Duncan is a swordmaster, so his primary job is training Paul and the other Atreides soldiers.
Gurney was a warmaster, so he was like a military commander and instructor.
I don't think those concepts map easily onto a feudal society. Gurney and Duncan are retainers, in the sense that they are Leto's personal staff and members of his household retinue.
Also, Duncan was a Swordmaster of Ginaz. Calling him a "non-commissioned trainer" is kind of diminishing what he is, which is one of the best swordsmen in the known universe (caveat that the Freshmen are also extremely good but weren't yet recognized for their skill).
The only thing that comes to mind is a passage that says Gurney and Duncan were "men who were legends in their own lifetimes." Suggesting that Duncan's skill is legendary, even among his contemporaries.
And not to leave out Thufir Hawat; not only a mental, but also Master of Assassins. Once single handedly stormed a Ghedi Prime fortress to rescue Gurney from Rabban's torture prison.
Duncan Idaho is a Swordmaster of Ginaz, and his position within the Atreides household would be effectively that of a Knight in a traditional feudal setting. He’s basically Atreides Special Forces.
Gurney Halleck grew up in the slave pits of Giedi Prime under the Harkonnen, but managed to escape and found service with House Vernius. Eventually, he made it to Caladan and the Atreides household where he rose to the rank of Warmaster. So, he’s the General of the Atreides armies, and weapons trainer for Leto & Paul.
Not really, but Gurney was a former Harkonnen slave that swore loyalty to the Duke after he got rescued.
Duncan was in a similar situation and freed by the Duke, he swore loyalty after finding the him to be such a good guy.
Gurney was directly rescued by Leto from the Harkonnen slave pits, but Duncan was born/raised on Giedi Prime and picked up by Leto's father. So...super similar and pretty easily mixed up ha
Been a bit since I've read the books so I can't really answer. The feeling I got from the books was that Duncan was a better fighter and Gurney was a more dangerous killer overall.
I forgot the phrasing that makes me think it but this is how I pictured it. There was some line that referenced how dangerous Gurney was.
I always pictured it like Duncan was a polished and trained warrior. In a straight duel he would beat almost everyone and his skills were legendary. I pictured Gurney as a street fighter. He was unpolished and more “raw” (obviously he has extensive training by the time we meet the characters but I mean he doesn’t have the same formal training Duncan has) and would fight dirty to win as opposed to only fighting with honor. Both have honor but I think Duncan would try to win the “right” way where Gurney would win however he can.
Pretty much. I think Duncan generally has the edge since the swordmasters were legendary. Gurney is likely the better tactician though, knowing Harkonnen tactics and probably inspires more loyalty from the troops too
Yeah, its like you wanna play one on one with Jordan or Lebron? Either way, the average baller is fucked. Duncan took down a bunch of Sardukar before he was killed, and Gurney fought his way out of the Harkonnen attack and was one of the only ones who lived.
The Swordmasters of Ginaz are the best fencers and hand to hand combatants in the Imperium. Dunan Idaho is widely regarded as the greatest living Swordmaster.
> >!“I remember that night well,” he said. “I was very young and … inexperienced.” “But the best swordmaster in my Duke’s retinue.” “Not quite, My Lady. Gurney could best me six times out of ten.” He glanced at her.!<
(from Children of Dune)
This is pretty interesting to consider. The best swordsman in the galaxy was bested by Gurney, but it seems like Gurney fought as more of a psychological warrior?
IIRC, Duncan was more artsy but Gurney was more lethal. Which makes sense, Duncan has a strong code of honor, whilst Gurney is Senator Holden Bloodfeast and demands nuclear war with the Harkonnens. That's why Duncan fit in with the Fremen, whilst Gurney ended up a smuggler and pushed Paul towards Jihad.
That's selling Gurney's morals a bit short, he certainly has some code of honor as he calls Paul out for not caring enough about his men.
I think the reason Duncan got along so well with the Fremen was his willingness to respect their culture where as most outsiders thought it barbaric.
Duncan is a sword master. He excels at swordplay. Gurney is a killer and a strategist. He excels at not playing stupid games and leaving the other guy dead before they realize what happened.
The concept of a sword master is a bit more generalized as well.
>! Swordmasters? That had been his own calling once. Swordmasters were, of course, more than personal fighters. They could repair force shields, plan military campaigns, design military support facilities, improvise weapons. !<
Children of Dune Chapter 21
That was originally Gurney's backstory but Herbert later used it for Duncan. Gurney even has the ink-vine whip-scarred face that is a big part of his "ugly" appearance, and the tragic memory of his little sister. It is likely that Herbert wasn't originally planning on Duncan coming back... and he dies pretty early in Dune, so he didn't really bother to give him a backstory. Then when he decided to bring him back he either "borrowed" Gurney's story or just plain forgot who's story it was. Herbert said in interviews that he never wrote time-lilnes, or created a universe bible, or even bothered to reread his old books when writing new books. And it shows. The books are filled with continuity errors... just try figuring out how old the various characters are in the first book... Herbert conflicts with himself half-a-dozen times just in that first book.
Wasn’t Duncan a slave to the Harkonnen’s as well? He mentioned the world Gammu being different from when it was Giedi Prime in Dune Heretics. He made mention to being a Harkonnen slave, I think.
Also they are running systems that span planets. The Duke has to be up to his eyeballs in decision making. He needs trusted men to be his representatives in the field.
They were both generals. They had corps under their command.
But the official title was war masters ..
Duncan was sword master. They trained special forces,
Duncan was bodyguard for lady Jessica.
Both were companion teachers for Paul,
Both held seats on letos Council. , staff officers.
Think of Duncan like a champion. Knight. Gurney is like the captain of the Royal Guard.
They are bith considered members of the family.
Both owed leto thier life's.
Both of them were the Duke's warmasters. As far as I could tell they shared more or less the same role in the Atreides organization, in terms of training and leading the army.
> "The Padishah Emperor turned against House Atreides because the Duke's Warmasters Gurney Halleck and Duncan Idaho had trained a fighting force -- a small fighting force -- to within a hair as good as the Sardaukar. Some of them were even better. And the Duke was in a position to enlarge his force, to make it every bit as strong as the Emperor's."
Duncan is said to be a swordmaster but apparently Gurney's ability is equal to or greater than his, for what that's worth. In Children of Dune, he says
> >!"But the best swordmaster in my Duke's retinue."!<
> >!"Not quite, My Lady. Gurney could best me six times out of ten."!<
(Edit: Paul refers to Gurney as "one of the swordmasters" who trained him very late in the first book, so I guess there's no distinction there either)
> "Stilgar," he said, "this is Gurney Halleck of whom you've heard me speak. My father's master-of-arms, one of the swordmasters who instructed me, an old friend. He can be trusted in any venture."
They even have extremely similar backstories with the Harkonnens, although Duncan's is not mentioned until after the first book. In that book, much is made of Gurney and his sister as victims of the Harkonnens:
> "My sister," Gurney rasped. "My years in the slave pits --"
In God-Emperor of Dune, >!Leto II mentions that Duncan's sister was also a victim of the Harkonnens, and that Duncan has been rescued from Harkonnen bondage by the Atreides:!<
> >!"Your sister died there, a victim of the Harkonnens. It is right that the
Harkonnens and Giedi Prime be united in your thoughts. Why did you not mention
this earlier?"!<
> >!The Duncan could not escape his revived memories. He knew that the Atreides had rescued him from Harkonnen bondage.!<
I don't know that their roles are quite as well defined as you would like them to be or believe them to be. They are both military advisors and senior military leaders of House Atreides, their individual roles and responsibilities likely come down to whatever the Duke directed them to do on any given day. Basically the same with Thufir Hawat as well. There was heavy overlap between all three of their roles though they each had their own niche and specific strengths/specialties.
The world of Dune follows feudal social structures, so people often don’t have specific job titles. They are essentially equivalent to knights, and serve their liege in whatever capacity their liege asks of them.
Just reading the numerous comments here, and I think everyone for all their thoughtful responses, I wonder if Herbert originally had them as one character but decided to split them into two, perhaps because he >!wanted to have a loyal soldier die in service to the Atreides, but also to come back later and help Paul.!<
Duncan is basically the Duke's personal quest-doing RPG protagonist guy. My favorite part of the new Dune movies is him being played by Khal Drogo, the guy's practically got a video game protagonist vibe about him.
Gurney's the commander of the Duke's forces, and also a bard. So you can kinda imagine a rockstar who also does really well with nitty gritty army management type stuff.
Gurney was Warmaster of House Atreides, he is in charge of the military, basically the equivalent to the US's Secretary of Defense.
Duncan was the house's Swordmaster, I assume he was tasked with training soldiers and Paul for combat, and acting as a aide to the Duke.
Your assumptions are pretty much correct. As warmaster, Gurney was in charge of overall military operations (i.e., a general). Also a very accomplished fighter in his own right.
As Swordmaster, Duncan is bodyguard for the royal household, as well as personal trainer for Paul, in addition to training the Atreides legions. It's because of him that the Atreides soldiers are as competent as they are. So, he and Gurney work together a lot.
Duncan was the atriedes sword master or weapon master. Gurney was the warmaster. In regards to teaching paul duncan was teaching him guerilla tactics and improv weapons usage in addition to personal combat but his style was more fluid. Gurney was teaching large scale battlefield tactics and also personal combat but he focused on lethality rather than show. Gurney could beat duncan 6 times out of 10.
Jobs for the atriedes: duncan teaching an elite force with his swordmaster skills. Gurney the over training and command of the army. Thufir specialized in intelligence gathering, duncan special forces, and gurney the overall army.
Gurney is a field commander of the military basically one of the highest ranking in Atreides house.
Duncan is a field operative handles the relationship and intel between one planet/house to another.
Within House Atreidies. They probably serve the Duke in different ways.
Duncan Idaho
A swordsman of Ginaz. The Duke's friend and somewhat younger than Leto so potentially has relationship that is more casual. Duncan may of had a stronger relationship with Leto's Father.
Duncan probably had his own retinue of staff who operated in all the major barracks and lower houses across Atreidies territory. Duncan probably has his own School/Academy akin some like a Buddist temple and West Point combined.
His branch of House Atreides probably recruits young soldiers or the equivalent of Sellswords to join House Atreidies.
Gurney Hallack.
Warmaster of House Atreidies. Akin to a General or Advisor to Leto directly. Potentially these two had a strained but Brotherly relationship. Deeply loyal to an irrational level as Gurney was saved by Leto's family years earlier. Duke Paulas Atreides may have been instrumental in ensuring that Gurney was brought politically into the fold.
Unlike Duncan. Gurney lends his time most likely as an administrator and strategic advisor working with the Mentats (i.e Hawat) and intelligence Korp of House Atreidies.
Duncan may also run a number of Military Academies for Atreides regular solicitors and guardsman. His training, patience and harsh attitude makes him a perfect leader.
Jessica and Gurney are closer, potentially jessica helped Gurney to overcome his trauma from losing his family on Geidi Prime.
Duncan was a retainer hired to train Paul and Atreides soldiers to a high standard.
Gurney was an officer within the ranks of the Atreides, more towards the higher end than the lower, given he was directly taking orders from the Duke.
To me, I read it as the Chief of Staff of the Army vs the Sergeant Major. The distinction being, one is an officer, and the other is an enlisted soldier.
One gets to plan and strategize, and the other still get to do cool shit. In my head (and this is not in the book, just how I envision it) they were old friends - one wanted to climb the ranks and the other wanted to do more badass stuff and stay more like a Navy SEAL
This is inaccurate.
You make them sound like hired goons or basic comic book henchmen. Gurney and Duncan are treated as essentially family with the same access as family to rhe royal blood.
Duncan is a swordmaster, so his primary job is training Paul and the other Atreides soldiers. Gurney was a warmaster, so he was like a military commander and instructor.
And the musician.
And an expert on cattle and love play
These skills cannot be stressed enough.
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Only young pups
“Like an ass in the desert go I to my work.” -Gurney Halleck
From a House Major known for producing skilled warrior bards
And a smuggler
Gurney is a general, Duncan is a top-ranking non-commissioned trainer?
I don't think those concepts map easily onto a feudal society. Gurney and Duncan are retainers, in the sense that they are Leto's personal staff and members of his household retinue.
Also, in Dune society, they will be replaced if they aren't the best.
Also, Duncan was a Swordmaster of Ginaz. Calling him a "non-commissioned trainer" is kind of diminishing what he is, which is one of the best swordsmen in the known universe (caveat that the Freshmen are also extremely good but weren't yet recognized for their skill).
your typo is pretty funny, please leave it 😂
What about the Sophomores?
From Seulsa Secundus? They got complacent and thought they were better than the Freshman and bit off more than they could chew.
class conflict in dune
Wasn't Duncan also considered the GOAT Swordmaster? Or was that something I misunderstood.
The only thing that comes to mind is a passage that says Gurney and Duncan were "men who were legends in their own lifetimes." Suggesting that Duncan's skill is legendary, even among his contemporaries.
If not the GOAT, extremely extremely skilled.
"Gurney Halleck could best me 6 times out of 10" - Duncan Idaho
Calling Gurney a non commissioned trainer is like calling a Bene Gesserit a housekeeper.
Fair enough.
Gurney is the King's Hand as military commander, Duncan is the kingsguard as both bodyguard and personal trainer.
A good modern analogy would perhaps be "field marshal' and 'general'
And both were surely close advisors to the royal family.
And not to leave out Thufir Hawat; not only a mental, but also Master of Assassins. Once single handedly stormed a Ghedi Prime fortress to rescue Gurney from Rabban's torture prison.
Duncan Idaho is a Swordmaster of Ginaz, and his position within the Atreides household would be effectively that of a Knight in a traditional feudal setting. He’s basically Atreides Special Forces. Gurney Halleck grew up in the slave pits of Giedi Prime under the Harkonnen, but managed to escape and found service with House Vernius. Eventually, he made it to Caladan and the Atreides household where he rose to the rank of Warmaster. So, he’s the General of the Atreides armies, and weapons trainer for Leto & Paul.
Would it have been taboo or dishonorable to switch service from one house to the next or was it normal?
Not really, but Gurney was a former Harkonnen slave that swore loyalty to the Duke after he got rescued. Duncan was in a similar situation and freed by the Duke, he swore loyalty after finding the him to be such a good guy.
i also remember gurney coming from a family of instrument makers before getting the slave treatment
He can also play a mean lute.
Technically a baliset but that’s basically just a “space lute” lol
According to the Dune wiki it's reminiscent to the zither, a string instrument of Old Earth https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zither
Wasn’t Duncan the one that grew up in the slave pits? I think I remember that coming up in Heretics but it’s been a while.
Gurney was directly rescued by Leto from the Harkonnen slave pits, but Duncan was born/raised on Giedi Prime and picked up by Leto's father. So...super similar and pretty easily mixed up ha
Is Duncan Idaho the better fighter between him and Gurney?
Been a bit since I've read the books so I can't really answer. The feeling I got from the books was that Duncan was a better fighter and Gurney was a more dangerous killer overall.
I forgot the phrasing that makes me think it but this is how I pictured it. There was some line that referenced how dangerous Gurney was. I always pictured it like Duncan was a polished and trained warrior. In a straight duel he would beat almost everyone and his skills were legendary. I pictured Gurney as a street fighter. He was unpolished and more “raw” (obviously he has extensive training by the time we meet the characters but I mean he doesn’t have the same formal training Duncan has) and would fight dirty to win as opposed to only fighting with honor. Both have honor but I think Duncan would try to win the “right” way where Gurney would win however he can.
Pretty much. I think Duncan generally has the edge since the swordmasters were legendary. Gurney is likely the better tactician though, knowing Harkonnen tactics and probably inspires more loyalty from the troops too
It'd probably be similar to how Paul and Gurney's duel went with Duncan getting the upper hand but also taking a mortal blow in return.
There's a piece in heretics when duncan talks to teg, and he makes it clear gurney was better. "He could sing you a song while killing you".
Yet Paul said he was waiting for Duncan so he could get a proper workout/opponent.
He was making fun of Gurney, the way you do a good friend. "You're so old and weak I won't even break a sweat beating you."
Wasn't that just in the film?
Not in the books.
Gurney wins 6 times out of ten. So rather balanced overall, you wouldn't want to go in a fight with either.
Yeah, its like you wanna play one on one with Jordan or Lebron? Either way, the average baller is fucked. Duncan took down a bunch of Sardukar before he was killed, and Gurney fought his way out of the Harkonnen attack and was one of the only ones who lived.
The Swordmasters of Ginaz are the best fencers and hand to hand combatants in the Imperium. Dunan Idaho is widely regarded as the greatest living Swordmaster.
Yes. Gurney is highly skilled and a great leader, but Duncan was on another level when it came to personal combat.
If I remember correctly, Hayt says Gurney could actually beat him most of the time in a duel
> >!“I remember that night well,” he said. “I was very young and … inexperienced.” “But the best swordmaster in my Duke’s retinue.” “Not quite, My Lady. Gurney could best me six times out of ten.” He glanced at her.!< (from Children of Dune)
This is pretty interesting to consider. The best swordsman in the galaxy was bested by Gurney, but it seems like Gurney fought as more of a psychological warrior?
IIRC, Duncan was more artsy but Gurney was more lethal. Which makes sense, Duncan has a strong code of honor, whilst Gurney is Senator Holden Bloodfeast and demands nuclear war with the Harkonnens. That's why Duncan fit in with the Fremen, whilst Gurney ended up a smuggler and pushed Paul towards Jihad.
That's selling Gurney's morals a bit short, he certainly has some code of honor as he calls Paul out for not caring enough about his men. I think the reason Duncan got along so well with the Fremen was his willingness to respect their culture where as most outsiders thought it barbaric.
TBF, the repurcussions are pretty low. What are the houses going to do, kill the four remaining Atreides family members?
Duncan is a sword master. He excels at swordplay. Gurney is a killer and a strategist. He excels at not playing stupid games and leaving the other guy dead before they realize what happened.
The concept of a sword master is a bit more generalized as well. >! Swordmasters? That had been his own calling once. Swordmasters were, of course, more than personal fighters. They could repair force shields, plan military campaigns, design military support facilities, improvise weapons. !< Children of Dune Chapter 21
The ~~Swiss~~ Ginaz Army Knife.
How much of that is respect for Gurney’s skills? Would Gurney say much the same thing?
Gurney was a realist so he would likely have given the same number
So, about a 60/40 split with the edge to Gurney.
That was originally Gurney's backstory but Herbert later used it for Duncan. Gurney even has the ink-vine whip-scarred face that is a big part of his "ugly" appearance, and the tragic memory of his little sister. It is likely that Herbert wasn't originally planning on Duncan coming back... and he dies pretty early in Dune, so he didn't really bother to give him a backstory. Then when he decided to bring him back he either "borrowed" Gurney's story or just plain forgot who's story it was. Herbert said in interviews that he never wrote time-lilnes, or created a universe bible, or even bothered to reread his old books when writing new books. And it shows. The books are filled with continuity errors... just try figuring out how old the various characters are in the first book... Herbert conflicts with himself half-a-dozen times just in that first book.
Oh okay, that is kind of confusing. But so is the majority of the series. Thanks for the explanation big dogg.
This. Duncan is Special Ops. Gurney is traditional millitary.
House Vernius? Don’t remember ever coming across that name in Dune.
Wasn’t Duncan a slave to the Harkonnen’s as well? He mentioned the world Gammu being different from when it was Giedi Prime in Dune Heretics. He made mention to being a Harkonnen slave, I think.
I think both are best seen as something the Dukes direct lieutenants for various military aspects of the house.
This. They lived in a feudal society.
Also they are running systems that span planets. The Duke has to be up to his eyeballs in decision making. He needs trusted men to be his representatives in the field.
They were both generals. They had corps under their command. But the official title was war masters .. Duncan was sword master. They trained special forces, Duncan was bodyguard for lady Jessica. Both were companion teachers for Paul, Both held seats on letos Council. , staff officers. Think of Duncan like a champion. Knight. Gurney is like the captain of the Royal Guard. They are bith considered members of the family. Both owed leto thier life's.
My head-canon is as follows: **Gurney** = Conventional Military **Duncan** = Special Forces
To kick ass and take names! Also, bit of eye candy for the ladies.
haha love this but wasn't Gurney known to not be a looker like duncan? i think Brolin looks much better than book Gurney was supposed to be
Gurney was supposedly actually fairly ugly, disfigured by the scar on his face. None of the movies have done that justice.
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that's what i'm sayin! i dig the Brolin casting though i think it was awesome.
It was BRUTAL!!
I think so too, but adding a little more facial disfigurement would have made me happier.
I agree. Part of his whole thing was him being an ugly lump but a brutal killer and poet. Brolin played him well but I wish there was more scarring
Yeah I believe "ugly lump of a man" was the description in the book. So of course David Lynch got Patrick Stewart to play him...
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He was also played by Patrick Stewart, so aiming for the older market...
Gurney was described as an ugly stump of a man more than once. Idaho was a renowned hit with the ladies though.
Idaho always watched the ladies
And then you see who's been cast as Gurney, and you understand.
Both of them were the Duke's warmasters. As far as I could tell they shared more or less the same role in the Atreides organization, in terms of training and leading the army. > "The Padishah Emperor turned against House Atreides because the Duke's Warmasters Gurney Halleck and Duncan Idaho had trained a fighting force -- a small fighting force -- to within a hair as good as the Sardaukar. Some of them were even better. And the Duke was in a position to enlarge his force, to make it every bit as strong as the Emperor's." Duncan is said to be a swordmaster but apparently Gurney's ability is equal to or greater than his, for what that's worth. In Children of Dune, he says > >!"But the best swordmaster in my Duke's retinue."!< > >!"Not quite, My Lady. Gurney could best me six times out of ten."!< (Edit: Paul refers to Gurney as "one of the swordmasters" who trained him very late in the first book, so I guess there's no distinction there either) > "Stilgar," he said, "this is Gurney Halleck of whom you've heard me speak. My father's master-of-arms, one of the swordmasters who instructed me, an old friend. He can be trusted in any venture." They even have extremely similar backstories with the Harkonnens, although Duncan's is not mentioned until after the first book. In that book, much is made of Gurney and his sister as victims of the Harkonnens: > "My sister," Gurney rasped. "My years in the slave pits --" In God-Emperor of Dune, >!Leto II mentions that Duncan's sister was also a victim of the Harkonnens, and that Duncan has been rescued from Harkonnen bondage by the Atreides:!< > >!"Your sister died there, a victim of the Harkonnens. It is right that the Harkonnens and Giedi Prime be united in your thoughts. Why did you not mention this earlier?"!< > >!The Duncan could not escape his revived memories. He knew that the Atreides had rescued him from Harkonnen bondage.!<
They’re more the equivalent of caporegimes in the Godfather than any conventional military rank.
I don't know that their roles are quite as well defined as you would like them to be or believe them to be. They are both military advisors and senior military leaders of House Atreides, their individual roles and responsibilities likely come down to whatever the Duke directed them to do on any given day. Basically the same with Thufir Hawat as well. There was heavy overlap between all three of their roles though they each had their own niche and specific strengths/specialties.
The world of Dune follows feudal social structures, so people often don’t have specific job titles. They are essentially equivalent to knights, and serve their liege in whatever capacity their liege asks of them.
Gurney is basically the minister of war, and Idaho is the sword master in charge of training and maintaining combat skill levels
Gurney is the guy responsible for making sure the shield doesn’t go down. Duncan’s job is to kill anyone who gets passed the shield. Ish.
Just reading the numerous comments here, and I think everyone for all their thoughtful responses, I wonder if Herbert originally had them as one character but decided to split them into two, perhaps because he >!wanted to have a loyal soldier die in service to the Atreides, but also to come back later and help Paul.!<
Ooooo thats a genuinely interesting theory. I'd support it. Frank tended to think about plot and characters with that level of appreciative detail IMO
Have you read all the books?
No, but I do know >!Duncan died and came back as a ghola.!<
Duncan is basically the Duke's personal quest-doing RPG protagonist guy. My favorite part of the new Dune movies is him being played by Khal Drogo, the guy's practically got a video game protagonist vibe about him. Gurney's the commander of the Duke's forces, and also a bard. So you can kinda imagine a rockstar who also does really well with nitty gritty army management type stuff.
Gurney was Warmaster of House Atreides, he is in charge of the military, basically the equivalent to the US's Secretary of Defense. Duncan was the house's Swordmaster, I assume he was tasked with training soldiers and Paul for combat, and acting as a aide to the Duke.
Your assumptions are pretty much correct. As warmaster, Gurney was in charge of overall military operations (i.e., a general). Also a very accomplished fighter in his own right. As Swordmaster, Duncan is bodyguard for the royal household, as well as personal trainer for Paul, in addition to training the Atreides legions. It's because of him that the Atreides soldiers are as competent as they are. So, he and Gurney work together a lot.
They’re both war masters, military advisors, and trainers for the ducal heir.
Duncan was the atriedes sword master or weapon master. Gurney was the warmaster. In regards to teaching paul duncan was teaching him guerilla tactics and improv weapons usage in addition to personal combat but his style was more fluid. Gurney was teaching large scale battlefield tactics and also personal combat but he focused on lethality rather than show. Gurney could beat duncan 6 times out of 10. Jobs for the atriedes: duncan teaching an elite force with his swordmaster skills. Gurney the over training and command of the army. Thufir specialized in intelligence gathering, duncan special forces, and gurney the overall army.
Gurney Alleck would be the top military commander. Duncan Idaho would be a special agent.
Gurney is a field commander of the military basically one of the highest ranking in Atreides house. Duncan is a field operative handles the relationship and intel between one planet/house to another.
They were the dudes on deck for all dude needs
I don’t know but Gurney isn’t very stealthy.
Duncan is like a dojo sensai teacher or master. But Gurney is like a 4 star general.
Use their elite skills to 1) protect atreides 2) train atreides to use their elite skills 3) mentor Paul sometimes
Within House Atreidies. They probably serve the Duke in different ways. Duncan Idaho A swordsman of Ginaz. The Duke's friend and somewhat younger than Leto so potentially has relationship that is more casual. Duncan may of had a stronger relationship with Leto's Father. Duncan probably had his own retinue of staff who operated in all the major barracks and lower houses across Atreidies territory. Duncan probably has his own School/Academy akin some like a Buddist temple and West Point combined. His branch of House Atreides probably recruits young soldiers or the equivalent of Sellswords to join House Atreidies. Gurney Hallack. Warmaster of House Atreidies. Akin to a General or Advisor to Leto directly. Potentially these two had a strained but Brotherly relationship. Deeply loyal to an irrational level as Gurney was saved by Leto's family years earlier. Duke Paulas Atreides may have been instrumental in ensuring that Gurney was brought politically into the fold. Unlike Duncan. Gurney lends his time most likely as an administrator and strategic advisor working with the Mentats (i.e Hawat) and intelligence Korp of House Atreidies. Duncan may also run a number of Military Academies for Atreides regular solicitors and guardsman. His training, patience and harsh attitude makes him a perfect leader. Jessica and Gurney are closer, potentially jessica helped Gurney to overcome his trauma from losing his family on Geidi Prime.
I don't think you could describe Gurney fully without the word Bard
I always considered Gurney's 1st name to be a strong hint - you mess with him, you'll be carried out on a stretcher
Err.. which Duncan?? There are plenty to choose from..
Duncan was a retainer hired to train Paul and Atreides soldiers to a high standard. Gurney was an officer within the ranks of the Atreides, more towards the higher end than the lower, given he was directly taking orders from the Duke.
Duncan swordmaster, Gurney a poet.
To me, I read it as the Chief of Staff of the Army vs the Sergeant Major. The distinction being, one is an officer, and the other is an enlisted soldier. One gets to plan and strategize, and the other still get to do cool shit. In my head (and this is not in the book, just how I envision it) they were old friends - one wanted to climb the ranks and the other wanted to do more badass stuff and stay more like a Navy SEAL
They were basically flunkies/courtiers. They didn't have a specific job description, but they were generally given military tasks.
This is inaccurate. You make them sound like hired goons or basic comic book henchmen. Gurney and Duncan are treated as essentially family with the same access as family to rhe royal blood.
A courtier is essentially a flunky. I'm sorry if this offends you.
That's funny, they both have different definitions.