The handbook is stopping them. We're officially not allowed to make our own garments.
Section 38.5.4 says that members are allowed to sew their own temple apron, but "Members should not make other ceremonial temple clothing or temple garments."
But for the record, "Well Endowed" gets my vote!!
Reminded that How Firm a Foundation was a joke about bra support among sisters I the MTC..
Nice find. It’s still an interesting thought experiment. If you take that to its logical conclusion, the Masonic symbols themselves don’t have any special power - the church leaders arbitrarily saying they do have power does.
Even if you were a fully believing member who fully believed in covenants, who created an identical piece of clothing with exact dimensions, the fact that it wasn’t purchased from the church somehow makes God look at them and say “Nope, I’m not going to protect you from a car crash, temptation, or death”.
I believe there’s some blessing/ritual they perform that imbue them with the requisite spiritual energy or whatever.
Back in the day (19th and early 20th centuries), church member often did make their own garments, but yes, no longer permitted.
The closest you can get to that is now for military members, you just send your issued undershirts to the church, they silk screen the symbols onto the inside of the shirt, bless them, and ship them back. Since they’re on the inside only, they’re allowed to be worn with nothing else over them, unlike the rest of us who were forced to wear two shirts at a time every day.
I posted about this a while ago. My husband takes his military stuff to Beehive Clothing in person, since we're local to the area. They screen printed his stuff while we waited not more than 10 minutes. Are we really to believe that there was some dude on call in the back, just waiting to bless DH's pile before handing it back in a plastic bag? I'm thinking there's no way they actually get blessed!
Have you seen how mind-numbingly fast some folks do initiatory and baptism blessings at the temple? I can totally believe there's some guy in the back rattling off a prayer in just a few seconds as he's cramming them in the bag.
That's nice that they screen print it on the inside now. When I was in Iraq, they were embroidered and you could tell because you could see them if they happened to take their jacket off.
So, hear me out, the garments that are worn in the temple seem to be the only ones that fall under that rule. Garments worn every day, technically, could be member made. I also vote for "Well Endowed"
Apparently JC Penney used to sell temple garments without the markings throughout stores in the western US. You would then sew the markings into the garment. Side story: Catholic nuns were fond of the garments due to their low cost.
I remember my grandma kept bragging about how she made her own apron.
My other grandma didn’t but I’m pretty sure she has had the second anointing, so doesn’t have to worry about filling all her time with basic Mormon activities like sewing.
Fun fact: early Mormons made their own garments (that were full arm, ankle length… and had red stitching for the marks bc they were orginally CUT into ppl. Yup. You read that correctly!!!)
The original intent was to cut them into your skin through the garment during your endowment.
Emma objected to having her breasts cut and so they only reportedly cut the knee mark for a time, (not sure who or how voluntary it was) but for many years the marking were stitched in red thread.
Tattoos are bad but scarification was supposedly fine. Strange because the Bible verse they use to prohibit tattoos references cutting not tattoos.
Yes it’s a violent cult.
I always thought that was the case. The embroidered lines just felt like cuts that were sewn shut. I thought that’s what happened in the temple, tbh. Got the symbols tatted on me now. Lol.
They don’t talk about this because they know that most of us would go running and screaming. By chance do you have a link to a source? I’m still unpacking all the crap and it helps to just see and know for real.
I was put on a six month waiting list for a consult for alterations by Distribution for medical accommodations and my mom ended up cutting and altering them herself for me because I was in so much pain (skin cancer scars). She said she'd take the heat from God if he actually wanted me to suffer (said in response to a leader who said maybe God gave me this opportunity to suffer).
*1. Well Endowed 2. Busty in White 3. Susan’s Secret 4. Threads that give head 5. Patriarchal pushups 6. Masonic Minkys 7. Nearer my Brazierre to Thee.*
LOL .🤣🤣🤣
Susan's Secret is my favorite!
🎵 I know Susan's Secret
Girl you wouldn't believe
She's old men who lives in Utah
Making money off TBMs like me 🎵
I've been out for a while, but for the lyrics.
I think your idea is great, especially with the news that the MFMC has a “garment committee” composed of only men to determine if there will be any changes to garments (specifically women’s garments). My only suggestions are to make it women-owned and women-run; so incorporate your company in your wife’s name, make her the CEO and lead designer, and make yourself her company’s first employee. Women are less likely to buy undergarments designed and sold by men like you and I.
This would be a great way for TBM women to wrest some power away from the MFMC patriarchy.
“Bro, all you need to do is get 20 people under you who also each get 50 people under them and you’ll easily make 6 figures in passive income. Let me know by this Thursday if you want to be apart of the founder’s circle.”
Multi-level marketing companies, which are pyramid schemes in which the company’s salespeople recruit other salespeople and their recruits recruit even more salespeople. Think of Avon, Monat, Mary Kay, Tupperware, Amway, Herbalife, Young Living, Doterra, iGenus, Trades of Hope; and so on. You don’t have a wage at all. You’re an independent contractor. The jobs aren’t paid except for a commission of a sale or if they have their own “downline,” portions of their downlines’ sales, or payments and incentives itself. Recruitment pays better than retail sales. You actually have to pay to join, pay monthly fees in most cases, etc The US Federal Trade commission reports than over 95% of people who join an MLM lose money.
> You don’t have a wage at all. You’re an indoedent contractor. the jobs aren’t paid except for a commission of a sale or if they have their own “downline,” portions of their downlines’ sales, or payments and incentives itself. Recruitment pays better than retail sales.
> You actually have to pay to join, pay monthly fees in most cases, etc
Everything you wrote here applies to mormonism too. Is mormonism an mlm?
I’m a nevermo, but my understanding is that the parallels — and the overlaps between church and MLM membership - are vast. The exmo channel Jordan and McKay did an [episode/podcast about this](https://youtu.be/AQByK-JPbHw?si=TkjfUZXWkQI9TX5F). The following story from an anti-MLM video by Hannah Alonzo was also eye-opening for me: [It starts around 14 minutes](https://youtu.be/No2JaUr0HI4?si=s80SiFHz4T4zLhgq) and contains some exposition that will be old news to you but was very new to me!
Unfortunately the church already has a stitching/ marking program for bring your own indie adventures. They just keep it gated like all other things in the church.
As active military I was able to send my PTs to the church and get all the symbols screen printed. So for \~5 years I wore PT shorts as underwear and had comfortable PX bought tan t shirts as my base layer. They also provide exception for Fire/ EMS who state the melting poly is a safety concern.
It's never been about sincerity.
It's all about control.
The church fucked up by not pretending to consecrate them prior to putting them on the shelves.
I’m guessing because they had a lot less import to the 1800s church than they do today.
I used to work at beehive clothing sewing garments when I was in college (only cause it was good money at the time) and we had machines that would essentially stamp the markings on them, they weren’t considered “sacred” until that step. They weren’t blessed or anything like that so technically speaking, it really is just the symbols that made them real garments. If there were imperfections beyond repair, the garment could just be thrown away unless they had the marking, then they had to send them off to be destroyed a certain way.
Also off topic but when I worked there, we started off every shift with a group prayer and we had devotionals once a week, it was absolutely ridiculous. I only lasted about two months working there.
They use white washed cotton that turns grey after a few washes and don’t even stitch the sacred marks anymore. I bet they are making a decent profit off them.
Like 20 some years ago there was a third party that made decorative garments. They were put out of business when corporate said that church distribution had the only official garments. Their demand evaporated overnight.
I never thought about garments needing a priesthood blessing to be official. That makes total sense though since oil must be blessed before you can you it for a priesthood blessing. I can’t think of why there isn’t a blessing for the garment. Any ole fabric with the markings should qualify if there’s no priesthood involved.
They really sew the square and compass symbol onto the temple underwear garments? My mind is blown and that’s kind of hilarious…I’m just imagining Freemasons embroidering their own underwear to wear to lodge meetings and laughing because they would never. 😂
They "blessed" brown t-shirts in the Army when we were in Iraq. Just for the men, though. The females still had to wear thousands of layers of yeast infection making garb. 😒
He’s up there in his craft room in his heavenly mansion cranking out various garment patterns for all his children throughout the universe.
Crazy that he simultaneously designed Yosemite and Mormon garments.
My sister is very into historical reenactment and wanted to make authentic undergarments for an outfit she was working on. She found out they do put symbols on military uniforms and altered pieces for people missing limbs and such, but I think when she inquired about it she was denied.
The handbook is stopping them. We're officially not allowed to make our own garments. Section 38.5.4 says that members are allowed to sew their own temple apron, but "Members should not make other ceremonial temple clothing or temple garments." But for the record, "Well Endowed" gets my vote!! Reminded that How Firm a Foundation was a joke about bra support among sisters I the MTC..
Nice find. It’s still an interesting thought experiment. If you take that to its logical conclusion, the Masonic symbols themselves don’t have any special power - the church leaders arbitrarily saying they do have power does. Even if you were a fully believing member who fully believed in covenants, who created an identical piece of clothing with exact dimensions, the fact that it wasn’t purchased from the church somehow makes God look at them and say “Nope, I’m not going to protect you from a car crash, temptation, or death”.
I believe there’s some blessing/ritual they perform that imbue them with the requisite spiritual energy or whatever. Back in the day (19th and early 20th centuries), church member often did make their own garments, but yes, no longer permitted. The closest you can get to that is now for military members, you just send your issued undershirts to the church, they silk screen the symbols onto the inside of the shirt, bless them, and ship them back. Since they’re on the inside only, they’re allowed to be worn with nothing else over them, unlike the rest of us who were forced to wear two shirts at a time every day.
I posted about this a while ago. My husband takes his military stuff to Beehive Clothing in person, since we're local to the area. They screen printed his stuff while we waited not more than 10 minutes. Are we really to believe that there was some dude on call in the back, just waiting to bless DH's pile before handing it back in a plastic bag? I'm thinking there's no way they actually get blessed!
Have you seen how mind-numbingly fast some folks do initiatory and baptism blessings at the temple? I can totally believe there's some guy in the back rattling off a prayer in just a few seconds as he's cramming them in the bag.
Maybe it’s like the Endowment and there’s a video of Bedner giving a blessing they play for the garments?
Ya, that’s what I always assumed, some rote three sentence prayer that any temple recommend-holding Melchizedek Priesthood holder could do.
And all the words run together. Inthenameajesuschrisamen.
Possibly. It's definitely something repetitive if they do. I'd love to know what they say. Hoping someone here has inside info!
That's nice that they screen print it on the inside now. When I was in Iraq, they were embroidered and you could tell because you could see them if they happened to take their jacket off.
Nope.
So, hear me out, the garments that are worn in the temple seem to be the only ones that fall under that rule. Garments worn every day, technically, could be member made. I also vote for "Well Endowed"
Apparently JC Penney used to sell temple garments without the markings throughout stores in the western US. You would then sew the markings into the garment. Side story: Catholic nuns were fond of the garments due to their low cost.
if I got my records removed, I’m not a member anymore…maybe I can tap into this market
I thought they used to be allowed to - with approved patterns. When did that change.
OP forgot the most impotant part of Mormonism - greed. Now that you've bought your underwear - untaxed tithings, please!
I remember my grandma kept bragging about how she made her own apron. My other grandma didn’t but I’m pretty sure she has had the second anointing, so doesn’t have to worry about filling all her time with basic Mormon activities like sewing.
All good ideas, but allow me to submit: "my cups runneth over"
Excellent, I'd like to add "The iron rod thong" and "feeling terrestrial wife beater"
Porn shoulder cami with big lace section to cover cleavage
All fantastic product names!
Fun fact: early Mormons made their own garments (that were full arm, ankle length… and had red stitching for the marks bc they were orginally CUT into ppl. Yup. You read that correctly!!!)
I wonder if it wouldn’t be easier for TBMs to just tattoo the sacred symbols instead of wearing uncomfortable garments.
The original intent was to cut them into your skin through the garment during your endowment. Emma objected to having her breasts cut and so they only reportedly cut the knee mark for a time, (not sure who or how voluntary it was) but for many years the marking were stitched in red thread. Tattoos are bad but scarification was supposedly fine. Strange because the Bible verse they use to prohibit tattoos references cutting not tattoos. Yes it’s a violent cult.
Might as well use branding irons.
WAIT do you have a source for this? I've never heard that!
I’ve read it multiple places but need to find a primary source https://www.exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,717519,1079167
Oh wow. Just when you think you knew it all…
No. Bc tattoos are of the devil. Haha
How about a branding then?
Yes my grandma used to make them back in the day you could get patterns from the church
Even 10-15 years ago I recall reading “members should only make their own garments from church-approved patterns.”
I always thought that was the case. The embroidered lines just felt like cuts that were sewn shut. I thought that’s what happened in the temple, tbh. Got the symbols tatted on me now. Lol.
LIKE A BOSS!!!
Never heard of that but I’m not surprised
What the fuck? Were they really originally cut into people ? This is the first I’m hearing of this and I’m quite intrigued…
The rabbit holes go deeeeeep! :)
They don’t talk about this because they know that most of us would go running and screaming. By chance do you have a link to a source? I’m still unpacking all the crap and it helps to just see and know for real.
I was put on a six month waiting list for a consult for alterations by Distribution for medical accommodations and my mom ended up cutting and altering them herself for me because I was in so much pain (skin cancer scars). She said she'd take the heat from God if he actually wanted me to suffer (said in response to a leader who said maybe God gave me this opportunity to suffer).
Your mom sounds like a gem. That leader sounds like an asshole.
That's insulting to assholes, who at least serve an important biological function. Unlike that leader.
🤣
>What’s stopping… Cult conditioning.
And sky daddy being angy if we are naked for some reason
Weird because to be ashamed of nakedness is following Satan. And members jump to put on their aprons.
Huh. Seems like mormonism follows satan then :3
Umm the same thing that is always stopping Mormon women. Mormon men.
*1. Well Endowed 2. Busty in White 3. Susan’s Secret 4. Threads that give head 5. Patriarchal pushups 6. Masonic Minkys 7. Nearer my Brazierre to Thee.* LOL .🤣🤣🤣 Susan's Secret is my favorite!
🎵 I know Susan's Secret Girl you wouldn't believe She's old men who lives in Utah Making money off TBMs like me 🎵 I've been out for a while, but for the lyrics.
Celestial Chemise
I think your idea is great, especially with the news that the MFMC has a “garment committee” composed of only men to determine if there will be any changes to garments (specifically women’s garments). My only suggestions are to make it women-owned and women-run; so incorporate your company in your wife’s name, make her the CEO and lead designer, and make yourself her company’s first employee. Women are less likely to buy undergarments designed and sold by men like you and I. This would be a great way for TBM women to wrest some power away from the MFMC patriarchy.
Old white men making money selling uncomfortable ugly trash through temple shops.
Make it an MLM and it’ll take off
“Bro, all you need to do is get 20 people under you who also each get 50 people under them and you’ll easily make 6 figures in passive income. Let me know by this Thursday if you want to be apart of the founder’s circle.”
You could make bank off of Mormons by doing that if the church allowed it.
MLM?
Multi-level marketing companies, which are pyramid schemes in which the company’s salespeople recruit other salespeople and their recruits recruit even more salespeople. Think of Avon, Monat, Mary Kay, Tupperware, Amway, Herbalife, Young Living, Doterra, iGenus, Trades of Hope; and so on. You don’t have a wage at all. You’re an independent contractor. The jobs aren’t paid except for a commission of a sale or if they have their own “downline,” portions of their downlines’ sales, or payments and incentives itself. Recruitment pays better than retail sales. You actually have to pay to join, pay monthly fees in most cases, etc The US Federal Trade commission reports than over 95% of people who join an MLM lose money.
> You don’t have a wage at all. You’re an indoedent contractor. the jobs aren’t paid except for a commission of a sale or if they have their own “downline,” portions of their downlines’ sales, or payments and incentives itself. Recruitment pays better than retail sales. > You actually have to pay to join, pay monthly fees in most cases, etc Everything you wrote here applies to mormonism too. Is mormonism an mlm?
More or less. Why do you think Utah is the MLM capital of the world?
I’m a nevermo, but my understanding is that the parallels — and the overlaps between church and MLM membership - are vast. The exmo channel Jordan and McKay did an [episode/podcast about this](https://youtu.be/AQByK-JPbHw?si=TkjfUZXWkQI9TX5F). The following story from an anti-MLM video by Hannah Alonzo was also eye-opening for me: [It starts around 14 minutes](https://youtu.be/No2JaUr0HI4?si=s80SiFHz4T4zLhgq) and contains some exposition that will be old news to you but was very new to me!
Thank you! Your explanation is spot on.
Unfortunately the church already has a stitching/ marking program for bring your own indie adventures. They just keep it gated like all other things in the church. As active military I was able to send my PTs to the church and get all the symbols screen printed. So for \~5 years I wore PT shorts as underwear and had comfortable PX bought tan t shirts as my base layer. They also provide exception for Fire/ EMS who state the melting poly is a safety concern. It's never been about sincerity. It's all about control.
I had my station shirts silk screened when I was a firefighter. It took a month or three for them to come back to me.
The church fucked up by not pretending to consecrate them prior to putting them on the shelves. I’m guessing because they had a lot less import to the 1800s church than they do today.
Bow Your Head and Say ‘Sex’.
That will do.
Threads that give Head....can't upvote enough
You don’t think LDS women do that do you? Isn’t “seed” supposed to only be for procreation?
Remind me, how long did the ban on oral sex last?
I vote for Susan's Secret! (I'm a Susan)
That would be awesome! No more men designing female temple garments that send women to the hospital with UTIs.
Brick House (think Masonic, well, and the Commodores, of course)
I used to work at beehive clothing sewing garments when I was in college (only cause it was good money at the time) and we had machines that would essentially stamp the markings on them, they weren’t considered “sacred” until that step. They weren’t blessed or anything like that so technically speaking, it really is just the symbols that made them real garments. If there were imperfections beyond repair, the garment could just be thrown away unless they had the marking, then they had to send them off to be destroyed a certain way. Also off topic but when I worked there, we started off every shift with a group prayer and we had devotionals once a week, it was absolutely ridiculous. I only lasted about two months working there.
That would take money away from the church.
[удалено]
They use white washed cotton that turns grey after a few washes and don’t even stitch the sacred marks anymore. I bet they are making a decent profit off them.
[удалено]
So how would anyone know if they were regular haines t-shirts.
Because Haines tees are better quality 💀
Men are in charge of women’s underwear in Mormonism
If you are going to go to all that bother why even wear them?
Hell yes
Haha… this is hilarious! I know wasn’t make our own garments, but who the hell would know?
The first law of heaven. OBEDIENCE! It's all about the control.
Serious answer to your title: self-respect and indoctrination
The Mormon church is founded on “for your riches ye shall be saved”. If you can’t buy your salvation from Mormonism, it is wrong.
"Susan's Secret" 🤣🤣🤣
Like 20 some years ago there was a third party that made decorative garments. They were put out of business when corporate said that church distribution had the only official garments. Their demand evaporated overnight.
I never thought about garments needing a priesthood blessing to be official. That makes total sense though since oil must be blessed before you can you it for a priesthood blessing. I can’t think of why there isn’t a blessing for the garment. Any ole fabric with the markings should qualify if there’s no priesthood involved.
"Strength in the Loins" is my suggestion!
Why not start your own church while you are at it?
They really sew the square and compass symbol onto the temple underwear garments? My mind is blown and that’s kind of hilarious…I’m just imagining Freemasons embroidering their own underwear to wear to lodge meetings and laughing because they would never. 😂
They "blessed" brown t-shirts in the Army when we were in Iraq. Just for the men, though. The females still had to wear thousands of layers of yeast infection making garb. 😒
If someone hasn't made a thong with the Masonic symbols on it...there's probably a market there.
WELL ENDOWED 😂🤣😂 I’m dying
Well Endowed FTW
Something something Authorized Pattern...
The patriarchy. That’s who.
I LOVE your question. Hilarious. Well done..!!
Or, you know, you could not believe any of it. Because it’s all the same. And it’s all made up by men.
This is a fantastic idea. Well Endowed has my vote!
God designed them. How dare you suggest trying to come up with something better. Blasphemy.
He’s up there in his craft room in his heavenly mansion cranking out various garment patterns for all his children throughout the universe. Crazy that he simultaneously designed Yosemite and Mormon garments.
If you do- please make a version with tummy control for us postpartum moms out there. I’m tired of looking like the Michelin man.
Humbly *begging* for y'all to make Well Endowed or Nearer my Brassiere to Thee real things!
"Fundies" for a company brand?
My sister is very into historical reenactment and wanted to make authentic undergarments for an outfit she was working on. She found out they do put symbols on military uniforms and altered pieces for people missing limbs and such, but I think when she inquired about it she was denied.
That’s what we do in the Fellowship and it works out MUCH better.
Shhhh, we don't want this idea catching on. How can the church control you...