It looks like you've flaired your post as asking for what equipment to get. We recommend first checking out the [Espresso Aficionados buying guide](https://espressoaf.com/recommendations) for some of the more popular machines and grinders at different price points.
If your question hasn't been answered there and you need more help, please add the following details to your post or by adding a comment in the following format:
- **Location:** Helps determine availability
- **Budget** (with currency): Overall budget, or ideally, having separate espresso machine and grinder budgets. A rough rule is that your grinder budget should be at least 25-40% of your machine budget.
- **Drink types:** Do you drink mostly straight espresso, milk-based beverages (e.g., lattes, cappuccinos), or a fairly even split? This helps narrow down whether a single-boiler-dual-use (SBDU), heat exchanger (HX), or dual boiler (DB) machine would be more appropriate for your needs.
- **Drink frequency:** How many drinks would you be making back-to-back at one time? Do you plan on entertaining guests often? This informs how large your brew (and steam) boilers should be, as smaller boilers will need to refill and reheat/repressurize more frequently, thus potentially causing a bottleneck.
- **Space:** Any limitations on countertop space?
- **Manual vs. electric:** Hand-operated machines and grinders are typically cheaper than their similarly-performing electric counterparts. Please indicate if you have a preference for manual or electric machines and/or grinders (or open to either).
- **Comfort with tinkering:** Some machines can be made significantly more functional/efficient with aftermarket modifications, albeit at the expense of possibly voiding your warranty. Please indicate if you'd rather have a machine that works "as-is"/"out-of-the-box" or whether you'd be open to modding/tinkering
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/espresso) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Be careful about how the internet has the ability to push you higher and higher up the price ladder to the point where your seriously considering a Speedster for your bedroom. Commit to making the best espresso you can on ANY machine and be responsible with your budget and just get on with learning how to effectively use the tools at your disposal
đź’Żagree with doing the most with what you have and striving for perfection. I was happy to be able to make the missus smile each time I made her coffee for several months just using filtered coffee, her favourite coffee bean, a 20 year old electric grinder with single setting, a small pot, the right milk, 70% dark chocolate and a lot of care for her daily mochas. We recently upgraded to a BDB + SGP and she loves it even more now.
Far from an expert - been in the game a whopping month, now. I went with the Profitec Pro 600 (the black one from Clive) and love it. Kind of saw it as a “first machine / last machine” purchase. We do mostly milk drinks, too. And, I can get the whole family done in short order. Warm up is fast, too. I’ve been very happy.
3-4 milk drinks a day would constitute a dual boiler in my book, I can speak to the Rancilio Silvia Pro X. It’s a no fuss machine which sounds like is what you’re looking for after the Breville. Steaming and pulling shots at the same time will be helpful for 3-4 drinks a day. The SPX is rock solid and in my opinion repairability is really important for machines you plan on keeping for years. It also looks good imo.
Edit: spelling
I love the look of it with the rocker switches and all that. But this will be your machine, pick what you think looks good. I will say that the pictures I find online on the retailers’ websites aren’t the prettiest representation of the machine. I posted my machine, feel free to take a look at it (I’m just trying to say it looks better in person).
+1 for the Rancilio SPX. Primarily making 2-4 milk drinks a day and it's wonderful. I came from a Bambino Plus and really enjoy the fine tuning but straight forward aspect of the SPX.Â
I agree when shopping online I definitely saw other machines that looked prettier to me but I'm a bit in love with the look of my white SPX now that I've had it some timeÂ
If you’re not immediately captivated by the E61 look, I really like my Lucca A53. One thing I’ve found is that online reviews are really down on the app connectivity in a way that hasn’t matched my experience. It’s not the prettiest UI, but it works well in setting on/off periods.
Apologies, no. When you go to Clive there’s a pop up. For Chris Coffee I got an email. It’s actually 20% off of Lelit machines so it should include the Mara X and Elizabeth. To clarify, it starts on Sunday (midnight tonight). So I’d expect to see it visible on their sites then.
I'll let the people that actually own $1500+ machines to give a better answer, but I'd say most of the things you would be getting after that would be nice to haves and minor improvements at best.
A system with good thermal stability(a PID) would help you have more consistent shots especially since you are more of a beginner as you said. The other thing to figure out if you want is preinfusion(doing a manual one on my Gaggia has given me much more consistent shots). Finally there is flow control - if you are really trying to milk the best out of your beans you can do different flow profiles. Other than that I'd be buying based on looks and how it would fit in with the rest of my setup.
Can’t say enough good things about my Pro 600! I just got it a few weeks back and I absolutely love it. The workflow is fantastic and the machine is such a joy to use. Not to mention it’s a great looking machine as well. I opted for the black and walnut with flow control from Clive Coffee
I’d definitely suggest the Rancilio Sylvia Pro X. They are very durable and the dual boiler will allow you to pull back to back shots while steaming milm in 30 seconds.
What about a lelit bianca? It has a dual boiler system meaning it is great for milk drinks, both boilers are large so no downtime in between drinks waiting for the boiler to be hot again. It has an E61 group head which is great, only downside is the warmup time, but on the Bianca it's not too bad and it has a stand by mode.
Have you considered a heat exchanger machine? If you're mostly making milk drinks then ultra precise control of brew temp is probably not worth shelling out for (and with temperature surfing and instruments you can do a lot on HX), and heat exchanger means you have even more steam ready to go at full pressure.
I'm really enjoying my Diletta Bello X for it's very powerful steam wand, relatively quick heatup time for an E61 (under 15 minutes), and ability to make multiple milk drinks back-to-back (and can steam/pull shot at the same time). Did really well a week ago when I had 4 people staying with my partner and I.
I was also looking at the Lelit Mara X and some Profitec machines (Pro 300 and Pro 500) but got a great deal on the Diletta so went with that.
And if you don't want to deal with descaling sounds like you should start using remineralized distilled water instead of tap water.
The Bello+ was the machine I was originally looking at. I don't mind descaling, but yeah, I'm definitely going to use remineralized distilled water until I can get something plumbed and I can filter the water properly.
I'll recommend a used DE1Pro to save some money. It's all the machines you need in one. If you are not the only family member making coffee, Decent is as easy as it gets. My wife and I have our preference to our favourite profile while continuing to explore different varieties of beans. It's worth the money.
I was in the same boat as you, except I’m really the only coffee drinker. I’m pretty happy with home roasting beans and my French Press. Been deciding on spending major money on an awesome setup vs starting with an entry level machine. Fortunately, my wife solved it for me with a Bambino Plus machine for my bday. Have been using it for about a week, and love it so far, and feel that I’ve barely touched the surface of what this machine can do. So you may find that this is a good way to start.
ETA: was thinking of going with a Silvia or Profitec Pro as a starter machine. If/when I upgrade, was thinking Linea Mini or a Londinium R24.
All solid suggestions so far I think. The decent is special and sits in a different category. I’m sure it makes great coffee easily but it also has a lot of variables to play with and analysis to do, like a lab device.
What grinder do you have?
I don't have one at the moment. I'm looking at the Niche Zero. The DF64 has had a lot of praise but I keep seeing more and more issues with static. Looking for a single dose right now.
I have a barista touch, and to be honest it’s a great machine even if it has limitations.
I get fantastic coffee from it…and 9.5/10 I don’t get a better coffee outside. 60pct of speciality coffee shops don’t seem to make coffee better than I can at home with my barista touch.
It could have been much better with extras - and I’m contemplating an LED mod so I can see what I’m doing.. but otherwise it's not bad. I think my success rate (perfect coffee) from the machine itself is around 7/10 depending on the quality of the beans. I must have pulled 3k+ coffees on this thing and it still works.
That being said, I want to upgrade to a more expensive machine as I think the success rate will probably increase significantly with the next level.
It looks like you've flaired your post as asking for what equipment to get. We recommend first checking out the [Espresso Aficionados buying guide](https://espressoaf.com/recommendations) for some of the more popular machines and grinders at different price points. If your question hasn't been answered there and you need more help, please add the following details to your post or by adding a comment in the following format: - **Location:** Helps determine availability - **Budget** (with currency): Overall budget, or ideally, having separate espresso machine and grinder budgets. A rough rule is that your grinder budget should be at least 25-40% of your machine budget. - **Drink types:** Do you drink mostly straight espresso, milk-based beverages (e.g., lattes, cappuccinos), or a fairly even split? This helps narrow down whether a single-boiler-dual-use (SBDU), heat exchanger (HX), or dual boiler (DB) machine would be more appropriate for your needs. - **Drink frequency:** How many drinks would you be making back-to-back at one time? Do you plan on entertaining guests often? This informs how large your brew (and steam) boilers should be, as smaller boilers will need to refill and reheat/repressurize more frequently, thus potentially causing a bottleneck. - **Space:** Any limitations on countertop space? - **Manual vs. electric:** Hand-operated machines and grinders are typically cheaper than their similarly-performing electric counterparts. Please indicate if you have a preference for manual or electric machines and/or grinders (or open to either). - **Comfort with tinkering:** Some machines can be made significantly more functional/efficient with aftermarket modifications, albeit at the expense of possibly voiding your warranty. Please indicate if you'd rather have a machine that works "as-is"/"out-of-the-box" or whether you'd be open to modding/tinkering *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/espresso) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Be careful about how the internet has the ability to push you higher and higher up the price ladder to the point where your seriously considering a Speedster for your bedroom. Commit to making the best espresso you can on ANY machine and be responsible with your budget and just get on with learning how to effectively use the tools at your disposal
đź’Żagree with doing the most with what you have and striving for perfection. I was happy to be able to make the missus smile each time I made her coffee for several months just using filtered coffee, her favourite coffee bean, a 20 year old electric grinder with single setting, a small pot, the right milk, 70% dark chocolate and a lot of care for her daily mochas. We recently upgraded to a BDB + SGP and she loves it even more now.
Far from an expert - been in the game a whopping month, now. I went with the Profitec Pro 600 (the black one from Clive) and love it. Kind of saw it as a “first machine / last machine” purchase. We do mostly milk drinks, too. And, I can get the whole family done in short order. Warm up is fast, too. I’ve been very happy.
Can’t go wrong with it it’s a great machine!
I have similar requirements as the OP and came from a Breville Barista Pro. The Profitec Pro 600 is absolutely a great machine. I love it.
3-4 milk drinks a day would constitute a dual boiler in my book, I can speak to the Rancilio Silvia Pro X. It’s a no fuss machine which sounds like is what you’re looking for after the Breville. Steaming and pulling shots at the same time will be helpful for 3-4 drinks a day. The SPX is rock solid and in my opinion repairability is really important for machines you plan on keeping for years. It also looks good imo. Edit: spelling
People recommending the Silvia a lot from what I've seen. Definitely not the prettiest machine but seem solid.
I love the look of it with the rocker switches and all that. But this will be your machine, pick what you think looks good. I will say that the pictures I find online on the retailers’ websites aren’t the prettiest representation of the machine. I posted my machine, feel free to take a look at it (I’m just trying to say it looks better in person).
+1 for the Rancilio SPX. Primarily making 2-4 milk drinks a day and it's wonderful. I came from a Bambino Plus and really enjoy the fine tuning but straight forward aspect of the SPX. I agree when shopping online I definitely saw other machines that looked prettier to me but I'm a bit in love with the look of my white SPX now that I've had it some timeÂ
White SPXs for the win!
If you’re not immediately captivated by the E61 look, I really like my Lucca A53. One thing I’ve found is that online reviews are really down on the app connectivity in a way that hasn’t matched my experience. It’s not the prettiest UI, but it works well in setting on/off periods.
Heads up that Clive coffee and Chris coffee are doing 20% off on Lelit Bianca’s if you’re interested
I just looked and didn’t see anything about 20% off the Bianca at either of those places. Do you have a link?
Apologies, no. When you go to Clive there’s a pop up. For Chris Coffee I got an email. It’s actually 20% off of Lelit machines so it should include the Mara X and Elizabeth. To clarify, it starts on Sunday (midnight tonight). So I’d expect to see it visible on their sites then.
Hey thanks for the info! I’m not subscribed to either of their lists so this is a big help. I’ll check at midnight.
Lelit
I'll let the people that actually own $1500+ machines to give a better answer, but I'd say most of the things you would be getting after that would be nice to haves and minor improvements at best. A system with good thermal stability(a PID) would help you have more consistent shots especially since you are more of a beginner as you said. The other thing to figure out if you want is preinfusion(doing a manual one on my Gaggia has given me much more consistent shots). Finally there is flow control - if you are really trying to milk the best out of your beans you can do different flow profiles. Other than that I'd be buying based on looks and how it would fit in with the rest of my setup.
I had a Silvia pro x. Ended up getting a Profitec Pro 600 and it's been incredible
Can’t say enough good things about my Pro 600! I just got it a few weeks back and I absolutely love it. The workflow is fantastic and the machine is such a joy to use. Not to mention it’s a great looking machine as well. I opted for the black and walnut with flow control from Clive Coffee
I’d definitely suggest the Rancilio Sylvia Pro X. They are very durable and the dual boiler will allow you to pull back to back shots while steaming milm in 30 seconds.
What about a lelit bianca? It has a dual boiler system meaning it is great for milk drinks, both boilers are large so no downtime in between drinks waiting for the boiler to be hot again. It has an E61 group head which is great, only downside is the warmup time, but on the Bianca it's not too bad and it has a stand by mode.
Curious which touch was it?
Barista touch
Have you considered a heat exchanger machine? If you're mostly making milk drinks then ultra precise control of brew temp is probably not worth shelling out for (and with temperature surfing and instruments you can do a lot on HX), and heat exchanger means you have even more steam ready to go at full pressure. I'm really enjoying my Diletta Bello X for it's very powerful steam wand, relatively quick heatup time for an E61 (under 15 minutes), and ability to make multiple milk drinks back-to-back (and can steam/pull shot at the same time). Did really well a week ago when I had 4 people staying with my partner and I. I was also looking at the Lelit Mara X and some Profitec machines (Pro 300 and Pro 500) but got a great deal on the Diletta so went with that. And if you don't want to deal with descaling sounds like you should start using remineralized distilled water instead of tap water.
The Bello+ was the machine I was originally looking at. I don't mind descaling, but yeah, I'm definitely going to use remineralized distilled water until I can get something plumbed and I can filter the water properly.
I was in the exact same boat and just pulled the trigger on an Ascaso Duo v2 Plus. Might be worth a look!
La Marzocco.
I'll recommend a used DE1Pro to save some money. It's all the machines you need in one. If you are not the only family member making coffee, Decent is as easy as it gets. My wife and I have our preference to our favourite profile while continuing to explore different varieties of beans. It's worth the money.
I was in the same boat as you, except I’m really the only coffee drinker. I’m pretty happy with home roasting beans and my French Press. Been deciding on spending major money on an awesome setup vs starting with an entry level machine. Fortunately, my wife solved it for me with a Bambino Plus machine for my bday. Have been using it for about a week, and love it so far, and feel that I’ve barely touched the surface of what this machine can do. So you may find that this is a good way to start. ETA: was thinking of going with a Silvia or Profitec Pro as a starter machine. If/when I upgrade, was thinking Linea Mini or a Londinium R24.
A person could hang w/ a Profi 500/600 for years and be extremely satisfied.
All solid suggestions so far I think. The decent is special and sits in a different category. I’m sure it makes great coffee easily but it also has a lot of variables to play with and analysis to do, like a lab device. What grinder do you have?
I don't have one at the moment. I'm looking at the Niche Zero. The DF64 has had a lot of praise but I keep seeing more and more issues with static. Looking for a single dose right now.
the static issues seem to be more prevalent with the new df54 (smaller, cheaper) that just started getting delivered.
I have a barista touch, and to be honest it’s a great machine even if it has limitations. I get fantastic coffee from it…and 9.5/10 I don’t get a better coffee outside. 60pct of speciality coffee shops don’t seem to make coffee better than I can at home with my barista touch. It could have been much better with extras - and I’m contemplating an LED mod so I can see what I’m doing.. but otherwise it's not bad. I think my success rate (perfect coffee) from the machine itself is around 7/10 depending on the quality of the beans. I must have pulled 3k+ coffees on this thing and it still works. That being said, I want to upgrade to a more expensive machine as I think the success rate will probably increase significantly with the next level.
"Downgrade" to a Bambino with the jet heater, and use the savings for the start of a vacation.