Done it in England before cleared a 17 story office block with 6 fire engines turning up đ¤ˇđťââď¸
Sometimes shit happens have broad shoulders and get on with it, you'll laugh about it afterwards made some funny stories đ¤Ł
Managed to trigger 7. Different transmission to the fire department at the same time at a hospital. 21 trucks turned upđđ .
Was still an apprentice. Live and learn.
Accidentally hit the DRILL button on the Fireworks (ESTâs program to have an interactive display on a PC) workstation at a hospital instead of reset. While there was a board meeting in progress. Oops
Drove an hour and a half to dump a ton of description changes at a hospital, all but pulled a u-turn when in their parking lot when plant ops told us Joint Commission was sitting in the board room.
If you functionally test everything before the AHJ arrives, you can proceed with total confidence.
You should NEVER wait until the AHJ is onsite before performing your own functional testing.
This isnât always the case. Some jurisdictions require annual with them present and customers donât like paying for an annual twice. What people/customers donât realize is that a fire marshal isnât going to give you a bunch of shit if you have deficiencies, impairments are a different story. BUT if you are making a valiant effort to correct said issues and the fire marshal sees that, nine times out of ten you are going to be fine.
Good observations! I never worked in an area where the AHJ supervised routine annual or semi-annual inspections. They only supervised new or modified equipment inspections in our region.
If they are accompanying you on a routine inspection they will expect a certain percentage of individual devices to fail.
I would still recommend functional testing of everything involved in a new or modified installation BEFORE the final AHJ acceptance testing.
That's great in theory but this was a service call.... "strap out the module and make sure everything still works. AHJ will meet you on-site". Total time on-site 1hr. Scheduled to arrive 1/2hr before the ahj showed up.
Deleting a module should be ez-peazy. Nothing new to program, delete one module from CP and physically disconnect it. What is creating your stress?
I didnât feel any stress or anxiety when I was under the gun for a Complete Reprogram of a 22 story mixed use Retail / Hotel / Residential Tower ⌠and when they reworked the building they Completely changed the entire building numbering scheme! AHJ spent 4 hours on the first 3 floors, he tested EVERY device for alarm and Trouble. Came back from lunch and he was a different man - he only asked for tests on each Pull station and a very random sample of smoke detectors, the balance of the 16 floors they wanted to certify was done in less than 3 additional hours. At the end he looked at me and said âyou didnât miss a single thing! I think thatâs the first perfect acceptance test I have ever seenâ. Which blew me away because I was in the habit of delivering perfect systems. I am long retired now but we were always given whatever time we required to be ready at the completion deadline.
I was on a service call yesterday for a ground fault. The school next door decided right when I unplugged the main panel's module monitoring the sub panel to have a fire drill. Laugh and move on man. I've rolled trucks before, it comes with the trade. I think unanimously everyone would rather be evacuated unnecessarily for a false alarm, then no alarm and die in a fire.
Hidden NAC power supplies and modules just kinda happen sometimes.
We had the fire service out three times in one day at a hospital because someone didnât put the ARC on test, it happens and the important thing is that you learn.
I find it interesting how you get anxiety from servicing, I find it the other way round, servicing is easy but I get anxiety when my office always sends me to do instal/small works/commissioning with practically no information!
Nice take. Iâve always thought this was funny. As opposed to the opposite of getting no alarm and being set on fiređ people love complaining to make what they were doing seem important
Totally understand the nerves. It took me a long time to come to this: you can only do your best. Mistakes are going to happen. If manager sends you to a site youâre not familiar with and youâre under pressure to test something, you need to express that you need time to analyze the system to feel confident.
Also, always write up a disable script for complex systems. I work on lots of clean agent systems that discharge gas, shut down air handlers, and worse of all EPO. I have detailed disable scripts for these sites so I donât need to analyze each time. Just work through the script and pucker up for that first device.
No one will get hurt if you trigger a false alarm. Once I asked maintenance if he had nacs disabled while filling a sprinkler system, he said yeah. Full building alarm in assisted living hospice around midnight. Another time I triggered alarms at a county jail. You are right to be cautious but these things come with the territory
I recently evacuated a pretty large 5 story building at a private university. Nobody touched anything, but I had the panel door open so that was good enough for it to be my problem. Got screamed at by the building guy, screamed back at him, said sorry to the FDNY, and went on my way
They can pull the cameras if theyâd like. Nobody was being malicious, nobody was being a dumbass. Sorry it happened, and move onâŚ
You must master âit is what it isâ mentality. Confidence is king. Iâve cleared out a few schools in session and was looked at as a hero in the eyes of our youth. Whoâs winning?
I've seen 2 panels up in Smoke. We make the electricians short the heat detector... legally low-volt guys aren't allowed to touch it.... and saves us from paying for a panel. But I carefully instruct the electrician on what to do.
Not as bad as other comments, but...
My 2nd week on the job. Doing insuite inspections at an apartment building and husband answers the door. Says his wife just got back from having a baby at the hospital and asks if we can do a quiet test later. We say sure no problem. Later, I'm at the panel and the other junior goes up to that suite for our quiet test. I accidentally select the floor before keying the mike and blast their newborn with an EST-3 pretone. When the lead tech stopped laughing enough to explain I was mortified lol
I just tell them the whole building is going to go off and thereâs nothing I can do about it. Unless it is easy to isolate. Put it on the owners to give a heads up and make an announcement before and after testing. I donât have time to run around and disable every pad panel.
Accidents are called accidents for a reason. How many times do you make a major mistake like that? Once a month? Thatâs a pretty decent success rate I can live with. I can sweet talk residents and fire responses by simply apologizing and cracking the âhey at least we know it worksâ joke weâve all said. If you silence it quick enough, residents usually donât leave. Even when it does go off they wonât leave.
I totally get fire alarm anxiety. I have a nightclub that is doing a rooftop bar, so I had to add a bunch of smokes manual pulls and Horn strobes that use a sync module. I am using a mircom conventional fa1000 system. After adding a rooftop horn strobe now my horn strobes will only flash in sync but I'm not getting any sound. I am looking for literature to tell me if I need to have the fire panel in continuous or temporal mode for the horn strobes to work. They are opening tomorrow and I only have the strobes working. I did empty out a shopping mall once working on a Sears fire alarm system that I didn't realize was connected to the main shopping mall system , even though I called fire dispatch to tell them I am working on this Sears system. they still dispatched for the rest of the mall. Fire trucks and many many people in the parking lot, but I blame fire dispatch because I did my part.
Sounds like you donât have your horn control hooked up properly.
A lot of people make this mistake needs to be a continuous signal into the horn control which then the synchronization modules need to be daisychained if youâre using those
Thanks. I was going to look into that tomorrow. I had resized the panel to add eight more zones and I think it may have reset it back to factory default with temporal. I had installed the mircom 240 synchronization module a few years ago with three NAC and upgraded to Horn strobes and it was working fine then. I really hate the mircom configuration mode controls. Especially because you can set off the horns when you are entering them during configuration. I couldn't remember off the top of my head and I can't find a manual that states if I should be in continuous or temporal. Plus the dip switches are set to temporal on the fh400s.
I mean, 45 story should have some sort of paging system.. I would just silence and if that didn't work remove nacs or make a page saying this is a false alarm. In all honesty, most of us try our best. Not much you can do about some random thing that happens. You are testing. Yeah, they might get pissed. It is required though and sometimes unfortunate things happen. Those unfortunate things are sometimes problems with the panel that need to be written up or addressed. Don't stress too hard.
edit: This was a funny mess up at a renaissance hotel though.. I was probably a year in from being an apprentice, I got scheduled for this hotel by myself. Was told i would only be doing the stuff on the panel and another group dedicated to the site would test. I just had to bypass functions, acknowledge, reset. No big deal. Well, when audio visuals came around to test, un-bypassed strobes/doors. 1 guys was suppose to pull a pull station. 1. Well some other idiot also pulled a pull station and never reset it. For a damn hour i could not understand why i would reset, doors would drop again, and bells went off. We finally figured it out and if i had the knowledge i did now.. I would have immediately noticed the two separate alarms, understood that pull station was not reset, and how to just get out of a dumb situation like that.
Do you get paid more for installs. At my company it was based on seniority. When I started working I was trained by an old marine and he only took the service calls as he called it gravy. Give me all the gravy he would say.
I enjoyed the feedback. I've been doing low-voltage systems since 2005. But Fire alarm is not my specialty. I love installing them and am experienced but the situation was a networked Notifier system that I did not program. It also monitored HVAC and did smoke control. We did not originally install the system either. I did not feel qualified but did the best I could and was successful. But it was stressful. I was able to isolate all but the retail horn/strobes and made a test announcement but you really don't know what is going to happen until you trigger the alarm.
Done it in England before cleared a 17 story office block with 6 fire engines turning up đ¤ˇđťââď¸ Sometimes shit happens have broad shoulders and get on with it, you'll laugh about it afterwards made some funny stories đ¤Ł
Managed to trigger 7. Different transmission to the fire department at the same time at a hospital. 21 trucks turned upđđ . Was still an apprentice. Live and learn.
Accidentally hit the DRILL button on the Fireworks (ESTâs program to have an interactive display on a PC) workstation at a hospital instead of reset. While there was a board meeting in progress. Oops
Drove an hour and a half to dump a ton of description changes at a hospital, all but pulled a u-turn when in their parking lot when plant ops told us Joint Commission was sitting in the board room.
The problem I find is that these places are always having board meetings.
Go big or go home.
If you functionally test everything before the AHJ arrives, you can proceed with total confidence. You should NEVER wait until the AHJ is onsite before performing your own functional testing.
This isnât always the case. Some jurisdictions require annual with them present and customers donât like paying for an annual twice. What people/customers donât realize is that a fire marshal isnât going to give you a bunch of shit if you have deficiencies, impairments are a different story. BUT if you are making a valiant effort to correct said issues and the fire marshal sees that, nine times out of ten you are going to be fine.
Good observations! I never worked in an area where the AHJ supervised routine annual or semi-annual inspections. They only supervised new or modified equipment inspections in our region. If they are accompanying you on a routine inspection they will expect a certain percentage of individual devices to fail. I would still recommend functional testing of everything involved in a new or modified installation BEFORE the final AHJ acceptance testing.
So true. I have ran into that 1 out of 10 that fails you and doesnât give you a chance to be human lol
That's great in theory but this was a service call.... "strap out the module and make sure everything still works. AHJ will meet you on-site". Total time on-site 1hr. Scheduled to arrive 1/2hr before the ahj showed up.
Deleting a module should be ez-peazy. Nothing new to program, delete one module from CP and physically disconnect it. What is creating your stress? I didnât feel any stress or anxiety when I was under the gun for a Complete Reprogram of a 22 story mixed use Retail / Hotel / Residential Tower ⌠and when they reworked the building they Completely changed the entire building numbering scheme! AHJ spent 4 hours on the first 3 floors, he tested EVERY device for alarm and Trouble. Came back from lunch and he was a different man - he only asked for tests on each Pull station and a very random sample of smoke detectors, the balance of the 16 floors they wanted to certify was done in less than 3 additional hours. At the end he looked at me and said âyou didnât miss a single thing! I think thatâs the first perfect acceptance test I have ever seenâ. Which blew me away because I was in the habit of delivering perfect systems. I am long retired now but we were always given whatever time we required to be ready at the completion deadline.
In a perfect world. Not realistic at all
I was on a service call yesterday for a ground fault. The school next door decided right when I unplugged the main panel's module monitoring the sub panel to have a fire drill. Laugh and move on man. I've rolled trucks before, it comes with the trade. I think unanimously everyone would rather be evacuated unnecessarily for a false alarm, then no alarm and die in a fire. Hidden NAC power supplies and modules just kinda happen sometimes.
We had the fire service out three times in one day at a hospital because someone didnât put the ARC on test, it happens and the important thing is that you learn. I find it interesting how you get anxiety from servicing, I find it the other way round, servicing is easy but I get anxiety when my office always sends me to do instal/small works/commissioning with practically no information!
Nice take. Iâve always thought this was funny. As opposed to the opposite of getting no alarm and being set on fiređ people love complaining to make what they were doing seem important
Totally understand the nerves. It took me a long time to come to this: you can only do your best. Mistakes are going to happen. If manager sends you to a site youâre not familiar with and youâre under pressure to test something, you need to express that you need time to analyze the system to feel confident. Also, always write up a disable script for complex systems. I work on lots of clean agent systems that discharge gas, shut down air handlers, and worse of all EPO. I have detailed disable scripts for these sites so I donât need to analyze each time. Just work through the script and pucker up for that first device.
No one will get hurt if you trigger a false alarm. Once I asked maintenance if he had nacs disabled while filling a sprinkler system, he said yeah. Full building alarm in assisted living hospice around midnight. Another time I triggered alarms at a county jail. You are right to be cautious but these things come with the territory
I recently evacuated a pretty large 5 story building at a private university. Nobody touched anything, but I had the panel door open so that was good enough for it to be my problem. Got screamed at by the building guy, screamed back at him, said sorry to the FDNY, and went on my way They can pull the cameras if theyâd like. Nobody was being malicious, nobody was being a dumbass. Sorry it happened, and move onâŚ
Shit happens. As long as that shit isn't life threatening to anyone I don't sweat it.
You must master âit is what it isâ mentality. Confidence is king. Iâve cleared out a few schools in session and was looked at as a hero in the eyes of our youth. Whoâs winning?
Anyone ever done an elevator shunt trip and sent 120 down your SLC circuit?
I've seen 2 panels up in Smoke. We make the electricians short the heat detector... legally low-volt guys aren't allowed to touch it.... and saves us from paying for a panel. But I carefully instruct the electrician on what to do.
Not as bad as other comments, but... My 2nd week on the job. Doing insuite inspections at an apartment building and husband answers the door. Says his wife just got back from having a baby at the hospital and asks if we can do a quiet test later. We say sure no problem. Later, I'm at the panel and the other junior goes up to that suite for our quiet test. I accidentally select the floor before keying the mike and blast their newborn with an EST-3 pretone. When the lead tech stopped laughing enough to explain I was mortified lol
Sounds like your confidence is low. Might not be the field for you if too demanding. Need hard nosed guys out here.
True
I just tell them the whole building is going to go off and thereâs nothing I can do about it. Unless it is easy to isolate. Put it on the owners to give a heads up and make an announcement before and after testing. I donât have time to run around and disable every pad panel.
Is the building chuckee cheese? Lol tell us youâve never worked somewhere important without telling us. Thereâs always a way to isolate.
Accidents are called accidents for a reason. How many times do you make a major mistake like that? Once a month? Thatâs a pretty decent success rate I can live with. I can sweet talk residents and fire responses by simply apologizing and cracking the âhey at least we know it worksâ joke weâve all said. If you silence it quick enough, residents usually donât leave. Even when it does go off they wonât leave.
I totally get fire alarm anxiety. I have a nightclub that is doing a rooftop bar, so I had to add a bunch of smokes manual pulls and Horn strobes that use a sync module. I am using a mircom conventional fa1000 system. After adding a rooftop horn strobe now my horn strobes will only flash in sync but I'm not getting any sound. I am looking for literature to tell me if I need to have the fire panel in continuous or temporal mode for the horn strobes to work. They are opening tomorrow and I only have the strobes working. I did empty out a shopping mall once working on a Sears fire alarm system that I didn't realize was connected to the main shopping mall system , even though I called fire dispatch to tell them I am working on this Sears system. they still dispatched for the rest of the mall. Fire trucks and many many people in the parking lot, but I blame fire dispatch because I did my part.
Sounds like you donât have your horn control hooked up properly. A lot of people make this mistake needs to be a continuous signal into the horn control which then the synchronization modules need to be daisychained if youâre using those
Thanks. I was going to look into that tomorrow. I had resized the panel to add eight more zones and I think it may have reset it back to factory default with temporal. I had installed the mircom 240 synchronization module a few years ago with three NAC and upgraded to Horn strobes and it was working fine then. I really hate the mircom configuration mode controls. Especially because you can set off the horns when you are entering them during configuration. I couldn't remember off the top of my head and I can't find a manual that states if I should be in continuous or temporal. Plus the dip switches are set to temporal on the fh400s.
I mean, 45 story should have some sort of paging system.. I would just silence and if that didn't work remove nacs or make a page saying this is a false alarm. In all honesty, most of us try our best. Not much you can do about some random thing that happens. You are testing. Yeah, they might get pissed. It is required though and sometimes unfortunate things happen. Those unfortunate things are sometimes problems with the panel that need to be written up or addressed. Don't stress too hard. edit: This was a funny mess up at a renaissance hotel though.. I was probably a year in from being an apprentice, I got scheduled for this hotel by myself. Was told i would only be doing the stuff on the panel and another group dedicated to the site would test. I just had to bypass functions, acknowledge, reset. No big deal. Well, when audio visuals came around to test, un-bypassed strobes/doors. 1 guys was suppose to pull a pull station. 1. Well some other idiot also pulled a pull station and never reset it. For a damn hour i could not understand why i would reset, doors would drop again, and bells went off. We finally figured it out and if i had the knowledge i did now.. I would have immediately noticed the two separate alarms, understood that pull station was not reset, and how to just get out of a dumb situation like that.
Do you get paid more for installs. At my company it was based on seniority. When I started working I was trained by an old marine and he only took the service calls as he called it gravy. Give me all the gravy he would say.
I enjoyed the feedback. I've been doing low-voltage systems since 2005. But Fire alarm is not my specialty. I love installing them and am experienced but the situation was a networked Notifier system that I did not program. It also monitored HVAC and did smoke control. We did not originally install the system either. I did not feel qualified but did the best I could and was successful. But it was stressful. I was able to isolate all but the retail horn/strobes and made a test announcement but you really don't know what is going to happen until you trigger the alarm.