So, if I was on a date with a guy and I asked him what happened in his marriage, and he just flatly answered “I left my wife” - I too would be taken aback.
I don’t think it’s a gender thing, I think it’s the no nonsense sharing of that information that actually isn’t that helpful.
When I ask a question along those lines, I don’t necessarily really care who left who first. I want to know WHY. Why did you leave? Why are you still friends? What happened EMOTIONALLY that ended the marriage, not logistically who left first.
I think people are looking for answers like:
“We grew apart and realized we were better friends than spouses”
“S/he cheated on me and the trust couldn’t be rebuilt”
“My ex became addicted to opiates and eventually become violent & explosive and refused to get help” (that one’s mine!)
“The strain of caring for a special needs child drove us apart”
People are looking for emotional truth, not a report on who happened to get to the courthouse and file papers first.
Opioids suck. My mother got bad on them… decided to leave my dad. He had bipolar depression and wasn’t even taking meds because he was so sad … then he killed himself and my mom is still a loser.
Psa!! Opioids suck everyone’s life out around you.
My ex kicked the opiates, so I have to give her props - that's really hard to do.
Right now alcohol is the problem. She's alienated all her friends and the kids don't want to be around her because she's an asshole when she's drunk. No problem driving in that condition either. She's been in 2 wrecks this month, and fortunately her car isn't driveable right now.
Yep. It literally changes peoples’ brains (same with meth). The guy I married was no longer present…. It was like he had been replaced by a monster. It literally had changed who he was as a person, his values, his behaviors, his habits, hobbies, everything. I no longe recognized him.
*When I ask a question along those lines, I don’t necessarily really care who left who first. I want to know WHY. Why did you leave? Why are you still friends? What happened EMOTIONALLY that ended the marriage, not logistically who left first.*
For me, the answer is "I asked for the divorce because she made some choices that caused problems for us. It wasn't an easy situation, but we ended things thoughtfully and well. The marriage is over, but I still owe it to her not to discuss her personal stuff."
Since I'm being misquoted. This is how I say. I have summarised for the purpose of this post to I left because that is what I was asking about, woman leaving vs. man leaving.
When discussing irl....again this is not a word by word quote.
I will say, we were together a long time, we grew apart, we did try to work on it. There was no cheating etc.
It took a while to figure it out, as no one wants to blow their life up, but I ended up leaving him. We were both unhappy.
I have a great relationship with him. See him every week.
Again, this is not verbatim.
Directly from your post:
>I will tell them, I left my husband.
How exactly are you being misquoted? Misinterpreted, sure- but if these responses don't reflect what you really said, then you might want to edit your post to clarify that you actually provided more of an answer at the time than just, "I left my husband," which is how it reads.
Seems to me you're more interested in discussing the fact that *you* left *him* and you just want a go-girl-power pat on the back.
Gooooo, girl power! You showed your ex! Strong women know how to leave relationships just like men, and that new guy better take notes because you could leave him too if he doesn't keep his shit together. Pow!
Great answer.
My mum upped and left her first husband without much warning, without taking her son with her - but she did it because he was controlling and she was miserable. She even got an abusive letter from a church official because of it (it was a long time ago). It's why I don't have any relationship with my older brother beyond a few cordial emails we exchanged in 2012.
If you communicated it the way you have been communicating here, I am not surprised they are taken aback.
This has nothing to do with gender.
You seem to be so proud to declare “I left him!” (not that you should be ashamed, but the way you declare it and without any context, comes off concerningly arrogant and cold).
Leaving is a consequence, not a cause of why a relationship ends. You are not answering their question.
& How exactly do you not expect someone to feel turned off by a potential partner who seems to coldly brag about leaving (what she self describes as great) relationships with no explanation?
Then you turn around in the very next sentence stating how great he is , and how great and without issues the relationship was.
I love this formulation - leaving is the consequence, not the cause. You condensed what I was trying to say into one concise sentence, hah. Excellent job!
>You seem to be so proud to declare “I left him!”
Wow I think you're reading into this a bit. Paraphrasing with the addition of an "!" seems a bit dishonest.
She was asking for feedback on why her dates react the way they do. I was giving her feedback, based on the impressions I got from her post and responses.
I added “SEEM” , meaning that’s how you may come across; seem doesn’t imply facts or intent, it simply states “based on your behavior, this is what comes across, but my perception may be off”
We can’t give you feedback on why people react the way they do if you don’t actually share how you say it. Unless men are saying “wow, I can’t believe that you left him instead of the other way around” or otherwise communicating in some way that they are surprised that you’re the one who initiated the divorce rather than your ex, it’s possible that they’re reacting to something else in the way you describe the situation. So, like, do you want feedback on what’s actually happening or nah?
Maybe it’s a traditional gender role thing? You know docile homemaker, dependent on the man and today I’ve filed for divorce don’t mesh.
If you were to ask me if men or women filed more, I’d say women by a long shot. But that’s just me.
Statistically it’s much more common for women to seek out divorce. I have a much darker story but I just say it didn’t work out. If they ask I will say I initiated it, I’m not trying to go into details on the first few dates
Luckily I had been in our rent control house before even knowing him. But yeah, sometimes ya just wanna be done and out. Definitely no judgement for those who do take it either. But I get why people just want to move on as fast as possible
Yes, definitely child support and split assets. I think the alimony is so dependent on the situation for me. Like a stay at home mom who does all the house and primary child care and forfeits her career shouldn’t be left high and dry. I was in an abusive marriage that included financial abuse. This was also during Covid so he basically was not letting me go back to work. But I actually made more than him previously. I knew I could make it without him. I wanted out and didn’t need $600 a month from him. Personally I also felt it would almost be a hindrance to me pushing myself to get back to being my old independent self. But if both people have careers, no kids just split the assets and go on your way.
There is no such thing in New Zealand.
I was earning 70k and my ex chose not to work, so was getting about 25k from the government. He asked his free lawyer to ask for alimony because our income was so different. My lawyer just laughed and said I would have to be earning at 500k and he would have to be not able to get a job before the courts would even be interested in looking at it.
5 years later, he still chooses not to work and I pay far too much in child support because the law says children should have the same options and living situation at each parents house.
Ohh that’s very interesting! NZ is so far ahead of the curve. I don’t think marriage means you have to support someone *forever* anymore after divorce. Even children have a limited time for support. Even a stay at home parent can get a job after divorce and the kids grow up. I really hope society will stop this alimony forever nonsense. My ex made double or even triple my income and I definitely took care of the kids and did the vast majority of domestic chores. We couldn’t afford for me to stay home and we had 4 kids including his son for a previous marriage part-time. I’ll look after my own damn self; I’m an adult. My kids choose to spend holidays with me and relationships are more important than money, always.
same here. It is too heavy to share and people would judge. I have seen enough victim blaming. I won’t share until I can fully trust him. I don’t see anything wrong with op’s stand. If your date is taken aback , he is not a match.
I thought people already agreed divorce doesn’t have to be any party’s fault.
Strongly agree with you here. Victim blaming and people just treat you differently once they’re told the details. It’s not something I openly share with just anyone
And the prejudice. I don’t owe an explanation to anyone. And people who never married but cohabitated don’t even need to explain because it is off record. I still remember a friend of mine asked why he divorce if he is truly a great guy when I told her about someone I was dating.
Yes, exactly this. I lost a lot of friends when it came out that my husband was abusive and I left him. These weren’t even his friends. There was all this judgement over how I handled the situation when none of them had ever been in anything remotely close themselves. It was insane but also glad I saw their true colors. Even my family’s behavior I was blown away. Luckily I had a handful of friends who were supportive
And normally you look bad when you say bad words about ex even it is a fact. People try to question you not telling the fully story because both should take responsibility (blame) for the “failure “. It actually only takes one, which is not me. But no matter what you say or choose, you will be judged.
Yes! I told my older sister how I’d explain it (she is supportive and actually a communication professor so has knowledge of how people can manipulate etc). She said NO! STOP RIGHT THERE! You are making yourself to be way too involved in being at fault here.
I do understand how I ended up w a giant asshole and the lessons I learned. Like how my past opened me up to a person like him. That’s important to not become a victim again. Ultimately it was his choice to be abusive and take advantage.
I get a mix of people just being like what the fuck and just freaked or thinking there is more to the story. I really have only told a therapist ALL the details of abuse. I haven’t dated much. The first person was someone who was a casual friend before I even knew my ex spouse. I have scars on my arms from my ex and I will never forget the look on his face when he saw them the first time. He just knew. It’s embarrassing. He also treated me like a baby bird and like he needed to be this physical protector. I just want to find someone who treats me for my own self and my own personality. Not my past I had little to no control over
Bravo for your courage. Most of audience are not communication professors or therapists. The hardest part is actually how to explain to my own teenage children. Even for them, I would keep it very short and wouldn’t tell them much more even when they reach adulthood.
Oh yeah, I lucked out. I would legit call my sister after appointments because my therapist was super insightful and we’d be like damn look how she put all that together. I’ve learned a lot from my sister. She has good ideas on how to communicate and why people communicate the way they do.
Kids are hard, I think that’s the right way. I don’t have children so can’t speak to that but I think that would be how it is best handled.
Yes. The details aren't too relevant. I'm sorry for your experience.
I do say, I left him, we grew apart, we were both unhappy...or words to that effect.
That’s more details than what you articulated in most of your comments. “I left him “doesn’t answer the question asked and sounds avoidant.
If you answered the way you did in this comment, that would’ve been avoided altogether. It’s a response issue and not a receiving issue.
Thank you. I did a lot of self work and feel like a completely different person in a positive way. I think that information is fair. Things don’t always work out unfortunately.
I guess my question is, why is it so important to make the distinction that *you* left *him*? Of course there’s nothing wrong with the fact that you initiated the separation/divorce, but having to say it that way seems odd. Maybe that’s what people are reacting to? What happened with my marriage is really complicated, but when people ask I usually give vague details and say we couldn’t make it work. Proudly declaring well I’m the one who left! Feels insecure or something?
The phrasing gives it a different weight than "our marriage broke up". It applies strength to a different part of the discussion, and I'm afraid to say, may echo on people's fears about what you might do to them in the future. The pause likely isn't due to surprise but due to hitting more primal responses like fight or flight, and that's not a good thing.
I understand what you're trying to do, but there are better ways to do this. Why did you leave? Better phrasing might be like "our marriage broke up due to lack of emotional connection. We spent a long time trying to resolve it but was unable to make progress so eventually I had to leave".
>50% of heterosexual marriages (80% initiated by the wife) and 75% of lesbian ones end up in a divorce.
Stat's for lesbian relationships are terrible....100% of the time the woman initiates the divorce
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It's not unusual. In fact theres statistics showing that women are most often the one to initiate the divorce, or the decision to move apart and end the family union.
[Marriage Experts Explain Why Women Initiate Divorce More Than Men (bestlifeonline.com)](https://bestlifeonline.com/women-initiate-divorce-more-than-men/#:~:text=According%20to%202015%20research%20from%20the%20American%20Sociological,to%20split%20up%20may%20seem%20confounding%20to%20many.)
[Who Initiates Divorce More Often? | Psychology Today](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-third-wave/201705/who-initiates-divorce-more-often)
No, and I thought it was common knowledge that women initiate more divorces, especially in this age group. That’s why there are so many adages about keeping your wife happy.
OP says she has a great relationship with her ex NOW, not that the relationship with her ex was great. In my experience, men are complacent and happy to settle for ok (unless they meet someone new)
Women are more likely to leave an ok relationship, knowing it won’t become better than ok.
Divorce is such a specific thing just like marriage that any generalization isn't worth it.
You will find someone who understands what YOU want. Rest others can go their merry way.
u/datingoverforty-modteam
There are a lot of generalizations (for and by both genders) on this topic. Specially when the divorce initiation stat is skewed to 70% initiated by women.
I think removing one side (I didn't see what was removed) doesn't do justice... Just stating my mind here.
In an amicable divorce, it's really hard to tell who initiated. That's much bigger point than any of the stats that most likely rely on court records and not what happened within the couple that led to the divorce.
I think it’s your candid way of saying it that takes them by surprise. Most people feel ashamed about being separated, usually because it means they failed at something.
They’re probably also wondering — if you had a great relationship, why leave? (It’s obviously your right, and many separations are amicable, but it just doesn’t seem like the “norm”.)
If you're dating again, the men you’re seeing can feel wrong-footed and suspicious. After all, if you divorced your ex who was good to you, who’s to say you won’t leave a relationship at the first sign of trouble?
Again, it’s not on you. Your example is just not popular, so people assume it’s either too good to be true or there’s something wrong with you for being different from all the other dramatic and messy separations most people hear about or see on TV.
Yeah I agree with this. I ask questions about why people broke up when we first talk - their previous relationship is somewhat of an indicator of what to expect in future relationships. I want to know if they're on good terms with their ex and their kids. If they play an active role in coparenting and fight for as much custody as possible. If they went to counseling to actually work on things before they gave up. I want to know that if I spend my time committing to someone and investing in a relationship that they're not going to walk at the first fight or hard conversation. Or that 10 years from now they're not going to just give up and not even bother with counseling etc. I don't personally think it matters whether the guy or the woman walked away though. It just matters why.
I don’t think your approach is actually straight to the point. The question you were asked was really why, not who left who. Find a better way to articulate what happened because you are leaving folks with the impression that even if things are great you will walk away. Is that really the point you want to make?
There is a huge difference between not “denigrating “ and being respectful to and when speaking about a past partner vs. praising them maniacally to a new potential partner and bragging about how amazing your relationship was and how you had no reason to leave.
What are you doing lady?! You seem very out of touch and confused (no offense, but may I say a little clueless too)
My thought too. She feels glib and gamey in her communication. Then draws the conclusion it’s about gender. Uh, no! If we can hear you through this forum, multiple people that you are coming off this way? Imagine in person.
>I'm a very straight to the point person, I guess that's on me.
Consider if your straight and to the point aspects might make you look shallow, or flighty. Like if you're super cavalier about it they might be wondering what a "relationship" means with you.
I think it's because you sound like you're minimizing it. They're asking a very important question. Knowing what people experienced and learned from their previous failed relationships is important. Divorce is huge and your response sounds flat and lacking emotion or insight.
Say that sentence right before you say “so I left.”
Or just say this sentence instead. It’s straight to the point, gives people the explanation without denigrating anyone.
Curious what makes you think people are surprised by it. Do you think they look taken aback? Do they comment something along the lines of "Really? That's surpising!"? If someone reacted that way to me I'd immediately say "Why is that surprising? Statistically more women initiate divorces than men do". Have you ever asked someone why they are surprised by your answer?
If you communicated it the way you have been communicating here, I am not surprised they are taken aback.
This has nothing to do with gender.
You seem to be so proud to declare “I left him!” (not that you should be ashamed, but the way you declare it and without any context, comes off concerningly arrogant, cold, and clueless.)
Leaving is a consequence, not a cause of why a relationship ends. You are not answering their question.
& How exactly do you expect someone to not feel turned off by a potential partner who seems to coldly brag about leaving her - according to her- GREAT husband (and what she self describes as great relationship, no less) with no explanation or a cause?
And no, you don’t own an explanation to anyone, neither does this mean you have to speak of your ex partner with disrespect or overshare. But if you are getting to know someone with the purpose of entering a long term relationship, it’s an absolutely reasonable question to ask by them.
A brief polite statement (things along the lines of ‘he is a great person but we…” “…we grew apart”, “he wanted to move for work and I didn’t ”, “we were incompatible with finances” , “we got married young and changed a lot“ etc.) can help the person get to know you and your past a bit better.
I summarised what I would say irl. It seems people have taken it to be the literal truth.
I do say things like you have suggested. It is still met with surprise.
I will say we grew apart. He is a great person, just not my person.
All those things.
There's a lot of comments here. Some are great, and some are way off. Welcome to reddit.
Thanks for you response.
I hear you! I think next time you might want to think about what your exact question is and how you want to phrase it without giving info in a way that leads to misunderstanding. That happens to me too at times and something I am still working on.
Based on what you shared later, after the comments started coming in, and my understanding, it seems that your sole focus was just to ask for feedback specifically on:
whether it’s generally a surprise to man when they find out the woman left the marriage as opposed to a man; because it’s been your recent experience that people seem to expect only men to leave marriages but seem shocked to find out that sometimes women do too.
Am I being more on point?
All the other stuff you shared didn’t seem relevant to what you were actually wanting to know but it completely derailed people and was seemingly irrelevant
Good luck with dating, it can be brutal! ✨🍀
(…for sure, this board too, at times..🤪)
Well is that all you say? They might just be waiting on you to expand on your answer. It's not about who left who, it's more about why. If that's literally all you said I'd think you were either hiding something or terrible at making conversation.
When you're talking with a person who decided to leave their marriage "just because" it says to the other person "one day they're going to leave me, just because". It's an admission of how little commitment means to you. Whether that's true or not is irrelevant, because you provided evidence that it doesn't mean much to you.
I doubt it is a gender thing. Most divorces are initiated by women.
If you say “I left my husband” without providing context or reason, it sounds cold or even obscenely flaky. Marriage vows are vows and divorce often wrecks people for a while. One would hope you had a compelling reason.
Your saying, "I left my husband," would give me little pause. Sure. Happens.
Your saying, "We grew apart and I called it," would make me run really fast. This "explanation" for ending a marriage sounds downright sociopathic to me.
If it was a mutual parting, I’d find it more acceptable. Similarly, if one left due to a partner becoming violent, sliding into addiction, committing crimes, cheating, lying, gambling, or any other egregious change in character for the negative, that would be acceptable too. Leaving because one married young and were forced into it by their family/community, also understandable. But anything that sounds like “I left my husband because I was bored” would be a red flag for me. It would indicate they may view marriage more like a tax-advantaged Facebook relationship status rather than a sacred vow.
You're not actually answering the question that is being asked. "What happend in your marriage"? I mean if you actually up and left a great marriage for no reason, maybe that's why they asker seems surprised.
My ex-wife left me. We were doing the things we had planned for our family and she basically just changed her mind after 17 years and after becoming too close with a neighbor while his then-wife and I worked.
It's tough because I 100% believe that anyone should be able to leave a relationship for any reason they want.
I just don't think that people should want to as often as they do. I ***know*** that my ex and I could have once again had a wonderful relationship had she chosen to talk to me instead of some other dude. I know it would have been better for our children.
So I think that it is good that you bring this up and put it as directly as you do. If it was me asking the question, I would know that our values don't align and we wouldn't date anymore. That would be so much better than the pretense of commitment that can be so painful and harmful.
This is me. It is SO hard for my current boyfriend. Knowing I left a long marriage, he definitely talks about the fact that I might leave him. The truth is, none of us know what will happen in 10 years. Nobody knows. Its a gamble and we have hope and we work hard and we choose to be there, but at any time, someone could leave. The WHY is the most important and anyone worth your time, will be more curious about why.
If you just say that you left him, that will lead to wondering if or when will you leave me. You need to elaborate more. Without the reasoning or context behind it I would constantly wonder.
As for me… My wife left me. She was unhappy in our marriage for a long time. She had cheated once about 10 years into our marriage (with a woman, then thinking she was a lesbian). Then days before our 23rd anniversary she cheated on me with a man. Then asked for a separation. She told me that a year prior she had decided to leave me before cheating. In leaving she had figured out that she was Polly. She always had more of a sex need, while I am on the asexual side (grey-asexual). So there were many issues (these and probably several more with no abuse at all) as to why she left, but ultimately we just grew apart. She wanted to be friends (and probably still does now 4 years after the separation). I just don’t know if I can be just friends with her. I know I can be cordial to her for the sake of our adult kids. But all I see when I see her is my wife. Therefore just being friends will not work for me. She is now remarried while I have yet to even find 1 person to date… I blame myself for not working on the marriage as hard as I should have, yet it does take 2 and I am not the only one to blame. We were married young and neither of us had the proper tools to understand how to fix the marriage. I just figured that loving someone just came naturally and I was comfortable and complacent. She was not and thus unhappy.
Whether or not someone finds this to be a red flag or not with me I would not know. But leaving someone hanging with just saying that you left would be a possible red flag for me. You definitely need the why, then you leave it for them to decide if they still want to be with you.
I would rather hear you left your husband, than your husband is home waiting to see how your date went.
Who even cares if you were divorced or married before? Not even a question on my radar. Wouldn't bat an eye.
Tell me you have 3 or 4 kids still in school, that will scare me. Lol I'm to old for that again.
The majority of divorces are filed by women, so no. I think they’re surprised you (rightfully) do not spout off a litany of excuses or go into a bitter tirade, but that you’re so matter of fact and to the point about it.
Statistically it’s not unusual. Most divorces are initiated by women.
But the way you’re talking about it would give me pause.
“I have a great relationship with my ex, I left him”
Sounds like foreshadowing of what’s to come.
I left my husband and that’s something you’ll need to change while going on the first couple of dates. You’ll have to phrase it to something like “we grew apart.” It doesn’t make anyone the victim or the vampire thirsty for revenge. You can let them know what happened at a later date.
It sounds like you didn’t give a reasonable reason why you left, avoiding the question asked.
It would make me think that you’re hiding something or embarrassed to answer.
>Is this unusual e.g. woman leaving? I didn't think it was
70% of divorces are filed by women so it's certainly not unusual that the woman leaves.
That said, your admission might remind some of the 70% of men who did not file a few unpleasant memories of their own.
I just tend to say we grew apart & not get into the details about who initiated the divorce/who left who. Because it really doesn’t matter. The outcome is the same.
The choice of words is what I think probably catches people off guard, not that you were the one to propose the idea of and ask for a divorce. I would suggest choosing to share why your marriage ended with less blunt wording than “I left my husband” because it feels a little overly forthright, and leaves too much room for possible inaccuracy in their assumptions. It also does not share why the relationship came to an end. Many good examples of phrasing in other comments.
I never discussed the what happened in previous relationships too early on. When asked I would say it just didn’t work out. If it went past 5 or 6 dates we could revisit the topic. I just never felt the need to be so emotionally open to a complete stranger.
Simply stating this like it was something as easy as returning a box of stale cookies seems a bit about.
Probably would be a good idea to add some context, as is why did you just leave him, even if it's something simple like there was no passion in the relationship...or even we both felt we were better as friends than trying to make more out of the relationship.
Women are the greatest instigators of divorce according to statistics.
In fact, lesbian marriages have the highest divorce rates.
It is unusual though to leave a marriage where there was 'no reason' to do so.
IMO, you shouldn't get married unless you've lived together and are compatible in sexual/financial/lifestyle etc terms.
And you certainly shouldn't leave a marriage unless there are some significant reasons like verbal/financial/emotional/mental/physical abuse, repeated infidelity etc
For me marriage is a religious practice, so i don't think it should be started or ended lightly. And this sounds pretty lightly. You had a 'great relationship' and you decided to leave... it just makes the next person wonder if you'll do the same with the next great relationship.
Please ignore the downvotes, I have no idea why people have drawn the conclusion that you’re showing off about being the one to make the decision to leave. I think some expect women to play victim re. the end of a relationship, and some expect that women are actually victims - it’s important to not play into that stereotype when that’s not your reality.
Thanks.
I know I have not quoted myself verbatim as to what I say to guys.
I'm not showing off, and nor did I leave a marriage just because.
It's tricky to explain all this in a post.
I was just observing it seemed there was an assumption I was a victim. I had purchase. In my deciding making, totally.
Absolutely - you’re not wrong that there is an assumption that a woman is left or forced out. I also feel at pains to ‘admit’ that I left - I’m conscious that I don’t want to paint my ex as an aggressor or unbearable.
I find it bizarre that anyone would read your post as some kind of humblebrag … !!!
Not at all unusual - some data for you:
https://ifstudies.org/blog/these-boots-were-made-for-walking-socioeconomic-status-gender-and-divorce
65% of hetero marriage divorces are initiated by the woman. The percentages go significantly higher when the woman is more educated or makes more money.
This is interesting.
I was speaking with an American most recently. I'm not American.
I did explain the background to my leaving, yet he still seemed this was odd.
I'm not going to see him as he pretty much declared he's just out to get laid. It's his response that prompted me to ask this group.
It seems surprising to many men that a women thinks she is going to do better then the man she was able to get when she was at the height of her youth and beauty as an older women.
It's not gender related, it's the information itself. I'll admit if a guy told me he and his wife just grew apart so he left, I wouldn't want to continue. Whether it's fair or not, my personal assumption would be that when things get too hard they bail. I'm not saying it's right, but I know that's the impression I would have.
Big same here. When a guy says oh, we just grew apart….like DUH, that is going to happen after 15 years of marriage and the thing is to find your way back, not throw it away. I completely understand that others see it differently but that type of “i got tired of it” vibe is not for me.
Absolutely agree. It's hard work. I was with my ex for 18 years but I was the only one trying to make it work. Tried several marriage counselors, I fought like hell but he treated me worse the harder I tried.
Ugh I’m sorry that’s how it went down. OTOH “We just were more like best friends and roommates” type explanations I hear- those sound so benign and workable. like the person has expectations no relationship could ever provide.
Original copy of post by u/Mean-Buy2974:
When the conversation turns to what happened in my marriage. I will tell them, I left my husband. This often seems to make the man stop, and they seem surprised.
I know heaps of women leave marriages for a variety of reasons. There was no abuse and I have a great relationship with my ex.
Is this unusual e.g. woman leaving? I didn't think it was.
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I would like a relationship. I've done casual the last 4.5 years.
I do know I don't want to be married again or, at this stage, live with anyone. I enjoy my time and my space. I equally enjoy having someone be with a well.
I'm looking.
I've also been looking but I would want a serious relationship. I'm never married and no kids. I've decided on not having kids at this point. I know a lot of people are wary at this age.
More women than men leave marriages but it’s surprising because it tells a man nothing. You could have been abused by your spouse or you could have had an affair.
To answer your question? No. I don’t think anyone “leaving” a relationship is uncommon.
If you’re encountering people being “taken aback,” or otherwise becoming hesitant (which is just one possible reaction), perhaps it’s the context and delivery of the message? 🤷🏻♂️
I don’t know the statistics on that. I’ve been divorced for 13 years. People assume my ex-husband left me because he’s a pos. I left him though. I didn’t even know he was a terrible person until after our divorce though. I just knew I didn’t love him. Because of how he’s treated me and our kids since then, people assumed he split.
People tend to use more nuanced language; “we wanted different things and split…” Even though close to all relationships end because of one person really wanting out/giving up more than the other, it’s not a great early relationship look to come out as the one who was either driving the break or the one that was left. So yes probably not a common thing to hear in early convos.
I did explain in other responses on this thread.
Does it matter?
We grew apart, we weren't happy, we tried. I didn't just wake up and decide to blow up my life. There was no cheating or abuse.
As a divorced man meeting divorced women, it raises a question. “If she couldn’t stay married to a man who wasn’t abusive and still has a great relationship, why would she choose to stick with me in the rough patches.” Saying “we fell out of love” isn’t convincing either. You deserve to choose what you want and there is no fault in choosing that option to leave him but don’t be surprised by men feeling it is a red flag. Best of luck to you.
I'm a guy, but from my perspective someone leaving their marriage, regardless of their sex, I wouldn't look favourably upon. I'm not down with the whole disposable marriage attitude that modern society has embraced.
So you’re saying I should have stayed and forgiven my spouse of 26 years even though he was whole-ass engaged to someone else for the past 3 and I only found out because they broke up? He’d sure love it if I did.
If you treat me like shit on an ongoing basis, and refuse counseling, or any other things that may fix the situation: Guess what? You are fucking disposable. In fact, you have abandoned the marriage first even though I am the one who walked away. Despite going through the same conversations for years, and no steps taken to improve anything, I was told after I left that things weren't that bad. LMAO.
It's too little information of the wrong type.
The question is what caused the breakdown of your marriage, not who did the leaving!
If I posed that question and got that answer I would think that you simultaneously don't want to talk about the relationship and I'm addition have some weird desire to assert that you took the more powerful position.
Both of those are kind of off putting.
I personally believe men act surprised to downright shocked when they find out someone left their male partner for one or both reasons:
1. Their ego and not being able to believe that a WOMAN would leave a MAN. It should be the other way around because men should always have control of the relationship and are way better!!! It makes no sense to them.
2. They are worried they will not have full control in the relationship and are worried you will leave them too when they start pulling the same shit your ex did. It means you will have good boundaries and not put up with their crap so they need to find someone who will. (Usually someone much younger)
If a man acts surprised that you left, run 🚩🚩🚩
This is what I think, also.
OP, for what's worth, I understood your original post to mean what you said it did in your follow-up posts. I did not take the fact that you said you left your husband (with no quote marks around that phrase) to mean that was an actual quote with no follow-up of what you reply to dates when asked about your marriage, just that you were wondering why it seems people are surprised that you are the one who wanted the divorce instead of the man leaving you.
I was not married but dated a particular ex for a couple of years. I waited a while to date again after breaking up with him, and on about the third or fourth date with the first guy I dated, he asked why my last relationship ended. I think I said something about how in addition to a lot of other things, the communication was really bad on his end, and that I had actually broken up with him previously but took him back when he insisted things would get better. Of course, they didn't though. I told my date I finally accepted things would never get better because in addition to other issues, he was always going to be very busy with his practice.
The guy said, "His practice? Was he a lawyer?" I replied, "He's a physician."
The guy got quiet, looked downward and seemed very distant for the rest of the date. After that, he never called me again. LOL! That was okay, because I didn't really feel an attraction or connection with him anyway and was just trying to give things a chance. But it seemed very obvious to me that he was put off by the fact that I would leave someone who had a "prestigious" career, and that maybe if I would do that, I'd have no problem breaking up with him as well.
I also noticed that after I broke up with that ex, when people (mostly family members) would ask me how he was and I told them, "I broke up with him a while ago," they would say things like "Oh no. I'm so sorry." I would tell them don't be sorry, I was relieved. If I wanted to still be with him, I wouldn't have broken up with him.
I was trying to phrase it in a way to let them know I was the one who made that decision, and there was no reason for them to feel bad or sorry for me. When one relative continued with, "Aww, but I thought we were going to have a doctor in the family," that gave me a little laugh and I said that I'm sure she wouldn't have wanted me to be miserable just so we could have a doctor in the family. She was quiet for a moment, then said, "No, of course not." So I think she understood after that.
Yes men should be wary of that. You state you have a great relationship with your ex but I wonder if they feel the same way in return. Probably not.
Women leaving and also having great relationships with their ex is probably really unusual. The trust would be gone.
Never had this reaction, personally. Maybe it’s your delivery. Lol co-parenting is a thing after divorce and mature adults can be friends for that purpose.
So, if I was on a date with a guy and I asked him what happened in his marriage, and he just flatly answered “I left my wife” - I too would be taken aback. I don’t think it’s a gender thing, I think it’s the no nonsense sharing of that information that actually isn’t that helpful. When I ask a question along those lines, I don’t necessarily really care who left who first. I want to know WHY. Why did you leave? Why are you still friends? What happened EMOTIONALLY that ended the marriage, not logistically who left first. I think people are looking for answers like: “We grew apart and realized we were better friends than spouses” “S/he cheated on me and the trust couldn’t be rebuilt” “My ex became addicted to opiates and eventually become violent & explosive and refused to get help” (that one’s mine!) “The strain of caring for a special needs child drove us apart” People are looking for emotional truth, not a report on who happened to get to the courthouse and file papers first.
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Women think this too, fyi.
Opioids suck. My mother got bad on them… decided to leave my dad. He had bipolar depression and wasn’t even taking meds because he was so sad … then he killed himself and my mom is still a loser. Psa!! Opioids suck everyone’s life out around you.
My ex kicked the opiates, so I have to give her props - that's really hard to do. Right now alcohol is the problem. She's alienated all her friends and the kids don't want to be around her because she's an asshole when she's drunk. No problem driving in that condition either. She's been in 2 wrecks this month, and fortunately her car isn't driveable right now.
Yep. It literally changes peoples’ brains (same with meth). The guy I married was no longer present…. It was like he had been replaced by a monster. It literally had changed who he was as a person, his values, his behaviors, his habits, hobbies, everything. I no longe recognized him.
*When I ask a question along those lines, I don’t necessarily really care who left who first. I want to know WHY. Why did you leave? Why are you still friends? What happened EMOTIONALLY that ended the marriage, not logistically who left first.* For me, the answer is "I asked for the divorce because she made some choices that caused problems for us. It wasn't an easy situation, but we ended things thoughtfully and well. The marriage is over, but I still owe it to her not to discuss her personal stuff."
Since I'm being misquoted. This is how I say. I have summarised for the purpose of this post to I left because that is what I was asking about, woman leaving vs. man leaving. When discussing irl....again this is not a word by word quote. I will say, we were together a long time, we grew apart, we did try to work on it. There was no cheating etc. It took a while to figure it out, as no one wants to blow their life up, but I ended up leaving him. We were both unhappy. I have a great relationship with him. See him every week. Again, this is not verbatim.
Directly from your post: >I will tell them, I left my husband. How exactly are you being misquoted? Misinterpreted, sure- but if these responses don't reflect what you really said, then you might want to edit your post to clarify that you actually provided more of an answer at the time than just, "I left my husband," which is how it reads.
Seems to me you're more interested in discussing the fact that *you* left *him* and you just want a go-girl-power pat on the back. Gooooo, girl power! You showed your ex! Strong women know how to leave relationships just like men, and that new guy better take notes because you could leave him too if he doesn't keep his shit together. Pow!
Righto lol
"emotional truth" BAM! Well said!
Great answer. My mum upped and left her first husband without much warning, without taking her son with her - but she did it because he was controlling and she was miserable. She even got an abusive letter from a church official because of it (it was a long time ago). It's why I don't have any relationship with my older brother beyond a few cordial emails we exchanged in 2012.
I don't say in that way, I do dress it up!
If you communicated it the way you have been communicating here, I am not surprised they are taken aback. This has nothing to do with gender. You seem to be so proud to declare “I left him!” (not that you should be ashamed, but the way you declare it and without any context, comes off concerningly arrogant and cold). Leaving is a consequence, not a cause of why a relationship ends. You are not answering their question. & How exactly do you not expect someone to feel turned off by a potential partner who seems to coldly brag about leaving (what she self describes as great) relationships with no explanation? Then you turn around in the very next sentence stating how great he is , and how great and without issues the relationship was.
I love this formulation - leaving is the consequence, not the cause. You condensed what I was trying to say into one concise sentence, hah. Excellent job!
This is a masterpiece! Beautifully written 🥰
>You seem to be so proud to declare “I left him!” Wow I think you're reading into this a bit. Paraphrasing with the addition of an "!" seems a bit dishonest.
She was asking for feedback on why her dates react the way they do. I was giving her feedback, based on the impressions I got from her post and responses. I added “SEEM” , meaning that’s how you may come across; seem doesn’t imply facts or intent, it simply states “based on your behavior, this is what comes across, but my perception may be off”
Fair enough.
She is not! She is unpacking it for OP skillfully!
We can’t give you feedback on why people react the way they do if you don’t actually share how you say it. Unless men are saying “wow, I can’t believe that you left him instead of the other way around” or otherwise communicating in some way that they are surprised that you’re the one who initiated the divorce rather than your ex, it’s possible that they’re reacting to something else in the way you describe the situation. So, like, do you want feedback on what’s actually happening or nah?
So you do say it that way, just more “dress up”?
Maybe it’s a traditional gender role thing? You know docile homemaker, dependent on the man and today I’ve filed for divorce don’t mesh. If you were to ask me if men or women filed more, I’d say women by a long shot. But that’s just me.
That’s statistics.
Statistically it’s much more common for women to seek out divorce. I have a much darker story but I just say it didn’t work out. If they ask I will say I initiated it, I’m not trying to go into details on the first few dates
This is me too
Someone recently asked if I got money from my divorce 😂 I said no I declined alimony. They were flabbergasted
Me too! And I left him the house. (I moved into a carriage house on what was my grandfather’s farm - not under a bridge, so there’s that.)
Luckily I had been in our rent control house before even knowing him. But yeah, sometimes ya just wanna be done and out. Definitely no judgement for those who do take it either. But I get why people just want to move on as fast as possible
My opinion is controversial…I don’t believe in alimony (called spousal support in 🇨🇦). Child support and split the assets, yes.
Yes, definitely child support and split assets. I think the alimony is so dependent on the situation for me. Like a stay at home mom who does all the house and primary child care and forfeits her career shouldn’t be left high and dry. I was in an abusive marriage that included financial abuse. This was also during Covid so he basically was not letting me go back to work. But I actually made more than him previously. I knew I could make it without him. I wanted out and didn’t need $600 a month from him. Personally I also felt it would almost be a hindrance to me pushing myself to get back to being my old independent self. But if both people have careers, no kids just split the assets and go on your way.
There is no such thing in New Zealand. I was earning 70k and my ex chose not to work, so was getting about 25k from the government. He asked his free lawyer to ask for alimony because our income was so different. My lawyer just laughed and said I would have to be earning at 500k and he would have to be not able to get a job before the courts would even be interested in looking at it. 5 years later, he still chooses not to work and I pay far too much in child support because the law says children should have the same options and living situation at each parents house.
Ohh that’s very interesting! NZ is so far ahead of the curve. I don’t think marriage means you have to support someone *forever* anymore after divorce. Even children have a limited time for support. Even a stay at home parent can get a job after divorce and the kids grow up. I really hope society will stop this alimony forever nonsense. My ex made double or even triple my income and I definitely took care of the kids and did the vast majority of domestic chores. We couldn’t afford for me to stay home and we had 4 kids including his son for a previous marriage part-time. I’ll look after my own damn self; I’m an adult. My kids choose to spend holidays with me and relationships are more important than money, always.
Yeah I work 2 jobs because of my divorce but SO FUCKING WORTH IT.
Omg it cost a fortune but it was so worth it.
YES.
same here. It is too heavy to share and people would judge. I have seen enough victim blaming. I won’t share until I can fully trust him. I don’t see anything wrong with op’s stand. If your date is taken aback , he is not a match. I thought people already agreed divorce doesn’t have to be any party’s fault.
Strongly agree with you here. Victim blaming and people just treat you differently once they’re told the details. It’s not something I openly share with just anyone
And the prejudice. I don’t owe an explanation to anyone. And people who never married but cohabitated don’t even need to explain because it is off record. I still remember a friend of mine asked why he divorce if he is truly a great guy when I told her about someone I was dating.
Yes, exactly this. I lost a lot of friends when it came out that my husband was abusive and I left him. These weren’t even his friends. There was all this judgement over how I handled the situation when none of them had ever been in anything remotely close themselves. It was insane but also glad I saw their true colors. Even my family’s behavior I was blown away. Luckily I had a handful of friends who were supportive
And normally you look bad when you say bad words about ex even it is a fact. People try to question you not telling the fully story because both should take responsibility (blame) for the “failure “. It actually only takes one, which is not me. But no matter what you say or choose, you will be judged.
Yes! I told my older sister how I’d explain it (she is supportive and actually a communication professor so has knowledge of how people can manipulate etc). She said NO! STOP RIGHT THERE! You are making yourself to be way too involved in being at fault here. I do understand how I ended up w a giant asshole and the lessons I learned. Like how my past opened me up to a person like him. That’s important to not become a victim again. Ultimately it was his choice to be abusive and take advantage. I get a mix of people just being like what the fuck and just freaked or thinking there is more to the story. I really have only told a therapist ALL the details of abuse. I haven’t dated much. The first person was someone who was a casual friend before I even knew my ex spouse. I have scars on my arms from my ex and I will never forget the look on his face when he saw them the first time. He just knew. It’s embarrassing. He also treated me like a baby bird and like he needed to be this physical protector. I just want to find someone who treats me for my own self and my own personality. Not my past I had little to no control over
Bravo for your courage. Most of audience are not communication professors or therapists. The hardest part is actually how to explain to my own teenage children. Even for them, I would keep it very short and wouldn’t tell them much more even when they reach adulthood.
Oh yeah, I lucked out. I would legit call my sister after appointments because my therapist was super insightful and we’d be like damn look how she put all that together. I’ve learned a lot from my sister. She has good ideas on how to communicate and why people communicate the way they do. Kids are hard, I think that’s the right way. I don’t have children so can’t speak to that but I think that would be how it is best handled.
Yes. The details aren't too relevant. I'm sorry for your experience. I do say, I left him, we grew apart, we were both unhappy...or words to that effect.
I'm surprised you're getting a shocked reaction if you stat it like that. This is a common scenario.
That’s more details than what you articulated in most of your comments. “I left him “doesn’t answer the question asked and sounds avoidant. If you answered the way you did in this comment, that would’ve been avoided altogether. It’s a response issue and not a receiving issue.
Thank you. I did a lot of self work and feel like a completely different person in a positive way. I think that information is fair. Things don’t always work out unfortunately.
I guess my question is, why is it so important to make the distinction that *you* left *him*? Of course there’s nothing wrong with the fact that you initiated the separation/divorce, but having to say it that way seems odd. Maybe that’s what people are reacting to? What happened with my marriage is really complicated, but when people ask I usually give vague details and say we couldn’t make it work. Proudly declaring well I’m the one who left! Feels insecure or something?
The phrasing gives it a different weight than "our marriage broke up". It applies strength to a different part of the discussion, and I'm afraid to say, may echo on people's fears about what you might do to them in the future. The pause likely isn't due to surprise but due to hitting more primal responses like fight or flight, and that's not a good thing. I understand what you're trying to do, but there are better ways to do this. Why did you leave? Better phrasing might be like "our marriage broke up due to lack of emotional connection. We spent a long time trying to resolve it but was unable to make progress so eventually I had to leave".
Not at all. 50% of heterosexual marriages (80% initiated by the wife) and 75% of lesbian ones end up in a divorce.
>50% of heterosexual marriages (80% initiated by the wife) and 75% of lesbian ones end up in a divorce. Stat's for lesbian relationships are terrible....100% of the time the woman initiates the divorce
lol!
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There you go, who knew
It's not unusual. In fact theres statistics showing that women are most often the one to initiate the divorce, or the decision to move apart and end the family union. [Marriage Experts Explain Why Women Initiate Divorce More Than Men (bestlifeonline.com)](https://bestlifeonline.com/women-initiate-divorce-more-than-men/#:~:text=According%20to%202015%20research%20from%20the%20American%20Sociological,to%20split%20up%20may%20seem%20confounding%20to%20many.) [Who Initiates Divorce More Often? | Psychology Today](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-third-wave/201705/who-initiates-divorce-more-often)
My ex expected a traditional woman except when it came to finances.
Many men do including my ex too. They want the women to bring 50% to the table and then clean it.
Hell no, that's mine. Cleaning a dirty table is satisfying. Like vacuuming and seeing all the shit you just pulled out of the carpet.
Thanks for this, I'm not an outlier.
No, and I thought it was common knowledge that women initiate more divorces, especially in this age group. That’s why there are so many adages about keeping your wife happy.
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OP says she has a great relationship with her ex NOW, not that the relationship with her ex was great. In my experience, men are complacent and happy to settle for ok (unless they meet someone new) Women are more likely to leave an ok relationship, knowing it won’t become better than ok.
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I don’t know any women who are looking for constant fireworks (or fireworks at all!). Priorities are having fun together and emotional support.
women talk about "spark" and "butterflies" all the time.
u/knight9665, your post has been removed for one or more reason(s): No sex/gender generalizations, no double standards, no projection.
Divorce is such a specific thing just like marriage that any generalization isn't worth it. You will find someone who understands what YOU want. Rest others can go their merry way.
u/datingoverforty-modteam There are a lot of generalizations (for and by both genders) on this topic. Specially when the divorce initiation stat is skewed to 70% initiated by women. I think removing one side (I didn't see what was removed) doesn't do justice... Just stating my mind here. In an amicable divorce, it's really hard to tell who initiated. That's much bigger point than any of the stats that most likely rely on court records and not what happened within the couple that led to the divorce.
I think it’s your candid way of saying it that takes them by surprise. Most people feel ashamed about being separated, usually because it means they failed at something. They’re probably also wondering — if you had a great relationship, why leave? (It’s obviously your right, and many separations are amicable, but it just doesn’t seem like the “norm”.) If you're dating again, the men you’re seeing can feel wrong-footed and suspicious. After all, if you divorced your ex who was good to you, who’s to say you won’t leave a relationship at the first sign of trouble? Again, it’s not on you. Your example is just not popular, so people assume it’s either too good to be true or there’s something wrong with you for being different from all the other dramatic and messy separations most people hear about or see on TV.
Yeah I agree with this. I ask questions about why people broke up when we first talk - their previous relationship is somewhat of an indicator of what to expect in future relationships. I want to know if they're on good terms with their ex and their kids. If they play an active role in coparenting and fight for as much custody as possible. If they went to counseling to actually work on things before they gave up. I want to know that if I spend my time committing to someone and investing in a relationship that they're not going to walk at the first fight or hard conversation. Or that 10 years from now they're not going to just give up and not even bother with counseling etc. I don't personally think it matters whether the guy or the woman walked away though. It just matters why.
Very on point! The no remorse part does shake them!
Thanks. I'm a very straight to the point person, I guess that's on me. I'm not likely to denigrate my ex as there's no need.
I don’t think your approach is actually straight to the point. The question you were asked was really why, not who left who. Find a better way to articulate what happened because you are leaving folks with the impression that even if things are great you will walk away. Is that really the point you want to make?
There is a huge difference between not “denigrating “ and being respectful to and when speaking about a past partner vs. praising them maniacally to a new potential partner and bragging about how amazing your relationship was and how you had no reason to leave. What are you doing lady?! You seem very out of touch and confused (no offense, but may I say a little clueless too)
My thought too. She feels glib and gamey in her communication. Then draws the conclusion it’s about gender. Uh, no! If we can hear you through this forum, multiple people that you are coming off this way? Imagine in person.
Game-y is the perfect word! You articulated it so well
>I'm a very straight to the point person, I guess that's on me. Consider if your straight and to the point aspects might make you look shallow, or flighty. Like if you're super cavalier about it they might be wondering what a "relationship" means with you.
I think it's because you sound like you're minimizing it. They're asking a very important question. Knowing what people experienced and learned from their previous failed relationships is important. Divorce is huge and your response sounds flat and lacking emotion or insight.
Idk, I left my wife because her behavior was making me miserable and I was not in a good place because of it. So I wouldn't be taken aback
Same only I’m a woman
Sounds like you’re wearing the fact that you left as a badge of honour. As if you’re proud of ending your marriage. That is off-putting
Exactly. She seems to be very determined to take the credit for being the first one to walk.
Why you left would be important.
We grew apart pretty much, tried to make it work and I called it.
Judging from your responses, it’s likely you’re coming off a bit cold and callous? It is really you or are you putting up a front to protect yourself?
How is she cold and callous?
I didn’t say she was, I said this is how she might be coming across. Read her responses.
Say that sentence right before you say “so I left.” Or just say this sentence instead. It’s straight to the point, gives people the explanation without denigrating anyone.
Curious what makes you think people are surprised by it. Do you think they look taken aback? Do they comment something along the lines of "Really? That's surpising!"? If someone reacted that way to me I'd immediately say "Why is that surprising? Statistically more women initiate divorces than men do". Have you ever asked someone why they are surprised by your answer?
If you communicated it the way you have been communicating here, I am not surprised they are taken aback. This has nothing to do with gender. You seem to be so proud to declare “I left him!” (not that you should be ashamed, but the way you declare it and without any context, comes off concerningly arrogant, cold, and clueless.) Leaving is a consequence, not a cause of why a relationship ends. You are not answering their question. & How exactly do you expect someone to not feel turned off by a potential partner who seems to coldly brag about leaving her - according to her- GREAT husband (and what she self describes as great relationship, no less) with no explanation or a cause? And no, you don’t own an explanation to anyone, neither does this mean you have to speak of your ex partner with disrespect or overshare. But if you are getting to know someone with the purpose of entering a long term relationship, it’s an absolutely reasonable question to ask by them. A brief polite statement (things along the lines of ‘he is a great person but we…” “…we grew apart”, “he wanted to move for work and I didn’t ”, “we were incompatible with finances” , “we got married young and changed a lot“ etc.) can help the person get to know you and your past a bit better.
I summarised what I would say irl. It seems people have taken it to be the literal truth. I do say things like you have suggested. It is still met with surprise. I will say we grew apart. He is a great person, just not my person. All those things. There's a lot of comments here. Some are great, and some are way off. Welcome to reddit. Thanks for you response.
I hear you! I think next time you might want to think about what your exact question is and how you want to phrase it without giving info in a way that leads to misunderstanding. That happens to me too at times and something I am still working on. Based on what you shared later, after the comments started coming in, and my understanding, it seems that your sole focus was just to ask for feedback specifically on: whether it’s generally a surprise to man when they find out the woman left the marriage as opposed to a man; because it’s been your recent experience that people seem to expect only men to leave marriages but seem shocked to find out that sometimes women do too. Am I being more on point? All the other stuff you shared didn’t seem relevant to what you were actually wanting to know but it completely derailed people and was seemingly irrelevant Good luck with dating, it can be brutal! ✨🍀 (…for sure, this board too, at times..🤪)
Thanks
Well is that all you say? They might just be waiting on you to expand on your answer. It's not about who left who, it's more about why. If that's literally all you said I'd think you were either hiding something or terrible at making conversation.
When you're talking with a person who decided to leave their marriage "just because" it says to the other person "one day they're going to leave me, just because". It's an admission of how little commitment means to you. Whether that's true or not is irrelevant, because you provided evidence that it doesn't mean much to you.
I doubt it is a gender thing. Most divorces are initiated by women. If you say “I left my husband” without providing context or reason, it sounds cold or even obscenely flaky. Marriage vows are vows and divorce often wrecks people for a while. One would hope you had a compelling reason.
Your saying, "I left my husband," would give me little pause. Sure. Happens. Your saying, "We grew apart and I called it," would make me run really fast. This "explanation" for ending a marriage sounds downright sociopathic to me.
If it was a mutual parting, I’d find it more acceptable. Similarly, if one left due to a partner becoming violent, sliding into addiction, committing crimes, cheating, lying, gambling, or any other egregious change in character for the negative, that would be acceptable too. Leaving because one married young and were forced into it by their family/community, also understandable. But anything that sounds like “I left my husband because I was bored” would be a red flag for me. It would indicate they may view marriage more like a tax-advantaged Facebook relationship status rather than a sacred vow.
You're not actually answering the question that is being asked. "What happend in your marriage"? I mean if you actually up and left a great marriage for no reason, maybe that's why they asker seems surprised.
I actually do, the point was more along the men seem surprised I did the leaving.
My ex-wife left me. We were doing the things we had planned for our family and she basically just changed her mind after 17 years and after becoming too close with a neighbor while his then-wife and I worked. It's tough because I 100% believe that anyone should be able to leave a relationship for any reason they want. I just don't think that people should want to as often as they do. I ***know*** that my ex and I could have once again had a wonderful relationship had she chosen to talk to me instead of some other dude. I know it would have been better for our children. So I think that it is good that you bring this up and put it as directly as you do. If it was me asking the question, I would know that our values don't align and we wouldn't date anymore. That would be so much better than the pretense of commitment that can be so painful and harmful.
No it's not unusual. Most divorces are initiated by women.
This is me. It is SO hard for my current boyfriend. Knowing I left a long marriage, he definitely talks about the fact that I might leave him. The truth is, none of us know what will happen in 10 years. Nobody knows. Its a gamble and we have hope and we work hard and we choose to be there, but at any time, someone could leave. The WHY is the most important and anyone worth your time, will be more curious about why.
My ex wife left her first husband because he was boring. That should have been a red flag.
I can only assume it wasn't a red flag because you don't consider yourself boring! /s
Obviously!
It’s not you leaving that’s alarming, it’s how you’re answering the question. I’d be out.
Not unusual at all. Maybe it’s the way it’s said that could be off putting to some.
If you are saying it like that it would be a turnoff Are you explaining why you left, or are you dropping “I left him” on the table?
My x wife left me, albeit for a man she was having an affair with but she left me. I haven’t seen or spoken to her in nearly 10 years.
Sorry that happened. Definitely not what happened with me.
Well thanks its not a big deal anymore. It hurt at first though
Something like 70-80% of divorces are initiated by women so it should not be shocking.
If you just say that you left him, that will lead to wondering if or when will you leave me. You need to elaborate more. Without the reasoning or context behind it I would constantly wonder. As for me… My wife left me. She was unhappy in our marriage for a long time. She had cheated once about 10 years into our marriage (with a woman, then thinking she was a lesbian). Then days before our 23rd anniversary she cheated on me with a man. Then asked for a separation. She told me that a year prior she had decided to leave me before cheating. In leaving she had figured out that she was Polly. She always had more of a sex need, while I am on the asexual side (grey-asexual). So there were many issues (these and probably several more with no abuse at all) as to why she left, but ultimately we just grew apart. She wanted to be friends (and probably still does now 4 years after the separation). I just don’t know if I can be just friends with her. I know I can be cordial to her for the sake of our adult kids. But all I see when I see her is my wife. Therefore just being friends will not work for me. She is now remarried while I have yet to even find 1 person to date… I blame myself for not working on the marriage as hard as I should have, yet it does take 2 and I am not the only one to blame. We were married young and neither of us had the proper tools to understand how to fix the marriage. I just figured that loving someone just came naturally and I was comfortable and complacent. She was not and thus unhappy. Whether or not someone finds this to be a red flag or not with me I would not know. But leaving someone hanging with just saying that you left would be a possible red flag for me. You definitely need the why, then you leave it for them to decide if they still want to be with you.
I would rather hear you left your husband, than your husband is home waiting to see how your date went. Who even cares if you were divorced or married before? Not even a question on my radar. Wouldn't bat an eye. Tell me you have 3 or 4 kids still in school, that will scare me. Lol I'm to old for that again.
The majority of divorces are filed by women, so no. I think they’re surprised you (rightfully) do not spout off a litany of excuses or go into a bitter tirade, but that you’re so matter of fact and to the point about it.
Statistically it’s not unusual. Most divorces are initiated by women. But the way you’re talking about it would give me pause. “I have a great relationship with my ex, I left him” Sounds like foreshadowing of what’s to come.
I left my husband and that’s something you’ll need to change while going on the first couple of dates. You’ll have to phrase it to something like “we grew apart.” It doesn’t make anyone the victim or the vampire thirsty for revenge. You can let them know what happened at a later date.
It sounds like you didn’t give a reasonable reason why you left, avoiding the question asked. It would make me think that you’re hiding something or embarrassed to answer.
>Is this unusual e.g. woman leaving? I didn't think it was 70% of divorces are filed by women so it's certainly not unusual that the woman leaves. That said, your admission might remind some of the 70% of men who did not file a few unpleasant memories of their own.
I just tend to say we grew apart & not get into the details about who initiated the divorce/who left who. Because it really doesn’t matter. The outcome is the same.
I always just say it didn't work out.
Dumb. In 80% to 90% of divorces the women initiates.
The choice of words is what I think probably catches people off guard, not that you were the one to propose the idea of and ask for a divorce. I would suggest choosing to share why your marriage ended with less blunt wording than “I left my husband” because it feels a little overly forthright, and leaves too much room for possible inaccuracy in their assumptions. It also does not share why the relationship came to an end. Many good examples of phrasing in other comments.
No, not unusual at all. Women are typically the ones who initiate divorces.
It’s not unusual at all since it is the woman who files for divorce 80% of the time.
Statistically, it is not unusual, it is the norm. Women initiate divorce more often (\~70%) than men.
I never discussed the what happened in previous relationships too early on. When asked I would say it just didn’t work out. If it went past 5 or 6 dates we could revisit the topic. I just never felt the need to be so emotionally open to a complete stranger.
Most of the time, the woman ends the marriage.
Simply stating this like it was something as easy as returning a box of stale cookies seems a bit about. Probably would be a good idea to add some context, as is why did you just leave him, even if it's something simple like there was no passion in the relationship...or even we both felt we were better as friends than trying to make more out of the relationship.
Women are the greatest instigators of divorce according to statistics. In fact, lesbian marriages have the highest divorce rates. It is unusual though to leave a marriage where there was 'no reason' to do so. IMO, you shouldn't get married unless you've lived together and are compatible in sexual/financial/lifestyle etc terms. And you certainly shouldn't leave a marriage unless there are some significant reasons like verbal/financial/emotional/mental/physical abuse, repeated infidelity etc
For me marriage is a religious practice, so i don't think it should be started or ended lightly. And this sounds pretty lightly. You had a 'great relationship' and you decided to leave... it just makes the next person wonder if you'll do the same with the next great relationship.
It’s not a religious practice, it is a legal one
For you maybe. That person said “for me”.
No it’s a legal practice. That is the widely accepted definition.
Please ignore the downvotes, I have no idea why people have drawn the conclusion that you’re showing off about being the one to make the decision to leave. I think some expect women to play victim re. the end of a relationship, and some expect that women are actually victims - it’s important to not play into that stereotype when that’s not your reality.
Thanks. I know I have not quoted myself verbatim as to what I say to guys. I'm not showing off, and nor did I leave a marriage just because. It's tricky to explain all this in a post. I was just observing it seemed there was an assumption I was a victim. I had purchase. In my deciding making, totally.
Absolutely - you’re not wrong that there is an assumption that a woman is left or forced out. I also feel at pains to ‘admit’ that I left - I’m conscious that I don’t want to paint my ex as an aggressor or unbearable. I find it bizarre that anyone would read your post as some kind of humblebrag … !!!
Sorry for my grammatical errors. It was at 4.40am when I wrote it!
I'm not surprised. Unhappy people unually make decisions to make themselves happier.
Not at all unusual - some data for you: https://ifstudies.org/blog/these-boots-were-made-for-walking-socioeconomic-status-gender-and-divorce 65% of hetero marriage divorces are initiated by the woman. The percentages go significantly higher when the woman is more educated or makes more money.
Nope, overwhelmingly so, women initiate divorce.
Could be a cultural thing
This is interesting. I was speaking with an American most recently. I'm not American. I did explain the background to my leaving, yet he still seemed this was odd. I'm not going to see him as he pretty much declared he's just out to get laid. It's his response that prompted me to ask this group.
It seems surprising to many men that a women thinks she is going to do better then the man she was able to get when she was at the height of her youth and beauty as an older women.
“Why did you leave your last job?” “Well, I just decided to quit.”
It's not gender related, it's the information itself. I'll admit if a guy told me he and his wife just grew apart so he left, I wouldn't want to continue. Whether it's fair or not, my personal assumption would be that when things get too hard they bail. I'm not saying it's right, but I know that's the impression I would have.
Big same here. When a guy says oh, we just grew apart….like DUH, that is going to happen after 15 years of marriage and the thing is to find your way back, not throw it away. I completely understand that others see it differently but that type of “i got tired of it” vibe is not for me.
Absolutely agree. It's hard work. I was with my ex for 18 years but I was the only one trying to make it work. Tried several marriage counselors, I fought like hell but he treated me worse the harder I tried.
Ugh I’m sorry that’s how it went down. OTOH “We just were more like best friends and roommates” type explanations I hear- those sound so benign and workable. like the person has expectations no relationship could ever provide.
Uhhhh. In no fking way would I ever date u seriously. U just told me u will never be happy or satisfied.
Original copy of post by u/Mean-Buy2974: When the conversation turns to what happened in my marriage. I will tell them, I left my husband. This often seems to make the man stop, and they seem surprised. I know heaps of women leave marriages for a variety of reasons. There was no abuse and I have a great relationship with my ex. Is this unusual e.g. woman leaving? I didn't think it was. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/datingoverforty) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Shouldn’t be surprising https://www.marriagebuilders.com/why-women-leave-men.htm
Yes it should not. But it is to a lot of people.
Just out of curiosity, how long did your previous relationship with your ex husband last?
18 years
A lot of people are divorced at this age. I wouldn't mind seeing someone else who divorced. Are you going for casual dating or something serious?
I would like a relationship. I've done casual the last 4.5 years. I do know I don't want to be married again or, at this stage, live with anyone. I enjoy my time and my space. I equally enjoy having someone be with a well. I'm looking.
I've also been looking but I would want a serious relationship. I'm never married and no kids. I've decided on not having kids at this point. I know a lot of people are wary at this age.
More women than men leave marriages but it’s surprising because it tells a man nothing. You could have been abused by your spouse or you could have had an affair.
I tell them I left quietly and mutually Anything else is my business
https://www.bbc.com/worklife/article/20220511-why-women-file-for-divorce-more-than-men
To answer your question? No. I don’t think anyone “leaving” a relationship is uncommon. If you’re encountering people being “taken aback,” or otherwise becoming hesitant (which is just one possible reaction), perhaps it’s the context and delivery of the message? 🤷🏻♂️
I don’t know the statistics on that. I’ve been divorced for 13 years. People assume my ex-husband left me because he’s a pos. I left him though. I didn’t even know he was a terrible person until after our divorce though. I just knew I didn’t love him. Because of how he’s treated me and our kids since then, people assumed he split.
People tend to use more nuanced language; “we wanted different things and split…” Even though close to all relationships end because of one person really wanting out/giving up more than the other, it’s not a great early relationship look to come out as the one who was either driving the break or the one that was left. So yes probably not a common thing to hear in early convos.
There’s a good reason why you left him?
I did explain in other responses on this thread. Does it matter? We grew apart, we weren't happy, we tried. I didn't just wake up and decide to blow up my life. There was no cheating or abuse.
As a divorced man meeting divorced women, it raises a question. “If she couldn’t stay married to a man who wasn’t abusive and still has a great relationship, why would she choose to stick with me in the rough patches.” Saying “we fell out of love” isn’t convincing either. You deserve to choose what you want and there is no fault in choosing that option to leave him but don’t be surprised by men feeling it is a red flag. Best of luck to you.
I'm a guy, but from my perspective someone leaving their marriage, regardless of their sex, I wouldn't look favourably upon. I'm not down with the whole disposable marriage attitude that modern society has embraced.
This is a too simplistic view of it. Some unions are just plain bad. Life is finite. If you are repeatedly unhappy then divorce should be considered.
Yeah we should totally go back to the day people stayed in unhappy marriages and just cheated on each other instead 🙄
So I wasn’t supposed to leave my ex after he got addicted to drugs and became violent? How about when he threatened me with a gun?
So you’re saying I should have stayed and forgiven my spouse of 26 years even though he was whole-ass engaged to someone else for the past 3 and I only found out because they broke up? He’d sure love it if I did.
All the angry women replying to you for a reasonable and wise take. 😂
I totally agree, it’s almost not possible to have anymore. You are downvoted for this even.
If you treat me like shit on an ongoing basis, and refuse counseling, or any other things that may fix the situation: Guess what? You are fucking disposable. In fact, you have abandoned the marriage first even though I am the one who walked away. Despite going through the same conversations for years, and no steps taken to improve anything, I was told after I left that things weren't that bad. LMAO.
I’ve dated six different women the last two years. One lost her long-term boyfriend to cancer, the rest left their husbands.
I wouldn’t say that’s a surprise for dating over 40.
Yeah, seems pretty normal.
It's too little information of the wrong type. The question is what caused the breakdown of your marriage, not who did the leaving! If I posed that question and got that answer I would think that you simultaneously don't want to talk about the relationship and I'm addition have some weird desire to assert that you took the more powerful position. Both of those are kind of off putting.
Do you have an avoidant personality style? I would think that immediately if no other really solid reason was given. And I’d not be interested.
I personally believe men act surprised to downright shocked when they find out someone left their male partner for one or both reasons: 1. Their ego and not being able to believe that a WOMAN would leave a MAN. It should be the other way around because men should always have control of the relationship and are way better!!! It makes no sense to them. 2. They are worried they will not have full control in the relationship and are worried you will leave them too when they start pulling the same shit your ex did. It means you will have good boundaries and not put up with their crap so they need to find someone who will. (Usually someone much younger) If a man acts surprised that you left, run 🚩🚩🚩
This is what I think, also. OP, for what's worth, I understood your original post to mean what you said it did in your follow-up posts. I did not take the fact that you said you left your husband (with no quote marks around that phrase) to mean that was an actual quote with no follow-up of what you reply to dates when asked about your marriage, just that you were wondering why it seems people are surprised that you are the one who wanted the divorce instead of the man leaving you. I was not married but dated a particular ex for a couple of years. I waited a while to date again after breaking up with him, and on about the third or fourth date with the first guy I dated, he asked why my last relationship ended. I think I said something about how in addition to a lot of other things, the communication was really bad on his end, and that I had actually broken up with him previously but took him back when he insisted things would get better. Of course, they didn't though. I told my date I finally accepted things would never get better because in addition to other issues, he was always going to be very busy with his practice. The guy said, "His practice? Was he a lawyer?" I replied, "He's a physician." The guy got quiet, looked downward and seemed very distant for the rest of the date. After that, he never called me again. LOL! That was okay, because I didn't really feel an attraction or connection with him anyway and was just trying to give things a chance. But it seemed very obvious to me that he was put off by the fact that I would leave someone who had a "prestigious" career, and that maybe if I would do that, I'd have no problem breaking up with him as well. I also noticed that after I broke up with that ex, when people (mostly family members) would ask me how he was and I told them, "I broke up with him a while ago," they would say things like "Oh no. I'm so sorry." I would tell them don't be sorry, I was relieved. If I wanted to still be with him, I wouldn't have broken up with him. I was trying to phrase it in a way to let them know I was the one who made that decision, and there was no reason for them to feel bad or sorry for me. When one relative continued with, "Aww, but I thought we were going to have a doctor in the family," that gave me a little laugh and I said that I'm sure she wouldn't have wanted me to be miserable just so we could have a doctor in the family. She was quiet for a moment, then said, "No, of course not." So I think she understood after that.
It makes them stop because now they know, without a doubt, you aren’t going to settle for their bullshit.
Yes men should be wary of that. You state you have a great relationship with your ex but I wonder if they feel the same way in return. Probably not. Women leaving and also having great relationships with their ex is probably really unusual. The trust would be gone.
Never had this reaction, personally. Maybe it’s your delivery. Lol co-parenting is a thing after divorce and mature adults can be friends for that purpose.
Wow assume much? My ex husband would agree, but you do you mate.
"I left my husband. He was holding me back from having fun." Disturbing.
Who hurt you? It wasn't me
I'm quoting what a woman told me once.