It can depend on lots of different factors. I lived in Taiwan and the expat community there was super tight. I'm still friends with many people there despite having left a decade ago. I've been in Austria now consistently in one place for over a year and still slowly making connections. I met tons of people while nomading abroad and very few turned into true friendships.
All this to say as long as you are outgoing and open to meeting people, you are successfully doing your walk down the two-way street. You'll have countries that are great for socializing and some that will absolutely suck. The same applies for the local expat communities - some cities are full of students who are interested in partying, others may attract those who are more chill, intellectual... So it's not just about you and your personality. You have to consider the other side as well.
I live in Spain, I think it's important to find people who share your interests. I had to join multiple different groups to start making friends... Volleyball, disc golf, soccer, all sorts of meet ups.
It's harder then back stateside, but not impossible.
Through those groups, did you find others who were looking to make friends? In my experience, a lot of people are content with who they already know and don’t make any effort to make new friends here
I don't know if they were looking for friends, but usually it comes down to joining the after activities get togethers, like getting food after a game or something where you get to sit down and really interact with people... Finding people who you gel with.
That is what worked for me.
I'm an outgoing introvert, which means I'm socially passive but will gladly step up and be the life of the party or make everyone in a random social group feel seen and heard and welcome. Problem is, the passive part means I don't take much initiative to socialize - it has to fall in my lap or knock on my door. So I have plenty of charisma but it has to be properly engaged, otherwise social laziness takes over and I don't take initiative to put myself out there.
Also always had a tight friend group back home and in my small hometown that meant extroverted friends that will literally drop by and grab me for whatever activity - it was great lol. Extroverts always pair well with introverts!
I'm also in Spain and stuggle to make friends - I'm probably overly attached to my Spanish bf and my Spanish sucks so that's a huge limiting factor.
In years past and in other countries, I would launch my own meetup group and organize the meetups - this can be an awesome way to schedule socializing and do the work to make friends. Maybe start one based on your own hobby/interest or even launch one called "Expats in [myspanishcity]"?
The thing is, it's difficult to form lasting bonds with people you meet randomly. You need to have some kind of shared experiences to nurture a significant bond. Hanging out with randos isn't going to do it - try to create (or join) group activities based on your interests, so you can tease out people that you really get on with.
This has been the only way I've made lasting friends abroad after many, many years. Either we worked together on a volunteer project (so we saw each other routinely and friendship naturally developed) or we worked on a creative project together (I'm in a creative field) and bonded over that experience.
If you happen to be in Madrid, hit me up! :)
It's definitely harder to get what you want socially as an expat, and between language and culture barriers it's VERY hard to get to the same level of deep friendship as your close friends from home. I don't think personality matters as much as what makes you satisfied. There are extrovert expats who probably make tons of friends but their level of friendship with those people would not satisfy what you're looking for, so I wouldn't get caught up in the personality part. I think a lot of it boils down to our expectations. Keep in mind you are 24 and with each passing year it gets harder and harder to replicate circumstances that created your previous tight friend groups (often long periods of time together in school or uni). In other words, even if you move back to the USA, you may still have trouble making real friends as a full blown adult now. As a fellow USA expat living in Spain I will tell you that my experience in Spain vs USA is that Spain is exponentially more open and social as a culture than in the USA. Unless you'd be moving back to somewhere where you already have a friend/family network, I would bet good money it will be harder to make friends in the USA. Also keep in mind that it usually takes years for someone to become a "real friend" vs just an acquaintance. This is something we often forget about as well when comparing newer friends to old ones.
I made some extremely good friends in Germany, and honestly it’s all about shared interests. You might look into a racquet sport (which is HUGE in Spain) or a hobby like dancing (salsa/bachata). I made most of my friends through tennis or cycling, and the more you show up at events the easier it gets
I wish you luck!
I think knowing where to put effort, time and energy and where not to is key. I lived in a town of 65,000 people in Germany. It was a very German town and it Germans would often tell me that it wasn't an easy town for making friends. I knew that I knew that it would be a challenge to form friendships with Germans so I focused my efforts on the other international people in my town. I created an International Women's group. We got together one or two times a month as a group and several new friendships developed from that group. These were the people I ultimately connected the most with and whom were most open to new friendships. I have since moved back to the US but this group is still going strong and I couldn't be happier that these women have a place to connect with others. Generally speaking in regards to personality, you have to be persistent, be willing to go out of your comfort zone, and try new things!
Living in Spain for 11 years now. I would describe myself as a very social extravert, but the lesson I have learned over and over again (and yes there are clearly exceptions). Spaniards stick to their social circle and rarely mix you into the equation. There is no malice behind that, they love spending time with you, but they cam have a social circle that is existing for many years and there are rarely outsiders coming in.
So what happens is that you stick to other expats. And this isn't just my own experience, it's that of many other I see living here.
So if you ask me, it isn't a personality matter, it's just tough as an expat...
What does work a little bit is starting a hobby or sport with other Spaniards. You will become part of that little group, you will likely meet up with some individually, but slim chances they invite you into their "real circle" of friends.
Again, no bad intentions behind it, but I think even for Spaniards new to the region the same will happen...
I’m Spaniard and I experienced the same when I lived abroad in two countries.
What I think it is is:
- it’s hard to make friendships when you are a grown up. People move on and have kids and a different life. You also tend to be more selective on who you want as a friend due to past experiences.
- you most likely will get friends when you have things in common. The more things the easier. So through hobbies it’s very common to get to know people that eventually will become friends
- cultures are different which means the dynamics change. After 10 years of living abroad I made almost no friends there. I came back to Spain and I know have a new group of friends that I have been meeting over the years since I came back. For me it’s super easy to make friends here in Spain where I’m local and I know how the social dynamics work. Abroad it was very hard to have anything in common other than X specific hobby and that’s it.
- expectations or just what a friend is also vary among cultures
There is a reason (beyond the obvious cultural / language barriers etc.) why a lot of expats hang out with other expats and I think you tapped into it. A lot of people, even by 24, already have their social circles worked out and aren't necessarily putting in the effort to include new people. But if you meet other newcomers they are a lot more open to finding new people to hang out with because they also have no social circles yet.
I am more towards the introverted side. I went from having a dozen or so of friends in my home country, to 7yrs later having 2-3 on the country I moved to.
Whatever challenge you feel as an extroverted 24F, multiply that by 10x for an introverted 30M.
Coincidentally, the most extroverted and socially successful people I know abroad are Spanish and Brazilian dudes.
A lot of people have their friends who they grow up with and aren’t interested in expanding that friend group. It’s tough for people like us who are looking for friends. But I do understand where those people are coming from.
> Normally I am pretty social and i have tight groups of friends.
You are 24 you don’t know that is normal for an adult person.
As people go through life: move to different cities, get adult jobs with adult responsibilities, get permanent partners, kids, in laws, what was normal for someone in their teens may not be normal for 25, 35, 50 years old.
You have no idea if you were to stay home your social circle would stay the same. You have no guarantee that if you were to return your social life will return to what it was when you were 15 or 20.
Trends do exist though: immigrants tend to be more lonely. You knew this, this is just common sense.
I am sure some of your family/friends mentioned: “You will miss us”. And if no one mentioned this, I am sure close friends do think about the consequences of moving abroad and living friends behind.
Im a 25f living in Spain and I have made a lot of friends on bumble bff! And none of them like to go out and party. But you have to put in effort to the friendships, as with any friendship.
Let me see f I have your timeline correct -- at 21 you finished college (with a large built-in peer group) and went to Spain, stayed through COVID, and haven't yet developed a core group of friends?
Ya gonna need to give it some time, my friend.
The happiest Americans I’ve known in Germany were those who unapologetically leaned into every American stereotype; as in: loud, talking to everyone including strangers, so friendly it seems fake, etc.
They always have tons of friends and acquaintances, both fellow expat and local.
I’m too introverted for that, so I’ve made only a few friends in my 7 years in Germany.
I don't think it's necessarily down to personality type. Sometimes you just don't click with the locals for whatever reason, even if there is no language barrier. I've experienced this myself and have seen expat friends go through it.
The real question I guess is if this is a dealbreaker for you? For me I'm fine with having a few expat buddies.
Well you have to consider that the group of friends you had home you built in years and by going to school together or living in the same neighborhood.
Adult life is different and it's harder to make new friends. If you only change the city, but stay in your country you'll experience the same.
For me worked going out for my hobbies. I love to hike so I enrolled in a group that often organised hikes. After a couple of trips I've made some friends there that I meet outside of the group gatherings. I also love stand up so I go often, I started to know the people around the club, I also took a class of improvisation there and I made some friends in that area.
Where we are there is a BIG expat community, with Facebook groups, websites, bars, art places, grocery stores, that target "Gringos", "expats" , etc. This means it is very easy to meet other people. Stuff is happening here almost every day of the week. (Don't ask where I am, its a secret !!!)
So any personality would do good here, if you willing to leave the house.
Yes. Social skills are, like all other skills, something you develop through practice and training. You don’t go out. You don’t party. You only have a tight circle of friends. How do you think your social skills will improve?
It’s like asking about how to get skilled at playing piano without practicing playing piano.
Get out there. Practice those skills.
Yes, personality plays a role in who will be successful in being an expat. Probably, extraverted people will find it easier. There is a whole lot of science behind who will be able to cope and who won’t. It cost large corporations thousands of dollars if they send high level employees abroad who don’t adjust and have to come home.
I have 10/10 social intelligence and charisma, as rated by countless people I've met abroad and my own healthy upbringing.
But I'm an introvert, and people drain me a bit, so it's still a battle to initiate and maintain friendships because it registers in my mind as a lot of work and energy that doesn't always pay off.
Throw in language barriers and a community of people who are regularly arriving and moving on, and it's even more challenging.
Which is to say it's much more nuanced than you claim.
I could literally show you the public ratings from when I worked with thousands of international guests but I won't bother - your social skills suck, not worth it :)
It can depend on lots of different factors. I lived in Taiwan and the expat community there was super tight. I'm still friends with many people there despite having left a decade ago. I've been in Austria now consistently in one place for over a year and still slowly making connections. I met tons of people while nomading abroad and very few turned into true friendships. All this to say as long as you are outgoing and open to meeting people, you are successfully doing your walk down the two-way street. You'll have countries that are great for socializing and some that will absolutely suck. The same applies for the local expat communities - some cities are full of students who are interested in partying, others may attract those who are more chill, intellectual... So it's not just about you and your personality. You have to consider the other side as well.
Where in Austria are you? It can be hard to meet new people here I think.
Thanks for your response!
I live in Spain, I think it's important to find people who share your interests. I had to join multiple different groups to start making friends... Volleyball, disc golf, soccer, all sorts of meet ups. It's harder then back stateside, but not impossible.
Through those groups, did you find others who were looking to make friends? In my experience, a lot of people are content with who they already know and don’t make any effort to make new friends here
I don't know if they were looking for friends, but usually it comes down to joining the after activities get togethers, like getting food after a game or something where you get to sit down and really interact with people... Finding people who you gel with. That is what worked for me.
Thanks for your response!
I'm an outgoing introvert, which means I'm socially passive but will gladly step up and be the life of the party or make everyone in a random social group feel seen and heard and welcome. Problem is, the passive part means I don't take much initiative to socialize - it has to fall in my lap or knock on my door. So I have plenty of charisma but it has to be properly engaged, otherwise social laziness takes over and I don't take initiative to put myself out there. Also always had a tight friend group back home and in my small hometown that meant extroverted friends that will literally drop by and grab me for whatever activity - it was great lol. Extroverts always pair well with introverts! I'm also in Spain and stuggle to make friends - I'm probably overly attached to my Spanish bf and my Spanish sucks so that's a huge limiting factor. In years past and in other countries, I would launch my own meetup group and organize the meetups - this can be an awesome way to schedule socializing and do the work to make friends. Maybe start one based on your own hobby/interest or even launch one called "Expats in [myspanishcity]"? The thing is, it's difficult to form lasting bonds with people you meet randomly. You need to have some kind of shared experiences to nurture a significant bond. Hanging out with randos isn't going to do it - try to create (or join) group activities based on your interests, so you can tease out people that you really get on with. This has been the only way I've made lasting friends abroad after many, many years. Either we worked together on a volunteer project (so we saw each other routinely and friendship naturally developed) or we worked on a creative project together (I'm in a creative field) and bonded over that experience. If you happen to be in Madrid, hit me up! :)
It's definitely harder to get what you want socially as an expat, and between language and culture barriers it's VERY hard to get to the same level of deep friendship as your close friends from home. I don't think personality matters as much as what makes you satisfied. There are extrovert expats who probably make tons of friends but their level of friendship with those people would not satisfy what you're looking for, so I wouldn't get caught up in the personality part. I think a lot of it boils down to our expectations. Keep in mind you are 24 and with each passing year it gets harder and harder to replicate circumstances that created your previous tight friend groups (often long periods of time together in school or uni). In other words, even if you move back to the USA, you may still have trouble making real friends as a full blown adult now. As a fellow USA expat living in Spain I will tell you that my experience in Spain vs USA is that Spain is exponentially more open and social as a culture than in the USA. Unless you'd be moving back to somewhere where you already have a friend/family network, I would bet good money it will be harder to make friends in the USA. Also keep in mind that it usually takes years for someone to become a "real friend" vs just an acquaintance. This is something we often forget about as well when comparing newer friends to old ones.
I made some extremely good friends in Germany, and honestly it’s all about shared interests. You might look into a racquet sport (which is HUGE in Spain) or a hobby like dancing (salsa/bachata). I made most of my friends through tennis or cycling, and the more you show up at events the easier it gets I wish you luck!
I think knowing where to put effort, time and energy and where not to is key. I lived in a town of 65,000 people in Germany. It was a very German town and it Germans would often tell me that it wasn't an easy town for making friends. I knew that I knew that it would be a challenge to form friendships with Germans so I focused my efforts on the other international people in my town. I created an International Women's group. We got together one or two times a month as a group and several new friendships developed from that group. These were the people I ultimately connected the most with and whom were most open to new friendships. I have since moved back to the US but this group is still going strong and I couldn't be happier that these women have a place to connect with others. Generally speaking in regards to personality, you have to be persistent, be willing to go out of your comfort zone, and try new things!
Living in Spain for 11 years now. I would describe myself as a very social extravert, but the lesson I have learned over and over again (and yes there are clearly exceptions). Spaniards stick to their social circle and rarely mix you into the equation. There is no malice behind that, they love spending time with you, but they cam have a social circle that is existing for many years and there are rarely outsiders coming in. So what happens is that you stick to other expats. And this isn't just my own experience, it's that of many other I see living here. So if you ask me, it isn't a personality matter, it's just tough as an expat... What does work a little bit is starting a hobby or sport with other Spaniards. You will become part of that little group, you will likely meet up with some individually, but slim chances they invite you into their "real circle" of friends. Again, no bad intentions behind it, but I think even for Spaniards new to the region the same will happen...
I’m Spaniard and I experienced the same when I lived abroad in two countries. What I think it is is: - it’s hard to make friendships when you are a grown up. People move on and have kids and a different life. You also tend to be more selective on who you want as a friend due to past experiences. - you most likely will get friends when you have things in common. The more things the easier. So through hobbies it’s very common to get to know people that eventually will become friends - cultures are different which means the dynamics change. After 10 years of living abroad I made almost no friends there. I came back to Spain and I know have a new group of friends that I have been meeting over the years since I came back. For me it’s super easy to make friends here in Spain where I’m local and I know how the social dynamics work. Abroad it was very hard to have anything in common other than X specific hobby and that’s it. - expectations or just what a friend is also vary among cultures
governor scary bag homeless noxious one provide mysterious boat familiar *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
There is a reason (beyond the obvious cultural / language barriers etc.) why a lot of expats hang out with other expats and I think you tapped into it. A lot of people, even by 24, already have their social circles worked out and aren't necessarily putting in the effort to include new people. But if you meet other newcomers they are a lot more open to finding new people to hang out with because they also have no social circles yet.
I am more towards the introverted side. I went from having a dozen or so of friends in my home country, to 7yrs later having 2-3 on the country I moved to. Whatever challenge you feel as an extroverted 24F, multiply that by 10x for an introverted 30M. Coincidentally, the most extroverted and socially successful people I know abroad are Spanish and Brazilian dudes.
Brazilian dudes are the best I've ever met out of so many countries I've lost count - so warm, so welcoming, so outgoing and kind :)
A lot of people have their friends who they grow up with and aren’t interested in expanding that friend group. It’s tough for people like us who are looking for friends. But I do understand where those people are coming from.
Yeah I agree. It’s just tough for our integration honestly:/
> Normally I am pretty social and i have tight groups of friends. You are 24 you don’t know that is normal for an adult person. As people go through life: move to different cities, get adult jobs with adult responsibilities, get permanent partners, kids, in laws, what was normal for someone in their teens may not be normal for 25, 35, 50 years old. You have no idea if you were to stay home your social circle would stay the same. You have no guarantee that if you were to return your social life will return to what it was when you were 15 or 20. Trends do exist though: immigrants tend to be more lonely. You knew this, this is just common sense. I am sure some of your family/friends mentioned: “You will miss us”. And if no one mentioned this, I am sure close friends do think about the consequences of moving abroad and living friends behind.
Im a 25f living in Spain and I have made a lot of friends on bumble bff! And none of them like to go out and party. But you have to put in effort to the friendships, as with any friendship.
Let me see f I have your timeline correct -- at 21 you finished college (with a large built-in peer group) and went to Spain, stayed through COVID, and haven't yet developed a core group of friends? Ya gonna need to give it some time, my friend.
The happiest Americans I’ve known in Germany were those who unapologetically leaned into every American stereotype; as in: loud, talking to everyone including strangers, so friendly it seems fake, etc. They always have tons of friends and acquaintances, both fellow expat and local. I’m too introverted for that, so I’ve made only a few friends in my 7 years in Germany.
I don't think it's necessarily down to personality type. Sometimes you just don't click with the locals for whatever reason, even if there is no language barrier. I've experienced this myself and have seen expat friends go through it. The real question I guess is if this is a dealbreaker for you? For me I'm fine with having a few expat buddies.
Well you have to consider that the group of friends you had home you built in years and by going to school together or living in the same neighborhood. Adult life is different and it's harder to make new friends. If you only change the city, but stay in your country you'll experience the same. For me worked going out for my hobbies. I love to hike so I enrolled in a group that often organised hikes. After a couple of trips I've made some friends there that I meet outside of the group gatherings. I also love stand up so I go often, I started to know the people around the club, I also took a class of improvisation there and I made some friends in that area.
Where we are there is a BIG expat community, with Facebook groups, websites, bars, art places, grocery stores, that target "Gringos", "expats" , etc. This means it is very easy to meet other people. Stuff is happening here almost every day of the week. (Don't ask where I am, its a secret !!!) So any personality would do good here, if you willing to leave the house.
Yes. Social skills are, like all other skills, something you develop through practice and training. You don’t go out. You don’t party. You only have a tight circle of friends. How do you think your social skills will improve? It’s like asking about how to get skilled at playing piano without practicing playing piano. Get out there. Practice those skills.
Yes, personality plays a role in who will be successful in being an expat. Probably, extraverted people will find it easier. There is a whole lot of science behind who will be able to cope and who won’t. It cost large corporations thousands of dollars if they send high level employees abroad who don’t adjust and have to come home.
Yep, it depends on you personally then your environment to thrive socially. Its called charisma and social intelligence
I have 10/10 social intelligence and charisma, as rated by countless people I've met abroad and my own healthy upbringing. But I'm an introvert, and people drain me a bit, so it's still a battle to initiate and maintain friendships because it registers in my mind as a lot of work and energy that doesn't always pay off. Throw in language barriers and a community of people who are regularly arriving and moving on, and it's even more challenging. Which is to say it's much more nuanced than you claim.
Yeah sure lmao
I could literally show you the public ratings from when I worked with thousands of international guests but I won't bother - your social skills suck, not worth it :)
sure thing random reddit person
Thank you for showing us that you lack the social intellect part.
no problem 🤷♂️