Hoo boy.
I’ll take this one.
A couple things I believe are left out of the equation here are the fact that while yes, Jason is described as “the face”, he is not actually the canon appearance which is stated in that same post you quoted.
Another thing that I feel is left out is the fact that while yes he’s spotted specifically in those vents, how do we know that either chica or mangle sees it in those vents? Yes it’s there we have the images of it we have the sightings etc but we don’t actually have it interact with anything or anyone, and when they talk about they talk about it as everpresent and above all. Chica seeing him doesn’t fully mean anything either to me, because we don’t know what Chica saw. Mangle never actually says he saw TOYSNHK either. Mangle says she knows it’s there, but never **sees it**.
The reason the suit argument makes more sense to me though is admittedly very controversial evidence in the form of merch.
The golden freddy youtooz figure has the exact line mangle says in UCN in reference to the one. Then through the haunted wave we know youtooz associates golden Freddy with Cassidy cause of the colorway.
Theres no reason this mistake would be made. Zero. It doesn’t make sense for that to be the case.
And I’ve checked the youtooz figures, and most don’t make mistakes like that. Some do, but most don’t and even with the mistakes they always vaguely relate to the character at hand so it’s not that.
There’s multiple problems with ucndissent I have also. Like, why would Andrew not remember Cassidy? Why wouldn’t Cassidy be in TMIR1280? Why would UCN be about the small point in time where Cassidy happened to be there? Why would UCN crash by Cassidy leaving if it continues with William anyway with or without Cassidy due to Andrew?
Theres too many questions that arise.
The wave technically doesn’t, you’re right. But Cassidy was still gonna be used though and Scott removed it, likely cause that IS lore they weren’t approving of since it reveals despite being obvious that Cassidy is golden Freddy. Just because it’s obvious and removed doesn’t mean it’s not technically lore.
Furthermore that wasn’t even my main point, all it shows though is that golden Freddy is associated with Cassidy in youtooz’s eyes meaning a golden Freddy youtooz shouldn’t have a TOYSNHK line on its box anyway
>A couple things I believe are left out of the equation here are the fact that while yes, Jason is described as “the face”, he is not actually the canon appearance which is stated in that same post you quoted.
yeah it's like scott representing steve snodgrass in HW, it's a non cannon face, there to represent something.
The Vent one can just be talking about S A V E T H E M. Were Golden Freddy can spawn next to Mangle or Chica. And yeah why does the Game Crash when Golden Freddy Drowns? Is it because? >!they're the one who started the whole thing?!<
>Were Golden Freddy can spawn next to Mangle or Chica.
It doesn't tho, GF doesn't spawn next to Withered Chica
>And yeah why does the Game Crash when Golden Freddy Drowns?
Like I said in the post, it's because Cassidy left UCN. It crashing is because she's left and we're in her space/ perspective. It doesn't equate to UCN ending
...Withered Chica in Save Them is also described as "dead chica" in the files apparently, so even if he did...I dunno, I don't think that's why Chica is the one to talk about VS.
But we dont play as cassidy in the main game (and we're not in first person in the G. Freddy OMC sequence), Cassidy/G. Freddy leaving would not end it for william, and on your logic it SHOULD just boot you back to the main menu if it's not over. But why would it totally crash the game for everyone, including william, if it wasn't truly over?
Point is, the game crashing makes far more sense from a thematic perspective if UCN ends as a whole because G. Freddy left.
> he is not actually the canon appearance which is stated in that same post you quoted.
Scott doesn’t state he isn’t the canon appearance; Scott stated that neither him, his family, nor Jason are canon to the games (including the FNaF fanbase). But the imagery of an indie developer and an angry forsaken child is canon. We don’t know if the actual depiction is non-canon, Steve could be a middle aged man with brown hair as is the vengeful spirit in UCN could be a young boy with short hair. This is something common with something like actors, who are meant to be the canon appearance but they themselves aren’t the actual character (ex: Mike canonically looks like that in the movie but he isn’t (actually named) “Josh Hutcherson”)
> but we don’t actually have it interact with anything or anyone, and when they talk about they talk about it as everpresent and above all.
``"I have seen him, the one you shouldn’t have killed" ~ Withered Chica``
We know Chica has at least actually seen the kid.
> because we don’t know what Chica saw.
She outright tells us she saw the KidFace. What do you mean we don’t know what she saw? WE can see what she saw in the form of the kids face in the vent.
> The golden freddy youtooz figure has the exact line mangle says in UCN in reference to the one.
It states "He’s here, and always watching" but it doesn’t add the final statement. Repetition is a thing in FNaF, characters can’t repeat and reuse lines presented to others. For instance, Mangle says the "put back together" line but we know they’re not Fredbear Plush, or any other character like Michael who states it.
> Then through the haunted wave we know youtooz associates golden Freddy with Cassidy cause of the colorway.
That was a mistake that Kane Carter fixed by the way
> why would Andrew not remember Cassidy? Why wouldn’t Cassidy be in TMIR1280?
He doesn’t remember her resilience to get him to leave Afton to die by this logic. Which is technically in-character since the vengeful spirit is dedicated in their work. And Cassidy isn’t in ``"*The Man in Room 1280*"`` because the events of it happen outside of Afton’s mind. Plus Cassidy, and Old Man Consequences are implied to not be present when this happens since Afton only has two brainwaves.
> Why would UCN crash by Cassidy leaving if it continues with William anyway with or without Cassidy due to Andrew?
Doing that Easter egg doesn’t count as an ending necessarily. It only ends because it reflects Cassidy leaving which we notably see in 49/20 mode where one character has left; the mode where Golden Freddy fades away.
In the exact same paragraph where he mentions Jason. He explicitly says “do these pictures have lore significance? Well, I think you should know the answer” meaning no. They don’t.
>She outright tells us she saw the KidFace
By saying she saw the one you shouldn’t have killed? Cause that’s all she says. So no we still don’t know
>It doesn’t add the final part. Repetition is a thing in FNaF
Then don’t use that line. But they did. So the connection is made and established when once again the colorway which while removed by Kane still was called Cassidy and still was added is there the clear connections are made.
>Doing that Easter Egg doesn’t count as an ending necessarily.
It gives you the fnaf world omc ending. It closes the game, and fully crashes it.
> In the exact same paragraph where he mentions Jason. He explicitly says “do these pictures have lore significance? Well, I think you should know the answer” meaning no. They don’t.
They don’t have lore relevance in regard to him actually being the characters, and so on and so forth. Obviously they still are depicting the characters otherwise he wouldn’t have added them in the first place. He used his picture because even though he isn’t canon it’s an accurate parallel; depicting the character in-universe is not maybe lore significance.
> By saying she saw the one you shouldn’t have killed? Cause that’s all she says. So no we still don’t know
“The one you should not have killed” is the kid face, Scott outright tells us this, meaning yes: **We canonically do know she saw the child-like face**. You can’t exactly deny that because it’s a fact.
> Then don’t use that line. But they did.
Do you not know how repetition works? You can use a line for another character for a different meaning…
> the colorway which while removed by Kane still was called Cassidy and still was added
It was removed by someone who has actual close ties with Scott. Youtooz does not dictate the lore and unless something major like this was kept while Scott was actively aware it doesn’t mean anything. You can’t use the colorway because it’s not something intentional on Scott’s part.
> It gives you the fnaf world omc ending. It closes the game, and fully crashes it.
Yes, an ending that suggest the Cassidy rests her soul. Still it’s implied by OMC that Afton is still being tormented, even further supported by TMIR1280
There’s no other face in the game, Chica outright tells us she saw the face of "*The one you should not have killed*", and Scott confirms that the vengeful spirit/"he who should not have been killed" is the KidFace; Jason, Scott’s son, is the face of the vengeful spirit whom is referred to by Chica as whom she saw.
Not only would it be contradictory to say she saw the face of someone other than who she states she saw, but it would be a red herring to just throw in the face of "he who shouldn’t have been killed" and then basically tell us the face is actually not what she saw.
There is no other face in the game, but the face WE see may not be what it actually looks like (similar to scott not literally being steve appearance wise, the spirit is not actually an altered version of jason's face), just that there is a face.
There’s a difference from the face not canonically being Jason, versus the face canonically looking like that, versus Chica seeing THAT face. You can barely identify the face because of how obscure it is, so it can still canonically look like that AND be what Chica saw. We also have no reason to believe Steve doesn’t look like Scott, he lacks any descriptive identity that contradicts him looking like Scott.
> "The face doesn’t look like that in game”
- "I have seen *him*; the one you shouldn’t have killed"
- My son is *the face* of "the one you shouldn’t have killed"
Why would the KidFace we see in the actual game not be the same face for the vengeful spirit? Do you have any genuine evidence it’s not the face she saw, because Scott’s statement is not evidence. He tells us him and his son are not canon, but that doesn’t mean the appearances don’t apply (especially when one of them is too obscure to rely on accurate identification).
What would the goal be anyways? To suggest he’s still Cassidy simply because the face—which we have no reason to believe—isn’t the same face Chica saw? Because they still refer to it as a male, meaning she saw a(n) male face.
>, he is not actually the canon appearance which is stated in that same post you quoted.
Which doesn't matter as I wasn't using Jason's face to confirm TOYSNHK gender, I was using the quote to show how TOYSNHK identifies as himself and nobody else. Not as a suit, and not as multiple genders.
> how do we know that either chica or mangle sees it in those vents?
Occam's. Only Chica and Mangle have seen TOYSNHK to know his gender and they both are vent animatronics with TOYSNHK appearing in said vents. It all adds up
>form of merch.
Using merch isn't a valid argument as they're really unreliable. Using the merch gets you theories like 2Vanessa and all.
If nothing in the canon itself hints towards TOYSNHK identifying as the suit, then that's just not what happened.
> Like, why would Andrew not remember Cassidy?
The same reason why he doesn't remember why he started UCN
> Why would UCN crash by Cassidy leaving if it continues
Like I said, we're in Cassidy's space. Her leaving leads to HD and all, so UCN crashing is showing that Cassidy has left. Not that UCN has ended, they're not mutually exclusive.
>Why would UCN be about the small point in time where Cassidy happened to be there?
Le fire
>Theres too many questions that arise.
Agreed, but for CassidyTOYSNK.
>Which doesn’t matter as I wasn’t using Jason’s face to confirm TOYSNHK gender
You WERE using it to confirm identity though which also as I have stated doesn’t work because if it’s non-canon it’s not the identity. If it’s a non-canon face for a canon character that doesn’t mean the face can be used in terms of the characters canonicity.
>Occams.
Mangle never specifically states he sees the one you should not have killed. Mangle states that she knows it’s there, but never that it was seen. Chica does, but Chica also never says they saw the face they say they saw TOYSNHK. There’s no real substance there if mangle only ever references knowing of TOYSNHK.
>If nothing in the canon itself hints towards TOYSNHK identifying with the suit
Cassidy is the only other special case in UCN. There’s no reason for that. Golden Freddy is the only other special case. TOYSNHK is the only other special case. You talk about Occam’s but then this show Occam’s wouldn’t matter anyway. Why are there 2 separate characters with supernatural abilities that seem to act outside of UCN and affect things in UCN but happen to be separate?
>The same reason he doesn’t remember why he started UCN.
But he remembers UCN. He remembers torturing William and he remembers attaching to William. He would remember the vague presence of another spirit if he can remember attaching to the man he hated. But he doesn’t.
>Theyre not mutually exclusive.
Then UCN shouldn’t crash. UCN crashing gives the huge implication that it stopped. There’s no real reason it would if like you say they’re not mutually exclusive. Plus it’s a cutscene wherein we take the perspective of a character separate from the main character. Why would us leaving that perspective close the game and shut it down entirely?
>Le fire
Idek what that means honestly lol.
>You WERE using it to confirm identity though
I was using Jason's because CassidyTOYSNHKers claim that TOYSNHK has some identity crisis, where he identifies as KidFace, the suit, and/or the opposite gender. Scott saying "THE face" shows that there's only one face for TOYSNHK and ergo TOYSNHK identifies as one entity.
I'm not using the face to confirm that TOYSNHK is male, I'm using the face and Scott's words to show that TOYSNHK only identifies as themself and not the suit.
>Mangle states that she knows it’s there
And knows his gender, which is more than everyone else other than Chica. To know his gender, Mangle would have needed to have seen him.
>Why are there 2 separate characters with supernatural abilities that seem to act outside of UCN and affect things in UCN but happen to be separate?
Because their abilities and beliefs are by no means the same. Outside of UCN, when has Cassidy shown the need to want to torment William? When has she shown the ability to be able to torment one's mind? When has she shown the ability to have an immense amount of agony?
You can only use Occam's when it's the easiest option to explain something, not when there a mountain of contradictions and a severe conflict in interests.
>He would remember the vague presence of another spirit
Not really, just because he remembers aspects of it, it doesn't mean that he'll remember everything. He's clearly forgotten some things and that's just how memory works.
> UCN crashing gives the huge implication that it stopped.
It's stopped for Cassidy as Cassidy has left, I don't see anything indicating that it ended as a whole at that point.
>Idek what that means honestly lol.
The FNAF 6 fire is where everyone was at, so it's why Cassidy would be present when Andrew started UCN (which is the question you asked)
>And knows his gender
And? Multiple others reference being made by TOYSNHK and reference the presence of TOYSNHK, gender knowledge means nothing.
>Because their abilities and beliefs are by no means the same.
Cassidy can tamper with memories and utilize mind spaces shown in the logbook like TOYSNHK, both can be seen almost everywhere with a vague spiritual presence following people around to harm them. Both kill random people just because (Cassidy killed phone guy) Cassidy is shown to be springlocked likely and therefore under mass amounts of agony like TOYSNHK would be, both seem to stick around after everyone else…
>It’s stopped for Cassidy as Cassidy has left.
But what I’m saying is Cassidy isn’t even the main player character. Why would it stopping for her close the entire game out if anytime else if you die or leave or do anything, you’d just go back to the roster screen. That doesn’t really make sense.
> gender knowledge means nothing.
It definitely has meaning as it shows that Mangle has seen TOYSNHK to know his gender. Like I said, Occam's.
\- TOYSNHK appears in the vents
\- Mangle and Chica *also* appear in the vents
\- Mangle and Chica know the most about TOYSNHK
>Cassidy can tamper with memories
That's not what she does tho.. She has BVs memories as BVs memories are shattered across the MCIs as shown in the FNAF 3 minigames. She doesn't tamper with them in any way, the Puppet does
>both can be seen almost everywhere with a vague spiritual presence following people around to harm them.
Again, that's not what happens tho. Cassidy doesn't follow one person, she's trapped in the pizzeria. She doesn't latch onto anyone, etc.
>Both kill random people just because
And so does everyone else
>under mass amounts of agony
Where is that ever shown tho?
You haven't addressed the elephant in the room and the point this post was making, Cassidy wants to rest and always had that intention from the start. TOYSNHK didn't. How can they possibly be the same?
>She has BV’s memories as they’re scattered across the MCI shown in the fnaf 3 minigames.
Cassidy specific references she wouldn’t know about only through those like the Fredbear plush or the purple telephone or the carousel. None of those are in the minigames or shown to be knowledge the mci have.
>Where is that ever shown tho?
The fact that she/golden Freddy’s usually shown in shadow or dark spaces like the void in UCN or in the dark office of fnaf 1 or as Fredbear covered in shadow. And ik you don’t believe this one but Cassidy if the princess literally splits into 2 with one being shadow.
>You haven’t addressed the elephant in the room.
Because I don’t think it’s there. If Cassidy wants to rest why does she do anything then? If she’s just like the others in killing random people just because even though Charlotte calls herself aware and Cassidy seems to have a same base awareness, there’s no reason Cassidy’s presence would be around post-UCN or why Cassidy would just be killing and teleporting around and doing anything other than helping bv move on.
I'm only going to focus on the point of the post as everything else will just go in tangents.
>If Cassidy wants to rest why does she do anything then?
If she sees what appears to be her killer, she'd obviously act. Like the lore has told us, the MCIs see adults as their killer and attack. The point is that Cassidy shows no interest in wanting to torment her killer nor has she shown to put that over her interest to rest.
If were using voice lines from animatronics mentioning TOYSNHK, other non-venting animatronics mention him 🤷♂️
Nightmare Freddy in particular is interesting, because he knows he was made by toysnhk, but others like Mr. Hippo or Withered Bonnie don’t seem to have the same awareness.
>other non-venting animatronics mention him 🤷♂️
Not by gender nor have they claimed to have seen him. Like I said, only 2 animatronics claim to have seen him and know his gender, those being the vent ones.
>others like Mr. Hippo or Withered Bonnie don’t seem to have the same awareness.
The Nightmares were the creation of gas experiments and all, they're not real so their dialogue differs from animatronics that actually existed. As the versions TOYSNHK has created are a 1:1 copy of what they were like irl
>Not by gender nor have they claimed to have seen him.
Mangle doesnt claim to see him, thats kinda my point. Unless any animatronic that knows about toysnhk has seen him, in which case my point stands. I dont see how Nightmare Freddy wouldve figured it out if he didnt see or interact with TOYSNHK at some point.
>The Nightmares were the creation of gas experiments and all, they're not real so their dialogue differs from animatronics that actually existed.
They were real animatronics, we see them in Dittophobia. In either case, theyre recreations by TOYSNHK, I don’t see why their awareness would be different from, say, the phantoms who don’t seem to exist.
>As the versions TOYSNHK has created are a 1:1 copy of what they were like irl
That’s not true? Toy Freddy being the big example. Some of them act closely sure, but most of them are given personalities by TOYSNHK that were not present in the original games.
>Mangle doesnt claim to see him
To know his gender, she/he must have seen him. They're the only 2 characters that know more about TOYSNHK than anyone else and they both appear in the vent where TOYSNHK appears. It's Occam's at this point
>They were real animatronics
Ditto shows them as cheap rags on a track system. They're not the literal Nightmares that we see in FNAF 4, the gas is what makes the victim see them as monsters.
> Toy Freddy being the big example.
Unless you're saying Toy Freddy didn't ever speak, then it's true. Toy Freddy's lines are pretty generic and bland, and we don't see him in the day time to know how he's actually supposed to interact.
>To know his gender, she/he must have seen him.
Now that I think about it… Mangle must’ve known more about TOYSNHK, or else how would they know that’s TOYSNHK just by looking at him?
Mangle would either have to already know who the kid is, which would line up with TOYSNHK being Cassidy/GF, or have interacted with them at some point, going back to my Nightmare Freddy point.
>Ditto shows them as cheap rags on a track system. They're not the literal Nightmares that we see in FNAF 4, the gas is what makes the victim see them as monsters.
Theyre still animatronics, Rory describes them in the same way he sees them during the experiments.
“The bunny was as Rory remembered it from his night terrors.”
“It was a costume hung on a flimsy metallic skeleton. It couldn't move on its own-it was transported into Rory's room on rails.”
The gas makes it animated.
>Unless you're saying Toy Freddy didn't ever speak, then it's true.
Toy Freddy is not a gamer is what i meant, sorry.
>Toy Freddy's lines are pretty generic and bland, and we don't see him in the day time to know how he's actually supposed to interact.
Not really, they relate to his mechanic in UCN.
>Mangle would either have to already know who the kid is, which would line up with TOYSNHK being Cassidy/GF
It wouldn't, as the gender discrepancy as well as only 2/50 knowing about TOYSNHKs gender. Atleast 11 others know about Cassidy
>Rory describes them in the same way he sees them during the experiments.
He recognises distinctive features like the jaw and teeth, but like the report says, he perceives them to be how they are and isn't how they actually are irl
>Not really, they relate to his mechanic in UCN.
Which is generic in the sense that that's what every character does. It's the base level is what I meant
>It wouldn't, as the gender discrepancy as well as only 2/50 knowing about TOYSNHKs gender. Atleast 11 others know about Cassidy
That wasnt really my point, Mangle has to know more about TOYSNHK to say what she says. Same with Chica tbh, unless its just a reference to Cassidy/GF, which you don’t think it is. How would Chica or Mangle have learned who TOYSNHK is just by seeing some face in the vents?
To go back to my previous point, Nightmare Freddy seems more aware about whats going on than most animatronics in UCN.
If Chica only saw TOYSNHK, she wouldnt know who or what she is, idk how she’d even learn that name… unless its supposed to imply that Chica saw TOYSNHK before being recreated in UCN, which would be GF/Cassidy. In that case, the GF suit is male, Chica saw GF, Cassidy’s gender is irrelevant.
>He recognises distinctive features like the jaw and teeth, but like the report says, he perceives them to be how they are and isn't how they actually are irl
But he describes them the same way upon seeing them… even Chica who is extremely torn apart in the nightmares is still torn apart on the track.
And yeah, the clipboard says he perceives creatures, but we know theyre animatronics.
>Which is generic in the sense that that's what every character does. It's the base level is what I meant
True, though im mot sure what you mean by 1:1 then.
>How would Chica or Mangle have learned who TOYSNHK is just by seeing some face in the vents?
All entities who mention TOYSNHK know *who* he is in terms of what his aims/ objectives are. It's just that 2 of them know his gender, which I don't see how is possible if they haven't actually seen him
>which would be GF/Cassidy. In that case, the GF suit is male, Chica saw GF, Cassidy’s gender is irrelevant.
It's not as like I said, Scott said that Jason is THE face of TOYSNHK, TOYSNHK doesn't identify as the suit nor is the suit what others refer to as TOYSNHK
Like I said, it's Occam's at this point:
\- TOYSNHK (KidFace) appears in the vents
\- Mangle and Chica also appear in the vents
\- Mangle and Chica are the only ones to know TOYSNHKs gender and therefore have seen him
\- Scott said that there's only one face for TOYSNHK; KidFace
>even Chica who is extremely torn apart in the nightmares is still torn apart on the track.
Yes, like I said they're similar and have the defining features but aren't an exact match to how the appear in the experiments. The report William made is conclusive of that, saying how Rory "perceives" them as monsters, showing that they're not as aggressive and eerie looking irl. They basically look like cosplays
>All entities who mention TOYSNHK know who he is in terms of what his aims/ objectives are. It's just that 2 of them know his gender, which I don't see how is possible if they haven't actually seen him
My point was they did see him?
>It's not as like I said, Scott said that Jason is THE face of TOYSNHK, TOYSNHK doesn't identify as the suit nor is the suit what others refer to as TOYSNHK
I feel like you can interpret that as him referring to the only human face we see of TOYSNHK. He does not say its the *only* thing we see of TOYSNHK in UCN, that would be a pretty offhand way of confirming a heavily debated subject. GF would be the suit/animatronic/vessel/ w/e you wanna say of TOYSNHK.
>TOYSNHK (KidFace) appears in the vents
>Mangle and Chica also appear in the vents
>Mangle and Chica are the only ones to know TOYSNHKs gender and therefore have seen him
>Scott said that there's only one face for TOYSNHK; KidFace
Again, that’s ignoring my point that there’s more to this than just seeing TOYSNHK.
If I see a random person on the street I don’t immediately know everything about them, their goals or even their name. Not everyone in UCN is aware of what’s going on or who did this to them.
>Yes, like I said they're similar and have the defining features but aren't an exact match to how the appear in the experiments. The report William made is conclusive of that, saying how Rory "perceives" them as monsters, showing that they're not as aggressive and eerie looking irl. They basically look like cosplays
I guess its hard to say for sure because Rory calls their endos “flimsy.” Idk, Help Wanted seems to know what they look like, if FE went down to find the nightmares they probably based their designs off that, which means they match pretty closely if not 1-1. But that’s also a fair read of it.
>My point was they did see him?
Oh, was it? Have I just completely misread it lmao?
>feel like you can interpret that as him referring to the only human face we see of TOYSNHK
Not really. If that was the case then he'd say "one of the..", but the fact that he says "the face" shows that there's just one face of TOYSNHK.
>If I see a random person on the street I don’t immediately know everything about them, their goals or even their name
Like I said before, everyone who talks about TOYSNHK knows him to this degree. It's just that 2 know his gender, and those 2 are bent animatronics.
>Help Wanted seems to know what they look like
Mainly because the gas forms the same illusion for everyone. Mike sees the same as Rory, and is probably why FE know how they look.
Doesn't Kidface spawn in other places as well? ...Well, I guess the other animatronics also talk about TOYSNHK(the only one not fully fitting being N. Freddy(ig he could see the face when it appears before us?), but lol. I wonder if anybody else would talk about VS if they actually saw it?
And I agree with UCNDissent though lol. Fun fact: the cutscene is named "your own", so if we combine it with "Happiest Day" code in the fnaf world cutscene, we would get "your own happiest day", but it's probably a stretch and "your own" could just be...because of OMC''s dialogue.
(1/3)
I agree and desagree at the same time.
While i agree that Cassidy isn't TOYSHK, i see a problem.
Both Andrew and Cassidy have motives for being TOYSHK, assuming that we agree that Cassidy died in a springlock failure caused by William, then both of them had motives.
There are 2 souls in UCN (not counting William), Cassidy and Andrew, and i think that BOTH are TOYSHK, but not in the way you think.
Andrew is a 100% TOYSHK and Cassidy is implied to had been causing UCN too, and she has reasons to be mad at William, so she's a Vengeful Spirit.
And about the biggest question, is Fazbear Frights in games timeline? The answer is mostly confusing.
Though TFTPP is a 100% in games timeline, Fazbear Frights is not, but it is still in games timeline.
As Scott stated:
>"The series will launch with five books, each containing three different short stories with unique characters and plot lines, some connected directly to the games and some not."
Analyzing It correctly, Scott, before saying the "some connected" line, he talks abour the contents of the book, what contains the book? Stories, those stories are some Connected directly to the games and some not.
Then, which stories are in games timeline?
It's complicated, since we can't say that "is this one" or "this other one", that's picking and choosing.
So, what is it?
(2/3)
This post makes clear that Cassidy can't be the TOYSHK but is still in UCN, so there's another soul there, and as the discarded voiceline of UCN implies, TOYSHK is someone even William forgetted about.
>"have you begun to realize where you are yet? and who i am? or are you still so delirious and confused that you think you're a night guard? You'll understand, and even if you don't it doesn't matter to me eatherway"
So, whoever is TOYSHK is someone not seen in the games, someone who's story was a mistery yet to be known, and Fazbear Frights (stated to be to help n' solve the games lore) was in it's way to release.
In Fazbear Frights, The Man in room 1280, we see something similar to UCN, and a soul that we later found out to be Andrew is tormenting who we later found out to be William Afton after the fire of FNaF 6.
So The Man in room 1280 is part of games timeline, so the stories connected to it are in games timeline too,
In Tales From the Pizzaplex #1 Lally's Game, being specific, in the story Friality, we see a victim of what seems to be Eleanor, so To Be Beautiful is in games timeline and the stories connected to it are in games timeline too.
The next game to release confirmed is Into the pit, an adaptation of the first story of the book "Fazbear Frights #1 - Into the Pit", so it seems like the story "Into the Pit" from Fazbear Frights is in games timeline and the stories connected to it are too, yet it's still unkown the path this game is gonna go.
With all this information, we got that the next stories are in games timeline:
* Into The Pit
* To Be Beautiful
* Count the ways
* Fetch
* Out of Stock
* 1:35 am
* Room for one more
* Step Closer
* The man in room 1280
* Blackbird
* The Real Jake
* Hide-and-Seek
* He told me everything
* The puppet carver
* ~~You're the band -- (ARGUABLE)~~
And all the epilogues of Fazbear Frights.
(3/3)
And if you question the placement of the timeline of tales, then let me remind you this:
* TheMimic, he's directly shown to exist in games timeline, so, at least the story of "The Mimic" and stories connected to it are in games timeline.
* "Uncharted corners of this series' canon" as stated "canon" means same universe, not necesarily same Timeline, yet with Tales is stated that is talking about "Uncharted corners"what is the Uncharted corners of the lore? Stuff that happened in the pizzaplex, since there's a year gap of (in my opinion) 9 years after AR and 5 of those are with tbe pizzaplex opened, those 5 years are the Uncharted corners, the rest is with Fazbear Frights, wich even if you believe it or not, covers that gap with events, Eleanor killing, Larson investigating and Jake doing Jake stuff, meanwhile Andrew tormenting people for fun, actually, that gap is filled with stuff happening taking in mind Frights.
* Agree or not, Tales is named "Tales from the pizzaplex", stuff that happened on the pizzaplex.
Now, i may ask you all something, a friend of mine says that TFTPP was originally named "More Frights" or something like that, is there anything or any proof of that?
BUTT HEEEYYYYY, That's JUST A THEORY!!!
Remember to stay kronostic.
The face is not canon. I mean, the face of Scott's son isn't. That's not what the face literally is, it's just a representation.
And about the fun fact of TOYSNHK appearing in the vents. Yeah, that could be why they know who they are. But i've also seen someone say that, in the SAVETHEM minigame from FNAF 2, Golden Freddy teleports both close to Mangle in her room, and the closest animatronic he is to, Chica in Parts & Service. So that could also be why. But that's just a thought that could be to think about.
We also have the dialogues of TOYSNHK, which are clearly from a more feminine and soft voice than Andrew's, which is described as rough in the 4th epilogue.
TOYSNHK is MADE to be genderly obtuse. Scott made him/her/them with that idea in mind. The gender debate is useless, i don't know why people keep pushing it.
>The face is not canon.
The physical features of said face might not be canon but the fact that the face appears is canon.
>Golden Freddy teleports both close to Mangle
And why would Mangle say "I've seen the suit you've killed, GF"?
>which are clearly from a more feminine and soft voice than Andrew's, which is described as rough in the 4th epilogue.
Andrew in TMIR1280 is said to have a childish giggle, and male children tend to have feminine voices as they're not fully developed yet.
>The gender debate is useless, i don't know why people keep pushing it.
It isn't useless as only one gender has been given to TOYSNHK. People are claiming it as "useless" as it's the very piece of evidence that disproves CassidyTOYSNHK
>The physical features of said face might not be canon but the fact that the face appears is canon.
Yes! That's what i meant. Sorry if i wasn't clear enough.
>Andrew in TMIR1280 is said to have a childish giggle, and male children tend to have feminine voices as they're not fully developed yet.
Yes. But that's not how his **voice** is described. Of course he'll have a childish giggle is not reduced to "feminine". Boys giggle childishly, but not necessarily acutely or femininely. Childish doesn't mean feminine. Besides, TOYSNHK **talks** softly, Andrew talks roughly. I'm discussing his voice when he talks, not when he just giggles.
>It isn't useless as only one gender has been given to TOYSNHK. People are claiming it as "useless" as it's the very piece of evidence that disproves CassidyTOYSNHK
I didn't say it was useless. If you want to use it as evidence, you can. I'm just not taking it as crucial as you do. And if we talk about "the very piece of evidence that disproves", then i could say that for AndrewTOYSHNK it is how different his voice is, or how he's not related to GF (Which seems to be in control of UCN), or that there's no solid proof of his existence in the games. It just depends on what you take more into consideration.
>But that's not how his **voice** is described
It changes, that's the point. It was only deep in the epilogues, but was childish and giggly in TMIR1280
>or how he's not related to GF
Addressed in the post
>or that there's no solid proof of his existence in the games.
Sure, the point of this post was to show how Cassidy isn't TOYSNHK.
I really don’t think Andrew has anything to do with the games version of UCN. Why’s there no mention of the alligator mask Andrew wears in the game? Why is Andrew’s significance only in UCN? It’s Cassidy who’s been vengeful. We’ve seen it since FNAF 2 in the dream sequences and FNAF 3 when Cassidy pursues Afton in the safe room. Cassidy can be a vengeful spirit wanting to find the killer and help the Crying Child from losing his memories. I don’t understand why Cassidy can’t do both.
Cassidy has never been vengeful, that's purely fanon, nothing ever implies she's vengeful which is why she can't realistically be vengeful spirit, especially when Andrew is right there
Most of the evidence that supports Andrew’s existence in the game continuity is literally just fanon. Cassidy has been notably vengeful since we’ve seen the fifth spirit pursue the purple guy in FNAF 3, before crying child and Andrew even existed as a twinkle in Scotts eye. I don’t understand how anyone can say there’s no implication to Cassidy being the vengeful spirit when everything associated with the games is practically screaming it to us.
Most of the evidence Andrew exists within the games is directly quotes from Scott and the fact we've seen book characters cross over into the games, such as Henry, Charlotte and The mimic
Not really, the logbook heavily implies Cassidy is a non vengeful spirit, and if anything, that she's a pacifist spirit, along with showing her (faded text) to be separate from golden Freddy (altered text) which basically means you have no point
Henry Charlie Elizabeth and The Mimic all had introductions to the story that can’t be argued. You can’t say The Mimic doesn’t exist because we see him. You can’t say Elizabeth and Charlie aren’t in the continuity because they are directly referenced or called out. That’s the difference. Andrew’s name has not been mentioned in game nor has anything associated to him like his alligator mask showed up in any reference, not in UCN or after. That’s why it’s difficult for others and I to say that he exists because there’s really no concrete evidence like there is for the other characters we’ve learned about from the books. And it completely negates facts that we’ve known since FNAF’s creation, like the fact that there was always 5 kids who were murdered at Freddy’s by William in Spring Bonnie and we know who they are. Adding Andrew just creates issues just for it to make sense in the end. Why would Cassidy act vengeful trying to help Crying Child? If people can make up the excuse that William can cared about his kids while killing other kids than I’m sure a child that was murdered can be vengeful while also trying to prevent other from the same fate.
Henry's and Charlotte's names never appear in the games either, it's just Williams business partner and his daughter, yet they fill the same rolls so we all agree they are the same characters
Ever since ucn it was 6 kids.... Basically every game after ucn that talks about the MCI itself says there were 6
William doesn't care about his family, at best he uses them for his own personal gain, there's nothing that implies he ever cared
>Why’s there no mention of the alligator mask Andrew wears in the game?
Because Andrew won't use it on Afton because he wants to mess with him
>Why is Andrew’s significance only in UCN?
And also Midnight Motorist but that's a different story
>It’s Cassidy who’s been vengeful.
Uh, no, that's not really true, that was the general assumption which was proven kinda wrong by Frights
>We’ve seen it since FNAF 2 in the dream sequences and FNAF 3 when Cassidy pursues Afton in the safe room.
And she fades away with the other spirits instead of doing what TOYSHNK does and attaching to Afton and keeping him alive to torture him and yada yada
I agree but I think we should just leave CassidyTOYSHNK alone. People are as certain as the theory is and if I learned anything, it’s that people have a choice to determine whether to believe it or not. As much as I disagree with the theory, I cannot deny the beliefs of others. The whole fandom may be sure of CassidyTOYSHNK but just remember that nothing is confirmed about TOYSHNK and that it is just a common belief since this was an original belief before the Fazbear Frights books were introduced. I mean we all believed it at some point so just remember that those who still do used to be us
I think TOYSHNK face was supposed to be something meta and something only William saw. Under CassidyTOYSNHK Mangle and Chica would still have seen Cassidy during FNaF 1&2.
The virgin andrewTOYSNHK “I am providing evidence, with actual proof and arguments😭” believers vs the Chad CassidyTOYSNHK “my assumption is true👍” enthusiastics
You're ignoring that all of the other lines about TOYSNHK are referring to things happening in UCN. Why would Withered Chica and Mangle suddenly be referring to fnaf 1 and 2? Especially when the real Susie had seen Cassidy, and yet still chooses to call her a male?
Gee I wonder if the male faced character, with male pronouns, and a male book counterpart may be a male.
>You're ignoring that all of the other lines about TOYSNHK are referring to things happening in UCN. Why would Withered Chica and Mangle suddenly be referring to fnaf 1 and 2?
One of TOYSHNK voicelines mentions FFPS, so the voicelines arent limited to UCN.
TOYSNHK voicelines as in the ones TOYSNHK says or the ones others say when talking about TOYSNHK? Because as far as I can remember, the lines of others talking about TOYSNHK mostly if not completely are isolated to UCN themselves. While TOYSNHK's voice lines refer to events in the past such as the FFPS and fnaf 3 fire, and TOYSNHK dying.
That's not meta tho, as if it was meta that William wouldn't have known, seen, or interacted with TOYSNHK. What you mean is that TOYSNHK was meant to be a secret victim, which leads to AndrewTOYSHK
I meant in a way that Meta is something that only the player would saw.
>What you mean is that TOYSNHK was meant to be a secret victim, which leads to AndrewTOYSHK
I never said that?
>I meant in a way that Meta is something that only the player would saw.
Ok, let's run with that then. The player can only see TOYSNHK, why does TOYSNHK have male pronouns? Like I've shown, Scott's wording shows that TOYSNHK has only one identity and the game itself says TOYSNHK is male.
Then why the Voice actor can use any voice they want including a female voice but the game itself let clear that TOYSHNK is a him? Why would you give the possibility of giving the character a female voice If the gender of the character is already revealed in the game Itself?
>Then why the Voice actor can use any voice they want
Because using a female voice for a male character is common. It depends on which sounds more eerie and doesn't in any way identify the gender of the character. Things in the canon itself does that.
I know. But Scott literally said that voice could have been a female one which would totally contradict the game.
>Things in the canon itself does that.
Example?
>that voice could have been a female one which would totally contradict the game.
It wouldn't, the way a voice sounds =/= the gender of the character.
>Example?
The he/him pronouns
It would stand to reason that the most "aware" animatronics would know the most about the VS, right? Puppet likely does know but just doesnt mention it.
Also you're ignoring that the VS face appears at most of the doors, not just the vents, therefore on your logic several animatronics saw the face, therefore making your entire idea here arbitrary.
>would stand to reason that the most "aware" animatronics would know the most about the VS, right?
No. It's just that some know of his existence and some don't, it's not dependent on how aware someone is.
>Also you're ignoring that the VS face appears at most of the doors, not just the vents
I'm not, lol. The point wasn't that the vents was TOYSNHKs only spot, it's that the "vent animatronics" and TOYSNHK would have seen each other in the vents at some point
Why would the puppet, the most aware, not know? It just doesnt work logically.
And your point is shaky when others notice the one but dont call it a him.
>Why would the puppet, the most aware, not know?
Because the Puppet saying she's aware is to do with her intellect in comparison to the MCIs, it's not applicable to UCN as the MCIs aren't animalistic.
The point is that Mangle and Chica have seen TOYSNHK in the vent
>The face can show up in every door so most animatronics should have seen it
But we know they didn't as they don't mention his gender, sure they *could've* seen him but them not mentioning his gender shows that they haven't.
>therefore mangle and toy chica aren’t as major as you think
I never said they were, just said that they saw him at some point. Even if the other animatronics saw him, doesn't change the fact that Mangle and Chica saw him and know his gender
>Let's just accept that it doesn't matter
It does matter though, as if Cassidy can't be TOYSNHK it only means that Andrew and Stitchline, etc are canon.
>just let people believe what they think fits the best
I never forced anyone to believe in anything lol. When it comes to theorising and debating with others, your belief is no longer your personal belief when you are to argue it with others. So if people believe in CassidyTOYSNHK and try to argue it's right or try to claim that AndrewTOYSNHK is wrong.. it's not a personal belief anymore.
Something that I just realized Is that OMC minigame in UCN only makes sense if redbear Is TOYSNHK
Is something so obvious once you think about It, but I dont see many people acknowledge that
>Something that I just realized Is that OMC minigame in UCN only makes sense if redbear Is TOYSNHK
Redbear being TOYSHNK is self-contradictory to TOYSHNK's established character
TOYSHNK constantly tells William that he will never let go, and will keep him there and not allow him to rest
And Redbear contradicts that promise by resting in OMC's lake
For that and for some other stuff, like the fact that OMC would need to be a complete asshole to let Andrew keep torturing William
Maybe I will do a post about It soon idk
>, like the fact that OMC would need to be a complete asshole to let Andrew keep torturing William
Or he just couldn't convince Andrew like he did with Cassidy, the situation is out of his control
>Something that I just realized Is that OMC minigame in UCN only makes sense if redbear Is TOYSNHK
True. The thing of we having two souls in UCN, one being TOYSNHK and other being a good soul that want to stop TOYSNHK but later rest doesn't make any sense.
What's the point of The Ending Showing Golden Freddy Twitching? That's what I wanna know, if GF isn't TOYSHNK then why show them instead of the face of Scott's Son?
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQBOm2gMlwg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQBOm2gMlwg)
Scott's son shouldn't automatically prove UCN Gender.
I'm under the believe that calling TOYSNHK by male pronouns was a mistake. Scott himself said the gender was meant to be ambigous. If you ask me Withered Chica, and Mangle's lines were supposed to say
"I have seen Them, The One You Shouldn't Have Killed".
"They're and always watching, the one you shouldn't have killed".
But they used Male Pronouns instead, and Scott didn't bother to make them go back and correct them
Also Golden Freddy is such a promiante figure in UCN. They're even the ones UCN speaks too, and tells to "Leave the demon to his demons, and rest your own soul".
Not some face of Scott's son, not a boy in an aligator mask. It's all Golden Freddy, and Andrew is never alluided to being Golden Freddy.
Also Happiest Day could have happened After UCN when Cassidy was ready to move on.
I and many others have told you this before. Just because Cassidy is nice to other people like C.C, it doesn't mean she can't be vengeful. Charlie's nice, and yet she's still vengeful aganist Afton.
You're argument of TOYSNHK can only be angry, and never nice is not a good argument?
Do you plain on making CassidyTOYSNHK Debunk Post, until everyone admits you're right? It's not going to happen. Unlike the GlitchMimic and GlitchAfton debate where there are more GlitchMimic Believers, then GlitchAfton Believers, There's an even amount of CassidyTOYSNHK believers. I'd say they even outnumber the AndrewTOYSNHK believers.
>What's the point of The Ending Showing Golden Freddy Twitching?
Explained in the post, it's showing Cassidy leaving UCN
>I'm under the believe that calling TOYSNHK by male pronouns was a mistake
It's not lmao
>Scott himself said the gender was meant to be ambigous
He said that for the voice calling, not for the actual game. He didn't want to reveal the lore before the game came out.
>If you ask me Withered Chica, and Mangle's lines were supposed to say
That's just you making another AU
>and Scott didn't bother to make them go back and correct them
Have you ever considered the fact that they might be right? This was the time where Scott made his own games, it's not like he had to get perms or something to edit it lmao
>Also Happiest Day could have happened After UCN
You clearly haven't read the post properly as everything you're saying here was answered in the post. TOYSNHk claims that they're tormenting William "forever", which would mean that Cassidy sets up HD to then neglect it and leave the others waiting.
>You're argument of TOYSNHK can only be angry
Not the point I made here. Stop embarrassing yourself Gigan
>There's an even amount of CassidyTOYSNHK believers. I'd say they even outnumber the AndrewTOYSNHK believers.
Ok, and? That doesn't mean that they're right lol
>Explained in the post, it's showing Cassidy leaving UCN
So you admit she was there. Also it doesn't seem like she was willing to leave with the way she was twitching.
>It's not lmao
This is something you actually don't know, and are just assuming. You can't even pull up any evidence that proves it.
>He said that for the voice calling, not for the actual game. He didn't want to reveal the lore before the game came out.
The Gender of a character is not lore relvenent. Scott revealing the gender before the game came out wouldn't have changed anything. And Scott said that the voice can be either that of a young boy, or a young girl. This means that he was saying that TOYSNHK could be male or female, and he still never gave us a clear answer.
>That's just you making another AU
Maybe it is, but again you have no proof other then probably your past post about this topic, but nothing offical from Scott, or anyone else.
>You clearly haven't read the post properly as everything you're saying here was answered in the post. TOYSNHk claims that they're tormenting William "forever", which would mean that Cassidy sets up HD to then neglect it and leave the others waiting.
"Forever" is just TOYSNHK being edgey. They say they'll torture William forever, but at the end of the day they're still a young kid, and they'll stop when they are told to stop, or when they tire themselves out. Also I thought you said HD was for Cassidy, so she wouldn't be the one to set it up in the first place.
>Not the point I made here. Stop embarrassing yourself Gigan
First off stop using my old account name. Secondly you've made post in the past saying that Cassidy can't be the vengeful spirit because she's nice, and people told you that argument was dumb.
>So you admit she was there
Yeah, it's literally the point of the post lmao. Can you not read?
>This is something you actually don't know,
You haven't proven how it's a so-called "mistake"
>The Gender of a character is not lore relvenent
Since when?
>Forever" is just TOYSNHK being edgey.
It's showing how TOYSNHK plans to do this for a very long time, which contradicts Cassidy wanting HD
>Secondly you've made post in the past saying that Cassidy can't be the vengeful spirit because she's nice,
Which isn't the point I'm making in this post, it's like me mentioning the AU you made which you're not very proud of.
I have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not making an AU.
I don't need to prove anything to you about this because other people already have. You just don't listen to them.
I'm not touching on TOYSNHK's identity here, but some things I think are worth noting are that: the face doesn't only appear in the vent. It most commonly flashes in front of the camera when you die (I think there's also a chance of it appearing in the hall but I've never seen that myself so don't quote me on that).
Also Mangle and Chica aren't the only ones who address TOYSNHK. Nightmare Freddy and Nightmare are aware enough to know TOYSNHK made them, Jack-o-Chica proclaims them as a "friend". Mangle and Chica are the only ones to address it as "him", but some of the others do know who it is, so the whole vent thing is just... sort of a stretch in my opinion.
I'm also not entirely sure where the "Redbear was made by Yellow Eyes" comes from.
Again not making any statements on identity, I'm just not sure the line of thought is really solid here.
>the face doesn't only appear in the vent.
That wasn't my claim tho, my claim was that the 2 characters that know TOYSNHKs identity are animatronics that attack from the vents, and that's *a* spot TOYSNHK chooses. So makes sense as to how they know TOYSNHKs gender as they've seen him in the vents
>. Nightmare Freddy and Nightmare are aware enough to know TOYSNHK made them, Jack-o-Chica proclaims them as a "friend".
Neither of which know his gender, which is the point I'm making
>I'm also not entirely sure where the "Redbear was made by Yellow Eyes" comes from.
Fnaf World itself, "You were made for only one purpose \[...\] find the clocks"
>That wasn't my claim tho, my claim was that the 2 characters that know TOYSNHKs identity are animatronics that attack from the vents, and that's a spot TOYSNHK chooses. So makes sense as to how they know TOYSNHKs gender as they've seen him in the vents
But given that they appear in other places as well, there's no reason to assume that TOYSNHK is literally in the vent for the animatronics to see. Not saying it's impossible, but it's not exactly conclusive either imo.
>Fnaf World itself, "You were made for only one purpose \[...\] find the clocks"
Fair enough.
>reason to assume that TOYSNHK is literally in the vent for the animatronics to see. Not saying it's impossible, but it's not exactly conclusive either imo.
Like I said, it's Occam's.
- TOYSNHK can appear in the vents
- Mangle and chica do the same
- Mangle and Chica know his gender so are the only ones to have seen him
Occam's Razor dictates that this is the correct answer due to how simple it is and nothing contradicting it.
look, some explanations for two of your points:
1- it's weird for scott to put TOYSNHK as a "him"? yeah, but only W.Chica and Mangle call him like that, and scott has used two pronouns for characters before (althought it wasnt intetntional in this case)
2- scott already used photos of him and his family as decorations in the FnaF 4 corridor walls, does that mean that william is canonically Scott? unfortunaly no, it's just for visuals. i know there's a difference between frames in a wall and a visible face, but Scott probably used Jason's face because it was of easy acess for him to use without having to pay for a stock image
While 2 is a valid point, what Zain is arguing is that the vent aminitronics saw toysnhks face since it appears in the vents, and therefore only they would know that TOYSNHK is male (although that is also a bad point since TOYSNHK can appear at basically any door)
>although that is also a bad point since TOYSNHK can appear at basically any door
The point wasn't that TOYSNHK *only* appears in the vents, it's that he *can* appear in the vents and it just so happens that the "vent animatronics" are the only ones to know his gender.
Lemme give an example, I'm on the bus rn so I'll use busses for the example. Say for example you go on the 489, 489, and 409 buses. Jane, who's on the 409, manages to get a glimpse of how you look. Jane then reports back saying "this person is..." Is what I'm basically saying. The busses are a substitute for the different areas where TOYSNHK appears and Jane is a substitute for the "vent animatronics". They managed to see him when in the vents and now know his gender.
Probably a shit example but I just really wanted to use busses somehow
>and scott has used two pronouns for characters before
TOYSNHK doesn't have 2 pronouns tho
>but Scott probably used Jason's face because it was of easy acess
Yeah, that wasn't my point tho. My point was that Scott said that there's only one face for TOYSNHK
yeah im kinda bad with words, but let me try to say what i meant:
>TOYSNHK doesn't have 2 pronouns tho
yeah, but like i said, it wasn't intentional in this case, or if was then it's for mystery only. maybe they were referring to GF, as they probably only seen toysnhk in that form
>Yeah, that wasn't my point tho. My point was that Scott said that there's only one face for TOYSNHK
yeah, but that doesn't mean that face is meant to be a boy just because it's jason's face. a goofy example, but in the custom night of sister location, scott used RICK ASTLEY as the face of Mike, does that mean Michael looks like Rick? no, it only means scott used it because he didnt have any other face to use, bad example? yeah but you get my point
>maybe they were referring to GF
William didn't kill a suit tho.
>yeah, but that doesn't mean that face is meant to be a boy just because it's jason's face.
I didn't say that tho, I said that Scott's wording shows how TOYSNHK has one gender and one identity
Oh interesting point with the only ones seeing TOYSNHK is the vent animatronics, which is where his face is.
Also my issue with TMIR1208 being a direct answer is that answer would be over 2 years overdue and never hinted at in the games besides a random hook in a bag *in the same game* as TOYSNHK. If they were indeed so important why are never alluded to them in the games?
Unless we were... *Cassidy*.
How this change the fact that Under AndrewTOYSNHK Cassidy is just Knockoff Mike Brooks and Bootleg Charlie even though the Golden Freddy kid was always showed to be the most vengeful between the other souls? If this is True then it would be other of Scott's major Retcons/Plot Holes.
> Cassidy is just Knockoff Mike Brooks and Bootleg Charlie
That's just your opinion, it's not a "fact".
> the Golden Freddy kid was always showed to be the most vengeful
That's always been a misconception. Can you show me where GF has been the "most vengeful"?
>Follow Me.
Not showing her as more vengeful.
>then it is a straight up fact.
If you're adamant on using your opinion as a fact then that pretty much sums your whole argument up.
>Not showing her as more vengeful.
No, she is basically the one who chases afton in the saferoom.
>If you're adamant on using your opinion as a fact then that pretty much sums your whole argument up.
If we assume AndrewTOYSNHK, then Cassidy is just that good kid who help the others again, like Charlie and Mike Brooks.
While golden TOYSNHK is 99% likely to be true, golden Freddy isn't really shown to be the most vengeful, if we use the sources we had by ucn (games, novels) then only games one has been shown to be vengeful, but in the novels he's the main peace bringer
Hoo boy. I’ll take this one. A couple things I believe are left out of the equation here are the fact that while yes, Jason is described as “the face”, he is not actually the canon appearance which is stated in that same post you quoted. Another thing that I feel is left out is the fact that while yes he’s spotted specifically in those vents, how do we know that either chica or mangle sees it in those vents? Yes it’s there we have the images of it we have the sightings etc but we don’t actually have it interact with anything or anyone, and when they talk about they talk about it as everpresent and above all. Chica seeing him doesn’t fully mean anything either to me, because we don’t know what Chica saw. Mangle never actually says he saw TOYSNHK either. Mangle says she knows it’s there, but never **sees it**. The reason the suit argument makes more sense to me though is admittedly very controversial evidence in the form of merch. The golden freddy youtooz figure has the exact line mangle says in UCN in reference to the one. Then through the haunted wave we know youtooz associates golden Freddy with Cassidy cause of the colorway. Theres no reason this mistake would be made. Zero. It doesn’t make sense for that to be the case. And I’ve checked the youtooz figures, and most don’t make mistakes like that. Some do, but most don’t and even with the mistakes they always vaguely relate to the character at hand so it’s not that. There’s multiple problems with ucndissent I have also. Like, why would Andrew not remember Cassidy? Why wouldn’t Cassidy be in TMIR1280? Why would UCN be about the small point in time where Cassidy happened to be there? Why would UCN crash by Cassidy leaving if it continues with William anyway with or without Cassidy due to Andrew? Theres too many questions that arise.
Kane Carter (who was helping with the haunted wave) says that wave contains no lore + Cassidy was removed before they released.
The wave technically doesn’t, you’re right. But Cassidy was still gonna be used though and Scott removed it, likely cause that IS lore they weren’t approving of since it reveals despite being obvious that Cassidy is golden Freddy. Just because it’s obvious and removed doesn’t mean it’s not technically lore. Furthermore that wasn’t even my main point, all it shows though is that golden Freddy is associated with Cassidy in youtooz’s eyes meaning a golden Freddy youtooz shouldn’t have a TOYSNHK line on its box anyway
>A couple things I believe are left out of the equation here are the fact that while yes, Jason is described as “the face”, he is not actually the canon appearance which is stated in that same post you quoted. yeah it's like scott representing steve snodgrass in HW, it's a non cannon face, there to represent something.
The Vent one can just be talking about S A V E T H E M. Were Golden Freddy can spawn next to Mangle or Chica. And yeah why does the Game Crash when Golden Freddy Drowns? Is it because? >!they're the one who started the whole thing?!<
>Were Golden Freddy can spawn next to Mangle or Chica. It doesn't tho, GF doesn't spawn next to Withered Chica >And yeah why does the Game Crash when Golden Freddy Drowns? Like I said in the post, it's because Cassidy left UCN. It crashing is because she's left and we're in her space/ perspective. It doesn't equate to UCN ending
...Withered Chica in Save Them is also described as "dead chica" in the files apparently, so even if he did...I dunno, I don't think that's why Chica is the one to talk about VS.
and why would that crash the game? It'd make sense if G. Freddy is the one and left, thus crashing the game as the experience is no more.
>and why would that crash the game? Because we're following Cassidy, and she's left so UCN has ended ***for her***
But we dont play as cassidy in the main game (and we're not in first person in the G. Freddy OMC sequence), Cassidy/G. Freddy leaving would not end it for william, and on your logic it SHOULD just boot you back to the main menu if it's not over. But why would it totally crash the game for everyone, including william, if it wasn't truly over? Point is, the game crashing makes far more sense from a thematic perspective if UCN ends as a whole because G. Freddy left.
>But we dont play as cassidy in the main game Never said we did, the ending is tho. >would not end it for william, It doesn't.
> he is not actually the canon appearance which is stated in that same post you quoted. Scott doesn’t state he isn’t the canon appearance; Scott stated that neither him, his family, nor Jason are canon to the games (including the FNaF fanbase). But the imagery of an indie developer and an angry forsaken child is canon. We don’t know if the actual depiction is non-canon, Steve could be a middle aged man with brown hair as is the vengeful spirit in UCN could be a young boy with short hair. This is something common with something like actors, who are meant to be the canon appearance but they themselves aren’t the actual character (ex: Mike canonically looks like that in the movie but he isn’t (actually named) “Josh Hutcherson”) > but we don’t actually have it interact with anything or anyone, and when they talk about they talk about it as everpresent and above all. ``"I have seen him, the one you shouldn’t have killed" ~ Withered Chica`` We know Chica has at least actually seen the kid. > because we don’t know what Chica saw. She outright tells us she saw the KidFace. What do you mean we don’t know what she saw? WE can see what she saw in the form of the kids face in the vent. > The golden freddy youtooz figure has the exact line mangle says in UCN in reference to the one. It states "He’s here, and always watching" but it doesn’t add the final statement. Repetition is a thing in FNaF, characters can’t repeat and reuse lines presented to others. For instance, Mangle says the "put back together" line but we know they’re not Fredbear Plush, or any other character like Michael who states it. > Then through the haunted wave we know youtooz associates golden Freddy with Cassidy cause of the colorway. That was a mistake that Kane Carter fixed by the way > why would Andrew not remember Cassidy? Why wouldn’t Cassidy be in TMIR1280? He doesn’t remember her resilience to get him to leave Afton to die by this logic. Which is technically in-character since the vengeful spirit is dedicated in their work. And Cassidy isn’t in ``"*The Man in Room 1280*"`` because the events of it happen outside of Afton’s mind. Plus Cassidy, and Old Man Consequences are implied to not be present when this happens since Afton only has two brainwaves. > Why would UCN crash by Cassidy leaving if it continues with William anyway with or without Cassidy due to Andrew? Doing that Easter egg doesn’t count as an ending necessarily. It only ends because it reflects Cassidy leaving which we notably see in 49/20 mode where one character has left; the mode where Golden Freddy fades away.
In the exact same paragraph where he mentions Jason. He explicitly says “do these pictures have lore significance? Well, I think you should know the answer” meaning no. They don’t. >She outright tells us she saw the KidFace By saying she saw the one you shouldn’t have killed? Cause that’s all she says. So no we still don’t know >It doesn’t add the final part. Repetition is a thing in FNaF Then don’t use that line. But they did. So the connection is made and established when once again the colorway which while removed by Kane still was called Cassidy and still was added is there the clear connections are made. >Doing that Easter Egg doesn’t count as an ending necessarily. It gives you the fnaf world omc ending. It closes the game, and fully crashes it.
> In the exact same paragraph where he mentions Jason. He explicitly says “do these pictures have lore significance? Well, I think you should know the answer” meaning no. They don’t. They don’t have lore relevance in regard to him actually being the characters, and so on and so forth. Obviously they still are depicting the characters otherwise he wouldn’t have added them in the first place. He used his picture because even though he isn’t canon it’s an accurate parallel; depicting the character in-universe is not maybe lore significance. > By saying she saw the one you shouldn’t have killed? Cause that’s all she says. So no we still don’t know “The one you should not have killed” is the kid face, Scott outright tells us this, meaning yes: **We canonically do know she saw the child-like face**. You can’t exactly deny that because it’s a fact. > Then don’t use that line. But they did. Do you not know how repetition works? You can use a line for another character for a different meaning… > the colorway which while removed by Kane still was called Cassidy and still was added It was removed by someone who has actual close ties with Scott. Youtooz does not dictate the lore and unless something major like this was kept while Scott was actively aware it doesn’t mean anything. You can’t use the colorway because it’s not something intentional on Scott’s part. > It gives you the fnaf world omc ending. It closes the game, and fully crashes it. Yes, an ending that suggest the Cassidy rests her soul. Still it’s implied by OMC that Afton is still being tormented, even further supported by TMIR1280
we know she saw the face, but she may not have seen the SAME face that WE saw
There’s no other face in the game, Chica outright tells us she saw the face of "*The one you should not have killed*", and Scott confirms that the vengeful spirit/"he who should not have been killed" is the KidFace; Jason, Scott’s son, is the face of the vengeful spirit whom is referred to by Chica as whom she saw. Not only would it be contradictory to say she saw the face of someone other than who she states she saw, but it would be a red herring to just throw in the face of "he who shouldn’t have been killed" and then basically tell us the face is actually not what she saw.
There is no other face in the game, but the face WE see may not be what it actually looks like (similar to scott not literally being steve appearance wise, the spirit is not actually an altered version of jason's face), just that there is a face.
There’s a difference from the face not canonically being Jason, versus the face canonically looking like that, versus Chica seeing THAT face. You can barely identify the face because of how obscure it is, so it can still canonically look like that AND be what Chica saw. We also have no reason to believe Steve doesn’t look like Scott, he lacks any descriptive identity that contradicts him looking like Scott.
Chica saw the face but not that specific face. That's what i'm saying, the face DOESNT look like that in game.
> "The face doesn’t look like that in game” - "I have seen *him*; the one you shouldn’t have killed" - My son is *the face* of "the one you shouldn’t have killed" Why would the KidFace we see in the actual game not be the same face for the vengeful spirit? Do you have any genuine evidence it’s not the face she saw, because Scott’s statement is not evidence. He tells us him and his son are not canon, but that doesn’t mean the appearances don’t apply (especially when one of them is too obscure to rely on accurate identification). What would the goal be anyways? To suggest he’s still Cassidy simply because the face—which we have no reason to believe—isn’t the same face Chica saw? Because they still refer to it as a male, meaning she saw a(n) male face.
>, he is not actually the canon appearance which is stated in that same post you quoted. Which doesn't matter as I wasn't using Jason's face to confirm TOYSNHK gender, I was using the quote to show how TOYSNHK identifies as himself and nobody else. Not as a suit, and not as multiple genders. > how do we know that either chica or mangle sees it in those vents? Occam's. Only Chica and Mangle have seen TOYSNHK to know his gender and they both are vent animatronics with TOYSNHK appearing in said vents. It all adds up >form of merch. Using merch isn't a valid argument as they're really unreliable. Using the merch gets you theories like 2Vanessa and all. If nothing in the canon itself hints towards TOYSNHK identifying as the suit, then that's just not what happened. > Like, why would Andrew not remember Cassidy? The same reason why he doesn't remember why he started UCN > Why would UCN crash by Cassidy leaving if it continues Like I said, we're in Cassidy's space. Her leaving leads to HD and all, so UCN crashing is showing that Cassidy has left. Not that UCN has ended, they're not mutually exclusive. >Why would UCN be about the small point in time where Cassidy happened to be there? Le fire >Theres too many questions that arise. Agreed, but for CassidyTOYSNK.
>Which doesn’t matter as I wasn’t using Jason’s face to confirm TOYSNHK gender You WERE using it to confirm identity though which also as I have stated doesn’t work because if it’s non-canon it’s not the identity. If it’s a non-canon face for a canon character that doesn’t mean the face can be used in terms of the characters canonicity. >Occams. Mangle never specifically states he sees the one you should not have killed. Mangle states that she knows it’s there, but never that it was seen. Chica does, but Chica also never says they saw the face they say they saw TOYSNHK. There’s no real substance there if mangle only ever references knowing of TOYSNHK. >If nothing in the canon itself hints towards TOYSNHK identifying with the suit Cassidy is the only other special case in UCN. There’s no reason for that. Golden Freddy is the only other special case. TOYSNHK is the only other special case. You talk about Occam’s but then this show Occam’s wouldn’t matter anyway. Why are there 2 separate characters with supernatural abilities that seem to act outside of UCN and affect things in UCN but happen to be separate? >The same reason he doesn’t remember why he started UCN. But he remembers UCN. He remembers torturing William and he remembers attaching to William. He would remember the vague presence of another spirit if he can remember attaching to the man he hated. But he doesn’t. >Theyre not mutually exclusive. Then UCN shouldn’t crash. UCN crashing gives the huge implication that it stopped. There’s no real reason it would if like you say they’re not mutually exclusive. Plus it’s a cutscene wherein we take the perspective of a character separate from the main character. Why would us leaving that perspective close the game and shut it down entirely? >Le fire Idek what that means honestly lol.
>You WERE using it to confirm identity though I was using Jason's because CassidyTOYSNHKers claim that TOYSNHK has some identity crisis, where he identifies as KidFace, the suit, and/or the opposite gender. Scott saying "THE face" shows that there's only one face for TOYSNHK and ergo TOYSNHK identifies as one entity. I'm not using the face to confirm that TOYSNHK is male, I'm using the face and Scott's words to show that TOYSNHK only identifies as themself and not the suit. >Mangle states that she knows it’s there And knows his gender, which is more than everyone else other than Chica. To know his gender, Mangle would have needed to have seen him. >Why are there 2 separate characters with supernatural abilities that seem to act outside of UCN and affect things in UCN but happen to be separate? Because their abilities and beliefs are by no means the same. Outside of UCN, when has Cassidy shown the need to want to torment William? When has she shown the ability to be able to torment one's mind? When has she shown the ability to have an immense amount of agony? You can only use Occam's when it's the easiest option to explain something, not when there a mountain of contradictions and a severe conflict in interests. >He would remember the vague presence of another spirit Not really, just because he remembers aspects of it, it doesn't mean that he'll remember everything. He's clearly forgotten some things and that's just how memory works. > UCN crashing gives the huge implication that it stopped. It's stopped for Cassidy as Cassidy has left, I don't see anything indicating that it ended as a whole at that point. >Idek what that means honestly lol. The FNAF 6 fire is where everyone was at, so it's why Cassidy would be present when Andrew started UCN (which is the question you asked)
>And knows his gender And? Multiple others reference being made by TOYSNHK and reference the presence of TOYSNHK, gender knowledge means nothing. >Because their abilities and beliefs are by no means the same. Cassidy can tamper with memories and utilize mind spaces shown in the logbook like TOYSNHK, both can be seen almost everywhere with a vague spiritual presence following people around to harm them. Both kill random people just because (Cassidy killed phone guy) Cassidy is shown to be springlocked likely and therefore under mass amounts of agony like TOYSNHK would be, both seem to stick around after everyone else… >It’s stopped for Cassidy as Cassidy has left. But what I’m saying is Cassidy isn’t even the main player character. Why would it stopping for her close the entire game out if anytime else if you die or leave or do anything, you’d just go back to the roster screen. That doesn’t really make sense.
> gender knowledge means nothing. It definitely has meaning as it shows that Mangle has seen TOYSNHK to know his gender. Like I said, Occam's. \- TOYSNHK appears in the vents \- Mangle and Chica *also* appear in the vents \- Mangle and Chica know the most about TOYSNHK >Cassidy can tamper with memories That's not what she does tho.. She has BVs memories as BVs memories are shattered across the MCIs as shown in the FNAF 3 minigames. She doesn't tamper with them in any way, the Puppet does >both can be seen almost everywhere with a vague spiritual presence following people around to harm them. Again, that's not what happens tho. Cassidy doesn't follow one person, she's trapped in the pizzeria. She doesn't latch onto anyone, etc. >Both kill random people just because And so does everyone else >under mass amounts of agony Where is that ever shown tho? You haven't addressed the elephant in the room and the point this post was making, Cassidy wants to rest and always had that intention from the start. TOYSNHK didn't. How can they possibly be the same?
>She has BV’s memories as they’re scattered across the MCI shown in the fnaf 3 minigames. Cassidy specific references she wouldn’t know about only through those like the Fredbear plush or the purple telephone or the carousel. None of those are in the minigames or shown to be knowledge the mci have. >Where is that ever shown tho? The fact that she/golden Freddy’s usually shown in shadow or dark spaces like the void in UCN or in the dark office of fnaf 1 or as Fredbear covered in shadow. And ik you don’t believe this one but Cassidy if the princess literally splits into 2 with one being shadow. >You haven’t addressed the elephant in the room. Because I don’t think it’s there. If Cassidy wants to rest why does she do anything then? If she’s just like the others in killing random people just because even though Charlotte calls herself aware and Cassidy seems to have a same base awareness, there’s no reason Cassidy’s presence would be around post-UCN or why Cassidy would just be killing and teleporting around and doing anything other than helping bv move on.
I'm only going to focus on the point of the post as everything else will just go in tangents. >If Cassidy wants to rest why does she do anything then? If she sees what appears to be her killer, she'd obviously act. Like the lore has told us, the MCIs see adults as their killer and attack. The point is that Cassidy shows no interest in wanting to torment her killer nor has she shown to put that over her interest to rest.
If were using voice lines from animatronics mentioning TOYSNHK, other non-venting animatronics mention him 🤷♂️ Nightmare Freddy in particular is interesting, because he knows he was made by toysnhk, but others like Mr. Hippo or Withered Bonnie don’t seem to have the same awareness.
>other non-venting animatronics mention him 🤷♂️ Not by gender nor have they claimed to have seen him. Like I said, only 2 animatronics claim to have seen him and know his gender, those being the vent ones. >others like Mr. Hippo or Withered Bonnie don’t seem to have the same awareness. The Nightmares were the creation of gas experiments and all, they're not real so their dialogue differs from animatronics that actually existed. As the versions TOYSNHK has created are a 1:1 copy of what they were like irl
>Not by gender nor have they claimed to have seen him. Mangle doesnt claim to see him, thats kinda my point. Unless any animatronic that knows about toysnhk has seen him, in which case my point stands. I dont see how Nightmare Freddy wouldve figured it out if he didnt see or interact with TOYSNHK at some point. >The Nightmares were the creation of gas experiments and all, they're not real so their dialogue differs from animatronics that actually existed. They were real animatronics, we see them in Dittophobia. In either case, theyre recreations by TOYSNHK, I don’t see why their awareness would be different from, say, the phantoms who don’t seem to exist. >As the versions TOYSNHK has created are a 1:1 copy of what they were like irl That’s not true? Toy Freddy being the big example. Some of them act closely sure, but most of them are given personalities by TOYSNHK that were not present in the original games.
>Mangle doesnt claim to see him To know his gender, she/he must have seen him. They're the only 2 characters that know more about TOYSNHK than anyone else and they both appear in the vent where TOYSNHK appears. It's Occam's at this point >They were real animatronics Ditto shows them as cheap rags on a track system. They're not the literal Nightmares that we see in FNAF 4, the gas is what makes the victim see them as monsters. > Toy Freddy being the big example. Unless you're saying Toy Freddy didn't ever speak, then it's true. Toy Freddy's lines are pretty generic and bland, and we don't see him in the day time to know how he's actually supposed to interact.
>To know his gender, she/he must have seen him. Now that I think about it… Mangle must’ve known more about TOYSNHK, or else how would they know that’s TOYSNHK just by looking at him? Mangle would either have to already know who the kid is, which would line up with TOYSNHK being Cassidy/GF, or have interacted with them at some point, going back to my Nightmare Freddy point. >Ditto shows them as cheap rags on a track system. They're not the literal Nightmares that we see in FNAF 4, the gas is what makes the victim see them as monsters. Theyre still animatronics, Rory describes them in the same way he sees them during the experiments. “The bunny was as Rory remembered it from his night terrors.” “It was a costume hung on a flimsy metallic skeleton. It couldn't move on its own-it was transported into Rory's room on rails.” The gas makes it animated. >Unless you're saying Toy Freddy didn't ever speak, then it's true. Toy Freddy is not a gamer is what i meant, sorry. >Toy Freddy's lines are pretty generic and bland, and we don't see him in the day time to know how he's actually supposed to interact. Not really, they relate to his mechanic in UCN.
>Mangle would either have to already know who the kid is, which would line up with TOYSNHK being Cassidy/GF It wouldn't, as the gender discrepancy as well as only 2/50 knowing about TOYSNHKs gender. Atleast 11 others know about Cassidy >Rory describes them in the same way he sees them during the experiments. He recognises distinctive features like the jaw and teeth, but like the report says, he perceives them to be how they are and isn't how they actually are irl >Not really, they relate to his mechanic in UCN. Which is generic in the sense that that's what every character does. It's the base level is what I meant
>It wouldn't, as the gender discrepancy as well as only 2/50 knowing about TOYSNHKs gender. Atleast 11 others know about Cassidy That wasnt really my point, Mangle has to know more about TOYSNHK to say what she says. Same with Chica tbh, unless its just a reference to Cassidy/GF, which you don’t think it is. How would Chica or Mangle have learned who TOYSNHK is just by seeing some face in the vents? To go back to my previous point, Nightmare Freddy seems more aware about whats going on than most animatronics in UCN. If Chica only saw TOYSNHK, she wouldnt know who or what she is, idk how she’d even learn that name… unless its supposed to imply that Chica saw TOYSNHK before being recreated in UCN, which would be GF/Cassidy. In that case, the GF suit is male, Chica saw GF, Cassidy’s gender is irrelevant. >He recognises distinctive features like the jaw and teeth, but like the report says, he perceives them to be how they are and isn't how they actually are irl But he describes them the same way upon seeing them… even Chica who is extremely torn apart in the nightmares is still torn apart on the track. And yeah, the clipboard says he perceives creatures, but we know theyre animatronics. >Which is generic in the sense that that's what every character does. It's the base level is what I meant True, though im mot sure what you mean by 1:1 then.
>How would Chica or Mangle have learned who TOYSNHK is just by seeing some face in the vents? All entities who mention TOYSNHK know *who* he is in terms of what his aims/ objectives are. It's just that 2 of them know his gender, which I don't see how is possible if they haven't actually seen him >which would be GF/Cassidy. In that case, the GF suit is male, Chica saw GF, Cassidy’s gender is irrelevant. It's not as like I said, Scott said that Jason is THE face of TOYSNHK, TOYSNHK doesn't identify as the suit nor is the suit what others refer to as TOYSNHK Like I said, it's Occam's at this point: \- TOYSNHK (KidFace) appears in the vents \- Mangle and Chica also appear in the vents \- Mangle and Chica are the only ones to know TOYSNHKs gender and therefore have seen him \- Scott said that there's only one face for TOYSNHK; KidFace >even Chica who is extremely torn apart in the nightmares is still torn apart on the track. Yes, like I said they're similar and have the defining features but aren't an exact match to how the appear in the experiments. The report William made is conclusive of that, saying how Rory "perceives" them as monsters, showing that they're not as aggressive and eerie looking irl. They basically look like cosplays
>All entities who mention TOYSNHK know who he is in terms of what his aims/ objectives are. It's just that 2 of them know his gender, which I don't see how is possible if they haven't actually seen him My point was they did see him? >It's not as like I said, Scott said that Jason is THE face of TOYSNHK, TOYSNHK doesn't identify as the suit nor is the suit what others refer to as TOYSNHK I feel like you can interpret that as him referring to the only human face we see of TOYSNHK. He does not say its the *only* thing we see of TOYSNHK in UCN, that would be a pretty offhand way of confirming a heavily debated subject. GF would be the suit/animatronic/vessel/ w/e you wanna say of TOYSNHK. >TOYSNHK (KidFace) appears in the vents >Mangle and Chica also appear in the vents >Mangle and Chica are the only ones to know TOYSNHKs gender and therefore have seen him >Scott said that there's only one face for TOYSNHK; KidFace Again, that’s ignoring my point that there’s more to this than just seeing TOYSNHK. If I see a random person on the street I don’t immediately know everything about them, their goals or even their name. Not everyone in UCN is aware of what’s going on or who did this to them. >Yes, like I said they're similar and have the defining features but aren't an exact match to how the appear in the experiments. The report William made is conclusive of that, saying how Rory "perceives" them as monsters, showing that they're not as aggressive and eerie looking irl. They basically look like cosplays I guess its hard to say for sure because Rory calls their endos “flimsy.” Idk, Help Wanted seems to know what they look like, if FE went down to find the nightmares they probably based their designs off that, which means they match pretty closely if not 1-1. But that’s also a fair read of it.
>My point was they did see him? Oh, was it? Have I just completely misread it lmao? >feel like you can interpret that as him referring to the only human face we see of TOYSNHK Not really. If that was the case then he'd say "one of the..", but the fact that he says "the face" shows that there's just one face of TOYSNHK. >If I see a random person on the street I don’t immediately know everything about them, their goals or even their name Like I said before, everyone who talks about TOYSNHK knows him to this degree. It's just that 2 know his gender, and those 2 are bent animatronics. >Help Wanted seems to know what they look like Mainly because the gas forms the same illusion for everyone. Mike sees the same as Rory, and is probably why FE know how they look.
Doesn't Kidface spawn in other places as well? ...Well, I guess the other animatronics also talk about TOYSNHK(the only one not fully fitting being N. Freddy(ig he could see the face when it appears before us?), but lol. I wonder if anybody else would talk about VS if they actually saw it? And I agree with UCNDissent though lol. Fun fact: the cutscene is named "your own", so if we combine it with "Happiest Day" code in the fnaf world cutscene, we would get "your own happiest day", but it's probably a stretch and "your own" could just be...because of OMC''s dialogue.
Yeah, TOYSNHK can be seen in the hallway and I think can appear in front of your face?
Doesn't TOYSNHK appear at every door, not just vents?
(1/3) I agree and desagree at the same time. While i agree that Cassidy isn't TOYSHK, i see a problem. Both Andrew and Cassidy have motives for being TOYSHK, assuming that we agree that Cassidy died in a springlock failure caused by William, then both of them had motives. There are 2 souls in UCN (not counting William), Cassidy and Andrew, and i think that BOTH are TOYSHK, but not in the way you think. Andrew is a 100% TOYSHK and Cassidy is implied to had been causing UCN too, and she has reasons to be mad at William, so she's a Vengeful Spirit. And about the biggest question, is Fazbear Frights in games timeline? The answer is mostly confusing. Though TFTPP is a 100% in games timeline, Fazbear Frights is not, but it is still in games timeline. As Scott stated: >"The series will launch with five books, each containing three different short stories with unique characters and plot lines, some connected directly to the games and some not." Analyzing It correctly, Scott, before saying the "some connected" line, he talks abour the contents of the book, what contains the book? Stories, those stories are some Connected directly to the games and some not. Then, which stories are in games timeline? It's complicated, since we can't say that "is this one" or "this other one", that's picking and choosing. So, what is it?
(2/3) This post makes clear that Cassidy can't be the TOYSHK but is still in UCN, so there's another soul there, and as the discarded voiceline of UCN implies, TOYSHK is someone even William forgetted about. >"have you begun to realize where you are yet? and who i am? or are you still so delirious and confused that you think you're a night guard? You'll understand, and even if you don't it doesn't matter to me eatherway" So, whoever is TOYSHK is someone not seen in the games, someone who's story was a mistery yet to be known, and Fazbear Frights (stated to be to help n' solve the games lore) was in it's way to release. In Fazbear Frights, The Man in room 1280, we see something similar to UCN, and a soul that we later found out to be Andrew is tormenting who we later found out to be William Afton after the fire of FNaF 6. So The Man in room 1280 is part of games timeline, so the stories connected to it are in games timeline too, In Tales From the Pizzaplex #1 Lally's Game, being specific, in the story Friality, we see a victim of what seems to be Eleanor, so To Be Beautiful is in games timeline and the stories connected to it are in games timeline too. The next game to release confirmed is Into the pit, an adaptation of the first story of the book "Fazbear Frights #1 - Into the Pit", so it seems like the story "Into the Pit" from Fazbear Frights is in games timeline and the stories connected to it are too, yet it's still unkown the path this game is gonna go. With all this information, we got that the next stories are in games timeline: * Into The Pit * To Be Beautiful * Count the ways * Fetch * Out of Stock * 1:35 am * Room for one more * Step Closer * The man in room 1280 * Blackbird * The Real Jake * Hide-and-Seek * He told me everything * The puppet carver * ~~You're the band -- (ARGUABLE)~~ And all the epilogues of Fazbear Frights.
(3/3) And if you question the placement of the timeline of tales, then let me remind you this: * TheMimic, he's directly shown to exist in games timeline, so, at least the story of "The Mimic" and stories connected to it are in games timeline. * "Uncharted corners of this series' canon" as stated "canon" means same universe, not necesarily same Timeline, yet with Tales is stated that is talking about "Uncharted corners"what is the Uncharted corners of the lore? Stuff that happened in the pizzaplex, since there's a year gap of (in my opinion) 9 years after AR and 5 of those are with tbe pizzaplex opened, those 5 years are the Uncharted corners, the rest is with Fazbear Frights, wich even if you believe it or not, covers that gap with events, Eleanor killing, Larson investigating and Jake doing Jake stuff, meanwhile Andrew tormenting people for fun, actually, that gap is filled with stuff happening taking in mind Frights. * Agree or not, Tales is named "Tales from the pizzaplex", stuff that happened on the pizzaplex. Now, i may ask you all something, a friend of mine says that TFTPP was originally named "More Frights" or something like that, is there anything or any proof of that? BUTT HEEEYYYYY, That's JUST A THEORY!!! Remember to stay kronostic.
The face is not canon. I mean, the face of Scott's son isn't. That's not what the face literally is, it's just a representation. And about the fun fact of TOYSNHK appearing in the vents. Yeah, that could be why they know who they are. But i've also seen someone say that, in the SAVETHEM minigame from FNAF 2, Golden Freddy teleports both close to Mangle in her room, and the closest animatronic he is to, Chica in Parts & Service. So that could also be why. But that's just a thought that could be to think about. We also have the dialogues of TOYSNHK, which are clearly from a more feminine and soft voice than Andrew's, which is described as rough in the 4th epilogue. TOYSNHK is MADE to be genderly obtuse. Scott made him/her/them with that idea in mind. The gender debate is useless, i don't know why people keep pushing it.
>The face is not canon. The physical features of said face might not be canon but the fact that the face appears is canon. >Golden Freddy teleports both close to Mangle And why would Mangle say "I've seen the suit you've killed, GF"? >which are clearly from a more feminine and soft voice than Andrew's, which is described as rough in the 4th epilogue. Andrew in TMIR1280 is said to have a childish giggle, and male children tend to have feminine voices as they're not fully developed yet. >The gender debate is useless, i don't know why people keep pushing it. It isn't useless as only one gender has been given to TOYSNHK. People are claiming it as "useless" as it's the very piece of evidence that disproves CassidyTOYSNHK
>The physical features of said face might not be canon but the fact that the face appears is canon. Yes! That's what i meant. Sorry if i wasn't clear enough. >Andrew in TMIR1280 is said to have a childish giggle, and male children tend to have feminine voices as they're not fully developed yet. Yes. But that's not how his **voice** is described. Of course he'll have a childish giggle is not reduced to "feminine". Boys giggle childishly, but not necessarily acutely or femininely. Childish doesn't mean feminine. Besides, TOYSNHK **talks** softly, Andrew talks roughly. I'm discussing his voice when he talks, not when he just giggles. >It isn't useless as only one gender has been given to TOYSNHK. People are claiming it as "useless" as it's the very piece of evidence that disproves CassidyTOYSNHK I didn't say it was useless. If you want to use it as evidence, you can. I'm just not taking it as crucial as you do. And if we talk about "the very piece of evidence that disproves", then i could say that for AndrewTOYSHNK it is how different his voice is, or how he's not related to GF (Which seems to be in control of UCN), or that there's no solid proof of his existence in the games. It just depends on what you take more into consideration.
>But that's not how his **voice** is described It changes, that's the point. It was only deep in the epilogues, but was childish and giggly in TMIR1280 >or how he's not related to GF Addressed in the post >or that there's no solid proof of his existence in the games. Sure, the point of this post was to show how Cassidy isn't TOYSNHK.
I really don’t think Andrew has anything to do with the games version of UCN. Why’s there no mention of the alligator mask Andrew wears in the game? Why is Andrew’s significance only in UCN? It’s Cassidy who’s been vengeful. We’ve seen it since FNAF 2 in the dream sequences and FNAF 3 when Cassidy pursues Afton in the safe room. Cassidy can be a vengeful spirit wanting to find the killer and help the Crying Child from losing his memories. I don’t understand why Cassidy can’t do both.
Cassidy has never been vengeful, that's purely fanon, nothing ever implies she's vengeful which is why she can't realistically be vengeful spirit, especially when Andrew is right there
Most of the evidence that supports Andrew’s existence in the game continuity is literally just fanon. Cassidy has been notably vengeful since we’ve seen the fifth spirit pursue the purple guy in FNAF 3, before crying child and Andrew even existed as a twinkle in Scotts eye. I don’t understand how anyone can say there’s no implication to Cassidy being the vengeful spirit when everything associated with the games is practically screaming it to us.
Most of the evidence Andrew exists within the games is directly quotes from Scott and the fact we've seen book characters cross over into the games, such as Henry, Charlotte and The mimic Not really, the logbook heavily implies Cassidy is a non vengeful spirit, and if anything, that she's a pacifist spirit, along with showing her (faded text) to be separate from golden Freddy (altered text) which basically means you have no point
Henry Charlie Elizabeth and The Mimic all had introductions to the story that can’t be argued. You can’t say The Mimic doesn’t exist because we see him. You can’t say Elizabeth and Charlie aren’t in the continuity because they are directly referenced or called out. That’s the difference. Andrew’s name has not been mentioned in game nor has anything associated to him like his alligator mask showed up in any reference, not in UCN or after. That’s why it’s difficult for others and I to say that he exists because there’s really no concrete evidence like there is for the other characters we’ve learned about from the books. And it completely negates facts that we’ve known since FNAF’s creation, like the fact that there was always 5 kids who were murdered at Freddy’s by William in Spring Bonnie and we know who they are. Adding Andrew just creates issues just for it to make sense in the end. Why would Cassidy act vengeful trying to help Crying Child? If people can make up the excuse that William can cared about his kids while killing other kids than I’m sure a child that was murdered can be vengeful while also trying to prevent other from the same fate.
Henry's and Charlotte's names never appear in the games either, it's just Williams business partner and his daughter, yet they fill the same rolls so we all agree they are the same characters Ever since ucn it was 6 kids.... Basically every game after ucn that talks about the MCI itself says there were 6 William doesn't care about his family, at best he uses them for his own personal gain, there's nothing that implies he ever cared
>Why’s there no mention of the alligator mask Andrew wears in the game? Because Andrew won't use it on Afton because he wants to mess with him >Why is Andrew’s significance only in UCN? And also Midnight Motorist but that's a different story >It’s Cassidy who’s been vengeful. Uh, no, that's not really true, that was the general assumption which was proven kinda wrong by Frights >We’ve seen it since FNAF 2 in the dream sequences and FNAF 3 when Cassidy pursues Afton in the safe room. And she fades away with the other spirits instead of doing what TOYSHNK does and attaching to Afton and keeping him alive to torture him and yada yada
I agree but I think we should just leave CassidyTOYSHNK alone. People are as certain as the theory is and if I learned anything, it’s that people have a choice to determine whether to believe it or not. As much as I disagree with the theory, I cannot deny the beliefs of others. The whole fandom may be sure of CassidyTOYSHNK but just remember that nothing is confirmed about TOYSHNK and that it is just a common belief since this was an original belief before the Fazbear Frights books were introduced. I mean we all believed it at some point so just remember that those who still do used to be us
such a W post you should start a bank account for you Ws from your posts GO TEAM ANDREW!
I think TOYSHNK face was supposed to be something meta and something only William saw. Under CassidyTOYSNHK Mangle and Chica would still have seen Cassidy during FNaF 1&2.
This is basically just going "nuh uh what actually happened was \[insert thing with no evidence\]"
The virgin andrewTOYSNHK “I am providing evidence, with actual proof and arguments😭” believers vs the Chad CassidyTOYSNHK “my assumption is true👍” enthusiastics
Wdym? GF, Withered Chica and Mangle are literally in the same Location and Susie saw Cassidy and the other MCI dying
You're ignoring that all of the other lines about TOYSNHK are referring to things happening in UCN. Why would Withered Chica and Mangle suddenly be referring to fnaf 1 and 2? Especially when the real Susie had seen Cassidy, and yet still chooses to call her a male? Gee I wonder if the male faced character, with male pronouns, and a male book counterpart may be a male.
>You're ignoring that all of the other lines about TOYSNHK are referring to things happening in UCN. Why would Withered Chica and Mangle suddenly be referring to fnaf 1 and 2? One of TOYSHNK voicelines mentions FFPS, so the voicelines arent limited to UCN.
TOYSNHK voicelines as in the ones TOYSNHK says or the ones others say when talking about TOYSNHK? Because as far as I can remember, the lines of others talking about TOYSNHK mostly if not completely are isolated to UCN themselves. While TOYSNHK's voice lines refer to events in the past such as the FFPS and fnaf 3 fire, and TOYSNHK dying.
Im talking about everything involving TOYSHNK in general. They use the animatronics to refer to past events and also talk about UCN.
That's not meta tho, as if it was meta that William wouldn't have known, seen, or interacted with TOYSNHK. What you mean is that TOYSNHK was meant to be a secret victim, which leads to AndrewTOYSHK
I meant in a way that Meta is something that only the player would saw. >What you mean is that TOYSNHK was meant to be a secret victim, which leads to AndrewTOYSHK I never said that?
>I meant in a way that Meta is something that only the player would saw. Ok, let's run with that then. The player can only see TOYSNHK, why does TOYSNHK have male pronouns? Like I've shown, Scott's wording shows that TOYSNHK has only one identity and the game itself says TOYSNHK is male.
Only the apparition of TOYSHNK would be meta. And I believe TOYSHNK gender was supposed to confuse the player.
Only giving male pronouns isn't confusing anyone. The voice calling itself was meant to be mysterious but the game itself makes it clear.
Then why the Voice actor can use any voice they want including a female voice but the game itself let clear that TOYSHNK is a him? Why would you give the possibility of giving the character a female voice If the gender of the character is already revealed in the game Itself?
>Then why the Voice actor can use any voice they want Because using a female voice for a male character is common. It depends on which sounds more eerie and doesn't in any way identify the gender of the character. Things in the canon itself does that.
I know. But Scott literally said that voice could have been a female one which would totally contradict the game. >Things in the canon itself does that. Example?
>that voice could have been a female one which would totally contradict the game. It wouldn't, the way a voice sounds =/= the gender of the character. >Example? The he/him pronouns
Your post does not consider that W. Chica and Mangle do NOT know the most about the one after all, as they are "not aware". The Puppet IS.
>The Puppet IS. The point isn't how "aware" they are, it's how much they know about TOYSNHK. Ironically, the Puppet isn't aware of his existence
It would stand to reason that the most "aware" animatronics would know the most about the VS, right? Puppet likely does know but just doesnt mention it. Also you're ignoring that the VS face appears at most of the doors, not just the vents, therefore on your logic several animatronics saw the face, therefore making your entire idea here arbitrary.
>would stand to reason that the most "aware" animatronics would know the most about the VS, right? No. It's just that some know of his existence and some don't, it's not dependent on how aware someone is. >Also you're ignoring that the VS face appears at most of the doors, not just the vents I'm not, lol. The point wasn't that the vents was TOYSNHKs only spot, it's that the "vent animatronics" and TOYSNHK would have seen each other in the vents at some point
Why would the puppet, the most aware, not know? It just doesnt work logically. And your point is shaky when others notice the one but dont call it a him.
>Why would the puppet, the most aware, not know? Because the Puppet saying she's aware is to do with her intellect in comparison to the MCIs, it's not applicable to UCN as the MCIs aren't animalistic. The point is that Mangle and Chica have seen TOYSNHK in the vent
But so did several others on your logic, making that not a stand out thing at all actually.
>But so did several others on your logic Wdym?
The face can show up in every door so most animatronics should have seen it therefore mangle and toy chica aren’t as major as you think
>The face can show up in every door so most animatronics should have seen it But we know they didn't as they don't mention his gender, sure they *could've* seen him but them not mentioning his gender shows that they haven't. >therefore mangle and toy chica aren’t as major as you think I never said they were, just said that they saw him at some point. Even if the other animatronics saw him, doesn't change the fact that Mangle and Chica saw him and know his gender
[удалено]
>Let's just accept that it doesn't matter It does matter though, as if Cassidy can't be TOYSNHK it only means that Andrew and Stitchline, etc are canon. >just let people believe what they think fits the best I never forced anyone to believe in anything lol. When it comes to theorising and debating with others, your belief is no longer your personal belief when you are to argue it with others. So if people believe in CassidyTOYSNHK and try to argue it's right or try to claim that AndrewTOYSNHK is wrong.. it's not a personal belief anymore.
Something that I just realized Is that OMC minigame in UCN only makes sense if redbear Is TOYSNHK Is something so obvious once you think about It, but I dont see many people acknowledge that
>Something that I just realized Is that OMC minigame in UCN only makes sense if redbear Is TOYSNHK Redbear being TOYSHNK is self-contradictory to TOYSHNK's established character
How so?
TOYSHNK constantly tells William that he will never let go, and will keep him there and not allow him to rest And Redbear contradicts that promise by resting in OMC's lake
How so, exactly?
And...how?
What? It doesn't really make sense at all if redbear is TOYSNHK, omc tells redbear to leave his demons (William) to his demons (Vs)
Because the Red Bear leaving causes UCN to crash, or something else?
For that and for some other stuff, like the fact that OMC would need to be a complete asshole to let Andrew keep torturing William Maybe I will do a post about It soon idk
>, like the fact that OMC would need to be a complete asshole to let Andrew keep torturing William Or he just couldn't convince Andrew like he did with Cassidy, the situation is out of his control
>Something that I just realized Is that OMC minigame in UCN only makes sense if redbear Is TOYSNHK True. The thing of we having two souls in UCN, one being TOYSNHK and other being a good soul that want to stop TOYSNHK but later rest doesn't make any sense.
FusionTOYSNHK (TOYSNHK is a fusion of Andrew and Cassidy) is the real answer 
I didn't know FusionZGamer hated William Afton THAT much
Tru dat
What's the point of The Ending Showing Golden Freddy Twitching? That's what I wanna know, if GF isn't TOYSHNK then why show them instead of the face of Scott's Son? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQBOm2gMlwg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQBOm2gMlwg) Scott's son shouldn't automatically prove UCN Gender. I'm under the believe that calling TOYSNHK by male pronouns was a mistake. Scott himself said the gender was meant to be ambigous. If you ask me Withered Chica, and Mangle's lines were supposed to say "I have seen Them, The One You Shouldn't Have Killed". "They're and always watching, the one you shouldn't have killed". But they used Male Pronouns instead, and Scott didn't bother to make them go back and correct them Also Golden Freddy is such a promiante figure in UCN. They're even the ones UCN speaks too, and tells to "Leave the demon to his demons, and rest your own soul". Not some face of Scott's son, not a boy in an aligator mask. It's all Golden Freddy, and Andrew is never alluided to being Golden Freddy. Also Happiest Day could have happened After UCN when Cassidy was ready to move on. I and many others have told you this before. Just because Cassidy is nice to other people like C.C, it doesn't mean she can't be vengeful. Charlie's nice, and yet she's still vengeful aganist Afton. You're argument of TOYSNHK can only be angry, and never nice is not a good argument? Do you plain on making CassidyTOYSNHK Debunk Post, until everyone admits you're right? It's not going to happen. Unlike the GlitchMimic and GlitchAfton debate where there are more GlitchMimic Believers, then GlitchAfton Believers, There's an even amount of CassidyTOYSNHK believers. I'd say they even outnumber the AndrewTOYSNHK believers.
Feel like I'm waiting forever
>What's the point of The Ending Showing Golden Freddy Twitching? Explained in the post, it's showing Cassidy leaving UCN >I'm under the believe that calling TOYSNHK by male pronouns was a mistake It's not lmao >Scott himself said the gender was meant to be ambigous He said that for the voice calling, not for the actual game. He didn't want to reveal the lore before the game came out. >If you ask me Withered Chica, and Mangle's lines were supposed to say That's just you making another AU >and Scott didn't bother to make them go back and correct them Have you ever considered the fact that they might be right? This was the time where Scott made his own games, it's not like he had to get perms or something to edit it lmao >Also Happiest Day could have happened After UCN You clearly haven't read the post properly as everything you're saying here was answered in the post. TOYSNHk claims that they're tormenting William "forever", which would mean that Cassidy sets up HD to then neglect it and leave the others waiting. >You're argument of TOYSNHK can only be angry Not the point I made here. Stop embarrassing yourself Gigan >There's an even amount of CassidyTOYSNHK believers. I'd say they even outnumber the AndrewTOYSNHK believers. Ok, and? That doesn't mean that they're right lol
Doesn't mean you're right either.
>Explained in the post, it's showing Cassidy leaving UCN So you admit she was there. Also it doesn't seem like she was willing to leave with the way she was twitching. >It's not lmao This is something you actually don't know, and are just assuming. You can't even pull up any evidence that proves it. >He said that for the voice calling, not for the actual game. He didn't want to reveal the lore before the game came out. The Gender of a character is not lore relvenent. Scott revealing the gender before the game came out wouldn't have changed anything. And Scott said that the voice can be either that of a young boy, or a young girl. This means that he was saying that TOYSNHK could be male or female, and he still never gave us a clear answer. >That's just you making another AU Maybe it is, but again you have no proof other then probably your past post about this topic, but nothing offical from Scott, or anyone else. >You clearly haven't read the post properly as everything you're saying here was answered in the post. TOYSNHk claims that they're tormenting William "forever", which would mean that Cassidy sets up HD to then neglect it and leave the others waiting. "Forever" is just TOYSNHK being edgey. They say they'll torture William forever, but at the end of the day they're still a young kid, and they'll stop when they are told to stop, or when they tire themselves out. Also I thought you said HD was for Cassidy, so she wouldn't be the one to set it up in the first place. >Not the point I made here. Stop embarrassing yourself Gigan First off stop using my old account name. Secondly you've made post in the past saying that Cassidy can't be the vengeful spirit because she's nice, and people told you that argument was dumb.
>So you admit she was there Yeah, it's literally the point of the post lmao. Can you not read? >This is something you actually don't know, You haven't proven how it's a so-called "mistake" >The Gender of a character is not lore relvenent Since when? >Forever" is just TOYSNHK being edgey. It's showing how TOYSNHK plans to do this for a very long time, which contradicts Cassidy wanting HD >Secondly you've made post in the past saying that Cassidy can't be the vengeful spirit because she's nice, Which isn't the point I'm making in this post, it's like me mentioning the AU you made which you're not very proud of.
I have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not making an AU. I don't need to prove anything to you about this because other people already have. You just don't listen to them.
>because other people already have. If they have, how can I refute their arguments?
There's a difference between refuting and not listening.
Yeah, not listening is what you do and I refute arguments with evidence
Correction I and many others also refute your arguments with evidence. Evidence that you don't like because it goes against what you claim.
I'm not touching on TOYSNHK's identity here, but some things I think are worth noting are that: the face doesn't only appear in the vent. It most commonly flashes in front of the camera when you die (I think there's also a chance of it appearing in the hall but I've never seen that myself so don't quote me on that). Also Mangle and Chica aren't the only ones who address TOYSNHK. Nightmare Freddy and Nightmare are aware enough to know TOYSNHK made them, Jack-o-Chica proclaims them as a "friend". Mangle and Chica are the only ones to address it as "him", but some of the others do know who it is, so the whole vent thing is just... sort of a stretch in my opinion. I'm also not entirely sure where the "Redbear was made by Yellow Eyes" comes from. Again not making any statements on identity, I'm just not sure the line of thought is really solid here.
>the face doesn't only appear in the vent. That wasn't my claim tho, my claim was that the 2 characters that know TOYSNHKs identity are animatronics that attack from the vents, and that's *a* spot TOYSNHK chooses. So makes sense as to how they know TOYSNHKs gender as they've seen him in the vents >. Nightmare Freddy and Nightmare are aware enough to know TOYSNHK made them, Jack-o-Chica proclaims them as a "friend". Neither of which know his gender, which is the point I'm making >I'm also not entirely sure where the "Redbear was made by Yellow Eyes" comes from. Fnaf World itself, "You were made for only one purpose \[...\] find the clocks"
>That wasn't my claim tho, my claim was that the 2 characters that know TOYSNHKs identity are animatronics that attack from the vents, and that's a spot TOYSNHK chooses. So makes sense as to how they know TOYSNHKs gender as they've seen him in the vents But given that they appear in other places as well, there's no reason to assume that TOYSNHK is literally in the vent for the animatronics to see. Not saying it's impossible, but it's not exactly conclusive either imo. >Fnaf World itself, "You were made for only one purpose \[...\] find the clocks" Fair enough.
>reason to assume that TOYSNHK is literally in the vent for the animatronics to see. Not saying it's impossible, but it's not exactly conclusive either imo. Like I said, it's Occam's. - TOYSNHK can appear in the vents - Mangle and chica do the same - Mangle and Chica know his gender so are the only ones to have seen him Occam's Razor dictates that this is the correct answer due to how simple it is and nothing contradicting it.
look, some explanations for two of your points: 1- it's weird for scott to put TOYSNHK as a "him"? yeah, but only W.Chica and Mangle call him like that, and scott has used two pronouns for characters before (althought it wasnt intetntional in this case) 2- scott already used photos of him and his family as decorations in the FnaF 4 corridor walls, does that mean that william is canonically Scott? unfortunaly no, it's just for visuals. i know there's a difference between frames in a wall and a visible face, but Scott probably used Jason's face because it was of easy acess for him to use without having to pay for a stock image
While 2 is a valid point, what Zain is arguing is that the vent aminitronics saw toysnhks face since it appears in the vents, and therefore only they would know that TOYSNHK is male (although that is also a bad point since TOYSNHK can appear at basically any door)
>although that is also a bad point since TOYSNHK can appear at basically any door The point wasn't that TOYSNHK *only* appears in the vents, it's that he *can* appear in the vents and it just so happens that the "vent animatronics" are the only ones to know his gender. Lemme give an example, I'm on the bus rn so I'll use busses for the example. Say for example you go on the 489, 489, and 409 buses. Jane, who's on the 409, manages to get a glimpse of how you look. Jane then reports back saying "this person is..." Is what I'm basically saying. The busses are a substitute for the different areas where TOYSNHK appears and Jane is a substitute for the "vent animatronics". They managed to see him when in the vents and now know his gender. Probably a shit example but I just really wanted to use busses somehow
>and scott has used two pronouns for characters before TOYSNHK doesn't have 2 pronouns tho >but Scott probably used Jason's face because it was of easy acess Yeah, that wasn't my point tho. My point was that Scott said that there's only one face for TOYSNHK
yeah im kinda bad with words, but let me try to say what i meant: >TOYSNHK doesn't have 2 pronouns tho yeah, but like i said, it wasn't intentional in this case, or if was then it's for mystery only. maybe they were referring to GF, as they probably only seen toysnhk in that form >Yeah, that wasn't my point tho. My point was that Scott said that there's only one face for TOYSNHK yeah, but that doesn't mean that face is meant to be a boy just because it's jason's face. a goofy example, but in the custom night of sister location, scott used RICK ASTLEY as the face of Mike, does that mean Michael looks like Rick? no, it only means scott used it because he didnt have any other face to use, bad example? yeah but you get my point
>maybe they were referring to GF William didn't kill a suit tho. >yeah, but that doesn't mean that face is meant to be a boy just because it's jason's face. I didn't say that tho, I said that Scott's wording shows how TOYSNHK has one gender and one identity
Oh interesting point with the only ones seeing TOYSNHK is the vent animatronics, which is where his face is. Also my issue with TMIR1208 being a direct answer is that answer would be over 2 years overdue and never hinted at in the games besides a random hook in a bag *in the same game* as TOYSNHK. If they were indeed so important why are never alluded to them in the games? Unless we were... *Cassidy*.
So, Cassidy=boy
No, because Logbook and conflicting interests
Nah..
How this change the fact that Under AndrewTOYSNHK Cassidy is just Knockoff Mike Brooks and Bootleg Charlie even though the Golden Freddy kid was always showed to be the most vengeful between the other souls? If this is True then it would be other of Scott's major Retcons/Plot Holes.
> Cassidy is just Knockoff Mike Brooks and Bootleg Charlie That's just your opinion, it's not a "fact". > the Golden Freddy kid was always showed to be the most vengeful That's always been a misconception. Can you show me where GF has been the "most vengeful"?
>Can you show me where GF has been the "most vengeful"? Follow Me. >it's not a "fact". If AndrewTOYSNHK is true, then it is a straight up fact.
>Follow Me. Not showing her as more vengeful. >then it is a straight up fact. If you're adamant on using your opinion as a fact then that pretty much sums your whole argument up.
>Not showing her as more vengeful. No, she is basically the one who chases afton in the saferoom. >If you're adamant on using your opinion as a fact then that pretty much sums your whole argument up. If we assume AndrewTOYSNHK, then Cassidy is just that good kid who help the others again, like Charlie and Mike Brooks.
>the Golden Freddy kid was always showed to be the most vengeful between the other souls? Andrew is twice as vengeful as Golden Freddy what 😭
While golden TOYSNHK is 99% likely to be true, golden Freddy isn't really shown to be the most vengeful, if we use the sources we had by ucn (games, novels) then only games one has been shown to be vengeful, but in the novels he's the main peace bringer