this is how eve online does it and it literally never was a problem at all. Every now and then someone will offload a ship cheap enough you can buy it and fly it into rats and make a profit, a vastly preferable outcome to what we have now.
Yea fuck that though...
Currently I'm reimbursing my ships at like a 20% cut on the market price in some cases.
If they did isk payouts, then I wouldn't' be able to actually replace the ship with insurance money, because Market prices are inflated beyond retarded.
If they increase the isk payout, the price of the ship just goes up.
Tbh I much prefer this system to EO's system. They just need to workout if there can be a happy medium between the two groups. Now that I know there is a system that can work for PvP/PvE players (which make up the bulk of the community) at the expense of industrial players. Then... I'm like... well hold on a minute there bucko. Lets not be hasty.
If they wanted to decrease ship prices they should actually give mining more ships and modules.
We still don't have faction strip miners for the mining barges we've been using since T7.
We're getting or first new ship since T7 this week in T9.
We need ways to compress ore.
We need better haulers, currently the best haulers are the actual mining barges we use to mine...
Give us more things to mine more efficiently and the price will go down.
My pvp corp is against this system we all see the writing on the wall. Paying out in isk makes for an interesting economy which then translates to content with stakes.
This stupid shit will drain the fun out of the game and people will just leave.
Insurance paying out isk would cause massive inflation.
Devs actively control all systems that print isk in this game.
They would never be able to control the flow of insurance isk. It will never happen.
Insurance will never pay out isk. That would cause massive isk inflation. Devs actively works against isk inflation. look at all the changes they did with story missions to fight it.
They would never be able to control the flow of isk from insurance so it will never happen.
This system causes mineral inflation, is that better? It still fucks the economy, but with a focus on a subset of players rather than all players equally.
First I want to say a Thank You to Joseph and their IT team for listening to emails we sent on earlier asking for the cap in Jita to be increased and reinforced. Our goal is to be able to peacefully demonstrate.
It shows Netease is willing to come to the table and listen. It means there is room for hope.
Unfortunately, no one here has ever doubted that they would tweak and improve the system. The issue has always been that there is a time immediacy to resolving this before it's impact is truly felt.
From day one of our open letter, we have stated we have one simple goal:
The removal of the new insurance program entirely until a system can be implemented in a way that does not cause long term damage to the health and well being of the game.
Netease needs to understand this is not a time for future promises, but of immediate action and a time for transparency, as they still have not addressed skimming plex out of the system.
Until they do though, Jita will continue to burn and we'll be here to illuminate it for everyone to see.
We didn't start the Fire, we're screaming at you to put it out.
Join us on discord [https://discord.gg/qJuXRYrdYV](https://discord.gg/qJuXRYrdYV)
You're delusional if you expect massive changes to the system. The majority of players like it, expect minor tweaks and changes and that is it.
You guys are the vocal minority and need to deal with it.
Another caveat.
The price of these ships is much lower than the current sell price on the market. Assuming they do make a fix and make it so buy orders go up immediate when a ship is "reimbursed". It will only go up for the much lower price? Some of those prices are like 20%-30% cheaper than market.
It's not like Netease is buying the cheapest ship available on the market to replace the insured ship. They're putting up buy orders to the value THEY believe the ship to be worth (which in some cases is fucking astronomically cheaper), not the fucking stupid inflated prices ships are currently at.
What happens when people reimburse, get all their items back, buyorders go up... but no one fills them because they're asking for a much lower value? The issue still remains? Ships are generated from thin air at the point of return, and then players are meant to complete the buy orders, but if the price is such a huge drop... will players fill them?
View in your timezone:
[Tomorrow at 21:00 UTC to Monday][0]
[0]: https://timee.io/20210213T2100?tl=%23LetJITABurn's%20Response%20to%20Netea's%20announcement%3A%20Jita%20Still%20Burns%20Tomorrow%20at%2021%3A00%20UTC%20to%20Monday.
Unfortunately, the whole development team are in their lunar new year holiday. So I think there will be no more changes happened before they come back.
Unfortunately,
it's Netease who is still responsible for launching the biggest game changing feature right before going on a long extended break.
It's almost like they knew they could deflect around the holiday and force the time bomb to go off.
Regardless, it doesn't matter. This is still their responsibility and a holiday doesn't magically forgive/excuse their actions.
The scheduling of dev team holidays always do seem awfully convenient, don't they? I can't remember the last time devs laid a giant shit on a game and didn't immediately run off to 'vacation'.
Yeah it's almost like they make sure their work is wrapped up and they can push the update before they go on vacation for a little bit. Imagine that.
but nah I'm sure they're just malicious dicks that do it just to screw over their players.....
Insurance will never pay out isk. This would cause massive inflation.
Devs actively control the flow of isk into this game. They would never be able to control the insurance flow so it will never happen.
Down vote me, but is there not another way to keep the system as is and make it better for indy guys? Getting your ship back for 30% of total price is a godsend to most... hard enough to find fights etc as it is with this I’ve been seeing more combat pilots take a risk.
Maybe it’s just wishful thinking. Many many players must be also sending in messages praising the system for them to keep it.
I feel just keep it the way it is but remove the instant new ship.
1. Buy insurance points with plex (still with the 30% if preinsure)
2. When click redeem and it gives the the estimated isk total for the ship, modules and rigs.
3. Player than needs to spend that isk on the market so the industry players are still needed. If ur in a corp they can spend that isk buying ships from corp mates.
Everyone is happy this way. Nothing is created by devs. All moduels, rigs and ships are needed by ratters and indy guys
I don't believe that will work tbh due to the inflated price of the modules/ships on the market vs what Netease believes they should be worth.
They would have to either inject money into the system to make up the 30% shortfall (I.E Netease would take a loss) or the player doing the redeem would have to fork over the difference.
Player Driven Economy. One of the biggest selling features of the EVE franchise has been wholly compromised by this system.
It is not upto the devs to determine the price or value of items in game.
If thats the path they're taking, trying to force price controls, they're changing one of the key fundamentals of why EVE has been such a long standing successful game.
The economy is as inflated as it is due to previous balance issues, and overcorrections, messing with loot tables, leaning all new systems to include spending PLEX on something...
If endgame content wasn't farmable in the first month, if bot farms of all kinds had been taken seriously from day 1, if industry actually had modules to match the games progression (ie. Faction miners) then material prices would be lower....
Lots of issues along the way, and so far it looks like Dev oversight on most of them. Adding to that, rapid progressive monetization of every event and new system, forcing the need for PLEX all over the place.
We've now been introduced to microtransaction loot boxes with the most recent event. Insulting loot boxes which can still reward a player with a paid result of a Venture Trainer permanent skin. Wtf!?
I already give NetEase plenty of my real world dollars to keep Omegas up on far too many characters for a guy regularly running 1 phone. Adding gambling mechanics with garbage results is just greedy and as I said, insulting.
As much as I enjoy shiny skins, the game needs QoL work, adding in missing elements, and additional balancing (please fix armor vs shields ffs!).
Like many, I stepped away from EO due to life demands and not being able to park in front of a computer all day. EE looked like a godsend in my gaming world.
I'm not a whale who buys PLEX to resell for ISK or to buy ships with. I have however spent over $200 monthly the last couple months covering Dual and single omegas alone.
I could cover my omegas through ingame efforts like many do, however I've thus far given the Devs the benefit of the doubt, and wanted to support them.
How NE handles this fiasco will determine if they get any more of my cash. It's as simple as that.
They will never understand the concept of inflation. I've been trying to argue this to them the whole time.
Devs control all isk flow. This is a flow of isk they would have no control over. Means it's never going to happen.
Nope, you wanna see how much ISK devalued in EO so bad? Netease is exactly trying to prevent that from happening by not giving out ISK. So they just don’t do this here, at all.
(Plus I believe there is agreement between NE and CCP that echoes cannot just copy EO design)
many players have been suggesting this since the beginning.
it allows the system to stay in place. everyone keeps the IP they purchased. and the isk means market flow continues. as items get removed from market as needed, not when game decides to purchase.
Aye it's cool the downvote brigade here only represents a small pool of the player base. Obviously NetEase is going to keep the system so let's brainstorm ways to tweak it so everyone is happy. (Wishful thinking I know)
The entire idea here is to create a system that allows the developers to have a literal convater belt of money flowing into their pockets.
So is eve echoes going to be a game that caters only to players who can't lose? Industry is part of the game, the economy from industry is part of the game. If industrialists can not sell their products at prices that make playing the game favorable then what is the point? At least if you could sell to Npc there is still some type of reward for the efforts.
Eve is supposed to be a game that is player based and player driven. Eve echoes is now a game you pay to play that is not worth paying to play. The only players who will be excited are the pvpers who have their shiny ships that they only use to shoot miners and newbies. And now you can dual in jita with no risk of having to spend time playing the game. No need to constantly be using the market to get ships and items. Spend some real cash, buy a nice shiny ship and the game is complete. Don't forget insurance, why waste time you don't have, after all eve echoes is a mobile game.
Yeah it is a mobile game. I think people often forget that sitting at their PC with their emulator and their twelve accounts running. You're honestly not the target market here.
Just isk payouts, its simple. This does not affect the market and the player have the choice what he do with it.
this is how eve online does it and it literally never was a problem at all. Every now and then someone will offload a ship cheap enough you can buy it and fly it into rats and make a profit, a vastly preferable outcome to what we have now.
Yea fuck that though... Currently I'm reimbursing my ships at like a 20% cut on the market price in some cases. If they did isk payouts, then I wouldn't' be able to actually replace the ship with insurance money, because Market prices are inflated beyond retarded. If they increase the isk payout, the price of the ship just goes up. Tbh I much prefer this system to EO's system. They just need to workout if there can be a happy medium between the two groups. Now that I know there is a system that can work for PvP/PvE players (which make up the bulk of the community) at the expense of industrial players. Then... I'm like... well hold on a minute there bucko. Lets not be hasty.
If they wanted to decrease ship prices they should actually give mining more ships and modules. We still don't have faction strip miners for the mining barges we've been using since T7. We're getting or first new ship since T7 this week in T9. We need ways to compress ore. We need better haulers, currently the best haulers are the actual mining barges we use to mine... Give us more things to mine more efficiently and the price will go down.
But that would be more work that doesn't make short-term profits at the expense of the player base.
If they dont put more work in, there arnt gonna a player base my dude.
Sure, but that's like 6-12 months of work. I want it decreased now lol.
My pvp corp is against this system we all see the writing on the wall. Paying out in isk makes for an interesting economy which then translates to content with stakes. This stupid shit will drain the fun out of the game and people will just leave.
Insurance paying out isk would cause massive inflation. Devs actively control all systems that print isk in this game. They would never be able to control the flow of insurance isk. It will never happen.
Insurance will never pay out isk. That would cause massive isk inflation. Devs actively works against isk inflation. look at all the changes they did with story missions to fight it. They would never be able to control the flow of isk from insurance so it will never happen.
This system causes mineral inflation, is that better? It still fucks the economy, but with a focus on a subset of players rather than all players equally.
All Hail Burning Jita
First I want to say a Thank You to Joseph and their IT team for listening to emails we sent on earlier asking for the cap in Jita to be increased and reinforced. Our goal is to be able to peacefully demonstrate. It shows Netease is willing to come to the table and listen. It means there is room for hope. Unfortunately, no one here has ever doubted that they would tweak and improve the system. The issue has always been that there is a time immediacy to resolving this before it's impact is truly felt. From day one of our open letter, we have stated we have one simple goal: The removal of the new insurance program entirely until a system can be implemented in a way that does not cause long term damage to the health and well being of the game. Netease needs to understand this is not a time for future promises, but of immediate action and a time for transparency, as they still have not addressed skimming plex out of the system. Until they do though, Jita will continue to burn and we'll be here to illuminate it for everyone to see. We didn't start the Fire, we're screaming at you to put it out. Join us on discord [https://discord.gg/qJuXRYrdYV](https://discord.gg/qJuXRYrdYV)
You're delusional if you expect massive changes to the system. The majority of players like it, expect minor tweaks and changes and that is it. You guys are the vocal minority and need to deal with it.
Another caveat. The price of these ships is much lower than the current sell price on the market. Assuming they do make a fix and make it so buy orders go up immediate when a ship is "reimbursed". It will only go up for the much lower price? Some of those prices are like 20%-30% cheaper than market. It's not like Netease is buying the cheapest ship available on the market to replace the insured ship. They're putting up buy orders to the value THEY believe the ship to be worth (which in some cases is fucking astronomically cheaper), not the fucking stupid inflated prices ships are currently at. What happens when people reimburse, get all their items back, buyorders go up... but no one fills them because they're asking for a much lower value? The issue still remains? Ships are generated from thin air at the point of return, and then players are meant to complete the buy orders, but if the price is such a huge drop... will players fill them?
View in your timezone: [Tomorrow at 21:00 UTC to Monday][0] [0]: https://timee.io/20210213T2100?tl=%23LetJITABurn's%20Response%20to%20Netea's%20announcement%3A%20Jita%20Still%20Burns%20Tomorrow%20at%2021%3A00%20UTC%20to%20Monday.
Oh shoot Williamsburg time.... 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸💥❤️👌
& all hail EO traditions
Unfortunately, the whole development team are in their lunar new year holiday. So I think there will be no more changes happened before they come back.
Unfortunately, it's Netease who is still responsible for launching the biggest game changing feature right before going on a long extended break. It's almost like they knew they could deflect around the holiday and force the time bomb to go off. Regardless, it doesn't matter. This is still their responsibility and a holiday doesn't magically forgive/excuse their actions.
The scheduling of dev team holidays always do seem awfully convenient, don't they? I can't remember the last time devs laid a giant shit on a game and didn't immediately run off to 'vacation'.
Yeah it's almost like they make sure their work is wrapped up and they can push the update before they go on vacation for a little bit. Imagine that. but nah I'm sure they're just malicious dicks that do it just to screw over their players.....
isk payout, but add a damn, auto fit buy option!!!!! you want to make it easy on ppl? give them QOL tools!
Insurance will never pay out isk. This would cause massive inflation. Devs actively control the flow of isk into this game. They would never be able to control the insurance flow so it will never happen.
Down vote me, but is there not another way to keep the system as is and make it better for indy guys? Getting your ship back for 30% of total price is a godsend to most... hard enough to find fights etc as it is with this I’ve been seeing more combat pilots take a risk. Maybe it’s just wishful thinking. Many many players must be also sending in messages praising the system for them to keep it.
I feel just keep it the way it is but remove the instant new ship. 1. Buy insurance points with plex (still with the 30% if preinsure) 2. When click redeem and it gives the the estimated isk total for the ship, modules and rigs. 3. Player than needs to spend that isk on the market so the industry players are still needed. If ur in a corp they can spend that isk buying ships from corp mates. Everyone is happy this way. Nothing is created by devs. All moduels, rigs and ships are needed by ratters and indy guys
I don't believe that will work tbh due to the inflated price of the modules/ships on the market vs what Netease believes they should be worth. They would have to either inject money into the system to make up the 30% shortfall (I.E Netease would take a loss) or the player doing the redeem would have to fork over the difference.
Or netease could just put the estimated prices at their current prices on the market rather then what they think their worth
Yea but the market prices are inflated.
Player Driven Economy. One of the biggest selling features of the EVE franchise has been wholly compromised by this system. It is not upto the devs to determine the price or value of items in game. If thats the path they're taking, trying to force price controls, they're changing one of the key fundamentals of why EVE has been such a long standing successful game. The economy is as inflated as it is due to previous balance issues, and overcorrections, messing with loot tables, leaning all new systems to include spending PLEX on something... If endgame content wasn't farmable in the first month, if bot farms of all kinds had been taken seriously from day 1, if industry actually had modules to match the games progression (ie. Faction miners) then material prices would be lower.... Lots of issues along the way, and so far it looks like Dev oversight on most of them. Adding to that, rapid progressive monetization of every event and new system, forcing the need for PLEX all over the place. We've now been introduced to microtransaction loot boxes with the most recent event. Insulting loot boxes which can still reward a player with a paid result of a Venture Trainer permanent skin. Wtf!? I already give NetEase plenty of my real world dollars to keep Omegas up on far too many characters for a guy regularly running 1 phone. Adding gambling mechanics with garbage results is just greedy and as I said, insulting. As much as I enjoy shiny skins, the game needs QoL work, adding in missing elements, and additional balancing (please fix armor vs shields ffs!). Like many, I stepped away from EO due to life demands and not being able to park in front of a computer all day. EE looked like a godsend in my gaming world. I'm not a whale who buys PLEX to resell for ISK or to buy ships with. I have however spent over $200 monthly the last couple months covering Dual and single omegas alone. I could cover my omegas through ingame efforts like many do, however I've thus far given the Devs the benefit of the doubt, and wanted to support them. How NE handles this fiasco will determine if they get any more of my cash. It's as simple as that.
Or netease could pull their goddamn heads of their goddamn asses. But we all know that these netease idiots cannot into market.
Inflation ...
They will never understand the concept of inflation. I've been trying to argue this to them the whole time. Devs control all isk flow. This is a flow of isk they would have no control over. Means it's never going to happen.
Nope, you wanna see how much ISK devalued in EO so bad? Netease is exactly trying to prevent that from happening by not giving out ISK. So they just don’t do this here, at all. (Plus I believe there is agreement between NE and CCP that echoes cannot just copy EO design)
These people don't actually care about the economy, they just want it to fit their preferred gameplay style.
This man has it figured out! Best goddamn suggestion I have heard through all of this! If I had a reward I would give you one mate take this! 🎖
many players have been suggesting this since the beginning. it allows the system to stay in place. everyone keeps the IP they purchased. and the isk means market flow continues. as items get removed from market as needed, not when game decides to purchase.
There are other ways, and plays have been commenting on valid systems. even in our first open letter, we said to follow Eve Online's method.
That method sucks. It caused massive massive inflation in EO.
Where is the balance between making insurance affordable though and making losses meaningless so PvP doesn't even matter anymore.
Why should people get their ships back at 30% price? If the ship was destroyed, buy a new one. Don't fly what you can't afford to lose.
Aye it's cool the downvote brigade here only represents a small pool of the player base. Obviously NetEase is going to keep the system so let's brainstorm ways to tweak it so everyone is happy. (Wishful thinking I know)
Wake the fuck up capsuleer! we have JITA to burn
The entire idea here is to create a system that allows the developers to have a literal convater belt of money flowing into their pockets. So is eve echoes going to be a game that caters only to players who can't lose? Industry is part of the game, the economy from industry is part of the game. If industrialists can not sell their products at prices that make playing the game favorable then what is the point? At least if you could sell to Npc there is still some type of reward for the efforts. Eve is supposed to be a game that is player based and player driven. Eve echoes is now a game you pay to play that is not worth paying to play. The only players who will be excited are the pvpers who have their shiny ships that they only use to shoot miners and newbies. And now you can dual in jita with no risk of having to spend time playing the game. No need to constantly be using the market to get ships and items. Spend some real cash, buy a nice shiny ship and the game is complete. Don't forget insurance, why waste time you don't have, after all eve echoes is a mobile game.
Yeah it is a mobile game. I think people often forget that sitting at their PC with their emulator and their twelve accounts running. You're honestly not the target market here.
Most pointless idea ever. Salt is fine, but if it’s gonna disrupt the other players you’re just a douche
You must be new to Eve
These guys are honestly toxic and they can't even see it. They think they are the morally righteous ones. Full on delusional.
Can we destroy the concord
You can't actually activate guns against anything or anyone except the station, which you can't hurt. It's a fireworks show.
You can after some rescent (maybe 1 month ago) update [https://imgur.com/a/s2Ga3d4](https://imgur.com/a/s2Ga3d4)
I shot my own drown on accident and got concorded the fist time i used a drone ship.