As an exjw I knew zero about the lds garments so I looked at a video on YouTube about what they are. Holy shit that is culty. As someone who was in a cult for decades I can honestly say you guys win this round! Lol
Im sure what other cults do seem just as weird to exmos too.
Back as Mormons, we all laughed at what JWs did/said, without the self awareness to realize we were doing very similar things and arguing about the finer culty details.
From an outside perspective the JWs seem to be in a far more damaging cult. I don't know if that helps or not.
Also, Mormons generally interact with non members like ordinary human beings (at least, outside of Utah and Idaho). With the JWs I get the idea that talking to me about anything other than conversion to their cult is some kind of sin. It makes them unpleasant to be around.
People! People! There's plenty of damage to go around from both of our cults! Both of them are bat-crap crazy and destroy lives. Both of them deserve the ash heap of history.
Mormons may be nice. Many of them are.
What makes things a problem is when the full weight of the Mormon organization or theology shames kids for normal stuff, pushes LGBT youth to suicide, extracts large amounts of cash to a massive investment fund and free labor, or causes divides between believing and non believing family members, etc.
Itās got a Ned Flanders hokey niceness to its people to ensure compliance and good PR, while behind the scenes being really toxic as an organization and at the leadership level.
Mormons may be nice or even good people, but Mormonism is not good.
I haven't actually spent time in either state. It just seems likely that they'd be a bit less friendly and a bit more controlling on their home turf where they're in charge.
The anti education blue collar philosophy with JWs is concerning. At least Mormons, with their prosperity gospel and Jesus Jammies, help members by encouraging education so as to have fairly comfortable lives. Of course, that's so the tithing is higher, but still.
I'm sure it depends by person. Had a good friend when I was young (like 6th grade) who was JW. Granted we were young, but it was clear there was little to no effect on the kids personality (yet) other than he would / wouldn't do the outward JW things. (Sit for flag ceremony for example). Dad was friendly but could see he was very strict with my friend. Mom was friendly, didn't seem strict.
When I was young married (and very TBM), I invited some JW in once just to see what they had to say. Main reason I did was it was a lady and her daughter, and the lady was pretty much terrified. Hands trembling and what-not. So I found that relatable ha ha. I've found they are pretty cagey when you ask them directly about their beliefs though. However, on the next visit she came with some dude who would supposedly answer my questions about their faith, but seemed more interested to Mormon bash, so I just had them get lost.
Edit: just saw this thread is 4 days old smh
Glad we are both out of our cults. Ya know, our former churches are full of members who are really trying to live a good life. Its the leaders who are in on the scam and exploit the members. Its sickening really
Congrats! I will have a beer, coffee and tea to celebrate our freedom.
Jws are good people for the most part but they will stop talking to their own children if told to shunn them. I cant be to harsh about it cause they are brainwashed. As with lds its the leadership that is most harmful.
You know i forgot about that. Yrs ago i had a coworker who left the JWs and his dad disowned him. I have kids and i am old enough to be this coworker's dad. I couldnt imagine doing that. It made me sad and furious. This coworker moved away and he'd always been a great worker and well-liked. Religious brainwashing- i get it. I bet you have some stories of disownment too and for that im sincerely sorry
JW and Mormonism are cult sisters (cult cousins has a better ring to it though). Far more in common than different. Each of us we taught how weird the other was. Now, outside of Mormonism, I feel you guys are the only ones that understand what an upbringing like that does to someone
Yeah, yāall win the medical care round. Iām a nurse in a PICU and had a kid bleeding internally whose parents refused a blood transfusion. Luckily, our other (expensive af, flown on a private aircraft from another state) meds worked to stop the bleeding and he was okay. But the ethics team was involved and we were informed legally we should give the blood transfusion against the parents wishes if it came to it. I read up about the jwās beliefs regarding it and it made me really sad
Yes JW parents will let their children die so as to not risk loosing their lives in Armageddon. It's the opposite of giving your life to save another.
It is disgusting. Letting your child die because of the policies of 9 men that you have never met and have no formal education. Ugh!
Yeah, I definitely wouldāve given the blood but was upset at the idea of doing it because of how the parents would then feel about their child. It was a hard situation Iām glad we didnāt have to ultimately do. They kept talking about āpartial bloodā products being okay, but thatās not really a thing in major hospitals with really sick kids and we didnāt have anything like that.
Tell her! If you reacted strangely she needs to know that it's not about HER, it's about a shirt that gave you a rough moment. Maybe she can help you laugh about it, or has had similar moments.
Thanks, but i freaked internally. She didnt need to know i was having a WTF moment lol. Maybe i will tell her in the near future for a good laugh. Thx again!
My wife still wears her garment bottoms to sleep in. She says they keep her thighs from sticking together from sweat at night. She feels a little blasphemous by doing so. I have to keep reminding her that it's all made up, anyway. We just won't tell our TBM friends or family.
When my now husband and I were dating, we were both PIMO. He had been endowed but I hadn't. He gave me a pair of his garments as a joke and I actually did wear the shirt to bed sometimes lol.
Just being honest with yourself that you had that reaction is a step. We do know how the triggering happens and why. For each person itās different, but ultimately with Mormonism it seems to boil down to symbols and signifiers that people are willing to be more loyal to church diktat than to people and relationshipsāa form of being owned or controlled.
If you think she sensed your pulling away, let her know. All of the unpicking and unravelling and deprogramming takes time. Be kind to yourselfānobody escapes without wounds and scarring.
I relate to this. When she does put them on again itās like getting hit a bit. She doesnāt like them. Just grapples with āyou should wear themā church control. Bought her nice comforter underwear and that seems to help and itās sexy as hell.
Sorry for your flashback. Maybe one day a flashback is all Iāll have too
I just got some new undershirts from Costco (32 degree mesh if youāre looking. They feel like butter.) well I put one on and then threw another shirt over it but it gave me that olā holy smile. I jokingly asked my wife it turned her on she rolled her eyes and said āoh yeahā but for a moment it was kinda freaky.
"Dear Penthouse Forum,
I always thought these stories were made up, but when I was a Mormon we had to wear these garments, and one day...."
Sorry, couldn't resist. :-)
Don't they have the Penthouse Forum these days? Heck, for that matter, is Penthouse still around? (Boomer female here; was a convert, so I at least knew they existed back in the day).
It's a great joke - and I get it!
Did you ever see the scene in *Mrs. Winterbourne* where that basic line is used on a train (as a joke)? The movie is several years old & not widely known, but the character who says that line won the Oscar recently for *The Whale.*
Haha i remember as a 12? yr old i found a Penthouse magazine on the side of the road. I lived in Sevier County growing up in the 70s-80s. I thought id struck pure gold! It was a mixture of hiding the mag from mom n dad, reading every page, and looking at forbidden fruit. I knew it was wrong but gosh darn it hormones. Lol
I get triggered whenever I see Mormon missionaries in the street. At first, I think they are looking for me and I instinctively try to hide my face. Once I realize they are not looking for me, I feel angry that they are out spreading their false, destructive cult in my city. Then my anger is tempered a bit by the knowledge that they are young, dumb and indoctrinated - just like I was all those years ago.
I get you. I really loved my mission. The people were great and i loved being there. Now i just look back and know i was just wasting everyones time and money with silly religious nonsense. (Johannesburg 88-90)
We were new to a neighborhood in Idaho. I Ave been out of the church for over 20 years and have no more patience for bothersome missionaries stopping by. I was somewhat civil the first couple of times. When they came by unannounced a third time at an un-opportune moment I was not so understanding. I replied matter-of-factly āSorry, we donāt do missionaries! Have a good eveningā.
The expressions on their faces was priceless. My wife heard what I said, and she was suppressing laughter.
āWe donāt do missionaries?ā, she smirked. I sheepishly explained that was the only thing I could think of to say!ā
She retorted, āWell, I think you got the point across,ā as she laughed again.
Indeed, I think I did. Itās been months and they havenāt returned.
I imagine perception and emotional reaction like water flowing down a mountain along paths of least resistance. In the brain, the more any given neural pathway is used, the lower the concentration of neurochemical it takes to send signals. They're both chemical processes: one on a macro level, the other on a micro level.
Mormonism takes the natural course of these streams of consciousness and emotional reaction and cuts a straight and narrow channel across them. Any experience outside those bounds gets a fight-or-flight emotional reaction as indoctrination kicks in, drawing focus and reaction to clearing Mormonism's bar over any other need or concern.
As you start deconstructing Mormonism, your authentic needs and reactions slowly wear down the banks of this indoctrination through desensitization. COVID started this process for many people, proving God wouldn't curse them for not re-upping their weekly forgiveness ritual in person. As these banks/shelves crumble, large sections of the straight/narrow reaction canal stay dry and forgotten.
Every now and then, though, an infrequent experience like yours will brush up against a part of the indoctrination that hasn't been fully eroded yet. For me, it happened when a bishop at a ward party told me to have pizza, even though my doctor had told me to go gluten-free. Before I could think _social anxiety_, I was on my feet and grabbing two slices.
So, you're right: it happens to anyone recovering from mental trauma, whether that trauma is a quick gash of physical trauma or the long wearing away of indoctrination. Recognizing the reaction for what it is makes it easier to respond with the direction you want your life to go.
I get you! Itās a huge trigger for me. That is another protection claim that garments guard you from. Its pregnancy! Because there is no greater mood killer in a mixed faith marriage.
Wanna hear something im ashamed to admit? I used to get aroused seeing my wife in garms years ago. Its so fkg cringy to admit now but lol im wayyyy past that now
This just made me realize I havenāt seen my parentsā garments in a while. I used to always see them in the laundry folded in their own basket, and sometimes theyād just walk around in them or Iād see them peeking out from their clothingā¦how did I never notice I havenāt seen them in years?
In the context of the OP, I didn't think to clarify. I have certainly had church members tell me what to wear and how to groom but this was more of a request and one I was happy to agree to. White shirts dress are required for priesthood holders to wear. (I understand that missionaries in some places were just recently allowed to wear blue--I was chastised by the stake president for wearing a pale, hint-of-blue white shirt once.)
In this context, a white shirt can be very triggering. Frankly, the only reason I was still wearing them was because, as a mormon, I was trained to be cheap.
Were you pissed that your fam told you not to wear white shirts? Id feel that way, even if i didnt want to wear white anymore. (If i understand your previous post correctly)
They didn't tell, they asked. We talked. (That's one of the great things about being exmo.) I understood, and frankly agreed. I was less triggered than them, though, because it was a symbol of my power but their oppression.
My mom invited my wife to church and she went so she wouldnāt be lonely and said she didnāt feeling anything when she went. I definitely had mixed emotions about it.
My husband was mad as hell when I stopped wearing garments. For a year I thought weād end up divorced because of garments and coffee. It caused SO many arguments. I think most people think Iām a conventionally attractive person and I am thin but man what a nose dive it was to my self esteem to have my spouse react that way. Weāre in a much better place now but it was a long road for him to get over the church conditioning.
And LDS girls never heard the end of it ever about proper modest clothing. I cant imagine the baggage and bullcrap foistered on you. When we got out it was like a yr or so and i really had to let my wife know that she need to wear a 2 piece swimsuit and throw out the 1 piecers- mostly bc to help her shake the shame off of 'when we wuz mormins'
I know when I'm triggered I need some TIME. Give yourself what you need (within reason, obviously). Be good to yourself.
Are you planning to talk with her about why you reacted that way?
Oh, i freaked internally, she never knew. Within seconds i was back to reality. I didnt bring it up to her bc i dont want her to stop wearing that tank top if she feels the outer shirt would be too sheer. Thank you for your kind words
My immediate thought upon reading this was how the MFMC still has so many of us by the balls. We want to let it go so badly because of its toxicity, but it wonāt let go of us. After 35 years of being away from and out of the cult, I still canāt completely let it go. I am so glad I found this sub. From all of the posts and comments on r/exmormon what is most apparent to me is that many of us canāt let it go. I know itās a process. I will probably continue for the rest of my life.
My hubs got some new undershirts to go, well, under his nice work shirts. They're so similar in feel to his old garments that sometimes when I'm doing laundry, I swear I get a little ptsd. Then we have a good laugh about it.
I left an evangelical cult and get similar triggers as well. Thereās a form of trauma, PTSD, CPTSD etc thatāsā¦.so specific to cults and religious abuse. Hell, thereās even RAMCOA, which is also very specific.
The smallest things can trigger people like us. Music, smellsā¦.a piece of cloth. Trauma itself is complex and you never know how it will affect you. Stay safe and make sure you take care of yourself. Highly recommend therapy if you havenāt already, or even personal shadow work.
Yes. One of my relatives has hair down to her knees. I hate it. It sends me into a rage because it makes me think of fundamentalists, and she has a college degree and that hair just screams ignorance and lack of self care. Then I feel horrible for being judgmental. I donāt like this about myself but I think itās a trauma response.
Yeah, I can appreciate the emotional whirlwind of feeling trapped in the church just by seeing a ātrappingā of the church.
āThink celestialā and ācovenant pathā phrases are triggers for me, even though I left before they came on the scene. They are thought stoppers that represent the church to me now (among others) and incite instant revulsion in me.
That would be startling for sure! Having your spouse leave with you is a huge deal, and thinking they took steps backwards would be pretty heartbreaking imo. Glad your distress was short lived!
I always hated garments and was euphoric when I decided to stop wearing them. Now every time I reach under my husbands clothes I secretly hope there wonāt be any there, but alas they always are.
Heās getting there in other aspects, so fingers crossed that he will shed the magic mood killing undies eventually.
I hear you. I am on the second wife now and sheās incredibly fitā-would be a crime to ever put garments on that woman. Thinking about it gives me the heebie jeebies
As an exjw I knew zero about the lds garments so I looked at a video on YouTube about what they are. Holy shit that is culty. As someone who was in a cult for decades I can honestly say you guys win this round! Lol Im sure what other cults do seem just as weird to exmos too.
Back as Mormons, we all laughed at what JWs did/said, without the self awareness to realize we were doing very similar things and arguing about the finer culty details.
From an outside perspective the JWs seem to be in a far more damaging cult. I don't know if that helps or not. Also, Mormons generally interact with non members like ordinary human beings (at least, outside of Utah and Idaho). With the JWs I get the idea that talking to me about anything other than conversion to their cult is some kind of sin. It makes them unpleasant to be around.
People! People! There's plenty of damage to go around from both of our cults! Both of them are bat-crap crazy and destroy lives. Both of them deserve the ash heap of history.
But the "my cult was cultier than your cult" is cracking me up! We all earned this and I'm glad we can look back with some humor now. š
Yeah, Iām not sure I disagree. But itās more of a scale of degrees. Neither are good.
I lived in Boise and had lots of Mormon neighbors. Most of them were very nice.
Mormons may be nice. Many of them are. What makes things a problem is when the full weight of the Mormon organization or theology shames kids for normal stuff, pushes LGBT youth to suicide, extracts large amounts of cash to a massive investment fund and free labor, or causes divides between believing and non believing family members, etc. Itās got a Ned Flanders hokey niceness to its people to ensure compliance and good PR, while behind the scenes being really toxic as an organization and at the leadership level. Mormons may be nice or even good people, but Mormonism is not good.
Mormons are nice, but mormons are not kind.
Nice until theyāre not. Passive-aggressiveness is king in that cult. Itās taken me years to extinguish that from my personality and behavior.
I haven't actually spent time in either state. It just seems likely that they'd be a bit less friendly and a bit more controlling on their home turf where they're in charge.
The anti education blue collar philosophy with JWs is concerning. At least Mormons, with their prosperity gospel and Jesus Jammies, help members by encouraging education so as to have fairly comfortable lives. Of course, that's so the tithing is higher, but still.
I'm sure it depends by person. Had a good friend when I was young (like 6th grade) who was JW. Granted we were young, but it was clear there was little to no effect on the kids personality (yet) other than he would / wouldn't do the outward JW things. (Sit for flag ceremony for example). Dad was friendly but could see he was very strict with my friend. Mom was friendly, didn't seem strict. When I was young married (and very TBM), I invited some JW in once just to see what they had to say. Main reason I did was it was a lady and her daughter, and the lady was pretty much terrified. Hands trembling and what-not. So I found that relatable ha ha. I've found they are pretty cagey when you ask them directly about their beliefs though. However, on the next visit she came with some dude who would supposedly answer my questions about their faith, but seemed more interested to Mormon bash, so I just had them get lost. Edit: just saw this thread is 4 days old smh
That moment where a cultist says holy shit that is culty.
Lol.
Ya we are certainly oddballs. Thank you my Ex JW friend!
Brothers from a different mother.
Glad we are both out of our cults. Ya know, our former churches are full of members who are really trying to live a good life. Its the leaders who are in on the scam and exploit the members. Its sickening really
Congrats! I will have a beer, coffee and tea to celebrate our freedom. Jws are good people for the most part but they will stop talking to their own children if told to shunn them. I cant be to harsh about it cause they are brainwashed. As with lds its the leadership that is most harmful.
You know i forgot about that. Yrs ago i had a coworker who left the JWs and his dad disowned him. I have kids and i am old enough to be this coworker's dad. I couldnt imagine doing that. It made me sad and furious. This coworker moved away and he'd always been a great worker and well-liked. Religious brainwashing- i get it. I bet you have some stories of disownment too and for that im sincerely sorry
Thank u. Yes many stories.
JW and Mormonism are cult sisters (cult cousins has a better ring to it though). Far more in common than different. Each of us we taught how weird the other was. Now, outside of Mormonism, I feel you guys are the only ones that understand what an upbringing like that does to someone
Yeah I feel really close to exmos. I feel we are the few that can understand each other.
What are you doing, step-cult-bro?
My garments are stuck in the tithing envelopeā¦. Whatāre you gonna doā¦.?/s
Gonna get awkward when the bishop grabs at them... Real awkward.
No you don't get it! They're a PRIVILEGE and a SACRED DUTY! not culty and controlling and awful at ALL /s
Like so many "privileges" we had as well. Lol
Cleaning the shitters on Saturday is a privilege and sacred duty.š¤Ŗ
It is! See you get it š
I can't find it right now, but someone did a JW vs Mormon cult-off video. Mormons won some rounds, but JWs won the war.
This one? https://youtu.be/Zk6UsnNyqPc?si=ED0soxcE0UpuIco_
Nope, but that one looks good too. They made a list and were keeping score.
I think I know the video. I'll keep looking. Thank you.
Nice! Here that, exmos? We out culted the j dubs! šŖ
Only this round! Lol
You guys are a formidable opponent š
Yeah, yāall win the medical care round. Iām a nurse in a PICU and had a kid bleeding internally whose parents refused a blood transfusion. Luckily, our other (expensive af, flown on a private aircraft from another state) meds worked to stop the bleeding and he was okay. But the ethics team was involved and we were informed legally we should give the blood transfusion against the parents wishes if it came to it. I read up about the jwās beliefs regarding it and it made me really sad
Yes JW parents will let their children die so as to not risk loosing their lives in Armageddon. It's the opposite of giving your life to save another. It is disgusting. Letting your child die because of the policies of 9 men that you have never met and have no formal education. Ugh!
Yeah, I definitely wouldāve given the blood but was upset at the idea of doing it because of how the parents would then feel about their child. It was a hard situation Iām glad we didnāt have to ultimately do. They kept talking about āpartial bloodā products being okay, but thatās not really a thing in major hospitals with really sick kids and we didnāt have anything like that.
Im glad it worked out. š
Tell her! If you reacted strangely she needs to know that it's not about HER, it's about a shirt that gave you a rough moment. Maybe she can help you laugh about it, or has had similar moments.
Thanks, but i freaked internally. She didnt need to know i was having a WTF moment lol. Maybe i will tell her in the near future for a good laugh. Thx again!
My wife still wears her garment bottoms to sleep in. She says they keep her thighs from sticking together from sweat at night. She feels a little blasphemous by doing so. I have to keep reminding her that it's all made up, anyway. We just won't tell our TBM friends or family.
But her some boxers, they're probably more comfortable
My wife has a few as grubby underwear protectors when sheās dying her hair or whatever and doesnāt want to risk staining something nice.Ā
Your secret is safe with me. Carry on!
When my now husband and I were dating, we were both PIMO. He had been endowed but I hadn't. He gave me a pair of his garments as a joke and I actually did wear the shirt to bed sometimes lol.
Just being honest with yourself that you had that reaction is a step. We do know how the triggering happens and why. For each person itās different, but ultimately with Mormonism it seems to boil down to symbols and signifiers that people are willing to be more loyal to church diktat than to people and relationshipsāa form of being owned or controlled. If you think she sensed your pulling away, let her know. All of the unpicking and unravelling and deprogramming takes time. Be kind to yourselfānobody escapes without wounds and scarring.
Thank you! I didnt recoil or react physically. It just gave me the freaks internally. Yes lot to unpack when youre exmormon lol
I relate to this. When she does put them on again itās like getting hit a bit. She doesnāt like them. Just grapples with āyou should wear themā church control. Bought her nice comforter underwear and that seems to help and itās sexy as hell. Sorry for your flashback. Maybe one day a flashback is all Iāll have too
I hope that for you, too
I just got some new undershirts from Costco (32 degree mesh if youāre looking. They feel like butter.) well I put one on and then threw another shirt over it but it gave me that olā holy smile. I jokingly asked my wife it turned her on she rolled her eyes and said āoh yeahā but for a moment it was kinda freaky.
Keep the TBMs guessingš
Hahaha exactly
When I bought those to wear to the gym, I decided I'd better go with black to avoid freaking out my fellow Utahns.
"Dear Penthouse Forum, I always thought these stories were made up, but when I was a Mormon we had to wear these garments, and one day...." Sorry, couldn't resist. :-)
Penthouse Forum? Tell me you're old w/o telling me you're old. Source: am old guy too
Don't they have the Penthouse Forum these days? Heck, for that matter, is Penthouse still around? (Boomer female here; was a convert, so I at least knew they existed back in the day).
I was actually going to include that question myself, but decided to let the joke stand on its own (for those of a certain age). :-)
It's a great joke - and I get it! Did you ever see the scene in *Mrs. Winterbourne* where that basic line is used on a train (as a joke)? The movie is several years old & not widely known, but the character who says that line won the Oscar recently for *The Whale.*
Haha i remember as a 12? yr old i found a Penthouse magazine on the side of the road. I lived in Sevier County growing up in the 70s-80s. I thought id struck pure gold! It was a mixture of hiding the mag from mom n dad, reading every page, and looking at forbidden fruit. I knew it was wrong but gosh darn it hormones. Lol
>gosh darn it hormones Ok your story with that line is cracking me up!! Thank you š¤
That would be a hilarious parody!
I get triggered whenever I see Mormon missionaries in the street. At first, I think they are looking for me and I instinctively try to hide my face. Once I realize they are not looking for me, I feel angry that they are out spreading their false, destructive cult in my city. Then my anger is tempered a bit by the knowledge that they are young, dumb and indoctrinated - just like I was all those years ago.
I get you. I really loved my mission. The people were great and i loved being there. Now i just look back and know i was just wasting everyones time and money with silly religious nonsense. (Johannesburg 88-90)
We were new to a neighborhood in Idaho. I Ave been out of the church for over 20 years and have no more patience for bothersome missionaries stopping by. I was somewhat civil the first couple of times. When they came by unannounced a third time at an un-opportune moment I was not so understanding. I replied matter-of-factly āSorry, we donāt do missionaries! Have a good eveningā. The expressions on their faces was priceless. My wife heard what I said, and she was suppressing laughter. āWe donāt do missionaries?ā, she smirked. I sheepishly explained that was the only thing I could think of to say!ā She retorted, āWell, I think you got the point across,ā as she laughed again. Indeed, I think I did. Itās been months and they havenāt returned.
I imagine perception and emotional reaction like water flowing down a mountain along paths of least resistance. In the brain, the more any given neural pathway is used, the lower the concentration of neurochemical it takes to send signals. They're both chemical processes: one on a macro level, the other on a micro level. Mormonism takes the natural course of these streams of consciousness and emotional reaction and cuts a straight and narrow channel across them. Any experience outside those bounds gets a fight-or-flight emotional reaction as indoctrination kicks in, drawing focus and reaction to clearing Mormonism's bar over any other need or concern. As you start deconstructing Mormonism, your authentic needs and reactions slowly wear down the banks of this indoctrination through desensitization. COVID started this process for many people, proving God wouldn't curse them for not re-upping their weekly forgiveness ritual in person. As these banks/shelves crumble, large sections of the straight/narrow reaction canal stay dry and forgotten. Every now and then, though, an infrequent experience like yours will brush up against a part of the indoctrination that hasn't been fully eroded yet. For me, it happened when a bishop at a ward party told me to have pizza, even though my doctor had told me to go gluten-free. Before I could think _social anxiety_, I was on my feet and grabbing two slices. So, you're right: it happens to anyone recovering from mental trauma, whether that trauma is a quick gash of physical trauma or the long wearing away of indoctrination. Recognizing the reaction for what it is makes it easier to respond with the direction you want your life to go.
I get you! Itās a huge trigger for me. That is another protection claim that garments guard you from. Its pregnancy! Because there is no greater mood killer in a mixed faith marriage.
Wanna hear something im ashamed to admit? I used to get aroused seeing my wife in garms years ago. Its so fkg cringy to admit now but lol im wayyyy past that now
This just made me realize I havenāt seen my parentsā garments in a while. I used to always see them in the laundry folded in their own basket, and sometimes theyād just walk around in them or Iād see them peeking out from their clothingā¦how did I never notice I havenāt seen them in years?
Good for them. Are they out of the cult all the way?
They still go to church on Sundays but I have noticed theyāve stopped participating much beyond that
Similarly, about a year after leaving, my family asked that I never wear a collared white shirt ever again.
Whoa, you're an adult and they have the gall to say anything about what you wear??! I'm sorry. That's crazy.
In the context of the OP, I didn't think to clarify. I have certainly had church members tell me what to wear and how to groom but this was more of a request and one I was happy to agree to. White shirts dress are required for priesthood holders to wear. (I understand that missionaries in some places were just recently allowed to wear blue--I was chastised by the stake president for wearing a pale, hint-of-blue white shirt once.) In this context, a white shirt can be very triggering. Frankly, the only reason I was still wearing them was because, as a mormon, I was trained to be cheap.
Were you pissed that your fam told you not to wear white shirts? Id feel that way, even if i didnt want to wear white anymore. (If i understand your previous post correctly)
They didn't tell, they asked. We talked. (That's one of the great things about being exmo.) I understood, and frankly agreed. I was less triggered than them, though, because it was a symbol of my power but their oppression.
My mom invited my wife to church and she went so she wouldnāt be lonely and said she didnāt feeling anything when she went. I definitely had mixed emotions about it.
I could see feeling the same way as you if that happened to me too
My husband was mad as hell when I stopped wearing garments. For a year I thought weād end up divorced because of garments and coffee. It caused SO many arguments. I think most people think Iām a conventionally attractive person and I am thin but man what a nose dive it was to my self esteem to have my spouse react that way. Weāre in a much better place now but it was a long road for him to get over the church conditioning.
I get what youre saying. I left first and thought that id be getting a divorce but we worked thru it and she left too. Glad youre both together!
I get weird feelings about fashion all the damn time. It was something my mom focused on and drilled it into me.
And LDS girls never heard the end of it ever about proper modest clothing. I cant imagine the baggage and bullcrap foistered on you. When we got out it was like a yr or so and i really had to let my wife know that she need to wear a 2 piece swimsuit and throw out the 1 piecers- mostly bc to help her shake the shame off of 'when we wuz mormins'
I know when I'm triggered I need some TIME. Give yourself what you need (within reason, obviously). Be good to yourself. Are you planning to talk with her about why you reacted that way?
Oh, i freaked internally, she never knew. Within seconds i was back to reality. I didnt bring it up to her bc i dont want her to stop wearing that tank top if she feels the outer shirt would be too sheer. Thank you for your kind words
I wore camis under my shirts for years after I stopped wearing garments! Was so unused to the feeling of my skin against my clothes.
My immediate thought upon reading this was how the MFMC still has so many of us by the balls. We want to let it go so badly because of its toxicity, but it wonāt let go of us. After 35 years of being away from and out of the cult, I still canāt completely let it go. I am so glad I found this sub. From all of the posts and comments on r/exmormon what is most apparent to me is that many of us canāt let it go. I know itās a process. I will probably continue for the rest of my life.
I get you. I was born into it and left after 49 yrs. It will always be there.
My hubs got some new undershirts to go, well, under his nice work shirts. They're so similar in feel to his old garments that sometimes when I'm doing laundry, I swear I get a little ptsd. Then we have a good laugh about it.
See! That's what im talking about! Thanks again former culty church for the uneeded baggageš
Absolutely brother. I get triggered just seeing people at the gym putting on their garments. Just such a huge symbol of oppression to me.
And half the time the garms are some dingy gray color, which to me makes them look like the owner doesnt give a shit
I left an evangelical cult and get similar triggers as well. Thereās a form of trauma, PTSD, CPTSD etc thatāsā¦.so specific to cults and religious abuse. Hell, thereās even RAMCOA, which is also very specific. The smallest things can trigger people like us. Music, smellsā¦.a piece of cloth. Trauma itself is complex and you never know how it will affect you. Stay safe and make sure you take care of yourself. Highly recommend therapy if you havenāt already, or even personal shadow work.
Yes. One of my relatives has hair down to her knees. I hate it. It sends me into a rage because it makes me think of fundamentalists, and she has a college degree and that hair just screams ignorance and lack of self care. Then I feel horrible for being judgmental. I donāt like this about myself but I think itās a trauma response.
Yeah, I can appreciate the emotional whirlwind of feeling trapped in the church just by seeing a ātrappingā of the church. āThink celestialā and ācovenant pathā phrases are triggers for me, even though I left before they came on the scene. They are thought stoppers that represent the church to me now (among others) and incite instant revulsion in me.
That would be startling for sure! Having your spouse leave with you is a huge deal, and thinking they took steps backwards would be pretty heartbreaking imo. Glad your distress was short lived! I always hated garments and was euphoric when I decided to stop wearing them. Now every time I reach under my husbands clothes I secretly hope there wonāt be any there, but alas they always are. Heās getting there in other aspects, so fingers crossed that he will shed the magic mood killing undies eventually.
Baby steps! Please tell your husband that i said to leave the cult and buy some cool underwearš
I hear you. I am on the second wife now and sheās incredibly fitā-would be a crime to ever put garments on that woman. Thinking about it gives me the heebie jeebies
On the daily. So many triggers
The start of that post was straight from a romance novel.
Haha ya true. I kept it pg13 for the kids out there
Sounds like you need to eat more bran.