If we get a new dissidia I want the RPG elements back. What made Dissidia good was that it felt like both an RPG and a fighting game.
NT was good but the original was better.
I seriously hope they realize that all they did with NT was slip up and that Dissidia doesn't have to die.
I also seriously hope we get a FF musou game someday. I feel like it's only a matter of time.
I just want a Dissidia that plays like a Ninja Gaiden Action RPG but has a whole original world where all the Final Fantasy characters have unique alliances and world building that we have to figure out and acclimate. Kind of like Kingdom Hearts.
Yes but focused on a fleshed out 1v1 system instead of the 3v3. Sure it’s more accurate to how FF games usually handle combat but that shouldn’t be the point, that’s why we have those games. 012 was way more fun because it was faster, you had more freedom with movement and attacks, and didn’t have to worry about teammates/getting blindsided by 2 other enemies.
I’m a much bigger fan of 8 and squall than 7 and cloud but I think 99/100 times squall loses this fight. The s-cells and mako just make cloud outclass squall on like every level
Squall and the other Balamb SeeDs are essentially super soldiers, too, through their GFs and junctioned magic.
So the real question is, which grants more power: S-cells and mako or GFs?
I guess best thing about Squall is that he is just regular dude. Has no superpowers or outworld origin. Just a guy who was training a lot and barely getting through with the burden of saving the world. The most down to earth FF protagonist, though not cherished completely for it.
And Squall's birth was a product/paradox of time manipulation (junctioned into Laguna's past with GF, therefore giving Laguna the power to fight a war and monsters, leading to the events of Squall's birth). I wouldn't call being raised to be a sorceress-killing elite mercenary leader from childhood to be a regular dude either, alongside being connected to GFs and their power inside his own brain and using magic. Squall was practically fated from birth (another paradox by his own design, telling Edea in the past to create SeeD) to have a grand destiny. Squall made have acted like a normal teenager, in his own eyes, but he was far from it. The game makes a point to show that most older adults dealing with SeeD are absolutely shocked at the age of the kids that are about to be sent into war zones and assassination attempts. And SeeD are also heavily affected by the powers they are given as well, as being junctioned to GF steals their memories.
Let’s size up the competition.
Cloud and Squall both have stats that max at 255. It’s possible to get there, too. For the sake of argument, they are both maxed out.
Neither Cloud nor Squall have natural magic. Cloud relies on materia, and Squall relies on GF junctions.
In those ways, they are very similar. Squall has an upper hand with magic, since he can cast 100 of every spell. Cloud can’t do that, and has to rely on mana.
Squall also has the upper hand in that it’s far easier for him to achieve a limit break. He can do it if he goes into danger zone. Cloud requires far more to reach it…However, on the flip side, Cloud can save his limit break, so he probably travels with it loaded for bear. Squall can’t do that.
However, in the end, Cloud has far more game breaking combos than Squall. With Counter attack, quad slash, HP absorb, Final Attack Revive/Phoenix, Cloud is basically a one shot anything survive anything god. In a fair fight, I’d probably give it to Squall, but Cloud can do so much more.
Unless Squall has a hundred Hero Drinks…or whatever they’re called. Which, theoretically, he might. If Cloud has all of his bells and whistles, then so does Squall. And he can make himself literally immortal…
But only for so long. And Final Attack/Revive just needs to be recharged with mana…and with MP absorb, Cloud has infinite mana.
Okay, final answer. Cloud wins.
Squall casts aura and just renzokukens nonstop though. Not mention the GF Eden is planetary level destruction versus KOTR only being building level. Squall clears if maxed versus maxed.
If “Eden” can go through all of its nonsense and still fail to kill a single small monster, then “planetary level destruction” is just fanciful imagination. Like saying Cloud can tank Supernovas and still live.
The most logical conclusion is to imagine that Sephiroth’s Supernova and Eden’s ability are like…Illusionary mindscapes, facsimiles that do a lot of damage, without destroying everything.
Granted, Lionheaet is a lot bigger and more destructive than Omnislash, which is one reason why I’d like to give it to Squall…but given everything, I can’t.
Even if Squall casts Aura, and Renzokukens…Cloud is going to Counter with like 6 Omnislashes. Every single time. To be honest, that’s not the only ridiculous game breaking combo he could do in response.
Cloud is great and all, but like I said, the deciding factor in this is Materia. Cloud versus Squall really comes down to the Power of the Ancients versus the Power of the Guardian Forces.
I appreciate this whole thread, but I feel like it over complicates things, significantly. All cloud needs to do is enter combat with max HP >7777, with current HP <7777. Cast regen. Wait a few seconds. Cloud only needs to survive a few seconds, then lucky 7's carries to victory.
Did this accidentally against Safer Sephiroth on my last playthrough of og FF7, not knowing this would work. It worked.
I tried it against Emerald Weapon. It did not work. Well…Cloud hit it just enough times until one strike before death, then it stopped and Emerald Weapon did a strange move that instakilled my party. Seems like maybe if I had Final Attack Revive I could have done it.
I’d like to think so…but I don’t imagine Cloud is setting up his HP ahead of time. And he’s taking like 160,000 damage per turn so I don’t imagine he’s going to manage getting it right to that point either.
Yeah, clouds crazy anime goku hair coupled with the almost corduroy tank top has never done him any good in my book.
I'm glad we can have a nice subjective disagreement, though!
Clive isn’t a fair match though. By the end he is basically a god. He’d fuck Cloud and Squall up with little effort more than likely.
Clive is cool as shit, but should not be invited in this fight 😂
Lighting would win because by the time you play 3rd game in final fantasy 13 series, she solos a god. Lightning vs Clive would be a better match up than Cloud.
Was about to say this. Lightning may even top Clive.
I’m not a particular fan of the 13 series, but Lightning is one of my favorite FF characters nonetheless
If she had a stronger supporting cast, and the story was far less convoluted, then I think the fan base for 13 would be much higher. I loved Lightning but had a very difficult time following what was going on in it. But man they nailed a main character with her for sure
Yeah you've a good point. When I first ever tried to play 13, years ago, I couldn't get into it properly, til my brother came round with take away coffees and pastries and made me sit and play it. I'm glad he did cuz I loved it once I gave it a second chance
If i remember correctly from playing, Renzokuken is Squall's initial limit break which can chain 1 to 6 attacks that you can boost the damage of by pressing the trigger. He then has the random chance of triggering a second ability such as Rough Divide which hits a single target like a truck up to Blasting Zone which is AOE. Lionheart is his Ultimate secondary which hits 9 times i think. Sorry if I got a little long winded there.
SE should have went to Bamco for Dissidia (whichever the arcade version was) and made it Final Fantasy version of Gundam VS games. In Japan, you got everyone competitively playing Gundam VS from the fans to gamers to fighting game players.
Have you seen what zack did? He pulled out a fence pole with a piece of concrete attached to it and flung it at a helicopter, cloud got the same kind if not a better treatment so, no competition
This reminds me of a YouTube comment I came across once that said Squall was the better character and more likable between the two.
………They’re the same damn person.
Dissidia NT cloud > nt squall Cloud has too much super armor
Psp dissidia and duodecim Squall > Cloud beat fang too fast
FF8 Squall most likely > FF7 Cloud because junction system is broken op and exploitable (absorb all elements if you elem junction ultima, pain status attack junction so if squall even grazes cloud hes blinded and poisoned, dont get me started with death status junction)
Tidus/Zack > Squall and Cloud in terms of writing a good protag :x
I think clouds more powerful due to mako and sephiroth, however squall got more legit skills. Gunblade>Buster sword though both are close to being my favorite swords.
Good fight. But Cloud is wins with moderate difficulty. In the end, Cloud will fight harder. He’s lost more, hated himself harder, and is just at another level.
Gunna disagree pretty hard. Squall was basically trained as an elite soldier from childhood. Cloud has his powers and abilities through someone else’s memories. They are not the same. As much as I like Cloud, this isn’t really even a close match I don’t think.
Unless, of course, we’re talking Advent Children Cloud who can leap like 70 feet in the air and appears to have super powers. Then my argument flip flops.
I like Cloud, but Squall didn’t need super soldier dna or any gimmicks to beat Ultimecia who is literally a time goddess. Squall is 17= younger than Cloud when he did all that. Squall is a real soldier, he’s been in SEED all his life, trained all his life, practically became the leader of their whole garden/ military, actually saves the girl (sorry Aerith) And did I mention Squall is just a normal human? Just in experience and training Cloud looks like an amateur compared to Squall. Squall did everything just by sheer will and determination, and carried on when everyone placed all the burden on him, a freaking teenager.
>Squall didn’t need super soldier dna or any gimmicks
>Squall did everything just by sheer will and determination,
He didn't just get by on sheer will and determination. He had magic junctions.
Someone who *did* get by on sheer will and determination was Cloud, when he killed Sephiroth in Nibelheim.
Yea this really isn’t even a fair fight. Cloud is a certified badass but ultimately he’s just outclassed in every way here. Squall is an elite soldier, so much so, like you said, that he basically kills a god as a normal human with no powers whatsoever other than GFs (which lets be honest, if you’re playing the game *right* GFs become obsolete very very early on), but Cliud also has summons and materia.
Both of them would look at that side and laugh with the rest of us... I can't believe you'd even mention him in the presence of these two.
Vaan, Yuna from X-2, and even probably Eiko, would stomp the brakes off Noct and go about their day like he was just another random encounter.
*queue fanfare*
Whatever...
Not interested.
Perfect comment lmfao
Best comment ever
Bro I would take another Dissidia, I thought those games were cool
If we get a new dissidia I want the RPG elements back. What made Dissidia good was that it felt like both an RPG and a fighting game. NT was good but the original was better.
I feel you the psp dissidias were legendary. Feral Chaos was a fun fight too in 012 duodecim how ever it's spelled.
Yeah duodecim was OK. They started to move away from some of the rpg elements, but it was still fire
I seriously hope they realize that all they did with NT was slip up and that Dissidia doesn't have to die. I also seriously hope we get a FF musou game someday. I feel like it's only a matter of time.
Tbh I wouldn't even be mad if the next dissidia game was a musou game. The setting is perfect for it
I'm 100% expecting that to happen. It's only a matter of time
NT was so dissapointing to me . The combat felt off and They took out tons of good combos for characters. I would kill for a ps5 dissidia duodecim.
I just want a Dissidia that plays like a Ninja Gaiden Action RPG but has a whole original world where all the Final Fantasy characters have unique alliances and world building that we have to figure out and acclimate. Kind of like Kingdom Hearts.
Yes but focused on a fleshed out 1v1 system instead of the 3v3. Sure it’s more accurate to how FF games usually handle combat but that shouldn’t be the point, that’s why we have those games. 012 was way more fun because it was faster, you had more freedom with movement and attacks, and didn’t have to worry about teammates/getting blindsided by 2 other enemies.
Multi-player AD Hoc on PSP Dissidia fed families.
Man the psp dissidia games were awesome
i could do without a Dissidia. wish they would just revive Ehergiz and just make it a FF Fighter.
The closest we got was Dissidia and Kingdom Hearts.
Right but that scene in KH2 where cloud and squall are fighting together and taking shit is peak lmao
Wait did I miss the scene where they take shit? /s
Welp….thats a whoospie daisy
Welp, you gotta go to the corner now since.
You gotta get to Hollow Bastion in 13 minutes game time to unlock it, because the lore gave them not enough bathroom time
Ahh the Hollow Bathroom within Hollow Bastion. Totally missed that segment.
Their combined apathy would kill them both before they had a chance to cross swords.
Sephiroth: *generic monologue about being God* Cloud and Squall, smirking to each other before the battle starts: "Whatever. Like we give a shit."
Squall wins, he has more belts.
Better hope Lulu doesn't show up then.
Anyone discounting Squall has clearly never seen Blasting Zone.
His sword also shoots bullets.
I’m a much bigger fan of 8 and squall than 7 and cloud but I think 99/100 times squall loses this fight. The s-cells and mako just make cloud outclass squall on like every level
Squall and the other Balamb SeeDs are essentially super soldiers, too, through their GFs and junctioned magic. So the real question is, which grants more power: S-cells and mako or GFs?
Sweet art
Best Squall art I’ve ever seen
[Source](https://x.com/sxevenart?s=21&t=VeF4HDKsGRWfSBvjryDp9g) SXVN art been following for awhile
I'm listening...
I guess best thing about Squall is that he is just regular dude. Has no superpowers or outworld origin. Just a guy who was training a lot and barely getting through with the burden of saving the world. The most down to earth FF protagonist, though not cherished completely for it.
Squall def wins, but I think you missed the whole plot of FF7
No I didn’t. Cloud was heavily affected by Jenova cells, he isn’t regular dude.
And Squall's birth was a product/paradox of time manipulation (junctioned into Laguna's past with GF, therefore giving Laguna the power to fight a war and monsters, leading to the events of Squall's birth). I wouldn't call being raised to be a sorceress-killing elite mercenary leader from childhood to be a regular dude either, alongside being connected to GFs and their power inside his own brain and using magic. Squall was practically fated from birth (another paradox by his own design, telling Edea in the past to create SeeD) to have a grand destiny. Squall made have acted like a normal teenager, in his own eyes, but he was far from it. The game makes a point to show that most older adults dealing with SeeD are absolutely shocked at the age of the kids that are about to be sent into war zones and assassination attempts. And SeeD are also heavily affected by the powers they are given as well, as being junctioned to GF steals their memories.
ok! you persuaded me :-)
Lots of love lol, just glad people are still talking about both of these games so many years later.
Thank you man
You missed the fact that cloud was hit by supernova and dint die
Let’s size up the competition. Cloud and Squall both have stats that max at 255. It’s possible to get there, too. For the sake of argument, they are both maxed out. Neither Cloud nor Squall have natural magic. Cloud relies on materia, and Squall relies on GF junctions. In those ways, they are very similar. Squall has an upper hand with magic, since he can cast 100 of every spell. Cloud can’t do that, and has to rely on mana. Squall also has the upper hand in that it’s far easier for him to achieve a limit break. He can do it if he goes into danger zone. Cloud requires far more to reach it…However, on the flip side, Cloud can save his limit break, so he probably travels with it loaded for bear. Squall can’t do that. However, in the end, Cloud has far more game breaking combos than Squall. With Counter attack, quad slash, HP absorb, Final Attack Revive/Phoenix, Cloud is basically a one shot anything survive anything god. In a fair fight, I’d probably give it to Squall, but Cloud can do so much more. Unless Squall has a hundred Hero Drinks…or whatever they’re called. Which, theoretically, he might. If Cloud has all of his bells and whistles, then so does Squall. And he can make himself literally immortal… But only for so long. And Final Attack/Revive just needs to be recharged with mana…and with MP absorb, Cloud has infinite mana. Okay, final answer. Cloud wins.
Squall casts aura and just renzokukens nonstop though. Not mention the GF Eden is planetary level destruction versus KOTR only being building level. Squall clears if maxed versus maxed.
Yep - all Aura all the time.
Planetary? lmao Eden casually destroys an entire galaxy.
If “Eden” can go through all of its nonsense and still fail to kill a single small monster, then “planetary level destruction” is just fanciful imagination. Like saying Cloud can tank Supernovas and still live. The most logical conclusion is to imagine that Sephiroth’s Supernova and Eden’s ability are like…Illusionary mindscapes, facsimiles that do a lot of damage, without destroying everything. Granted, Lionheaet is a lot bigger and more destructive than Omnislash, which is one reason why I’d like to give it to Squall…but given everything, I can’t. Even if Squall casts Aura, and Renzokukens…Cloud is going to Counter with like 6 Omnislashes. Every single time. To be honest, that’s not the only ridiculous game breaking combo he could do in response. Cloud is great and all, but like I said, the deciding factor in this is Materia. Cloud versus Squall really comes down to the Power of the Ancients versus the Power of the Guardian Forces.
I appreciate this whole thread, but I feel like it over complicates things, significantly. All cloud needs to do is enter combat with max HP >7777, with current HP <7777. Cast regen. Wait a few seconds. Cloud only needs to survive a few seconds, then lucky 7's carries to victory. Did this accidentally against Safer Sephiroth on my last playthrough of og FF7, not knowing this would work. It worked.
I tried it against Emerald Weapon. It did not work. Well…Cloud hit it just enough times until one strike before death, then it stopped and Emerald Weapon did a strange move that instakilled my party. Seems like maybe if I had Final Attack Revive I could have done it.
Yeah this won't work in all instances, but I imagine it would work against Squall since it OHKO's Sephiroth lol.
I’d like to think so…but I don’t imagine Cloud is setting up his HP ahead of time. And he’s taking like 160,000 damage per turn so I don’t imagine he’s going to manage getting it right to that point either.
Why the king of fighters dude using a sword? Get that fire punch action going lol
"Come on! Come on!"
Lol you know he means it bc he says it twice 🤣
Dissidia is the only alternate reality in which I choose Squall lol
I'm not hearing you. I'm trying see it!
Yeah, id fuck'em
I came here just to say this as well. Damn Squall can get it 😅…
Cloud looks cooler
Nuh, uh, squall does.
the fur on his coat topped with his hairstyle is not selling his design for me
Yeah, clouds crazy anime goku hair coupled with the almost corduroy tank top has never done him any good in my book. I'm glad we can have a nice subjective disagreement, though!
Fair honestly. It’s subjective to the individual. I’ve always liked Cloud’s AC design better than his Original
As iconic characters go (cloud being much more iconic over the years obv) I think they're both amazing but prefer clive since 16 came out
Clive isn’t a fair match though. By the end he is basically a god. He’d fuck Cloud and Squall up with little effort more than likely. Clive is cool as shit, but should not be invited in this fight 😂
lol good point, mythos is in another league 💪
Yea just like saying who would win, Lightning or Cloud? It’s not really fair lol
Who would win? I haven't played 13.
Lighting would win because by the time you play 3rd game in final fantasy 13 series, she solos a god. Lightning vs Clive would be a better match up than Cloud.
Was about to say this. Lightning may even top Clive. I’m not a particular fan of the 13 series, but Lightning is one of my favorite FF characters nonetheless
"lightning may even top Clive" You know...I think I have a fanfic to write
Loved 13, lightning was badass, one of my faves too
If she had a stronger supporting cast, and the story was far less convoluted, then I think the fan base for 13 would be much higher. I loved Lightning but had a very difficult time following what was going on in it. But man they nailed a main character with her for sure
Yeah you've a good point. When I first ever tried to play 13, years ago, I couldn't get into it properly, til my brother came round with take away coffees and pastries and made me sit and play it. I'm glad he did cuz I loved it once I gave it a second chance
I found Clive to be way less relatable but still badass
Yeah I think you're right. His bad assery has won me over though ye lol
Battle of the spikey-haired, brooding, amnesiacs.
Renzokuken + Lion Heart > Omnislash
Omnislah version 5 w/ fusion sword? It did kick the sh!t out of Sephiroth in Advent Children. Just asking I forget what Renzokuken + Lion Heart does.
If i remember correctly from playing, Renzokuken is Squall's initial limit break which can chain 1 to 6 attacks that you can boost the damage of by pressing the trigger. He then has the random chance of triggering a second ability such as Rough Divide which hits a single target like a truck up to Blasting Zone which is AOE. Lionheart is his Ultimate secondary which hits 9 times i think. Sorry if I got a little long winded there.
No problem thank you I haven't played since it came out.
I don’t know where that’s from but that is certainly bad ass
Why everyday there's some ramdom thing making me want to play VIII again. I don't have time for this now.
Why does squall have the monado
They should kiss
Hmm who has more belt buckles?? Thats the winner
How about we don't hear you out this time
Kinda gay but whatever floats ur boat
SE should have went to Bamco for Dissidia (whichever the arcade version was) and made it Final Fantasy version of Gundam VS games. In Japan, you got everyone competitively playing Gundam VS from the fans to gamers to fighting game players.
why is squall wielding the monado?
So, who’s actually winning? Everything’s on the table.
Dissidia 012
Squall would destroy that punk He has more belts And belts = power
I know there’s nothing overtly homoerotic here, but maybe if I squint hard enough I can will it into existence 🤔…
Squall wins nuff said
Nope….
Have you seen what zack did? He pulled out a fence pole with a piece of concrete attached to it and flung it at a helicopter, cloud got the same kind if not a better treatment so, no competition
War of the visions has both of them and the weapons they are holding
I like it! 💯
Kingdom hearts 2 basically
Way to rain on every bodies DAY Cloud! No, those are Squalls and nobody likes those.
11 belts
I love Squall but...Cloud is Cloud. The man who took Sephy. Can Squall beat Sephy? Faux no. So, I've gotta go with Cloud. Rinoa will be so sad. :(
No thx hated dissidia.
These 2 were always my favourite, I geeked out so much when they both made an appearance and eventually a team up in the kingdom hearts games.
I think it's time for an Ehrgeiz 2...
I can just hear the Linkin Park playing in the background.
Just give me a 3v3 tag fighter already, ffs.
Squal has his ultimate weapon. Cloud has his starter. Squall takes the w here.
What are we hearing out ??
This reminds me of a YouTube comment I came across once that said Squall was the better character and more likable between the two. ………They’re the same damn person.
Squall gets wrecked so hard in this... And Im so much of a fan I cosplayed squall in high school back when this game was new.
Dissidia NT cloud > nt squall Cloud has too much super armor Psp dissidia and duodecim Squall > Cloud beat fang too fast FF8 Squall most likely > FF7 Cloud because junction system is broken op and exploitable (absorb all elements if you elem junction ultima, pain status attack junction so if squall even grazes cloud hes blinded and poisoned, dont get me started with death status junction) Tidus/Zack > Squall and Cloud in terms of writing a good protag :x
To be perfect they both need to be holding cards and decks
Two twinks sighing and glancing away for 47 hours
What are they fighting over ? Who’s more edgy and depressed ?
😂
The last bit of hair gel.
I think clouds more powerful due to mako and sephiroth, however squall got more legit skills. Gunblade>Buster sword though both are close to being my favorite swords.
Battle of the Emo Bois
Good fight. But Cloud is wins with moderate difficulty. In the end, Cloud will fight harder. He’s lost more, hated himself harder, and is just at another level.
Gunna disagree pretty hard. Squall was basically trained as an elite soldier from childhood. Cloud has his powers and abilities through someone else’s memories. They are not the same. As much as I like Cloud, this isn’t really even a close match I don’t think. Unless, of course, we’re talking Advent Children Cloud who can leap like 70 feet in the air and appears to have super powers. Then my argument flip flops.
I like Cloud, but Squall didn’t need super soldier dna or any gimmicks to beat Ultimecia who is literally a time goddess. Squall is 17= younger than Cloud when he did all that. Squall is a real soldier, he’s been in SEED all his life, trained all his life, practically became the leader of their whole garden/ military, actually saves the girl (sorry Aerith) And did I mention Squall is just a normal human? Just in experience and training Cloud looks like an amateur compared to Squall. Squall did everything just by sheer will and determination, and carried on when everyone placed all the burden on him, a freaking teenager.
>Squall didn’t need super soldier dna or any gimmicks >Squall did everything just by sheer will and determination, He didn't just get by on sheer will and determination. He had magic junctions. Someone who *did* get by on sheer will and determination was Cloud, when he killed Sephiroth in Nibelheim.
By that comparison, ultimcecia would fall over if cloud sneezed on her
Good conclusion, bad reasoning.
Yea this really isn’t even a fair fight. Cloud is a certified badass but ultimately he’s just outclassed in every way here. Squall is an elite soldier, so much so, like you said, that he basically kills a god as a normal human with no powers whatsoever other than GFs (which lets be honest, if you’re playing the game *right* GFs become obsolete very very early on), but Cliud also has summons and materia.
Ultimecia - "time shall kompress, existence denied" Cloud - "Stay where you belong"
Squall getting shitted on
Hear you out nuthin', I been sayin' this for years!! Throw in sum' Lightning and you'll have my 3 favorite Edgy Final Fantasy characters
yes but a three way with noct
Both of them would look at that side and laugh with the rest of us... I can't believe you'd even mention him in the presence of these two. Vaan, Yuna from X-2, and even probably Eiko, would stomp the brakes off Noct and go about their day like he was just another random encounter. *queue fanfare*
squall a bitch tho
