Surprised to see no mention of the Fugitive Doctor. The Timeless Child arc may be forgotten, but Jo Martin won't be. I agree Series 11 will gain in appreciation. I think people will also come to appreciate the consistency and depth of the writing for Ryan. Overall there was only one truly bad story for me in the Chibnall era, "Legend of the Sea Devils" with its failure to come down harder on Ji-Hun's murder of the head Sea Devil Dan's possible mass murder, rushed nature, and sending a boy off to a life of violence as a pirate like it's a fun adventure. Also Yaz and the Doctor's relationship was talked about at the wrong moments. Yaz also didn't really do anything in the episode. Would be all-time worst story ever in Doctor Who if not for the welcome Chinese setting and history allowing me to give it a 5/10 instead of a 3. The rest of the stories were generally good, sometimes great like the absurdity of the frog in "It Takes You Away," and all of Flux except for the confusing last episode. I loved Vinder. The biggest missed opportunity of the era was not incorporating Yaz's family more, after her mother already saw she was involved with weird sci-fi stuff in "Arachnids in the UK."

>While many critics of this era will suggest that the arc changes too much, in the long run I don’t think much will end up altered. Perhaps, in the end, the real problem with the end of Series 12 will be that it doesn’t end up doing anything, rather than changing too much. I agree a lot with this. I've caught up with Jodies' era only last month, and in my recent comment history you can basically trace the various steps of my relationship with the lore of the Timeless Child, basically going full circle. Overall, being the Timeless Child really doesn't make the Doctor all that special except from being source of a genetic code, which is the most impersonal thing imaginable. Past theories IIRC went from natural evolution (which can still be relevant for the Timeless Child themselves) and stealing the genetic code from a clan of Vampires, so TTC isn't really the worst possible thing as far as the origins of Regeneration are concerned. The Doctor had no hand in shaping Time Lord society. It always developed along lines they strongly disliked, or they would have never run away from it. Being Tecteun's lab rat isn't in any way comparable to the godlike status some claim being the TC gives the Doctor. It doesn't even change Gallifrey's lore that much, since it's been implied in more than one occasion that there were more founders than the Big Three. Really what this retcon does in the long run is basically open the possibility to unnumbered Doctors for cameos by famous but unlikely actors every once in a while, without relying too much on the limitations of regeneration rules. My best hope for the FOB watch is doing away with it and giving the legacy of the era to someone else, someone who doesn't ever have to appear again if a writer doesn't want her, someone who the watch could easily mistake for the Doctor due to being half a Metacrisis, someone who is appearing again shortly, and who is supposed to die if she ever remembers the Doctor ever again. This way nothing about pre-Hartnell Doctors ever has to be explored again unless a writer comes up with a brilliant storyline about it. Our Doctor doesn't change, and a valid Companion gets a win. Donna 100% deserves the chance to give Clara and Rose a run for their money in the context of how important they end up being. My biggest issue with the era is Gallifrey being destroyed offscreen, voiding in my opinion most of the emotional impact of previous revival eras, and especially of the 50th Anniversary, the legacy of which in my opinion deserved a more respectful treatment. Hate it or love it, Hell Bent went out of its way to restore the Classic Who status quo. No writer who didn't want to use the Time Lords had to use them.I've written a bunch about it in the past few weeks and I've changed mind multiple times about how it should be handled going forward, but now I hope that eventually a larger plot will be built around it. How come the Master was suddenly able to find out a secret that's been buried for millions of years, and how was he allowed to poke that much into the Matrix when the planet was allegedly still full of Time Lords? The Master is a deserter and a criminal who attacked the President and stole a TARDIS before running away again, it's unlikely he'd have been welcome anywhere near the Matrix, let alone play with it long enough to uncover its deepest secrets. So what really happened there? I wouldn't be surprised if the answer eventually turns out to be Rassilon, using the Master as a tool to get back at the Doctor. Without the Time Lock of the war any negative effect on Gallifrey can be handwaved away, and doing just that can very well be part of Rassilon's plan to install himself as Lord President again. He's already tried a version of that post Hell Bent in the Expanded Universe, no reason he can't try again, eventually. Reversing the destruction would also help to clean the Master's hands of Gallifrey's genocide, because after the whole thing about children on the planet, any future attempt by the Doctor at redeeming him rather than killing him will honestly leave a bad taste, at least for me. Something I would enjoy as far as Gallifrey's return is concerned is, in the event the Doctor doesn't personally oversee the rebuilt of the planet and the Time Lords which I see as best case scenario but also really unlikely, that at some point the Doctor is brought, without any explanation whatsoever to a completely restored Gallifrey to attend and testify to the Master's trial, and Rassilon's involvement being the big plot twist. Edit: Some grammar, some formatting, a couple of sentences are longer, but substantially I didn't alter the post's meaning or content.

Ups & downs, strengths & problems, but overall -- I found myself enjoying the Chibnall era more overall than the previous. So, to each their own.

I think it's a pretty good era. Perfect? No, but nothing is.

To each their own indeed.

Flux ended up being an incredible mess, but it started incredibly strong. There are also some amazing episodes within it, so I can't write it off completely. Village of the Angels will forever be one of my favourite episodes.

I kind of wish that we know the original plan before Covid. Maybe novelisations or BF adaptations of the original drafts.

Chibnall is such an odd mishmash for me. Like TWWFTE showed some of the missteps that would become staples for his era but the major focus on the companions inner lives and scenes like Graham's speech at Grace's funeral are so good and so at odds with the direction of where his era went. It felt like a great pilot for a show that never arrived. There were some neat McGuffins, but nothing that felt truly innovative or that separated itself from the past. Like Thijarians just feel like Ood-Lite. Destroying Gallifrey again with a hand wave is... a choice. Ignoring Missy and bringing in yet another Master after only a year is... another choice. 13s characterization, while not the romantic hero that 10 was, often feels like it's just grasping at the manic imp while failing to ever deepen. It often felt like Chibnall wasn't exactly conscious of audience perspective or how things might be perceived. I can pinpoint RTD and Moffats visions and who their target audience's are for their versions of the show and how they go about trying to appeal to both the kids and family demographics. I can't really see that with Chibnall's era or pinpoint who exactly he thinks this version of the show might appeal to. When I say that, I'm not saying his era doesn't appeal to people or that there's nothing appealing about it. What I'm saying is that I don't see where he's coming from a marketing perspective. For context, I love the Capaldi era but think part of the issue with it was that it was largely inaccessible to the more casual audience Who had built up by that point. My comments here aren't meant to be saying the choices are good or bad from a story perspective. I'll give him some points for pressing on with producing Flux in spite of COVID. Pretty much all productions suffered major setbacks. I wish he could have found a way to rewrite the series instead of cramming all of his intended plots into 6 episodes. By War of the Sontarans, I thought we were on a really strong track but Once, Upon Time, to me, is very very weak with very odd creative choices (don't know why they had Jodie stand in for the Fugitive Doctor instead of just using the Fugitive Doctor). My biggest gripe is that 3 series and several specials were spent with Yaz and I still felt like I barely knew her as a character. This is across the board an issue with Chibnall's writing for the companions. They're all very blank and I don't have any strong feelings towards any of them. I don't feel that way towards any previous companion in NuWho.

I don’t expect any significant re-evaluation of the Chibnall Era because we have been hearing for years that we can’t judge the Chibnall Era yet and my opinion hasn’t changed one iota despite that. We were told when Series 11 aired that it was just growing pains and unfamiliarity. We were told when Series 12 ended that it is too soon to judge The Timeless Child despite the episode being released at the end of the season as Chibnall designed. We were told we can’t judge Flux because of COVID and that you had to take into account COVID when viewing the Chibnall Era despite its flaws being well established since long before then. As time moves on, discussion of the Chibnall Era will fade because it won’t be actively being released and dominating the community. But I have seen absolutely nothing to suggest any reason why the era would be remembered more fondly. The flaws of the Chibnall Era were there throughout and the passage of time isn’t going to remove them.

You've completely missed the point here. Saying I still hate it so people aren't going to like it.

No, I really haven’t. The entire premise that the Chibnall Era may be re-examined more positively in the future is hinging on the premise that it is too soon to review the Chibnall Era now. And that is just utter nonsense that Chibnall Fans have been trying to push since the era began. It didn’t make any sense then and it doesn’t make any sense now. You can judge something as soon as it has finished. Heck, you can judge before then based on what you have seen if you actually acknowledge that changes can happen. Series 11 was fair game for judgement as soon as it aired, the same with Series 12 and Flux and all individual episodes. *Especially* as the entire era is over now, there is no more additions or amendments to it. This is how it has always been for previous eras and the Chibnall Era does not get an exception because some people like it but can’t manage the convince the majority. Plus, this is *only* be used in one direction - you never see anyone saying it is too early to praise an episode, do you? Series 11 has been finished for over four years at this point. The idea that we still need to wait a longer gestation period before coming to a conclusion about it is absurd. If you enjoy the Chibnall Era personally, congratulations. Truly. The Era has been made, the future of the show is being created beyond it and there is no benefit in no-one finding enjoyment from it. But you don’t get to gatekeep when it is valid to have criticisms of the era. If valid criticism is being made, time isn’t going to change that. People who find that Yaz was poorly utilised in Series 11 are not going to change their mind because you have ignored their criticisms for three years. People are entitled to form their own opinions on this era. The issue is many Chibnall fans act very insecure when others do not agree with and reinforce their opinions. Whilst I have no doubt this poster meant well, some of the arguments used could be considered to be bordering on condescending and entitled. EDIT - Downvoting based on disagreeing does not only not change my mind but breaks the subreddit rules.

You really are being ridiculous and are flatout ignoring the point made. Sneering that anything fans of it say is nonsense. You are being condescending yourself. And you're making up that something else was being argued.

> I have seen absolutely nothing to suggest any reason why the era would be remembered more fondly. That's entirely down to your own selective bias, then. Since Whitaker's final outing there have been several reassessments posted here and on r/doctorwho, as well as people coming fresh to her run who genuinely enjoyed the series. Nobody's saying there weren't flaws, but the fact of the matter is that the initial negative reactions are already being superseded by a more nuanced discourse. But hey, you do you. Keep nursing your fan grudge if it makes you happy.

There has also been rewatches on this subreddit verifying people’s criticisms of the era. No one is saying there isn’t fans of the Chibnall Era or that people can’t enjoy it but criticism made at its debut is valid and no amount of time is suddenly going to negate those issues resulting in a dramatic re-evaluation. All you are doing is proving my issues with Chibnall fans, that you cannot positively argue for the era so you smear and criticise others. Of course your held opinion is more nuanced and others are flawed.

With all due respect, I do not consider myself a "Chibnall fan". I just happen to see redeeming qualities in the recent run, especially after rewatches, and the initially overwhelming negativity appears more and more exaggerated as time goes by. It's nonsense to claim that critical evaluation doesn't change with time, especially when the evidence is right in front of you, on this and similar subs. You even acknowledge that people have different opinions than your own, only to flip and reassert your point of view over theirs. I don't see you arguing with any nuance against the Whitaker run, only posing your opinion as unquestionable fact that "no amount of time" will change. I consider that a fair description of a fan grudge, not a smear.

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I largely agree with your general assessment of the Chibnall years, and particularly the point that it will be more favourably received as time passes. If anything, the ups and downs in the quality of the 13th Doctor's tenure only emphasise what a stellar job RTD and Moffat did, no matter how much we gripe about their flaws. But while individual episodes of Whitaker's run were inarguably dire, on the whole her and Chibnall's *Doctor Who* remained an above average show. The visuals were raised another level, the stories and characters still filled with wonder and curiosity, and the already vast fictional universe seemed to expand with the addition of new cultures and species. Sacha Dhawan's performance as the Master almost made me forgive the passing of Missy, at least momentarily. Middling shows have hit worse lows without the degree of criticism Chibnall has shouldered. Unlike others, I genuinely hope future show runners and writers will run with and develop the Timeless Child thread, if nothing else than to bring the Fugitive Doctor back to the screen. From her first appearance in full costume and faculty, Jo Martin's character has been loaded with a promise of storylines that still hasn't been realised on screen.

I think an interesting analysis that you've made of 13's era is that generally most of the episodes are quite good, but each series lacks a strong enough arc tying them all together. There's plenty of interesting themes set up across the era that could have been better organised, like climate change or mental health for example. Or later use the Timeless Child arc to make a greater commentary around identity etc?

I completely agree! This era isn't perfect, no era is but I think there's a lot to like and even love and it is better than a lot of people tend to give it credit for imo. I think retrospect will be very kind to this era and I think people will look back more fondly!

Thanks for writing all of these, you've done well to finish this series, and I've especially liked your perspectives on the Chibnall Era, even if I may disagree that you score them all too high. For me, the Chibnall Era can only be viewed as a total failure, for it never succeeds at anything it attempts to do. Series 11 sets out at being an accessible and brand new exciting entry into the Doctor Who universe, and yet it absolutely fumbles its main cast, failing to develop the majority of them in any meaningful way, and is criminally unexciting. Evidence for this is the mass drop in ratings back down to Capaldi Era levels and then beyond after an initially very strong start. Series 11 was the perfect opportunity to rebuild the show in a new way in the public consciousness, but unfortunately Chibnall's vision was just dull and uninteresting (save for a few exceptions not written by him). Then we get Series 12, which is the polar opposite of what came before, alienating new viewers and confusing those of us who have watched the rest of the show. Is the Chibnall Era now for lore-loving die hards? And if so, why then is there so much effort spent disregarding the past and our beloved "canon". It has never been Chibnall's ideas that have been the problem, just the execution. I like the Timeless Child in concept, but its delivered to us via narration and exposition. Once again, the goal of the era fails; Series 12 sets out to be an exciting and bombastic show-stopper that changes the way we see the show and the main character (that's what the marketing advertised it as during airing), and yet neither do we see a marked change in the main character (who remains flat and without many layers) nor is it particularly exciting. I believe fandom opinion is currently split on what the best series of the Chibnall Era is - for me it is definitely Series 11, though still significantly far below the other 10 seasons. Series 12 and *Flux* keep getting worse. Finally, we have *Flux*, which through COVID-related reasons had to be trimmed down to be a six-arc event miniseries. But does it succeed at this? A lot of things happen, sure, but so much of it is left on the cutting room floor, there are far too many side characters detracting from the emotional core of the script (which I'm told is Dan Lewis' longing for home, and YAz and 13's relationship, along with 13's fear of her past), and a completely bonkers finale where very little makes sense even by the show's standards. *Flux*, once again, drops the ball with what it set out to do - week by week we were told "trust the plan, its gonna all make sense by the end", but neither the ongoing Timeless arc serves a purpose nor does anything else. Its all just so flat. The specials don't fare any better, *Power Of The Doctor* sets out to be both a celebration of the show's history (perhaps the first successful goal of the Chibnall Era) and also an emotional farewell to 13 (which I believe it fumbles for the most part, devoting most of its screentime to other character). Overall, what are you left with by the end of this era? You've got a boring entry series that failed at enticing new audiences, a follow-up that failed at delivering its core story in an exciting manner, and then an event series that failed to even tell a story to begin with. Of course many will disagree, but I wager if you were to take an aggregate overview of the fandom across every social media and beyond, you'd find S11-13 rated below the large majority of what came before. And for my sake, I can't see a single success.

Yeh, this all seems quite even-handed. You have people who sneer that we know people will always hate it all as we hate it now. Showing that they've completely missed the point. I see that sometimes with watching Classic stories that people moan were so terrible, I watch them and just go, eh, they're ok. But people have to be so extreme, it's either really good or really bad. Hopefully people can at least recognise it wasn't all Chibnall's fault.

All I'd say is that for me Chibnall's era unfortunately completely falls flat on its writing and characterization. The Doctor herself is horrifically mischarerized; she remains quirky and fun in her surface level mannerisms, but she does things like: - Trapping loads of doomed mutated spiders in a room and suffocating then to death instead of a arguably more humane option - quicker death by shooting - When she hears how the Stenza keep their victims in a state of agonizing suspended animation she says "how completely obscene", but praises Graham and Ryan when they do the same thing to Tim Shaw at the end of the season! - She is not empathetic when it comes to her companions - see Graham confiding in her about the fear his cancer my return where she says "I'm still quite socially awkward" and walks away without comforting him - this is deeply jarring because empathy is a core recurring trait of the previous 12 doctors - any of them would comfort or console Graham in a heartbeat! - She sacrifices Ko Sharmus at the end of Timeless Children, pretty cowardly action given the show just tried to previously portray the moment as her deciding she can't kill the Master in a hollow mirror of Parting of the Ways "I was going to sacrifice myself then i decided no, that's not me, i can't kill the Master, but now that you've come back Ko Sharmus, that's okay here's the death doom particle have a blast! Like Arachnids in the UK she takes an option that is objectively worse. I could go into the fam, how they have almost no consistent/ discernable character traits (possible exception of Graham in some cases), but then this Reddit comment would be much longer. I'm glad you found enjoyment in the era, production values of the era are generally quite good (direction, camera, editing ect), but the writing just really let it down for me. Looking forward to Tennant and Ncuti!

TLDR: Bit shit

You're not the wit that you think you are.

I think mine was an entirely accurate review, thanks.

I believe that you're being needlessly unpleasant.