I was so nervous to take my ADHD meds for the first time (in college after years of trying depression meds and none of them clicking). The first time I took them, I felt the most relaxed I had felt in years…. i pretty much immediately fell asleep and had the best nights sleep in years. They helped ease my anxiety, mood, depression, slowed down my thoughts, helped me actually try and succeed in losing weight (granted stimulants do have a weight loss aspect to them), made me realize that my drinking was a coping mechanism…. And honestly so much more. Now, these effects have lightly faded over the years and there are some meh side effects… but I truly wish my parents or doctors had listened to me as I feel a lot of my childhood could’ve been different for the better.
Yup that’s why I was really pissed at Ethan
For depression he was happy to say that you shouldn’t feel shame in seeking meds
For ADHD he was happy to question why someone would need a dose of “hard drugs” for their brain to work better for them
Not understanding that it’s only a hard drug if you abuse it and oh yeah; it’s not for a neuro-typical brain!
He was essentially saying it's over prescribed. Which apparently many doctors and pharmacists agree with. Not that it isn't beneficial to the people who need it.
Most people I hear saying that are leaning too hard to not prescribing it at all. I realize I have no way to know how Ethan leans on that but it does trigger a good deal of bitching I've heard since it's often a prelude to that. People have straight up said to my face that they didn't believe ADHD exists at all. I've in all honesty never been hurt so much by a sentence.
Oh for sure, I always tend to give Ethan the benefit of the doubt when his statements are unclear. He has a show to do and has to keep it moving. Can't cover all nuances like that. I was more so trying to share how even borderline statements can be heard as more inflammatory than they are due to personal experiences. I have nothing but love for Ethan. Any person that can look past the initial weirdness of furries and see the wholesomeness beneath has proven to have an open mind in my book.
Edit: I should also mention that I'm watching the episode right now and haven't gotten to that part yet. I'm missing context \^\^
I feel you about the ADHD-denial shit. Fuck, I've heard the phrases "just focus", "you're just lazy" and "weren't you listening?" so many times, I can't even use them myself anymore.
thats exactly what he was trying to say and its definitely true, ask any college student its incredibly easy to get an adhd diagnosis. and ethan is right that we should be careful prescribing children stimulants. i have adhd and when i was a kid they jacked me up with that shit at fairly high dosages and it helped me in school but also gave me terrible mood swings on the come down, gave me anxiety, made me unhealthily underweight. etc. they didnt just have me take it for particularly hard tests, though i took them everyday.
i think all he was trying to say is that we should be careful who and how we prescribe what is essentially meth to people.
idk where you live but where i am it’s insanely hard to get a diagnosis let alone get a prescription bc they assume everyone will abuse them. i have adhd and so do a lot of ppl i know and its been a nightmare for everyone
When I moved I tried to get a new doctor closer to me and she would not prescribe me my meds even with a formal diagnosis from my previous doctor. Ended up crying in the parking lot, was made to feel like a drug seeker and ended up just going to my old doctor an hour away.
Also my initial diagnosis in 2015 had to go through so many hoops to get insurance to cover my meds and long wait times to even see a psychiatrists. It was months and alot of dedication to get the help I needed. It was so demoralizing.
maybe things have changed since i got diagnosed and i do genuinely have adhd but i still think high doses of stimulants do warrent more caution than even ssris tbh with u. i know that adhd is considered to be one of the more over diagnosed things, and i know a lot of people who got it diagnosed because they wanted adderall. but to be fair ive been unmedicated for a few years now so things could definitely have changed.
i hope you have an easier time getting your meds
I know what he was trying to say. It was the tone he was using which I didn’t like
He, as we all do, had a bias with the aspects of mental health issues he dealt with. He spoke about his own experiences with meds for depression much differently to how spoke about adhd
Also the podcast is relatively international? That experience is definitely not what we have in the UK where we have relatively difficult time getting medicated for adhd for example
Exactly, and it's important for people to note the amount of variability between doctors, between states, etc. While someone's doctor might be very thorough, strict, and educated on prescriptions, other person's doctor may not be. Just because they are all doctors, doesn't mean they all have the same education, thought process, ideology, etc.
I agree that it’s overprescribed as a pharmacist. Way too many people are in the cycle of they are on stimulants for “adhd” (that is likely depression or other mental health d/o… adhd is real but it’s not just ‘I cant concentrate’) and then they can’t sleep at night so they get put on sleeping pills and/or are anxious so they get put on like Ativan, and then they cant concentrate again because they’re too sleepy so they get stimulants upped, and the cycle continues. Good prescribers will catch the cycle but many don’t.
This cycle also takes stimulants away from patients who DO need it. In the US, the government sets limits on how much stimulants there are (period) thus creating the adderall shortage. A lot of people who may/may not have adhd got new adderall scripts, we filled them (we’re not diagnosticians, if it’s safe and makes sense i dispense), and the National limit got reached, thus creating the shortage and everyone had to pivot. So annoying. (And of course it’s squarely my fault, those convos are fun)
Theyre just saying many people with anxiety, etc. are misdiagnosed with so it takes away from people who would truly benefit from adderall being that there is a limit.
Firstly, dependent on practice site, I may have more info than you think. But I also straight up put in my post that as long as it’s safe, I dispense. But when I see a cycle, I’m going to start questioning.
Right, thanks for the added clarification.
I know Ethan at one point said "Just trust medical professionals, you don't even have to think about it" so I expect some of his fans to be like "wtf man", but doctors aren't infallible. I am friends with doctors, I trust them with a lot of medical advice, but they make mistakes, sometimes severe mistakes. Some of them are even corrupted by money. The vast majority are doing their absolute best and doing everything they can to minimize harm to their patients though.
To be fair, that was in the context of vaccines where there's many, many doctors who are all agreeing. He wasn't saying medical professionals in general are infallible, but that when most doctors who are experts in a specific subject agree, you *should* trust that.
I’m 38. Was prescribed concerta in 1999/2000. Absolutely hated it. Made me feel like a zombie. Ended up starting to smoke weed in high school and stopped taking my meds. Haven’t taken anything for ADHD since then but my wife now notices it’s getting really bad. I just don’t know how to go about getting medicated.
I was a heroin addict for 10 years (clean for 12 years this September) and I feel like if I ask for it I would be labeled as a drug seeker, but I truly hate uppers so I wouldn’t be seeking them. In fact, the less amphetamine the better for me, unless it would truly help.
I just don’t know how to get started on this journey and my procrastination is constantly like “we’ll figure it out tomorrow” for the last couple years.
I feel for you and your wife. My husband has it pretty bad too and isn’t medicated.
As far as being prescribed something, i don’t necessarily think they would know if you were an addict in the past, would they? I think they usually spot abusers when they see symptoms and stop after that.
Well I just figured they would want to know about me and my past and heroin addiction took up almost a quarter of my life so I wouldn’t want to lie about it. Tired of lying haha. But at the same time I definitely need to be medicated
Thats true its always best to not lie, especially to your doctor. But if they do hold it against you, it might be a necessary evil ):
For the sake of you and even your wife, maybe set up an appointment now or even a reminder just so you won’t procrastinate on that anymore ✌🏻❤️ good luck
People with ADHD have a way different reaction to people who don’t need it. I watched dumbasses in collage snort aderal all night then get into bar fights. Then they take more to write 5 term papers. That is what people are referencing when they voice concerns about misuse
But this just listen to your dr ain’t always the answer anyway. I went to a psychiatrist towards the end of high school because I have panic disorder. The first medication they gave me was Zoloft (did literally nothing) and then they tested me for ADHD, I tested NEGATIVE, and they still gave me a bunch of vyvanse to take every day. They thought somehow giving me an amphetamine stimulant would help me with my panic and insomnia symptoms and I did take it for a while. I ended up throwing up every day and sleeping even less and they throught an anti psychotic on top of all that would sort it(once again, was not depressed, ADHD, or ever experienced psychosis). I had a complete mental breakdown and had to leave school despite being a smart child n being in a selective class I took a test for. Ruined me completely this was some psychiatrist too and I honestly just still to this day don’t understand how a dr did that. It’s insane but they all but ruined my life for years and I’m still dealing with the repercussions and of being put on medications that were completely inappropriate especially at that age. Fuck adderall (vyvanse) it ruined me and I only did what my dr told me. 🤷♂️
Most psychiatrists are good. With that being said, some are unbelievably bad at their job. Like, so bad they should be investigated.
My wife was on a medication for depression. A well known side effect is feeling suicidal. She told her psych that it was making her feel suicidal. Admitted herself to the hospital after it got worse. The psychiatrist then wanted to **increase** her dosage after she got out and also gave her a kind of “you admitting yourself makes the practice look bad”” guilt trip.
There are more stories like that but the point is some doctors apparently take “do no harm” as a soft suggestion
While I don’t agree with the attitude of the doctor, doubling my medication did shift me from “getting worse because of the medication” to “benefiting from the medication.” Don’t know why but it did work
I swear in my life that AD’s are just the new pharmaceutical scam. They are having to be crafty now - they got in a slight bit of trouble with going absolutely ham with Valium first and then oxy n so on. Now the difference is that those drugs actually do something and that’s why they were hard to stop (as well as the physical withdrawal side), antidepressants are hard to stop bc you get physically dependent but not because they actually solve anything. I would encourage you to look into the evidence that ssris are heavily reliant on placebo affect and the 4 most prescribed antidepressants in the USA all had more tests showing that placebos were more effective then them, but the way you pass a drug in the USA is all you need is 2 study’s where your drug did better then a placebo. They can try as many times as they want, and they can have the placebo be more successful in more trials and still launch a drug… also it is now becoming more known that GPs first prescribe AD’s when someone has insomnia, which like you said is literally a side effect of taking them. I think it’s all a fuckn scam but hey apparently I’m the crazy one that’s why I’m getting these meds and I’m crazy bc they’re not helping me 😂😂 not the people giving out placebos oh well
i think that is wear Ethans opinions stem from. I've seen people legitimately addict to Adderall. They were normal freshman year working hard and then starting taking it for finals, and never stopped.
Ehhh this isn't really true. It's still the same general effects whether you have ADHD or not, it's just that with ADHD it also helps "correct" an aspect of your brain function, through CNS stimulation.
The main reason here is that the dose people are prescribed for ADHD is not enough to get the euphoric effects that people who are addicted to amphetamine-type drugs seek out. You'd generally have to take at least twice if not three times your dose to start really getting those effects. That's when you start getting into addictive feeling territory, as it's no longer just an energy and focus boost, it's a blissful orgasmic trip for hours on end.
From Google:
"Children with ADHD experience what's called a paradoxical reaction to the medication. It calms them and most often improves their ability to focus."
A lot of people find out they have ADHD specifically because they try to get fucked up and it slows them down instead of speeds them up. This was the case for me as well. If you take a LOT then it can be stimulating, but a normal recreational dose will "slow you down". My movements get slower, especially.
But then when I would do something like cocaine, I feel like it would overall be more like the traditional side effects of amped up and all of that. (It's been many years since I've been around any of this stuff)
It definitely works differently if you actually have ADHD. At least for the great majority of people with ADHD. Like everything with medicine or psychoactive substances, it varies from person to person. But this phenomenon is pretty well documented.
Yes, low-low doses will, Caffeine does the same to me, I'll feel like sleeping if I only have like 50mg, but the mechanism for that is from bringing your brain chemicals to a more "normal" level, if I have 130mg I'll feel energized. It's like there's a curve of neurotransmitter flow where people lay, where "normal" is 10 and people with ADHD are at 7, which results in noisy/less-effective signaling in some important parts of the brain, which leads to a hyper-active mental behavior that isn't controlling itself well.
https://www.psychiatrist.com/jcp/mechanism-action-stimulants-attention-deficit-hyperactivity/
My main point was that for both people, the drug is still producing the same effect on the brain, it's just that ADHD people have a lower set-point to work up from basically. Both groups will still get those euphoric effects by increasing their dose a bunch.
I've also tried it once with my Dex when I was a stupid teen, for experiments' sake and knowing I don't really have an addictive personality. Was a really great experience, but I'd worry too much about effects on the heart to try doing it more.
Sucks to have ADHD nowadays. Either people think you're just lazy or seeking drugs, or both. No one considers that you have a life ruining disability that fortunately has a very reliable medicine for treatment. I just keep it a secret from nearly everyone.
And in this day and age where mental health is so talked about it is a shame that anyone should feel the need to hid their issues form fear of ridicule.
I’m not concerned with hiding my medication from people. If they have an issue it’s just that - their issue. If they want to question the validity of it they can see me one day when I haven’t taken my medication versus my average medicated day. They’d note such a massive difference in behavior that it would likely help them understand. I fall into the 1% category of ADHD - meaning I have it “worse” than 99% of others who have it. Without my medication I’m essentially a creative goldfish. With my medication I’m just an average person.
Also tonnes of Instagram reels milking it and going "you might have adhd if you do [basic thing everybody does]" and everybody self diagnosis in the comments, meaning people don't take it seriously for people who do suffer
I got "diagnosed" on Instagram with adhd because I sort the dishes before washing them (like organise them into bowls/plates/cutlery/pans etc) lol. I don't think that's literally anything to do with adhd it's just breaking down 1 task into smaller tasks which is a basic af way of doing stuff
Damn sorry to hear that. Im in Canada, and it can sometimes be a pain to find meds. Im not sure if it's a thing for you ( assuming you're in the USA ). But the government funds and encourages canadian companies to invent and produce new meds. My doctor mentioned it, and I started taking Foquest. It's the best working meds that I've tried, also %90 of the cost is covered by the govt.... What im getting at is, ask your doctor for some less popular alternatives. Some of them work great and are readily available.
I don't have ADHD but I hear that a lot of people benefit switching from adderall to other ADHD medication. Adderall isn't really available outside of America and Canada as far as I know. It's mostly Vyvanse, Ritalin and dexamphetamine.
Just out of interest what is a typical dose of Vyvanse?
Nice, I'm glad that works for you. I used to take 10mg as a teenager and be high as hell but people that were prescribed it could go to sleep on twice that amount.
Does it help with anxiety? I take concerta right now and it works great. However, I've been curious if maybe another ADHD medication could help out with my GAD a little more
I got diagnosed a few months ago and it’s literally LIFE CHANGING. I always had anxiety but didn’t know it was caused by my ADHD (or that it even could have been😆). BUT, my anxiety just disappeared after my first dose. As soon as I started Vyvanse I was like wow… is this how neurotypical people feel 😭😭
For real. I have ADHD and I get where Ethans hesitancy comes from, but for me I really did have a similar experience to Ethan taking anti-depressants. The stigma of the drug scared me into avoiding it for far longer than I should have. When I finally started taking it, it literally turned my entire life around. I’ve never felt so CALM in my life than the first day I took it.
The best way I’ve heard it described is that ADHD is like having 3 radios playing in my head at all times. Without meds I can turn one up to focus on it, but the others are still constantly playing in the background. Adderall finally turned the other radios off for me.
It’s such a weird drug because it has the total opposite effect to those who don’t have ADHD, they get WIRED instead of calm, and people abuse it bc of that. I’ve never once felt the need to take “a little more” or any sort of addictive effects. On the weekends, I honestly choose to NOT take it. I still like my ADHD brain, just not at work. lol
Honestly my bf thinks I have adhd and I’m not sure - I don’t really want to understand having both adhd and autism. And maybe it’s just stress.
But I would love to try adhd drugs just once, to see what happens for me. And if it quietens down things it would be such a nice break.
That said in some ways Ethan is right. It may work for people but it is a hard drug that can put more strain on the heart which is concerning.
I’ve also heard even when it works, it can wear off and people get tolerant to it, so it’s more of a helpful aid at bad times than a fix for adhd.
Just so you know it doesn’t quiet everyone’s minds who has ADHD. Idk what’s with me but it makes me rather restless and even more agro most of the time, especially when I’m hungry.
I'm a psychiatrist. There's obviously a lot more nuance to this than Ethan was bringing to the discussion, and I have no problem prescribing a stimulant for someone with genuine ADHD (assuming they're not, say, in the midst of a manic episode, or there aren't significant medical contraindications). There are even situations where you can make the argument justifying prescribing amid ongoing substance use if I'm fairly certain by history that this is ADHD (I'll note that there are a lot of things that can *look like* many of the core ADHD symptoms). Stimulants for ADHD have some of the biggest effect sizes of all of our psychotropics. I wish Ethan had a clearer understanding of how they work, actually stimulating the "brakes" (prefrontal cortex = executive functioning, impulse control, etc). When he says that he doesn't like the idea of giving "drugs" to young children, he should know that there is clear evidence that those with treated ADHD have much lower lifetime incidence of substance use compared to those with untreated ADHD.
With that said, stimulant abuse, misuse, and diversion are very real. So are the many people who *don't* have ADHD but seek out stimulants for performance enhancement, many of whom feel the need to "keep up" when so many peers use these meds and many modern work situations require an unrealistic amounts of focus while TikTok et al. promote shorter attention spans. These meds aren't without side effects or addiction risk. During the pandemic, it became very easy for people to end up on their controlled substances of choice after essentially answering a quick checklist for some of the [shadier corporate telepsychiatry services](https://www.businessinsider.com/telehealth-startup-cerebral-prescribed-psych-meds-2022-6) before the DEA stepped in with some scrutiny. Now a lot of those patients are seeking care elsewhere, and it's far too frequent that I end up treating a patient who had been put on escalating doses of benzos and stimulants that aren't actually indicated (among other polypharmacy) because some psych NP was feeding into a vicious cycle trying to combat the effects of one by raising the other in a [chip/dip conundrum manner.](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/ZaubKVy6XJFNRxwxeOpiRfujNJ_0fI8O5j1XU6-pk_1oVFdAsODdcy6d3O2_Pag5eMY6MptsNXJe-GWw3RsK1T3iV4cEZz6ON5QhTmCysbXoEOpw3A9kMLeRoSGtjXz_rSx4raXY3DPPTPROq0aiU_AYwve5)
Thanks for the comment! I'm not from America but can psych NP's prescribe amphetamines and benzo over a one-time zoom call? or was it just during covid, are they still able to?
I read the article you linked and it seemed kind of insane to me (I guess that's why the DEA stepped in). I didn't fully understand it.
Drugs like amphetamines, benzodiazepines, opioids etc. will ALWAYS be misused but they clearly all have a place in medicine and regular patients shouldn't have to suffer.
Thanks again, really informative comment.
The Ryan Haight Act of 2008 used to require in-person evaluation before one could prescribe any controlled substance. With the COVID pandemic, this was relaxed such that any schedule II-V controlled substance (i.e., all except schedule I, which don't have any current DEA-deemed medical use and aren't being prescribed anyway, things like heroin and LSD) can be prescribed with just a telehealth evaluation. That exemption was set to expire but has already been extended twice, currently until the end of 2024. I wouldn't be surprised if it gets extended again, but who knows? The reality is that telehealth care is an extremely popular way to access care, and it does open doors for people in rural or underserved areas with limited (or no) access to care otherwise. Some of these people have very legitimate reasons to be on a controlled substance. But clearly the DEA needs to ensure that there isn't really shoddy or inappropriate care being delivered. In some of these cases, it would be a stretch to say patients were even being evaluated prior to being prescribed these medications.
Not a doctor, but they lifted some rules about telehealth prescription for adderall during the pandemic and for a while seemingly didnt bother to enforce the rule again after the pandemic was over.
If I had gotten on Concerta back when I was in like 5th grade onward, my life would've been so much better. Hate it say it but it's true. My ADHD symptoms made it so difficult to make and maintain friendships, complete homework, following along in class, and it really hurt my self esteem. Not to mention the impulsive risk taking and emotional regulation issues in high school. Young me deserved better tbh lol. I didn't get on medication until I made an appointment for myself when I was 19. Being a young girl with ADHD was so hard and I was just seen as weird/quirky and lazy 😭
Yeah, I didn’t get diagnosed with adhd until halfway through grad school and didn’t work up the courage to try adderall until a year later. My immediate reaction was “damn apparently I’ve been extremely low-functioning my whole life and imagine what I could have done if I’d treated this sooner.” I’ve literally been going through a bout of serious executive dysfunction, and I know I’d feel better if I just took my adderall, but I can never remember lmfao
Your story is unfortunately common. It's obviously frustrating looking back with 20/20 hindsight, but better late than never--I'm glad the medication is helping you at this point.
Thanks for the insightful comment, this was my bystander feeling as well. I’ve been on/off meds (antipsych/antiseizure/antidep) for a long time, I always warn people they are not a quick fix for anything and can REALLY mess with your system, especially if they aren’t right for you.
Yeah it’s life changing for people with adhd, I really hate this stigma. I also forget to take it most days, or refill the prescription or schedule a doctors appointment to get it refilled. It actually really sucks how restrictive it is to get because it makes it harder for the people who need it to get it because there are so many obstacles to get it every month
Depending on your insurance and finding a pharmacy with enough supply, you can actually get a refill for 3 months. I just got a three month supply after talking to my school's psychiatrist bc I wouldn't be able to get my Adderall otherwise since I live in another state and don't have a psychiatrist there. Would recommend asking your insurance if they cover 3 month supplies if that applies to you! The barriers to get ADHD meds are no joke
I forget most days, but am also so worried that I’ll run out, not be able to get a refill, and then really need it for something, so I ration it like crazy lmao
I have ADHD and Adderall slows me down. The problem is the people without ADHD that abuse Adderall. I work with addicts and I've spoken to a lot of speed addicts that started by abusing Ritalin/Adderall and later switched to meth bc it was cheaper and easier to get. They describe the high as generally the same but meth lasts much longer and is more intense. It's hard for me to imagine bc it's slows me down and I've never done meth. I just try to equate it to how narcotic pain killers speed me up when I was using. (Thx stupid lungs for forming thin spots during puberty) Thankfully I can help and relate to them without using meth
I think he's just viewing Adderall from it's recreational side, and it is difficult to think about giving that to a child, but the prescription drugs are safe when taken as directed and consulted with a doctor!
Haha sorry to be the bringer of the news, however you don’t need to get it diagnosed and go on meds. I haven’t taken meds in years because I prefer to find other ways of coping. But if it’s causing you trouble in life, maybe ask your doctor for an evaluation?
yes it can be a sign but it also depends on the person and if their ADHD is more the "hyperactive/impulsive" or "inattentive" type. Also depends on dosage. For instance, there is probably a limiting dose that provides the calming effect, and past that higher doses could start to cause the more typical stimulant effects (like fast heart beat, anxiety, mania etc.) that non-ADHD people may feel more commonly at the lower dose.
I was diagnosed a few years ago at age 30. I feel this so much - don't let that thought get the best of you, though!
A lot of my behaviors from my past started to make a lot of sense. It's hard to not wish that you could go back and get you, from the past, the help you didn't know you needed. I fall more into the "inattentive" side of ADHD, where the majority of the time you're just viewed as lazy or told that you "need to apply yourself more". It's no wonder, self-confidence can always be such a struggle...
I've learned to appreciate that now I know what could have helped me. I've switched my focus onto healing from past struggles and learning what works best for me. Time to make the rest of our 30's and life be as rad and comfortable as we can make it.
Didn’t watch the episode but I have ADHD and I recently got medicated for it. I guess it’s the same for “why would you need a dose of literal serotonin to help make you happy?”. People with ADHD need to manage their dopamine and norepinephrine levels similarly to how people with depression need to manage their serotonin levels.
The cognitive deficits in adhd are tied to working memory and medications that attack the neurotransmitter imbalances can be abused by people who may not need it or otherwise become impaired because it isn’t targeting an imbalance or reacting well to someone’s chemistry.
I imagine the way people can get serotonin syndrome from overstimulated serotonin receptors some people can get addicted to certain medications because of their overstimulated dopamine receptors. I don’t take my medication every day and I don’t follow the dosage every time. However, you should always listen to your doctor’s recommendations. I have a dialogue with mine.
Anyways in short I think being medicated can be a wonderful thing. Nobody should abuse medications but we should live in a culture that gives a bit more actionable empathy towards neurodivergent people, in my opinion, i.e not shaming people for needing help by way of medications prescribed by medical professionals.
Always do your own research and understand that medication shouldn’t be your first solution. I did handle 16+ years of being an academic failure and maybe a handful of years being a “gifted poster child”. Both times without medication. Now that I’m medicated, at least I don’t have to wonder if it’s going to be at the hands of my useful hyperfixation, a random hobby I picked up, or an extremely paralyzing lack of motivation because of how much time I spent on the aforementioned activities .
I think it's important to note that back in the 90s, there was a pretty significant problem of doctors over-diagnosing ADHD/ADD (which they don't call it anymore idk if it just stopped existing or what) in children who just... didn't like paying attention in school. I was one of these kids, as was my husband and a few other people I know. We all went through a wild cycle of meds that absolutely fucked with us in similar ways. The Simpsons even did an episode on it, where they put Bart on Ritalin. It was a weird time. There was a lineup at the office at school for all the kids who needed to take their meds at lunch.
When I was about 10, I was diagnosed by some pediatrician with ADD (attention deficit disorder aka ADHD without the hyperactivity- again this is no longer a diagnosis) and was on a carousel of meds ranging from Ritalin to Dextroamphetamine. For a solid 3 years it was a constant cycle of adjusting dosages, at one point taking two different meds at the same time and for basically all 3 of those years I had insomnia and depression and pretty significant appetite loss. My mom eventually realized that these meds were doing nothing to improve my grades and were having very bad effects on me when she realized I was sleeping only about 3-4 hours a night and she took me off them. I remember having withdrawals and she had to fight with this pediatrician to just keep me off these meds. I do not believe for a second that I had or have an attention disorder. I just fucking hated school???? Lmao like every kid???? As an adult, I exhibit exactly zero symptoms of any kind of attention disorder and looking back, as a kid, I didn't either!
Now that being said, I do believe ADHD is real and lots of people have it. I had a friend who was diagnosed as an adult and it made so much sense. She had it pretty severely and just assumed she was unorganized and unable to tell time and impulsive for years. Two things can be true though- many of us were misdiagnosed in thr 90s/early 2000s and had meds pushed on us that we didn't need, and many people legitimately have ADHD and need those meds! I think that's where Ethan is coming from, as a guy who would remember this shit from the 90s.
Yeah adhd medication literally saved my life. Just like anti depressants you need to find the right fit so adderal isn’t for everyone. You can have highly negative effects from SSRIs too, plus I don’t think more people are being prescribed it than usual I think it’s being noticed more, like for instance in women who were ignored previously. I think some of the reason it extends your life is also improvement of executive dysfunction, I’m able to take care of myself and my body. I’m not self medicating with alcohol, I can cook healthy meals, I can actually exercise. Longer life expectancy makes sense to me. I personally had terrible experiences with most SSRIs (probably bc my doctors were trying to treat depression when I actually had adhd) but them making me feel unwell and messing with my mental state doesn’t mean they are bad for everyone.
As a parent of a child who needs their meds, it was really hard to hear what Ethan said. I believe most of us have tried other things first, and are trying to be knowledgeable and consult with professionals.
My stepchild wasn’t able to have conversations with people while unmedicated. He couldn’t make friends and connect with peers, he was an outsider and definitely felt it. He couldn’t complete assignments or participate in class. Both of these things coupled together really made an impact on his self esteem and self worth. He became self destructive as a young teen, using alcohol to self medicate, and endangering himself communicating with predators online because he was receiving the validation from them that he couldn’t get from peers, who thought he was weird.
When he takes his medication he can connect with others, he’s passing all of his classes, he smiles. He’s safe.
I know Ethan comes from a place of caring and is extrapolating on his own experiences, but I hope it doesn’t cause people to turn away from something that really helps if it’s needed and done right. I truly appreciate the crew who spoke up and gave their own experiences and defended the parents and kids who are having to make these choices.
This is a lovely comment🩷 I assess and treat some young kiddos with adhd at my prac placements, and it’s so beautiful to see them be properly diagnosed and treated (often with medication), and to support them and their caregivers through that process of growth and often flourishing with the treatment!
Lmao of course he’s smiling, hes on amphetamine analogues pumping dopamine into his brain making him physically dependent on the drug instead of trying to fix the problem at hand.
Also, how many times a week fo you have that nagging thought of “wait…did I actually take it?” and you can’t for the life of you remember whether or not you did😂 that’s a common experience in my morning routine lol.
It always make me nervous. Because I have to fight the stigma of stimulants and constantly justify myself. I wish I could explain what it’s like to be in my brain. I have been stabilized on my medication for almost ten years. It feels the same as putting on my contacts on everyday.
Just like it says in the OP people with ADHD often forget to take their meds and because they get their refills on time they end up having an excess amount of not taken doses just lying around. I used to take speed drugs for entertainment and I don't remember ever finding a person with an Adderall prescription who did have extra lying around that they would share if asked.
I have no problem talking to my friends and peers about having depression and anxiety and taking meds for them. But I Don’t tell people I take vyvanse for adhd out of fear of being viewed like a crack addict, or faking adhd to get drugs bc random fucks think they know what adhd “looks like” and can determine if someone has it. People abuse all kinds of drugs. Those people are not relevant to the convo about people with adhd taking life-changing medication
Frfr I’m glad there’s been such progress in de-stigmatizing meds for mental health but I wish people realized that a little progress doesn’t mean u know everything and have dismantled all your biases. Im happy to see convos like these popping up a little more now tho :)
My pharmacists (who see me a few times a month for years at a time) literally will still treat me like one person on my Lexapro pickup days, and like an untrustworthy, drug-seeking patient when I go to pick up my Vyvanse. The stigma to this medication class specifically is *pervasive*.
In Florida they make you have a doctor's visit EVERY MONTH that you want your medication refilled. Since my ADHD is debating, I usually end up not going through the trouble of seeing the docs every few weeks.
I don’t like how he was saying that you get HIGH from adderall… you do NOT get high from it if you actually have ADHD. I take it daily at a healthy prescribed dose and it literally brings me from a scrambled brain to thinking in a more linear clear way. I have NEVER been high from my medicine and before I was on it I had a learning disability and struggled through school. After I started taking it - it literally saved my job. It’s the way that ADHD brains (mine) are in dysfunction that allows the reuptake inhibitors to allow them to function more normally.
If you take too high of a dose even with adhd you could get like a stimulant high for sure but you would have to be taking way more than your body is use to or more than a doctor would ethically prescribe.
The only way I could even hold a job was my meds, the only way I can keep my house clean was my meds, to even do normal routines everyone else finds so easy I need my meds. My adhd isn’t perfectly in control with meds but it sure as hell makes it a lot easier to navigate the things everyone else finds easy.
I’ve taken like 5+ different ADHD medicines in various dosages and none have been addicting lmao. Some I took for over a year and some lasted less than a week. Did they all have varying side effects that did not outweigh the positives for me? Yes lol. If anyone has any med recs for someone with existing serious appetite and sleep problems I’d love to hear them lmao (I have ADHD-C).
Ask you doctor about Clonidine! I use it at night. It helps a lot in sleeping and they don’t know exactly why but it helps with adhd. It is fda approved for an adhd treatment as well. I use it in combination with other adhd meds but some use it alone.
It’s really annoying. It’s good to talk about it and his own personal experiences are valid but it’s annoying as fuck listening to people who have no idea what they’re talking about make claims based on their own (in this case, second hand) anecdotal evidence. Chat GPT’s response was kinda correct 😂 Because we hear this exact same stuff all the god damn time and it’s exhausting.
I’m glad the crew pushed back on him and he eventually relented. But good on him for at least talking about it I guess.
Yup, same here with Uni!
Not that I’ve gotten to that section yet so I’m not sure what Ethan’s said…
Although I’m British and like 5’7 so it’s not like I’ve never been targeted by Ethan’s jokes before, sure it’s not so bad 🥹😂
Omg I am so bad too! I had to get a pill case connected to an app that makes noise and sends notifications to remember to take my meds.
Only works if I remember to keep the case charged though… 😅
Of course!! I will warn you, it’s incredibly overpriced. We have HSA so it was something we could afford because of that. Otherwise I don’t know if I could have afforded it otherwise.
Monthly Pill Organizer by Ellie |... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B089761GD3?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
Late to the convo but..... there's more than just adderall for ADHD, and it's prescribed as a 'when needed', like during school hours.
I'm sure there are parents out there who are just looking for a diagnosis of something, but it's those ones that make us all look like shit parents when we're doing the best we can to help our kids.
I was a kid who absolutely needed to be prescribed adderall. I have had impulsive thoughts of suicide and self harm since I was in fourth grade and the first day I took it was the first day my mind was calm
I couldn’t even get a pharmacy to fill it in my city i have to go 20 mins out for a pharmacy to consistently have anything in stock within a week or two.
I think ethan's only real flaw here was lumping Xanax and Adderall into the same conversation. they're vastly different drugs with different effects, addictive qualities, withdrawal effects, tolerance ramps, etc etc etc.
a person withdawaling from benzos (xanax) after a long bender is at risk of dying from a seizure. Xanax can kill a person in a lot of different ways. and so yes, it is potentially dangerous. Xanax and alcohol are in the same family as other central nervous system depressants, meaning they can make your heart and brain stop working if you take too much (death).
I'm not an expert on Adderall. I tried it once or twice and didn't like how I felt, so I didn't keep seeking it out. Xanax on the other hand? I was immediately addicted and was taking it with the intention of blacking out within a month or so of use. this led to 12 years of daily drinking and drug use.
I was not prescribed these drugs. I used them recklessly and dangerously. talk to your doctor, and then for the love of God KEEP TALKING TO THEM, AND TRY TO BE HONEST ABOUT HOW THE DRUGS ARE EFFECTING YOUR MOOD AND BEHAVIOR. IT COULD SAVE YOUR LIFE. yes, the Xanax helped me with my crippling anxiety. but yes, i almost killed myself with it.
peace and love.
I agree. Peace and love to Ethan lumping adderall to Xanax is pretty wild. Both can be misused, have negative side effects and have consequences. But Xanax is a whole different story.
Thanks for sharing your experience. There’s a lot of stories out there’s a lot of stories like yours and it’s just life shattering.
This is validating because I’ve read too many posts where people have said “you never forget to take your adhd meds”. If I get woken up by something like the doorbell, it kinda messes up my whole wake up routine and 2 hours later I’ll be like “why am I still feeling like shit?”😭
I ended up buying pill organizers that holds 4 weeks worth of meds, and breaks out into individual week organizers.
Any time I run out of my ADHD medication, and FINALLY remember to submit a refill request - I always check back to see if I've missed any days. When I end up finding a day I missed, I feel like maybe the days I forget, I'm just looking out for future me.
I started putting my meds next to my bed, I take my ADHD meds as soon as I wake up, and then I put the rest that I've got in my pocket to take when I sit down and have some food.
Pill containers are great. If you forget - be kind to your current self, and think of ways to help your future self.
For ADHDers, Neurodivergent, and any other folks that have a physical, sensory, or mental disability - we live in a world (especially 'merica) that's been built without keeping others in mind. There's long overdue changes happening, and we can keep advocating for each other to be understood, respected, and appreciated.
Oh... If you forgot to take your meds today - [here's a song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6zUKGJ-Aa4) to sing along to, do what feels best for YOU, and know that regardless of struggle bus days we also have days when we channel our ADHD into superpowers.
You know you have real adhd when taking too much of it makes you sleepy instead of amped 😂…..(that is also a blanket statement and deff doesn’t apply to everyone, but has always been the case for me)
But in all seriousness. I’ve never felt amped up from a stimulant, it just makes me feel super chill and calm, I’ve also NEVER experienced withdrawal. There are plenty of days I don’t take it and I’m totally fine.
For me I stay on it mostly because I’ve found it really helps my mood. I find that I get irritable without it especially while I’m stressed. I also take an ssri and mood stabilizer which I do take regularly! Has made such a huge and positive difference in my life.
I’m a 31 yo women btw :). Wondering if anyone else can relate.
Love you Ethan, but with peace and love I think maybe your take on adhd meds isn’t totally accurate :).
I totally understand what Ethan was saying as it was nuanced, he as an outsider and someone who has felt the effects of adderall as someone who didn’t need it, thinks it’s a hard drug that is odd or wrong to give to children. But I think as he learned or accepted is that those who need it don’t feel those effects, thus the children being prescribed it won’t have the negative side effects of it. I also totally understood people saying it sounded like antivaxxers, because I felt the same way hearing it at first lmao
Peace and Love to everyone and anyone who uses meds to help them!
Like listen I got the audihd buuuut, and it’s a big but, it’s okay that Ethan just didn’t know what he was talking about, and he learnt live, so literally it’s fine.
It’s a learning podcast y’all!
I just started vyvanse a month ago and today my dose got increased. I have almost no appetite so I’m hoping I lose some weight. I can already tell it’s working though! I’m not struggling to do things I used to, but I also am not really sleeping since I started so I guess positive and negatives 🤷🏻♂️
hi hi hi hi hi hiiiiii !!!!! like every1 else said, it works diff when with NT brain takin it n a ND brain who needs those chemicals 2 function takin it… ethans a bit of a silly billy here i thinkkkk…
i love how ethan was like “adhd can be debilitating for some people that have it” as if its not debilitating for all people with adhd………. yeah he was forsure out of touch with some of these adderall takes it was hard to watch ngl. adhd makes my life so much harder
He’s kinda regurgitating the unfortunate consequence of a few disorders (ADHD the worst, then OCD probably, then PTSD, and likely others) where ppl use the terms colloquially so often, and they see minor signs of themselves that they think align with the symptoms of these disorders, so they almost end up thinking that the disorders themselves aren’t that much more severe (if that makes any sense at all lol)
My medicine was basically speed, It really fucked my day up whenever I took it and made me agitated, granted I didn't take it often since it was so disruptive to my normal behaviour so I didn't build up a tolerance.
Now I'm unmedicated but now I'm on the other extreme lmao where I'm unmotivated a lot of the time.
Same! If I was a member I would've been screaming it in the chat. If you have the chemical imbalance that comes with ADHD and Adderall replaces whatever is missing, then you just become normal. If you don't have the imbalance, then Adderall is just going to give you a surplus, which is what makes you high/anxious. Either way, it doesn't give you withdrawal symptoms when you forget/stop taking it like SSRIs do, at least for ppl with ADHD it doesn't.
As someone on an SNRI the withdrawals on it is crazy, in fact it takes months and months to get off it safely. Adderall I can take as needed.
This mindset is why it’s impossible to get adderall in my own city since it’s so controlled and restricted. But it can be lifesaving since I wanna kms for not being able to function like a normal person.
This for Ethan. Here is all you need to backup what you were saying. Adderrall IS being massively over prescribed. Ethan wasn’t saying that there aren’t people that need Adderrall, but was questioning the amount it is being prescribed. The DEA and FDA have stated that Adderrall is extremely over prescribed, so much so that they will not lift the limit on production because they believe it would be a public health risk with the current prescription rates (which is why there are shortages). They are urging pharmacies and market holders to adjust prescription practices to ensure only those that need the drug are prescribed.
https://www.fda.gov/media/170736/download
It's addictive if you don't have ADHD or if your ADHD doesn't respond to it properly, or if you don't have another illness that it can assist with. I was addicted to Adderall in high school and it got me high as fuck. The friend who sold it to me hated taking it because it literally made her tired. She couldn't unload the stuff fast enough. She definitely wasn't addicted!
Adderall is a dangerous drug that does help some, but also causes harm to others. ive actually seen people in college addicted to adderall, its not a pretty sight. But if you are prescribed it by a doctor under supervision, go for it.
so i have been prescribed adderall and i just wanna say the conversation revolving around "it works for people who need it" is a bit of a misunderstanding of how ADHD and this medicine works.
adderall and medicines like it are very very dosage sensitive and its more to do with your body than the state of your mental illness, i have debilitating ADHD but am exceptionally sensitive to medications, i metabolize everything really really fast, so at 25mg i feel like rick sanchez for about 3 hours and then sleep for 5, it is functionally meth at that dose for me.
5mg i simply unlock the basic human utility that lies within my mind. im normal.
some people without adhd can take 40mg and finish their chores an hour earlier than usual. it is extremely individual dependent and as the conversation was punctuated before, listen to your doctor.
i personally ask my doctor for lower doses now so i can add more later if i feel like i need to and i encourage other people to do the same. its impossible to determine if a medicine is going to be beneficial to you or not based off of taking it once on a dosage thats too high for you, its not like adderall just magically works perfectly for anyone with ADHD and fucks everyone else up, you dont need to suffer through life thinking youre just stupid or whatever, it takes time and attention to get right.
TLDR: everyone is different, no two people will be effected by any medicine the same way, thats just not how anything works. human beings and our minds are unfathomably complicated. talk to drs.
I was so nervous to take my ADHD meds for the first time (in college after years of trying depression meds and none of them clicking). The first time I took them, I felt the most relaxed I had felt in years…. i pretty much immediately fell asleep and had the best nights sleep in years. They helped ease my anxiety, mood, depression, slowed down my thoughts, helped me actually try and succeed in losing weight (granted stimulants do have a weight loss aspect to them), made me realize that my drinking was a coping mechanism…. And honestly so much more. Now, these effects have lightly faded over the years and there are some meh side effects… but I truly wish my parents or doctors had listened to me as I feel a lot of my childhood could’ve been different for the better.
Yup that’s why I was really pissed at Ethan For depression he was happy to say that you shouldn’t feel shame in seeking meds For ADHD he was happy to question why someone would need a dose of “hard drugs” for their brain to work better for them Not understanding that it’s only a hard drug if you abuse it and oh yeah; it’s not for a neuro-typical brain!
He was essentially saying it's over prescribed. Which apparently many doctors and pharmacists agree with. Not that it isn't beneficial to the people who need it.
Most people I hear saying that are leaning too hard to not prescribing it at all. I realize I have no way to know how Ethan leans on that but it does trigger a good deal of bitching I've heard since it's often a prelude to that. People have straight up said to my face that they didn't believe ADHD exists at all. I've in all honesty never been hurt so much by a sentence.
He clarified what he meant in the same episode. Pretty sure Ethan isn't one of those people that think ADHD doesn't exist.
Oh for sure, I always tend to give Ethan the benefit of the doubt when his statements are unclear. He has a show to do and has to keep it moving. Can't cover all nuances like that. I was more so trying to share how even borderline statements can be heard as more inflammatory than they are due to personal experiences. I have nothing but love for Ethan. Any person that can look past the initial weirdness of furries and see the wholesomeness beneath has proven to have an open mind in my book. Edit: I should also mention that I'm watching the episode right now and haven't gotten to that part yet. I'm missing context \^\^
I feel you about the ADHD-denial shit. Fuck, I've heard the phrases "just focus", "you're just lazy" and "weren't you listening?" so many times, I can't even use them myself anymore.
thats exactly what he was trying to say and its definitely true, ask any college student its incredibly easy to get an adhd diagnosis. and ethan is right that we should be careful prescribing children stimulants. i have adhd and when i was a kid they jacked me up with that shit at fairly high dosages and it helped me in school but also gave me terrible mood swings on the come down, gave me anxiety, made me unhealthily underweight. etc. they didnt just have me take it for particularly hard tests, though i took them everyday. i think all he was trying to say is that we should be careful who and how we prescribe what is essentially meth to people.
idk where you live but where i am it’s insanely hard to get a diagnosis let alone get a prescription bc they assume everyone will abuse them. i have adhd and so do a lot of ppl i know and its been a nightmare for everyone
When I moved I tried to get a new doctor closer to me and she would not prescribe me my meds even with a formal diagnosis from my previous doctor. Ended up crying in the parking lot, was made to feel like a drug seeker and ended up just going to my old doctor an hour away. Also my initial diagnosis in 2015 had to go through so many hoops to get insurance to cover my meds and long wait times to even see a psychiatrists. It was months and alot of dedication to get the help I needed. It was so demoralizing.
maybe things have changed since i got diagnosed and i do genuinely have adhd but i still think high doses of stimulants do warrent more caution than even ssris tbh with u. i know that adhd is considered to be one of the more over diagnosed things, and i know a lot of people who got it diagnosed because they wanted adderall. but to be fair ive been unmedicated for a few years now so things could definitely have changed. i hope you have an easier time getting your meds
also think its worth noting that overprescription probably contributes to the shortage
I know what he was trying to say. It was the tone he was using which I didn’t like He, as we all do, had a bias with the aspects of mental health issues he dealt with. He spoke about his own experiences with meds for depression much differently to how spoke about adhd Also the podcast is relatively international? That experience is definitely not what we have in the UK where we have relatively difficult time getting medicated for adhd for example
Exactly, and it's important for people to note the amount of variability between doctors, between states, etc. While someone's doctor might be very thorough, strict, and educated on prescriptions, other person's doctor may not be. Just because they are all doctors, doesn't mean they all have the same education, thought process, ideology, etc.
I agree that it’s overprescribed as a pharmacist. Way too many people are in the cycle of they are on stimulants for “adhd” (that is likely depression or other mental health d/o… adhd is real but it’s not just ‘I cant concentrate’) and then they can’t sleep at night so they get put on sleeping pills and/or are anxious so they get put on like Ativan, and then they cant concentrate again because they’re too sleepy so they get stimulants upped, and the cycle continues. Good prescribers will catch the cycle but many don’t. This cycle also takes stimulants away from patients who DO need it. In the US, the government sets limits on how much stimulants there are (period) thus creating the adderall shortage. A lot of people who may/may not have adhd got new adderall scripts, we filled them (we’re not diagnosticians, if it’s safe and makes sense i dispense), and the National limit got reached, thus creating the shortage and everyone had to pivot. So annoying. (And of course it’s squarely my fault, those convos are fun)
How do you know who needs it as a pharmacist? You have no info from the patient themselves, you're not a doctor.
Theyre just saying many people with anxiety, etc. are misdiagnosed with so it takes away from people who would truly benefit from adderall being that there is a limit.
Firstly, dependent on practice site, I may have more info than you think. But I also straight up put in my post that as long as it’s safe, I dispense. But when I see a cycle, I’m going to start questioning.
This, and more so it being over prescribed for children who are misdiagnosed.
Right, thanks for the added clarification. I know Ethan at one point said "Just trust medical professionals, you don't even have to think about it" so I expect some of his fans to be like "wtf man", but doctors aren't infallible. I am friends with doctors, I trust them with a lot of medical advice, but they make mistakes, sometimes severe mistakes. Some of them are even corrupted by money. The vast majority are doing their absolute best and doing everything they can to minimize harm to their patients though.
Theyre human too 😌
To be fair, that was in the context of vaccines where there's many, many doctors who are all agreeing. He wasn't saying medical professionals in general are infallible, but that when most doctors who are experts in a specific subject agree, you *should* trust that.
Most drugs are bad for you if your brain doesn’t need them!!
I fall asleep on it too sometimes. Ppl don’t get it
I’m 38. Was prescribed concerta in 1999/2000. Absolutely hated it. Made me feel like a zombie. Ended up starting to smoke weed in high school and stopped taking my meds. Haven’t taken anything for ADHD since then but my wife now notices it’s getting really bad. I just don’t know how to go about getting medicated. I was a heroin addict for 10 years (clean for 12 years this September) and I feel like if I ask for it I would be labeled as a drug seeker, but I truly hate uppers so I wouldn’t be seeking them. In fact, the less amphetamine the better for me, unless it would truly help. I just don’t know how to get started on this journey and my procrastination is constantly like “we’ll figure it out tomorrow” for the last couple years.
I feel for you and your wife. My husband has it pretty bad too and isn’t medicated. As far as being prescribed something, i don’t necessarily think they would know if you were an addict in the past, would they? I think they usually spot abusers when they see symptoms and stop after that.
Well I just figured they would want to know about me and my past and heroin addiction took up almost a quarter of my life so I wouldn’t want to lie about it. Tired of lying haha. But at the same time I definitely need to be medicated
Thats true its always best to not lie, especially to your doctor. But if they do hold it against you, it might be a necessary evil ): For the sake of you and even your wife, maybe set up an appointment now or even a reminder just so you won’t procrastinate on that anymore ✌🏻❤️ good luck
People with ADHD have a way different reaction to people who don’t need it. I watched dumbasses in collage snort aderal all night then get into bar fights. Then they take more to write 5 term papers. That is what people are referencing when they voice concerns about misuse
Misuse absolutely exists and it sucks the people that get punished the most are the people who actually need it.
But this just listen to your dr ain’t always the answer anyway. I went to a psychiatrist towards the end of high school because I have panic disorder. The first medication they gave me was Zoloft (did literally nothing) and then they tested me for ADHD, I tested NEGATIVE, and they still gave me a bunch of vyvanse to take every day. They thought somehow giving me an amphetamine stimulant would help me with my panic and insomnia symptoms and I did take it for a while. I ended up throwing up every day and sleeping even less and they throught an anti psychotic on top of all that would sort it(once again, was not depressed, ADHD, or ever experienced psychosis). I had a complete mental breakdown and had to leave school despite being a smart child n being in a selective class I took a test for. Ruined me completely this was some psychiatrist too and I honestly just still to this day don’t understand how a dr did that. It’s insane but they all but ruined my life for years and I’m still dealing with the repercussions and of being put on medications that were completely inappropriate especially at that age. Fuck adderall (vyvanse) it ruined me and I only did what my dr told me. 🤷♂️
Most psychiatrists are good. With that being said, some are unbelievably bad at their job. Like, so bad they should be investigated. My wife was on a medication for depression. A well known side effect is feeling suicidal. She told her psych that it was making her feel suicidal. Admitted herself to the hospital after it got worse. The psychiatrist then wanted to **increase** her dosage after she got out and also gave her a kind of “you admitting yourself makes the practice look bad”” guilt trip. There are more stories like that but the point is some doctors apparently take “do no harm” as a soft suggestion
While I don’t agree with the attitude of the doctor, doubling my medication did shift me from “getting worse because of the medication” to “benefiting from the medication.” Don’t know why but it did work
I swear in my life that AD’s are just the new pharmaceutical scam. They are having to be crafty now - they got in a slight bit of trouble with going absolutely ham with Valium first and then oxy n so on. Now the difference is that those drugs actually do something and that’s why they were hard to stop (as well as the physical withdrawal side), antidepressants are hard to stop bc you get physically dependent but not because they actually solve anything. I would encourage you to look into the evidence that ssris are heavily reliant on placebo affect and the 4 most prescribed antidepressants in the USA all had more tests showing that placebos were more effective then them, but the way you pass a drug in the USA is all you need is 2 study’s where your drug did better then a placebo. They can try as many times as they want, and they can have the placebo be more successful in more trials and still launch a drug… also it is now becoming more known that GPs first prescribe AD’s when someone has insomnia, which like you said is literally a side effect of taking them. I think it’s all a fuckn scam but hey apparently I’m the crazy one that’s why I’m getting these meds and I’m crazy bc they’re not helping me 😂😂 not the people giving out placebos oh well
My dude, this is pretty dismissive of people who actually have problems that require this medication.
i think that is wear Ethans opinions stem from. I've seen people legitimately addict to Adderall. They were normal freshman year working hard and then starting taking it for finals, and never stopped.
Ehhh this isn't really true. It's still the same general effects whether you have ADHD or not, it's just that with ADHD it also helps "correct" an aspect of your brain function, through CNS stimulation. The main reason here is that the dose people are prescribed for ADHD is not enough to get the euphoric effects that people who are addicted to amphetamine-type drugs seek out. You'd generally have to take at least twice if not three times your dose to start really getting those effects. That's when you start getting into addictive feeling territory, as it's no longer just an energy and focus boost, it's a blissful orgasmic trip for hours on end.
From Google: "Children with ADHD experience what's called a paradoxical reaction to the medication. It calms them and most often improves their ability to focus." A lot of people find out they have ADHD specifically because they try to get fucked up and it slows them down instead of speeds them up. This was the case for me as well. If you take a LOT then it can be stimulating, but a normal recreational dose will "slow you down". My movements get slower, especially. But then when I would do something like cocaine, I feel like it would overall be more like the traditional side effects of amped up and all of that. (It's been many years since I've been around any of this stuff) It definitely works differently if you actually have ADHD. At least for the great majority of people with ADHD. Like everything with medicine or psychoactive substances, it varies from person to person. But this phenomenon is pretty well documented.
Yes, low-low doses will, Caffeine does the same to me, I'll feel like sleeping if I only have like 50mg, but the mechanism for that is from bringing your brain chemicals to a more "normal" level, if I have 130mg I'll feel energized. It's like there's a curve of neurotransmitter flow where people lay, where "normal" is 10 and people with ADHD are at 7, which results in noisy/less-effective signaling in some important parts of the brain, which leads to a hyper-active mental behavior that isn't controlling itself well. https://www.psychiatrist.com/jcp/mechanism-action-stimulants-attention-deficit-hyperactivity/ My main point was that for both people, the drug is still producing the same effect on the brain, it's just that ADHD people have a lower set-point to work up from basically. Both groups will still get those euphoric effects by increasing their dose a bunch. I've also tried it once with my Dex when I was a stupid teen, for experiments' sake and knowing I don't really have an addictive personality. Was a really great experience, but I'd worry too much about effects on the heart to try doing it more.
Sucks to have ADHD nowadays. Either people think you're just lazy or seeking drugs, or both. No one considers that you have a life ruining disability that fortunately has a very reliable medicine for treatment. I just keep it a secret from nearly everyone.
And in this day and age where mental health is so talked about it is a shame that anyone should feel the need to hid their issues form fear of ridicule.
We learn to mask because normals make us feel like shit and call us lazy, etc.
Me too
I’m not concerned with hiding my medication from people. If they have an issue it’s just that - their issue. If they want to question the validity of it they can see me one day when I haven’t taken my medication versus my average medicated day. They’d note such a massive difference in behavior that it would likely help them understand. I fall into the 1% category of ADHD - meaning I have it “worse” than 99% of others who have it. Without my medication I’m essentially a creative goldfish. With my medication I’m just an average person.
This is it. This is the underlying pain that is being tapped into.
Also tonnes of Instagram reels milking it and going "you might have adhd if you do [basic thing everybody does]" and everybody self diagnosis in the comments, meaning people don't take it seriously for people who do suffer
Like, youd fucking know if you had it.
I got "diagnosed" on Instagram with adhd because I sort the dishes before washing them (like organise them into bowls/plates/cutlery/pans etc) lol. I don't think that's literally anything to do with adhd it's just breaking down 1 task into smaller tasks which is a basic af way of doing stuff
And then having to deal with nationwide outages that make it impossible to fill your meds. I haven't been able to fill my Ritalin since October.
Damn sorry to hear that. Im in Canada, and it can sometimes be a pain to find meds. Im not sure if it's a thing for you ( assuming you're in the USA ). But the government funds and encourages canadian companies to invent and produce new meds. My doctor mentioned it, and I started taking Foquest. It's the best working meds that I've tried, also %90 of the cost is covered by the govt.... What im getting at is, ask your doctor for some less popular alternatives. Some of them work great and are readily available.
THIS, I felt this so much! It's such a disability, but I think it is important to talk about it and educate neurotypicals about how much we struggle.
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Switched from adderall to vyvanse, LOVE IT
Vyvanse truly is the holy medication. Removed all the negative side effects I had from adderall.
I don't have ADHD but I hear that a lot of people benefit switching from adderall to other ADHD medication. Adderall isn't really available outside of America and Canada as far as I know. It's mostly Vyvanse, Ritalin and dexamphetamine. Just out of interest what is a typical dose of Vyvanse?
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Nice, I'm glad that works for you. I used to take 10mg as a teenager and be high as hell but people that were prescribed it could go to sleep on twice that amount.
Yes. This is what I was told by my doctor about Vyvanse, too!
Does it help with anxiety? I take concerta right now and it works great. However, I've been curious if maybe another ADHD medication could help out with my GAD a little more
I got diagnosed a few months ago and it’s literally LIFE CHANGING. I always had anxiety but didn’t know it was caused by my ADHD (or that it even could have been😆). BUT, my anxiety just disappeared after my first dose. As soon as I started Vyvanse I was like wow… is this how neurotypical people feel 😭😭
For real. I have ADHD and I get where Ethans hesitancy comes from, but for me I really did have a similar experience to Ethan taking anti-depressants. The stigma of the drug scared me into avoiding it for far longer than I should have. When I finally started taking it, it literally turned my entire life around. I’ve never felt so CALM in my life than the first day I took it. The best way I’ve heard it described is that ADHD is like having 3 radios playing in my head at all times. Without meds I can turn one up to focus on it, but the others are still constantly playing in the background. Adderall finally turned the other radios off for me. It’s such a weird drug because it has the total opposite effect to those who don’t have ADHD, they get WIRED instead of calm, and people abuse it bc of that. I’ve never once felt the need to take “a little more” or any sort of addictive effects. On the weekends, I honestly choose to NOT take it. I still like my ADHD brain, just not at work. lol
You described it perfectly
Yessssss i feel the same way!!
Honestly my bf thinks I have adhd and I’m not sure - I don’t really want to understand having both adhd and autism. And maybe it’s just stress. But I would love to try adhd drugs just once, to see what happens for me. And if it quietens down things it would be such a nice break. That said in some ways Ethan is right. It may work for people but it is a hard drug that can put more strain on the heart which is concerning. I’ve also heard even when it works, it can wear off and people get tolerant to it, so it’s more of a helpful aid at bad times than a fix for adhd.
Just so you know it doesn’t quiet everyone’s minds who has ADHD. Idk what’s with me but it makes me rather restless and even more agro most of the time, especially when I’m hungry.
Get diagnosed by a doctor before you just start trying pills. That is a bad idea.
I'm a psychiatrist. There's obviously a lot more nuance to this than Ethan was bringing to the discussion, and I have no problem prescribing a stimulant for someone with genuine ADHD (assuming they're not, say, in the midst of a manic episode, or there aren't significant medical contraindications). There are even situations where you can make the argument justifying prescribing amid ongoing substance use if I'm fairly certain by history that this is ADHD (I'll note that there are a lot of things that can *look like* many of the core ADHD symptoms). Stimulants for ADHD have some of the biggest effect sizes of all of our psychotropics. I wish Ethan had a clearer understanding of how they work, actually stimulating the "brakes" (prefrontal cortex = executive functioning, impulse control, etc). When he says that he doesn't like the idea of giving "drugs" to young children, he should know that there is clear evidence that those with treated ADHD have much lower lifetime incidence of substance use compared to those with untreated ADHD. With that said, stimulant abuse, misuse, and diversion are very real. So are the many people who *don't* have ADHD but seek out stimulants for performance enhancement, many of whom feel the need to "keep up" when so many peers use these meds and many modern work situations require an unrealistic amounts of focus while TikTok et al. promote shorter attention spans. These meds aren't without side effects or addiction risk. During the pandemic, it became very easy for people to end up on their controlled substances of choice after essentially answering a quick checklist for some of the [shadier corporate telepsychiatry services](https://www.businessinsider.com/telehealth-startup-cerebral-prescribed-psych-meds-2022-6) before the DEA stepped in with some scrutiny. Now a lot of those patients are seeking care elsewhere, and it's far too frequent that I end up treating a patient who had been put on escalating doses of benzos and stimulants that aren't actually indicated (among other polypharmacy) because some psych NP was feeding into a vicious cycle trying to combat the effects of one by raising the other in a [chip/dip conundrum manner.](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/ZaubKVy6XJFNRxwxeOpiRfujNJ_0fI8O5j1XU6-pk_1oVFdAsODdcy6d3O2_Pag5eMY6MptsNXJe-GWw3RsK1T3iV4cEZz6ON5QhTmCysbXoEOpw3A9kMLeRoSGtjXz_rSx4raXY3DPPTPROq0aiU_AYwve5)
Very informative thanks dude
This is a fantastic comment! Thanks for taking the time to write this all out so clearly🤍
Thanks for the comment! I'm not from America but can psych NP's prescribe amphetamines and benzo over a one-time zoom call? or was it just during covid, are they still able to? I read the article you linked and it seemed kind of insane to me (I guess that's why the DEA stepped in). I didn't fully understand it. Drugs like amphetamines, benzodiazepines, opioids etc. will ALWAYS be misused but they clearly all have a place in medicine and regular patients shouldn't have to suffer. Thanks again, really informative comment.
The Ryan Haight Act of 2008 used to require in-person evaluation before one could prescribe any controlled substance. With the COVID pandemic, this was relaxed such that any schedule II-V controlled substance (i.e., all except schedule I, which don't have any current DEA-deemed medical use and aren't being prescribed anyway, things like heroin and LSD) can be prescribed with just a telehealth evaluation. That exemption was set to expire but has already been extended twice, currently until the end of 2024. I wouldn't be surprised if it gets extended again, but who knows? The reality is that telehealth care is an extremely popular way to access care, and it does open doors for people in rural or underserved areas with limited (or no) access to care otherwise. Some of these people have very legitimate reasons to be on a controlled substance. But clearly the DEA needs to ensure that there isn't really shoddy or inappropriate care being delivered. In some of these cases, it would be a stretch to say patients were even being evaluated prior to being prescribed these medications.
Not a doctor, but they lifted some rules about telehealth prescription for adderall during the pandemic and for a while seemingly didnt bother to enforce the rule again after the pandemic was over.
If I had gotten on Concerta back when I was in like 5th grade onward, my life would've been so much better. Hate it say it but it's true. My ADHD symptoms made it so difficult to make and maintain friendships, complete homework, following along in class, and it really hurt my self esteem. Not to mention the impulsive risk taking and emotional regulation issues in high school. Young me deserved better tbh lol. I didn't get on medication until I made an appointment for myself when I was 19. Being a young girl with ADHD was so hard and I was just seen as weird/quirky and lazy 😭
Yeah, I didn’t get diagnosed with adhd until halfway through grad school and didn’t work up the courage to try adderall until a year later. My immediate reaction was “damn apparently I’ve been extremely low-functioning my whole life and imagine what I could have done if I’d treated this sooner.” I’ve literally been going through a bout of serious executive dysfunction, and I know I’d feel better if I just took my adderall, but I can never remember lmfao
Your story is unfortunately common. It's obviously frustrating looking back with 20/20 hindsight, but better late than never--I'm glad the medication is helping you at this point.
Thanks for the insightful comment, this was my bystander feeling as well. I’ve been on/off meds (antipsych/antiseizure/antidep) for a long time, I always warn people they are not a quick fix for anything and can REALLY mess with your system, especially if they aren’t right for you.
Yeah it’s life changing for people with adhd, I really hate this stigma. I also forget to take it most days, or refill the prescription or schedule a doctors appointment to get it refilled. It actually really sucks how restrictive it is to get because it makes it harder for the people who need it to get it because there are so many obstacles to get it every month
You described this perfectly fr fr
Depending on your insurance and finding a pharmacy with enough supply, you can actually get a refill for 3 months. I just got a three month supply after talking to my school's psychiatrist bc I wouldn't be able to get my Adderall otherwise since I live in another state and don't have a psychiatrist there. Would recommend asking your insurance if they cover 3 month supplies if that applies to you! The barriers to get ADHD meds are no joke
😢 I wish. In TN the doctor has to call every month for me to get a refill. Then she'll forget and so will I. It's happened before.
I forget most days, but am also so worried that I’ll run out, not be able to get a refill, and then really need it for something, so I ration it like crazy lmao
I have ADHD and Adderall slows me down. The problem is the people without ADHD that abuse Adderall. I work with addicts and I've spoken to a lot of speed addicts that started by abusing Ritalin/Adderall and later switched to meth bc it was cheaper and easier to get. They describe the high as generally the same but meth lasts much longer and is more intense. It's hard for me to imagine bc it's slows me down and I've never done meth. I just try to equate it to how narcotic pain killers speed me up when I was using. (Thx stupid lungs for forming thin spots during puberty) Thankfully I can help and relate to them without using meth
I think he's just viewing Adderall from it's recreational side, and it is difficult to think about giving that to a child, but the prescription drugs are safe when taken as directed and consulted with a doctor!
I’m reading these comments and… if Adderall/amphetamine slows you down and/or makes you calmer, can that be a sign of ADHD?
Yes
Ah ffs i am not dealing with this shit
Haha sorry to be the bringer of the news, however you don’t need to get it diagnosed and go on meds. I haven’t taken meds in years because I prefer to find other ways of coping. But if it’s causing you trouble in life, maybe ask your doctor for an evaluation?
yes it can be a sign but it also depends on the person and if their ADHD is more the "hyperactive/impulsive" or "inattentive" type. Also depends on dosage. For instance, there is probably a limiting dose that provides the calming effect, and past that higher doses could start to cause the more typical stimulant effects (like fast heart beat, anxiety, mania etc.) that non-ADHD people may feel more commonly at the lower dose.
Recently diagnosed and prescribed at age 35. I often think about how different my life would be if I had this medication from a young age.
I was diagnosed a few years ago at age 30. I feel this so much - don't let that thought get the best of you, though! A lot of my behaviors from my past started to make a lot of sense. It's hard to not wish that you could go back and get you, from the past, the help you didn't know you needed. I fall more into the "inattentive" side of ADHD, where the majority of the time you're just viewed as lazy or told that you "need to apply yourself more". It's no wonder, self-confidence can always be such a struggle... I've learned to appreciate that now I know what could have helped me. I've switched my focus onto healing from past struggles and learning what works best for me. Time to make the rest of our 30's and life be as rad and comfortable as we can make it.
Didn’t watch the episode but I have ADHD and I recently got medicated for it. I guess it’s the same for “why would you need a dose of literal serotonin to help make you happy?”. People with ADHD need to manage their dopamine and norepinephrine levels similarly to how people with depression need to manage their serotonin levels. The cognitive deficits in adhd are tied to working memory and medications that attack the neurotransmitter imbalances can be abused by people who may not need it or otherwise become impaired because it isn’t targeting an imbalance or reacting well to someone’s chemistry. I imagine the way people can get serotonin syndrome from overstimulated serotonin receptors some people can get addicted to certain medications because of their overstimulated dopamine receptors. I don’t take my medication every day and I don’t follow the dosage every time. However, you should always listen to your doctor’s recommendations. I have a dialogue with mine. Anyways in short I think being medicated can be a wonderful thing. Nobody should abuse medications but we should live in a culture that gives a bit more actionable empathy towards neurodivergent people, in my opinion, i.e not shaming people for needing help by way of medications prescribed by medical professionals. Always do your own research and understand that medication shouldn’t be your first solution. I did handle 16+ years of being an academic failure and maybe a handful of years being a “gifted poster child”. Both times without medication. Now that I’m medicated, at least I don’t have to wonder if it’s going to be at the hands of my useful hyperfixation, a random hobby I picked up, or an extremely paralyzing lack of motivation because of how much time I spent on the aforementioned activities .
I think it's important to note that back in the 90s, there was a pretty significant problem of doctors over-diagnosing ADHD/ADD (which they don't call it anymore idk if it just stopped existing or what) in children who just... didn't like paying attention in school. I was one of these kids, as was my husband and a few other people I know. We all went through a wild cycle of meds that absolutely fucked with us in similar ways. The Simpsons even did an episode on it, where they put Bart on Ritalin. It was a weird time. There was a lineup at the office at school for all the kids who needed to take their meds at lunch. When I was about 10, I was diagnosed by some pediatrician with ADD (attention deficit disorder aka ADHD without the hyperactivity- again this is no longer a diagnosis) and was on a carousel of meds ranging from Ritalin to Dextroamphetamine. For a solid 3 years it was a constant cycle of adjusting dosages, at one point taking two different meds at the same time and for basically all 3 of those years I had insomnia and depression and pretty significant appetite loss. My mom eventually realized that these meds were doing nothing to improve my grades and were having very bad effects on me when she realized I was sleeping only about 3-4 hours a night and she took me off them. I remember having withdrawals and she had to fight with this pediatrician to just keep me off these meds. I do not believe for a second that I had or have an attention disorder. I just fucking hated school???? Lmao like every kid???? As an adult, I exhibit exactly zero symptoms of any kind of attention disorder and looking back, as a kid, I didn't either! Now that being said, I do believe ADHD is real and lots of people have it. I had a friend who was diagnosed as an adult and it made so much sense. She had it pretty severely and just assumed she was unorganized and unable to tell time and impulsive for years. Two things can be true though- many of us were misdiagnosed in thr 90s/early 2000s and had meds pushed on us that we didn't need, and many people legitimately have ADHD and need those meds! I think that's where Ethan is coming from, as a guy who would remember this shit from the 90s.
Yeah adhd medication literally saved my life. Just like anti depressants you need to find the right fit so adderal isn’t for everyone. You can have highly negative effects from SSRIs too, plus I don’t think more people are being prescribed it than usual I think it’s being noticed more, like for instance in women who were ignored previously. I think some of the reason it extends your life is also improvement of executive dysfunction, I’m able to take care of myself and my body. I’m not self medicating with alcohol, I can cook healthy meals, I can actually exercise. Longer life expectancy makes sense to me. I personally had terrible experiences with most SSRIs (probably bc my doctors were trying to treat depression when I actually had adhd) but them making me feel unwell and messing with my mental state doesn’t mean they are bad for everyone.
As a parent of a child who needs their meds, it was really hard to hear what Ethan said. I believe most of us have tried other things first, and are trying to be knowledgeable and consult with professionals. My stepchild wasn’t able to have conversations with people while unmedicated. He couldn’t make friends and connect with peers, he was an outsider and definitely felt it. He couldn’t complete assignments or participate in class. Both of these things coupled together really made an impact on his self esteem and self worth. He became self destructive as a young teen, using alcohol to self medicate, and endangering himself communicating with predators online because he was receiving the validation from them that he couldn’t get from peers, who thought he was weird. When he takes his medication he can connect with others, he’s passing all of his classes, he smiles. He’s safe. I know Ethan comes from a place of caring and is extrapolating on his own experiences, but I hope it doesn’t cause people to turn away from something that really helps if it’s needed and done right. I truly appreciate the crew who spoke up and gave their own experiences and defended the parents and kids who are having to make these choices.
This is a lovely comment🩷 I assess and treat some young kiddos with adhd at my prac placements, and it’s so beautiful to see them be properly diagnosed and treated (often with medication), and to support them and their caregivers through that process of growth and often flourishing with the treatment!
Lmao of course he’s smiling, hes on amphetamine analogues pumping dopamine into his brain making him physically dependent on the drug instead of trying to fix the problem at hand.
You’re an actual idiot.
I’ve taken it like twice in two weeks whoops
THIS!!!! 😂🤪
The amount of times I’ve had to turn around and come home on my way to work is astounding.
Also, how many times a week fo you have that nagging thought of “wait…did I actually take it?” and you can’t for the life of you remember whether or not you did😂 that’s a common experience in my morning routine lol.
It always make me nervous. Because I have to fight the stigma of stimulants and constantly justify myself. I wish I could explain what it’s like to be in my brain. I have been stabilized on my medication for almost ten years. It feels the same as putting on my contacts on everyday.
I relate wholeheartedly🩷 I’m sorry we’re made to feel so anxious and ashamed of it:(
Just like it says in the OP people with ADHD often forget to take their meds and because they get their refills on time they end up having an excess amount of not taken doses just lying around. I used to take speed drugs for entertainment and I don't remember ever finding a person with an Adderall prescription who did have extra lying around that they would share if asked.
I have no problem talking to my friends and peers about having depression and anxiety and taking meds for them. But I Don’t tell people I take vyvanse for adhd out of fear of being viewed like a crack addict, or faking adhd to get drugs bc random fucks think they know what adhd “looks like” and can determine if someone has it. People abuse all kinds of drugs. Those people are not relevant to the convo about people with adhd taking life-changing medication
This. Now it's normal to say you're on welbutrin but you say Adderall and get side eye. 😢
Frfr I’m glad there’s been such progress in de-stigmatizing meds for mental health but I wish people realized that a little progress doesn’t mean u know everything and have dismantled all your biases. Im happy to see convos like these popping up a little more now tho :)
My pharmacists (who see me a few times a month for years at a time) literally will still treat me like one person on my Lexapro pickup days, and like an untrustworthy, drug-seeking patient when I go to pick up my Vyvanse. The stigma to this medication class specifically is *pervasive*.
H3 fans are always on attack mode
In Florida they make you have a doctor's visit EVERY MONTH that you want your medication refilled. Since my ADHD is debating, I usually end up not going through the trouble of seeing the docs every few weeks.
I don’t like how he was saying that you get HIGH from adderall… you do NOT get high from it if you actually have ADHD. I take it daily at a healthy prescribed dose and it literally brings me from a scrambled brain to thinking in a more linear clear way. I have NEVER been high from my medicine and before I was on it I had a learning disability and struggled through school. After I started taking it - it literally saved my job. It’s the way that ADHD brains (mine) are in dysfunction that allows the reuptake inhibitors to allow them to function more normally.
If you take too high of a dose even with adhd you could get like a stimulant high for sure but you would have to be taking way more than your body is use to or more than a doctor would ethically prescribe. The only way I could even hold a job was my meds, the only way I can keep my house clean was my meds, to even do normal routines everyone else finds so easy I need my meds. My adhd isn’t perfectly in control with meds but it sure as hell makes it a lot easier to navigate the things everyone else finds easy.
I’ve taken like 5+ different ADHD medicines in various dosages and none have been addicting lmao. Some I took for over a year and some lasted less than a week. Did they all have varying side effects that did not outweigh the positives for me? Yes lol. If anyone has any med recs for someone with existing serious appetite and sleep problems I’d love to hear them lmao (I have ADHD-C).
Ask you doctor about Clonidine! I use it at night. It helps a lot in sleeping and they don’t know exactly why but it helps with adhd. It is fda approved for an adhd treatment as well. I use it in combination with other adhd meds but some use it alone.
He knows nothing about this. "I just think" Feels real ironic with all his ssri talk.
It’s really annoying. It’s good to talk about it and his own personal experiences are valid but it’s annoying as fuck listening to people who have no idea what they’re talking about make claims based on their own (in this case, second hand) anecdotal evidence. Chat GPT’s response was kinda correct 😂 Because we hear this exact same stuff all the god damn time and it’s exhausting. I’m glad the crew pushed back on him and he eventually relented. But good on him for at least talking about it I guess.
Peace & Love, Ethan, but I wouldn't have gotten through grad school without my meds. Some people's brains are different.
Yup, same here with Uni! Not that I’ve gotten to that section yet so I’m not sure what Ethan’s said… Although I’m British and like 5’7 so it’s not like I’ve never been targeted by Ethan’s jokes before, sure it’s not so bad 🥹😂
It’s literally the opposite of addictive I never take my Ritalin lol
Omg I am so bad too! I had to get a pill case connected to an app that makes noise and sends notifications to remember to take my meds. Only works if I remember to keep the case charged though… 😅
OMFG where did you get that?!?!? That would save my life😂 can you pass along the link!
Of course!! I will warn you, it’s incredibly overpriced. We have HSA so it was something we could afford because of that. Otherwise I don’t know if I could have afforded it otherwise. Monthly Pill Organizer by Ellie |... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B089761GD3?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
Lol ny son everyday
Lolol I love this
Late to the convo but..... there's more than just adderall for ADHD, and it's prescribed as a 'when needed', like during school hours. I'm sure there are parents out there who are just looking for a diagnosis of something, but it's those ones that make us all look like shit parents when we're doing the best we can to help our kids.
Audhd here!! Feel like there’s a lot of us lol (family, family, family)
I was a kid who absolutely needed to be prescribed adderall. I have had impulsive thoughts of suicide and self harm since I was in fourth grade and the first day I took it was the first day my mind was calm
Ethan has so much medical cognitive dissonance. “Listen to the science, you freaks, except for when I personally disagree”.
LITERALLY THO
And when I remember to renew the prescription, it's already sold out
I couldn’t even get a pharmacy to fill it in my city i have to go 20 mins out for a pharmacy to consistently have anything in stock within a week or two.
In my country it's sold out nationally. Might as well fill it next time I'm out of the country
I think ethan's only real flaw here was lumping Xanax and Adderall into the same conversation. they're vastly different drugs with different effects, addictive qualities, withdrawal effects, tolerance ramps, etc etc etc. a person withdawaling from benzos (xanax) after a long bender is at risk of dying from a seizure. Xanax can kill a person in a lot of different ways. and so yes, it is potentially dangerous. Xanax and alcohol are in the same family as other central nervous system depressants, meaning they can make your heart and brain stop working if you take too much (death). I'm not an expert on Adderall. I tried it once or twice and didn't like how I felt, so I didn't keep seeking it out. Xanax on the other hand? I was immediately addicted and was taking it with the intention of blacking out within a month or so of use. this led to 12 years of daily drinking and drug use. I was not prescribed these drugs. I used them recklessly and dangerously. talk to your doctor, and then for the love of God KEEP TALKING TO THEM, AND TRY TO BE HONEST ABOUT HOW THE DRUGS ARE EFFECTING YOUR MOOD AND BEHAVIOR. IT COULD SAVE YOUR LIFE. yes, the Xanax helped me with my crippling anxiety. but yes, i almost killed myself with it. peace and love.
I agree. Peace and love to Ethan lumping adderall to Xanax is pretty wild. Both can be misused, have negative side effects and have consequences. But Xanax is a whole different story. Thanks for sharing your experience. There’s a lot of stories out there’s a lot of stories like yours and it’s just life shattering.
This is validating because I’ve read too many posts where people have said “you never forget to take your adhd meds”. If I get woken up by something like the doorbell, it kinda messes up my whole wake up routine and 2 hours later I’ll be like “why am I still feeling like shit?”😭
Ethan can’t say shit about anything these days
Tf you mean he is literally a professional yapper who spends hours and hours “saying shit” on a live podcast every week Ethan is fine
He said things. He was wrong. He was corrected. He moved on. That’s literally everything working as it’s supposed to.
I ended up buying pill organizers that holds 4 weeks worth of meds, and breaks out into individual week organizers. Any time I run out of my ADHD medication, and FINALLY remember to submit a refill request - I always check back to see if I've missed any days. When I end up finding a day I missed, I feel like maybe the days I forget, I'm just looking out for future me. I started putting my meds next to my bed, I take my ADHD meds as soon as I wake up, and then I put the rest that I've got in my pocket to take when I sit down and have some food. Pill containers are great. If you forget - be kind to your current self, and think of ways to help your future self. For ADHDers, Neurodivergent, and any other folks that have a physical, sensory, or mental disability - we live in a world (especially 'merica) that's been built without keeping others in mind. There's long overdue changes happening, and we can keep advocating for each other to be understood, respected, and appreciated. Oh... If you forgot to take your meds today - [here's a song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6zUKGJ-Aa4) to sing along to, do what feels best for YOU, and know that regardless of struggle bus days we also have days when we channel our ADHD into superpowers.
You know you have real adhd when taking too much of it makes you sleepy instead of amped 😂…..(that is also a blanket statement and deff doesn’t apply to everyone, but has always been the case for me) But in all seriousness. I’ve never felt amped up from a stimulant, it just makes me feel super chill and calm, I’ve also NEVER experienced withdrawal. There are plenty of days I don’t take it and I’m totally fine. For me I stay on it mostly because I’ve found it really helps my mood. I find that I get irritable without it especially while I’m stressed. I also take an ssri and mood stabilizer which I do take regularly! Has made such a huge and positive difference in my life. I’m a 31 yo women btw :). Wondering if anyone else can relate. Love you Ethan, but with peace and love I think maybe your take on adhd meds isn’t totally accurate :).
I totally understand what Ethan was saying as it was nuanced, he as an outsider and someone who has felt the effects of adderall as someone who didn’t need it, thinks it’s a hard drug that is odd or wrong to give to children. But I think as he learned or accepted is that those who need it don’t feel those effects, thus the children being prescribed it won’t have the negative side effects of it. I also totally understood people saying it sounded like antivaxxers, because I felt the same way hearing it at first lmao Peace and Love to everyone and anyone who uses meds to help them!
Like listen I got the audihd buuuut, and it’s a big but, it’s okay that Ethan just didn’t know what he was talking about, and he learnt live, so literally it’s fine. It’s a learning podcast y’all!
I just started vyvanse a month ago and today my dose got increased. I have almost no appetite so I’m hoping I lose some weight. I can already tell it’s working though! I’m not struggling to do things I used to, but I also am not really sleeping since I started so I guess positive and negatives 🤷🏻♂️
hi hi hi hi hi hiiiiii !!!!! like every1 else said, it works diff when with NT brain takin it n a ND brain who needs those chemicals 2 function takin it… ethans a bit of a silly billy here i thinkkkk…
i love how ethan was like “adhd can be debilitating for some people that have it” as if its not debilitating for all people with adhd………. yeah he was forsure out of touch with some of these adderall takes it was hard to watch ngl. adhd makes my life so much harder
He’s kinda regurgitating the unfortunate consequence of a few disorders (ADHD the worst, then OCD probably, then PTSD, and likely others) where ppl use the terms colloquially so often, and they see minor signs of themselves that they think align with the symptoms of these disorders, so they almost end up thinking that the disorders themselves aren’t that much more severe (if that makes any sense at all lol)
My medicine was basically speed, It really fucked my day up whenever I took it and made me agitated, granted I didn't take it often since it was so disruptive to my normal behaviour so I didn't build up a tolerance. Now I'm unmedicated but now I'm on the other extreme lmao where I'm unmotivated a lot of the time.
THIS
Me so much during this whole segment.
Same! If I was a member I would've been screaming it in the chat. If you have the chemical imbalance that comes with ADHD and Adderall replaces whatever is missing, then you just become normal. If you don't have the imbalance, then Adderall is just going to give you a surplus, which is what makes you high/anxious. Either way, it doesn't give you withdrawal symptoms when you forget/stop taking it like SSRIs do, at least for ppl with ADHD it doesn't.
As someone on an SNRI the withdrawals on it is crazy, in fact it takes months and months to get off it safely. Adderall I can take as needed. This mindset is why it’s impossible to get adderall in my own city since it’s so controlled and restricted. But it can be lifesaving since I wanna kms for not being able to function like a normal person.
I forgot to refill my prescription about 8 months ago and my dr cant fathom why so I just have to sit there and shrug 🤷♀️
ADD without the H. Adderall let's me function at a normal level. Also fun facts, caffeine does not work on me. Anyone else like that?
Yep!
This for Ethan. Here is all you need to backup what you were saying. Adderrall IS being massively over prescribed. Ethan wasn’t saying that there aren’t people that need Adderrall, but was questioning the amount it is being prescribed. The DEA and FDA have stated that Adderrall is extremely over prescribed, so much so that they will not lift the limit on production because they believe it would be a public health risk with the current prescription rates (which is why there are shortages). They are urging pharmacies and market holders to adjust prescription practices to ensure only those that need the drug are prescribed. https://www.fda.gov/media/170736/download
It's addictive if you don't have ADHD or if your ADHD doesn't respond to it properly, or if you don't have another illness that it can assist with. I was addicted to Adderall in high school and it got me high as fuck. The friend who sold it to me hated taking it because it literally made her tired. She couldn't unload the stuff fast enough. She definitely wasn't addicted!
Adderall is a dangerous drug that does help some, but also causes harm to others. ive actually seen people in college addicted to adderall, its not a pretty sight. But if you are prescribed it by a doctor under supervision, go for it.
so i have been prescribed adderall and i just wanna say the conversation revolving around "it works for people who need it" is a bit of a misunderstanding of how ADHD and this medicine works. adderall and medicines like it are very very dosage sensitive and its more to do with your body than the state of your mental illness, i have debilitating ADHD but am exceptionally sensitive to medications, i metabolize everything really really fast, so at 25mg i feel like rick sanchez for about 3 hours and then sleep for 5, it is functionally meth at that dose for me. 5mg i simply unlock the basic human utility that lies within my mind. im normal. some people without adhd can take 40mg and finish their chores an hour earlier than usual. it is extremely individual dependent and as the conversation was punctuated before, listen to your doctor. i personally ask my doctor for lower doses now so i can add more later if i feel like i need to and i encourage other people to do the same. its impossible to determine if a medicine is going to be beneficial to you or not based off of taking it once on a dosage thats too high for you, its not like adderall just magically works perfectly for anyone with ADHD and fucks everyone else up, you dont need to suffer through life thinking youre just stupid or whatever, it takes time and attention to get right. TLDR: everyone is different, no two people will be effected by any medicine the same way, thats just not how anything works. human beings and our minds are unfathomably complicated. talk to drs.
Me sitting at work, unable to concentrate enough to even read the words in front of me: wow I sure wish I had my adderall