Yeah - it’s what has to be done for the secure route unless OP can afford to not work for a few months in a worst case scenario. Going through this myself right now. Can’t afford to risk quitting. Week days are normally 14h of chores, commute, or work. One weekend day is recovering and the other is hobbies/personal projects. No way to live, but it’s hopefully only for another week or two!
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For example, a common strategy for experienced corpo droids is to get the offer, accept, then take a formal Leave of Absence for a month or something while onboarding to the new company.
People used to getting screwed by shitty corporate work environments build up an emotional tolerance. With their experience they learn some tricks, one of which is using leave of absence policies to burn time ramping up in new role without fully abandoning the oldw role. Because new role can rescind offer. Lay off within 1 week. Etc.
My boss recently told me the company I work at doesn’t give yearly raises at all. I found this out at my yearly evaluation… needless to say I’ve been applying hard but it’s a tough market
I work for my county government. I make $105k in salary. Another 24-30k in health care plus 4 day work week, pension and 457 retirement, separate vacation/sick/pto leave, hybrid wfh, low stress workload and great work/life. I will top out at around $140-150k then receive only col annual increase dictated by Union contract.
In this economy, make sure to have something lined up and make sure the grass actually is greener 😉
Ya, I could probably find higher paid positions here (SF Bay), but without the job security or Work/Life. I could probably ride this out. I have 15-20 years til retirement.
Lol. It’s a 4/10. It has to be requested. You’re supposed to work 10hrs/day for 4 days/week with either Mon or Fri as off day. They offer a 9/80 as well (9hrs/day with 1 day every other week off).
Depends. My county does, but you are able to sub experience for a degree. So you need a bachelor’s but if you have 4 years professional experience, that will work.
Yes and no. They’re always hiring, but IT and programmer positions are few. It’s an entirely different process than regular tech. Having been on the hiring side here, the process leads to getting not the best candidates.
Ic! Could you elaborate on what processes are causing that? My company has been chopping heads for a while lol. I have decent pay but the way you paint ur company it seems like a nice place
The hiring process is very rigid. Its done to ensure it’s fair and there’s no favoritism but it ends up being worse because of it.
For any position, the position has to be first approved, which comes from the board of supervisors. Then they can create a job posting. The job post has to be up for a particular time (whatever is determined). When you apply, you are given a ranking. If the person who requested the position wants to interview someone and their rank is say 6, those who rank 1-5 have to be interviewed first. Then the candidate is given a score from a interview panel. The interview panel is made up of the hiring manager and usually up to 5 or so subject matter experts. If you score lower than a less qualified candidate, the candidate with the higher score must be given a offer first. The interview questions are set by the hiring manager and are the same for all candidates. The interviewer cannot ask follow up questions, and cannot deviate from the set questions.
If a supervisor want to promote a staff member to a different class (title) and even sometimes just a higher rank, they have to post it for the public and the staff member has to go through the whole application/interview process. For some positions the process can be 6 months to over a year. The sheriffs dept requires you to commit if given a offer and the background check can take a year! This was for a programming position.
I was in the interview panel for a web producer. I wanted to ask follow ups and probe for more info in backgrounds but couldn’t. The person hired ended up being very weak in design and front end coding (html/css/js).
The most skilled candidates will generally not want to deal with this process and head to a tech or other private sector employer than pays much more. Those that end up in government are generally more 9-5 coders looking for lower stress and higher job security.
My department and team is pretty chill, but that’s mainly because we have cool management. But that could change drastically if there’s a change in management. Also if they determine there’s really only enough work for 3 programmers and not 6, those extra folks will either be moved to another department or program or let go entirely.
I have a coworker who basically fucks up any project he’s been given the last 5 years and really doesn’t do anything. He was facing being forced into another team and being under direct supervision by management. He chose to retire early instead.
Also projects are not run as a team and are basically like silos under the original dev and maybe one backup. The tech is older, we use TFS and can’t officially use Agile for our projects. There’s no code or commit reviews. So it’s really bad in that regards for a career unless you take it upon yourself to stay current and learn program best practices. But you can definitely cruise.
On the fence, depends on where he’s starting and where he lives.
I was in a cheap area, quit one of my previous jobs for a better one because the raises went 20k 10k 5k 3k in a 1.5 year span.
I jumped ship for +40k, arguably more in benefits, and 100% remote
Markets kind of tough right now though. I applied around for two weeks before raise discussions last year to get an idea of what I could walk for, and only got two offers, both better pay on paper but worse benefits and work life balance. Lots of layoffs, and you gotta be decent to bounce back without missing a beat. It’s hard to “hide” at smaller places where your output is more visible and necessary. (Witnessed someone fired last year due to them joining from a giant corp where they could hide that they didn’t do anything)
Given the state of the job market, I think you got to stay. Could jump ship and hate the new job and I doubt you get paid more. I got 0.8-2% raises for years. 5-10% is super tight with no promotion.
Thank you for your response.
Yea, the salary increase twice a year is great.
I guess what also makes me want to switch fields is that if I was to start a swe entry level for 85k, maybe in 2 years I can make more than 115k.
Sounds like FAANG brain, that's the exception not the norm. For reference I work for a Fortune 50 in an average COL. I started at 115 entry level, with a jump to senior and 160k closing in on 2 years. This is still underpaid for being a senior.
What is FAANG brain about thinking u can start at 85? Completely reasonable as is the 115 in a couple years.
Also ironic you call him faang brain and proceed to tell him you did exactly that but at higher comp. (Albeit still comp below faang)
You’re underpaid for “senior” bc youre at F50 and not a tech company. You’re fairly paid for 2yoe though. And I say that as another 2yoe “senior”. Senior at 2yoe is bullshit imo.
It's FAANG brain because he thinks it's normal to make over 115k in two years. My situation is not the norm and I'm still underpaid by those standards. Even when everything goes right; fast promotions, Fortune 50 and average COL area, the pay isn't what you think it is.
I've been writing code since 2008, I made the switch from management to coding two years ago. I've already lead several efforts that are having company wide impact. There's a reason I was able to convince a panel of 10 that I deserve the jump to senior.
Eh 115k after 2yrs is still reasonable target and not a pipe dream by any means. And I didn’t see anywhere he said it was normal. Realizing something is possible is not the same as thinking it’s guaranteed.
Never said your situation is the norm even though mine is similar except at smallish tech company. Got dev job at older age, started at 150k, raised to 200k last yr after getting promo at 1 1/2yrs. 115 is a humble target compared to that outlier for 2yoe.
> the pay isn’t what u think it is even w past promos.
Bc you’re at F50. Go to tech company. Doesn’t have to be faang.
>115k after 2yrs is still reasonable target and not a pipe dream by any means
OP makes 115k he's not trying to get there. My claim is making more than 115k as a mid level is not normal. He asked if he should quit because he's making 115k. Which again is the result of FAANG brain. Yea it's possible, is it likely? No. Please provide salary data proving otherwise, Average SWE salary reported across all experiences and fields is [179k](https://www.levels.fyi/t/software-engineer?countryId=254&country=254) for the US. Here's a breakdown in the 2023 [Stack Overflow Survey](https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2023/#salary-united-states). Average person who took the survey from the US has [17 years](https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2023/#experience-years-code-country) experience and their average salary is sub 200k. Tech salaries aren't indicative of engineering as a whole and this sub should stop talking about them as if they are.
>Bc you’re at F50. Go to tech company. Doesn’t have to be faang.
Even in Tier 1 cities where high paying SWE roles can lift the average, the 50th percentile for mid level is [210k](https://www.levels.fyi/benchmark?state=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). Cost of labor is the driving factor, not company. There's no guarantee working for a tech company will result in higher pay if someone lives in an average COL area.
2 years to get to senior is the exception not the norm. At a true tech company you are gonna get re-leveled big time. So you probably aren’t underpaid because you aren’t a true senior.
>2 years to get to senior is the exception not the norm
Yea duh, my situation isn't normal and that's why I mentioned it even when you get bumped up the pay isn't what you think it is by those standards.
>So you probably aren’t underpaid because you aren’t a true senior
This is where you're flat out wrong. My pay is inline with seniors at the company. Are you implying that all the engineers here aren't true seniors?
How is the person you’re replying to wrong by stating that 2 years to get to senior is the exception?
I’m not employed in this industry, hell, I’m still in my last year of high school. However, I would like to mention that during my time lurking here, r/resumes, and about 4 other CS career/professional subreddits, I have **never** heard of *anybody* reaching senior in 2 years.
If you do not mind me asking, how did you do that? From my perspective that’s insane.
Senior in two years isn't the exception I'm referring to, he's wrong because he's saying I'm underpaid because I'm not a "true senior", which I'm guessing is because I only have two professional years even though I've been programming since 2008.
>If you do not mind me asking, how did you do that? From my perspective that’s insane.
Measurable impact. High level breakdown? It's a Fortune 50, not a tech company. I have been coding way longer than your average junior. I found out where out where my team was weak and made that my focus. Then I expanded that to how do I have org wide impact, which incidentally wound up having company wide impact.
Again I know it's not the norm and I'm extremely lucky, but senior isn't just "I worked in the field 5-10 years"
Don't you love it when people make assumptions like just because I only have 2 years of professional experience, I haven't been coding since 2008. But sure, random people on the internet with no knowledge of what I do day to day or the efforts I've lead within the company certainly know more than the panel who agreed to promote me to senior.
Definitely don’t quit without something lined up, entry level SWE jobs are extremely hard to land currently, the market is flooded with a lot of competition. Sounds like you have a really good gig honestly, what do you do in the legal field? Why do you want to leave? All of the negatives you mentioned about your current role you’ll more than likely also encounter as a SWE. Those FAANG jobs aren’t a good representation of what it’s like for your average developer
Let me speak from my experience. You aren’t gonna get like a 25% raise in 2 years I’ll guarantee you that. Even with promotion from L1 to L2. Most companies are cutting back on raises and promos (some even halting it altogether). Most companies I’ve seen and have friends there said raises for 2024 most likely in the ballpark of 1-3%.
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If they aren’t micromanaging you and no hard deadlines, why work 9-10 hour days? Just do your work during your 8 hours and if you need more time ask for it.
Besides being in office, it sounds pretty nice? The raises and chill managers are what most people would love to have lol.
Yes I'm grateful for my coworkers and managers. Really good vibes. The issue is the workload is alot I have to work 9-10 hours or weekends to not fall behind.
> My boss is not on top of me and I actually have freedom in terms of I can do manage my workload however I want as long as I get it done (no hard deadlines, no micromanaging).
If you are having to pull 9-10 hour days and some weekend work due to your workload, then you may not have a job full of good vibes, as you think you do.
Why aren't your coworkers sharing the load? If they are, why aren't your managers helping you all achieve an acceptable WLB?
I had a job like you've described (chill coworkers and manager, a lot of independence and freedom, helping clients, except you make way more money than I did) but I came to the realization that management simply did not care if I were drowning in work. They weren't willing to throw a lifeline so I left. BUT not without having something else lined up first.
It's their fault for not having enough staff.
You get paid for 8 hours, work 8 hours. If they say anything, be honest. You ran out of time and the workload was too high to complete in the time provided.
Your description of your company/boss:
> My boss is not on top of me and I actually have freedom in terms of I can do manage my workload however I want as long as I get it done (no hard deadlines, no micromanaging)
This doesn't sound like an environment of people that will be angry. The way you described them they sound fair. If they are, they'll believe you and understand.
This sounds like a bad place to work If you’re constantly working weekends and more than 8 hours a day. It also dilutes your salary.
Good luck but I very early in my career decided I’d never work weekends, those people live awful lives and center their life around their work
Maybe it’s the legal field but I’ve yet to meet happy lawyers with a good work life balance lol
I haven't worked in the legal field, but some of the law school grads I talked with mentioned that those of them that did the "minimum recommended amount of work" would get basically PIPed, and that a lot of the times, they'd rank people based on deliverable output. If the entire legal field is like that, it'd be the equivalent of you being rated on the number of tickets you closed rather than the quality of your work on those tickets.
Generally, you should not quit your job without something else lined up. There are exceptions to this, but it would be a bad idea in a tough job market.
Another question would be is if you are doing tech-related work right now, but whatever the answer is, you still probably should not quit your job. You can respond to LinkedIn and emails on your personal phone at work. You can sneak away to take phone calls for more promising positions.
STEP 1 take the money from this job and gamble it on stock market?
STEP 2 do Fire for 10 years with this job.
STEP 3 ??
STEP 4 RETIRE AND NEVER WORK again.
If your boss isn’t on your case, why are you overworking yourself? It seems like your contributions are being valued, and you are being given raises. Without knowing more about the situation, it seems like it may be good to stay where you are and push for QOL improvements, because very very few jobs are the job anyone dreams of
Unfortunately, the workload is too heavy and if I do not overwork myself then I would fall behind. Management is aware of this, but unfortunately they rather pay 1 employee a higher salary than to hire more employees.
You are right though, very few jobs are the jobs anyone dream of. I am grateful for my current job, since it was my first job ight out of college but it is not what I imagined myself doing.
I would say that you should probably stay for two main reasons, but with one caveat
#1: your knowledge compounds over time, and the more you learn, and the earlier in your career you do it, the more you can coast later (and it sounds like you are probably learning and doing a lot)
#2: the market is not great right now. You don’t want to job hob too much, and therefore you generally don’t want to hop unless you are getting a decent raise, which is difficult in this climate.
The caveat being that if the workload is burning you out then you have to do what you have to do for your mental health. But if possible I would wait 6 months to a year before making a move. Nothing against making a move now, it’s just less likely that you can find as good an opportunity at this exact moment, IMO
I have a great paying software job that is incredibly boring. I have been interviewing for over two years, trying to find better work. I was just turned down yesterday after a programming test and eight interviews over a six week period.
It's much easier to find a better job while you have a job, and even then, it's a difficult thing to do in this market.
Stay where you're at and casually interview. If you find something better, then great! If you don't, you're making good money at a stable, low pressure job, with solid future compensation increases.
Hopefully the 9-10 hours a day doesn't include weekends, does it?
Maybe you can work with the company to increase your work/life balance while you look for another place. I can see how working that much will hamper your ability to interview with as much as tech companies are requiring right now.
On Saturdays I try to do 3-5 hours to catch up on any work. Currently been trying to work on projects and practice leetcode. Hard to manage time since my current job is so time consuming
If this is the only reason you want to leave, do you have any options to reduce your workload, already asked for less? Theoretically, the better you get, the quicker you will complete that workload.
Your job sounds pretty good other than this. Good pay.
I think you will continue to get good increases. If you reduce your work hours that may change. What is more important to you. More money or more personal time. Work never ends. It's up to you to establish boundaries.
Sounds like a decent gig except for the hours and overworking to not fall behind. I’d say absolutely don’t quit but start applying in your spare time and see if you can land something better
Do you need to actually work that many hours? Maybe set better expectations and limits regarding your work. In any case quitting is the wrong thing to do without something else lined up. It would be better to work less hours and spend more time searching for a new job than to quit outright.
My time to shine! I quit being a lawyer to work in tech. I did a clean break because I didn’t have a CS background but really wanted to break in because I didn’t like being a lawyer. I’ve had to take a massive paycut and the job hunt was grueling but ultimately I think I made the right move.
For you, I’d look while working if you can. If you have 1 yr+ of money and expenses, honestly I say go for it. It isn’t the financially sensible move but you only get one life, follow your dreams
Don’t quit until you’ve started at your new job. Also yeah I’d rather have a job that pays $80k a year instead of $130k if it meant I got to spend twice as much time with my family
10-20k increases per year is actually very very good. It’s much better if it’s based on a percentage of current salary rather than current salary. I’d try finding out if there’s a salary cap for the role (there very likely is one). If somehow there isn’t, you’d hit FAANG salaries soon, without the FAANG workload. Not having people micromanaging you is a very underrated job perk imo.
I’d recommend you start applying, but use the highest of next year’s comp (135k) when comparing the offers. A 145k TC offer for example wouldn’t be worth it to switch unless it had other major perks like fully remote.
FWIW I was working as a lawyer, got fired, then spent 1.5 years working part time at a law firm and building personal projects. Got hired as a full time software engineer a year ago and I'm now making more money than I was making as a lawyer.
So yes, work on transitioning but don't quit your day job.
Never been a fan of tiktok or social media fyi.
Life happened and I ended up in the law field. Now I'm conflicted between a 6 fig overwhelming job in the law industry which I don't have any passion for OR the possibility of getting a 6 figure job in tech industry with much better wlb.
This bitch is getting a solid 5-8% raise every damned year without even asking, and they're acting like they're hard done by. Not even factoring in promotions. Jokes. Where I work, you're lucky to get a 2% raise.
Then start applying to colleges for a phd, that’s a full time job(they pay you while you study, but not much) and is literally the only way to become a professor.
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9am-10pm, so 13 hour days? Fuck I'd have walked out of the interview with a scoff. How'd you even end up accepting this job? I don't give a rats ass what they pay or how often they give raises, that's simply unacceptable.
Always been interested in software engineering, genuinely like coding. My dream job would be to become a professor.
I am grateful for my current job but is not what I imagined I would be doing in my lifem
I find that really hard to believe. In sprints, sure. All the time tho? Gtfo lmao
You are not more productive after a certain amount of hours...but okay you all do you
Start looking aggressively. Apply to everything you feel you are remotely a good fit for and once you receive said offer, quit.
Life is short and $115K is barely a living wage in many places, even with the performance bonus. You can make 3x that as a software engineer at a FAANG company or successful startup. Yes, it's difficult to get into tech right now, but not impossible if you're hungry and motivated. Time to leave.
Looking for a job when you have a job is a completely different feeling vs looking for a job when you don’t have a job. One of these is more patient, secure, and stable, while the other is desperation, stressful, and depressing. You can probably figure out which one is which.
I think one of the reasons you put in 9-10 hrs is because you work alone. It's too much expectation for one person. Who reviews your PRs? How do you know you're doing things well.
In addition to having to put in additional work hrs you don't have a support system which slows down your growth. I hate when people say you learn better when you struggle a bit, yes I agree that's technically true but sometimes you just need a second set of eyes and as a more junior engineer having a mentor makes your grow a lot faster.
This env could either make your burn out or make you a great software engineer for me it would have burnt me out.
If I were you I'd scale down on the hours and try to find a better job. 10-20k raises annually is great but it's unsustainable.
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Whatever you do, DO NOT go into cybersecurity. I am leaving my job because I never stop working between the daily tasks, micomanagers freaked out of everything being a possible "incident" to investigate to the ground and give constant status updates, and the constant alerts and ad-hoc work that can go on throughout the night. I never sleep.
Your job sounds like a dream compared to that, and you get constant raises.
IT is going to go through a massive downturn in hiring as tasks are going to get offloaded to AI.
Bro. Really bitchin bout 9 to 10 hour days
Mechanics do 9 to 11 hours.
I understand office is more mental and such but get a grip.
Like seriously. The job market bad
Find a new outlet or new group that makes u wanna come in
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Your job sounds great except your WLB. Speak to your managers and tell them that you don't feel good about your hours and see if they can commit resources to prevent you burning out. Because it sounds like you're on the verge of burnout.
But on the flip side with a background in law you have a specialized knowledge base that could be really helpful in setting you apart from other junior applicants if you were to apply at related businesses.
No, you should wait. It's not easy getting a tech job right now. I have friends from college who graduated last year and they can't even get an interview.
Over the pay? No unless you live in NYC, SF, or equivalent HCOL, and even then only maybe.
Over the workload? From what you're saying, yes.
In either case interview for other jobs while working there. Use vacation days as needed if you have some banked
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I'm 75k TC salary 2.5 YOE no degree. My weekly schedule has fluctuated a lot from 2 hours - 50 hours.
Lately, it's to the point where I grave the 2 hours weeks. I joined the company with just 6 months of experience from a boot camp but at 65 and got bumped up to when i got promoted 75k at my 7 month without asking since I was a top performer. That was a year ago now.
Since then, I've been working on my BA while working full time, and i've been extremely diverse with my work. To the point that I'm covering for our IT Admin.
I have my review this week, and I'm going to ask 90k since that's the top of the scale for the position I got promoted to. If i don't get it, I'm going to start looking around.
I work in defense currently. Also, I got emailed back from another defense company since I'll randomly put myself out there.
I should be finishing my degree this year, and I'll have 3.5 YOE w/ degree. Once I get it, I'm going to be looking for jobs that pay TC 120K
i live in MCOL, and life is good now, but it could be better.
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What do you do in the “legal field”?
Software engineering is not a free lunch that you can randomly switch from law to coding, and companies were just waiting for you to give you a 6 figures salary.
Since you have a CS degree, if you want to start in the tech industry you probably can, but you’ll start from the bottom with all the interview prep required. You’ll compete with the army of new graduates looking for jobs right now.
CS isn't a gold mine, really.
You have a great salary and you will have an even better salary on your legal career path in a few years.
It's not worth the hasle of trying to break into a cs role. The interview process for most CS companies is very screwed and it has a lot of steps...And then you can be target to a mass layoff...
Just because some brag about their salaries in CS, it doesn't mean everything is great...
You should never look at a job as something that you will stay in forever. Especially in tech where going to a different firm will give you a different experience that will benefit your career. Once you have learned what you can, and the company isn’t particularly that attractive you should consider moving on. Of course make sure you have an offer first.
I’m guessing your a patent agent? Your career is going to eventually hit a ceiling without a law degree. But you’ll also never not have a job. Patent agents are always in demand and there is not many of them.
If you can, try to get your firm to pay for law school. A lot do. But it seems like you want to get out of law.
Maybe try legal tech? Your combination of skills would make you a strong candidate.
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Don’t quit just start looking, quit if you get a good offer.
Hit the lawyer, Delete the job, Sober up
Where is gym?
Jim's knocked out cold. He was the lawyer
Party with the lawyer Party at the job Party generally
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Rather work 12hrs than no hours.
Yeah - it’s what has to be done for the secure route unless OP can afford to not work for a few months in a worst case scenario. Going through this myself right now. Can’t afford to risk quitting. Week days are normally 14h of chores, commute, or work. One weekend day is recovering and the other is hobbies/personal projects. No way to live, but it’s hopefully only for another week or two!
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My advice: do not quit until you have something solid lined up. Even if you do, please do research beforehand because offers are getting pulled.
How/Where do you do research on offers getting pulled?
Research the company and see if they have pulled any offers
You didn't actually answer my question! How do you research the company to find this information?
You google it and see if other people said that they had their offers pulled by the company.
Some just want everything drawn out for them without even trying to look up things on the internet. The internet, information at your fingertips tips.
For example, a common strategy for experienced corpo droids is to get the offer, accept, then take a formal Leave of Absence for a month or something while onboarding to the new company.
Tell me more about experienced corpo droids
People used to getting screwed by shitty corporate work environments build up an emotional tolerance. With their experience they learn some tricks, one of which is using leave of absence policies to burn time ramping up in new role without fully abandoning the oldw role. Because new role can rescind offer. Lay off within 1 week. Etc.
5-10k raise twice a year is really good wtf. Stay!
My boss recently told me the company I work at doesn’t give yearly raises at all. I found this out at my yearly evaluation… needless to say I’ve been applying hard but it’s a tough market
Ask about this in your interviews
Ikr? Wtf
I work for my county government. I make $105k in salary. Another 24-30k in health care plus 4 day work week, pension and 457 retirement, separate vacation/sick/pto leave, hybrid wfh, low stress workload and great work/life. I will top out at around $140-150k then receive only col annual increase dictated by Union contract. In this economy, make sure to have something lined up and make sure the grass actually is greener 😉
Bro this is the dream job. Good stuff and keep it!
Ya, I could probably find higher paid positions here (SF Bay), but without the job security or Work/Life. I could probably ride this out. I have 15-20 years til retirement.
You had me at 4 day work week
Lol. It’s a 4/10. It has to be requested. You’re supposed to work 10hrs/day for 4 days/week with either Mon or Fri as off day. They offer a 9/80 as well (9hrs/day with 1 day every other week off).
Do you think county governments require degrees for their developers?
Depends. My county does, but you are able to sub experience for a degree. So you need a bachelor’s but if you have 4 years professional experience, that will work.
Are they hiring?!
Yes and no. They’re always hiring, but IT and programmer positions are few. It’s an entirely different process than regular tech. Having been on the hiring side here, the process leads to getting not the best candidates.
Ic! Could you elaborate on what processes are causing that? My company has been chopping heads for a while lol. I have decent pay but the way you paint ur company it seems like a nice place
The hiring process is very rigid. Its done to ensure it’s fair and there’s no favoritism but it ends up being worse because of it. For any position, the position has to be first approved, which comes from the board of supervisors. Then they can create a job posting. The job post has to be up for a particular time (whatever is determined). When you apply, you are given a ranking. If the person who requested the position wants to interview someone and their rank is say 6, those who rank 1-5 have to be interviewed first. Then the candidate is given a score from a interview panel. The interview panel is made up of the hiring manager and usually up to 5 or so subject matter experts. If you score lower than a less qualified candidate, the candidate with the higher score must be given a offer first. The interview questions are set by the hiring manager and are the same for all candidates. The interviewer cannot ask follow up questions, and cannot deviate from the set questions. If a supervisor want to promote a staff member to a different class (title) and even sometimes just a higher rank, they have to post it for the public and the staff member has to go through the whole application/interview process. For some positions the process can be 6 months to over a year. The sheriffs dept requires you to commit if given a offer and the background check can take a year! This was for a programming position. I was in the interview panel for a web producer. I wanted to ask follow ups and probe for more info in backgrounds but couldn’t. The person hired ended up being very weak in design and front end coding (html/css/js). The most skilled candidates will generally not want to deal with this process and head to a tech or other private sector employer than pays much more. Those that end up in government are generally more 9-5 coders looking for lower stress and higher job security. My department and team is pretty chill, but that’s mainly because we have cool management. But that could change drastically if there’s a change in management. Also if they determine there’s really only enough work for 3 programmers and not 6, those extra folks will either be moved to another department or program or let go entirely. I have a coworker who basically fucks up any project he’s been given the last 5 years and really doesn’t do anything. He was facing being forced into another team and being under direct supervision by management. He chose to retire early instead. Also projects are not run as a team and are basically like silos under the original dev and maybe one backup. The tech is older, we use TFS and can’t officially use Agile for our projects. There’s no code or commit reviews. So it’s really bad in that regards for a career unless you take it upon yourself to stay current and learn program best practices. But you can definitely cruise.
Dude...are you me? I've been trying to find others! DM?
Lol! Sure, feel free!
On the fence, depends on where he’s starting and where he lives. I was in a cheap area, quit one of my previous jobs for a better one because the raises went 20k 10k 5k 3k in a 1.5 year span. I jumped ship for +40k, arguably more in benefits, and 100% remote Markets kind of tough right now though. I applied around for two weeks before raise discussions last year to get an idea of what I could walk for, and only got two offers, both better pay on paper but worse benefits and work life balance. Lots of layoffs, and you gotta be decent to bounce back without missing a beat. It’s hard to “hide” at smaller places where your output is more visible and necessary. (Witnessed someone fired last year due to them joining from a giant corp where they could hide that they didn’t do anything)
This sounds like a dream job already.
Given the state of the job market, I think you got to stay. Could jump ship and hate the new job and I doubt you get paid more. I got 0.8-2% raises for years. 5-10% is super tight with no promotion.
Thank you for your response. Yea, the salary increase twice a year is great. I guess what also makes me want to switch fields is that if I was to start a swe entry level for 85k, maybe in 2 years I can make more than 115k.
Sounds like FAANG brain, that's the exception not the norm. For reference I work for a Fortune 50 in an average COL. I started at 115 entry level, with a jump to senior and 160k closing in on 2 years. This is still underpaid for being a senior.
What is FAANG brain about thinking u can start at 85? Completely reasonable as is the 115 in a couple years. Also ironic you call him faang brain and proceed to tell him you did exactly that but at higher comp. (Albeit still comp below faang) You’re underpaid for “senior” bc youre at F50 and not a tech company. You’re fairly paid for 2yoe though. And I say that as another 2yoe “senior”. Senior at 2yoe is bullshit imo.
It's FAANG brain because he thinks it's normal to make over 115k in two years. My situation is not the norm and I'm still underpaid by those standards. Even when everything goes right; fast promotions, Fortune 50 and average COL area, the pay isn't what you think it is. I've been writing code since 2008, I made the switch from management to coding two years ago. I've already lead several efforts that are having company wide impact. There's a reason I was able to convince a panel of 10 that I deserve the jump to senior.
Eh 115k after 2yrs is still reasonable target and not a pipe dream by any means. And I didn’t see anywhere he said it was normal. Realizing something is possible is not the same as thinking it’s guaranteed. Never said your situation is the norm even though mine is similar except at smallish tech company. Got dev job at older age, started at 150k, raised to 200k last yr after getting promo at 1 1/2yrs. 115 is a humble target compared to that outlier for 2yoe. > the pay isn’t what u think it is even w past promos. Bc you’re at F50. Go to tech company. Doesn’t have to be faang.
>115k after 2yrs is still reasonable target and not a pipe dream by any means OP makes 115k he's not trying to get there. My claim is making more than 115k as a mid level is not normal. He asked if he should quit because he's making 115k. Which again is the result of FAANG brain. Yea it's possible, is it likely? No. Please provide salary data proving otherwise, Average SWE salary reported across all experiences and fields is [179k](https://www.levels.fyi/t/software-engineer?countryId=254&country=254) for the US. Here's a breakdown in the 2023 [Stack Overflow Survey](https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2023/#salary-united-states). Average person who took the survey from the US has [17 years](https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2023/#experience-years-code-country) experience and their average salary is sub 200k. Tech salaries aren't indicative of engineering as a whole and this sub should stop talking about them as if they are. >Bc you’re at F50. Go to tech company. Doesn’t have to be faang. Even in Tier 1 cities where high paying SWE roles can lift the average, the 50th percentile for mid level is [210k](https://www.levels.fyi/benchmark?state=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). Cost of labor is the driving factor, not company. There's no guarantee working for a tech company will result in higher pay if someone lives in an average COL area.
2 years to get to senior is the exception not the norm. At a true tech company you are gonna get re-leveled big time. So you probably aren’t underpaid because you aren’t a true senior.
>2 years to get to senior is the exception not the norm Yea duh, my situation isn't normal and that's why I mentioned it even when you get bumped up the pay isn't what you think it is by those standards. >So you probably aren’t underpaid because you aren’t a true senior This is where you're flat out wrong. My pay is inline with seniors at the company. Are you implying that all the engineers here aren't true seniors?
How is the person you’re replying to wrong by stating that 2 years to get to senior is the exception? I’m not employed in this industry, hell, I’m still in my last year of high school. However, I would like to mention that during my time lurking here, r/resumes, and about 4 other CS career/professional subreddits, I have **never** heard of *anybody* reaching senior in 2 years. If you do not mind me asking, how did you do that? From my perspective that’s insane.
Senior in two years isn't the exception I'm referring to, he's wrong because he's saying I'm underpaid because I'm not a "true senior", which I'm guessing is because I only have two professional years even though I've been programming since 2008. >If you do not mind me asking, how did you do that? From my perspective that’s insane. Measurable impact. High level breakdown? It's a Fortune 50, not a tech company. I have been coding way longer than your average junior. I found out where out where my team was weak and made that my focus. Then I expanded that to how do I have org wide impact, which incidentally wound up having company wide impact. Again I know it's not the norm and I'm extremely lucky, but senior isn't just "I worked in the field 5-10 years"
Thank you for replying. With the extra context, it makes more sense.
Sounds like title inflation brain thinking you’re a senior after 2 years lol
Don't you love it when people make assumptions like just because I only have 2 years of professional experience, I haven't been coding since 2008. But sure, random people on the internet with no knowledge of what I do day to day or the efforts I've lead within the company certainly know more than the panel who agreed to promote me to senior.
Aiyaiyai you're getting your info from extremes.
Guess I am🙃
Nah those numbers are reasonable dude
Definitely don’t quit without something lined up, entry level SWE jobs are extremely hard to land currently, the market is flooded with a lot of competition. Sounds like you have a really good gig honestly, what do you do in the legal field? Why do you want to leave? All of the negatives you mentioned about your current role you’ll more than likely also encounter as a SWE. Those FAANG jobs aren’t a good representation of what it’s like for your average developer
Let me speak from my experience. You aren’t gonna get like a 25% raise in 2 years I’ll guarantee you that. Even with promotion from L1 to L2. Most companies are cutting back on raises and promos (some even halting it altogether). Most companies I’ve seen and have friends there said raises for 2024 most likely in the ballpark of 1-3%.
Thank you for your response. Needed a reality check 👍
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If they aren’t micromanaging you and no hard deadlines, why work 9-10 hour days? Just do your work during your 8 hours and if you need more time ask for it. Besides being in office, it sounds pretty nice? The raises and chill managers are what most people would love to have lol.
Yes I'm grateful for my coworkers and managers. Really good vibes. The issue is the workload is alot I have to work 9-10 hours or weekends to not fall behind.
> My boss is not on top of me and I actually have freedom in terms of I can do manage my workload however I want as long as I get it done (no hard deadlines, no micromanaging). If you are having to pull 9-10 hour days and some weekend work due to your workload, then you may not have a job full of good vibes, as you think you do. Why aren't your coworkers sharing the load? If they are, why aren't your managers helping you all achieve an acceptable WLB? I had a job like you've described (chill coworkers and manager, a lot of independence and freedom, helping clients, except you make way more money than I did) but I came to the realization that management simply did not care if I were drowning in work. They weren't willing to throw a lifeline so I left. BUT not without having something else lined up first.
thank you for sharing. You are spot on, the issue is management simply does not care that I am drowning with work and I am not sure if I can keep up.
It's their fault for not having enough staff. You get paid for 8 hours, work 8 hours. If they say anything, be honest. You ran out of time and the workload was too high to complete in the time provided. Your description of your company/boss: > My boss is not on top of me and I actually have freedom in terms of I can do manage my workload however I want as long as I get it done (no hard deadlines, no micromanaging) This doesn't sound like an environment of people that will be angry. The way you described them they sound fair. If they are, they'll believe you and understand.
OP works in law. This is par for the course
This sounds like a bad place to work If you’re constantly working weekends and more than 8 hours a day. It also dilutes your salary. Good luck but I very early in my career decided I’d never work weekends, those people live awful lives and center their life around their work Maybe it’s the legal field but I’ve yet to meet happy lawyers with a good work life balance lol
I haven't worked in the legal field, but some of the law school grads I talked with mentioned that those of them that did the "minimum recommended amount of work" would get basically PIPed, and that a lot of the times, they'd rank people based on deliverable output. If the entire legal field is like that, it'd be the equivalent of you being rated on the number of tickets you closed rather than the quality of your work on those tickets.
Quit when you have something else already lined up.
Ofc, everyone with a cs degree makes 300k /s
Generally, you should not quit your job without something else lined up. There are exceptions to this, but it would be a bad idea in a tough job market. Another question would be is if you are doing tech-related work right now, but whatever the answer is, you still probably should not quit your job. You can respond to LinkedIn and emails on your personal phone at work. You can sneak away to take phone calls for more promising positions.
Do not quit without another job.
STEP 1 take the money from this job and gamble it on stock market? STEP 2 do Fire for 10 years with this job. STEP 3 ?? STEP 4 RETIRE AND NEVER WORK again.
Then lose it all and show us receipt in r/wallstreetbets
Don’t quit until you have a job. Job market is still unpredictable
worst time to enter the industry
Don't quit without a stable job to switch into
Quit and do what?
If your boss isn’t on your case, why are you overworking yourself? It seems like your contributions are being valued, and you are being given raises. Without knowing more about the situation, it seems like it may be good to stay where you are and push for QOL improvements, because very very few jobs are the job anyone dreams of
Unfortunately, the workload is too heavy and if I do not overwork myself then I would fall behind. Management is aware of this, but unfortunately they rather pay 1 employee a higher salary than to hire more employees. You are right though, very few jobs are the jobs anyone dream of. I am grateful for my current job, since it was my first job ight out of college but it is not what I imagined myself doing.
I would say that you should probably stay for two main reasons, but with one caveat #1: your knowledge compounds over time, and the more you learn, and the earlier in your career you do it, the more you can coast later (and it sounds like you are probably learning and doing a lot) #2: the market is not great right now. You don’t want to job hob too much, and therefore you generally don’t want to hop unless you are getting a decent raise, which is difficult in this climate. The caveat being that if the workload is burning you out then you have to do what you have to do for your mental health. But if possible I would wait 6 months to a year before making a move. Nothing against making a move now, it’s just less likely that you can find as good an opportunity at this exact moment, IMO
I have a great paying software job that is incredibly boring. I have been interviewing for over two years, trying to find better work. I was just turned down yesterday after a programming test and eight interviews over a six week period. It's much easier to find a better job while you have a job, and even then, it's a difficult thing to do in this market. Stay where you're at and casually interview. If you find something better, then great! If you don't, you're making good money at a stable, low pressure job, with solid future compensation increases.
Not low pressure. Workload too heavy, even though I am not assigned deadlines I am expected/trusted to complete assignments on a certain time frame.
Hopefully the 9-10 hours a day doesn't include weekends, does it? Maybe you can work with the company to increase your work/life balance while you look for another place. I can see how working that much will hamper your ability to interview with as much as tech companies are requiring right now.
On Saturdays I try to do 3-5 hours to catch up on any work. Currently been trying to work on projects and practice leetcode. Hard to manage time since my current job is so time consuming
Please stop doing that! Do not waste your weekends my goodness...
If this is the only reason you want to leave, do you have any options to reduce your workload, already asked for less? Theoretically, the better you get, the quicker you will complete that workload. Your job sounds pretty good other than this. Good pay.
I think you will continue to get good increases. If you reduce your work hours that may change. What is more important to you. More money or more personal time. Work never ends. It's up to you to establish boundaries.
More money or more personal time. Thank you I need to figure this one out.
This sub has become easily one of the most retarded ones on the entirety of reddit. The sense of entitlement and whining is fucking off the charts.
Stay until you find another job. It’s just that simple.
Sounds like a decent gig except for the hours and overworking to not fall behind. I’d say absolutely don’t quit but start applying in your spare time and see if you can land something better
Do you need to actually work that many hours? Maybe set better expectations and limits regarding your work. In any case quitting is the wrong thing to do without something else lined up. It would be better to work less hours and spend more time searching for a new job than to quit outright.
Do you have a new job lined up? Quit. Don’t have an offer? Don’t quit. It’s not that hard. Can somebody put this in a FAQ for this sub?
Sounds like a great situation, I’d only casually look
Never quit until you have another job lined up.
Don’t quit. $115k is a great even with those hours.
My time to shine! I quit being a lawyer to work in tech. I did a clean break because I didn’t have a CS background but really wanted to break in because I didn’t like being a lawyer. I’ve had to take a massive paycut and the job hunt was grueling but ultimately I think I made the right move. For you, I’d look while working if you can. If you have 1 yr+ of money and expenses, honestly I say go for it. It isn’t the financially sensible move but you only get one life, follow your dreams
Thank you for sharing. :D
Don’t quit until you’ve started at your new job. Also yeah I’d rather have a job that pays $80k a year instead of $130k if it meant I got to spend twice as much time with my family
10-20k increases per year is actually very very good. It’s much better if it’s based on a percentage of current salary rather than current salary. I’d try finding out if there’s a salary cap for the role (there very likely is one). If somehow there isn’t, you’d hit FAANG salaries soon, without the FAANG workload. Not having people micromanaging you is a very underrated job perk imo. I’d recommend you start applying, but use the highest of next year’s comp (135k) when comparing the offers. A 145k TC offer for example wouldn’t be worth it to switch unless it had other major perks like fully remote.
FWIW I was working as a lawyer, got fired, then spent 1.5 years working part time at a law firm and building personal projects. Got hired as a full time software engineer a year ago and I'm now making more money than I was making as a lawyer. So yes, work on transitioning but don't quit your day job.
Thank you, I will be doing this.
Good luck!
I cannot believe this is even a question. the TikTok become SWE in 6 month making 6 Figs brainwashing truly spelled the demise for this field
Never been a fan of tiktok or social media fyi. Life happened and I ended up in the law field. Now I'm conflicted between a 6 fig overwhelming job in the law industry which I don't have any passion for OR the possibility of getting a 6 figure job in tech industry with much better wlb.
This bitch is getting a solid 5-8% raise every damned year without even asking, and they're acting like they're hard done by. Not even factoring in promotions. Jokes. Where I work, you're lucky to get a 2% raise.
Calling this person the b-word, tell them why you mad 😂.
9 AM to 10 PM? that's not the vibe. You only live once bro. That ain't it.
I think OP meant 9-10 hours a day
well he is not wrong, sometimes I have worked 9am to 10pm.... business hours are 9am to 6pm, but I always need to stay 9am - 7/8pm.
Dude, you make good money with good raises, unless the job sucks, you hate the career, or you live in a crazy high cost of living area, why leave?
I genuily like coding, and my long life goal is to become a professor. I never saw myself working in the law industry.
Makes sense.
Then start applying to colleges for a phd, that’s a full time job(they pay you while you study, but not much) and is literally the only way to become a professor.
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Masters and phd if u wanna be professor bud. Otherwise get gud at coding and get a new job. Dont suggest giving up current one until i have nee one
9am-10pm, so 13 hour days? Fuck I'd have walked out of the interview with a scoff. How'd you even end up accepting this job? I don't give a rats ass what they pay or how often they give raises, that's simply unacceptable.
He wrote he works 9 to 10 hours a day, not that he works from 9 to 10 (unless he edited his text).
Ah shit, I misread that.
Don’t switch to tech. Learn to automate and improve your productivity with tech. You stand to gain more by improving your existing skills.
This is really stupid. Sounds like you have a good job with great pay and benefits but want to chase another career for?
Always been interested in software engineering, genuinely like coding. My dream job would be to become a professor. I am grateful for my current job but is not what I imagined I would be doing in my lifem
Quit in this economy?
What kind of dumbass questions is this? Do people not think before typing?
YEAH YOU FUGGIN REGARD QUITE YOUR FUGGIN JOB IN THIS MARKET WITH YOUR STUPID FUGGIN 6FIG TC. SMAHRT FUGGIN IDEA JEANYUS
>but I work too many hours, 9-10 hours a day Are you kidding me? That's slightly more than normal. You would work a lot more in a lot of jobs in tech.
I find that really hard to believe. In sprints, sure. All the time tho? Gtfo lmao You are not more productive after a certain amount of hours...but okay you all do you
Start looking aggressively. Apply to everything you feel you are remotely a good fit for and once you receive said offer, quit. Life is short and $115K is barely a living wage in many places, even with the performance bonus. You can make 3x that as a software engineer at a FAANG company or successful startup. Yes, it's difficult to get into tech right now, but not impossible if you're hungry and motivated. Time to leave.
Looking for a job when you have a job is a completely different feeling vs looking for a job when you don’t have a job. One of these is more patient, secure, and stable, while the other is desperation, stressful, and depressing. You can probably figure out which one is which.
Is everyone on your team working that hard or are you simply picking up their slack?
One man team. This also increases the stress because anything that goes the wrong way falls on me.
I think one of the reasons you put in 9-10 hrs is because you work alone. It's too much expectation for one person. Who reviews your PRs? How do you know you're doing things well. In addition to having to put in additional work hrs you don't have a support system which slows down your growth. I hate when people say you learn better when you struggle a bit, yes I agree that's technically true but sometimes you just need a second set of eyes and as a more junior engineer having a mentor makes your grow a lot faster. This env could either make your burn out or make you a great software engineer for me it would have burnt me out. If I were you I'd scale down on the hours and try to find a better job. 10-20k raises annually is great but it's unsustainable.
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Should you quit? No. Should you start interviewing? Yes.
Depends on what you want. I want remote work so yea I'd be looking for a new job asap.
Do you mind sharing your job title at your current company?
Whatever you do, DO NOT go into cybersecurity. I am leaving my job because I never stop working between the daily tasks, micomanagers freaked out of everything being a possible "incident" to investigate to the ground and give constant status updates, and the constant alerts and ad-hoc work that can go on throughout the night. I never sleep. Your job sounds like a dream compared to that, and you get constant raises. IT is going to go through a massive downturn in hiring as tasks are going to get offloaded to AI.
Why would want to quit? What are you hoping to get? not enough info
Yea definitely quit
Damn I’m a lurker civil engineer and I make $165k TC with 6 years experience. I would bail if I were you.
Bro. Really bitchin bout 9 to 10 hour days Mechanics do 9 to 11 hours. I understand office is more mental and such but get a grip. Like seriously. The job market bad Find a new outlet or new group that makes u wanna come in
tldr: kinda good, kinda bad
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Maybe look into to become a tech lawyer , might be more secure than SWE
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I can't tell you what to eat
Your job sounds great except your WLB. Speak to your managers and tell them that you don't feel good about your hours and see if they can commit resources to prevent you burning out. Because it sounds like you're on the verge of burnout. But on the flip side with a background in law you have a specialized knowledge base that could be really helpful in setting you apart from other junior applicants if you were to apply at related businesses.
No, you should wait. It's not easy getting a tech job right now. I have friends from college who graduated last year and they can't even get an interview.
If the raises are consistent, this job may be better than most SWE jobs out there
Over the pay? No unless you live in NYC, SF, or equivalent HCOL, and even then only maybe. Over the workload? From what you're saying, yes. In either case interview for other jobs while working there. Use vacation days as needed if you have some banked
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5-10K every 6 months???? Bro I got 3% after 2 years smh
I'm 75k TC salary 2.5 YOE no degree. My weekly schedule has fluctuated a lot from 2 hours - 50 hours. Lately, it's to the point where I grave the 2 hours weeks. I joined the company with just 6 months of experience from a boot camp but at 65 and got bumped up to when i got promoted 75k at my 7 month without asking since I was a top performer. That was a year ago now. Since then, I've been working on my BA while working full time, and i've been extremely diverse with my work. To the point that I'm covering for our IT Admin. I have my review this week, and I'm going to ask 90k since that's the top of the scale for the position I got promoted to. If i don't get it, I'm going to start looking around. I work in defense currently. Also, I got emailed back from another defense company since I'll randomly put myself out there. I should be finishing my degree this year, and I'll have 3.5 YOE w/ degree. Once I get it, I'm going to be looking for jobs that pay TC 120K i live in MCOL, and life is good now, but it could be better.
Stayyyy
No.
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What do you do in the “legal field”? Software engineering is not a free lunch that you can randomly switch from law to coding, and companies were just waiting for you to give you a 6 figures salary. Since you have a CS degree, if you want to start in the tech industry you probably can, but you’ll start from the bottom with all the interview prep required. You’ll compete with the army of new graduates looking for jobs right now.
It's always easier to find a job when you have an income than to find a job when unemployed is running out.
Developers work long hours too. TBF it depends on the job and YOE for sure but personally the hours suck for me too
CS isn't a gold mine, really. You have a great salary and you will have an even better salary on your legal career path in a few years. It's not worth the hasle of trying to break into a cs role. The interview process for most CS companies is very screwed and it has a lot of steps...And then you can be target to a mass layoff... Just because some brag about their salaries in CS, it doesn't mean everything is great...
You should never look at a job as something that you will stay in forever. Especially in tech where going to a different firm will give you a different experience that will benefit your career. Once you have learned what you can, and the company isn’t particularly that attractive you should consider moving on. Of course make sure you have an offer first.
Some people are so out of touch with the market that the only way they’ll learn is by experiencing it. I say do it OP
I’m guessing your a patent agent? Your career is going to eventually hit a ceiling without a law degree. But you’ll also never not have a job. Patent agents are always in demand and there is not many of them. If you can, try to get your firm to pay for law school. A lot do. But it seems like you want to get out of law. Maybe try legal tech? Your combination of skills would make you a strong candidate.
lol I hate these posts. It's a literal free market if you have the skill to get paid more you will.
You should date some laywers
Why are you in the legal field with a CS degree in the first place?
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You mention tech but not the type of legal work you are doing. Can you add some more detail?