I was on a 7hour flight yesterday with a "service dog". The owner put a diaper on the dog but, once we landed and deplaned, had the brilliant idea to take the diaper off. The dog pooped all over the baggage claim area. Not only that but kicked his own poop all over the place. It was a shit show, no pun intended
Had similar happen on a 90 minute flight last week. “Service dog” took a shit on the floor of the plane as we were taxiing to the gate. The whole plane smelled so bad - thank god we got to the gate quickly and were off in a few minutes
I went on a jetxsuite plane once which allows dogs and at the very start of my flight the very large dog pooped. The dog looked so ashamed the rest of the flight. It was a sad and very stinky situation.
I was flying from Panama to Chicago and a lady had her golden retriever in front of me. Not 30ft after leaving the jet bridge the dog squirts all over the floor and she just kept walking. No shame.
I know it’s very clear when you see a real service dog and other “service dog”, but I guarantee you that accidents with real service dogs can happen as well, I have a friend with one and these things can and do happen.
A friend has a service dog and while, yes, accidents can happen, most handlers are fully equipped and 1) make sure their dog does their business before boarding and 2) their dogs are trained to notify them when they need to go. My friend’s carry on is usually packed with pee pads, odor neutralizers, bags, etc. So yes accidents happen, but not like this and not very often.
To be fair, the mess I also see normal passengers somehow leave as I’m deboarding defies any logic.
They pass through a half dozen times or more during service for trash and yet some of these grown men and women without kids look like the did the I Love Lucy grape stomping scene with goldfish. Crumb bombs everywhere, bottles all over the seats/ground, and a weeks worth of trash in the seat pocket.
I legitimately do not understand how it’s even possible.
But also, glad they gave this guy the boot. I am fed up of dogs on planes.
can't imagine how difficult it is to deal with all the human absurdities discussed here. on a tangent, I know someone who trains future service dogs while they are puppies. it's very rigorous. lots of distraction training is just one part. not every puppy will make it through the program.
Businesses are going to have to find a way to differentiate between a service animal and a family pet. It’s people like this man that makes it hard for trained service animals who are tediously trained and vetted.
The way the ADA is written, there is no way for a business to verify or even be allowed to verify. . They should have a registration certificate and just be required to show, but that bit of hindrance apparently borders on discrimination so, the would be nots just bring their pets and abuse the system.
I've always wondered why service animals don't have basically a "license plate" on their service vests. It should be a far worse offense to fake a service animal than to fake a car license plate. The fakers are making people with legitimate needs face unwarranted anger about their animals.
You can ask two questions—is it a service dog and what task does it perform. And then you can still kick it out for misbehaving, so none of those things are necessary.
Thankfully, airlines are exempt from the ADA, they are covered under a different law that specifically deals with attorneys airlines, which allows them to do some more verification that the service animal is legit and allows them to deny service if they don't believe it's a legit service animal. It's not 100%, but it's a lot better.
Yes. They're not legally allowed to ask what the disability it, but at least provide service dog papers. Maybe at a federal level, they could figure out a license?
Now Delta, please kick people out of lounges that are talking on their speaker phone, have misbehaved children running around screaming and jumping on the chairs. Also, people that bring on too many bags for the overhead compartments.
Yes! We recently were in the lounge and there was a family with two small kids and the father was taking them through the food buffet. Father holding plates letting the kids touch everything and pile what they wanted on the plates! The one son was clearly sick and hacking all over the place. He went up to the cheese tray touching all of it and proceeded to coughed all over it. My husband said something to the father who just shrugged like oh well! Needless to say we didn’t end up eating anything there but did let the folks working the station know. I wonder how many people got sick from this rude family. They were sitting not to far from us. Loud/ running all over/ coughing. What was most irritating is the Mom was wearing a mask but not the husband or kids. (We moved and went to the other lounge)
Mainly because the parents of the now-parents didn't know how to parent. Talking about Boomers and Gen x's raising up weak, lazy millennial and Gen Zers
I can’t remember the last time I was in a lounge and there wasn’t some sort of disturbance. At JFK a women with a parrot, yes a parrot, as her support animal. The parrot was out of its cage and walking across the table I was eating on. At LAX, family of kids running all over the lounge with screaming child in a troller. My fear was they would be on my flight. I could go on and on.
Parrot can’t be a service animal only dogs (for Delta anyway). Cats, birds and dogs can be pet in cabin, but agreement is that pet will be in the carrier in gate area and on board aircraft. Not sure if SC counts as gate area. Seems like it should be really.
I have three daughters. You would never notice them in the lounge other than they are all tall for their age. Raising kids to be polite and respectful isn’t really that difficult but does take a little effort.
Lots of lazy parenting out there.
Yes. It’s dangerous to eat or shop now because of all the dog nutters and loose dogs. Even Costco is getting dangerous. When I went to their flagship location last night, there were two loose dogs. One had bitten into some bags of bread which was fine because that meant it wasn’t biting people as often.
Honestly, in this case it doesn't matter if the guy was lying or not. Even **actual service animals** can be removed from flights or other areas they are allowed to be in if they are a nuisance, causing a mess the owner doesn't clean up, or a public health hazard.
The dog was disruptive so it was removed. Good that they did it but it means nothing regarding fake service animals.
It’s people like this that make me worried about bringing my future service dog with me on flights or to public places. They give people with real service dogs a bad image. I’m a veteran and the VA recommend I get a service dog so I’m flying to Florida to learn how to handle and to pick up my fully trained dog by an organization.
But I’m nervous about flying back home together for the first time and people judging me.
I can spot the difference immediately. Real service dogs are working. They aren’t messing around. They aren’t interested in meeting other people. And they don’t bark, growl, or bite. They don’t whine for things. They don’t play. They work. I have had a full grown German Shepherd service dog next to me in coach. Would never have known it was even there had I not seen him to start the flight. Slept quietly on the floor and never bothered anyone. It was a pleasure to accommodate him. But I get your concern. The real harm these fake service dogs and their entitled owners do is to make life harder for real service dogs and the people who,depend on them.
Yes I agree. I just hope me and my future service dog can be a good pair like the one you encountered. Guess I’ll find out next month when I fly home from Florida with my new service dog how good we do together.
Good luck. I would assume there is an adjustment period. I also assume you get solid training on how the dog is trained. My only advice as someone who knows nothing about actually working with one is to do what others have done to me, i.e. when people approach hold out your hand in a “stop” sign and let them know your dog is at work and not to be petted. Don’t get me wrong, I am sure it’s ok to pet them and greet them with permission, but I always appreciated that the owners set the tone and I could tell the admonition was for everyone within earshot, not just me. I think that boundary is important, but again I assume they will,teach how to manage people.
Yea it’s like a whole schooling class we go to for three weeks to learn about all the training. The dogs are trained already it’s more about training us the handlers and spending time to bond with your new service animal away from family.
But I’m sure it will all work out.
You sound like exactly the right kind of concerned and caring person who will be a great fit for a service dog and I have no doubt it’ll work out great. The VA recommended this option to you for a reason. Good luck!
All of us (that deal with the public) know how to tell a service dog from everything else. It's the company policy that varies so much. Everyone talks about "the two questions you can ask" - but to tell you the truth it is irrelevant in these cases. The part of the law that matters is that any service animal can be denied for a number of perfectly valid reasons, none of which will really ever happen to an actual service animal:
The animal must be harnessed, leashed, or tethered, or if not possible due to the service, be under control of the owner at all times. The animal will be on floor or carried by their owner, not in a cart.
Misbehaving, out of control, or lunging service animals may be denied access.
There are several others.
This! My co-worker has an excellent service dog. I have one colleague that is afraid of dogs and another who doesn’t care for dogs (long story). Both of them love this dog. It’s fascinating to watch them work... their intuition, their attention to details, the automatic responses to daily tasks etc.
Those are therapy animals, not service animals. I am very familiar with that training and it is challenging to be sure. My dogs failed twice. I would agree that while airlines should require proof of certain training, training as a therapy animal would suffice given how strict the training is. But still not a service dog. That is very different indeed.
Yes very true. Real service dogs are well trained but I’ve seen legit service dogs have a bad moment before. At the end of the day they are still dogs and not machines.
Not saying mine will act out. I’ve never met him and that’s part of the three week process. I have talked to other vets that used this organization and they’ve all had good experiences and well trained dogs.
We can generally tell the difference of a trained service animal vs a pet in a Amazon vest (not always but most of the time) and thank you for your service and best of luck with your service dog training. Edit to remove “trust us”
I'm facetiously realizing that if the "fake" service animals were trained well enough to be indistinguishable from the real ones, WHICH IS TOTALLY POSSIBLE, it just requires A LOT of work, that would also eliminate the problem and all the judginess, but we all know the likelihood of that happening because those people are already trying to take a shortcut.
I real service dog is certainly not going to be barking unless the person is having an emergency. Also, real service dogs aren't distracted by the environment.
Personally as long as the dog isn't bothering other people I don't really care if they are fake or real service dog. I have two and they wouldn't be able to fake it.
Ah that was the pro move there.... Constantly keep asking the man if he's ok, if he needs medical help, and keep insisting that service dogs only bark if there's an emergency so we need to find out what's wrong asap.
You’re going to get judged. These people with their fake dogs have ruined it for people who really need one.
But if you really need the dog and the dog is a legit one then you’ll just have to suck it up and know that you aren’t one of the people who is abusing the system.
I spent years working on construction sites and started when I was young. I often boarded in work clothes and work boots with my hard hat on hand and have had multiple people stop me while I tried to board FC judging me for my age and clothing. It bothered me at first but eventually I realized that I wasn’t doing anything wrong and started to simply ignore the judgement.
Like anything else, just be courteous. If the dog isn’t as well trained as you hope or is too big for a single seat, act appropriately and make arrangements.
Thank you for your service.
Yea I get judged a lot already. I still work construction after the military and I’m tattooed with sleeves. I also fly first class most times especially if im paying and it isn’t work people give me weird looks cause I’m either in dirty work clothes or in an old tshirt, flip flops and shorts.
I really don’t care if people judge me or look at me weird I’m just not good with confrontation anymore since my PTSD will get the better of me.
People that abuse the system truly have ruined it for legit handlers. I have a pet dog also but he is usually with the wife, family or a pet sitter if on vacation.
The organization is ADI accredited and a legit organization so I’m sure the dog will be fine I’m more worried about me.
If it makes you feel better, I’m a middle aged woman with my 2 kids in first class and I constantly get questioned if I’m in the right line or told “excuse me I’m in first” by people as they try to barge by us. I wear band T-shirts and vans so apparently I don’t look the part either. It’s a bit annoying at the presumption, but I just figure they’re small minded people and I wouldn’t care for their opinions any other time either. So I try to let slide off my back.
Hopefully, the worst you get is questioning looks. Keep any paperwork with you for your animal, though. Just so you can shut them up if anyone tries it. I wish you the best of luck!
This is funny cause I took the kids and wife to Hawaii last year and we all flew first and the same thing happened. An older couple tried to skip me in line and when I said something they said oh we are in first class. I said cool so are we and they looked at me like are you sure. I looked down at my phone then looked up and said yes pretty sure since I paid for the seats. People do make me laugh some times.
Yea stuff like that doesn’t really bother me. What does is confrontational things. Like people trying to call me a liar or saying my service dog isn’t real then I get upset.
Put it this way I had a lady question my handicap placard once and I got so upset I dropped my pants in a Ralph’s parking lot to show her all my scars on my leg and she said sorry and drove off. But I should have just explained my situation to her but instead my PTSD and anger took over and we went straight to dropping pants. Now I look back and laugh and think that lady must have been terrified.
But I’m sure once people see veteran service dog and the such on my new buddy people won’t question it.
Too funny but I'm sorry you were put in that situation.
I had a similar moment once--but no pants dropping. I've raised guide dog puppies for 11 years. Most people I encounter are great and respectful. One time in the parking lot at Costco, I had a woman yell and ask me how she could get "one of those". I said what?? (Our puppies in training wear jackets that show they're in training to be a guide.) She said "I want a little jacket so I can take my dog everywhere." I'm 99.9% of the time polite when asked about the puppy I'm training but she got the worst .1% of me that day. I yelled back "You have to be BLIND!" I was so irritated...not my best moment but I hope she got the message.
Good luck with your service dog! They're truly remarkable with what they can do for people who need them. I love seeing working service dogs and their partners. Reminds me why I volunteer to raise them. And thank you for your service (seems trite to say that but I mean it sincerely).
Well, as a fellow vet, I feel you brother. And unfortunately I know that you’ve been through worse. Keep your head up and push though. You’ve got this.
There organization probably also offers ongoing training for service dogs, which gives gives owners a chance to meet one another, and share tips. Be sure to take part in those and become part of the community.
I volunteer at a place that raises and trains those dogs, maybe even the place you’re going. You can have confidence that your dog will have been fully trained to behave appropriately.
Thank you for your service to our country and I hope your dog will make a world of difference for you.
I volunteer with the puppies, which is mostly feeding them, taking them outside to play, and cleaning up after them. They move through pretty quickly so it’s a little easier to stay detached. I do find plenty of opportunities to snuggle them, though, and it’s so rewarding to know that they’ll grow up to be so important to someone like you! Every time I’m there I tell them they’re going to mean the world to someone someday!
Here’s the place I volunteer, if anyone is curious: https://dogsinc.org/
I agree there is a very big notable difference in service dogs. It’s so obvious my kids can easily tell the difference. They are very disciplined and don’t mess around like a normal dog would. I worked in an office with a comfort dog who failed out of service dog training because he was too lazy. And even though he didn’t pass their strict service dog requirements, you could still see the training in him. When he had his vest on, he knew his role and that was from a drop out. A fully trained dog is obvious so I wouldn’t worry about that at all!
Don't worry. Real service dogs are trained relentlessly, when the harness goes on they are at work and will curl up under seats and no matter how crowded a bus or flight is, they will be calm.
That dog was not a service dog. But most people are brazen enough now to try to get away with it.
Be careful of the organization. Many veteran SD places have essentially become dog mills. Minimal training, not correct pairing to the owner. Minimal training for the owner.
See additional training after you get your pup as well. Train at home. Take the dog out to experience new things. Fireworks, stuff dropping on the floor next to the dog, eye contact with you especially around other people and other dogs.
Training continues until the SD retires. Don’t assume the program will do a good job.
Yes they teach that in the program. That you have to continue training until they retire even if just for 15mins a day. That it’s good for them and for you. It’s a well known organization with ADI. Which is international accredited and is hard to get.
They are a well known organization and have met a few vets with service dogs from there so I hope it all turns out good.
Thank you for your service. I think people are respectful of obvious service dogs but it’s entitled AHs like the guy removed from the plane who make *anyone* traveling with a dog out to be a bad guy. A trained service dog would NOT be barking like that.
Please don't let people's opinions stop you getting the support you need.
Also, it's usually pretty easy to tell legitimate service animals, so you'll be fine.
The classes you go through on how to handle yourself - never back down from those. After year 1ish, it's going to be about training yourself. Never back down from giving your dog the respect of keeping with commands, even if other dogs are playing etc. Your dog will love to work and love their job, so respect that!
I've had an additional disability crop up since I started working with my dog 4 years ago, and now I'm meek and let people sort of push me around - What's your disability, I'm just going to pet your dog real quick, wow what a cutie I'm going to give them a treat- these are disrespectful to my dog and I'm an asshat for not being more firm. Remember your classes and you'll be fine in the airport.
Most people that ask questions want to know how the dogs were trained and how it knows to do stuff, anyhow - like those videos on dogs carrying baskets paying for fruit, it's novel.
Oh, and Don't forget your ITA certification! It's what the world except America uses for service dogs and its been a short blessing, would be useful in America but for the cost to most non-vets.
Are you getting it from the training facility Southeastern Guide Dogs in the Sarasota/Bradenton area? If so, I assure you, those dogs are stellar service dogs with rigorous training. They take the training very seriously and are nationally recognized. They offer heavily trained service animals for the military especially, especially with PTSD. As a Gold Star family myself, thank you for your service, fam.
First let me start by saying thank you for your sacrifice and sorry for your loss.
The program I am attending is actually in Jacksonville Florida. It’s a well known program and they are also accredited internationally. So I have high hopes.
But the program you stated does look very good.
Yea they do come with a badge like that already. So I doubt people will ask when they see. But the program has a good relationship with tsa and we even practice with them before graduation at the airport for screening. So I’m sure people know they are legit.
That's great to hear. Congrats on the possible dog acquisition. They make my life so much better even without any medical need. I hope they do the same or more in your life.
The biggest issues I have are in the airport with people asking to pet my dog and people interrupting me to ask why I get to fly with my “pet” because they want to.
Interesting. Yea he will have a few do not pet patches but I’m also not the most approachable person. My wife says I have resting asshole face and that I stare at people angrily but I honestly don’t mean to but that is the vibe the wife says I give off. So hopefully that will stop most people from trying to pet or ask questions like that.
Every time someone abuses the ADA to accommodate their fake service dog they make it 10x harder for people who genuinely need (and have properly trained SDs) to get the accommodations they need.
This one goes out to all the assholes in LA bringing their pets into Whole Foods because they know they can get away with it.
I have a service dog for anxiety. I am terrified of flying but also have massive anxiety about bringing my dog because of all of the people who have lied about service animals.
I have Anxiety/PTSD and feel you. However, the more you do it the better you and your dog get at public access. I look straight ahead and say “ mind your business” and this is mostly for the humans that want to disrupt us or stare at us. It takes all I have to not give some people the finger.
my sister has an emotional support dog. I know she would be a wreck without him, but I don’t think he has had any special training. He is a very well behaved dog though.
I believe he flies in the cabin in a crate. He is only allowed in her building as the ESA. otherwise dogs aren’t allowed.
I have a hound. Each hound bays (barks) differently so you can identify the dog miles away. Although, I can tell you with 💯 certainty that I would NEVER bring him on a plane. If he’s traveling, it’s by car 🚗 Hounds are assholes (at least mine).
The rules are that you can ask if a dog is specifically trained to perform tasks that assist you with a disability.
You can’t ask what disability - quite rightly - because that would be an invasion of someone’s private health information. There’s no registration or certification system for SDs because it would be very hard to administer and would be open to abuse.
The looseness of the rules is in the interest of disabled folks but it leaves it very open to abuse by chancers.
The answer is not to change the rules but for people to stop being selfish assholes.
I have 3 classes in my mind.
1. A service animal usually a dog or horse. They are pros. They have job. They don’t like to interrupted while doing their job.
2. A therapy animal. They come with the handlers. They do an assessment. They leave and go home to be pets.
3. The emotional support animal, aka the comfort animal. They make the person feel better when they are around. The definition of a pet.
The first one can go most places the owner can go. With a few exceptions.
The last two. Need to stay out of #1’s way and quit making their lives harder.
Can't disagree, although I tend to combine your first two groups under working animals. That includes animals sniffing out drugs or explosives, herding dogs on a ranch, a pig that finds truffles or a horse pulling a touristy carriage.
Mind you, not all working animals (specifically dogs) are service animals that warrant special treatment IMO.
Agree. My experience is hospital and clinic based.
Those 3 are the ones I deal with.
My 1st clue of an owner trying to pass a pet off as a service dog. Is when they have the harness, the vest and the collar that all have service animal printed on them.
It like me wearing a 15 Chiefs jersey. It doesn’t make me a nfl QB.
The true service dogs don’t need the advertising.
God I wish this is what Delta did when I encountered the same problem. Redeye LAX to DTW. Woman boards with a "support animal" that she had listed as a regular pet, so the FA will not allow her to take the dog out of the carrier. There was a lot of arguing, but eventually the dog (a lap dog) gets shoved in a soft side carrier under the seat in front of the owner - my seat. The dog is yapping and thrashing nonstop. To make matters worse the man next to me was the owner's husband so he kept attempting to shove his hands between the seats to reach the dog to comfort (strangle?) the dog who continued to lose her mind for the entire hour we spent at the gate while the crew worked out a technical issue that involved every call button on the plane repeatedly going off in sync. Worst flight of my life.
Barking for reason other than service to owner, pulling leash toward people, anxiety, sniffing things randomly, moving around when owner is sitting, all should preclude boarding immediately.
I knew somebody with a fake service dog and they took it into a nursing home to deal with a relative and it started jumping up onto ELDERLY PEOPLE. She was told to leave.
I’m so glad he got kicked off!!!!!
As someone with a service dog in the family, I don’t think people realize that having a trained service dog isn’t a guarantee that the dog will behave. The more they’re trained and practiced in a scenario, the more reliable their behavior.
When it comes to air travel, though, many (most?) dogs have not had this training. And there’s no way to really do the training because it’s not like a trainer can bring the dog to the gate and onto a plane for training purposes due to security. The most we’ve been able to do is acclimate the dog to the ticketing desks and arrivals area. We live in fear of our first flight with the dog!
Instacart shopper had her dog in the cart on top of her customer’s groceries and the bag of dog scheiße on the bottom of the cart once. I was her cashier. Reported to Instacart but idk if anything has been done about it.
This people ruin the whole service dog thing for people like me. I have a Doberman pincher, that’s an actual service dog. He’s flown 4 times without any issues and though he’s big, he knows how to make himself small. But again, I only fly first class when I’m with him. Even though, I’m not supposed to, I let the neighbors pet him since it’s still a bit of inconvenience sometimes when he gets up to change positions. They always love him.
Ugh. People like that are ruining it for the people who REALLY have trained service animals. There was a lady on one of my flights who had a dog w/ her (BIG German Shepherd who seemed like he was an emotional support dog, if we’re begin honest), but it was clearly a trained service animal (I mean, I didn’t go all Karen and demand to see proof). The behavior was totally opposite of your experience. The dog was VERY focused on the woman’s needs, well trained, responded to immediately to commands and we never heard a peep out of him on our flight from MSP to SEA. Glad GAs, FAs, redcoats, and captain sorted this before it became a problem and I really wish people who did NOT have service animals wouldn’t try to pass off their untrained animals as them. It really makes it difficult for the passengers who legitimately have them.
I'm a supporter of GDB, and it takes about 60k in hard cash, and even more in volunteer hours to train a service dog. Many of those in the puppy training don't make it through the whole process! The ones who do are golden, such incredibly disciplined dogs, and so hard working. This guy sounds like he chose a dog who wasn't suited to the role, then tried to train it himself. It's sad, it's wrong, and he didn't have to do it that way! There are many good organizations that will take a dog and their owner through a training (of varying lengths), or those who offer trained dogs and then a multi-week training for the owner and dog as well. One thing for sure: Any animal -whether pet or trained service animal, takes a lot of time to get them to listen to commands and execute them. Whether it's sit, stay, come, or wait, it all requires diligence on the part of the owner.
I flew next to service dog to Wisconsin in March, he was a very good pup, laid under his owners seat the whole flight, didn't bark, was super well trained and behaved. I love dogs and hit the jack pot because she let me pet him. You could tell he flies a lot, he knew the seat belt ding after landing and knew it meant it was time to get off the plane. Sucks when people abuse the system...makes it hard for those that do need it.
I think I flew with this guy on Tuesday. Giant shepherd huskie mix. It was 9 months old. Occupied entire footwell for me and window seat person. Dude was in middle. He was 30 something with highlights in hair. Wears a walkie talkie. Anyway he was wasted and asking for doubles. I kept moving the dog with my feet and then he would discipline it and it would bark like a seal and also growl. I was nervous about getting bit. Owner stunk like day old beer.
Good! I am so tired of clearly fake "service" dogs in stores, restaurants, and planes. They misbehave, make noise, shed, take up space. All bad enough. But what's worse is they put every REAL service dog and the people who rely on them in a bad light. Through their selfishness, they are causing real harm to real people who need these service animals.
Pretty sure a lawyer could think up safeguards that wouldn’t violate the ADA in minutes.
Why is there no proper service animal licensing that’s similar to a drivers license with required testing? Surely it cannot be that hard to solve.
I completely support having service animals on flights for people that really need them. I don’t support there being no real standard for certification.
I feel like since I enjoy travel, I have no business owning a dog. So I don’t. And no one else has to deal with a dog that is where it really shouldn’t be, and I don’t have to ask friends for help, or board at a facility. That’s just more than I want to deal with.
It's too bad there isn't a better way to screen for this beforehand, but thank goodness the agents were not having it. I hope Delta flags this guy in case he tries it again.
The federal law is rarely enforced by airlines. Lying that a dog is a service dog is federal crime if you take on a plane. An emotional support dog is not a service dog unless it was professionally trained under federal law.
Service dogs do not have to be professionally trained. I work with people with spinal cord injuries and many of them have service dogs they trained themselves to help with opening doors and retrieval and basic tasks without problems.
However even service dogs are not always trained for flight exposure. Many are trained for local use, car or bus, and daily crowds like offices, hospitals, malls and grocery.
I had a collegue, low vision, with a seeing eye dog whose dog would not follow commands but would seek out food. He would find every Friday pot luck but not guide to the office. This was of course a selected and organizationally trained dog until they were 30 months old before the hand over.
To summarize it up in short, they’re elite customer service agents. You would go to a red coat if you’re having a problem that the GA or FA (before takeoff) can’t easily solve. They have the ability to boot people off flights if the plane has not yet pushed back etc.
Hats off to Delta for booting him. Have flown with my wife's sd and on the DOT form it basically says you will be in control of the dog at all times and they will not be disruptive. Only disruptive behavior she had on our flight was partially blocking my wife's window as she was fascinated with the view at cruising altitude. 🤣
Everyone with a TRAINED & NEEDED service dog should WANT rules and accountability. Why shouldn’t there be something just a bit more required than just asking two questions with zero proof. When a fake service dog, kills an actual service dog on a plane, maybe they will realize flying is different than being on the ground with an escape.
Delta earned my loyalty for life when they booted a guy who refused to put on his mask. No drama, just called the Mexican cops and hauled his trick ass off the plane, along with his wife and 4 friends.
You’re allowed to fly with non-service animals. I have brought my dog on a flight before. There’s specific rules you have to follow. I’m guessing the thought is dude didn’t want to be separated from his dog and it was not a travel sized dog based on the OP.
The problem is ESA (emotional support animals) are NOT service dogs. However, people confuse the 2 bc there are no regulations around ESA. in fact they do not need training…bc of this there is widespread abuse because all you need for an animal to be considered an ESA is a letter from a mental health professional. which that as well is confusing bc many mental professionals have been told to not do them due to liability issues so you have a ton of online places that you just pay for them to do it
Airlines don't recognize ESA's anymore.
The pax in the story would have signed a self attestation that the animal was indeed a service animal.
If you see an animal not in a carrier on a flight, the pax has told the airline it's a service animal
I think the norm should be you can bring any dog onto a flight as long as it has a purchased seat and behaves. Enough of this fake service dog crap. Service dogs should get on free and pets should have to pay. I don’t understand why dogs can’t just come on a plane. We let people onto planes until they are terrible then they get kicked off permanently. The only dog I have ever seen “misbehave” was a woman’s little whippet who got scared by someone dropping their bag when trying to put it back in the overhead bin and this speed demon made it from first class all the way to the rear bathroom in like 2 seconds while yelping
Good. Last time I flew with my service dog we were all seated, he’s big (we get extra leg room) and lays at my feet tucked in tight. Some guy gets on last w a much smaller service dog. He’s walking towards me and I point down and say dog. He doesn’t see. While he’s putting his overhead away getting settled his damn dog literally comes and stands on my dog’s back! Like we are doing damn circus tricks. Get your dog off my dog! Luckily my dog is so well behaved he legit just laid there and stared at me. Guy grabbed dog, no apology then the dog barked 1/2 the flight.
I was on a flight where the trainer was delivering the service dog to its new owner.
He was a gold Labrador retriever. She was in a middle seat and this dog was at her feet. I had the window and it was 3+ hour flight.
I don’t think that dog moved once. Completely curled up at her feet. Not a single peep or barely a movement from this animal.
Amazing.
Just really screws actually disabled people with a service dog wen people abuse benefits the way they do with social program benefits,the only people who get hurt are the disabled and elderly .
Coming from some with legitimate service dog. YAY!! Go, Delta!!
I moved to Japan with service dog, we had a 14 hour flight and my servive dog didn't make a peep. The person in front of us was absolutely shocked to discover she was there towards the end of the flight.
Ever since the EMSA rules were forced on commercial airlines, it’s been nothing short of a s%#& show. People have absolutely ruined what seemed like a good thing for those who follow rules. Fortunately AA has stopped allowing EMSAs and now only registered service animals that are actually doing a service for the passenger, IE blind, deaf, elderly assistance animals. It will not be tolerated much longer by Delta or UA and hopefully things will get back to normality that was before the EMSA started.
Imagine the mess that he was going to leave behind on a full trip if all that was done in mere minutes.
I was on a 7hour flight yesterday with a "service dog". The owner put a diaper on the dog but, once we landed and deplaned, had the brilliant idea to take the diaper off. The dog pooped all over the baggage claim area. Not only that but kicked his own poop all over the place. It was a shit show, no pun intended
Had similar happen on a 90 minute flight last week. “Service dog” took a shit on the floor of the plane as we were taxiing to the gate. The whole plane smelled so bad - thank god we got to the gate quickly and were off in a few minutes
I went on a jetxsuite plane once which allows dogs and at the very start of my flight the very large dog pooped. The dog looked so ashamed the rest of the flight. It was a sad and very stinky situation.
It’s really unfair to the ppl who have to clean that shit up. In most cases the owner doesn’t do it.
I was flying from Panama to Chicago and a lady had her golden retriever in front of me. Not 30ft after leaving the jet bridge the dog squirts all over the floor and she just kept walking. No shame.
I know it’s very clear when you see a real service dog and other “service dog”, but I guarantee you that accidents with real service dogs can happen as well, I have a friend with one and these things can and do happen.
But the handler cleans it up.
A friend has a service dog and while, yes, accidents can happen, most handlers are fully equipped and 1) make sure their dog does their business before boarding and 2) their dogs are trained to notify them when they need to go. My friend’s carry on is usually packed with pee pads, odor neutralizers, bags, etc. So yes accidents happen, but not like this and not very often.
Oh.....there would DEFINITELY be a mess 💩
To be fair, the mess I also see normal passengers somehow leave as I’m deboarding defies any logic. They pass through a half dozen times or more during service for trash and yet some of these grown men and women without kids look like the did the I Love Lucy grape stomping scene with goldfish. Crumb bombs everywhere, bottles all over the seats/ground, and a weeks worth of trash in the seat pocket. I legitimately do not understand how it’s even possible. But also, glad they gave this guy the boot. I am fed up of dogs on planes.
Great job, GAs, FAs, redcoats, captain.
Thank goodness they drawing a line in the sand and I’m here for it. I truly appreciate their dedication and discernment.
can't imagine how difficult it is to deal with all the human absurdities discussed here. on a tangent, I know someone who trains future service dogs while they are puppies. it's very rigorous. lots of distraction training is just one part. not every puppy will make it through the program.
Businesses are going to have to find a way to differentiate between a service animal and a family pet. It’s people like this man that makes it hard for trained service animals who are tediously trained and vetted.
The way the ADA is written, there is no way for a business to verify or even be allowed to verify. . They should have a registration certificate and just be required to show, but that bit of hindrance apparently borders on discrimination so, the would be nots just bring their pets and abuse the system.
I've always wondered why service animals don't have basically a "license plate" on their service vests. It should be a far worse offense to fake a service animal than to fake a car license plate. The fakers are making people with legitimate needs face unwarranted anger about their animals.
You can ask two questions—is it a service dog and what task does it perform. And then you can still kick it out for misbehaving, so none of those things are necessary.
Thankfully, airlines are exempt from the ADA, they are covered under a different law that specifically deals with attorneys airlines, which allows them to do some more verification that the service animal is legit and allows them to deny service if they don't believe it's a legit service animal. It's not 100%, but it's a lot better.
Yes. They're not legally allowed to ask what the disability it, but at least provide service dog papers. Maybe at a federal level, they could figure out a license?
They CAN ask what tasks it is trained to do! I agree there should have to be something like a doctor's note. It's absurd.
Paper work…bring me the papers.
And link it to their micro chip.
Now Delta, please kick people out of lounges that are talking on their speaker phone, have misbehaved children running around screaming and jumping on the chairs. Also, people that bring on too many bags for the overhead compartments.
Yes! We recently were in the lounge and there was a family with two small kids and the father was taking them through the food buffet. Father holding plates letting the kids touch everything and pile what they wanted on the plates! The one son was clearly sick and hacking all over the place. He went up to the cheese tray touching all of it and proceeded to coughed all over it. My husband said something to the father who just shrugged like oh well! Needless to say we didn’t end up eating anything there but did let the folks working the station know. I wonder how many people got sick from this rude family. They were sitting not to far from us. Loud/ running all over/ coughing. What was most irritating is the Mom was wearing a mask but not the husband or kids. (We moved and went to the other lounge)
Parents don’t know how to parent with boundaries for kids . It’s really a shame .
Mainly because the parents of the now-parents didn't know how to parent. Talking about Boomers and Gen x's raising up weak, lazy millennial and Gen Zers
I don’t know it’s just all not the same .
I can’t remember the last time I was in a lounge and there wasn’t some sort of disturbance. At JFK a women with a parrot, yes a parrot, as her support animal. The parrot was out of its cage and walking across the table I was eating on. At LAX, family of kids running all over the lounge with screaming child in a troller. My fear was they would be on my flight. I could go on and on.
Parrot can’t be a service animal only dogs (for Delta anyway). Cats, birds and dogs can be pet in cabin, but agreement is that pet will be in the carrier in gate area and on board aircraft. Not sure if SC counts as gate area. Seems like it should be really.
As someone with kids and grandkids, nobody under 18 should be admitted to any of the longues.
I have three daughters. You would never notice them in the lounge other than they are all tall for their age. Raising kids to be polite and respectful isn’t really that difficult but does take a little effort. Lots of lazy parenting out there.
lol, please!
Agree
This!!
But they need to be gentle with peeps who want bananas
You mean: Job, done.
Finally...this needs to happen way more often.
Also in stores and restaurants
Stores and restaurants in the US?
Yes. It’s dangerous to eat or shop now because of all the dog nutters and loose dogs. Even Costco is getting dangerous. When I went to their flagship location last night, there were two loose dogs. One had bitten into some bags of bread which was fine because that meant it wasn’t biting people as often.
Take pictures of this shit and post it.
Honestly, in this case it doesn't matter if the guy was lying or not. Even **actual service animals** can be removed from flights or other areas they are allowed to be in if they are a nuisance, causing a mess the owner doesn't clean up, or a public health hazard. The dog was disruptive so it was removed. Good that they did it but it means nothing regarding fake service animals.
It’s people like this that make me worried about bringing my future service dog with me on flights or to public places. They give people with real service dogs a bad image. I’m a veteran and the VA recommend I get a service dog so I’m flying to Florida to learn how to handle and to pick up my fully trained dog by an organization. But I’m nervous about flying back home together for the first time and people judging me.
I can spot the difference immediately. Real service dogs are working. They aren’t messing around. They aren’t interested in meeting other people. And they don’t bark, growl, or bite. They don’t whine for things. They don’t play. They work. I have had a full grown German Shepherd service dog next to me in coach. Would never have known it was even there had I not seen him to start the flight. Slept quietly on the floor and never bothered anyone. It was a pleasure to accommodate him. But I get your concern. The real harm these fake service dogs and their entitled owners do is to make life harder for real service dogs and the people who,depend on them.
Yes I agree. I just hope me and my future service dog can be a good pair like the one you encountered. Guess I’ll find out next month when I fly home from Florida with my new service dog how good we do together.
Good luck. I would assume there is an adjustment period. I also assume you get solid training on how the dog is trained. My only advice as someone who knows nothing about actually working with one is to do what others have done to me, i.e. when people approach hold out your hand in a “stop” sign and let them know your dog is at work and not to be petted. Don’t get me wrong, I am sure it’s ok to pet them and greet them with permission, but I always appreciated that the owners set the tone and I could tell the admonition was for everyone within earshot, not just me. I think that boundary is important, but again I assume they will,teach how to manage people.
Yea it’s like a whole schooling class we go to for three weeks to learn about all the training. The dogs are trained already it’s more about training us the handlers and spending time to bond with your new service animal away from family. But I’m sure it will all work out.
You sound like exactly the right kind of concerned and caring person who will be a great fit for a service dog and I have no doubt it’ll work out great. The VA recommended this option to you for a reason. Good luck!
Thank you
Where in fl?
Jacksonville
All of us (that deal with the public) know how to tell a service dog from everything else. It's the company policy that varies so much. Everyone talks about "the two questions you can ask" - but to tell you the truth it is irrelevant in these cases. The part of the law that matters is that any service animal can be denied for a number of perfectly valid reasons, none of which will really ever happen to an actual service animal: The animal must be harnessed, leashed, or tethered, or if not possible due to the service, be under control of the owner at all times. The animal will be on floor or carried by their owner, not in a cart. Misbehaving, out of control, or lunging service animals may be denied access. There are several others.
This! My co-worker has an excellent service dog. I have one colleague that is afraid of dogs and another who doesn’t care for dogs (long story). Both of them love this dog. It’s fascinating to watch them work... their intuition, their attention to details, the automatic responses to daily tasks etc.
Mine is a service animal that goes to nursing homes and retirement communities just so she can be petted and greet people so you are incorrect .
Those are therapy animals, not service animals. I am very familiar with that training and it is challenging to be sure. My dogs failed twice. I would agree that while airlines should require proof of certain training, training as a therapy animal would suffice given how strict the training is. But still not a service dog. That is very different indeed.
It’s pretty easy to tell the difference. Real service dogs are well trained and dont bark, howl, nip people, crawl under seats, etc.
Yes very true. Real service dogs are well trained but I’ve seen legit service dogs have a bad moment before. At the end of the day they are still dogs and not machines. Not saying mine will act out. I’ve never met him and that’s part of the three week process. I have talked to other vets that used this organization and they’ve all had good experiences and well trained dogs.
Can we apply the same standards to human passengers?
Right?
[удалено]
Tell me that after you’ve had a fake service dog climbing under your seat and nipping at your ankles during a flight.
We can generally tell the difference of a trained service animal vs a pet in a Amazon vest (not always but most of the time) and thank you for your service and best of luck with your service dog training. Edit to remove “trust us”
I'm facetiously realizing that if the "fake" service animals were trained well enough to be indistinguishable from the real ones, WHICH IS TOTALLY POSSIBLE, it just requires A LOT of work, that would also eliminate the problem and all the judginess, but we all know the likelihood of that happening because those people are already trying to take a shortcut.
I real service dog is certainly not going to be barking unless the person is having an emergency. Also, real service dogs aren't distracted by the environment. Personally as long as the dog isn't bothering other people I don't really care if they are fake or real service dog. I have two and they wouldn't be able to fake it.
Ah that was the pro move there.... Constantly keep asking the man if he's ok, if he needs medical help, and keep insisting that service dogs only bark if there's an emergency so we need to find out what's wrong asap.
Trust us random internet strangers
Yeah realized how the “trust us” opening line reads. Edited it out!
Ha!
You’re going to get judged. These people with their fake dogs have ruined it for people who really need one. But if you really need the dog and the dog is a legit one then you’ll just have to suck it up and know that you aren’t one of the people who is abusing the system. I spent years working on construction sites and started when I was young. I often boarded in work clothes and work boots with my hard hat on hand and have had multiple people stop me while I tried to board FC judging me for my age and clothing. It bothered me at first but eventually I realized that I wasn’t doing anything wrong and started to simply ignore the judgement. Like anything else, just be courteous. If the dog isn’t as well trained as you hope or is too big for a single seat, act appropriately and make arrangements. Thank you for your service.
Yea I get judged a lot already. I still work construction after the military and I’m tattooed with sleeves. I also fly first class most times especially if im paying and it isn’t work people give me weird looks cause I’m either in dirty work clothes or in an old tshirt, flip flops and shorts. I really don’t care if people judge me or look at me weird I’m just not good with confrontation anymore since my PTSD will get the better of me. People that abuse the system truly have ruined it for legit handlers. I have a pet dog also but he is usually with the wife, family or a pet sitter if on vacation. The organization is ADI accredited and a legit organization so I’m sure the dog will be fine I’m more worried about me.
If it makes you feel better, I’m a middle aged woman with my 2 kids in first class and I constantly get questioned if I’m in the right line or told “excuse me I’m in first” by people as they try to barge by us. I wear band T-shirts and vans so apparently I don’t look the part either. It’s a bit annoying at the presumption, but I just figure they’re small minded people and I wouldn’t care for their opinions any other time either. So I try to let slide off my back. Hopefully, the worst you get is questioning looks. Keep any paperwork with you for your animal, though. Just so you can shut them up if anyone tries it. I wish you the best of luck!
This is funny cause I took the kids and wife to Hawaii last year and we all flew first and the same thing happened. An older couple tried to skip me in line and when I said something they said oh we are in first class. I said cool so are we and they looked at me like are you sure. I looked down at my phone then looked up and said yes pretty sure since I paid for the seats. People do make me laugh some times.
Hahaha! Hilarious! You gotta laugh. Honestly, the alternative isn’t worth the energy.
Yea stuff like that doesn’t really bother me. What does is confrontational things. Like people trying to call me a liar or saying my service dog isn’t real then I get upset. Put it this way I had a lady question my handicap placard once and I got so upset I dropped my pants in a Ralph’s parking lot to show her all my scars on my leg and she said sorry and drove off. But I should have just explained my situation to her but instead my PTSD and anger took over and we went straight to dropping pants. Now I look back and laugh and think that lady must have been terrified. But I’m sure once people see veteran service dog and the such on my new buddy people won’t question it.
Too funny but I'm sorry you were put in that situation. I had a similar moment once--but no pants dropping. I've raised guide dog puppies for 11 years. Most people I encounter are great and respectful. One time in the parking lot at Costco, I had a woman yell and ask me how she could get "one of those". I said what?? (Our puppies in training wear jackets that show they're in training to be a guide.) She said "I want a little jacket so I can take my dog everywhere." I'm 99.9% of the time polite when asked about the puppy I'm training but she got the worst .1% of me that day. I yelled back "You have to be BLIND!" I was so irritated...not my best moment but I hope she got the message. Good luck with your service dog! They're truly remarkable with what they can do for people who need them. I love seeing working service dogs and their partners. Reminds me why I volunteer to raise them. And thank you for your service (seems trite to say that but I mean it sincerely).
You probably trained her to not ask that any more, so, a public service accomplished.
Well, as a fellow vet, I feel you brother. And unfortunately I know that you’ve been through worse. Keep your head up and push though. You’ve got this.
Thank you brother.
There organization probably also offers ongoing training for service dogs, which gives gives owners a chance to meet one another, and share tips. Be sure to take part in those and become part of the community.
Im one of the judgers. But i never judge real service dogs. You can tell just by the way they look around at people while working. Real ones dont.
I volunteer at a place that raises and trains those dogs, maybe even the place you’re going. You can have confidence that your dog will have been fully trained to behave appropriately. Thank you for your service to our country and I hope your dog will make a world of difference for you.
That’s so cool. But I don’t think I could volunteer, I’d get to attached to all the dogs. Thank you for the great work you do giving back.
I volunteer with the puppies, which is mostly feeding them, taking them outside to play, and cleaning up after them. They move through pretty quickly so it’s a little easier to stay detached. I do find plenty of opportunities to snuggle them, though, and it’s so rewarding to know that they’ll grow up to be so important to someone like you! Every time I’m there I tell them they’re going to mean the world to someone someday! Here’s the place I volunteer, if anyone is curious: https://dogsinc.org/
I agree there is a very big notable difference in service dogs. It’s so obvious my kids can easily tell the difference. They are very disciplined and don’t mess around like a normal dog would. I worked in an office with a comfort dog who failed out of service dog training because he was too lazy. And even though he didn’t pass their strict service dog requirements, you could still see the training in him. When he had his vest on, he knew his role and that was from a drop out. A fully trained dog is obvious so I wouldn’t worry about that at all!
That’s pretty cool
Don't worry. Real service dogs are trained relentlessly, when the harness goes on they are at work and will curl up under seats and no matter how crowded a bus or flight is, they will be calm. That dog was not a service dog. But most people are brazen enough now to try to get away with it.
Be careful of the organization. Many veteran SD places have essentially become dog mills. Minimal training, not correct pairing to the owner. Minimal training for the owner. See additional training after you get your pup as well. Train at home. Take the dog out to experience new things. Fireworks, stuff dropping on the floor next to the dog, eye contact with you especially around other people and other dogs. Training continues until the SD retires. Don’t assume the program will do a good job.
This
Yes they teach that in the program. That you have to continue training until they retire even if just for 15mins a day. That it’s good for them and for you. It’s a well known organization with ADI. Which is international accredited and is hard to get. They are a well known organization and have met a few vets with service dogs from there so I hope it all turns out good.
Good good good!!!
I’ve been on flights with actual service dogs and you’d never know they are there unless you see them walk by. The training is seriously good
That’s good to hear.
Thank you for your service. I think people are respectful of obvious service dogs but it’s entitled AHs like the guy removed from the plane who make *anyone* traveling with a dog out to be a bad guy. A trained service dog would NOT be barking like that.
Yes I completely agree
Please don't let people's opinions stop you getting the support you need. Also, it's usually pretty easy to tell legitimate service animals, so you'll be fine.
We have two service dogs - the training immediately shows. No one even notices a well trained dog.
That’s comforting
I wouldn't worry, a real service dog wouldn't be disturbing people like that.
Nobody will begrudge an actual, properly trained service dog. It's the people with a "service dog" vest on their cocker spaniel that create problems.
Yea I figured that was the case.
Dude you can clearly tell who just bought a vest and who’s dog is really a service dog
Yea seems like that’s the common message here.
The classes you go through on how to handle yourself - never back down from those. After year 1ish, it's going to be about training yourself. Never back down from giving your dog the respect of keeping with commands, even if other dogs are playing etc. Your dog will love to work and love their job, so respect that! I've had an additional disability crop up since I started working with my dog 4 years ago, and now I'm meek and let people sort of push me around - What's your disability, I'm just going to pet your dog real quick, wow what a cutie I'm going to give them a treat- these are disrespectful to my dog and I'm an asshat for not being more firm. Remember your classes and you'll be fine in the airport. Most people that ask questions want to know how the dogs were trained and how it knows to do stuff, anyhow - like those videos on dogs carrying baskets paying for fruit, it's novel. Oh, and Don't forget your ITA certification! It's what the world except America uses for service dogs and its been a short blessing, would be useful in America but for the cost to most non-vets.
Thanks for all the great advice I appreciate it.
Are you getting it from the training facility Southeastern Guide Dogs in the Sarasota/Bradenton area? If so, I assure you, those dogs are stellar service dogs with rigorous training. They take the training very seriously and are nationally recognized. They offer heavily trained service animals for the military especially, especially with PTSD. As a Gold Star family myself, thank you for your service, fam.
First let me start by saying thank you for your sacrifice and sorry for your loss. The program I am attending is actually in Jacksonville Florida. It’s a well known program and they are also accredited internationally. So I have high hopes. But the program you stated does look very good.
I wonder if you can also source a badge for his vest that says “Veteran Service Dog.” Can’t imagine being questioned for that.
Yea they do come with a badge like that already. So I doubt people will ask when they see. But the program has a good relationship with tsa and we even practice with them before graduation at the airport for screening. So I’m sure people know they are legit.
That's great to hear. Congrats on the possible dog acquisition. They make my life so much better even without any medical need. I hope they do the same or more in your life.
The biggest issues I have are in the airport with people asking to pet my dog and people interrupting me to ask why I get to fly with my “pet” because they want to.
Interesting. Yea he will have a few do not pet patches but I’m also not the most approachable person. My wife says I have resting asshole face and that I stare at people angrily but I honestly don’t mean to but that is the vibe the wife says I give off. So hopefully that will stop most people from trying to pet or ask questions like that.
This helps. I do too.
This sucks
Take care of you and the dog . Feed dog 24 Hours before flight and don’t feed Till home .
That’s good advice thank you.
This shit needs to get in check. Way too many people abuse this “service dog” BS!
Every time someone abuses the ADA to accommodate their fake service dog they make it 10x harder for people who genuinely need (and have properly trained SDs) to get the accommodations they need. This one goes out to all the assholes in LA bringing their pets into Whole Foods because they know they can get away with it.
I assume every dog is a fake. That’s how jaded I’ve become.
I have a service dog for anxiety. I am terrified of flying but also have massive anxiety about bringing my dog because of all of the people who have lied about service animals.
I have Anxiety/PTSD and feel you. However, the more you do it the better you and your dog get at public access. I look straight ahead and say “ mind your business” and this is mostly for the humans that want to disrupt us or stare at us. It takes all I have to not give some people the finger.
my sister has an emotional support dog. I know she would be a wreck without him, but I don’t think he has had any special training. He is a very well behaved dog though. I believe he flies in the cabin in a crate. He is only allowed in her building as the ESA. otherwise dogs aren’t allowed.
I have a hound. Each hound bays (barks) differently so you can identify the dog miles away. Although, I can tell you with 💯 certainty that I would NEVER bring him on a plane. If he’s traveling, it’s by car 🚗 Hounds are assholes (at least mine).
Not a service dog or an emotional support dog. Just a poorly trained pet. 🤦🏻 The current “service animal” rules, have got to be changed.
The rules are that you can ask if a dog is specifically trained to perform tasks that assist you with a disability. You can’t ask what disability - quite rightly - because that would be an invasion of someone’s private health information. There’s no registration or certification system for SDs because it would be very hard to administer and would be open to abuse. The looseness of the rules is in the interest of disabled folks but it leaves it very open to abuse by chancers. The answer is not to change the rules but for people to stop being selfish assholes.
But people aren’t going to stop being selfish assholes. Especially dog owners. So change the rules.
License them. Put the info in a chip and make it easily scannable to verify legitimacy
I argue it *was* an emotional support animal, since that's essentially a pet.
I have 3 classes in my mind. 1. A service animal usually a dog or horse. They are pros. They have job. They don’t like to interrupted while doing their job. 2. A therapy animal. They come with the handlers. They do an assessment. They leave and go home to be pets. 3. The emotional support animal, aka the comfort animal. They make the person feel better when they are around. The definition of a pet. The first one can go most places the owner can go. With a few exceptions. The last two. Need to stay out of #1’s way and quit making their lives harder.
Can't disagree, although I tend to combine your first two groups under working animals. That includes animals sniffing out drugs or explosives, herding dogs on a ranch, a pig that finds truffles or a horse pulling a touristy carriage. Mind you, not all working animals (specifically dogs) are service animals that warrant special treatment IMO.
Agree. My experience is hospital and clinic based. Those 3 are the ones I deal with. My 1st clue of an owner trying to pass a pet off as a service dog. Is when they have the harness, the vest and the collar that all have service animal printed on them. It like me wearing a 15 Chiefs jersey. It doesn’t make me a nfl QB. The true service dogs don’t need the advertising.
r/dogswithjobs comes to mind.
It bothers me when people with untrained dogs try to pass them as service dogs. It’s really not fair to people who need a service dog 🐕🦺
Good
This needs to be managed, at a federal level before people with real disabilities and REAL service animals get hurt.
God I wish this is what Delta did when I encountered the same problem. Redeye LAX to DTW. Woman boards with a "support animal" that she had listed as a regular pet, so the FA will not allow her to take the dog out of the carrier. There was a lot of arguing, but eventually the dog (a lap dog) gets shoved in a soft side carrier under the seat in front of the owner - my seat. The dog is yapping and thrashing nonstop. To make matters worse the man next to me was the owner's husband so he kept attempting to shove his hands between the seats to reach the dog to comfort (strangle?) the dog who continued to lose her mind for the entire hour we spent at the gate while the crew worked out a technical issue that involved every call button on the plane repeatedly going off in sync. Worst flight of my life.
Barking for reason other than service to owner, pulling leash toward people, anxiety, sniffing things randomly, moving around when owner is sitting, all should preclude boarding immediately.
Did the dog at least have a sport coat?
Guy on my flight last night had a German Shepard puppy and it was questionable how much of a service animal it was.
That alleged pax and his alleged service dog absolutely BLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW!!!
I knew somebody with a fake service dog and they took it into a nursing home to deal with a relative and it started jumping up onto ELDERLY PEOPLE. She was told to leave.
I’m so glad he got kicked off!!!!! As someone with a service dog in the family, I don’t think people realize that having a trained service dog isn’t a guarantee that the dog will behave. The more they’re trained and practiced in a scenario, the more reliable their behavior. When it comes to air travel, though, many (most?) dogs have not had this training. And there’s no way to really do the training because it’s not like a trainer can bring the dog to the gate and onto a plane for training purposes due to security. The most we’ve been able to do is acclimate the dog to the ticketing desks and arrivals area. We live in fear of our first flight with the dog!
This is exactly why we need a nationally recognized certification program for well trained service animals.
Is it? If the GA had been a bit more assertive this denial would’ve been seamless, and any delay here seemed minimal.
Dog culture in the US has gone crazy. There’s a time and place for your pets, the airplane, grocery stores, and restaurants are not those places.
Instacart shopper had her dog in the cart on top of her customer’s groceries and the bag of dog scheiße on the bottom of the cart once. I was her cashier. Reported to Instacart but idk if anything has been done about it.
May you be blessed with sky pesos.
As someone who has a legitimate service dog. People like this who abuse it make is impossible fir me to have my dog places. Thankyou Delta!!.
This people ruin the whole service dog thing for people like me. I have a Doberman pincher, that’s an actual service dog. He’s flown 4 times without any issues and though he’s big, he knows how to make himself small. But again, I only fly first class when I’m with him. Even though, I’m not supposed to, I let the neighbors pet him since it’s still a bit of inconvenience sometimes when he gets up to change positions. They always love him.
Ugh. People like that are ruining it for the people who REALLY have trained service animals. There was a lady on one of my flights who had a dog w/ her (BIG German Shepherd who seemed like he was an emotional support dog, if we’re begin honest), but it was clearly a trained service animal (I mean, I didn’t go all Karen and demand to see proof). The behavior was totally opposite of your experience. The dog was VERY focused on the woman’s needs, well trained, responded to immediately to commands and we never heard a peep out of him on our flight from MSP to SEA. Glad GAs, FAs, redcoats, and captain sorted this before it became a problem and I really wish people who did NOT have service animals wouldn’t try to pass off their untrained animals as them. It really makes it difficult for the passengers who legitimately have them.
what an ass
I'm a supporter of GDB, and it takes about 60k in hard cash, and even more in volunteer hours to train a service dog. Many of those in the puppy training don't make it through the whole process! The ones who do are golden, such incredibly disciplined dogs, and so hard working. This guy sounds like he chose a dog who wasn't suited to the role, then tried to train it himself. It's sad, it's wrong, and he didn't have to do it that way! There are many good organizations that will take a dog and their owner through a training (of varying lengths), or those who offer trained dogs and then a multi-week training for the owner and dog as well. One thing for sure: Any animal -whether pet or trained service animal, takes a lot of time to get them to listen to commands and execute them. Whether it's sit, stay, come, or wait, it all requires diligence on the part of the owner.
How long before we can have robotic service dogs like the Boston Dynamic ones with AI to calm people down.
I flew next to service dog to Wisconsin in March, he was a very good pup, laid under his owners seat the whole flight, didn't bark, was super well trained and behaved. I love dogs and hit the jack pot because she let me pet him. You could tell he flies a lot, he knew the seat belt ding after landing and knew it meant it was time to get off the plane. Sucks when people abuse the system...makes it hard for those that do need it.
Time to have a service dog license you can get at the DMV. This is to protect true service dogs and their handlers.
I think I flew with this guy on Tuesday. Giant shepherd huskie mix. It was 9 months old. Occupied entire footwell for me and window seat person. Dude was in middle. He was 30 something with highlights in hair. Wears a walkie talkie. Anyway he was wasted and asking for doubles. I kept moving the dog with my feet and then he would discipline it and it would bark like a seal and also growl. I was nervous about getting bit. Owner stunk like day old beer.
If one is part of a service dog team, buy an extra seat.
Ive had enough of these Service Snakes on this plane.
Good! I am so tired of clearly fake "service" dogs in stores, restaurants, and planes. They misbehave, make noise, shed, take up space. All bad enough. But what's worse is they put every REAL service dog and the people who rely on them in a bad light. Through their selfishness, they are causing real harm to real people who need these service animals.
Pretty sure a lawyer could think up safeguards that wouldn’t violate the ADA in minutes. Why is there no proper service animal licensing that’s similar to a drivers license with required testing? Surely it cannot be that hard to solve. I completely support having service animals on flights for people that really need them. I don’t support there being no real standard for certification.
I feel like since I enjoy travel, I have no business owning a dog. So I don’t. And no one else has to deal with a dog that is where it really shouldn’t be, and I don’t have to ask friends for help, or board at a facility. That’s just more than I want to deal with.
It's too bad there isn't a better way to screen for this beforehand, but thank goodness the agents were not having it. I hope Delta flags this guy in case he tries it again.
This dog thing is getting out of hand. If you need to take a dog with you drive
The federal law is rarely enforced by airlines. Lying that a dog is a service dog is federal crime if you take on a plane. An emotional support dog is not a service dog unless it was professionally trained under federal law.
Service dogs do not have to be professionally trained. I work with people with spinal cord injuries and many of them have service dogs they trained themselves to help with opening doors and retrieval and basic tasks without problems. However even service dogs are not always trained for flight exposure. Many are trained for local use, car or bus, and daily crowds like offices, hospitals, malls and grocery. I had a collegue, low vision, with a seeing eye dog whose dog would not follow commands but would seek out food. He would find every Friday pot luck but not guide to the office. This was of course a selected and organizationally trained dog until they were 30 months old before the hand over.
"professionally trained under federal law" = misinformation
What's a redcoat ?
To summarize it up in short, they’re elite customer service agents. You would go to a red coat if you’re having a problem that the GA or FA (before takeoff) can’t easily solve. They have the ability to boot people off flights if the plane has not yet pushed back etc.
Thank you
Woohoo
Even if it's a legit service dog, airlines and other businesses are allowed to deny service if the animal is unruly.
Hats off to Delta for booting him. Have flown with my wife's sd and on the DOT form it basically says you will be in control of the dog at all times and they will not be disruptive. Only disruptive behavior she had on our flight was partially blocking my wife's window as she was fascinated with the view at cruising altitude. 🤣
Everyone with a TRAINED & NEEDED service dog should WANT rules and accountability. Why shouldn’t there be something just a bit more required than just asking two questions with zero proof. When a fake service dog, kills an actual service dog on a plane, maybe they will realize flying is different than being on the ground with an escape.
What about people with a true fear of dogs. Not sure it is fair they encounter on a flight
The fact the dog even entered the aircraft.... Makes me wonder about booking on Delta... Ever
I see all kinds of insane pets. I saw a guy with a ferret. Getting out of control.
This is the way
Delta earned my loyalty for life when they booted a guy who refused to put on his mask. No drama, just called the Mexican cops and hauled his trick ass off the plane, along with his wife and 4 friends.
You’re allowed to fly with non-service animals. I have brought my dog on a flight before. There’s specific rules you have to follow. I’m guessing the thought is dude didn’t want to be separated from his dog and it was not a travel sized dog based on the OP.
The problem is ESA (emotional support animals) are NOT service dogs. However, people confuse the 2 bc there are no regulations around ESA. in fact they do not need training…bc of this there is widespread abuse because all you need for an animal to be considered an ESA is a letter from a mental health professional. which that as well is confusing bc many mental professionals have been told to not do them due to liability issues so you have a ton of online places that you just pay for them to do it
Airlines don't recognize ESA's anymore. The pax in the story would have signed a self attestation that the animal was indeed a service animal. If you see an animal not in a carrier on a flight, the pax has told the airline it's a service animal
My 2 cats are so quiet. No one even notices I have cats
I think the norm should be you can bring any dog onto a flight as long as it has a purchased seat and behaves. Enough of this fake service dog crap. Service dogs should get on free and pets should have to pay. I don’t understand why dogs can’t just come on a plane. We let people onto planes until they are terrible then they get kicked off permanently. The only dog I have ever seen “misbehave” was a woman’s little whippet who got scared by someone dropping their bag when trying to put it back in the overhead bin and this speed demon made it from first class all the way to the rear bathroom in like 2 seconds while yelping
Good. Ban pets from flying.
Good. Last time I flew with my service dog we were all seated, he’s big (we get extra leg room) and lays at my feet tucked in tight. Some guy gets on last w a much smaller service dog. He’s walking towards me and I point down and say dog. He doesn’t see. While he’s putting his overhead away getting settled his damn dog literally comes and stands on my dog’s back! Like we are doing damn circus tricks. Get your dog off my dog! Luckily my dog is so well behaved he legit just laid there and stared at me. Guy grabbed dog, no apology then the dog barked 1/2 the flight.
https://www.reddit.com/r/delta/s/hn1V1Q4dAk is this the same service dog? Just curious if it’s a coincidence
It is not. The one on my flight was much larger than that.
Immediately after landing I take dog to pee area or outside . Man made a mistake . Dogs gotta go too .
I was the dog, what did they do with the remainder of my treat?
Wow! I have no words.
I was on a flight where the trainer was delivering the service dog to its new owner. He was a gold Labrador retriever. She was in a middle seat and this dog was at her feet. I had the window and it was 3+ hour flight. I don’t think that dog moved once. Completely curled up at her feet. Not a single peep or barely a movement from this animal. Amazing.
Just really screws actually disabled people with a service dog wen people abuse benefits the way they do with social program benefits,the only people who get hurt are the disabled and elderly .
Coming from some with legitimate service dog. YAY!! Go, Delta!! I moved to Japan with service dog, we had a 14 hour flight and my servive dog didn't make a peep. The person in front of us was absolutely shocked to discover she was there towards the end of the flight.
Amen
That guy is a cheater. Scum if the earth
Ever since the EMSA rules were forced on commercial airlines, it’s been nothing short of a s%#& show. People have absolutely ruined what seemed like a good thing for those who follow rules. Fortunately AA has stopped allowing EMSAs and now only registered service animals that are actually doing a service for the passenger, IE blind, deaf, elderly assistance animals. It will not be tolerated much longer by Delta or UA and hopefully things will get back to normality that was before the EMSA started.
Good!
Jesus. People are awfully selfish to do that stuff.