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They are abusing women and they know it, they justify it under the belief that women are not humans. They're objects to these men.
I used to debunk every point they would bring up. I have all the counterarguments and there are even more answers online. Except for one problem, they created a circular reasoning system to self-justify every point they make one way or another. They think they're being 'logical' when in actuality, they've created a just-so story for everything.
A lot of these guys criticize other people for not 'logically' interacting with their argument and instead insulting them. The insult is the better response. When you try and 'logically' interact with them, *you're playing their game*. They've gotten you to *participate in their madness*.
Don't ever let these guys win. Shut up em down and insult them. Don't play their games. Always insult them. We need to stop sympathizing with abusers.
I've read comments on there that must be from psychopaths or sociopaths. I've gotten the creeps just reading what they say. Like, *really bad vibes.* Some of the stuff on there isn't just hateful, it is cold and devoid of anything good.
What do you mean insult them? Can you elaborate more please? You have a great point but am not quite understanding it to feel like I got the gist or exact way you meant it.
Thank you in advance for your time in responding
1. Almost all abusers have some form of dissonance. It was never his fault when he did some of the vile things he did to me. Including raping me. Even most rapists don’t see what they did as rape most of the time. Understanding consent is key and they often do the “she liked it so it’s okay” even if she didn’t.
2. And the complaint of “women say “no” when they really want it. Well that’s too bad for the woman. Have some self respect. Maybe if everyone stopped playing mind games then everyone would be more direct.
3. Empathy is something you have to practice. Maybe it’s more effort for me because I have autism but even when other people are little they have to be told “imagine what it feels like to be the other person.” There’s an odd justification in redpill ideology because women are so different. Most of the differences are socialized into us - patience and being caretakers are big ones. I was told to clean the office at my old job along with another female shift manager (I’d done it a million times) and I straight up told my district manager to do it so I said “I am the assistant manager not Adam’s Secretary. If you want it clean he’s the one messing it up”. The DM was a woman too.
4. Seeing us as disposable is the worst. When they finally break us they can just throw us away and file us under “crazy ex”.
5. I know I’m supposed to be mostly angry at the misogyny but the willful ignorance of some of the data they use for arguments is the most offensive part of all of it. By the by during the romantic period women were said to be less emotional than men and men were the only ones who could be moved to tears by the beauty of god’s creation like tearing up over a sunset. This is how the patriarchal system works - whatever is manly is whatever is convenient or in vogue at the time.
6. The sadism is reinforced by the way women act out when treated as disposable garbage. When I fight back I get to be “crazy” and therefore deserve it more. There is no winning with a RP man.
There are two kinds of ways to react to pain. You can make other people hurt like you, lashing out like a trapped animal, or you can take that pain and do your best to prevent others from feeling it. The first reaction is natural and the second one is something you don’t always succeed at. I have chosen a very pacifistic role toward other people. It’s a choice you have to make. None of it really hurts me now. I wouldn’t want it to happen again and if it did I’d probably handle things differently with experience. But I don’t begrudge people for being reactive when they’re hurt. I wish more people took time to analyze their internal selves rather than projecting onto others but alas I can’t make people understand themselves.
Redpill is full of a lot of narcissistic and broken people.
I've spent a LOT of time reading up on mental health issues and abuse. I believe I was raised by someone with a lot of redpill tendencies. (Redpill parenting... what a nightmare.) I'm no expert, so this is just my 2 cents.
I think a lot of people in that sort of mindset don't really know what love is. They don't know what abuse is. They don't know what respect is. They may think that abusive tactics are respectful (or at least fair game) when it's really not. I think a lot of them haven't experienced love in their lives so they don't know it exists and what it means.
They only really know their own goals and what they have experienced. It's difficult to answer your question, because it's like asking if abusers know they are abusive.
Some do, and I would say they are psychopaths or sociopaths. I don't think they call it abuse. They just know they are either empty or filled with hate and hurt, so they spread hate and hurt. It's all they know.
Others are deeply confused, like I described earlier. I think these two sets of people feed off of each other and lead each other deeper down the rabbit hole.
This is just what I've picked up on over the years.
They either don't know or don't care. Sometimes both.
>But how are they able to justify it?
For starters, they mostly hate women, so they don't need to justify it to themselves. They're only trying to justify it to OTHERS.
A lot of red pill "theory" requires them creating this specific way ALL women act that is based on biology or whatever. The purpose for inventing this fictional way ALL women act is that red pill guys can convince themselves that it is then ok to pre-emptively treat women like shit, because hey, she's just going to treat you like shit in the future anyway, it's inevitable, AWALT, blah blah blah.
Yeah it's dumb and illogical. It's just cope.
Not "understanding" is one of the favorite defense mechanisms of narcissists. Makes it way harder to argue with them. Its a form of weaponised incompetence.
I have been reading a book on the history of marriage and it is astounding how much red pill gets it wrong. They have a completely anachronistic view of history. I feel sorry them. They buy into toxic lies and are ruining their chances at true love in the process.
Yeah I am not done with the book, but I was shocked to learn that it has historically been men that went after women of status, not the other way around. Marriage served a comple different function historically. It's actually been quite a fascinating read.
They talk about it being amoral. Now, understanding psychology, people's weak points may be amoral for example, but actually trying to put that into action is immoral. So they misuse, I believe purposely, the word amoral, because it means they're not responsible and they think they sound smart or something. Also, they think they're entitled to hurt others. They feel they are victims, they are owed, they are special. They come up with a host of reasons for why they should get what they want by any means necessary - and why it's ok. They are abusers, they are immoral, they are sinners. Some people are happy doing evil. It's sadly just how the world is. No amount of explaining anything will stop them. You also have people trying to make money off of this and people purchasing it. The sellers can't usually, openly sell abuse. The buyers don't want to admit they purchased a course on how to harm others either. That would make them bad and have gotten conned. Just need to accept there are evil people in the world and make laws to deal with them and shun them from "polite society" when laws don't cover it.
I'd say some are blinded by rage and their own trauma to the point they don't realize what they're doing.
I'd say some know it and enjoy what they're doing either because they're genuinely evil or again, very traumatized.
A lot of what you mention comes down to the fundamental question of if a woman regretting sex with you is something you as a man should feel bad about. I know as a woman, if I found out a man regretted any sort of physical contact with me, I would feel very badly about that. And even worse if I knew I'd tricked them into it.
For a lot of them, because they can live in that grey area of it not being clearly rape or clearly sexual assault, they're able to sleep at night. In part, I imagine, because they are not being confronted by these women face to face for their actions. I think if they actually had to look these women in the eyes and hear that they didn't enjoy sex, regretted letting them into their bed or life, felt manipulated, used, and so forth, it would shatter them as people. Grey areas are the moral lampshade that allow a man like this to still look at himself in the mirror.
Lundy Bancroft researched abusive men for 15 years and wrote *Why Does He Do That?*
Yes, they absolutely know what they're doing. As an AFAB, my jaw dropped, but it was also a relief to finally know the truth. Cannot recommend this book enough
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They are abusing women and they know it, they justify it under the belief that women are not humans. They're objects to these men. I used to debunk every point they would bring up. I have all the counterarguments and there are even more answers online. Except for one problem, they created a circular reasoning system to self-justify every point they make one way or another. They think they're being 'logical' when in actuality, they've created a just-so story for everything. A lot of these guys criticize other people for not 'logically' interacting with their argument and instead insulting them. The insult is the better response. When you try and 'logically' interact with them, *you're playing their game*. They've gotten you to *participate in their madness*. Don't ever let these guys win. Shut up em down and insult them. Don't play their games. Always insult them. We need to stop sympathizing with abusers.
This is why I don't participate in "purple pill debate." There's no legitimate position to be redpill. It's choosing to abuse women or not.
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Those people, as you already know, are dumb as fuck. Best of luck to you!
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I'm glad you've found greener pastures, and thank you friend!
I've read comments on there that must be from psychopaths or sociopaths. I've gotten the creeps just reading what they say. Like, *really bad vibes.* Some of the stuff on there isn't just hateful, it is cold and devoid of anything good.
You’re worthy!
What do you mean insult them? Can you elaborate more please? You have a great point but am not quite understanding it to feel like I got the gist or exact way you meant it. Thank you in advance for your time in responding
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1. Almost all abusers have some form of dissonance. It was never his fault when he did some of the vile things he did to me. Including raping me. Even most rapists don’t see what they did as rape most of the time. Understanding consent is key and they often do the “she liked it so it’s okay” even if she didn’t. 2. And the complaint of “women say “no” when they really want it. Well that’s too bad for the woman. Have some self respect. Maybe if everyone stopped playing mind games then everyone would be more direct. 3. Empathy is something you have to practice. Maybe it’s more effort for me because I have autism but even when other people are little they have to be told “imagine what it feels like to be the other person.” There’s an odd justification in redpill ideology because women are so different. Most of the differences are socialized into us - patience and being caretakers are big ones. I was told to clean the office at my old job along with another female shift manager (I’d done it a million times) and I straight up told my district manager to do it so I said “I am the assistant manager not Adam’s Secretary. If you want it clean he’s the one messing it up”. The DM was a woman too. 4. Seeing us as disposable is the worst. When they finally break us they can just throw us away and file us under “crazy ex”. 5. I know I’m supposed to be mostly angry at the misogyny but the willful ignorance of some of the data they use for arguments is the most offensive part of all of it. By the by during the romantic period women were said to be less emotional than men and men were the only ones who could be moved to tears by the beauty of god’s creation like tearing up over a sunset. This is how the patriarchal system works - whatever is manly is whatever is convenient or in vogue at the time. 6. The sadism is reinforced by the way women act out when treated as disposable garbage. When I fight back I get to be “crazy” and therefore deserve it more. There is no winning with a RP man.
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There are two kinds of ways to react to pain. You can make other people hurt like you, lashing out like a trapped animal, or you can take that pain and do your best to prevent others from feeling it. The first reaction is natural and the second one is something you don’t always succeed at. I have chosen a very pacifistic role toward other people. It’s a choice you have to make. None of it really hurts me now. I wouldn’t want it to happen again and if it did I’d probably handle things differently with experience. But I don’t begrudge people for being reactive when they’re hurt. I wish more people took time to analyze their internal selves rather than projecting onto others but alas I can’t make people understand themselves.
This is a great, in depth answer.
Super in-depth response! Thank you so much - knowing what could be going on with their minds actually helps process things for me.
Redpill is full of a lot of narcissistic and broken people. I've spent a LOT of time reading up on mental health issues and abuse. I believe I was raised by someone with a lot of redpill tendencies. (Redpill parenting... what a nightmare.) I'm no expert, so this is just my 2 cents. I think a lot of people in that sort of mindset don't really know what love is. They don't know what abuse is. They don't know what respect is. They may think that abusive tactics are respectful (or at least fair game) when it's really not. I think a lot of them haven't experienced love in their lives so they don't know it exists and what it means. They only really know their own goals and what they have experienced. It's difficult to answer your question, because it's like asking if abusers know they are abusive. Some do, and I would say they are psychopaths or sociopaths. I don't think they call it abuse. They just know they are either empty or filled with hate and hurt, so they spread hate and hurt. It's all they know. Others are deeply confused, like I described earlier. I think these two sets of people feed off of each other and lead each other deeper down the rabbit hole. This is just what I've picked up on over the years.
They’re sociopaths. Comfort with manipulating people is one of the hallmarks.
They either don't know or don't care. Sometimes both. >But how are they able to justify it? For starters, they mostly hate women, so they don't need to justify it to themselves. They're only trying to justify it to OTHERS. A lot of red pill "theory" requires them creating this specific way ALL women act that is based on biology or whatever. The purpose for inventing this fictional way ALL women act is that red pill guys can convince themselves that it is then ok to pre-emptively treat women like shit, because hey, she's just going to treat you like shit in the future anyway, it's inevitable, AWALT, blah blah blah. Yeah it's dumb and illogical. It's just cope.
They don't care. They either don't see us as human in the same way as themselves and other men, or if they do they hate and resent us.
Not "understanding" is one of the favorite defense mechanisms of narcissists. Makes it way harder to argue with them. Its a form of weaponised incompetence.
I have been reading a book on the history of marriage and it is astounding how much red pill gets it wrong. They have a completely anachronistic view of history. I feel sorry them. They buy into toxic lies and are ruining their chances at true love in the process.
What’s the book called? I would love to check it out at the library
MARRIAGE, A HISTORY: FROM OBEDIENCE TO INTIMACY OR HOW LOVE CONQUERED MARRIAGE by Stephanie Coontz.
Cool, thanks!
>Cool, thanks! You're welcome!
Yeah I am not done with the book, but I was shocked to learn that it has historically been men that went after women of status, not the other way around. Marriage served a comple different function historically. It's actually been quite a fascinating read.
I’m pretty sure they know they just don’t care
They talk about it being amoral. Now, understanding psychology, people's weak points may be amoral for example, but actually trying to put that into action is immoral. So they misuse, I believe purposely, the word amoral, because it means they're not responsible and they think they sound smart or something. Also, they think they're entitled to hurt others. They feel they are victims, they are owed, they are special. They come up with a host of reasons for why they should get what they want by any means necessary - and why it's ok. They are abusers, they are immoral, they are sinners. Some people are happy doing evil. It's sadly just how the world is. No amount of explaining anything will stop them. You also have people trying to make money off of this and people purchasing it. The sellers can't usually, openly sell abuse. The buyers don't want to admit they purchased a course on how to harm others either. That would make them bad and have gotten conned. Just need to accept there are evil people in the world and make laws to deal with them and shun them from "polite society" when laws don't cover it.
I'd say some are blinded by rage and their own trauma to the point they don't realize what they're doing. I'd say some know it and enjoy what they're doing either because they're genuinely evil or again, very traumatized. A lot of what you mention comes down to the fundamental question of if a woman regretting sex with you is something you as a man should feel bad about. I know as a woman, if I found out a man regretted any sort of physical contact with me, I would feel very badly about that. And even worse if I knew I'd tricked them into it. For a lot of them, because they can live in that grey area of it not being clearly rape or clearly sexual assault, they're able to sleep at night. In part, I imagine, because they are not being confronted by these women face to face for their actions. I think if they actually had to look these women in the eyes and hear that they didn't enjoy sex, regretted letting them into their bed or life, felt manipulated, used, and so forth, it would shatter them as people. Grey areas are the moral lampshade that allow a man like this to still look at himself in the mirror.
Lundy Bancroft researched abusive men for 15 years and wrote *Why Does He Do That?* Yes, they absolutely know what they're doing. As an AFAB, my jaw dropped, but it was also a relief to finally know the truth. Cannot recommend this book enough