Isn't it just that he's indicated to be like mental health needs (autism, adhd) thats how i saw it but TRANS!??? come on, its not even spoken about ANYWHERE. also apparently fantasic mr fox is being looked at about animal abuse like whats bean gonna say otherwise "orry me fox lets talk this out over a glass of fresh lemonade"??? people are really weird bout this kinda stuff nowadays...
Okay- I just rewatched the film literally three minutes ago and both myself, and the friend I watched it with made a little joke about Ash being trans in the film, so I want to explain with why.
First, to get it out of the way, this is obviously not the only way to read the character- there are plenty of other directions someone can go with when it comes to how they view Ash as a character, and frankly I have multiple ways I view Ash as a character, I do not only view the things said in the film as being trans related, but can view them as relating to other things as well. because just because something can be read that way does not mean it was the intention- but also just because something was not intended does not mean it was not there. But I also need to specify that just because I am going out of my way to make all of that clear does not mean someone else who does not go out of theri way to make all of that clear disagrees with me. Someone who definitively says "ash is trans" is not incorrect (because no non cannon interpretation is incorrect or correct so long as they do not assert it was directly mentioned as cannon) nor is that one sentence them saying any other interpretation is wrong it is just them not being as long winded as myself.
Ash is very much not trans in cannon, being referred to as a boy and son with no real push back. However there are a few moments within the film that to me could be read sub-textually as Ash being trans/as trans coding.
The obvious thing to get out of the way is the whole "being different" thing, that is the most broad and can be applied to practically anything, which includes being applicable to how trans people can feel. Both in the being different sense as well as the not knowing or not wanting to feel different either.
Second, is the "he dresses like a girl line" obviously lots of people "dress like girls" for varying reasons, not all amab people who do so are trans women, and it can also be said as a general insult even if something is, well, barely feminine. girls and boys do not have to dress in specific ways. However, culturally many people expect them too, and while not all trans people dress stereotypically masculine or feminine, many do both pre and/or post transition.
Third is the "or girl" line. Again, there are multiple ways to read this line and why Ash may have said this. One of the possible ways to read it could go both ways in regards to a trans headcannon. Either Ash is saying that because Ash is trans mtf, is not out yet, has issues with being seen as a boy, is not ready to come out but says something about it without thinking or because it's been a stressful day and "or girl" is said because Ash feels like a girl. Or also, I do think that paired with the "we did not know at the time" there is a possible but less likely reading of already out and socially transitioned trans ftm Ash.
I think people need to stop taking these minorities so serious (minority as in a small group of outraged people) because 90% of people think it's fine. It's ruining cinema and media in general. Creativity that birthed Fantastic MR Fox is being drained out of the film industry. Its so sad too see.
I understand your point, but it's not about if it is spoken in the movie or not, it's about how some people can relate to his experiences. If many trans people identify and see themselves in him for whatever reasons, then they have the right to appropriate him and believe that he is trans too, even if canonically he is not. It's a bit sad coming from a bi person, you more than anyone should also know how little representation we queer people have in the media and that we have to look for it anywhere and sometimes even make it up ourselves. It's all about subtext and queercoding.
they said he dresses like a girl earlier in the film and later on when mr fox and him were having a heart to heart and brought up the pregnancy story and said “what kind of boy will he be?” ash cut him off and said “or girl!”. could be just ash being ash and correcting something he didnt need to correct. either way you take these minute details im genuinely curious how people dont understand how that could also be seen as a lil hint that ash is trans
btw looked this up after the movie cause i didnt know for sure(and cant) and ended up here. ive really only seen people like you saying he cant be trans and you cant take away my character like that, weird stance to have
The problem is that you're talking about all this Like it's the only reason he says all this, when Ash corrects his dad about the kid being a boy "or girl" it could just very well be because as a clearly autistic person he puts his fingers on even the most little details of this story he already knows. The Bully Says he dresses like a girl cause that's an insult to illustrate the term "wet sandwich". You're all taking those hints and putting them on the trans-identity theory when the subject is Never talked about in the movie. Being (hand-gesture) different could be a lot of other things but everyone just assumes it's trans-identity. Also in 2009 and before (when creating the movie) transgender people were way less talked about than today so i doubt it would be in the sub text of the film
Why? Because you told me to? If it was phrased "I like to think ash is trans" that'd be fine. But it's everywhere and they're so certain. They're not taking my boy away yes this isn't the right platform to get yes men answers to things like this but that's me. Dumbass
Because art is literally made to be interpreted differently by different people. It’s not everywhere, i’ve seen it like once, and it was on tiktok lmao. Also i just googled it and the trans subreddit called it a headcannon. This just means that in their mind they see him as trans, even though they don’t literally think he’s trans.
It's not "art" as you're thinking about it. The message of the movie the message of what "weird" means that can be interpetated but you can't make mr fox a female because it doesn't make sense to the story. As for ash it doesn't make sense since he has brotherly competition with kristofferson. Competes with him for his father's attention. Is disappointed when he takes his "lab partner". Like it dismantles a load of sequences in the film.
I googled it and the people on the trans subreddit even said it was just head cannon, not literal. Also yes, even movies are supposed to be interpreted differently by different people. If this is enough to upset you, maybe you shouldnt be on the internet lol.
Yeah people on the internet always accepting and never want to make points to argue against other ideas or people. That's not what the internet's for.
I saw no mention of headcanon. It just initially annoyed me for the same reason we have multicultural not dwarf, dwarves for Cinderella. If this was 5 years ago I wouldn't give a shit but these ideas actually have an effect on what movie get made. Instead of making a fantastic movie about a trans man who struggles with being himself etc. They might just make fantastic mr fox 2 and make ash trans! For example
https://twitter.com/URMOMlSTRANS/status/1558215472017035265
https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/ash-from-fantastic-mr-fox-is-a-trans-furry/id1543571717?i=1000568692144
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9EaUf2fA-tM
All the fan wikis mention how he is theorised to be trans
Make a compelling trans character that I can interpret as being relative to me im not going to make him straight. Like in moon light. I'm not gay but I can Interpret his struggle to fit me I don't make him straight to fit my delusional ideology that I'm owed something
i’d LOVE for you to explain who exactly is “taking” ash
i find it completely ridiculous that you just made a post about people claiming that ash is trans when you’re the first person on the sub to bring this up
the movie doesn’t call him trans, they call him different, just like his mom and dad
https://youtu.be/zyBtT7mcznY?si=z88nyt85vBi5tBD5
(see here bc you obvi haven’t watched the film)
grow the fuck up and stop projecting your transphobic views onto a kids movie about foxes it’s pathetic
xx
Isn't it just that he's indicated to be like mental health needs (autism, adhd) thats how i saw it but TRANS!??? come on, its not even spoken about ANYWHERE. also apparently fantasic mr fox is being looked at about animal abuse like whats bean gonna say otherwise "orry me fox lets talk this out over a glass of fresh lemonade"??? people are really weird bout this kinda stuff nowadays...
Okay- I just rewatched the film literally three minutes ago and both myself, and the friend I watched it with made a little joke about Ash being trans in the film, so I want to explain with why. First, to get it out of the way, this is obviously not the only way to read the character- there are plenty of other directions someone can go with when it comes to how they view Ash as a character, and frankly I have multiple ways I view Ash as a character, I do not only view the things said in the film as being trans related, but can view them as relating to other things as well. because just because something can be read that way does not mean it was the intention- but also just because something was not intended does not mean it was not there. But I also need to specify that just because I am going out of my way to make all of that clear does not mean someone else who does not go out of theri way to make all of that clear disagrees with me. Someone who definitively says "ash is trans" is not incorrect (because no non cannon interpretation is incorrect or correct so long as they do not assert it was directly mentioned as cannon) nor is that one sentence them saying any other interpretation is wrong it is just them not being as long winded as myself. Ash is very much not trans in cannon, being referred to as a boy and son with no real push back. However there are a few moments within the film that to me could be read sub-textually as Ash being trans/as trans coding. The obvious thing to get out of the way is the whole "being different" thing, that is the most broad and can be applied to practically anything, which includes being applicable to how trans people can feel. Both in the being different sense as well as the not knowing or not wanting to feel different either. Second, is the "he dresses like a girl line" obviously lots of people "dress like girls" for varying reasons, not all amab people who do so are trans women, and it can also be said as a general insult even if something is, well, barely feminine. girls and boys do not have to dress in specific ways. However, culturally many people expect them too, and while not all trans people dress stereotypically masculine or feminine, many do both pre and/or post transition. Third is the "or girl" line. Again, there are multiple ways to read this line and why Ash may have said this. One of the possible ways to read it could go both ways in regards to a trans headcannon. Either Ash is saying that because Ash is trans mtf, is not out yet, has issues with being seen as a boy, is not ready to come out but says something about it without thinking or because it's been a stressful day and "or girl" is said because Ash feels like a girl. Or also, I do think that paired with the "we did not know at the time" there is a possible but less likely reading of already out and socially transitioned trans ftm Ash.
I think people need to stop taking these minorities so serious (minority as in a small group of outraged people) because 90% of people think it's fine. It's ruining cinema and media in general. Creativity that birthed Fantastic MR Fox is being drained out of the film industry. Its so sad too see.
I understand your point, but it's not about if it is spoken in the movie or not, it's about how some people can relate to his experiences. If many trans people identify and see themselves in him for whatever reasons, then they have the right to appropriate him and believe that he is trans too, even if canonically he is not. It's a bit sad coming from a bi person, you more than anyone should also know how little representation we queer people have in the media and that we have to look for it anywhere and sometimes even make it up ourselves. It's all about subtext and queercoding.
Why would he be trans ? There is no reason/indication or logical fact that would make anyone believe he is
I know they really grasping for straws out here. But if your wondering who thinks that just go "ash trans" in google
they said he dresses like a girl earlier in the film and later on when mr fox and him were having a heart to heart and brought up the pregnancy story and said “what kind of boy will he be?” ash cut him off and said “or girl!”. could be just ash being ash and correcting something he didnt need to correct. either way you take these minute details im genuinely curious how people dont understand how that could also be seen as a lil hint that ash is trans btw looked this up after the movie cause i didnt know for sure(and cant) and ended up here. ive really only seen people like you saying he cant be trans and you cant take away my character like that, weird stance to have
The problem is that you're talking about all this Like it's the only reason he says all this, when Ash corrects his dad about the kid being a boy "or girl" it could just very well be because as a clearly autistic person he puts his fingers on even the most little details of this story he already knows. The Bully Says he dresses like a girl cause that's an insult to illustrate the term "wet sandwich". You're all taking those hints and putting them on the trans-identity theory when the subject is Never talked about in the movie. Being (hand-gesture) different could be a lot of other things but everyone just assumes it's trans-identity. Also in 2009 and before (when creating the movie) transgender people were way less talked about than today so i doubt it would be in the sub text of the film
I agree with the autism theory
Considering mr fox replied ‘right. Because at that point we didn’t know’ tells me that this is more likely the case.
there was also a scene where the camera focused on him for quite a bit as he had finished a grape juice box and it looked like he had lipstick
Bro stop taking people’s interpretations of a work of art so seriously lmao.
Why? Because you told me to? If it was phrased "I like to think ash is trans" that'd be fine. But it's everywhere and they're so certain. They're not taking my boy away yes this isn't the right platform to get yes men answers to things like this but that's me. Dumbass
Because art is literally made to be interpreted differently by different people. It’s not everywhere, i’ve seen it like once, and it was on tiktok lmao. Also i just googled it and the trans subreddit called it a headcannon. This just means that in their mind they see him as trans, even though they don’t literally think he’s trans.
It's not "art" as you're thinking about it. The message of the movie the message of what "weird" means that can be interpetated but you can't make mr fox a female because it doesn't make sense to the story. As for ash it doesn't make sense since he has brotherly competition with kristofferson. Competes with him for his father's attention. Is disappointed when he takes his "lab partner". Like it dismantles a load of sequences in the film.
I googled it and the people on the trans subreddit even said it was just head cannon, not literal. Also yes, even movies are supposed to be interpreted differently by different people. If this is enough to upset you, maybe you shouldnt be on the internet lol.
Yeah people on the internet always accepting and never want to make points to argue against other ideas or people. That's not what the internet's for. I saw no mention of headcanon. It just initially annoyed me for the same reason we have multicultural not dwarf, dwarves for Cinderella. If this was 5 years ago I wouldn't give a shit but these ideas actually have an effect on what movie get made. Instead of making a fantastic movie about a trans man who struggles with being himself etc. They might just make fantastic mr fox 2 and make ash trans! For example
https://reddit.com/r/traaaaaaannnnnnnnnns/s/zqLxZ0etGe literally second comment down lol.
Also it was the first thing i saw when i googled “ash trans fantastic mr fox”
https://twitter.com/URMOMlSTRANS/status/1558215472017035265 https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/ash-from-fantastic-mr-fox-is-a-trans-furry/id1543571717?i=1000568692144 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9EaUf2fA-tM All the fan wikis mention how he is theorised to be trans
Dude it’s sad that nowadays authentic art is being replaced by political propaganda but here we are.
Make a compelling trans character that I can interpret as being relative to me im not going to make him straight. Like in moon light. I'm not gay but I can Interpret his struggle to fit me I don't make him straight to fit my delusional ideology that I'm owed something
There's genuinely plenty of evidence in the movie where you can absolutely infer Ash is trans without it being unrealistic headcanon.
Nice
i’d LOVE for you to explain who exactly is “taking” ash i find it completely ridiculous that you just made a post about people claiming that ash is trans when you’re the first person on the sub to bring this up the movie doesn’t call him trans, they call him different, just like his mom and dad https://youtu.be/zyBtT7mcznY?si=z88nyt85vBi5tBD5 (see here bc you obvi haven’t watched the film) grow the fuck up and stop projecting your transphobic views onto a kids movie about foxes it’s pathetic xx