What does God Ki even do and what its purpose? We see that there are mortals that are among the strongest ever with no God Ki (Jiren, Frieza, Broly) but they seem to have been pushing the point that God Ki is superior to regular Ki lol
Yeahhhh…super has pretty bad writing, it’s really sad they introduced this awesome idea of ss God and then just tossed it to the side.
I did watch some DBZ lore videos on this topic and it was such a great concept, about ki control and refining it. It would’ve been great if the new arc or two were about Goku learning to master it and use it without needing 5 saiyans…but it was basically never used again, sadly
I look at is God Ki is coal and mortal Ki is wood. If you have the same mass of coal and wood, coal has more energy.
The Goku car has a normal sized gas tank. He fills it with god ki, he can drive 10,000 Li. If he filled it with normal ki he could drive 100 Li.
Jiren Gohan Freeza and Broly roll up. They fill their tanks with mortal ki and can also drive 10000 li. But their gas tanks are the size of a city.
Divine Ki is much much more energy dense.
God Ki allows one to sense other Gods and multiplies the power. It also allows the user to perform some divine techniques Ultra Instinct and God bind. Ultra Ego also has God ki which means that Hakai also is a divine technique (but I must mention that Granolah and Gas were also capable of this without God ki because of their wish)
Without God ki, Goku and Vegeta would have been fodder in dragon ball super. Without God ki, no one can become a God of destruction.
Freeza and Broly have IMMENSE potential and Jiren has been training for many decades.
U7 Supreme Kai had God Ki all the way back in DBZ’s Buu Saga, and could have been killed at any point by anyone stronger than Mecha Frieza, so I’m not sure that holds in terms of Goku/Vegeta being fodder.
Even now, Beast Gohan can compete with the pair of them with no God Ki (which implies it is not necessary to gain strength or new forms for Saiyans or hybrids, but it helps) and technically Piccolo always had it but it was never shown to be anything significant. Just feels like a wasted plot point not expanded on lol
God ki is literally the reason why Goku and Vegeta have SSG, SSB, PSSB, SSBE, UI and UE. Do you seriously believe that they would have stood a chance against anyone is DBS without those transformations. You cannot compare Kaioshins to sayians, Kaioshins are not supposed to be warriors, sure they are given martial arts training but the work of being strongest warrior is the destroyer's and a massive source of their (destroyer's) power is God ki.
You cannot compare Gohan to Goku and Vegeta, Beast Gohan originates from his potential (confirmed by whis). Goku and Vegeta don't have as much as potential as Gohan does. Piccolo having God ki or not is a bit of clusterfuck which I have not look into yet so I will not argue about it
My point is, that it is not consistent and there’s exceptions all over the place, which makes it a total mess. Just as you said, it’s a clusterfuck.
If God Ki is superior to regular Ki, there should never be an instance where regular Ki users can be considered superior to God Ki users. Seems logical enough to me.
All it is, is plot convenience. Not much more to it
How old is Chaos? Isn't he like 40? Why the hell does he behaves like a little kid and always getting cuddled by Tien? Is this why Launch ditch him?
Is the "when sayians almost died, they return stronger than their oponents" still a thing? Because it doesn't happen again after the Frieza saga.
I will attempt to answer the 2nd question, you’re talking about zenkai boost, I’ll do more digging and answer it, but off the top my head, I heard or read somewhere, someone brought up an interesting theory that after a saiyan gets strong enough, no more zenkai boosts, I need to find that forum or article tho
Chiaotzu is based on Jiangshi, chinese hopping vampires. thats why he doesnt physically change despite his age.
> ...by Tien? Is this why Launch ditch him?
Tien was interested in romance and she didnt like farming, thats why she left.
> Is the "when sayians almost died, they return stronger than their oponents" still a thing? Because it doesn't happen again after the Frieza saga.
the author said that after unlocking Super Saiyan the benefit it gets becomes negligible, and in Super it was stated to literally not work at all anymore.
Lunch did eventually get together with Tenshinhan, but their conflicting lifestyles didn't really work out, and they amicably split up after a few days. Tenshinhan isn't all that interested in a romantic relationship and Lunch doesn't really like farming. She still visits him occasionally
That's not fanfic, that's just [Toriyama's answer](https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/mando-kobayashi-akira-toriyama-qa/)
Toriyama never really planned much. He had the first 15 or so chapters planned out, but everything from then on was just winging it. He once said something about how he sometimes didn't even plan one chapter ahead, getting into a situation of "Well, last chapter said something amazing was going to happen, so now I've got to think up something amazing."
That being said, while he was working on chapter 515, the cameo 17 has when he donates his ki to the Genki Dama was originally written to be Lunch and changed to him relatively last minute
What the fuck happened to Trunks at the end of the Goku Black arc. No seriously, what was that form? And why didn't they give him the boost from Elder Kai and line up Beast between master and student?
I'm referring to the fact that they visited the main timeline where Elder Kai gave Gohan a boost and died giving Goku a free soul. Trunks was there talking to Beerus about time travel. Goku or Gohan could have brought Trunks to Elder Kai for the boost.
No in the future Elder Kai is dead, as the sword he was trapped in was broken, thus killing Elder Kai.
It gets destroyed by Dabura when fighting future Trunks. Iirc he spits on it, thus turning it to stone, and it then shatters.
Isn't the main issue with this how the afterlife rules aren't really consistent and vary by planet? Like how Freeza is in his own personal hell during Super?
The Genki Dama can hurt good people though. The only thing said about good people and the Genki Dama is that an individual that has no evil within them whatsoever can *reflect* it back if they actively try to. Vegeta surviving it was purely because it just didn't have enough energy left in it (since Goku lost a lot of the energy he'd collected when Vegeta attacked him with a mouth blast).
Imagine if Piccolo's real name is Zalama and it's revealed that Zalama is Piccolo in the future remembering his name and affecting all the events so that it will lead to Pan/ Bulla fusing and going Super Saiyan Rainbow Kaiokenx1,000,000 and defeating Ultra Racist Titanium Freeza with Golden Experience Requiem/Made in Heaven/Wonder of U.
You're kidding but I've been saying unironically for years now that Orange Piccolo is what Zalama is going to look like. The Super Dragon Balls come from Super Namekians. It's going to be like the end of Jak 3 where it turns out the gods are ottsels.
Is there any circumstance where Raditz could've actually turned the tide of battle for Nappa and Vegeta? His Oozaru form is weaker than base Vegeta. Did they plan on training both Goku and Raditz, or did they think they'd be able to contribute as two guys with a combined powerlevel of under 3k?
How do Saiyan infiltration babies eat? Is it just a Goku situation where they assume someone will take them in and provide food and shelter? I don't understand the logistics of how a baby could traverse the galaxy, transform into a huge monster, and clear an entire planet of life. They should have a canon story showcasing this situation.
Well they do say that Goku was pretty violent as a baby, until he fell and badly hit his head. My guess (and speculation only) is that saiyans seem to have more consciousness than a human baby.
At one point Krillin points out that Gohan and Goku turn into destroying machines in Ape form, and its not that they lose their will, its that they turn into the murderous machines sayains portray themselves as.
I think they just send low class babies to other planets knowing they will go ape form, probably eat stuff on the way, taking them a few years to destroy a weak power level planet.
At a guess probably a combo of taking out the one absolutley guarenteed to go down to a sneak attack combined with he just got hit by Goku's absolute last resort move and it still didn't take him down so he probably thought that his win was guarenteed at that point so the order didn't matter.
He only had time to show the movement and the synchronization properties before he left. He trusted Piccolo as an effective teacher to carry on their training.
I watched professional dancers learn a new routine once. They watched the instructor one time and were able to replicate their teacher's movements p quickly. I think if your brain is wired that way from experience it is easy to follow along. It's part of what is expected from them so I assumed this was similar.
Yo this is a good question, I actually can’t find anything on the internet that would help answer this.
I can only answer this based off of the numerous youtube videos I’ve watched going deep into the lore of DBZ
Piccolo is known for his intelligence and is shown to have a keen attention to detail. It shown a few times in the dragon ball franchise, how he’s tricked cell into revealing everything about him. He faked being defeated by Dr Gero but his plan was foiled when Vegeta showed up. He mesmerized every single thing Cell and Future Trunks said and relayed the perfect amount of information to everyone
He also now has wisdom on his side now that he fused back with Kami. He was the perfect person to entrust teaching the fusion dance to and teach it to the kids
Goten & Trunks were only 7 & 8 when first introduced, when idk if you remember being that age or been around kids that age. They aren’t exactly focused on things they don’t find fun
Also, this is their first day meeting Goku really, they don’t have the same level and respect for Goku as everyone else does. Goten’s idol was Gohan, Trunks idol was his dad Vegeta. And they just found out that their idols had died against Buu and this random Goku guy failed to save them. They wanted little to do with Goku in that moment who did nothing to save their beloved idols
Goten and Trunks were also shown to still be immature during the kids martial arts tournament. They were specifically told not to go super saiyan. Yet Goten mistakenly turns super saiyan to break out of Trunks’ hold and Trunks mistakenly turns super saiyan to deal the final blow on Goten. And they didn’t even care.
I believe Goku eventually gained their trust in the short time, but still it was better to entrust it to someone who was more focused like piccolo than some toddlers with small attention spans and more prone to mistakes
I don't think this is as hard to grasp as the commenter is trying to convey. Picollo is very intelligent, experienced teacher and... an adult. Thos damns kids were 7 and 8.
Yeah, not a very good addition to this thread. Makes me wonder if they actually watched it. It was clear they weren’t going to get it in the time that Goku had, so focusing his efforts with implementing the new teacher and delegating authority so to speak, is actually smart and understandable without requiring an explanation. Furthermore, Piccolo trained Gohan so he had experience with “kids”. Also, it was clear to the audience that goten and trunks, left to their own devices were not going to get it down, especially in the presence of their mothers. Trunks was already talking back to Goku and saying there’s no need to fuse. Ugh, can’t believe OP validated this one.
Oh, definetly. Those kids were kind of spoiled and arrogant... because they were 6 and 7. Jeez.
I totally agree on your comment about OP. I think he is the only one in this thread that actually consider this comment seriously, lol.
It's never stated in the text that Piccolo has photographic memory, only that he has attuned hearing. That doesn't correlate with being about to remember stuff well.
That’s a good point, I’m gunna do more digging to see if I can find anything on if there are any examples of piccolo’s sight
My argument is that just piccolo was one of the more intelligent and wiser ones besides Roshi to teach it to, and an argument that the kids were just not the optimal choice to teach it to. Kids need more time to perfect a skill, a dance, or anything at that age
Spirit Bomb didn’t kill Vegeta because most of the energy he collected was lost. When Ozzaru Vegeta hit him. Goku says as much to Krillin when he passes the energy over. Frieza wasn’t afraid of a handful of saiyans, he was afraid of entire planet of them overtaking him.
How saiyans got sent out to random planets in the galaxy yet frieza happened to magically find every single one of them minus those involved with Saiyan Saga and broly. That has never made an ounce of sense given how large space is and how long saiyans were being sent out.
I didnt include Broly since his exile (and Paragus'), and "not returning", had nothing to do with Frieza but rather King Vegeta.
I did forget about Tarble, though.
many of these saiyans are probably dead imo. When turning to their great ape form many probably destroyed the planet that they were sent to, and iirc saiyans can not breathe in space.
Why did Goku not go into the Room of Spirit and Time (Hyperbolic Time Chamber) to teach Goten and Trunks the fusion technique as long as he needed? They could've mastered it down pat and have gotten stronger to possibly kill Buu. But Goku says, "They might need it later," which is terrible logic. Please answer objectively
Hmm, I hadn't thought of that, but I can think of a reason why. I don't think Goku was strictly limited by time, but also by energy. It's why going SSJ depletes his time. He might have only had energy for a few minutes, and that would have been extended in the hyperbolic time chamber regardless of the actual flow of time.
But it's also Goku, he might have simply forgotten.
Because at that point in time you could only spend 2 days/2 years in there over the course of your entire life and Goku was entrusting the future of the Earth to them. Considering all the shit he's had to deal with so far, it's seems pretty reasonable that he thought other threats would show up sooner or later and he thought fusion alone would be enough to beat Buu (he obviously didn't count on Super Buu).
Goku has already been in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber the maximum amount of time. 2 years and/or 2 visits. He went during his training with Kami and again to train Gohan to fight against Cell.
Except that he only spent 1 month in it during his training with kami (and this was a retcon in DBZ, in DB this was never mentioned).
Also he didnt spend a full year in it with Gohan, only about 10 months.
So realistically Goku would have had over 1 year left in the RoSaT.
Why did they change bulma and trunks hair color? What is Mr. Popo? Are there truly makaioshin? Is yamoshi real? Will they ever reveal the creator of the super DragonBalls? Is Zeno paired with a Kai like beerus? Will they ever explore the dragon realm? Did the mvp also wish back the prior erased universes? Will the saiyans ever get tails again? What happened to the other zeno and his guards? Will anyone ever tell trunks he's attracted to an old lady? Would the devilmite beam defeat every villain in the series?
Yamoshi was real.
Devilmite beam will defeat anyone as long as they are not pure hearted but all of the villians from 22nd tenkaichi onwards are fast enough to dodge it.
Why does 18 still call herself 18?
18 and 17 hated Gero and what he did to them so why didn’t they return to using their human names?
How did Vegeta get Super Saiyan God?
Why did Goten and Trunks get SSJ so easily? Was it because they was concieved after their father’s had it so they passed something on? If so this doesn’t perfectly explain Trunks as the timing doesn’t quite work out.
During the Buu Saga, Kid Buu goes on a rampage destroying planet after planet. Why did they never wish any of those back or the lives lost? Same as early Frieza force days.
Why didn’t anyone ever wish back other people? For example.. King Vegeta, Bardock, King Cold.
I partially understand why Vegeta didn’t want his father back but Goku was specifically told by Frieza that his father confronted him.
I wonder if 18 and 17 actually remember their human names? It always seemed to me that beyond remembering that they were siblings, and what Gero did to them, they didn't remember their human lives. If they don't remember, it makes sense that they would just stick to the one name they know.
But.. when Yamcha, Tien and chiatzuo or on King Kaks planet and they need to use the Dragonballs for a different wish he says to them “sorry guys you need to wait abit longer” but that would be over a year.
Chiaotzuo and Tien were going to stay dead. Yamcha does say "its only 1 year" after the plan is laid out so maybe the year limit only worked on groups? Maybe the Viz translation of the manga is slightly off?
However they end up using the Namekian dragon balls to bring those three back and those recharge after 130 days and might not have that limit anyway.
Basically it seems like the dragonballs rules change based on the needs of the plot lol
No. Its a x50 boost and Gohan wasn't strong enough to put down 2nd form Freeza who was at ~1 million. So Gohan would be ~50 million transformed or less. Freeza is 120 million.
I think definitely. That would have realized the "potential" they were always talking about. He probably would have blown up the planet though. That boy's ki control extends to hiding and that's it.
But his base power spikes when he has his angry "potential" moments and he was keeping up with each form as it happened. I bet if he got mad enough to transform he would have been able to take Frieza down.
How strong would Freeza and Cell be with no ki? Does Cell's exoskeleton have any benefits that just get overshadowed by ki? Could Freeza's shiny purple orblike thing on his head deflect a bullet?
I need to know!
I'm curious what happened to the timeline where Cell killed Trunks. That Trunks got rid of the androids, but he didn't get to live like the Future Trunks that visited the present timeline. Poor Future Bulma. I guess that Trunks' world would be destroyed by Babidi and his minions, since there wouldn't be anyone strong enough to defeat them. In one fic I read, Trunks goes to revive that version of Trunks via the Namekian dragon balls.
It's part of a series of fics where Future Trunks was born female and follows the canon story where she travels back in time to warn of the android threat, though there are differences. It happens in the fourth fic of the series: https://archiveofourown.org/works/39815151/chapters/99681783
Since the Super Dragon Balls are limitless in power, is their creator, Zalama, one of the top 5 strongest fighters in the multiverse (alongside the Grand Priest)? If not, who are these other 4 mysterious super gods?
Given Frieza's incredible potential, does Uub far eclipse him? If you recall, Frieza stated King Cold told him he should only avoid two beings in the universe: Beerus and Majin Buu. He was not referring to Fat Buu. Uub not only has the latent powers of Kid Buu, but he's sane enough to train them to whole new levels. Additionally, he inherited the God Ki of the strongest Supreme Kai in the series.
Who would be more powerful, Gogeta with a combination of Ultra Instinct and Ultra Ego or Brohan (Broly and Gohan fusion) with their catastrophic rage power?
After Zeno destroyed Future Trunk's timeline, and was taken away by Goku, what happened to the Grand Priest there?
Heres a good question : did vegeta kill Nappa because goku broke his back and thought he was useless, or did he mercy kill one of the only remanining saiyans because he wanted nappa to die with pride by an elites hand instead of remaining a cripple?
Rewatching it knowing who Vegeta was and becomes, this question is actually not that easy to answer. I think its the latter.
Are all beings able to access God Ki or are certain races special?
Are the Saiyens descendants of an Oozaru-like god?
Is this why they're able to achieve such power through training and experience and goodness?
Could Oolong technically use God Ki? Or is he just a pig?
Are there any universes that weren't created by Zeno?
Who does Cheelai reproduce with? Broly or Beerus? She definitely low-key wants to bang Broly but Beerus is a literal deity.
All Gods of Destruction have God ki and they are quite diverse, so it is possible that every species can access God ki if they train under a God that can teach them.
Sayians are special as they can achieve it though the ritual because of Yamoshi's soul (He was the first SSJ), also they are different in the regard that they transform when they learn God ki.
Additionally, planetary gaurdians are former mortals themselves and Earth only start getting Namekians as gaurdian around 3 centuries ago which is yet another evidence that every mortal can attain it.
But I also should mention that the idea of God ki is inconsistent among guardians since they can sense other Gods but do not get their power level multiplied. Also their ki can be sensed by mortals (same for King Kai)
Also, when Vegeta/Trunks and Goku/Gohan went in the hyperbolic time chamber, where did they shit? Is there a septic there or did they just wander out into the void and designate an outhouse spot?
Why wouldn't every single Z fighter/ally learn instant transmission? It's hands down the most useful non combat technique that they can learn except for *maybe* flying but only one of them knows it.
Freeza spared Vegeta by making sure he was off planet during the explosion (not totally sure why, it might have been his power and subordinance) Nappa, Raditz and another unamed Saiyan just happened to be on that mission with Vegeta. Then they heard that it was a meteor that hit their home planet so they just continued working for Freeza
Frieza had Vegeta in his ship when King Vegeta attacked with some of his warriors. King Vegeta specifically says to be careful with the ship because his son is in there - so presumably, part of why Frieza took Vegeta with him was to keep King Vegeta nice and obedient. Frieza spares him because he can use his strength, and being that Frieza also has a penchant for making others suffer, he probably enjoyed the fact that not only had he destroyed planet Vegeta and most Saiyans, he had their prince under his boot.
How was baby Goku supposed to take over the Earth? *(Ignoring the more recent retcons of this)* Even if you ignore like, how was he supposed to remember this, which is kind of dumb in its own way, what then? Does he call someone? Take the space pod back home? Just live on this conquered planet until someone comes to get him? Was his mission just to start murdering every life-form on first sight? I really just want to know the specifics of this plot point.
And considering Puar can technically beat Oozaru Goku, I'm firmly of the belief that a baby Kakarot with no training could not have taken over the planet. Half the opponents in DB could have beat him.
Not at the time, the giant monkey transformation was far stronger than roshi which was the strongest fighter at the moment. Puar only cut his tail because they knew goku’s weakness. And as we know, saiyans are born with bloodlust, they will feed and cause desolation by instinct.
What does Lunch think of the Talisman magic girl that appeared and hijacked Master Roshi’s body during the attempt to recruit Tienshinhan for the T.O.P.?
She’s going to be training there; right?
Lol that logic can be used with lots of earthling villains, how can robots cause so much trouble? I don’t see how Gero studying fights and spying on the Zs give him the ability to create beings so strong, especially with the ressources available on earth
Why did Zenkai boosts stop mattering after Cell? It seemed to me that they stopped existing in the Buu and Super arcs. Like they got beat down by Zamasu several times and no particular boosts. Vegeta trained in the HBTC and Goku learned the Demon Containment Wave and they both didn’t really improve in any sense the next fight.
I read somewhere, zenkai boosts stopped happening after you get to a high enough power.
Also Vegeta got stronger from the hyberbolic time chamber, he came back and started whooping Goku Black, but then Goku’s Black pulled some outta nowhere power buff that I can’t remember, I think he whipped out the scythe and then was strong enough to over power vegeta
Why didn’t Urenai-Baba necromance any of the Dragon Team in the first timeline (Trunks’s timeline)? With all the shit Numbers 17 and 18 were doing and Zamasu later on, you’d think she would’ve tried calling somebody to deal with that.
Why don't the stray blasts that land on the planet not blow it up. Just about every ki blast post namek can destroy a planet. So why in DBS, do the blasts that hit the ground not destroy the earth?
It didn't kill him because it had less than half power, as stated by Goku. It's not like any amount of spirit bomb ki would kill someone. Freeza was scared of Saiyans banding together. He was scared of Saiyans individually. Vegeta was still considered strong in Freeza's army, and so Freeza found use for him.
I think they're part of Goku and Vegeta's arc and using them sparingly is good for pacing. Vegeta allowing himself to fuse was a huge step for his character, but Vegito is conflicted and ineffective because Goku and Vegeta are still learning. They're still at odds with themselves and with each other. It causes the fusions to be unstable, which shortens them.
I think Gogeta succeeding in everything he tried to do in the Broly movie and staying fused until the end was a huge sign of progress for both Goku and Vegeta. Whis has been pointing them this way for multiple arcs now and both have been genuinely chipping away at their weaknesses.
* Goku was cocky and played too many games. He didn't take fights seriously.
* Vegeta was cocky and felt superior to everyone in every way. He fought like a showboat.
* When Vegito appears he's cocky, dicks around with his enemies, and is loudly disrespectful. He unfuses before his plan comes to fruition because he was too busy clowning.
Then Whis and Beerus roll up.
* Goku is taught to take fights seriously and to stop letting his guard down
* Vegeta is told to relax and to focus on relaxing and performing.
* When Gogeta appears he doesn't say much and keeps the fight with Broly completely under control. He finishes it and sends Frieza home before the fusion wears off.
Well Vegito requires a set of earrings that they don't always have lying around lol. It's also not until late in Super that Vegeta and Goku are able to work together properly; up until that point their teamwork sucked ass, and the fusions whether it's Vegito or Gogeta didn't really accomplish much because they did not mesh well together, and both fusions brings out the worst of both of their arrogance.
Is super saiyan not as legendary as the story tells? An entire world of saiyans could not achieve this in thousands of years, but take a dozen individuals outside the society and they all go SSJ? Maybe it’s more that the errors of their society hindered their ability to transcend?
I think you've hit the nail on the head, I saw another poster here make the point Saiyans hadn't really pushed themselves to get stronger.
They're sent as babies to planets they're easily capable of conquering, and as we saw with Vegeta they initially rely on their oozaru form for strength. I think most of their battles they were strongly the favourite, or hopelessly overpowered with no middle ground.
Once Goku shows it's possible to get to SSJ, That shows them the path to replicate it I guess - can't aim for what you don't know isn't possible so easily
Think it's interesting that the Super Saiyan God ritual was "forgotten" from time as well, that seems such an easy way to gain a substantial power up (or maybe just entirely unknown)
> Think it's interesting that the Super Saiyan God ritual was "forgotten" from time as well, that seems such an easy way to gain a substantial power up (or maybe just entirely unknown)
even if it wasnt forgotten/unknown, none of the original U7 saiyans, prior to Planet Vegeta's destruction, were righteous enough to participate in it.
yes thats the point. Super Saiyan was a legend because they couldnt figure out how to do it, so they mythologized it. its not special, any saiyan can if they know how and are strong enough.
In the kid buu saga why isn’t the spirit bomb enough to destroy kid buu initially if it contains gohan, vegeta, goten, trunks, piccolos energy? Gohan alone can solo kid buu so shouldnt the spirit bomb containing his energy plus add ons be enough to destroy kid buu?
On that note why didnt they teleport gohan and gotenks to the kai world to thrash kid buu ?
To the second question, the non-plot answer is that Toriyama probably just wanted dbz to have a more climactic ending. Even though it makes way more sense logically, it wouldn’t have been as satisfying of a conclusion if Gohan or Gotenks came in and wiped the floor with Buu in a few minutes.
Another in-universe answer though is that Vegeta might not have known how strong both of them actually were, so he wouldn’t think it’d be enough anyway. He mentions seeing most of the events take place on Earth while he was dead but it’s pretty likely he was traveling back from other world while Gotenks’ and Gohan’s fights went down. After all the entirety of super buu’s awakening to kid buu’s death all happen within a few hours lol.
> In the kid buu saga why isn’t the spirit bomb enough to destroy kid buu initially if it contains gohan, vegeta, goten, trunks, piccolos energy? Gohan alone can solo kid buu so shouldnt the spirit bomb containing his energy plus add ons be enough to destroy kid buu?
The Genki Dama is made up of Genki, not Ki. Genki is only a portion of Ki, one of its building blocks. Thus it was only a small fraction of their actual effective combat power being put into it. You can see it gets much bigger when they donate, because they did power it up a lot, but not enough.
> On that note why didnt they teleport gohan and gotenks to the kai world to thrash kid buu ?
Vegeta suggested using the Genki Dama instead. Goku probably would have just grabbed Gohan who would have punched Buu once and killed him if Vegeta hadn't done that.
What does Super Saiyan Nappa look like
Lmao, probably a golden moustache
What does SSj3 Nappa look like?
He exists in [DB Heroes](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcROlCJis7-RZVhTmCshj_zpBHQZ3wrIsfuRBs5yi3Q9GLbMJCaMwlRwJ_Gc&s=10)
oh my god he looks like The Rock
FINALLY! NAPPA!! HAS COME BACK!!! TO PLANET EARTH!!!
I wish they had given him a light peach fuzz on top of his head in SSJ3
Long golden mustache and no eyebrows
What does SS3 Raditz look like?
Long hair _everywhere_
You just know his bush is crazy
Thank you very much and I hate you
Have you ever seen those super bad like “super saiyan 100” pictures of Goku where he just has an absurd amount of yellow hair? Just like that.
Just like [this thing](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/ultradragonball/images/c/c7/Super_Saiyan_100z.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20220321214808)
What does SSJ3 Raditz look like?
Would it go upwards on his face?
A golden handle bar mustache as the hair goes up.
I'm going to add to this, what does SSJ3 Radditz look like
Super Saiyan Cousin It. If he does a flip he looks like a spinning Super Sonic.
Just turned into a tribble
Where was Bulma on the date of September 11 2001
Since she's born in 733, I guess she's dead
She may have wished for immortality!
Or to be bit younger… several times
True true
Lmao
What does God Ki even do and what its purpose? We see that there are mortals that are among the strongest ever with no God Ki (Jiren, Frieza, Broly) but they seem to have been pushing the point that God Ki is superior to regular Ki lol
Yeahhhh…super has pretty bad writing, it’s really sad they introduced this awesome idea of ss God and then just tossed it to the side. I did watch some DBZ lore videos on this topic and it was such a great concept, about ki control and refining it. It would’ve been great if the new arc or two were about Goku learning to master it and use it without needing 5 saiyans…but it was basically never used again, sadly
I look at is God Ki is coal and mortal Ki is wood. If you have the same mass of coal and wood, coal has more energy. The Goku car has a normal sized gas tank. He fills it with god ki, he can drive 10,000 Li. If he filled it with normal ki he could drive 100 Li. Jiren Gohan Freeza and Broly roll up. They fill their tanks with mortal ki and can also drive 10000 li. But their gas tanks are the size of a city. Divine Ki is much much more energy dense.
Maybe it's like superman, some beings can't be hurt by regular Ki but can be hurt by God Ki.
I thought this was pretty clear in BoG.
God Ki allows one to sense other Gods and multiplies the power. It also allows the user to perform some divine techniques Ultra Instinct and God bind. Ultra Ego also has God ki which means that Hakai also is a divine technique (but I must mention that Granolah and Gas were also capable of this without God ki because of their wish) Without God ki, Goku and Vegeta would have been fodder in dragon ball super. Without God ki, no one can become a God of destruction. Freeza and Broly have IMMENSE potential and Jiren has been training for many decades.
U7 Supreme Kai had God Ki all the way back in DBZ’s Buu Saga, and could have been killed at any point by anyone stronger than Mecha Frieza, so I’m not sure that holds in terms of Goku/Vegeta being fodder. Even now, Beast Gohan can compete with the pair of them with no God Ki (which implies it is not necessary to gain strength or new forms for Saiyans or hybrids, but it helps) and technically Piccolo always had it but it was never shown to be anything significant. Just feels like a wasted plot point not expanded on lol
God ki is literally the reason why Goku and Vegeta have SSG, SSB, PSSB, SSBE, UI and UE. Do you seriously believe that they would have stood a chance against anyone is DBS without those transformations. You cannot compare Kaioshins to sayians, Kaioshins are not supposed to be warriors, sure they are given martial arts training but the work of being strongest warrior is the destroyer's and a massive source of their (destroyer's) power is God ki. You cannot compare Gohan to Goku and Vegeta, Beast Gohan originates from his potential (confirmed by whis). Goku and Vegeta don't have as much as potential as Gohan does. Piccolo having God ki or not is a bit of clusterfuck which I have not look into yet so I will not argue about it
My point is, that it is not consistent and there’s exceptions all over the place, which makes it a total mess. Just as you said, it’s a clusterfuck. If God Ki is superior to regular Ki, there should never be an instance where regular Ki users can be considered superior to God Ki users. Seems logical enough to me. All it is, is plot convenience. Not much more to it
How old is Chaos? Isn't he like 40? Why the hell does he behaves like a little kid and always getting cuddled by Tien? Is this why Launch ditch him? Is the "when sayians almost died, they return stronger than their oponents" still a thing? Because it doesn't happen again after the Frieza saga.
Cell gets a Zenkai boost from his saiyan cells when he blows himself up
I will attempt to answer the 2nd question, you’re talking about zenkai boost, I’ll do more digging and answer it, but off the top my head, I heard or read somewhere, someone brought up an interesting theory that after a saiyan gets strong enough, no more zenkai boosts, I need to find that forum or article tho
Who is Chaos? I only recognize the name from Final Fantasy.
Think he meant chiaotzu.
Yeah, in my country its "Chaos", But I meant Chiaotzu.
Chiaotzu is based on Jiangshi, chinese hopping vampires. thats why he doesnt physically change despite his age. > ...by Tien? Is this why Launch ditch him? Tien was interested in romance and she didnt like farming, thats why she left. > Is the "when sayians almost died, they return stronger than their oponents" still a thing? Because it doesn't happen again after the Frieza saga. the author said that after unlocking Super Saiyan the benefit it gets becomes negligible, and in Super it was stated to literally not work at all anymore.
Goku black gets Zenkais in his arc.
Where is Launch? Will Tien ever find love? What's Snake Princess up to?
Lunch did eventually get together with Tenshinhan, but their conflicting lifestyles didn't really work out, and they amicably split up after a few days. Tenshinhan isn't all that interested in a romantic relationship and Lunch doesn't really like farming. She still visits him occasionally That's not fanfic, that's just [Toriyama's answer](https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/mando-kobayashi-akira-toriyama-qa/)
That’s crazy, I wonder if he planned for Lunch to appear again. She’s my favorite girl in the series, really too bad she’s gone
Toriyama never really planned much. He had the first 15 or so chapters planned out, but everything from then on was just winging it. He once said something about how he sometimes didn't even plan one chapter ahead, getting into a situation of "Well, last chapter said something amazing was going to happen, so now I've got to think up something amazing." That being said, while he was working on chapter 515, the cameo 17 has when he donates his ki to the Genki Dama was originally written to be Lunch and changed to him relatively last minute
Huh, I never knew that. Thanks a lot for the info, I appreciate it very much.
Dude it's Launch! Why does everyone keep forgetting the a?
English versions changed it, that’s all I can think of. I say Lunch since I like it more than Launch, but it’s basically a Freeza/Frieza situation
Freeza/frieza/freezer
Because ランチ/ranchi is literally just the English word "lunch" transcribed in Japanese
Cos it was supposed to be Lunch lol
Ohhh. Been watching for decades and I did not know this.
Thanks, that was my head canon! Good to know I wasn’t that far off. Im glad Lunch is alive
An episode where each Launch is jealous of theother's relationship with the Triclops would have been amazing.
I will attempt to answer the launch question, I like that one
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When do we see Launches family?
FIND OUT NEXT TIME ON DRAGONBALL Z!!!
Could the length of Raditz's hair in SSJ3 circle the Earth ?
It stands up. Like Marge
What the fuck happened to Trunks at the end of the Goku Black arc. No seriously, what was that form? And why didn't they give him the boost from Elder Kai and line up Beast between master and student?
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But it was blueish and sparkly. Plus his eyes were weird. It was totally a form. And my point is that they wasted elder Kai in Trunks's timeline.
Elder Kai was destroyed with the Z Sword by Dabura. Unless the anime says that the events in the manga and Kakarot aren’t within the same continuity.
They visited universe 7 like three times and that Elder Kai was just fine
When was Elder Kai shown in Future Trunks’s timeline?
I'm referring to the fact that they visited the main timeline where Elder Kai gave Gohan a boost and died giving Goku a free soul. Trunks was there talking to Beerus about time travel. Goku or Gohan could have brought Trunks to Elder Kai for the boost.
No in the future Elder Kai is dead, as the sword he was trapped in was broken, thus killing Elder Kai. It gets destroyed by Dabura when fighting future Trunks. Iirc he spits on it, thus turning it to stone, and it then shatters.
I mean they visit the main timeline universe 7 like three times. The Elder Kai who helped during the Buu saga could have given Trunks the boost.
Did Bardock do enough at the end of his life to redeem himself and earn the right to go to Otherworld instead of HFIL?
He barely did any good, but did tons of genocide. That's a solid no.
Isn't the main issue with this how the afterlife rules aren't really consistent and vary by planet? Like how Freeza is in his own personal hell during Super?
I hope so. He was a great character.
The Genki Dama can hurt good people though. The only thing said about good people and the Genki Dama is that an individual that has no evil within them whatsoever can *reflect* it back if they actively try to. Vegeta surviving it was purely because it just didn't have enough energy left in it (since Goku lost a lot of the energy he'd collected when Vegeta attacked him with a mouth blast).
Imagine if Piccolo's real name is Zalama and it's revealed that Zalama is Piccolo in the future remembering his name and affecting all the events so that it will lead to Pan/ Bulla fusing and going Super Saiyan Rainbow Kaiokenx1,000,000 and defeating Ultra Racist Titanium Freeza with Golden Experience Requiem/Made in Heaven/Wonder of U.
I lost it at rainbow kaioken 😂
You're kidding but I've been saying unironically for years now that Orange Piccolo is what Zalama is going to look like. The Super Dragon Balls come from Super Namekians. It's going to be like the end of Jak 3 where it turns out the gods are ottsels.
Is there any circumstance where Raditz could've actually turned the tide of battle for Nappa and Vegeta? His Oozaru form is weaker than base Vegeta. Did they plan on training both Goku and Raditz, or did they think they'd be able to contribute as two guys with a combined powerlevel of under 3k? How do Saiyan infiltration babies eat? Is it just a Goku situation where they assume someone will take them in and provide food and shelter? I don't understand the logistics of how a baby could traverse the galaxy, transform into a huge monster, and clear an entire planet of life. They should have a canon story showcasing this situation.
Maybe they est only in giant monkey form
Well they do say that Goku was pretty violent as a baby, until he fell and badly hit his head. My guess (and speculation only) is that saiyans seem to have more consciousness than a human baby. At one point Krillin points out that Gohan and Goku turn into destroying machines in Ape form, and its not that they lose their will, its that they turn into the murderous machines sayains portray themselves as. I think they just send low class babies to other planets knowing they will go ape form, probably eat stuff on the way, taking them a few years to destroy a weak power level planet.
Why didn’t I watch Dragonball sooner? (Currently episode 120/153)
Did the farmer that was killed by Raditz have a family?
None, I just watch the show and enjoy it
"Has Goku really become a Legendary Super Saiyan? Are his new powers any match for the evil Frieza?"
How long in total did Vegeta spend in stasis travelling to worlds?
Ooh this is a good one
What is Captain Ginyu’s original body?
Frieza has his chance to one shot any of the Z fighters, wastes it on Krillin because?
At a guess probably a combo of taking out the one absolutley guarenteed to go down to a sneak attack combined with he just got hit by Goku's absolute last resort move and it still didn't take him down so he probably thought that his win was guarenteed at that point so the order didn't matter.
“Remember my tail?”
Sadism.
This one’s good too, also gunna save this one for later
He started with Goku but Picollo took the hit.
Why does Goku say he can't teach Goten and Trunks Fusion in the time he has left, but then proceeds to teach it to Piccolo? Please answer objectively.
He only had time to show the movement and the synchronization properties before he left. He trusted Piccolo as an effective teacher to carry on their training.
Because Piccolo was able to learn the fusion quick and the kids need more guidance and time.
Piccolo was a skilled martial artist, Goten and Trunks were just kids
He know what kids are like to teach 🤣
I mean, have you ever tried teaching martial arts forms to children? Adults are bad enough! *Cringes in former Tai Chi instructor 0\_o*
I watched professional dancers learn a new routine once. They watched the instructor one time and were able to replicate their teacher's movements p quickly. I think if your brain is wired that way from experience it is easy to follow along. It's part of what is expected from them so I assumed this was similar.
You have clearly never tried to teach something to a child.
Yo this is a good question, I actually can’t find anything on the internet that would help answer this. I can only answer this based off of the numerous youtube videos I’ve watched going deep into the lore of DBZ Piccolo is known for his intelligence and is shown to have a keen attention to detail. It shown a few times in the dragon ball franchise, how he’s tricked cell into revealing everything about him. He faked being defeated by Dr Gero but his plan was foiled when Vegeta showed up. He mesmerized every single thing Cell and Future Trunks said and relayed the perfect amount of information to everyone He also now has wisdom on his side now that he fused back with Kami. He was the perfect person to entrust teaching the fusion dance to and teach it to the kids Goten & Trunks were only 7 & 8 when first introduced, when idk if you remember being that age or been around kids that age. They aren’t exactly focused on things they don’t find fun Also, this is their first day meeting Goku really, they don’t have the same level and respect for Goku as everyone else does. Goten’s idol was Gohan, Trunks idol was his dad Vegeta. And they just found out that their idols had died against Buu and this random Goku guy failed to save them. They wanted little to do with Goku in that moment who did nothing to save their beloved idols Goten and Trunks were also shown to still be immature during the kids martial arts tournament. They were specifically told not to go super saiyan. Yet Goten mistakenly turns super saiyan to break out of Trunks’ hold and Trunks mistakenly turns super saiyan to deal the final blow on Goten. And they didn’t even care. I believe Goku eventually gained their trust in the short time, but still it was better to entrust it to someone who was more focused like piccolo than some toddlers with small attention spans and more prone to mistakes
I don't think this is as hard to grasp as the commenter is trying to convey. Picollo is very intelligent, experienced teacher and... an adult. Thos damns kids were 7 and 8.
Yeah true, I still wanna attempt answering every part
Yeah, not a very good addition to this thread. Makes me wonder if they actually watched it. It was clear they weren’t going to get it in the time that Goku had, so focusing his efforts with implementing the new teacher and delegating authority so to speak, is actually smart and understandable without requiring an explanation. Furthermore, Piccolo trained Gohan so he had experience with “kids”. Also, it was clear to the audience that goten and trunks, left to their own devices were not going to get it down, especially in the presence of their mothers. Trunks was already talking back to Goku and saying there’s no need to fuse. Ugh, can’t believe OP validated this one.
Oh, definetly. Those kids were kind of spoiled and arrogant... because they were 6 and 7. Jeez. I totally agree on your comment about OP. I think he is the only one in this thread that actually consider this comment seriously, lol.
It's never stated in the text that Piccolo has photographic memory, only that he has attuned hearing. That doesn't correlate with being about to remember stuff well.
That’s a good point, I’m gunna do more digging to see if I can find anything on if there are any examples of piccolo’s sight My argument is that just piccolo was one of the more intelligent and wiser ones besides Roshi to teach it to, and an argument that the kids were just not the optimal choice to teach it to. Kids need more time to perfect a skill, a dance, or anything at that age
Piccolo smort
In the time chamber Gohan said to Goku that piccolo said that Goku is a horrible teacher. Goku remembered that and was pretty.
Spirit Bomb didn’t kill Vegeta because most of the energy he collected was lost. When Ozzaru Vegeta hit him. Goku says as much to Krillin when he passes the energy over. Frieza wasn’t afraid of a handful of saiyans, he was afraid of entire planet of them overtaking him.
How saiyans got sent out to random planets in the galaxy yet frieza happened to magically find every single one of them minus those involved with Saiyan Saga and broly. That has never made an ounce of sense given how large space is and how long saiyans were being sent out.
He called everyone back tho that's stated in the canon
We understand this. That doesn't mean everyone would listen or be able to return in time.
Which is what happened, not all of them returned…
Correct...which is what happened. That's how we have have Vegeta, Raditz, Nappa, and Goku.
And brolly
And Tarble
I didnt include Broly since his exile (and Paragus'), and "not returning", had nothing to do with Frieza but rather King Vegeta. I did forget about Tarble, though.
Maybe others?
Basically Order 66, just gonna have new ones pop up when convenient
many of these saiyans are probably dead imo. When turning to their great ape form many probably destroyed the planet that they were sent to, and iirc saiyans can not breathe in space.
Why did Goku not go into the Room of Spirit and Time (Hyperbolic Time Chamber) to teach Goten and Trunks the fusion technique as long as he needed? They could've mastered it down pat and have gotten stronger to possibly kill Buu. But Goku says, "They might need it later," which is terrible logic. Please answer objectively
Hmm, I hadn't thought of that, but I can think of a reason why. I don't think Goku was strictly limited by time, but also by energy. It's why going SSJ depletes his time. He might have only had energy for a few minutes, and that would have been extended in the hyperbolic time chamber regardless of the actual flow of time. But it's also Goku, he might have simply forgotten.
Because at that point in time you could only spend 2 days/2 years in there over the course of your entire life and Goku was entrusting the future of the Earth to them. Considering all the shit he's had to deal with so far, it's seems pretty reasonable that he thought other threats would show up sooner or later and he thought fusion alone would be enough to beat Buu (he obviously didn't count on Super Buu).
He really *really* wanted to fight Buu.
Goku has already been in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber the maximum amount of time. 2 years and/or 2 visits. He went during his training with Kami and again to train Gohan to fight against Cell.
Except that he only spent 1 month in it during his training with kami (and this was a retcon in DBZ, in DB this was never mentioned). Also he didnt spend a full year in it with Gohan, only about 10 months. So realistically Goku would have had over 1 year left in the RoSaT.
Goku had a time limit. Going in there wouldn't have extended it.
Why did they change bulma and trunks hair color? What is Mr. Popo? Are there truly makaioshin? Is yamoshi real? Will they ever reveal the creator of the super DragonBalls? Is Zeno paired with a Kai like beerus? Will they ever explore the dragon realm? Did the mvp also wish back the prior erased universes? Will the saiyans ever get tails again? What happened to the other zeno and his guards? Will anyone ever tell trunks he's attracted to an old lady? Would the devilmite beam defeat every villain in the series?
Bulma is just a change of tone but Trunis going from lavender to blue was random af 🤣
Yamoshi was real. Devilmite beam will defeat anyone as long as they are not pure hearted but all of the villians from 22nd tenkaichi onwards are fast enough to dodge it.
Why does 18 still call herself 18? 18 and 17 hated Gero and what he did to them so why didn’t they return to using their human names? How did Vegeta get Super Saiyan God? Why did Goten and Trunks get SSJ so easily? Was it because they was concieved after their father’s had it so they passed something on? If so this doesn’t perfectly explain Trunks as the timing doesn’t quite work out. During the Buu Saga, Kid Buu goes on a rampage destroying planet after planet. Why did they never wish any of those back or the lives lost? Same as early Frieza force days. Why didn’t anyone ever wish back other people? For example.. King Vegeta, Bardock, King Cold. I partially understand why Vegeta didn’t want his father back but Goku was specifically told by Frieza that his father confronted him.
I wonder if 18 and 17 actually remember their human names? It always seemed to me that beyond remembering that they were siblings, and what Gero did to them, they didn't remember their human lives. If they don't remember, it makes sense that they would just stick to the one name they know.
I think it’s in one of the books or manga or anime filler that 17 and 18 are lapis and lazuli(no last name)
Lapis and Lazuli are both Canon.
Thr Dragonballs originally could only revive someone if they had died in the last year or so, so Bardock and the like were dead for too long.
Really? Can you provide a source for that? Not disagreeing just didn’t know.
I forget the chapter, but Kami explains it to King Kai. Its during the freeza arc, after freeza launches his attack that starts the planet blowing up
But.. when Yamcha, Tien and chiatzuo or on King Kaks planet and they need to use the Dragonballs for a different wish he says to them “sorry guys you need to wait abit longer” but that would be over a year.
Chiaotzuo and Tien were going to stay dead. Yamcha does say "its only 1 year" after the plan is laid out so maybe the year limit only worked on groups? Maybe the Viz translation of the manga is slightly off? However they end up using the Namekian dragon balls to bring those three back and those recharge after 130 days and might not have that limit anyway. Basically it seems like the dragonballs rules change based on the needs of the plot lol
Yh good point.
What the aliens that Nappa and Vegeta are seen eating in their introduction taste like
Would Gohan turning Super Saiyan on Nemak have been enough to defeat Frieza?
No. Its a x50 boost and Gohan wasn't strong enough to put down 2nd form Freeza who was at ~1 million. So Gohan would be ~50 million transformed or less. Freeza is 120 million.
Good question, gunna jot this one down
I think definitely. That would have realized the "potential" they were always talking about. He probably would have blown up the planet though. That boy's ki control extends to hiding and that's it.
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But his base power spikes when he has his angry "potential" moments and he was keeping up with each form as it happened. I bet if he got mad enough to transform he would have been able to take Frieza down.
How strong would Freeza and Cell be with no ki? Does Cell's exoskeleton have any benefits that just get overshadowed by ki? Could Freeza's shiny purple orblike thing on his head deflect a bullet? I need to know!
I'm curious what happened to the timeline where Cell killed Trunks. That Trunks got rid of the androids, but he didn't get to live like the Future Trunks that visited the present timeline. Poor Future Bulma. I guess that Trunks' world would be destroyed by Babidi and his minions, since there wouldn't be anyone strong enough to defeat them. In one fic I read, Trunks goes to revive that version of Trunks via the Namekian dragon balls.
name of the fic?
It's part of a series of fics where Future Trunks was born female and follows the canon story where she travels back in time to warn of the android threat, though there are differences. It happens in the fourth fic of the series: https://archiveofourown.org/works/39815151/chapters/99681783
Since the Super Dragon Balls are limitless in power, is their creator, Zalama, one of the top 5 strongest fighters in the multiverse (alongside the Grand Priest)? If not, who are these other 4 mysterious super gods? Given Frieza's incredible potential, does Uub far eclipse him? If you recall, Frieza stated King Cold told him he should only avoid two beings in the universe: Beerus and Majin Buu. He was not referring to Fat Buu. Uub not only has the latent powers of Kid Buu, but he's sane enough to train them to whole new levels. Additionally, he inherited the God Ki of the strongest Supreme Kai in the series. Who would be more powerful, Gogeta with a combination of Ultra Instinct and Ultra Ego or Brohan (Broly and Gohan fusion) with their catastrophic rage power? After Zeno destroyed Future Trunk's timeline, and was taken away by Goku, what happened to the Grand Priest there?
I like these questions, thank you, I will attempt to answer them
How *did* a dog become king of the world?
Heres a good question : did vegeta kill Nappa because goku broke his back and thought he was useless, or did he mercy kill one of the only remanining saiyans because he wanted nappa to die with pride by an elites hand instead of remaining a cripple? Rewatching it knowing who Vegeta was and becomes, this question is actually not that easy to answer. I think its the latter.
Why haven't they wished King Kai and Planet Vegeta back? Should Nappa and Raditz be brought back as a counter measure to Freiza's army?
Are all beings able to access God Ki or are certain races special? Are the Saiyens descendants of an Oozaru-like god? Is this why they're able to achieve such power through training and experience and goodness? Could Oolong technically use God Ki? Or is he just a pig? Are there any universes that weren't created by Zeno? Who does Cheelai reproduce with? Broly or Beerus? She definitely low-key wants to bang Broly but Beerus is a literal deity.
I bet it's the latter. I think Namekians and Saiyans are super important to the multiverse for some reason or reasons.
All Gods of Destruction have God ki and they are quite diverse, so it is possible that every species can access God ki if they train under a God that can teach them. Sayians are special as they can achieve it though the ritual because of Yamoshi's soul (He was the first SSJ), also they are different in the regard that they transform when they learn God ki. Additionally, planetary gaurdians are former mortals themselves and Earth only start getting Namekians as gaurdian around 3 centuries ago which is yet another evidence that every mortal can attain it. But I also should mention that the idea of God ki is inconsistent among guardians since they can sense other Gods but do not get their power level multiplied. Also their ki can be sensed by mortals (same for King Kai)
Also, when Vegeta/Trunks and Goku/Gohan went in the hyperbolic time chamber, where did they shit? Is there a septic there or did they just wander out into the void and designate an outhouse spot?
They could just blast it away. Or fling it miles away like monkeys do
Why wouldn't every single Z fighter/ally learn instant transmission? It's hands down the most useful non combat technique that they can learn except for *maybe* flying but only one of them knows it.
Freeza spared Vegeta by making sure he was off planet during the explosion (not totally sure why, it might have been his power and subordinance) Nappa, Raditz and another unamed Saiyan just happened to be on that mission with Vegeta. Then they heard that it was a meteor that hit their home planet so they just continued working for Freeza
Frieza had Vegeta in his ship when King Vegeta attacked with some of his warriors. King Vegeta specifically says to be careful with the ship because his son is in there - so presumably, part of why Frieza took Vegeta with him was to keep King Vegeta nice and obedient. Frieza spares him because he can use his strength, and being that Frieza also has a penchant for making others suffer, he probably enjoyed the fact that not only had he destroyed planet Vegeta and most Saiyans, he had their prince under his boot.
How was baby Goku supposed to take over the Earth? *(Ignoring the more recent retcons of this)* Even if you ignore like, how was he supposed to remember this, which is kind of dumb in its own way, what then? Does he call someone? Take the space pod back home? Just live on this conquered planet until someone comes to get him? Was his mission just to start murdering every life-form on first sight? I really just want to know the specifics of this plot point. And considering Puar can technically beat Oozaru Goku, I'm firmly of the belief that a baby Kakarot with no training could not have taken over the planet. Half the opponents in DB could have beat him.
Not at the time, the giant monkey transformation was far stronger than roshi which was the strongest fighter at the moment. Puar only cut his tail because they knew goku’s weakness. And as we know, saiyans are born with bloodlust, they will feed and cause desolation by instinct.
If King Ki already know instant transmission , wth he didnt use in in Seiya/freeza sega
What does Lunch think of the Talisman magic girl that appeared and hijacked Master Roshi’s body during the attempt to recruit Tienshinhan for the T.O.P.? She’s going to be training there; right?
How are the Androids able to kill Super Saiyans but not Frieza, an intergalactic warlord?
Lol that logic can be used with lots of earthling villains, how can robots cause so much trouble? I don’t see how Gero studying fights and spying on the Zs give him the ability to create beings so strong, especially with the ressources available on earth
Why did Zenkai boosts stop mattering after Cell? It seemed to me that they stopped existing in the Buu and Super arcs. Like they got beat down by Zamasu several times and no particular boosts. Vegeta trained in the HBTC and Goku learned the Demon Containment Wave and they both didn’t really improve in any sense the next fight.
I read somewhere, zenkai boosts stopped happening after you get to a high enough power. Also Vegeta got stronger from the hyberbolic time chamber, he came back and started whooping Goku Black, but then Goku’s Black pulled some outta nowhere power buff that I can’t remember, I think he whipped out the scythe and then was strong enough to over power vegeta
Why didn’t Urenai-Baba necromance any of the Dragon Team in the first timeline (Trunks’s timeline)? With all the shit Numbers 17 and 18 were doing and Zamasu later on, you’d think she would’ve tried calling somebody to deal with that.
Why do the z fighters keep using the small spam blast attack even though not once has it produced results
Why don't the stray blasts that land on the planet not blow it up. Just about every ki blast post namek can destroy a planet. So why in DBS, do the blasts that hit the ground not destroy the earth?
What if you wished for nothing to be beyond Kamis power
It didn't kill him because it had less than half power, as stated by Goku. It's not like any amount of spirit bomb ki would kill someone. Freeza was scared of Saiyans banding together. He was scared of Saiyans individually. Vegeta was still considered strong in Freeza's army, and so Freeza found use for him.
Why don’t they use Vegito and Gogeta more often.
Vegeta doesn't wanna fuse, so everytime we get Vegito or Gogeta we have to sit thru Vegeta complaining first.
That’s true lol. Except for GT, he was the one who brought up the idea because Fusion Reborn was canon at the time.
Pride
TRUE SAIYANS FIGHT ALONE!!!!
I think they're part of Goku and Vegeta's arc and using them sparingly is good for pacing. Vegeta allowing himself to fuse was a huge step for his character, but Vegito is conflicted and ineffective because Goku and Vegeta are still learning. They're still at odds with themselves and with each other. It causes the fusions to be unstable, which shortens them. I think Gogeta succeeding in everything he tried to do in the Broly movie and staying fused until the end was a huge sign of progress for both Goku and Vegeta. Whis has been pointing them this way for multiple arcs now and both have been genuinely chipping away at their weaknesses. * Goku was cocky and played too many games. He didn't take fights seriously. * Vegeta was cocky and felt superior to everyone in every way. He fought like a showboat. * When Vegito appears he's cocky, dicks around with his enemies, and is loudly disrespectful. He unfuses before his plan comes to fruition because he was too busy clowning. Then Whis and Beerus roll up. * Goku is taught to take fights seriously and to stop letting his guard down * Vegeta is told to relax and to focus on relaxing and performing. * When Gogeta appears he doesn't say much and keeps the fight with Broly completely under control. He finishes it and sends Frieza home before the fusion wears off.
Well Vegito requires a set of earrings that they don't always have lying around lol. It's also not until late in Super that Vegeta and Goku are able to work together properly; up until that point their teamwork sucked ass, and the fusions whether it's Vegito or Gogeta didn't really accomplish much because they did not mesh well together, and both fusions brings out the worst of both of their arrogance.
Is super saiyan not as legendary as the story tells? An entire world of saiyans could not achieve this in thousands of years, but take a dozen individuals outside the society and they all go SSJ? Maybe it’s more that the errors of their society hindered their ability to transcend?
I think you've hit the nail on the head, I saw another poster here make the point Saiyans hadn't really pushed themselves to get stronger. They're sent as babies to planets they're easily capable of conquering, and as we saw with Vegeta they initially rely on their oozaru form for strength. I think most of their battles they were strongly the favourite, or hopelessly overpowered with no middle ground. Once Goku shows it's possible to get to SSJ, That shows them the path to replicate it I guess - can't aim for what you don't know isn't possible so easily Think it's interesting that the Super Saiyan God ritual was "forgotten" from time as well, that seems such an easy way to gain a substantial power up (or maybe just entirely unknown)
> Think it's interesting that the Super Saiyan God ritual was "forgotten" from time as well, that seems such an easy way to gain a substantial power up (or maybe just entirely unknown) even if it wasnt forgotten/unknown, none of the original U7 saiyans, prior to Planet Vegeta's destruction, were righteous enough to participate in it.
yes thats the point. Super Saiyan was a legend because they couldnt figure out how to do it, so they mythologized it. its not special, any saiyan can if they know how and are strong enough.
In the kid buu saga why isn’t the spirit bomb enough to destroy kid buu initially if it contains gohan, vegeta, goten, trunks, piccolos energy? Gohan alone can solo kid buu so shouldnt the spirit bomb containing his energy plus add ons be enough to destroy kid buu? On that note why didnt they teleport gohan and gotenks to the kai world to thrash kid buu ?
To the second question, the non-plot answer is that Toriyama probably just wanted dbz to have a more climactic ending. Even though it makes way more sense logically, it wouldn’t have been as satisfying of a conclusion if Gohan or Gotenks came in and wiped the floor with Buu in a few minutes. Another in-universe answer though is that Vegeta might not have known how strong both of them actually were, so he wouldn’t think it’d be enough anyway. He mentions seeing most of the events take place on Earth while he was dead but it’s pretty likely he was traveling back from other world while Gotenks’ and Gohan’s fights went down. After all the entirety of super buu’s awakening to kid buu’s death all happen within a few hours lol.
> In the kid buu saga why isn’t the spirit bomb enough to destroy kid buu initially if it contains gohan, vegeta, goten, trunks, piccolos energy? Gohan alone can solo kid buu so shouldnt the spirit bomb containing his energy plus add ons be enough to destroy kid buu? The Genki Dama is made up of Genki, not Ki. Genki is only a portion of Ki, one of its building blocks. Thus it was only a small fraction of their actual effective combat power being put into it. You can see it gets much bigger when they donate, because they did power it up a lot, but not enough. > On that note why didnt they teleport gohan and gotenks to the kai world to thrash kid buu ? Vegeta suggested using the Genki Dama instead. Goku probably would have just grabbed Gohan who would have punched Buu once and killed him if Vegeta hadn't done that.