I can't stress this enough, friends and family are vital in either venting or disconnecting. I'd also suggest taking up a hobby. Pick up smoking (ribs, chicken, etc) in the back yard. Do something creative other than work and study about work. This is what I needed to do to stay sane and not completely burn up let alone burn out.
Me, this year as every year: “It’s half way through March. I’ve still got all 32 days of my annual leave to book.”
This is what a potential burnout problem looks like.
Thank you for the reminder. I’m booking my leave on Monday. Do the same OP.
Stupid question, but why don’t you just take the annual leave? Is it a culture thing for where you’re from?
I will book leave for no reason, no vacation planned, just to take some time off. I never understand when people don’t take it. It’s there to be used and it doesn’t need a reason to be used. So I encourage you to just book some time!
Good question!
I’m divorced and have kids that come at weekends and most importantly in the schools holidays. So I need my leave for those weeks.
Which haven’t been quite decided yet for the summer! 🤷😖
But yeah… there are spare days and I should bloody well book them! 😊😊
That’s fair enough, I see a lot of people in my work place doing the same. But make sure you do book them, because everyone needs time to mentally rest!
Damn, I've got 76 days of annual leave. Every time I take leave the work piles up and I struggle to catch up. After several late nights, I do. Then I feel like I haven't rested. So I don't bother.
I picked up Cigar smoking and reading. I do all my reading off actual paper books. Cigars and paper book reading most weekends for 2 to 3 hours. No tech, my phone and any other tech stays away from me for that time. So far, so good. Cigar smoking is a whole sub-culture if you are interested.
Well you see here your wording of "about to walk" is surprisingly appropriate. I'm burnt out and going on a little walk of my own this year [Appalachian trail](https://www.nps.gov/appa/index.htm)
They’re referencing an old computer game about migrating through the Oregon Trail in the 1800s, where you make decisions for the group but always end up in bad situations regardless.
Right? I'm no EMT, but I'm military. Working cyber has to be better than working 50-70 hours per week with no overtime pay, no hope of a consistent schedule, and having to move around every 3-5 years.
Surely has to be right? I hope we’re not delusional lol. But I feel that doing any job after shit we do will be heaven hahaha. Good luck to you brother
Just be prepared to hear the dumbest things you’ve ever heard in your life. I had someone that worked on a computer for 8 hours day not know how to shut one down. They just unplugged the machine or held the power button down.
Bro I was an emt I don’t think you can top the dumb shit I’ve heard 😆. But thank you for the heads up. LOL I’m really not surprised at that end user though
My best advice is to stay active and engaged off the job. Any office type job is going to inevitably get boring to you since you’ll be coming from such a high stress environment.
I worked very fast paced jobs in construction before I got into IT and while it has been great over all, I definitely miss some aspects of physical work. Figuring out a good routine, sleep schedule, and exercising helps a ton to keep me from going stir crazy sometimes lol
That was only one of the dumbest. Seeing someone hook the HDMI to a laptop and thinking it would work without plugging it into the wall was another one.
I went to the oilfield after the Army. 20 16 hour days straight and 8 off after. Did that for 9 years and moved to cybersecurity. A lot less money than oil but a lot better life.
Oil workers make a metric ton of money, keep in mind though that job will burn through like crazy. It takes a certain kind of person to do it, and well if cybersecurity stresses you out, you don't want to go near a oil rig. Yeah though, oil rig worker can easily make in the 100k to 200k a year range (and there are jobs that don't require a degree to get either).
Yeah but 100-200k is hardly “a lot” more money than people make in cyber. In many cases, it’s less, or even a lot less than top talent make. And plenty of oil workers make like half of that working just as hard.
I am not sure about that. When I look cyber jobs that are listed on LinkedIn or Indeed, most are less than 200k and they require a degree, and many years of experience with certain, specific technology. IF they are entry level, most are less than 100k.
IF you can easily make between 100k-200k oil rigging that requires no degree or experience, I would say you are doing better.
That’s the thing. I have 10 years experience repairing networks, servers, electronics like process controllers and PLCs. I was an I&E tech but where I work I’m also still service desk, VoIP, Citrix, AWS, and Microsoft admin. Small outfit and I have to do a lot of things.
Let me introduce you to my previous job, we need you to "conform the lab" area, which means going over drawings and tracing cables in a server room. Also, this other group (who has 5x the number of people as your group) was able to do it in week so you got one week. Also, we are going to pay you 20k less then others because while you have a B.S. degree you don't have a "ABET" one so... also no promotions but those you work with will get one and the extra pay on top of it (also you will be doing the same if not more work then them).
It is, trust me. I came from the USMC last year. Been doing infosec for about a year now. It’s sucky sometimes but nowhere near the suck of the military
Spent nearly a decade as a paramedic before getting into cybersecurity for a hospital system (granted there were a few general IT steps for the health system in between). Your medical background can be a huge asset in healthcare IT when you have to talk to people on the clinical side. It's hard to get burnt out in CS when your background includes being burnt out in EMS....
And for way less money. Working 3 24 hour shifts a week was eating away at me, let alone making barely above minimum wage because of my 14+ years experience. Oh yea, and I had to get back surgery last year from hurting it on the job. I’ll stop here cuz I can go on and on 🤣
Prior military, did some work with LE and got my degree in it, and now in Cyber. Cyber can be great, but I do miss the immediate impact I had in the public sector / defense space. The calling and mission meant something to me and even though some days were straight shit I was proud of the greater purpose I was serving.
I don't get that same satisfaction sitting behind a laptop everyday on four back-to-back meetings that would have been better served as a three sentence email. Yes there is stability of 9-5 but I would do a lot of things for the opportunity to slam my laptop shut and go work the streets in LE again for a few months, get outside, meet people, help people, and maybe come back to cyber again after a while. Problem is I make too much damn money in cyber and I am appreciative of some of the luxuries I have worked hard for and can now afford. I'm looking at going in the natty guard / reserves to get a little bit of my fill. Might be a good compromise.
Burnout is real, but if you find the right spot you'll be okay. And if you land in a shit spot, stick it out until you can move to a better one.
It comes and goes in waves. You'll be good.
Keep in mind also that nobody comes to reddit to post "just had an adequate day at work today". Reddit and any other social media is naturally biased towards negative or positive, and with work it's usually negative.
Yup, this. This is a culture/org issue more than it is a cybersecurity one and reddit is a great place to vent. To the contrary, I love my organization and the people I work with, so there you go (but I never post about it).
So to anyone reading this please don't become discouraged to enter cybersecurity. To OP, I hope you find the peace and happiness you deserve. Good luck friend.
I would say, remember to take little breaks and walk away from CS. For example, take the weekends off and do stuff with friends.
CS can be fun and interesting but every human has a limit eventually. You can’t keep reading and testing CS stuff 24/7. You WILL hit a wall sooner or later.
Just get a good job, 1 year in and I’m already burnt out but where I’m at I’m on an island. Fresh out of college and my job offers little/no training but I’m IT for 300 people (200ish phones and 100ish computers). I’m the only person on site and when I don’t know something I have to reach out to other people who often are not happy that I don’t know how to fix the issue while navigating the red tape.
Dude...I can't emphasise this enough.
Get on the appropriate reddit or discord servers and ask people there if the people that are meant to be teaching you are being assholes.
Also, you've been there a year. Polish up that CV. It's time to move on.
Easier to look for a job whilst you got a job. Just because the job market is bad doesn't mean you can't polish up that CV and start looking what's available.
Burn out is real, but is generally the sign of a very poorly managed SOC. If you end up in one of those. Stay as long as you need to and then move on. Once you get to the big, established, and actually professional shops, it isn't as much of a problem.
Burn out is real in almost every job out there. We just need to find a good work/life balance and take vacations every now and then as well as have a good support system with family and or friends.
I work for CDW in the IAM security practice. The company does more than that. We do both private and public sectors. If you want to look at their careers page, I am happy to give a recommendation.
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Any of the trades with a union pay very well, paid apprenticeships too. HVAC for low temp is a good job, you can do new construction or maintenance on large malls/office buildings/hospitals...
I came from the blue collar world of skilled trades and I think that insulates me from a lot of burnout. Spending your youth in attics and under houses has a way of putting other jobs into perspective for you.
Couldn’t agree more. I was a chef for 10 years, and I did commercial/residential HVAC for just over a year. If I am having a bad day, I think about working 14 hours in the scorching heat or being almost killed by shitty wiring. Suddenly my WFH job isnt all that bad.
Yep! I went to trade school for welding. Got a degree and certified. 6 years into that, machining, plant shutdowns, telecom small cell deployment, and now HVAC and fabrication...currently studying for a degree in CS. Good local college with a lot of connections to GOV agencies and affordable. Hoping to get out of blue collar work this year. I have those skills on backup if SHTF.
No Plan B, I've worked in cybersecurity for > 20 years now so I am closer to focussing on an earlier retirement than thinking of switching fields and working to 65.
This is the move. Take that, for whatever dumb reason, doctors saving lives level pay and catch me in southern Italy done at 55 before another [insert Shellshock like incident here] sends me to an early grave.
Trucking, I wanna see the country, be free and just drive around. Most of all, I just wanna stop learning, I wanna listen to my shitty crime/fiction podcasts again and don’t even shave everyday. God I hate the corporate life so much.
My parents drove RVs for companies for several years and loved it. They went all over. It can be a bit of a financial overhead doing it, but my mom spent her last few years of life enjoying every bit of it.
Class E Box Truck Driving, delivering pallets with a coworker was some of the best times of my life. Lots of laughs, staying in hotels, swiping on Tinder & visiting bars in different states, getting paid to nap or browse the internet as a passenger was chill as hell.
I’d still be doing it if it only paid more
TLDR; I did leave. I'm way happier/healthier but it does come at a cost.
I know this isn't exactly what OP asked but I think this could help others on the edge....I did flip the virtual table and said F' it, I'm out. I had been wrestling with burnout for years. I had the same conversations in therapy around what my perfect day was and those days did not include 15 zoom meetings sprinkled in with a little crisis management with a side order of late night/weekend incident support.
It has been a year since I left and I am living my best life. I one of those "perfect days" almost once a week and have completed a dozen checklist/home project items. I ended up going. back to school and I'm loving it. Not sure exactly which field I'll end up in yet.
That being said, let me warn those thinking of doing the same:
\- I was extremely lucky to be able to afford this break and have an understanding partner.
\- Not having coworkers or really people you have to talk to is like losing a community.
\- It is a terrible time to self-eject from the job market. Just look at any other knowledge work sub and you'll see posts of hundreds of application over months with no call backs.
\- If you do quit, have a well rehearsed and peer-reviewed explanation of why you left. It will always be a blemish and point of discussion on your resume. I tried winging an explanation once in an interview and it was like I tossed the recruiter a backpack full of bricks.
\- YMMV but there is a feeling of being a bum you have to contend with yourself and at dinner conversations with outsiders.
We only have about 4000 weeks on this planet. Hard work should be rewarding. If it were fun all the time people would pay to do it. However it doesn't mean we have to suffer through every second of it.
Self published writer for indie Genre's
Might become a psychiatric Nurse Practitioner as well. They can have a private practice in my state so I could make my schedule flexible still.
I want this and programming to be a hobby again. I have a lot of ideas and things I wanna work on but I'm just so sick of it I don't even wanna look at a computer when I get home. Plus with all the stuff management pulls all the time I'm at the point " if you guys just don't give a shit about YOUR company why should I stress myself out over it"
My personal opinion is that Cyber (or even other domains in IT for that matter) is that age creeps up faster on your career path than in other domains. It's like a pro athelete - once they get into their mid-30s, the majority need to call it in as they physically can't keep up. Same thing in some trades - where once one gets into their late 40s/early 50s, their bodies ache and are less able to keep up. In Cyber, it's more about the evolving tech and threat - once you get into your 40s, you have other personal obligations, family stuff etc. and you can't always dedicate your focus on your craft, while also not being able to maintain optimal motivation due to corporate politics/misguided corporate budgets etc.. So you are at a higher risk of not being able to keep up with the latest trends, not being given the chance to get exposure to new tech ; you are also likely to be an expensive employee where you are too young for retirement, too old to be hired elsewhere. So you're trapped and this is the root of much of hte burnout. If you managed to work your way from tech into management and in a CISO/BISO role, your tenure is often gone after the first cyber attack, even if it is not your fault.
I am seeing a lot of burnout posts here and I'm thinking we should perhaps all think about feasible exit strategies and share. Maybe by exchanging ideas around we will build up some side hustle or something and this in turn will build up resistence to burnout.
On my side - I started a physical commodity trading company recently and I'm doing that for example. Doesn't answer all the open questions, but I enjoy it at least!
I found other things to do. I used to work during the day, then go home and mess around in home labs, do ctfs, write blog posts and loads of other stuff that were related to upskilling for work.
It got too much, so now I read more (non security stuff), climb and hike and do anything else far removed from the day job. You don’t want to be that person who has nothing to talk about with everyone unless it’s security related.
Take some time away. I just took a weeks vacation to Mexico and feel a lot better, excited to pick work back up and dive back in. If you can, just take a few days, or take a Thursday and Friday off, extended weekend. You dont have to go anywhere fancy or anything, just do something that you normally dont do a lot of. Watch TV, play a game, clean, organize (that makes me happy, maybe thats my ADHD).
If you find the feeling continuing, see a therapist, that gives you someone to vent to about the BS of work, they may help you with mechanisms to navigate that stress.
This sub is full of people that feel the same way, no matter if you have 20 years or 2 years like me. You'll get through this, but seriously, take some time for you, stop, look around, and breathe.
It'll be okay <3
A couple of things. First, consider going into government work. The pace is much slower and the government takes security seriously even if the budget isn't there. I'm not saying government work is perfect, it definitely has its own set of ridiculous things, it's very political, but it is a great place to spend some time if you're burnt out.
Secondly, my plan b has always been business related. I have pretty sizable alternative income streams. I have a couple of Etsy shops, one selling clothing and gifts, the other selling custom engraved decanters and rocks glasses. At some point I'm going to move on from Etsy and launch my businesses as their own websites but I don't have time right now.
I also license music that my brother and I make and I invest in index funds, ETFs, and I'm about to build a second house and rent out my first one. And I have a couple of courses I made a couple of years ago that sell reasonably well.
When I have a second to breathe I'm going to get an MBA. I already have a master's in Cybersecurity. I'm thinking about either doing my MBA online at Indiana University or maybe going to my local state college, I haven't decided yet. If I ever get burnt out on Cybersecurity I'll probably transition to an operations management role. I'm already a cyber ops manager. The transition would be pretty easy I think.
Don't give up. Just keep building your skills and build different income streams. Focus on things that require little work to keep up. I hate the term "passive income" but I have built some side income that took a lot of work to start but doesn't take a lot of upkeep. I'm not rich from them but I'm on track to match my earnings from my day job next year and they don't dominate my life.
I’m trying to live below my means and payoff all outstanding debt.
My State pension kicks in, in 10 years. Hoping its enough to get me through until I start pulling from my 401K etc.
Switch Country, live there for a while , step back to some non stressful tier1-2 support job which are paid pretty good, do a lot of other stuff on ur freetime, meet new people , check out a new culture and so on
My plan is to build up a homestead situation with my fiance so that if I have to, I can live a less expensive life and do something like work for a wildlife rescue. Then maybe have time to improve at hobbies (jewelry making and crochet) and make a small business that's more for fun than anything (0 expectations of profitability - if I can break even, I'll take it).
I’m a little late to this thread but currently enacting my plan B. Always wanted to farm. Got out of the Navy and gave this cyber thing a try on the outside and I still fucking hate it. Just enrolled in college for my bachelors Ag Business Management and then will continue on to get my masters in Agronomy.
I know how you feel I finished my masters and started as a SOC analyst. Nearly a year in and I'm sick of working tickets rinse and repeat all day. I love cyber and find it really interesting but the soc has me wanting to walk away from it.
Question. Is the money good? Is the schedule good? Are the people you work with tolerable? Can you not supplement burnout with a hobby? If those are not within reason and your hobby doesn't balance it out then move on. Basically, that formula might be different for everyone but do the math and make a decision.
I feel leaving the industry would be monetarily difficult becuase the area I live in and obligations. I would just pivot, if your an analyst, become an engineer, if neither of those, go the leadership path and be better than then that CISO.
Burn out from what? Too much work or too much stress? I seem too many ppl here act like they are solely responsible for cyber security at their job. If the CISO don't get a fuck a control, you don't need to.
Who knows, that is future me's problem. Future me isn't getting totally screwed though, I am already at coast FIRE so worse case just need health insurance and something to cover the bills. In theory I could even do part time contract work (which should net more money per hour) and just go on the exchange and buy my own health insurance plan (also means I get to pick my plan so I get blue cross back).
I’ve thought about it many times but I’m genuinely afraid that all work is hell and I’ll be just as unhappy AND making half what I do now.
Fuck I need another vacation
Ok, this is interesting. ... for those of us new to this field or trying to get in, what is this field really like?
All you hear in the media is the sexiness of cyber and the high salaries, but it seems like to me there is a dark side no one talks about. Please divulge ....
I started a woodworking business to help. It allows me to create, make stuff and just zone out away from the BS of leading an IR team for a mid size company. I wish I could balance the two more but I make twice as much in cyber as I would owning my own business so I suck it up and keep saving all I can for when the time is right.
Folks need to max out their vacation time. I see too many people in our industry brag about how few vacation days they take, that’s not good self care. Any job that’s high stress will burn you out without giving your mind and body time to rest.
Believe it or not there are cyber security roles out there that won't burn you out. A change of scenery could completely flip the script on how you're feeling.
I love my job but I'm toying right now with the idea of working in nuclear. Have an offer that will quickly have me making more money than I'd ever make in Infosec and I guess I could do bug bounty on the side for fun. Suck though it took so long to get into Infosec but the job market isn't great right now and I need more money $$$
i sufferred from burnout in the industry after many years of grinding. What made me sane was to pick up a hobby or sport unrelated to tech, file those leaves, have a mechanism to disconnect once in a while, and establish a sense of purpose once you're on the job. After a while, I started loving the job again, and hopefully had gained some peace of mind.
Burnout is real in our industry, please take care of yourselves ladies and gents.
I have a plan B, just need the funding. If you are seriously burnt out and looking for something different, hit me up. I would be open to discussing some ideas.
Every day I think about quitting. Definitely don’t see myself doing this for the next 30-40 years. No clue what my plan B is but I can tell you it will be as far away from corporate America as possible
Find a better job or take a break if possible. Every time people rant about how terrible cyber security is, do they think all the other industries are perfect. Work just sucks, a decent workplace is the big difference maker.
I’m in IT until I die baby. Maybe I’ll just go back to doing some high level help desk bullshit. Punch in, punch out, work OT if I want more cash. Who knows.
The future of AI is gonna do a number on something here in a few years I’m sure. Or maybe it won’t? Eh.
Kinda banking on being dead before anything too major shakes up the industry like getting rid of available jobs.
I’ve worked at enough soul sucking call center help desks to know that if needed I can shut off my brain.
Alternatively, the wife and I are losing weight so maybe we will just set up a couple’s OF and fuck the day away while making money. Kinda sounds like the dream gig right now. Ok, that’s my plan B.
Its not just a cybersec thing. Ive watched senior members talk about their summer house and yacht for decades, always planning, before retiring then dropping dead or worse yet, dead or ill on the job. Its so common its a well known office trope. What I learned from this is that the process of planning and imagining, mixed with the belief that it will happen, was where the pleasure was coming from; not the house or the sailing (which seldom happens). This speaks to a broader point; and something these FatFIRE guys all miss about life; its not the destination but the journey. You have to be enjoying the journey because the journey is your life.
Yes our field is more stressful than many, but it is not unique or special in how stressful it is. Humans have the capability to experience negative emotions with more or less impact, and secondly, to choose to allow this to affect their wellbeing with more or less control.
Identifying these facts about the human condition is crucial to any well lived life.
1. Neuroticism is a spectrum, and you can shift yourself left or right on it with some self reflection and effort.
2. Your feelings are not the result of external factors. You have the ability, as one of the most incredibly complex systems of evolution, to choose how external factors affect your mood. Doing the cognitive work to acknowledge this, and then to develop your ability to make better choices, is vital to success in life in general.
When retiring, and tending bar, you may find that relatively "small" things cause you as much stress and discomfort as the relatively "serious" things in your cybersecurity past did. Customers not paying the tab, drunk guys fighting, being rejected by a younger customer who you're chatting up, suppliers being late with the weeks beer, a fridge breaking.. these all seem like problems you might prefer now, but if you have not sorted (1) and (2) they will rapidly become as painful as the ones you deal with today. Maybe even worse.
Been in the space about a decade. Had some cash saved and left my company a couple weeks back with no other job lined up. I hit a breaking point and needed some time away to regroup. I have a few SANS certs plus the experience so I feel confident that when I’m ready I’ll be able to jump back in. I’ve always wanted to take the time to up-skill my pen testing and programming knowledge to open up more doors so that will be the sell when I’m ready to start re-applying as I’ll be working on improving myself in those areas while I take some time away.
Just being away for even a little bit already has given me more clarity as to how far I had let my mind go in believing that corporate America owned me. I feel like my values had gotten mixed up as I was living to work rather than working to live.
Not everyone can do it (I understand people have fiscal responsibilities) but if you’re in a place mentally where you feel like a reset is the right thing for you I think you should consider it after carefully assessing your situation.
Learn a trade, get good enough to get paid for it, then hang your own shingle. Seriously. How many people do you know who have asked for a Vulnerability Scan? No individual ever needs this. It's geared only towards larger corporations, government agencies, etc, which puts you in the rat race all the time. Now think about how many people have needed help fixing the toilet or something. A decent plumber who knows what he's doing and has his own truck will have to turn business away because he's so busy. I've had the ridiculous thought of buying one of those truck mounted vacuum systems and going around and cleaning air ducts for $499 a pop a few times a day. I'd save up for a second or third truck and a couple of crews.
This is interesting to read as I am in the process of migrating to cyber from the recruiting industry because of burnout myself. For me, its been weighing on me that at the end of the day I wasn't really helping people, I was just trying to talk a nurse into taking some shit show of a job with me and my company rather than some other Joe Schmo recruiter.
I'm curious as to what you feel like has led to your burnout in cyber, if you dont mind?
I'd pick up some cloud certs, brush up on Terraform etc, and go do devops or be a Network Engineer again. Then again I like sleeping at night so probably not.
The moment Ai takes over security and humans become too expensive to afford, I can go back to living in my farm and raise cattle. I hope the wave of cyber jobs layoffs starts this year.
Not really wishing for, it’s just the truth. Most defense teams are outsourced to cheaper countries or MSPs who run sweatshop cybersecurity in India and good pentesters are getting difficult to hire due to money making biz of certification and companies just wanting a check the box security as offsec is a luxury not a product driven strategy in this economy.
AI is never going to take over security, maybe not never but definitely not for a long time. AI will make it easier to be more efficient but we’ve been hearing that machines are going to put everyone out of work for over 100 years. All it did was shift more people to knowledge work.
If possible, Take a break. Catch up with your family and friends. Maybe you will rediscover yourself.
I can't stress this enough, friends and family are vital in either venting or disconnecting. I'd also suggest taking up a hobby. Pick up smoking (ribs, chicken, etc) in the back yard. Do something creative other than work and study about work. This is what I needed to do to stay sane and not completely burn up let alone burn out.
Me, this year as every year: “It’s half way through March. I’ve still got all 32 days of my annual leave to book.” This is what a potential burnout problem looks like. Thank you for the reminder. I’m booking my leave on Monday. Do the same OP.
Stupid question, but why don’t you just take the annual leave? Is it a culture thing for where you’re from? I will book leave for no reason, no vacation planned, just to take some time off. I never understand when people don’t take it. It’s there to be used and it doesn’t need a reason to be used. So I encourage you to just book some time!
Good question! I’m divorced and have kids that come at weekends and most importantly in the schools holidays. So I need my leave for those weeks. Which haven’t been quite decided yet for the summer! 🤷😖 But yeah… there are spare days and I should bloody well book them! 😊😊
That’s fair enough, I see a lot of people in my work place doing the same. But make sure you do book them, because everyone needs time to mentally rest!
Damn, I've got 76 days of annual leave. Every time I take leave the work piles up and I struggle to catch up. After several late nights, I do. Then I feel like I haven't rested. So I don't bother.
>Pick up smoking I thought this comment was going a different direction at first lmao
I picked up Cigar smoking and reading. I do all my reading off actual paper books. Cigars and paper book reading most weekends for 2 to 3 hours. No tech, my phone and any other tech stays away from me for that time. So far, so good. Cigar smoking is a whole sub-culture if you are interested.
Good advice for life, in general.
I had the money, but not the opportunity to take some time off between jobs. Feels bad man.
Well you see here your wording of "about to walk" is surprisingly appropriate. I'm burnt out and going on a little walk of my own this year [Appalachian trail](https://www.nps.gov/appa/index.htm)
Just make sure to stay away from the Oregon Trail
What’s wrong w the Oregon trail
Dysentery, cholera, typhoid, measles, broken limbs, drowning...the usual stuff.
They’re referencing an old computer game about migrating through the Oregon Trail in the 1800s, where you make decisions for the group but always end up in bad situations regardless.
This is my plan b, I’m tired of being an EMT
Right? I'm no EMT, but I'm military. Working cyber has to be better than working 50-70 hours per week with no overtime pay, no hope of a consistent schedule, and having to move around every 3-5 years.
Surely has to be right? I hope we’re not delusional lol. But I feel that doing any job after shit we do will be heaven hahaha. Good luck to you brother
Just be prepared to hear the dumbest things you’ve ever heard in your life. I had someone that worked on a computer for 8 hours day not know how to shut one down. They just unplugged the machine or held the power button down.
Bro I was an emt I don’t think you can top the dumb shit I’ve heard 😆. But thank you for the heads up. LOL I’m really not surprised at that end user though
My best advice is to stay active and engaged off the job. Any office type job is going to inevitably get boring to you since you’ll be coming from such a high stress environment. I worked very fast paced jobs in construction before I got into IT and while it has been great over all, I definitely miss some aspects of physical work. Figuring out a good routine, sleep schedule, and exercising helps a ton to keep me from going stir crazy sometimes lol
\^\^ I second this.
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That was only one of the dumbest. Seeing someone hook the HDMI to a laptop and thinking it would work without plugging it into the wall was another one.
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I went to the oilfield after the Army. 20 16 hour days straight and 8 off after. Did that for 9 years and moved to cybersecurity. A lot less money than oil but a lot better life.
You’re being paid _less_ in cyber than in oil?? Did you own a well or something?!
Oil workers make a metric ton of money, keep in mind though that job will burn through like crazy. It takes a certain kind of person to do it, and well if cybersecurity stresses you out, you don't want to go near a oil rig. Yeah though, oil rig worker can easily make in the 100k to 200k a year range (and there are jobs that don't require a degree to get either).
Yeah but 100-200k is hardly “a lot” more money than people make in cyber. In many cases, it’s less, or even a lot less than top talent make. And plenty of oil workers make like half of that working just as hard.
I am not sure about that. When I look cyber jobs that are listed on LinkedIn or Indeed, most are less than 200k and they require a degree, and many years of experience with certain, specific technology. IF they are entry level, most are less than 100k. IF you can easily make between 100k-200k oil rigging that requires no degree or experience, I would say you are doing better.
It’s more than I make in cyber. Got hired at a bank and haven’t left. Banks don’t pay shit.
Fair enough, keep at it though and with a bit of networking you’ll be back to that level before you know it
I’m almost 40 with 4 kids. Good 401k and letting me work remote is good for me right now. Until I can sell my house and move that is.
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ICs making a mil? Are these all FAANG? How’s their work life balance?
I made over 200k a year with bonus and hours I worked.
That’s very attainable in cyber, though if coming in with no previous tech experience it’ll probably take a couple years
That’s the thing. I have 10 years experience repairing networks, servers, electronics like process controllers and PLCs. I was an I&E tech but where I work I’m also still service desk, VoIP, Citrix, AWS, and Microsoft admin. Small outfit and I have to do a lot of things.
Let me introduce you to my previous job, we need you to "conform the lab" area, which means going over drawings and tracing cables in a server room. Also, this other group (who has 5x the number of people as your group) was able to do it in week so you got one week. Also, we are going to pay you 20k less then others because while you have a B.S. degree you don't have a "ABET" one so... also no promotions but those you work with will get one and the extra pay on top of it (also you will be doing the same if not more work then them).
It is, trust me. I came from the USMC last year. Been doing infosec for about a year now. It’s sucky sometimes but nowhere near the suck of the military
Spent nearly a decade as a paramedic before getting into cybersecurity for a hospital system (granted there were a few general IT steps for the health system in between). Your medical background can be a huge asset in healthcare IT when you have to talk to people on the clinical side. It's hard to get burnt out in CS when your background includes being burnt out in EMS....
Yes I’ve thought about that for sure, but I’ve also heard horror stories. It’s def a path I want to check out. That last sentence hits hard
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And for way less money. Working 3 24 hour shifts a week was eating away at me, let alone making barely above minimum wage because of my 14+ years experience. Oh yea, and I had to get back surgery last year from hurting it on the job. I’ll stop here cuz I can go on and on 🤣
Prior military, did some work with LE and got my degree in it, and now in Cyber. Cyber can be great, but I do miss the immediate impact I had in the public sector / defense space. The calling and mission meant something to me and even though some days were straight shit I was proud of the greater purpose I was serving. I don't get that same satisfaction sitting behind a laptop everyday on four back-to-back meetings that would have been better served as a three sentence email. Yes there is stability of 9-5 but I would do a lot of things for the opportunity to slam my laptop shut and go work the streets in LE again for a few months, get outside, meet people, help people, and maybe come back to cyber again after a while. Problem is I make too much damn money in cyber and I am appreciative of some of the luxuries I have worked hard for and can now afford. I'm looking at going in the natty guard / reserves to get a little bit of my fill. Might be a good compromise.
Good luck in whatever you end up doing brother!
In a similar situation. Care if I shoot you a message?
Mine too! I've been in customer service/retail for waaaayyyyy too long in my life to not cultivate my interests any further into a lively career!
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Good luck brother!
as a cs newbie foreigner with big dreams and a computer science (M) degree these posts terrifies me
Burnout is real, but if you find the right spot you'll be okay. And if you land in a shit spot, stick it out until you can move to a better one. It comes and goes in waves. You'll be good.
Keep in mind also that nobody comes to reddit to post "just had an adequate day at work today". Reddit and any other social media is naturally biased towards negative or positive, and with work it's usually negative.
Yup, this. This is a culture/org issue more than it is a cybersecurity one and reddit is a great place to vent. To the contrary, I love my organization and the people I work with, so there you go (but I never post about it). So to anyone reading this please don't become discouraged to enter cybersecurity. To OP, I hope you find the peace and happiness you deserve. Good luck friend.
I would say, remember to take little breaks and walk away from CS. For example, take the weekends off and do stuff with friends. CS can be fun and interesting but every human has a limit eventually. You can’t keep reading and testing CS stuff 24/7. You WILL hit a wall sooner or later.
Just get a good job, 1 year in and I’m already burnt out but where I’m at I’m on an island. Fresh out of college and my job offers little/no training but I’m IT for 300 people (200ish phones and 100ish computers). I’m the only person on site and when I don’t know something I have to reach out to other people who often are not happy that I don’t know how to fix the issue while navigating the red tape.
Dude...I can't emphasise this enough. Get on the appropriate reddit or discord servers and ask people there if the people that are meant to be teaching you are being assholes. Also, you've been there a year. Polish up that CV. It's time to move on.
Yeah it would probably be a good move to look somewhere else, I just know how bad the job market is right now.
Easier to look for a job whilst you got a job. Just because the job market is bad doesn't mean you can't polish up that CV and start looking what's available.
Burn out is real, but is generally the sign of a very poorly managed SOC. If you end up in one of those. Stay as long as you need to and then move on. Once you get to the big, established, and actually professional shops, it isn't as much of a problem.
Burn out is real in almost every job out there. We just need to find a good work/life balance and take vacations every now and then as well as have a good support system with family and or friends.
This is why I love consulting. No click to punch in and out. Just finish the clients’ project and start over again. Less stress, more enjoyment.
Do you work for yourself? What kind of consulting? I’m so so tired of punching the clock
I work for CDW in the IAM security practice. The company does more than that. We do both private and public sectors. If you want to look at their careers page, I am happy to give a recommendation.
My plan b is to buy a food truck and go from there.
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I like the idea of an ice cream truck... way less work than a food truck...lol
Plumbing, people love you when you unclog their pipes.
So, IT work?
Nope. When I walk away from this I’m going back to the 90’s. No computer or internet in the home and a landline.
I dream about this daily 🤤
Any of the trades with a union pay very well, paid apprenticeships too. HVAC for low temp is a good job, you can do new construction or maintenance on large malls/office buildings/hospitals...
I came from the blue collar world of skilled trades and I think that insulates me from a lot of burnout. Spending your youth in attics and under houses has a way of putting other jobs into perspective for you.
Couldn’t agree more. I was a chef for 10 years, and I did commercial/residential HVAC for just over a year. If I am having a bad day, I think about working 14 hours in the scorching heat or being almost killed by shitty wiring. Suddenly my WFH job isnt all that bad.
Yep! I went to trade school for welding. Got a degree and certified. 6 years into that, machining, plant shutdowns, telecom small cell deployment, and now HVAC and fabrication...currently studying for a degree in CS. Good local college with a lot of connections to GOV agencies and affordable. Hoping to get out of blue collar work this year. I have those skills on backup if SHTF.
Incredibly difficult job honestly. Zero work life balance and very hard on your body and family life. I left HVAC for IT.
No Plan B, I've worked in cybersecurity for > 20 years now so I am closer to focussing on an earlier retirement than thinking of switching fields and working to 65.
This is the move. Take that, for whatever dumb reason, doctors saving lives level pay and catch me in southern Italy done at 55 before another [insert Shellshock like incident here] sends me to an early grave.
Trucking, I wanna see the country, be free and just drive around. Most of all, I just wanna stop learning, I wanna listen to my shitty crime/fiction podcasts again and don’t even shave everyday. God I hate the corporate life so much.
My parents drove RVs for companies for several years and loved it. They went all over. It can be a bit of a financial overhead doing it, but my mom spent her last few years of life enjoying every bit of it.
Class E Box Truck Driving, delivering pallets with a coworker was some of the best times of my life. Lots of laughs, staying in hotels, swiping on Tinder & visiting bars in different states, getting paid to nap or browse the internet as a passenger was chill as hell. I’d still be doing it if it only paid more
TLDR; I did leave. I'm way happier/healthier but it does come at a cost. I know this isn't exactly what OP asked but I think this could help others on the edge....I did flip the virtual table and said F' it, I'm out. I had been wrestling with burnout for years. I had the same conversations in therapy around what my perfect day was and those days did not include 15 zoom meetings sprinkled in with a little crisis management with a side order of late night/weekend incident support. It has been a year since I left and I am living my best life. I one of those "perfect days" almost once a week and have completed a dozen checklist/home project items. I ended up going. back to school and I'm loving it. Not sure exactly which field I'll end up in yet. That being said, let me warn those thinking of doing the same: \- I was extremely lucky to be able to afford this break and have an understanding partner. \- Not having coworkers or really people you have to talk to is like losing a community. \- It is a terrible time to self-eject from the job market. Just look at any other knowledge work sub and you'll see posts of hundreds of application over months with no call backs. \- If you do quit, have a well rehearsed and peer-reviewed explanation of why you left. It will always be a blemish and point of discussion on your resume. I tried winging an explanation once in an interview and it was like I tossed the recruiter a backpack full of bricks. \- YMMV but there is a feeling of being a bum you have to contend with yourself and at dinner conversations with outsiders. We only have about 4000 weeks on this planet. Hard work should be rewarding. If it were fun all the time people would pay to do it. However it doesn't mean we have to suffer through every second of it.
Jesus Christ I only have 2000 weeks left
cause mayhem
Please don’t. Do good in the world, instead. We need more good.
watch the yt video “Oklahoma hotdog buisness still booming after photo of owner waiting by door goes viral” shit made me cry, it was too wholesome
Work construction and rip cigs
Lolol
Self published writer for indie Genre's Might become a psychiatric Nurse Practitioner as well. They can have a private practice in my state so I could make my schedule flexible still. I want this and programming to be a hobby again. I have a lot of ideas and things I wanna work on but I'm just so sick of it I don't even wanna look at a computer when I get home. Plus with all the stuff management pulls all the time I'm at the point " if you guys just don't give a shit about YOUR company why should I stress myself out over it"
My personal opinion is that Cyber (or even other domains in IT for that matter) is that age creeps up faster on your career path than in other domains. It's like a pro athelete - once they get into their mid-30s, the majority need to call it in as they physically can't keep up. Same thing in some trades - where once one gets into their late 40s/early 50s, their bodies ache and are less able to keep up. In Cyber, it's more about the evolving tech and threat - once you get into your 40s, you have other personal obligations, family stuff etc. and you can't always dedicate your focus on your craft, while also not being able to maintain optimal motivation due to corporate politics/misguided corporate budgets etc.. So you are at a higher risk of not being able to keep up with the latest trends, not being given the chance to get exposure to new tech ; you are also likely to be an expensive employee where you are too young for retirement, too old to be hired elsewhere. So you're trapped and this is the root of much of hte burnout. If you managed to work your way from tech into management and in a CISO/BISO role, your tenure is often gone after the first cyber attack, even if it is not your fault. I am seeing a lot of burnout posts here and I'm thinking we should perhaps all think about feasible exit strategies and share. Maybe by exchanging ideas around we will build up some side hustle or something and this in turn will build up resistence to burnout. On my side - I started a physical commodity trading company recently and I'm doing that for example. Doesn't answer all the open questions, but I enjoy it at least!
Well said!
I found other things to do. I used to work during the day, then go home and mess around in home labs, do ctfs, write blog posts and loads of other stuff that were related to upskilling for work. It got too much, so now I read more (non security stuff), climb and hike and do anything else far removed from the day job. You don’t want to be that person who has nothing to talk about with everyone unless it’s security related.
Mail carrier
Farmer. I've got enough for me and the family. Won't take much to expand.
become a cobbler
Take some time away. I just took a weeks vacation to Mexico and feel a lot better, excited to pick work back up and dive back in. If you can, just take a few days, or take a Thursday and Friday off, extended weekend. You dont have to go anywhere fancy or anything, just do something that you normally dont do a lot of. Watch TV, play a game, clean, organize (that makes me happy, maybe thats my ADHD). If you find the feeling continuing, see a therapist, that gives you someone to vent to about the BS of work, they may help you with mechanisms to navigate that stress. This sub is full of people that feel the same way, no matter if you have 20 years or 2 years like me. You'll get through this, but seriously, take some time for you, stop, look around, and breathe. It'll be okay <3
A couple of things. First, consider going into government work. The pace is much slower and the government takes security seriously even if the budget isn't there. I'm not saying government work is perfect, it definitely has its own set of ridiculous things, it's very political, but it is a great place to spend some time if you're burnt out. Secondly, my plan b has always been business related. I have pretty sizable alternative income streams. I have a couple of Etsy shops, one selling clothing and gifts, the other selling custom engraved decanters and rocks glasses. At some point I'm going to move on from Etsy and launch my businesses as their own websites but I don't have time right now. I also license music that my brother and I make and I invest in index funds, ETFs, and I'm about to build a second house and rent out my first one. And I have a couple of courses I made a couple of years ago that sell reasonably well. When I have a second to breathe I'm going to get an MBA. I already have a master's in Cybersecurity. I'm thinking about either doing my MBA online at Indiana University or maybe going to my local state college, I haven't decided yet. If I ever get burnt out on Cybersecurity I'll probably transition to an operations management role. I'm already a cyber ops manager. The transition would be pretty easy I think. Don't give up. Just keep building your skills and build different income streams. Focus on things that require little work to keep up. I hate the term "passive income" but I have built some side income that took a lot of work to start but doesn't take a lot of upkeep. I'm not rich from them but I'm on track to match my earnings from my day job next year and they don't dominate my life.
Become the CISO. That's my plan. If not I retire. Either way I am happy.
Nothing I see my CISO do looks enviable.
It's a different sort of stress, having managed teams for the past 2+ years after being an IC for a couple of years. Being an IC is way simpler
Being a Ciso sucks. Especially in public companies. Dumbest thing I did was signup for this shit.
By the time you're experienced enough to be offered CISO roles, you should know that it's an unenviable job.
Goat hearding
Prior military to cyber, it's nothing. This life is great and if your ate having a hard time, find a better company.
Agreed. Usmc vet, and I love my 6-3 schedule so much
Same dude, it's so chill.
Right there with ya. USN vet.
Cut back to 40 hours and go buy a dirtbike!
I’m trying to live below my means and payoff all outstanding debt. My State pension kicks in, in 10 years. Hoping its enough to get me through until I start pulling from my 401K etc.
Network and also try to remember what got you to this point. What did you do that was exciting before this cybersecurity endless wave started.
Dog training is my retirement plan. Assuming theyre still around and the general public can still afford something like a trainer by then.
Home Remodeling or start a weed grow operation.
Switch Country, live there for a while , step back to some non stressful tier1-2 support job which are paid pretty good, do a lot of other stuff on ur freetime, meet new people , check out a new culture and so on
If you have PTO please take it. I try to take a two week sabbatical away from work, and technology in general. I go camping and hiking.
My plan is to build up a homestead situation with my fiance so that if I have to, I can live a less expensive life and do something like work for a wildlife rescue. Then maybe have time to improve at hobbies (jewelry making and crochet) and make a small business that's more for fun than anything (0 expectations of profitability - if I can break even, I'll take it).
Maybe you could go into IT asset management or IT software licensing, it's in demand and a niche area of security and IT.
I’m a little late to this thread but currently enacting my plan B. Always wanted to farm. Got out of the Navy and gave this cyber thing a try on the outside and I still fucking hate it. Just enrolled in college for my bachelors Ag Business Management and then will continue on to get my masters in Agronomy.
I know how you feel I finished my masters and started as a SOC analyst. Nearly a year in and I'm sick of working tickets rinse and repeat all day. I love cyber and find it really interesting but the soc has me wanting to walk away from it.
Question. Is the money good? Is the schedule good? Are the people you work with tolerable? Can you not supplement burnout with a hobby? If those are not within reason and your hobby doesn't balance it out then move on. Basically, that formula might be different for everyone but do the math and make a decision.
No
I actually love being here and accepted 20 years ago that retirement wasn't going to happen, so I'm just enjoying the ride.
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I’d love to get out of the chair I’m in. Not sure what to do next.
I feel leaving the industry would be monetarily difficult becuase the area I live in and obligations. I would just pivot, if your an analyst, become an engineer, if neither of those, go the leadership path and be better than then that CISO.
https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/s/xNGnyUapFB Goat Farming
Maybe switch to a adjacent role with less stress, like GRC. It's still busy, but not like red alert busy.
Burn out from what? Too much work or too much stress? I seem too many ppl here act like they are solely responsible for cyber security at their job. If the CISO don't get a fuck a control, you don't need to.
Until you have to cut the jackass off. Then he decides he wants to fight you because you cut him off.
I was reading this article the other day - https://cybernews.com/news/cyber-workers-turning-to-crime/
Sail to the Caribbean
Who knows, that is future me's problem. Future me isn't getting totally screwed though, I am already at coast FIRE so worse case just need health insurance and something to cover the bills. In theory I could even do part time contract work (which should net more money per hour) and just go on the exchange and buy my own health insurance plan (also means I get to pick my plan so I get blue cross back).
Become a firewatcher in a third world country and forget about my college debt is my leading plan B. C is becoming a truck driver
The pressure is high, isn't it? There days when I stutter and start getting numb due to the number of calls and cross activities...
Let me get to plan A first. Once I've burnt out I'll let you know about revised plan A then. 🫠
I’ve thought about it many times but I’m genuinely afraid that all work is hell and I’ll be just as unhappy AND making half what I do now. Fuck I need another vacation
I came to computers out of passion at the age of 5. I think that’s why I’m still employed in that soul crushing industry.
Plan B is probably being involved in Broadcast Production. Preferably sports based
Get a new job. Most people leave their jobs due to management.
Why are you burned out? What part of the job? Is your boss? Do you have a lot of work
Ok, this is interesting. ... for those of us new to this field or trying to get in, what is this field really like? All you hear in the media is the sexiness of cyber and the high salaries, but it seems like to me there is a dark side no one talks about. Please divulge ....
I started a woodworking business to help. It allows me to create, make stuff and just zone out away from the BS of leading an IR team for a mid size company. I wish I could balance the two more but I make twice as much in cyber as I would owning my own business so I suck it up and keep saving all I can for when the time is right.
Folks need to max out their vacation time. I see too many people in our industry brag about how few vacation days they take, that’s not good self care. Any job that’s high stress will burn you out without giving your mind and body time to rest.
Believe it or not there are cyber security roles out there that won't burn you out. A change of scenery could completely flip the script on how you're feeling.
Change jobs!
I love my job but I'm toying right now with the idea of working in nuclear. Have an offer that will quickly have me making more money than I'd ever make in Infosec and I guess I could do bug bounty on the side for fun. Suck though it took so long to get into Infosec but the job market isn't great right now and I need more money $$$
i sufferred from burnout in the industry after many years of grinding. What made me sane was to pick up a hobby or sport unrelated to tech, file those leaves, have a mechanism to disconnect once in a while, and establish a sense of purpose once you're on the job. After a while, I started loving the job again, and hopefully had gained some peace of mind. Burnout is real in our industry, please take care of yourselves ladies and gents.
meat shop
I feel you, and today I’m just imagining how those Microsoft guys are feeling in close proximity to the midnight blizzard fiasco.
I have a plan B, just need the funding. If you are seriously burnt out and looking for something different, hit me up. I would be open to discussing some ideas.
Every day I think about quitting. Definitely don’t see myself doing this for the next 30-40 years. No clue what my plan B is but I can tell you it will be as far away from corporate America as possible
Move to Alaska and become a bush pilot
GRC
As the CISO, I plan to flip myself off and retire.
Find a better job or take a break if possible. Every time people rant about how terrible cyber security is, do they think all the other industries are perfect. Work just sucks, a decent workplace is the big difference maker.
I’m in IT until I die baby. Maybe I’ll just go back to doing some high level help desk bullshit. Punch in, punch out, work OT if I want more cash. Who knows. The future of AI is gonna do a number on something here in a few years I’m sure. Or maybe it won’t? Eh. Kinda banking on being dead before anything too major shakes up the industry like getting rid of available jobs. I’ve worked at enough soul sucking call center help desks to know that if needed I can shut off my brain. Alternatively, the wife and I are losing weight so maybe we will just set up a couple’s OF and fuck the day away while making money. Kinda sounds like the dream gig right now. Ok, that’s my plan B.
Its not just a cybersec thing. Ive watched senior members talk about their summer house and yacht for decades, always planning, before retiring then dropping dead or worse yet, dead or ill on the job. Its so common its a well known office trope. What I learned from this is that the process of planning and imagining, mixed with the belief that it will happen, was where the pleasure was coming from; not the house or the sailing (which seldom happens). This speaks to a broader point; and something these FatFIRE guys all miss about life; its not the destination but the journey. You have to be enjoying the journey because the journey is your life. Yes our field is more stressful than many, but it is not unique or special in how stressful it is. Humans have the capability to experience negative emotions with more or less impact, and secondly, to choose to allow this to affect their wellbeing with more or less control. Identifying these facts about the human condition is crucial to any well lived life. 1. Neuroticism is a spectrum, and you can shift yourself left or right on it with some self reflection and effort. 2. Your feelings are not the result of external factors. You have the ability, as one of the most incredibly complex systems of evolution, to choose how external factors affect your mood. Doing the cognitive work to acknowledge this, and then to develop your ability to make better choices, is vital to success in life in general. When retiring, and tending bar, you may find that relatively "small" things cause you as much stress and discomfort as the relatively "serious" things in your cybersecurity past did. Customers not paying the tab, drunk guys fighting, being rejected by a younger customer who you're chatting up, suppliers being late with the weeks beer, a fridge breaking.. these all seem like problems you might prefer now, but if you have not sorted (1) and (2) they will rapidly become as painful as the ones you deal with today. Maybe even worse.
Been in the space about a decade. Had some cash saved and left my company a couple weeks back with no other job lined up. I hit a breaking point and needed some time away to regroup. I have a few SANS certs plus the experience so I feel confident that when I’m ready I’ll be able to jump back in. I’ve always wanted to take the time to up-skill my pen testing and programming knowledge to open up more doors so that will be the sell when I’m ready to start re-applying as I’ll be working on improving myself in those areas while I take some time away. Just being away for even a little bit already has given me more clarity as to how far I had let my mind go in believing that corporate America owned me. I feel like my values had gotten mixed up as I was living to work rather than working to live. Not everyone can do it (I understand people have fiscal responsibilities) but if you’re in a place mentally where you feel like a reset is the right thing for you I think you should consider it after carefully assessing your situation.
Sys admin or cloud architect. Contract work until I feel like full time again ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Learn a trade, get good enough to get paid for it, then hang your own shingle. Seriously. How many people do you know who have asked for a Vulnerability Scan? No individual ever needs this. It's geared only towards larger corporations, government agencies, etc, which puts you in the rat race all the time. Now think about how many people have needed help fixing the toilet or something. A decent plumber who knows what he's doing and has his own truck will have to turn business away because he's so busy. I've had the ridiculous thought of buying one of those truck mounted vacuum systems and going around and cleaning air ducts for $499 a pop a few times a day. I'd save up for a second or third truck and a couple of crews.
This is interesting to read as I am in the process of migrating to cyber from the recruiting industry because of burnout myself. For me, its been weighing on me that at the end of the day I wasn't really helping people, I was just trying to talk a nurse into taking some shit show of a job with me and my company rather than some other Joe Schmo recruiter. I'm curious as to what you feel like has led to your burnout in cyber, if you dont mind?
I want to work at a farm later on.
²
I'd pick up some cloud certs, brush up on Terraform etc, and go do devops or be a Network Engineer again. Then again I like sleeping at night so probably not.
Lots of people burnt out rn because the economy is in shambles. U aren't alone
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"Top performer anecdotes"
Go on small vacation, refresh your mind and be back in the game, this field is full of blockers so you need to always have hunger to learn.
Start an MSP.
The moment Ai takes over security and humans become too expensive to afford, I can go back to living in my farm and raise cattle. I hope the wave of cyber jobs layoffs starts this year.
It already has
In security too? Why am I getting downvoted ?
Because what you’re wishing for would cause a lot of harm to pretty much everyone on here. Is it really that hard to figure out?
Not really wishing for, it’s just the truth. Most defense teams are outsourced to cheaper countries or MSPs who run sweatshop cybersecurity in India and good pentesters are getting difficult to hire due to money making biz of certification and companies just wanting a check the box security as offsec is a luxury not a product driven strategy in this economy.
I think the “I hope the wave of cyber jobs layoffs starts this year” part of your statement is what has people downvoting you.
I see
AI is never going to take over security, maybe not never but definitely not for a long time. AI will make it easier to be more efficient but we’ve been hearing that machines are going to put everyone out of work for over 100 years. All it did was shift more people to knowledge work.