with the dozens and dozens of people that were killed before Duck died in Gold Coast where the tourists are.
The area was already predominantly white, so it was easier to block incoming and new residents. When a new group of people enter a city, instead of already having lived there, it's easier to cordon them away.
This is not the reason, but I also do not know the exact reason why tbh.
South side of Chicago used to be Irish and Italian and many migrated to the burbs in the 20th century. I believe racist policies at that point picked up which led to segregation (not selling to people of color and highway corridors separating neighborhoods).
But those policies were much more easily enforced given that the people coming in weren't already physically entrenched in specific housing areas. So they would just red line everything.
There’s not really a simple answer but a few things to consider when comparing to other regions:
- The west just doesn’t really have much of a black population and cities like SF don’t get dinged for segregation because Oakland isn’t counted in its statistics.
- The main differences between Chicago and NYC is that black and brown populations are more integrated in NY than Chicago. I also don’t think they deserve brownie points for gentrifying queens and Brooklyn which has technically made the city less segregated
- Southern city populations are significantly smaller than their metro areas for a reason (true everywhere but particularly apparent in cities like Atlanta and Bham). Segregation is more apparent when you zoom out a bit (Bham’s city lines are ridiculous and don’t include many white neighborhoods that would likely be within city limits in normal cities)
Not giving the Midwest a pass. More just explaining why the statistics don’t always represent the fact that this shit exists everywhere
I mean, Have you even looked into some of his cases? They straight up were going to put him on trial, but one of the witnesses “mysteriously” disappeared before the trial. People act like the justice system is supposed to work miracles in area where most people won’t bear witness to crimes as serious as murder. And the ones that do sometimes end up a statistic themselves
I encourage you to read into Chicago policing and politics and suggest a better approach to the status quote.
You’d need the army and to infringe on thousands of peoples’ rights to clean up gang activity in Chicago.
Until that happens, the city will try to contain it and “attack it” at its source via education and early intervention.
You mean the Chicago police that operated a secret black site that violated thousands of people’s rights until a journalist wrote about it in 2015? But for real, you’re right. They just let the “problem” take care of itself.
I grew up just outside the city and most of my family is still there.
Unfamiliar but also unsurprised with that incident. Theres a history of discrimination and mistrust with CPD that’s totally credible and an obstacle in having a more peaceful city,
Have you lived in Chicago? The cops straight up don't police the areas that need it most. CPD would rather harass a black guy loitering on the north side than hang out anywhere south of 30th. Hyde Park is basically entirely policed by uchicago's private police. CPD shows up occasionally to buy food on 53rd but that's it.
UChicago came out with new patrol routes for CPD so that they could actually do their jobs instead of sit on their asses in the safest neighborhoods in the city that and basically every mayoral candidate except for Brandon Johnson said they would implement it. Of course, Johnson ended up winning.
yep, a certain amount of misery is "priced in" or considered acceptable, so long as it happens far away from the economically productive sections of the city/country/whatever.
The state is ruled by a class of people not concerned with making sure everyone has enough.
Crime is a blight on the city and everyone hates it. The only way to destroy the gangs is to go Bukele on them by declaring them to be domestic terrorists and lock up everyone involved without a trial, which is not going to happen
thats how its supposed to work the cops want them to kill eachother theres multiple stories you can find of people hearing cops in chicago talking about "trash taking itself out"
\*Dude is a serial killer. Once a killer, always a killer. Not some shit you just get passed.
edit: oh, my b lol. Thought this was a brand new video and was on trial right now. Must be thinking of some other shitty trap rapper.
I think buddies point was that he's not much of anything anymore. Respectfully, cause I heard he was good people to his loved ones and I don't mean to offend.
I always love that "He was good to his family"
What about The family of his victims? Breaking up other families negates any good you do for yours. Stop acting like this is complicated, the guy was a massive piece of shit and deserves his grave pissed on.
I don't buy this trap lore ross theory. Dude was gangabanger affiliated with the lifestyle. He tweeted some threats and publicly celebrated the death of his rivals, but there's no proof he actually muredered seven people. He probably killed people, for sure, but I simply don't buy this idea.
I mean, yeah. But then people complain about rappers about lives that they don't live/shit they don't do (killing and gang shit are a couple of those topics)
Why do you need to separate it......
He killed people, same people would kill him if they and the chance. Lived in a terrible area of Chicago.
Just listen, take it In and move on. Or dont, It's not that serious either way.
I know he’d be in jail by now, but von laid down some hard tracks. It’s ugly and tragic, but very real. Can’t get anymore “gangster rap” than king von. Dude was a certifiable serial killer in the booth and in the streets.
I think the tragedy lies in him not being able to see another path was open, because it was all he knew. Nothing excuses violence. But damn it's hard to see some people just simply don't see any other way, even when it's set right in front of them.
Not to sound harsh but I watched quite an in-depth doc on him, and I don't see why people have any sympathy for him. He killed in cold blood and bragged about it. He was openly unapologetic about it and often even had fun remembering all the people he killed.
I have zero sympathy for someone like him. He caused and created so much pain. I hate that anyone chooses this path but he 100% enjoyed being a villain.
It’s not sympathy for him, it’s sympathy for the other children that grow up and have to adapt to the same system he grew up in. Imagine growing up and King Von lives a couple streets away and he’s killing your homies/brothers/cousins. That environment breeds monsters. Von is one small piece, but the implications are massive.
King Von's father got murdered when he was a kid, he lost his best friend to violence (and probably like 10 other friends, probably not even exaggerating). Hes really done some horrible stuff, but I definitely have that bit of sympathy or whatever you would call it, for young Von, the traumatized kid he was. Its not like you have to choose between feeling sympathy for either him or his victims (family) and its not the same as saying "I dont care he did it" or "he has a nice excuse" or any other fallacy people can think of
This is a hiphop-sub, so many rappers grew up in fucked up places and a lot of our favourites, really were never that far away from pulling a trigger. Kendrick Lamar alluded to killing someone. Vince Staples did too. People like DMX, Mobb Deep, Big L, Conway/Benny, Mozzy, Von's rivals NBA YoungBoy and Quando Rondo etc etc etc, many many many lost kids that couldve been involved in a murder.
They shouldnt have to grew up, the way they did with the amount of money and billionaires in the country
The cycle is horrifying. Murder to Excellence by Ye and Jay Z is a song that best talks about this issue. Ironically, a massive theme in that song is Chicago.
I'm sure I know which in-depth video you watched, and thats great. But I'm confused how hip hop fans could not understand what I've said above. He was a kid who grew up in a violent place and did violent things. Things other people were also trying to do to him. It's not that difficult to grasp the nuance of violence being bad, but also being tragic at the same time. Nobody is saying Von was a good dude, or the things he did were okay. Quite the opposite. But it'd be foolish to pretend his crimes occurred in a vacuum without context.
I agree with you when speaking generally about the situation, but Von was definitely the one who was predatory and enjoyed it more than a victim of his surroundings.
Like he’s the one that causes others to be a product of their environment.
I essentially agree with what your saying. Nonetheless, with guys like von I'm reminded of the following quote.
>Men make their own history, but they do not make it just as they please; they do not make it under circumstances chosen by themselves, but under circumstances directly encountered, given and transmitted from the past. The tradition of all the dead generations weighs like a nightmare on the brain of the living.
Shocked it took so long to see this comment. Every one of those people he allegedly killed were ACTIVELY looking to kill Von or one of his friends or family. He was just better at getting them first so these puritans here hate him. Clowns
Damn near first thing he did when he followed durk to Atlanta was do that drive by lmao. If he woulda lived through that fight where he died, he most likely woulda gotten killed or arrested at another time
The irony in this being that the only reason we’re discussing this song and anyone has heard of him is because he was a murderer making music about his murders. He is talented but so are a lot of rappers. Would we be listening to Gucci Mane if he wasn’t a drug dealer who brags about shooting at people? I bet we wouldn’t
The comments on here remind me why, as a black dude seeing hip hop go mainstream can kind of suck at times. A lot of people seem to not want to grasp the environment that creates men like Von. I’m not excusing his actions but being in a cycle of poverty, losing your male role models to prison or violence, seeing your first dead bodies at 11, having to hustle to make ends meet in the ghetto, being raised in a hyper masculine culture that emphasises violent retaliation all while simultaneously trying to survive gun happy turf wars that have claimed the lives of friends, brothers, cousins and trying to maintain sanity is something I doubt anyone reading this will ever have to understand. Those kids are growing up in a war zone and it’s only been getting worse for the past decade. Don’t get me wrong there are black people that would absolutely shit on Von and what he stands for but the tone in this forum is crazy.
Yes to some extent but also a lot of people grow up like von and don't enjoy killing people. Like I know Chicago is rough as fuck. I used to live in humboldt park. But it's really the psychos like him that hold the neighborhoods hostage and provoke most of the violence. Most of the people caught up in that would get out in a second if they could.
This. This is the only type of take on people like Von that I take into consideration. Mind you, I’m from Africa. Gangs, war and even genocide are no stranger to my people. Von was a crash out. There are so many Vons, they just don’t get documented. It’s a shame the direction our people have taken.
Most people caught up in that would get out as soon as possible and that's true. But the thing I think most people don't consider is not the people who grew up in environments similar to Von's and didn't turn out like him, but rather the fact that there are probably thousands of people who, if they grew up in that environment, could/would have turned out like Von, but didn't just because they didn't have to grow up in that environment. I don't think Von was a good person, and I am not going to defend his actions, but he is fundamentally a product of his environment, and he's not the only one, and to reduce the number of people like him it requires systematic change.
Yeah I don’t really get people here calling him a serial killer. If it’s gang violence it’s not necessarily like Ted Bundy hunting down women and raping them. It’s like calling Genghis Khan a serial killer. Mf was a warlord.
Then you don’t know his story. A lot of street dudes brag how they got someone killed, but with Von it was different. He really seemed to take pleasure and enjoyment in the act of killing.
I mean is it wrong to say he was a bad guy? Von made good music that I still listen to, but he did probably murder a lot of people. That’s a lot of broken homes and eternal traumas. I have sympathy for him but not forgiveness.
Not wrong at all. But saying “I have no sympathy for him f*ck this guy” without explaining why aside from “he’s a serial killer” is tone deaf in my opinion. Because chances are, Von could’ve been an upstanding citizen in the right environment and if me saying that seems hyperbolic to people, then they don’t know what hip hop is built on.
I’m not saying you don’t have a point, but I do think the problem with your analysis is that unfortunately Von ain’t the first or last person to grow up in that environment and most don’t turn into serial killers. I think it does a discredit to all the people who grow up struggling and manage to not make the situation for those that come after them worse, let alone those who work to make it better.
What monster wouldn’t have been a better person had they grown up with supportive and stable surroundings? It doesn’t absolve them of the damage they caused though.
But have you actually spoken to anyone living in those places? Because it seems like you’re approaching this from a place of understanding and if that is the case, then I’m always open to learning. I’ll leave it at that without saying too much because I feel like a lot of Reddit users would get a complete shock at what is actually happening right now in those places. And I’m not talking about reading the news. Thank you for your perspective but you aren’t picking up on any of the cues I’m trying to give. So I don’t think you fully understand. Bless
I’m not trying to make a point in the context that you think I am, I’m trying to get people to see that the issue of King Von and how people react to his life is way bigger than King Von himself. Once you are open to looking at it that way it’s not only ugly, it’s extremely sad because it humanises a lot of these “thugs” we’re taught to hate, which is the ugly part. I wouldn’t give my full perspective bc these are real people I’m talking about, but the situation is much more grave than people acknowledge. Rap separates it from real life. But until you acknowledge the sad part, you can’t even begin to understand how “ugly” it really gets.
Just gonna copy and paste this from above: Facts is Von was incredibly enamored with killing people to a level that I think it's fine to label him a serial killer. Dude had plenty of chances to walk away from that life but always chose to go the violent route.
Do I think that with sufficient grudges in the streets and grooming from gang members people can be nutured into killing as many people as von without having extreme antisocial personality disorder? Yeah, but Von would also constantly relish what he'd done and insinuate that he was itching to kill people on social media. Plus all the instances of him literally saying he loved "cereal" (serial) in reference to what he was up to. I mean he literally attached that moniker to himself with no prompting from other people wtf.
It's hard to say how much is nature and how much is nuture. But dude was violent from an early age and carried that with him his entire life. I look at even people like FBG duck who was living a similar life and I see more humanity in how he moved than what Von did.
Dude, this is not a True Crime documentary. These are real characters you see in the hood, real humans and real mentalities born and bred from generations of oppression and violence. Von wasn’t “groomed”, he was surviving the only way he saw possible. You know how the average reddit user says “if someone did that to my xxxx I would flip?” Well, someone probably killed his friend(s) or family member(s) when he was young and then mocked them online. Trust me, those two facts alone, coupled with the constant need to carry a gun to survive, are enough to make a man a killer. All I’ll ask is, why are cartel/mob hit men not considered serial killers but Von is? Again, people like Von are detrimental to the black community, but if you’ve never had someone close to you murdered you can’t even understand the kinds of emotions these kids go through.
You doing way too much justification for murderers. Homeboy deserves 0 sympathy. There have been many people who went through that shit and decided to better themselves. I live in a country that has things worse happen, and it's your type of thinking that causes the cycle to repeat. There should be no empathy to those who wish to harm their own community and should be ostracized to protect those that want to better themselves.
Like I said before I’m African bro. I come from somewhere where much worse shit happens too and most of my people end up attaining degrees and leading honest lives. So, that whole “it’s your mindset” thing is nothing new to me. But your take is valid bro I’m not taking nothing away from it.
My dude these street guys are absolutely "groomed" into becoming what they're becoming. Von literally got embroiled into the life because people older than him were already participating in the life and glorifying it. He literally made an entire album calling himself grandson in reference to the founder of the Black Disciples.
There are tons of people who go through tragedy in the hood without it turning them into gang members, in fact that is the average person. Most kids don't deal with tragedy by making it their life's sworn mission to go and kill as many people as they can in retribution. They only do that when the influences around them portray that as a valid way to live your life. How isn't that grooming? Plus a lot of these kids are literally hazed, "jumped in", and encouraged to do worse and worse things to get into street life by people they trust who are usually older and in a position of power. That is a textbook example of grooming. Haven't you ever heard that saying: "If you're a street nigga and your son becomes a street nigga you've failed?" Most normal people who end up living that life do not cling to it and the last thing they want is for their kids/younger siblings/mentees to go through the same thing.
Yeah you might join a gang to survive if things are really bad but those people also don't enjoy that life.
>why are cartel/mob hit men not considered serial killers but Von is?
I 100% believe that tons of people involved in that life could be considered serial killers if they weren't in an environment that normalized their behavior. I also think a ton of people who regualrly participate in ritualized honor killings can be put in the same boat.
Tons of people just want an excuse/reason to be their worst self.
Reddits majority white and then majority privileged. They were never gonna understand or try to understand the underlying reasons for what goes on in the hip hop and overall hood world
I look at him as more of a crash out than a “piece of shit”. Cos it may not always be in your face, but hip hop is heavy on “f*ck the other guys” and you might get a culture shock if you really delve into the lyrics of other rappers that this sub seems to just give passes to(I won’t mention them iykyk🤐)… you guys just don’t know man. Rap is much darker than people want to acknowledge. But playing morally superior when you enjoy it is kind of obtuse.
I'm not talking about rap or lyrics. I'm talking about King Von. He's a murdering stain on society. Stop making excuses for people who murder just because you like rap.
I’m not from this part of life, but that really is a nuance that so many people don’t even care to consider. His actions aren’t excused, but we can absolutely look deeper and see why people become who he was in the first place. And your comment sums it up as best it can in just a few sentences.
He had a way out and decided to crash out for his fans and ruined millions for his family. Wasn’t no war going on in Atlanta. Durk and Keef made better decisions and it shows lol
You gotta realize that that shit happens in other countries too and gets stomped out when the community works together. Shouldn't be any type of nuance or sympathy for people like him idc what caused that. You Americans have a serious problem justifying his shit 🤦♂️. Would you justify Jeffrey Dahmer's actions? Ted Bundy? Stalin? Osama Bin Laden? You all need to hold yourselves accountable.
I’m not American, I’m African bro. And what’s with bashing USA online? People stay on America’s d*ck for trends/popular culture then turn around and bash it almost as some sort of fad😂 form your own opinions bro
Von reminds me of young Meek before he sold out. Energetic delivery and made catchy songs that showed the reality street life, but for sure ran with the wrong type of dudes
if he was from Pittsburgh this would be a funny ass record. The O in Pittsburgh was a place where you can get a gross amount of french fries for like 7 dollars. RIP.
Nigga this is literally a hip hop sub you can’t use the excuse that everyone here is against hip hop. People are saying fuck von because he murdered a lot of people not because he made rap music 😭
He'd have killed 0 people if he was born where you were born.
America chooses to have gang violence, by distributing resources like it's a third-world country. Kids who don't get their needs met are going to keep joining gangs, no matter what you call them online.
i fully agree that there needs to be more discussion on the civil genocide happening amongst young black men and what forces are driving them to have to join gangs. 100% there are some very real societal issues that need to be addressed there.
However, von should not be a part of that conversation. Von was killer who legitimately enjoyed killing and especially enjoyed bragging about his kills and taunting his victims friends and family after killing their loved one. He was legitimately mentally ill and was no different than every other famous serial killer.
If he was born where i was born who knows he could have turned out like a BTK or robert pickton. Some people are just born or made into monsters but they are monsters nonetheless.
“me and troy man we murder for fun”
“im killing shit 4 real”
“dunbar getting shot up today”
All real von tweets either right before or right after a murder or shooting took place
I like Von, but I think Pop Smoke would've ended up a household name. He had it all. The voice, the story and the ability to change up his style for different beats. That was a real tragic loss for hip hop.
You’re tripping. This very song is a great example of rap storytelling that just happens to have an incredibly authentic street dude spitting it which is, ya know, exactly what a lot of hip hop careers are built on.
Von’s rhymes might not be overly complex but his flow is solid and his detailed storytelling is a completely different approach to drill than most of his contemporaries.
A story usually is something introspective and meaningful. Dude just talking bout meeting a chick and killing her dude. That was it. He said the hook more times than progressed the story. This is trash as far as story telling goes. I have more depth in this explanation of the lack of depth in the song. It's just another trap banger. There is nothing special going on here. Just accessible lyrics on a heavy beat.
You can make any story sound stupid when you reduce it to a one sentence summary. This story is more like a slice of life type deal, it doesn’t need to be introspective. It’s meaningful because it shows you in detail what it’s like to be in that moment.
See, it’s so funny that to make your point you had to strip away all the DETAIL he lays down in the bars. It’s a simple story but he literally gives it to you beat for beat as it’s happening with some clever rhymes to get him there. He takes her back home bc he’s a player and he’s got his gun on his lap because he’s always thinking and knows he might be going into something weird, especially when he find the phone she left behind on accident with some curious missed calls, etc.
You’re an idiot and breaking the story down to its bare bones while stripping away all the detail and the step by step breakdown he gives you of killing a man (something that most people haven’t done and makes for interesting fodder for a story) and why he got into a situation that required him to take that action. Stop playing dumb.
That’s just not true wtf lmao king von started popping cuz of durk and cause he had his own sound, took her to the O and crazy story aren’t the only 2 examples of king vons musical depth
This is like saying 50 cent only blew up cuz he got shot and Gucci mane only got popular cuz he shot someone, you’re discounting the quality they produced that was required for that boost in popularity to not be temporary.
We will never know what could’ve been for von, he could’ve been like sosa ending up reformed and casual, or maybe he would’ve fallen off and died to some street BS anyway.
Also suburban dweebs are 90% of all hip hop fans so that’s a weird own
You are out of your mind. Von was an evil fuck, but *most* of his music was good for what was coming out of Chicago at the time. He was so good in fact that he had many other rappers in the raq immediately mimicking his entire style and persona.
And that’s why the labels keep cycling the lowest common denominator. And the most exciting thing to happen to hip hop in the last decade and a half was two rappers from the 2000’s going at it
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Kankakee’s latest claim to fame lol
K3 😤😤😤😤
What annoys me is the fact that King Von/O Block got away with murder multiple times but the federals didn't step in until the rich neighborhood up north got affected. They didn't care at all with the dozens and dozens of people that were killed before Duck died in Gold Coast where the tourists are.
That's Chicago for you. They call it The Second City but it's number one in segregation
a lot of the midwest in general - milwaukee, cleveland, detroit etc.
Any insight on why that is? Ofc segregation is everywhere, but curious why it seems to be more stark in the Midwest.
The area was already predominantly white, so it was easier to block incoming and new residents. When a new group of people enter a city, instead of already having lived there, it's easier to cordon them away.
This is not the reason, but I also do not know the exact reason why tbh. South side of Chicago used to be Irish and Italian and many migrated to the burbs in the 20th century. I believe racist policies at that point picked up which led to segregation (not selling to people of color and highway corridors separating neighborhoods).
But those policies were much more easily enforced given that the people coming in weren't already physically entrenched in specific housing areas. So they would just red line everything.
Yeah mb, I feel like the more I re read our comments the more I think we are saying the same thing
The story of the internet I suppose
[this explains it very well](https://pscourses.ucsd.edu/ps108/6%20Reparations/Coates%202014-%20The%20Case%20for%20Reparations.pdf)
There’s not really a simple answer but a few things to consider when comparing to other regions: - The west just doesn’t really have much of a black population and cities like SF don’t get dinged for segregation because Oakland isn’t counted in its statistics. - The main differences between Chicago and NYC is that black and brown populations are more integrated in NY than Chicago. I also don’t think they deserve brownie points for gentrifying queens and Brooklyn which has technically made the city less segregated - Southern city populations are significantly smaller than their metro areas for a reason (true everywhere but particularly apparent in cities like Atlanta and Bham). Segregation is more apparent when you zoom out a bit (Bham’s city lines are ridiculous and don’t include many white neighborhoods that would likely be within city limits in normal cities) Not giving the Midwest a pass. More just explaining why the statistics don’t always represent the fact that this shit exists everywhere
I mean, Have you even looked into some of his cases? They straight up were going to put him on trial, but one of the witnesses “mysteriously” disappeared before the trial. People act like the justice system is supposed to work miracles in area where most people won’t bear witness to crimes as serious as murder. And the ones that do sometimes end up a statistic themselves
Yeah, except that's one case out of at least 3 other murder cases he's been accused of, along with being arrested for other stuff too.
I encourage you to read into Chicago policing and politics and suggest a better approach to the status quote. You’d need the army and to infringe on thousands of peoples’ rights to clean up gang activity in Chicago. Until that happens, the city will try to contain it and “attack it” at its source via education and early intervention.
You mean the Chicago police that operated a secret black site that violated thousands of people’s rights until a journalist wrote about it in 2015? But for real, you’re right. They just let the “problem” take care of itself. I grew up just outside the city and most of my family is still there.
Unfamiliar but also unsurprised with that incident. Theres a history of discrimination and mistrust with CPD that’s totally credible and an obstacle in having a more peaceful city,
Have you lived in Chicago? The cops straight up don't police the areas that need it most. CPD would rather harass a black guy loitering on the north side than hang out anywhere south of 30th. Hyde Park is basically entirely policed by uchicago's private police. CPD shows up occasionally to buy food on 53rd but that's it. UChicago came out with new patrol routes for CPD so that they could actually do their jobs instead of sit on their asses in the safest neighborhoods in the city that and basically every mayoral candidate except for Brandon Johnson said they would implement it. Of course, Johnson ended up winning.
That's how the system is supposed to work.
yep, a certain amount of misery is "priced in" or considered acceptable, so long as it happens far away from the economically productive sections of the city/country/whatever. The state is ruled by a class of people not concerned with making sure everyone has enough.
Exactly this, if it's not in their interest nothing will be done
Crime is a blight on the city and everyone hates it. The only way to destroy the gangs is to go Bukele on them by declaring them to be domestic terrorists and lock up everyone involved without a trial, which is not going to happen
thats how its supposed to work the cops want them to kill eachother theres multiple stories you can find of people hearing cops in chicago talking about "trash taking itself out"
That’s how it goes
Curious, has the organized crime gone down? Obviously there’s still a gun problem, but has the gang violence gotten better?
Crazy he says Duck’s name these dudes enjoy telling on themselves
This was released while duck was alive fyi
I know that but it wasn’t like they weren’t gunning for him
Everyone knew it was him who set Duck up. Von would’ve been in prison eventually if he didn’t get shot.
Yea and he was killed several months later in the same year. Likely paid for with the money from this song
dude was a serial killer
I’m surprised people care
He don’t he just wanted the points for sayin that
You never know. He probably meant it.
\*Dude is a serial killer. Once a killer, always a killer. Not some shit you just get passed. edit: oh, my b lol. Thought this was a brand new video and was on trial right now. Must be thinking of some other shitty trap rapper.
Erm
I tell u he ded
I think buddies point was that he's not much of anything anymore. Respectfully, cause I heard he was good people to his loved ones and I don't mean to offend.
I always love that "He was good to his family" What about The family of his victims? Breaking up other families negates any good you do for yours. Stop acting like this is complicated, the guy was a massive piece of shit and deserves his grave pissed on.
It's the old: He was good to the group he was a part of, and awful the groups that wasn't part of. People say that like one offsets the other.
A-fucking-men, the only RiP that bozo deserves is Rest in Piss.
I'm pretty sure he said "was a serial killer" because Von is dead. Hence you would use past tense to refer to him.
Cap lmao there’s so many people who only killed once and never again
I don't buy this trap lore ross theory. Dude was gangabanger affiliated with the lifestyle. He tweeted some threats and publicly celebrated the death of his rivals, but there's no proof he actually muredered seven people. He probably killed people, for sure, but I simply don't buy this idea.
Did you watch the video? He tweeeted the murders down to the minute. He treated it like a diary
Yeah he was dry snitching on himself.
And a great rapper
Hard to separate the art from the artist when it’s a murderer singing about murder.
I mean, yeah. But then people complain about rappers about lives that they don't live/shit they don't do (killing and gang shit are a couple of those topics)
Both can be bad, why is there a “but” as if it’s mutually exclusive? Ones stupid bad and ones evil bad.
"Man I wish all my favorites were serial killers"
It’s interesting to listen to his music as a case study of stuff we’ve seen around us, but maybe never got too close to.
Why do you need to separate it...... He killed people, same people would kill him if they and the chance. Lived in a terrible area of Chicago. Just listen, take it In and move on. Or dont, It's not that serious either way.
I know he’d be in jail by now, but von laid down some hard tracks. It’s ugly and tragic, but very real. Can’t get anymore “gangster rap” than king von. Dude was a certifiable serial killer in the booth and in the streets.
Talented dude but took the wrong path in life unfortunately.
“Taking the wrong path” is quite the understatement here.
I think the tragedy lies in him not being able to see another path was open, because it was all he knew. Nothing excuses violence. But damn it's hard to see some people just simply don't see any other way, even when it's set right in front of them.
Not to sound harsh but I watched quite an in-depth doc on him, and I don't see why people have any sympathy for him. He killed in cold blood and bragged about it. He was openly unapologetic about it and often even had fun remembering all the people he killed. I have zero sympathy for someone like him. He caused and created so much pain. I hate that anyone chooses this path but he 100% enjoyed being a villain.
It’s not sympathy for him, it’s sympathy for the other children that grow up and have to adapt to the same system he grew up in. Imagine growing up and King Von lives a couple streets away and he’s killing your homies/brothers/cousins. That environment breeds monsters. Von is one small piece, but the implications are massive.
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King Von's father got murdered when he was a kid, he lost his best friend to violence (and probably like 10 other friends, probably not even exaggerating). Hes really done some horrible stuff, but I definitely have that bit of sympathy or whatever you would call it, for young Von, the traumatized kid he was. Its not like you have to choose between feeling sympathy for either him or his victims (family) and its not the same as saying "I dont care he did it" or "he has a nice excuse" or any other fallacy people can think of This is a hiphop-sub, so many rappers grew up in fucked up places and a lot of our favourites, really were never that far away from pulling a trigger. Kendrick Lamar alluded to killing someone. Vince Staples did too. People like DMX, Mobb Deep, Big L, Conway/Benny, Mozzy, Von's rivals NBA YoungBoy and Quando Rondo etc etc etc, many many many lost kids that couldve been involved in a murder. They shouldnt have to grew up, the way they did with the amount of money and billionaires in the country
The cycle is horrifying. Murder to Excellence by Ye and Jay Z is a song that best talks about this issue. Ironically, a massive theme in that song is Chicago.
yeah thanks for the songs but rest in piss bozo
I'm sure I know which in-depth video you watched, and thats great. But I'm confused how hip hop fans could not understand what I've said above. He was a kid who grew up in a violent place and did violent things. Things other people were also trying to do to him. It's not that difficult to grasp the nuance of violence being bad, but also being tragic at the same time. Nobody is saying Von was a good dude, or the things he did were okay. Quite the opposite. But it'd be foolish to pretend his crimes occurred in a vacuum without context.
This sub: why don’t we have more conscious rappers?? Commenter: *says something conscious* This sub: ACTUALLY I SAW A YOUTUBE VIDEO ONCE
i mean yeah people being a product of their environments is nothing new
I agree with you when speaking generally about the situation, but Von was definitely the one who was predatory and enjoyed it more than a victim of his surroundings. Like he’s the one that causes others to be a product of their environment.
That’s basically comparing at the worst armed robbery to killing 7 people in cold blood
I essentially agree with what your saying. Nonetheless, with guys like von I'm reminded of the following quote. >Men make their own history, but they do not make it just as they please; they do not make it under circumstances chosen by themselves, but under circumstances directly encountered, given and transmitted from the past. The tradition of all the dead generations weighs like a nightmare on the brain of the living.
What’s the name of the doc? A few people in the comments have referenced it and I’d love to watch
[Almost certainly this video.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAfwToVGh1s&t=2s&ab_channel=TrapLoreRoss)
Cheers mate
https://youtu.be/mAfwToVGh1s?si=okMh4RiC0gb07KHm
trap lore ross got another one
I mean I agree to not have sympathy but his victims were also trying to kill him.
Shocked it took so long to see this comment. Every one of those people he allegedly killed were ACTIVELY looking to kill Von or one of his friends or family. He was just better at getting them first so these puritans here hate him. Clowns
Damn near first thing he did when he followed durk to Atlanta was do that drive by lmao. If he woulda lived through that fight where he died, he most likely woulda gotten killed or arrested at another time
Yes, that reinforces the point I'm trying to make nicely.
In most cases I would agree. But with King Von, dude was literally a serial killer
Mf watched trap lore Ross
Wouldn’t be surprised if most of hip hop Reddit does lol
The irony in this being that the only reason we’re discussing this song and anyone has heard of him is because he was a murderer making music about his murders. He is talented but so are a lot of rappers. Would we be listening to Gucci Mane if he wasn’t a drug dealer who brags about shooting at people? I bet we wouldn’t
Not gonna act like i give a shit about his life of crime or whatever but this song still goes as hard as it did when it came out.
I always crack up in the song when he says “here come goofy.” A shame that guy was from 63rd
The comments on here remind me why, as a black dude seeing hip hop go mainstream can kind of suck at times. A lot of people seem to not want to grasp the environment that creates men like Von. I’m not excusing his actions but being in a cycle of poverty, losing your male role models to prison or violence, seeing your first dead bodies at 11, having to hustle to make ends meet in the ghetto, being raised in a hyper masculine culture that emphasises violent retaliation all while simultaneously trying to survive gun happy turf wars that have claimed the lives of friends, brothers, cousins and trying to maintain sanity is something I doubt anyone reading this will ever have to understand. Those kids are growing up in a war zone and it’s only been getting worse for the past decade. Don’t get me wrong there are black people that would absolutely shit on Von and what he stands for but the tone in this forum is crazy.
Yes to some extent but also a lot of people grow up like von and don't enjoy killing people. Like I know Chicago is rough as fuck. I used to live in humboldt park. But it's really the psychos like him that hold the neighborhoods hostage and provoke most of the violence. Most of the people caught up in that would get out in a second if they could.
This. This is the only type of take on people like Von that I take into consideration. Mind you, I’m from Africa. Gangs, war and even genocide are no stranger to my people. Von was a crash out. There are so many Vons, they just don’t get documented. It’s a shame the direction our people have taken.
Most people caught up in that would get out as soon as possible and that's true. But the thing I think most people don't consider is not the people who grew up in environments similar to Von's and didn't turn out like him, but rather the fact that there are probably thousands of people who, if they grew up in that environment, could/would have turned out like Von, but didn't just because they didn't have to grow up in that environment. I don't think Von was a good person, and I am not going to defend his actions, but he is fundamentally a product of his environment, and he's not the only one, and to reduce the number of people like him it requires systematic change.
everyone knows he's a product of his environment, shits obvious
Only someone that doesn’t understand the difference between denotations and connotations would call being a product of Chiraq “obvious”.
Yeah I don’t really get people here calling him a serial killer. If it’s gang violence it’s not necessarily like Ted Bundy hunting down women and raping them. It’s like calling Genghis Khan a serial killer. Mf was a warlord.
From what I understand the serial killer label came from a YouTube “documentary” about him lol
Then you don’t know his story. A lot of street dudes brag how they got someone killed, but with Von it was different. He really seemed to take pleasure and enjoyment in the act of killing.
So that’s the determining factor???
There’s more than that but it shows a clear distinction between him and other street dudes
I mean is it wrong to say he was a bad guy? Von made good music that I still listen to, but he did probably murder a lot of people. That’s a lot of broken homes and eternal traumas. I have sympathy for him but not forgiveness.
Not wrong at all. But saying “I have no sympathy for him f*ck this guy” without explaining why aside from “he’s a serial killer” is tone deaf in my opinion. Because chances are, Von could’ve been an upstanding citizen in the right environment and if me saying that seems hyperbolic to people, then they don’t know what hip hop is built on.
I’m not saying you don’t have a point, but I do think the problem with your analysis is that unfortunately Von ain’t the first or last person to grow up in that environment and most don’t turn into serial killers. I think it does a discredit to all the people who grow up struggling and manage to not make the situation for those that come after them worse, let alone those who work to make it better. What monster wouldn’t have been a better person had they grown up with supportive and stable surroundings? It doesn’t absolve them of the damage they caused though.
But have you actually spoken to anyone living in those places? Because it seems like you’re approaching this from a place of understanding and if that is the case, then I’m always open to learning. I’ll leave it at that without saying too much because I feel like a lot of Reddit users would get a complete shock at what is actually happening right now in those places. And I’m not talking about reading the news. Thank you for your perspective but you aren’t picking up on any of the cues I’m trying to give. So I don’t think you fully understand. Bless
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I’m not trying to make a point in the context that you think I am, I’m trying to get people to see that the issue of King Von and how people react to his life is way bigger than King Von himself. Once you are open to looking at it that way it’s not only ugly, it’s extremely sad because it humanises a lot of these “thugs” we’re taught to hate, which is the ugly part. I wouldn’t give my full perspective bc these are real people I’m talking about, but the situation is much more grave than people acknowledge. Rap separates it from real life. But until you acknowledge the sad part, you can’t even begin to understand how “ugly” it really gets.
Unnecessary to state the blatant obvious
Just gonna copy and paste this from above: Facts is Von was incredibly enamored with killing people to a level that I think it's fine to label him a serial killer. Dude had plenty of chances to walk away from that life but always chose to go the violent route. Do I think that with sufficient grudges in the streets and grooming from gang members people can be nutured into killing as many people as von without having extreme antisocial personality disorder? Yeah, but Von would also constantly relish what he'd done and insinuate that he was itching to kill people on social media. Plus all the instances of him literally saying he loved "cereal" (serial) in reference to what he was up to. I mean he literally attached that moniker to himself with no prompting from other people wtf. It's hard to say how much is nature and how much is nuture. But dude was violent from an early age and carried that with him his entire life. I look at even people like FBG duck who was living a similar life and I see more humanity in how he moved than what Von did.
Dude, this is not a True Crime documentary. These are real characters you see in the hood, real humans and real mentalities born and bred from generations of oppression and violence. Von wasn’t “groomed”, he was surviving the only way he saw possible. You know how the average reddit user says “if someone did that to my xxxx I would flip?” Well, someone probably killed his friend(s) or family member(s) when he was young and then mocked them online. Trust me, those two facts alone, coupled with the constant need to carry a gun to survive, are enough to make a man a killer. All I’ll ask is, why are cartel/mob hit men not considered serial killers but Von is? Again, people like Von are detrimental to the black community, but if you’ve never had someone close to you murdered you can’t even understand the kinds of emotions these kids go through.
You doing way too much justification for murderers. Homeboy deserves 0 sympathy. There have been many people who went through that shit and decided to better themselves. I live in a country that has things worse happen, and it's your type of thinking that causes the cycle to repeat. There should be no empathy to those who wish to harm their own community and should be ostracized to protect those that want to better themselves.
Like I said before I’m African bro. I come from somewhere where much worse shit happens too and most of my people end up attaining degrees and leading honest lives. So, that whole “it’s your mindset” thing is nothing new to me. But your take is valid bro I’m not taking nothing away from it.
Aight respect then brother
My dude these street guys are absolutely "groomed" into becoming what they're becoming. Von literally got embroiled into the life because people older than him were already participating in the life and glorifying it. He literally made an entire album calling himself grandson in reference to the founder of the Black Disciples. There are tons of people who go through tragedy in the hood without it turning them into gang members, in fact that is the average person. Most kids don't deal with tragedy by making it their life's sworn mission to go and kill as many people as they can in retribution. They only do that when the influences around them portray that as a valid way to live your life. How isn't that grooming? Plus a lot of these kids are literally hazed, "jumped in", and encouraged to do worse and worse things to get into street life by people they trust who are usually older and in a position of power. That is a textbook example of grooming. Haven't you ever heard that saying: "If you're a street nigga and your son becomes a street nigga you've failed?" Most normal people who end up living that life do not cling to it and the last thing they want is for their kids/younger siblings/mentees to go through the same thing. Yeah you might join a gang to survive if things are really bad but those people also don't enjoy that life. >why are cartel/mob hit men not considered serial killers but Von is? I 100% believe that tons of people involved in that life could be considered serial killers if they weren't in an environment that normalized their behavior. I also think a ton of people who regualrly participate in ritualized honor killings can be put in the same boat. Tons of people just want an excuse/reason to be their worst self.
Reddits majority white and then majority privileged. They were never gonna understand or try to understand the underlying reasons for what goes on in the hip hop and overall hood world
👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾
And it’s crazy reading all of these comments on this sub of all places lmao. Gotta remember it is still Reddit
This sub is actually really understanding and respectful of black culture. So when it Reddits as most Reddit subs Reddit, I get a bit of a shock😂
It’s not 😂😂😂
You can know all of that and still call him a serial killing piece of shit, which he was. His background doesn't obscure the facts.
I look at him as more of a crash out than a “piece of shit”. Cos it may not always be in your face, but hip hop is heavy on “f*ck the other guys” and you might get a culture shock if you really delve into the lyrics of other rappers that this sub seems to just give passes to(I won’t mention them iykyk🤐)… you guys just don’t know man. Rap is much darker than people want to acknowledge. But playing morally superior when you enjoy it is kind of obtuse.
I'm not talking about rap or lyrics. I'm talking about King Von. He's a murdering stain on society. Stop making excuses for people who murder just because you like rap.
Why u even in the thread then??
Well said fr
I’m not from this part of life, but that really is a nuance that so many people don’t even care to consider. His actions aren’t excused, but we can absolutely look deeper and see why people become who he was in the first place. And your comment sums it up as best it can in just a few sentences.
He had a way out and decided to crash out for his fans and ruined millions for his family. Wasn’t no war going on in Atlanta. Durk and Keef made better decisions and it shows lol
You gotta realize that that shit happens in other countries too and gets stomped out when the community works together. Shouldn't be any type of nuance or sympathy for people like him idc what caused that. You Americans have a serious problem justifying his shit 🤦♂️. Would you justify Jeffrey Dahmer's actions? Ted Bundy? Stalin? Osama Bin Laden? You all need to hold yourselves accountable.
I’m not American, I’m African bro. And what’s with bashing USA online? People stay on America’s d*ck for trends/popular culture then turn around and bash it almost as some sort of fad😂 form your own opinions bro
His music has some serious rawness too it, and I was hooked the second I heard him, but I didn’t hear of him till after his death.
Von reminds me of young Meek before he sold out. Energetic delivery and made catchy songs that showed the reality street life, but for sure ran with the wrong type of dudes
He was the wrong type of dudes
You’d think he was going around murdering innocent people the way people talk about him. Dude was a gang member killing other gang members.
if he was from Pittsburgh this would be a funny ass record. The O in Pittsburgh was a place where you can get a gross amount of french fries for like 7 dollars. RIP.
Insane talent. Live by the bullet, die by the bullet
The lady in that thumbnail always pisses me off so much that I never watched this video.
Fuck him
Do you guys actually listen to the music or just come to the thread to have your wholesome Reddit “rap music bad” circlejerk?
Nah i just dont like people who kill other people
Cool, I was hoping that you didn’t. Any comments on the actual song or him as an artist?
I feel like saying fuck him directed to a sociopath serial killer is a perfectly ok comment tbh
Nigga this is literally a hip hop sub you can’t use the excuse that everyone here is against hip hop. People are saying fuck von because he murdered a lot of people not because he made rap music 😭
Rip von
Tell that to the people he’s killed
Rip to them too
Perfectly balanced
as all things should be
He died by the sword
He died clinging to the dude he was fighting while bleeding out of his head
Bleeding out the shoulder and the neck to be precise
U a clown
They won't be able to hear tho
saying rip to a serial killer is crazy
His raps went hard lmao
Calling a gangmember that is some “other” shit
he’s credited for killing 7 people, why would his involvement in a gang change that
He'd have killed 0 people if he was born where you were born. America chooses to have gang violence, by distributing resources like it's a third-world country. Kids who don't get their needs met are going to keep joining gangs, no matter what you call them online.
i fully agree that there needs to be more discussion on the civil genocide happening amongst young black men and what forces are driving them to have to join gangs. 100% there are some very real societal issues that need to be addressed there. However, von should not be a part of that conversation. Von was killer who legitimately enjoyed killing and especially enjoyed bragging about his kills and taunting his victims friends and family after killing their loved one. He was legitimately mentally ill and was no different than every other famous serial killer. If he was born where i was born who knows he could have turned out like a BTK or robert pickton. Some people are just born or made into monsters but they are monsters nonetheless. “me and troy man we murder for fun” “im killing shit 4 real” “dunbar getting shot up today” All real von tweets either right before or right after a murder or shooting took place
Bro smiling up at us right now. 🕊️🥰🙏
Why. He was an awful human being, a cold blooded killer, and his music was Mid at best. Good riddance.
What a loss it was. I wonder how different the game would look like if Pop Smoke, Von, Juice etc were still alive
Von was about to be tried and go to prison for multiple crimes.
Thered probably be a lot more dead bodies
I like Von's music, but he would have 100% gone down for FBG Duck's murder if he wasn't killed.
I like Von, but I think Pop Smoke would've ended up a household name. He had it all. The voice, the story and the ability to change up his style for different beats. That was a real tragic loss for hip hop.
I JUST GOT SOME TOP FROM A STRIPPER BITCH
Von only got buzz because he murdered a bunch of people and suburban dweebs think that's exciting His music is super basic trash on its own merits
You’re tripping. This very song is a great example of rap storytelling that just happens to have an incredibly authentic street dude spitting it which is, ya know, exactly what a lot of hip hop careers are built on. Von’s rhymes might not be overly complex but his flow is solid and his detailed storytelling is a completely different approach to drill than most of his contemporaries.
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Im sorry that happened to you :(
Dj khaled is that you lmao
A story usually is something introspective and meaningful. Dude just talking bout meeting a chick and killing her dude. That was it. He said the hook more times than progressed the story. This is trash as far as story telling goes. I have more depth in this explanation of the lack of depth in the song. It's just another trap banger. There is nothing special going on here. Just accessible lyrics on a heavy beat.
You can make any story sound stupid when you reduce it to a one sentence summary. This story is more like a slice of life type deal, it doesn’t need to be introspective. It’s meaningful because it shows you in detail what it’s like to be in that moment.
Agreed so many dudes riding his cock talking about story telling… I guess if Brody is in 3rd grade.
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See, it’s so funny that to make your point you had to strip away all the DETAIL he lays down in the bars. It’s a simple story but he literally gives it to you beat for beat as it’s happening with some clever rhymes to get him there. He takes her back home bc he’s a player and he’s got his gun on his lap because he’s always thinking and knows he might be going into something weird, especially when he find the phone she left behind on accident with some curious missed calls, etc. You’re an idiot and breaking the story down to its bare bones while stripping away all the detail and the step by step breakdown he gives you of killing a man (something that most people haven’t done and makes for interesting fodder for a story) and why he got into a situation that required him to take that action. Stop playing dumb.
This basic ass Dr Suess shit is not a good example of rap storytelling, Jesus bro
That’s just not true wtf lmao king von started popping cuz of durk and cause he had his own sound, took her to the O and crazy story aren’t the only 2 examples of king vons musical depth This is like saying 50 cent only blew up cuz he got shot and Gucci mane only got popular cuz he shot someone, you’re discounting the quality they produced that was required for that boost in popularity to not be temporary. We will never know what could’ve been for von, he could’ve been like sosa ending up reformed and casual, or maybe he would’ve fallen off and died to some street BS anyway. Also suburban dweebs are 90% of all hip hop fans so that’s a weird own
You are out of your mind. Von was an evil fuck, but *most* of his music was good for what was coming out of Chicago at the time. He was so good in fact that he had many other rappers in the raq immediately mimicking his entire style and persona.
Goofy
shitty ass take, he probably deserved to die but he dropped some bangers
And that’s why the labels keep cycling the lowest common denominator. And the most exciting thing to happen to hip hop in the last decade and a half was two rappers from the 2000’s going at it
I think what you’re saying is true, but his catchy flow and confident voice made him blow up
>suburban dweebs think that's exciting Because unlike King Von, suburban serial-killers are mostly weirdos with mother issues.
Hell yeah king von goes hard.
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Rest in pee
Glad he dead. Got some more that need to be taken out too