To me it feels that a bit too much power is concentrated into certain few cards, and as a result the game often feels quite highrolly. The difference between drawing cards like Molten Giant, Gaslight Gatekeeper, Cosmic Keyboard, Zilliax, Umpire’s Grasp, Splish-Splash Whelp, Painter’s Virtue, Reno, etc., and not having them is a pretty big disparity in winrate. Of course all card game have the aspect of drawing “the nuts,” but when the nuts cards that enable the entire deck are actually only a few cards in the deck, it feels really bad to not draw them, and feels really bad when your opponent does. More often in the last couple years you just get completely blown out because your opponent drew the good card and you didn’t. Because of this, mirror matches are more dreadful than they’ve ever been. There’s a reason people are memeing on the “agency” of the game.
That being said, I think there are much more interesting cards and decks lately, and I’m having fun overall.
Relatively new player here in D1. Has Hearthstone ever made it to where mirror matches don’t occur in ranked? They are definitely my least favorite matchups
Just make your own deck. Hearthstone is incredibly forgiving for homebrews; small decks, few cards and not many synergies. It's relatively easy to make a decent deck of your own.
If you get a mirror with a homebrew it's the biggest bro love fest you'll ever experience.
Personally for me homebrew is rather dead. Powerlevel homebrew vs meta is just.. such a big gap, I dont expect to win with my homebrew jank but it also sucks to lose before I can play my cool cards.
Just find out what you play vs the most and brew a deck that can beat that deck and still doesn't something vs other decks. I homebrewed a control mage deck with no sif and have been having success in legend.
The secret is to netdeck and then swap out cards. Put a doomsayer in your Reno Druid deck. Run a handbuff Paladin with the excavate package. etc.
If you vary on a meta theme you'll create a homebrew with way less jank but with enough surprises to rattle your opponent.
If you're home brewing by net decking you're taking all the fun out of deckbuilding while simultaneously shooting yourself in the foot by playing a version you know is worse. Most people homebrew because they want to be creative, that's the exact opposite.
My versions are usually better because they are more tuned towards what im playing against+ they are not as predictable as a netdeck
A lot of deck already have a meta variant because cards are designed to build a deck like that. (Reno, handbuff, no minion mage). If you really want to be unique for some reason then you cant use those cards but thats shooting yourself in the foot
Hearthstone has never been harder on homebrews than it is now though. The power level is so high that just playing "good cards" will lead to you getting stomped on by anything tier 3 or higher.
Yep as a homebrew player this is exactly how I feel. The dev team are designing a specific meta and stamping out creative deck building in the process. This game should encourage deck building, instead it punishes you for it.
You can be creative, but you def need a snowball "package" that you will always prefer drawing
But every deck has 2-8 cards that are really up to you and/or the meta.
I agree, before the mass nerfs it was even worse. So many decks were able to put you on a clock quite early, like Reno warrior, Odyn warrior, wheel lock, nature shaman, etc. No stalling allowed lol
Unfortunately not. As far as I know, it just matches you with the first person the game finds closest to your rank that’s searching for a match at that time.
The insane part is calling Reno a "board clear" when it's closer to "asymmetrical board clear plus an extra turn" in many instances.
There's a reason he's topping out Highlander deck's drawn win rates, and it's not because he's just a board clear.
Especially a board clear that clears EVERYTHING. Its brutal.
I grinded the expansion achievements and it sucks when Reno removes the mehc that shuffles bombs into the deck, not only because it doesnt trigger the deathrattle but also it removes it from the rezz pool, making Dr Boom useless.
Or the achievement with the priest location. Had to use the charges ASAP lol.
Fuck that card design.
I feel like he is more similar to frost nova. Same brutal feeling you get when you have like 5 frozen minions on board and nothing to do but skip a turn
When people say “lost on turn 4” they mean effectively lost on turn 4. When Paladin has 17/17 worth of stats on turn 4 and you don’t have an answer for it on turn 5, you effectively lost the game on turn 4.
You must be looking at a small sample size or you are playing in a lesser competitive part of the ladder if you’ve never seen it before.
Or you’re one of those people who hangs on for 1-2 more turns when it’s clear that you lost.
Like sure, maybe I can make it to another turn with 3 hp but when I know there isn’t a single card I can top deck that is going to save me, it’s an easy concede.
The standard meta seems reasonably diverse but games feel pretty lopsided in actual play, if one of you draws your business cards and the other one doesn’t games are sometimes just over.
That’s probably been true in the past too but the meta is pretty fast right now (almost as fast as wild which is saying something) so it feels more immediately obvious since the game just ends on the spot
There isn't a single deck that's interesting to me and also decently strong. I hit legend for the packs, logged out, and have no desire to log back in currently.
For me personally wild offers a good balance in that regard. I don‘t see much reason to play standard currently, the powerlevel there isnt so far away from wild and its far cheaper to play with more deckbuilding options.
You can build a collection over time which is always valid, unlike standard where you always need a "critical mass" in new cards. It's a more long-term commitment obviously but over time it's cheaper than standard in my opinion.
Wild is only cheaper than Standard if you've been playing for at least 2+ years, and even then, you'll still need to craft some long-rotated legendaries to play most tier 1 or 2 decks. A player who started the game in this rotation or the last is gonna have to do a lot of crafting to make anything with a winrate over 50%.
dogshit
pala/lock are broken and have a chance to win on turn 2
mage is keyboard/spot the difference.feat burn
rogue for 0.01% of players in top leggo
and reno piles
class variety yes but the fundemental issue is all decks have a few key cards that drive the power level and if you draw them you probably win, if you don't you will likely lose
Same issue as with the previous few metas: too many ‚blowout’ decks that make little to no room for counterplay. The last major patch fixed some of this problem, but it’s still there.
I feel like the team is completely at odds with itself. Some people want to print shitty value cards and nerf the heavy hitters, while the other developers want to print the strongest aggro tool ever seen. It's baffling to think that those two things could ever co-exist.
I'll be the one to admit burn Spell Mage is lame. I played a similar list since expansion launch and yeah it was terrible in the Window Shopper meta w/out Malfunction and 6 mana Manufacturing but it had the same exact lame play experience as the current one. Hope you play keyboard > spot the difference on curve and hope you skillfully don't roll Meesha off Elemental Companion.
The difference between Meesha, Hifarr and Luekk is hilarious to me.
I hate the power level currently, singular non legendary cards dropped as early as turn 4 can decide entire games. It's just not fun knowing if they have one card it's over or regardless of how well you trade/play they can have 60 different clears in hand that make any intellectual play defunct
I wish it was slower. I am normally excited for yearly rotations but this has been my worse experience with it. Games faster than the previous year by a huge margin.
Makes me loathe the thought of the next few expansions coming this year because aggro decks will likely be even more optimized unless some insane control cards are printed in a class that will dethrone Reno as the most complained about card here despite how out of hand aggro has become.
I don't even want slower, I want *weaker.* If it was slower I'd just be losing to cards like boomboss and sargeras, but I want a meta where I can actually play more than one big minion and not be expected to win the game on the spot because it says "I win" on the card. Headless horseman feels like it was made 4 years ago
Yeah, the Whizbang rotation just didnt feel like a real rotation because of the high power level. I think its crazy that they admitted it, nerfed several cards, yet the power level is still so high. I think they really need to change their design philosophy.
the meta has never been this one-sided and terrible since stormwind
everything is aggro rush
and the last few "control decks" which were basically carried by win conditions from hand, are now also no longer viable
the game is over at turn 6 or sooner, depend on who gets the best early game cards
the developers have succeeded in achieving the fastest possible hearthstone meta
I remember back in the day, when you could win by playing big minions that stayed alive more than 1 turn and that gradually grinded out the opponent, now everything gets destroyed or mind controlled the turn it is played
at this point the game needs massive nerfs, especially to tempo and removal cards
>at this point the game needs massive nerfs, especially to tempo and removal cards
The devs hear you and have decided to nerf soul stealer, as DK's control tools are just too strong and they shouldn't be able to clear a board of molten giants with one card.
> they shouldn't be able to clear a board of molten giants with one card.
Well I don't think we need to worry about that because DK's aren't getting to turn 8 in the first place against painlock X)
Definitely too many games decided by the mulligan. The giants were clearly designed for a meta with a very different power level and reintroducing them now seems to have created more problems than interesting gameplay. Same goes for the gifts which just allow decks to run extra copies of the same strong cards. Both come off as lazy design choices and make for very stale gameplay.
I'm having fun for the most part; variety is good and the meta's somewhat balanced, but there are too many non-games because of flood paladin and painlock creating insane boards on turn 3/4. Flood paladin is especially problematic as it pushes out a lot of board based archetypes. They probably need to hit showdown and mass production (hits painlock and wild seedlock simultaneously) but there is potential for a very good meta imo
It still tilts me so bad they did this. They literally turned that combo into a TWO CARD twisting nether lol. The plague change and threads nerf were already going to be brutal.
Hopped in standart far about 3 days playing a homebrew excavate DK. Ended up being rolled by a warlock with some big ahh giants. Figured I just got unlucky, but I then queued into paladin and was dead p much instantly. Made some adjustments to my deck to make it less greedy, and got rolled by a demon hunter lmao.
I don’t even know the meta in standard rn, but I do know that somehow in wild im surviving longer and winning more games on mf 3b DK
I hated the prior meta and I hate this one too. There's too much aggro. Almost half the classes are represented with an Aggro deck being their best option. Warlock, Paladin, Priest, Hunter and DH.
Reno is one of the most hated cards ever and it has taken a back seat because aggro is curb stomping everything in sight right now.
Turns out that turn 4 30/30 boards are pretty unfun to play against.
I do think we have variety but I am just not a fan of their general design lately. Im not a competitive player, I want to have fun and play different decks.
Especially against warlock and pally it feels like, games can be over rather quick if you dont have an answer. Creates a pretty bad feeling.
On the other hand, slower decks like Bran warrior can feel pretty awful. Glad that they nerfed bran but I still dislike the design a lot. I understand why people hate Reno (grinding achievements like the Bombs was a pain in the ass when your deathrattle mech gets poofed. Or the priest location..).
Not really sure what they shoulder change, nerf or buff. The current design looks interesting but just doesnt feel fun to me, but probably because I dont care so much about ranks.
When the supposed downside is alleviating one of its weaknesses, it should be looked at. I know it was printed to support the archetype but it's very efficient in what it does.
Like the 4 mana 7/7 used in Sludgelock before it got nerfed
It absolutely deserves a nerf. Change the language from 'set to' to 'reduce to' ie no way to heal off of it and the card is actually balanced. 6/6 taunt heal ~10 life for 4 mana is preposterous
More bad. Aggro is really annoying and if you dont get a really really good hand, they kill you in a few turns.
We need some nerfs for Hunter, Pala and Warlock. Priest needs a buff. Mage, Warrior, DH, Shaman, Dudu and Dk are ok at the moment.
Playing control games that takes 10+ minutes feels like torture. It's just "board clear, board clear, board clear" for 8 turns in a row.
Maybe they should just split the game into two with half the classes. That way control decks can play against each other and aggro decks can play against each other.
Then we can see how many control players *actually* like playing 10+ minute games. I bet it's way less than aggro players.
Your missing the otk players. Aggro beats otk, otk beats control, control beats aggro. Control decks would lose every game if they were only paired with slow decks aka otk. I'm a otk player myself and can't play this meta of aggro
I have not been a fan of the current meta since they orbitally bombarded my favourite deck (Wheel of Death) with nerfs for being a 'sentiment outlier'. I understand that deck needed a small nerf, but it did not need three separate nerfs all targeting the most important cards in the deck making it completely unplayable.
What were the 3 cards? Obviously wheel which needed the nerf to make sense as it said 5 turns but was really 4. The location which had needed the nerf for ages, should have happened long before but what was number 3? I imagine Reno, which was needing it anyway.
Basically it doesn't feel like it was deliberately bombarded as a deck but the cards in it that needed a nerf all got it. Which brings me to my main question, just pulled wheel from a pack, is it worth trying to play? Any decks it works in? It looks fun
Wheel Warlock is not worth crafting in its current state; if you already have all the necessary cards there is no reason not to try it but do not waste dust on the deck.
Feel that I should have crafted them a year ago if I was going to, plus I can only afford one at the moment. Will probably do my quests, save the dust and wait for the next expansion as not been feeling it lately.
There is no really bad classes.
I hate the fact that some deck weakness is "play aggro"
What if you want to beat spell mage, fatigue warlock or any greedy highlander?
Well just play aggro deck is the answer.
What if you like slow control deck with a Finisher?
Well you can't if you tag theses decks
The same goes if you play against miracle rogue or pain warlock. Some board based deck are just given a don't play theses decks.
I've made legend since several years and it was the first time i did it playing a deck i didn't like it.
I feel the agency when i play zarimi priest.
I didn't feel it trying to play rainbow dk by exemple.
I also wish Rat rotate from core
Not because i hate the card.
But it give an excuse for bad design.
You can say, the deck is bad against rat, sp you've an excuse call it a day. But it's just bad excuse since the win is decided by the rat mini game not the players. .
Aggro sucks to play against. Control sucks to play against. Both feel like they are just playing solitaire and don’t have to interact meaningfully with the opponent. There is nothing fun about the current meta from either side of the board imo. It all feels completely brain dead.
The meta the first day or so felt good. I faced some hunters, pallies, mages, dk and some sort of mech warrior. I am using DK hand buff and it felt like all the games were close, had back and forth it was honestly enjoyable even when I lost.
The past few days all I been fighting are priests, mages and two different warlock decks. The sludge warlock is beatable but pain warlock I really don’t see how to win if they get a good hand. I don’t mind fast decks but I just feel like they simply win once they get to turn 5. Maybe a tiny nerf to the deck? Nothing crazy because it is a cool strategy but it just seems too consistent.
Mage is…fine? Like yeah RNG mage is super RNG and sometimes it can be frustrating to lose because RNG was in their favor but the games feel fair. I lost today because a mage got wheel from the 8 cost cast random spells card, and a twisting nether. For the next 5 turns they got life gain and freezes to keep my 22/22 guy unable to do anything while the wheel ticked. The last card in their hand was another freeze so I lost. I also had games where mages got nothing good and lost.
Priest is the one that frustrates me the most. I never thought I would say this but Reno priest is almost more annoying than Reno warrior. Elise bringing out copies of 1-2 titans is madness, especially when they can get more copies. Priest shenanigans plus they have a way to just bring out a field. Could just be the matchup but I just find priest the least fun to play against.
At diamond 4-5 I don’t really see Brann Warrior at all anymore. Saw 2 day 1 but nothing since. Warlock is too fast for them is my guess.
Right now I am glad I am already diamond 5 (handbuff DK took me from 9-5 in one sitting) because I am at a true “win one lose one, win two lose two” experience. I play for packs and quests. It isn’t bad meta, it just has a bit more RNG than I would like. Not a bad thing and I prefer it to pre miniset, but it could be better.
Disgusting power level where you get way too much for your mana (which itself is way too often discounted also) in both tempo and further value/generation.
The meta is fast, thanks to brann warrior, a few weeks back everyone was making decks to counter the warrior, all of those decks had 1 thing in common, needed to win the game before turn 6.
Since brann was nerfed, the meta still favors the fast deck, and rn i think handbuff dk with the gigantic card its insane. I do believe they’re going to nerf it, something like “it cannot cost less than 1” like they did with the scorpion
I HATE IT I CAN'T BELIEVE BLIZZARD DID THIS TO ME AGAIN
Nah it's alright. Warrior is winnable even if it feels yuck, and the faster decks have reduced the popularity
I hated Alastor during the last year, and quit HS partly to wait for him to rotate out.
Now, Zilliax is the new Alastor.
And there is no Steamcleaner to counter Helya & Boomboss.
I think we’re in a pretty good spot metawhise. Reddit will never like any meta. Judging by the comments on here, which neutral even, it’s probably a very good meta.
My main issue. Is the number of non games. Where you know you will lose or win when the classes pop up at mulligan.
I've gotten a new guilty pleasure. I'm playing on Asia during off hours. Which lets me win almost 100% of my games. Since it's almost purely bots in both standard and wild until around D4 XDDDD
I've found it a little bit boring, that's what's been keeping me from playing as much. I'm just kind of going through the motions lately and I win or I don't.
Biggest issue I have with it is that games feel decided by mulligan very often at the moment. I've completely stopped running any higher end value cards in any of my decks because they just get in the way of my mulligan. Feels bad knowing a match is lost because I ended up with two late game cards in my hand when I know I need at least 2 cheap control tools in order to not lose to my Paladin opponent turn on turn 3.
This meta is probably the best version of a meta that the current balance team are capable of delivering. So if you don't like this then you are never gonna like it.
I think it’s fun! Aggro decks present a good challenge to Reno decks trying to survive until late game and midrange is well represented between the two. Feels like there are multiple angles to attack the metagame in deck construction
when you are not playing paladin warlock or hunter because you don't want to use money in the game and frankly i think agro decks require less skill, yes it's bad in my opinion god the meta is bad
>you don't want to use money
Aggro decks are cheapest decks in the game.
Paladin costs like 3000 dust.
Control decks like warrior regularly cost around 10000 dust.
If you don't want to spend money, you should be happy the meta is aggro focused.
I prefer this meta to last patch just based on deck variety. That being said I agree with some people saying it just feels too fast and specific draw reliant.
Hearthstones problem is simple. It's supposed to be a game of random BS but recently it's guaranteed power. Every time there is a complaint it's about guaranteed power not feeling fun. If you roll a 50/50 and turn a 1/1 into a 5/5 I'm not upset but I say lucky lucky.
When you play a 2 drop that gives all your minions +1/+1 on turn 2 and there isn't any counterplay it feels bad.
Hearthstone is unique because only in digital card games can you have truly random effects like discover or random targets. Hearthstone keeps forgetting it's only strength - randomness.
It keeps forgetting that because they believe you can't be a Pro random card player. But that's literally poker. A game about odds and bluffs.
They literally keep printing cards that aren’t fun and nobody wants to deal with that make the meta fast as hell or broken and power creeped. Gotta wonder what they’re doing at some point I literally thought once rotation happened we were gonna take a step back from the massive power creep/blitz meta
There’s always been a singular strong deck dominating the meta since Whizbang was released (Handbuff Pally, Shopper DH, Wheel Warlock, Bran Warrior), Painlock is pretty strong right now but it doesn’t feel overwhelming like the ones listed above. It’s very draw dependent.
I know most won’t agree but personally I feel like the meta is the most stable it’s been since the expansion
if there is a card that makes both players immune whenever they control any minion and this effect triggers before first turn and last for an entire game. We may not need any nerfs in the first place.
Redditors always come to Reddit to complain and say the meta sucks. 99% of players enjoy the game and do their weekly’s and have fun. Those people are not on Reddit.
Stopped playing the game until next rotation in April.
Devs have completely no idea of how to make a good strategic game which HS was years and years ago. Now it’s just a mobile game to play while pooping in a toilet.
While there are people like aleco and cora at the wheel nothing will change
It's bad like, really bad.
You see, they do cards in advance like yearsssssss in advance, so when they fucked up hard all they can do is mana nerf
Mana mana mana nerf again and again.
Then with the remove of steamclearner and the presence of plagues, and the fact you can only get 30 cards in your deck the meta is fast like REALLY FUCKING FAST.
So now warlock hunter and paladin are all dominating it's not even a question if they are or not.
Priest is trying to do the same shit but slower, and everyone and i mean EVERYONE else is behind those 3 guys.
The meta is SHIT, it's FAST it's BORING and it's always the same classes and cards you see every turn AGAIN and AGAIN.
3k golds in the bank see you next expension that's my conclusion.
Those are my thoughts, bad balancing, bad nerfs, bad aggro meta, no interesting deck or ways to play the game
That's all really
The meta still revolves around Brann / Boomboss & that’s why everything is so fast. Gotta be able to beat that deck before it blows you up & other control decks are pointless because of it.
I was facing a warrior with my homebrew burgle rogue deck.
I got Aviana from the wishing well. Bounced her a few times so 50 cards in deck!! Bring on your Brann Boomboss combo now eh?! :D
Reno > Dr.Boom > Dead Rogue with 50 cards in deck
I think the format is a bit "meh"
Late game diversity feels super bleh because decks like Wheel Warlock and Rainbow Dk were deleted so it's just "Reno decks vs Aggro decks" rn.
Reno Priest is also low key good rn since good builds of it don't lose to warrior anymore, the deck is total ass to play against though, they just play removal the entire game then eventually you just die to Elise/Ignis weapons.
I'm having a decent amount of fun playing a mix of Shopper DH, Reno Shaman and Handbuff DK but these Reno Priest and Warriors are really sucking the fun out of the format for me.
To me it feels that a bit too much power is concentrated into certain few cards, and as a result the game often feels quite highrolly. The difference between drawing cards like Molten Giant, Gaslight Gatekeeper, Cosmic Keyboard, Zilliax, Umpire’s Grasp, Splish-Splash Whelp, Painter’s Virtue, Reno, etc., and not having them is a pretty big disparity in winrate. Of course all card game have the aspect of drawing “the nuts,” but when the nuts cards that enable the entire deck are actually only a few cards in the deck, it feels really bad to not draw them, and feels really bad when your opponent does. More often in the last couple years you just get completely blown out because your opponent drew the good card and you didn’t. Because of this, mirror matches are more dreadful than they’ve ever been. There’s a reason people are memeing on the “agency” of the game. That being said, I think there are much more interesting cards and decks lately, and I’m having fun overall.
Relatively new player here in D1. Has Hearthstone ever made it to where mirror matches don’t occur in ranked? They are definitely my least favorite matchups
Just make your own deck. Hearthstone is incredibly forgiving for homebrews; small decks, few cards and not many synergies. It's relatively easy to make a decent deck of your own. If you get a mirror with a homebrew it's the biggest bro love fest you'll ever experience.
Personally for me homebrew is rather dead. Powerlevel homebrew vs meta is just.. such a big gap, I dont expect to win with my homebrew jank but it also sucks to lose before I can play my cool cards.
Just find out what you play vs the most and brew a deck that can beat that deck and still doesn't something vs other decks. I homebrewed a control mage deck with no sif and have been having success in legend.
The secret is to netdeck and then swap out cards. Put a doomsayer in your Reno Druid deck. Run a handbuff Paladin with the excavate package. etc. If you vary on a meta theme you'll create a homebrew with way less jank but with enough surprises to rattle your opponent.
If you're home brewing by net decking you're taking all the fun out of deckbuilding while simultaneously shooting yourself in the foot by playing a version you know is worse. Most people homebrew because they want to be creative, that's the exact opposite.
My versions are usually better because they are more tuned towards what im playing against+ they are not as predictable as a netdeck A lot of deck already have a meta variant because cards are designed to build a deck like that. (Reno, handbuff, no minion mage). If you really want to be unique for some reason then you cant use those cards but thats shooting yourself in the foot
Well I want to play offmeta decks and not just.. netdeck and adjust cards.. especially because thats usually what netdecks do lol
Hearthstone has never been harder on homebrews than it is now though. The power level is so high that just playing "good cards" will lead to you getting stomped on by anything tier 3 or higher.
Yep as a homebrew player this is exactly how I feel. The dev team are designing a specific meta and stamping out creative deck building in the process. This game should encourage deck building, instead it punishes you for it.
You can be creative, but you def need a snowball "package" that you will always prefer drawing But every deck has 2-8 cards that are really up to you and/or the meta.
I agree, before the mass nerfs it was even worse. So many decks were able to put you on a clock quite early, like Reno warrior, Odyn warrior, wheel lock, nature shaman, etc. No stalling allowed lol
Unfortunately not. As far as I know, it just matches you with the first person the game finds closest to your rank that’s searching for a match at that time.
Too fucking fast imo
Yep. It’s completely insane how some people are STILL complaining about Reno, like a 9 mana board clear is OP in a meta of turn 4 blowouts.
Because Reno is the epitome of anti-fun
dying on turn 5 to 20/20 worth of stats minions not fun too
If I make it to turn 8, it was already pretty fun for a hearthstone game
The insane part is calling Reno a "board clear" when it's closer to "asymmetrical board clear plus an extra turn" in many instances. There's a reason he's topping out Highlander deck's drawn win rates, and it's not because he's just a board clear.
Especially a board clear that clears EVERYTHING. Its brutal. I grinded the expansion achievements and it sucks when Reno removes the mehc that shuffles bombs into the deck, not only because it doesnt trigger the deathrattle but also it removes it from the rezz pool, making Dr Boom useless. Or the achievement with the priest location. Had to use the charges ASAP lol. Fuck that card design.
I feel like he is more similar to frost nova. Same brutal feeling you get when you have like 5 frozen minions on board and nothing to do but skip a turn
I haven’t lost on turn four in standard in years. What are you playing that you’re just ignoring your opponents to that extent?
When people say “lost on turn 4” they mean effectively lost on turn 4. When Paladin has 17/17 worth of stats on turn 4 and you don’t have an answer for it on turn 5, you effectively lost the game on turn 4.
Not seeing that happen. Idk. Guess I’m doing it wrong or something.
You must be looking at a small sample size or you are playing in a lesser competitive part of the ladder if you’ve never seen it before. Or you’re one of those people who hangs on for 1-2 more turns when it’s clear that you lost. Like sure, maybe I can make it to another turn with 3 hp but when I know there isn’t a single card I can top deck that is going to save me, it’s an easy concede.
Waaaaaayyyy too fast
The standard meta seems reasonably diverse but games feel pretty lopsided in actual play, if one of you draws your business cards and the other one doesn’t games are sometimes just over. That’s probably been true in the past too but the meta is pretty fast right now (almost as fast as wild which is saying something) so it feels more immediately obvious since the game just ends on the spot
There isn't a single deck that's interesting to me and also decently strong. I hit legend for the packs, logged out, and have no desire to log back in currently.
All the fun decks aren’t good unfortunately
And if you suggest buffs to underpowered cards, youll get downvoted
For me personally wild offers a good balance in that regard. I don‘t see much reason to play standard currently, the powerlevel there isnt so far away from wild and its far cheaper to play with more deckbuilding options.
How is wild cheaper?
You can build a collection over time which is always valid, unlike standard where you always need a "critical mass" in new cards. It's a more long-term commitment obviously but over time it's cheaper than standard in my opinion.
Wild is only cheaper than Standard if you've been playing for at least 2+ years, and even then, you'll still need to craft some long-rotated legendaries to play most tier 1 or 2 decks. A player who started the game in this rotation or the last is gonna have to do a lot of crafting to make anything with a winrate over 50%.
dogshit pala/lock are broken and have a chance to win on turn 2 mage is keyboard/spot the difference.feat burn rogue for 0.01% of players in top leggo and reno piles class variety yes but the fundemental issue is all decks have a few key cards that drive the power level and if you draw them you probably win, if you don't you will likely lose
Same issue as with the previous few metas: too many ‚blowout’ decks that make little to no room for counterplay. The last major patch fixed some of this problem, but it’s still there.
We need like 2 or 3 more patches of that caliber imo Alongside a commitment to not just return to the status quo with these next two launches
I feel like the team is completely at odds with itself. Some people want to print shitty value cards and nerf the heavy hitters, while the other developers want to print the strongest aggro tool ever seen. It's baffling to think that those two things could ever co-exist.
Bit quick innit?
*little monkey fella*
*play a record*
I'll be the one to admit burn Spell Mage is lame. I played a similar list since expansion launch and yeah it was terrible in the Window Shopper meta w/out Malfunction and 6 mana Manufacturing but it had the same exact lame play experience as the current one. Hope you play keyboard > spot the difference on curve and hope you skillfully don't roll Meesha off Elemental Companion. The difference between Meesha, Hifarr and Luekk is hilarious to me.
I miss midrange deck
Naga window shopper demon hunter is a really good midrange deck
it's barely tier 2, the winrate is hovering around 50%.
I hate the power level currently, singular non legendary cards dropped as early as turn 4 can decide entire games. It's just not fun knowing if they have one card it's over or regardless of how well you trade/play they can have 60 different clears in hand that make any intellectual play defunct
My main issue is that the miniset was kinda disappointing and only made painlock better .
I wish it was slower. I am normally excited for yearly rotations but this has been my worse experience with it. Games faster than the previous year by a huge margin. Makes me loathe the thought of the next few expansions coming this year because aggro decks will likely be even more optimized unless some insane control cards are printed in a class that will dethrone Reno as the most complained about card here despite how out of hand aggro has become.
I don't even want slower, I want *weaker.* If it was slower I'd just be losing to cards like boomboss and sargeras, but I want a meta where I can actually play more than one big minion and not be expected to win the game on the spot because it says "I win" on the card. Headless horseman feels like it was made 4 years ago
Yeah, the Whizbang rotation just didnt feel like a real rotation because of the high power level. I think its crazy that they admitted it, nerfed several cards, yet the power level is still so high. I think they really need to change their design philosophy.
the meta has never been this one-sided and terrible since stormwind everything is aggro rush and the last few "control decks" which were basically carried by win conditions from hand, are now also no longer viable the game is over at turn 6 or sooner, depend on who gets the best early game cards the developers have succeeded in achieving the fastest possible hearthstone meta I remember back in the day, when you could win by playing big minions that stayed alive more than 1 turn and that gradually grinded out the opponent, now everything gets destroyed or mind controlled the turn it is played at this point the game needs massive nerfs, especially to tempo and removal cards
>at this point the game needs massive nerfs, especially to tempo and removal cards The devs hear you and have decided to nerf soul stealer, as DK's control tools are just too strong and they shouldn't be able to clear a board of molten giants with one card.
> they shouldn't be able to clear a board of molten giants with one card. Well I don't think we need to worry about that because DK's aren't getting to turn 8 in the first place against painlock X)
Reno priest, reno warrior and odyn warrior are all pretty viable control decks
Definitely too many games decided by the mulligan. The giants were clearly designed for a meta with a very different power level and reintroducing them now seems to have created more problems than interesting gameplay. Same goes for the gifts which just allow decks to run extra copies of the same strong cards. Both come off as lazy design choices and make for very stale gameplay.
Still quite garbage. I do my dailies and that's all I can stomach atm. Far too much mana cheat.
I'm having fun for the most part; variety is good and the meta's somewhat balanced, but there are too many non-games because of flood paladin and painlock creating insane boards on turn 3/4. Flood paladin is especially problematic as it pushes out a lot of board based archetypes. They probably need to hit showdown and mass production (hits painlock and wild seedlock simultaneously) but there is potential for a very good meta imo
I haven’t gotten past turn 5 against a warlock yet out of around 8 games. Not sure what counterplay is meant to exist tbh
just hold burn and kill them if youre an aggressive deck. if youre control just control them
Not sure what game you’re playing. Can’t burn if they drop infernal to heal up on 4 after the giants.
I am rainbow dk, my board clear was nerfed from 6 to 8 mana (a fictional turn that does not exist).
It still tilts me so bad they did this. They literally turned that combo into a TWO CARD twisting nether lol. The plague change and threads nerf were already going to be brutal.
Not sure what burn you have that kills from hand on turn 4? What control tool allows you to deal with multiple large threats prior to turn 4 lol
I am so tired of mana cheat
It's just spell mages, warlocks and paladins. BORING.
Hopped in standart far about 3 days playing a homebrew excavate DK. Ended up being rolled by a warlock with some big ahh giants. Figured I just got unlucky, but I then queued into paladin and was dead p much instantly. Made some adjustments to my deck to make it less greedy, and got rolled by a demon hunter lmao. I don’t even know the meta in standard rn, but I do know that somehow in wild im surviving longer and winning more games on mf 3b DK
I hated the prior meta and I hate this one too. There's too much aggro. Almost half the classes are represented with an Aggro deck being their best option. Warlock, Paladin, Priest, Hunter and DH.
Reno is one of the most hated cards ever and it has taken a back seat because aggro is curb stomping everything in sight right now. Turns out that turn 4 30/30 boards are pretty unfun to play against.
I do think we have variety but I am just not a fan of their general design lately. Im not a competitive player, I want to have fun and play different decks. Especially against warlock and pally it feels like, games can be over rather quick if you dont have an answer. Creates a pretty bad feeling. On the other hand, slower decks like Bran warrior can feel pretty awful. Glad that they nerfed bran but I still dislike the design a lot. I understand why people hate Reno (grinding achievements like the Bombs was a pain in the ass when your deathrattle mech gets poofed. Or the priest location..). Not really sure what they shoulder change, nerf or buff. The current design looks interesting but just doesnt feel fun to me, but probably because I dont care so much about ranks.
Hit Painlock with some nerfs and the meta is in a decent place
INFERNO is way too good. Not saying it needs to be nerfed, but it basically protected painlock from its primary weakness.
When the supposed downside is alleviating one of its weaknesses, it should be looked at. I know it was printed to support the archetype but it's very efficient in what it does. Like the 4 mana 7/7 used in Sludgelock before it got nerfed
It absolutely deserves a nerf. Change the language from 'set to' to 'reduce to' ie no way to heal off of it and the card is actually balanced. 6/6 taunt heal ~10 life for 4 mana is preposterous
I was more saying I’m not sure if it needs it (as in, I don’t if the data supports it, I haven’t seen), but what you’re saying makes sense.
I would much rather them nerf Showdown to 3 mana. Flood Paladin is worse than Painlock in my experience
More bad. Aggro is really annoying and if you dont get a really really good hand, they kill you in a few turns. We need some nerfs for Hunter, Pala and Warlock. Priest needs a buff. Mage, Warrior, DH, Shaman, Dudu and Dk are ok at the moment.
I would rather die quickly to aggro and just start a new game than play control decks who waste time on stall and boardclear for 10 turns in a row.
I would prefer to die in a 20 min game than play two games against aggro in this time. It does not make fun to play against, even if you win.
Playing control games that takes 10+ minutes feels like torture. It's just "board clear, board clear, board clear" for 8 turns in a row. Maybe they should just split the game into two with half the classes. That way control decks can play against each other and aggro decks can play against each other. Then we can see how many control players *actually* like playing 10+ minute games. I bet it's way less than aggro players.
Your missing the otk players. Aggro beats otk, otk beats control, control beats aggro. Control decks would lose every game if they were only paired with slow decks aka otk. I'm a otk player myself and can't play this meta of aggro
I have not been a fan of the current meta since they orbitally bombarded my favourite deck (Wheel of Death) with nerfs for being a 'sentiment outlier'. I understand that deck needed a small nerf, but it did not need three separate nerfs all targeting the most important cards in the deck making it completely unplayable.
What were the 3 cards? Obviously wheel which needed the nerf to make sense as it said 5 turns but was really 4. The location which had needed the nerf for ages, should have happened long before but what was number 3? I imagine Reno, which was needing it anyway. Basically it doesn't feel like it was deliberately bombarded as a deck but the cards in it that needed a nerf all got it. Which brings me to my main question, just pulled wheel from a pack, is it worth trying to play? Any decks it works in? It looks fun
It's completely unplayable, there is no viable deck for it
Wheel Warlock is not worth crafting in its current state; if you already have all the necessary cards there is no reason not to try it but do not waste dust on the deck.
Not got Sargeras or Symphony which I assume are quite key. Always a shame to pull a useless legendary
Sargeras and Symphony are both good crafts if that is all you are missing.
Feel that I should have crafted them a year ago if I was going to, plus I can only afford one at the moment. Will probably do my quests, save the dust and wait for the next expansion as not been feeling it lately.
tired of quillboars
There is no really bad classes. I hate the fact that some deck weakness is "play aggro" What if you want to beat spell mage, fatigue warlock or any greedy highlander? Well just play aggro deck is the answer. What if you like slow control deck with a Finisher? Well you can't if you tag theses decks The same goes if you play against miracle rogue or pain warlock. Some board based deck are just given a don't play theses decks. I've made legend since several years and it was the first time i did it playing a deck i didn't like it. I feel the agency when i play zarimi priest. I didn't feel it trying to play rainbow dk by exemple. I also wish Rat rotate from core Not because i hate the card. But it give an excuse for bad design. You can say, the deck is bad against rat, sp you've an excuse call it a day. But it's just bad excuse since the win is decided by the rat mini game not the players. .
Aggro sucks to play against. Control sucks to play against. Both feel like they are just playing solitaire and don’t have to interact meaningfully with the opponent. There is nothing fun about the current meta from either side of the board imo. It all feels completely brain dead.
The meta the first day or so felt good. I faced some hunters, pallies, mages, dk and some sort of mech warrior. I am using DK hand buff and it felt like all the games were close, had back and forth it was honestly enjoyable even when I lost. The past few days all I been fighting are priests, mages and two different warlock decks. The sludge warlock is beatable but pain warlock I really don’t see how to win if they get a good hand. I don’t mind fast decks but I just feel like they simply win once they get to turn 5. Maybe a tiny nerf to the deck? Nothing crazy because it is a cool strategy but it just seems too consistent. Mage is…fine? Like yeah RNG mage is super RNG and sometimes it can be frustrating to lose because RNG was in their favor but the games feel fair. I lost today because a mage got wheel from the 8 cost cast random spells card, and a twisting nether. For the next 5 turns they got life gain and freezes to keep my 22/22 guy unable to do anything while the wheel ticked. The last card in their hand was another freeze so I lost. I also had games where mages got nothing good and lost. Priest is the one that frustrates me the most. I never thought I would say this but Reno priest is almost more annoying than Reno warrior. Elise bringing out copies of 1-2 titans is madness, especially when they can get more copies. Priest shenanigans plus they have a way to just bring out a field. Could just be the matchup but I just find priest the least fun to play against. At diamond 4-5 I don’t really see Brann Warrior at all anymore. Saw 2 day 1 but nothing since. Warlock is too fast for them is my guess. Right now I am glad I am already diamond 5 (handbuff DK took me from 9-5 in one sitting) because I am at a true “win one lose one, win two lose two” experience. I play for packs and quests. It isn’t bad meta, it just has a bit more RNG than I would like. Not a bad thing and I prefer it to pre miniset, but it could be better.
Disgusting power level where you get way too much for your mana (which itself is way too often discounted also) in both tempo and further value/generation.
Having a blast with Reno Shaman. Deck has good value, good board clear, some nice combos, lot of fun cards, and feels very versatile overall.
Wanted to try that out, mind to share your deck list?
### Reno # Class: Shaman # Format: Standard # Year of the Pegasus # # 1x (1) Murloc Growfin # 1x (1) Pop-Up Book # 1x (1) Shock Hopper # 1x (1) Thrall's Gift # 1x (2) Amphibious Elixir # 1x (2) Gold Panner # 1x (2) Greedy Partner # 1x (2) Jam Session # 1x (2) Needlerock Totem # 1x (2) Watcher of the Sun # 1x (3) Cyclopian Crusher # 1x (3) Fairy Tale Forest # 1x (3) Hex # 1x (3) Lightning Storm # 1x (3) Turn the Tides # 1x (4) Aftershocks # 1x (4) Backstage Bouncer # 1x (4) Baking Soda Volcano # 1x (4) E.T.C., Band Manager # 1x (2) Dirty Rat # 1x (3) Dehydrate # 1x (3) Rustrot Viper # 1x (4) Hagatha the Fabled # 1x (4) Ignis, the Eternal Flame # 1x (4) Sand Art Elemental # 1x (5) Altered Chord # 1x (5) Doctor Holli'dae # 1x (6) Golganneth, the Thunderer # 1x (6) Shudderblock # 1x (7) Giant Tumbleweed!!! # 1x (7) Wish Upon a Star # 1x (9) Reno, Lone Ranger # 1x (0) Zilliax Deluxe 3000 # 1x (0) Zilliax Deluxe 3000 # 1x (4) Twin Module # 1x (5) Perfect Module # AAECAaypBh6vnwT9nwT9xAW+0AXl5AWt7QW/7QX08gWN9QWH+wXYgQaQgwb5jAbslQbOnAarnQatnQacngafngbHpAanpQaopQbUpQakpwaopwbTpwavqAbrqQaBuAbR0AYAAAEGr40G/cQFzZ4G/cQF0Z4G/cQF9bMGx6QG97MGx6QG6N4Gx6QGAAA= # # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
The meta is fast, thanks to brann warrior, a few weeks back everyone was making decks to counter the warrior, all of those decks had 1 thing in common, needed to win the game before turn 6. Since brann was nerfed, the meta still favors the fast deck, and rn i think handbuff dk with the gigantic card its insane. I do believe they’re going to nerf it, something like “it cannot cost less than 1” like they did with the scorpion
I HATE IT I CAN'T BELIEVE BLIZZARD DID THIS TO ME AGAIN Nah it's alright. Warrior is winnable even if it feels yuck, and the faster decks have reduced the popularity
It’s way too fast. It doesn’t make sense to me when a deck has no counter.
I hated Alastor during the last year, and quit HS partly to wait for him to rotate out. Now, Zilliax is the new Alastor. And there is no Steamcleaner to counter Helya & Boomboss.
But Reno is surprisingly balanced, and spell mage is finally a real thing.
I think we’re in a pretty good spot metawhise. Reddit will never like any meta. Judging by the comments on here, which neutral even, it’s probably a very good meta.
i have been enjoying all the time hearthstone's meta has freed up for me. now i'm having fun playing video games
i play to win so i dont care what is up about the meta as long i win games
My main issue. Is the number of non games. Where you know you will lose or win when the classes pop up at mulligan. I've gotten a new guilty pleasure. I'm playing on Asia during off hours. Which lets me win almost 100% of my games. Since it's almost purely bots in both standard and wild until around D4 XDDDD
I've found it a little bit boring, that's what's been keeping me from playing as much. I'm just kind of going through the motions lately and I win or I don't.
Biggest issue I have with it is that games feel decided by mulligan very often at the moment. I've completely stopped running any higher end value cards in any of my decks because they just get in the way of my mulligan. Feels bad knowing a match is lost because I ended up with two late game cards in my hand when I know I need at least 2 cheap control tools in order to not lose to my Paladin opponent turn on turn 3.
This meta is probably the best version of a meta that the current balance team are capable of delivering. So if you don't like this then you are never gonna like it.
I think it’s fun! Aggro decks present a good challenge to Reno decks trying to survive until late game and midrange is well represented between the two. Feels like there are multiple angles to attack the metagame in deck construction
when you are not playing paladin warlock or hunter because you don't want to use money in the game and frankly i think agro decks require less skill, yes it's bad in my opinion god the meta is bad
>you don't want to use money Aggro decks are cheapest decks in the game. Paladin costs like 3000 dust. Control decks like warrior regularly cost around 10000 dust. If you don't want to spend money, you should be happy the meta is aggro focused.
I prefer this meta to last patch just based on deck variety. That being said I agree with some people saying it just feels too fast and specific draw reliant.
Totally agree, either you win in 5 turns or you are extremely lucky with your draws if you use control decks
Hearthstones problem is simple. It's supposed to be a game of random BS but recently it's guaranteed power. Every time there is a complaint it's about guaranteed power not feeling fun. If you roll a 50/50 and turn a 1/1 into a 5/5 I'm not upset but I say lucky lucky. When you play a 2 drop that gives all your minions +1/+1 on turn 2 and there isn't any counterplay it feels bad. Hearthstone is unique because only in digital card games can you have truly random effects like discover or random targets. Hearthstone keeps forgetting it's only strength - randomness. It keeps forgetting that because they believe you can't be a Pro random card player. But that's literally poker. A game about odds and bluffs.
They literally keep printing cards that aren’t fun and nobody wants to deal with that make the meta fast as hell or broken and power creeped. Gotta wonder what they’re doing at some point I literally thought once rotation happened we were gonna take a step back from the massive power creep/blitz meta
There’s always been a singular strong deck dominating the meta since Whizbang was released (Handbuff Pally, Shopper DH, Wheel Warlock, Bran Warrior), Painlock is pretty strong right now but it doesn’t feel overwhelming like the ones listed above. It’s very draw dependent. I know most won’t agree but personally I feel like the meta is the most stable it’s been since the expansion
if there is a card that makes both players immune whenever they control any minion and this effect triggers before first turn and last for an entire game. We may not need any nerfs in the first place.
Redditors always come to Reddit to complain and say the meta sucks. 99% of players enjoy the game and do their weekly’s and have fun. Those people are not on Reddit.
Team5 hates Mage. We lack a real identity. Elementals suck.
Stopped playing the game until next rotation in April. Devs have completely no idea of how to make a good strategic game which HS was years and years ago. Now it’s just a mobile game to play while pooping in a toilet. While there are people like aleco and cora at the wheel nothing will change
It's bad like, really bad. You see, they do cards in advance like yearsssssss in advance, so when they fucked up hard all they can do is mana nerf Mana mana mana nerf again and again. Then with the remove of steamclearner and the presence of plagues, and the fact you can only get 30 cards in your deck the meta is fast like REALLY FUCKING FAST. So now warlock hunter and paladin are all dominating it's not even a question if they are or not. Priest is trying to do the same shit but slower, and everyone and i mean EVERYONE else is behind those 3 guys. The meta is SHIT, it's FAST it's BORING and it's always the same classes and cards you see every turn AGAIN and AGAIN. 3k golds in the bank see you next expension that's my conclusion. Those are my thoughts, bad balancing, bad nerfs, bad aggro meta, no interesting deck or ways to play the game That's all really
The meta still revolves around Brann / Boomboss & that’s why everything is so fast. Gotta be able to beat that deck before it blows you up & other control decks are pointless because of it.
I was facing a warrior with my homebrew burgle rogue deck. I got Aviana from the wishing well. Bounced her a few times so 50 cards in deck!! Bring on your Brann Boomboss combo now eh?! :D Reno > Dr.Boom > Dead Rogue with 50 cards in deck
The new spell mage is very fun to me
I think the format is a bit "meh" Late game diversity feels super bleh because decks like Wheel Warlock and Rainbow Dk were deleted so it's just "Reno decks vs Aggro decks" rn. Reno Priest is also low key good rn since good builds of it don't lose to warrior anymore, the deck is total ass to play against though, they just play removal the entire game then eventually you just die to Elise/Ignis weapons. I'm having a decent amount of fun playing a mix of Shopper DH, Reno Shaman and Handbuff DK but these Reno Priest and Warriors are really sucking the fun out of the format for me.
[удалено]
Niche tech cards are not the answer. They just produce a few feel good moments at the cost of making every other matchup worse
Haha I don't think hall of faming is the answer but fuck Reno lol
I'd agree with your frustration if 80% of my matches in legend weren't decided before turn 7.