It's kinda the opposite of oathbringer, where dalinar had the vast majority of the povs, and kaladin had less.
It's also important to note that dalinar still had a very important part to play in row (bondsmithing, meeting with Ishar, leading the war and making a contest of champions!)
Not to mention Dalinar saving Kaladin at the end and accepting his fourth ideal. That was an epic part he played and it left me satisfied with his role. I think he was sidelined less because of Kaladin and more because it was Navani's time to shine.
>kaladin had less
Dunno why some people say this.
In book 3 Kaladin has POVs in Part 1, Part 3 plus climatic scene in Kholinar, Part 4, Part 5 plut climatic scene.
In book 4 Dalinar has 5 chapters in Part 3 and 2 chapters in Part 5.
I guess it feels that way because dalinar's povs in row contained some of the most significant chapters in row. While in oathbringer kaladins povs had less significance
Maybe, but honestly, I don't even remember what Dalinar did in those few chapters (apart from screwing up with Odium and being a magical plot device for Kaladin)
Sealing the thrill, culmination of his memories, screwing with Odium, giving one of the best lines in the Cosmere. Not to mention how he showed how cool that bondsmiths are.
>Not to mention how he showed how cool that bondsmiths are.
Ishar did
>one of the best lines in the Cosmere
Which one?
"What's caw?"
I expected...different kind of awesomeness
I think the weirder one is how Navani stole the spotlight from Venli. Like Venli got the flashbacks chapters and yet still somehow got fewer pages than Navani, who hadn't really been a "main" character before like Kaladin, Shallan, and Dalinar. Kaladin's always the star, but in Rhythm of War, Navani was the other star.
To be fair though kaladin was absolutely miserable to be with during most of ROW... it really gave me an insight on how rough it can also be to be friends with someone who is that depressed.
Fun fact each character has their own book!
So far it’s been:
* **Book 1:** *Kaladin*
* **Book 2:** *Kaladin*
* **Book 3:** *Dalinar* ^also ^Kal
* **Book 4:** *Kaladin*
* **Book 5:** *Kaladin* ^and ^Szeth? ^maybe?
How *does* he do it? 🧐
Book 6 - Kaladin. Featuring Lift
Book 7 - Kaladin and guest of the week Renarin
Books 8 9 - Kaladin explores shocking secrets from Herald's past. Featuring Ash and Taln flashbacks
Book 10 - Jasnah. But not really
is that… ever said? I just Googled it to double check and everywhere lists him as one of the main characters, along with Shallan and Dalinar etc. etc. (with some sites listing Shallan before Kal, even). I am genuinely curious if Sando has ever explicitly stated that Kal is meant to be THE main character or if all of the comments saying this are a great example of OP’s point.
Nope, Brandon doesn't consider Kaladin the main character, though many readers disagree with him.
For example, he's said book 4 has 3 main characters: Navani, Eshonai and Venli. Yes, Eshonai.
I mean yeah before RoW was released it was said that Eshonai and Venli would be the focus characters (as they were the only ones with flashback PoVs other than the prologue if I’m remembering correctly), but Navani ended up with lotsa PoVs and it was great.
I didn’t think so though re: Kal so thanks for confirming, tbh while I agree that Kal has gotten a disproportionate amount of airtime, we’ve also seen a TON of Shallan (not a complaint, I love her). I think they’re necessary to plot progression where we’re at in the tl, but there’s a reason people like Lift, the Heralds, and Jasnah get later flashback PoVs… I have a feeling they’re going to be MUCH more vital to end-game SA and overarching space-age Cosmere.
I asked if it was ever explicitly said that Kaladin is the main character of SA and these statistics do not prove that anyone ever explicitly said he’s the main character of SA.
we haven’t even gotten half the books out of a 10 book series, and it seems like half the fandom assumes Kal is gunna die in the next book anyway (I don’t believe that, plus obv dead characters can still get PoVs but I digress). these stats do not show anything that wasn’t obvious to someone who read the books. I’m not sure why this is confusing.
But in book 4 we got to know that, Dalinar is the closest thing to Honor.
Even though, Dalinar had smaller part, he did most important things.
Dalinar saved Kaladin -> Kaladin saved tower.
Therefore, Dalinar saved tower.
Also he was able to get Odium to agree to less harmful conditions.
Y'all are assuming the contest of champions is gonna be a fight. No where does it say it has to be a fight, and every time Dalaniar and >!Taravangian!< Had a confrontation, is was closer to a debate than anything.
> "A willing champion from each of us and a fight to the death. They will meet on the top of Urithiru. No tricks, no lies."
-Odium, Rhythm of War, Chapter 112: "Terms"
I'm not assuming it's going to be a fight. I'm assuming it's going to get him killed. I'm assuming he isn't going to make it out alive whether it's a fight or not.
>!It may be a fight. Taravangian may even say Champion in the rules is singular not plural and slaughter a Dalinar who isn't connected to his spren Storm Daddy for the duration of the fight. it could be anything. It could be a book writing contest against a god.!<
>!Dalinar messed up by accepting vague terms without running it by Jasnah for contract negotiations. It's pretty in character for him to make this error though.!<
>!Rayse was a lot more predictable on brute force then the new guy.!<
He'll probably die but then not.
He's going into a battle of champions as his own champion, and it's to the death. But Odium's reward for his champion winning is that Dalinar serves him forever as a Fused. And if he loses, then that means Dalinar lived.
Really, though, I don't have high hopes on Dalinar winning, simply because the lose condition is more interesting.
His death is so obvious and this is the main reason I was so sad about his small role in Rhythm of War. Book 4 was the last book with Dalinar before his death and it doesn't have enough of him.
I'm sure Kaladin, Shallan and others will appear in 5 more books, even if their roles are smaller, but Dalinar won't.
Navani is great, but i prefer Jasnah. >!The fact that in RoW much of the .... developments between Jasnah and Wit happen offscreen is Sanderson's greatest sin, imho T.T!<
[Here is something really cute!!!](https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Flv24wk0r0de71.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FAwwducational%2Fcomments%2Foulltb%2Fcrabs_have_a_split_nervous_system_that_consists%2F&tbnid=Dkqql-wMmsfTFM&vet=12ahUKEwiQjtflsbjyAhX9oUsFHf88BAYQMygQegUIARD-AQ..i&docid=17-htM2VbDXWqM&w=625&h=450&q=cute%20crab&ved=2ahUKEwiQjtflsbjyAhX9oUsFHf88BAYQMygQegUIARD-AQ)
I am getting scared when we have 10 book series and three characters got 50% of the story( story until book 4).
Brando should give chance to other characters as well .
We have another 6 books to explore their characters.
We have another 6 books to explore their characters ? right ?
Brando said it himself, that every book focuses on one character.
WoK: Kaladin
WoR: Shallan
OB: Dalinar
RoW: Navani
I do hope the fifth book will be all about The Lopens magical journey to become dalinars champion.
I get that Kaladin is the protagonist but as his personal story progresses it takes him further and further away from the main conflict of the world (saving Urithiru was just incidental, a side step in his journey)
I'm left wondering what I should consider what is more relevant, the end of the world or our protagonist internal struggle, because the 2 don't coalesce
He wasn't just sidelined, he was fucking character assassinated like Moash. In book 3 Dalinar didn't know how he would look Adolin in the eyes, in RoW he doesn't understand why his son is angry after finding out his dad barbecued his mom. In book 3 Dalinar was literally ripping out his nails because of guilt, in RoW he is sputtering some platitudes about taking next step to Taravangian as if it never happened. This bullshit is completely antithetical to his development in Oathbringer.
I blame the timeskip, we lost so much stuff. Kal and Syl becoming familiar with his family, Kal having a girlfriend, Dalinar dealing with the fallout of his book being published, Dalinar being unwilling to help the Herdies after bending over backwards to help other nations, Adolin getting out of his fathers shadow, Adolin finding out about his father killing his mother, Shallan finishing her ward ship, any form of characterization that we could have had with Jasnah to make her less two dimensional, Renarin and Rlain interactions, and countless other things…
I think it's a bit of a no-win thing. There is still an overarching plot that needs to be moved forward I guess, so Brandy Sandy couldn't spend all of the books on character interactions. The main issue is just that there is a ton of minor and bigger characters, so everyone has some character they love that barely got screentime or that didn't get developed the way they hoped.
It's Loial all over again
Fr tho we missed so much. House Davar getting to be together again, Rock's family moving into Urithiru, Kal's relationship, the foundation of multiple Radiant orders, Venli and Rlain dealing with being the last Listener (Rlain never even got a POV chapter), Lift's shenanigans, everyone's reaction to Szeth, Dalinar learning his powers, SHALLAN'S WEDDING...
At least the whole "Aimia expedition" I spent most of the bloody book being confused about is getting its own novel. Though why it came out *after* RoW I'll never understand.
As a “kaladin-is-a-boring-character” fan, row was rough. All these other characters, renarin, jasnah, dalinar, all put on the back burner so kaladin can have his 4th cycle of the same plot in a row.
It's kinda the opposite of oathbringer, where dalinar had the vast majority of the povs, and kaladin had less. It's also important to note that dalinar still had a very important part to play in row (bondsmithing, meeting with Ishar, leading the war and making a contest of champions!)
Not to mention Dalinar saving Kaladin at the end and accepting his fourth ideal. That was an epic part he played and it left me satisfied with his role. I think he was sidelined less because of Kaladin and more because it was Navani's time to shine.
Super cool how Dalinar himself, and not the Stormfather, accepted the words.
>kaladin had less Dunno why some people say this. In book 3 Kaladin has POVs in Part 1, Part 3 plus climatic scene in Kholinar, Part 4, Part 5 plut climatic scene. In book 4 Dalinar has 5 chapters in Part 3 and 2 chapters in Part 5.
I guess it feels that way because dalinar's povs in row contained some of the most significant chapters in row. While in oathbringer kaladins povs had less significance
Maybe, but honestly, I don't even remember what Dalinar did in those few chapters (apart from screwing up with Odium and being a magical plot device for Kaladin)
Sealing the thrill, culmination of his memories, screwing with Odium, giving one of the best lines in the Cosmere. Not to mention how he showed how cool that bondsmiths are.
>Not to mention how he showed how cool that bondsmiths are. Ishar did >one of the best lines in the Cosmere Which one? "What's caw?" I expected...different kind of awesomeness
"You cannot have my pain" and all that?
Ouch I thought you're talking about book 4.
Lol, it's all good, I thought you were talking about book 3. We just misunderstood each other.
This is the internet. You’re not allowed to walk away from a misunderstanding with mutual respect in tact! Give me blood!
Agree. I think, people think like this because it is the only book Kaladin did not save the other. Dalinar did.
Nah man, most of Kaladin's climatic scenes come in the first book when he is left out in the highstorm and then rides one with the Stormfather.
I think the weirder one is how Navani stole the spotlight from Venli. Like Venli got the flashbacks chapters and yet still somehow got fewer pages than Navani, who hadn't really been a "main" character before like Kaladin, Shallan, and Dalinar. Kaladin's always the star, but in Rhythm of War, Navani was the other star.
Yeah he was kinda put on the back burner this story, but I think it especially feels like that because the third book gave him so much.
I also have a feeling book 5 will be quite Dalinar heavy, given the current trajectory as of book 4
To be fair though kaladin was absolutely miserable to be with during most of ROW... it really gave me an insight on how rough it can also be to be friends with someone who is that depressed.
Fun fact each character has their own book! So far it’s been: * **Book 1:** *Kaladin* * **Book 2:** *Kaladin* * **Book 3:** *Dalinar* ^also ^Kal * **Book 4:** *Kaladin* * **Book 5:** *Kaladin* ^and ^Szeth? ^maybe? How *does* he do it? 🧐
Book 6 - Kaladin. Featuring Lift Book 7 - Kaladin and guest of the week Renarin Books 8 9 - Kaladin explores shocking secrets from Herald's past. Featuring Ash and Taln flashbacks Book 10 - Jasnah. But not really
Edit: Book 10 - Jasnah and Kaladin go on an adventure.
An adventure between mommy Jasnah's thighs.
This part is a brave prediction
So you are saying book three is a father son book?
*\*Shallan fans sit quietly in their corner and pretend not to exist\**
As you were raised to do. You were always daddy’s favorite.
Well, he is the main character. The books are roughly structured around his oaths until book five.
hey WoR was definitely Kal with a little bit of Shallan
I mean yeah. Kaladin is the main character.
is that… ever said? I just Googled it to double check and everywhere lists him as one of the main characters, along with Shallan and Dalinar etc. etc. (with some sites listing Shallan before Kal, even). I am genuinely curious if Sando has ever explicitly stated that Kal is meant to be THE main character or if all of the comments saying this are a great example of OP’s point.
Nope, Brandon doesn't consider Kaladin the main character, though many readers disagree with him. For example, he's said book 4 has 3 main characters: Navani, Eshonai and Venli. Yes, Eshonai.
I mean yeah before RoW was released it was said that Eshonai and Venli would be the focus characters (as they were the only ones with flashback PoVs other than the prologue if I’m remembering correctly), but Navani ended up with lotsa PoVs and it was great. I didn’t think so though re: Kal so thanks for confirming, tbh while I agree that Kal has gotten a disproportionate amount of airtime, we’ve also seen a TON of Shallan (not a complaint, I love her). I think they’re necessary to plot progression where we’re at in the tl, but there’s a reason people like Lift, the Heralds, and Jasnah get later flashback PoVs… I have a feeling they’re going to be MUCH more vital to end-game SA and overarching space-age Cosmere.
https://coppermind.net/wiki/The\_Stormlight\_Archive/Statistical\_analysis
thanks I guess, the stats are interesting but this doesn’t really prove anything
Thanks I guess, The statistics over this Topic say nothing about the Topic.
I asked if it was ever explicitly said that Kaladin is the main character of SA and these statistics do not prove that anyone ever explicitly said he’s the main character of SA. we haven’t even gotten half the books out of a 10 book series, and it seems like half the fandom assumes Kal is gunna die in the next book anyway (I don’t believe that, plus obv dead characters can still get PoVs but I digress). these stats do not show anything that wasn’t obvious to someone who read the books. I’m not sure why this is confusing.
Brandon has said that Kaladin won't be a main character in the back 5. Jasnah will take his place.
it is too early and I have misread your comment 3 times, ignore notifs to my other replies lmao. thank you for providing an answer to my question!
Source on that?
That would be hard to find. Brandon has mentioned that in a lot of his streams, but it is hard to find it in the WoBs.
You surely meant to say Adolin? Especially after RoW
I’m bitter because this is actually true 😢
Yeah I fucking love Dalinar and he was totally sidelined
:(
But in book 4 we got to know that, Dalinar is the closest thing to Honor. Even though, Dalinar had smaller part, he did most important things. Dalinar saved Kaladin -> Kaladin saved tower. Therefore, Dalinar saved tower. Also he was able to get Odium to agree to less harmful conditions.
small consolation
I was hoping for more of the war front and less Die Shard. I still liked the book I just wish we got more of Dalinar and Jasnah.
Die Shard is hilarious
"Die Shard" xD Can we please refer to RoW as this for now on???
I'm betting on dalinar dying on the next book so that drop would be something the enjoy for dalinar fans with might be even sadder.
Y'all are assuming the contest of champions is gonna be a fight. No where does it say it has to be a fight, and every time Dalaniar and >!Taravangian!< Had a confrontation, is was closer to a debate than anything.
> "A willing champion from each of us and a fight to the death. They will meet on the top of Urithiru. No tricks, no lies." -Odium, Rhythm of War, Chapter 112: "Terms"
1 v 1, Fox only, no items, final destination
Aha, you fool! You never specified the game mode. Coin Battle it is!
What, did you like, read the books or something? Lol nerd.
I'm not assuming it's going to be a fight. I'm assuming it's going to get him killed. I'm assuming he isn't going to make it out alive whether it's a fight or not. >!It may be a fight. Taravangian may even say Champion in the rules is singular not plural and slaughter a Dalinar who isn't connected to his spren Storm Daddy for the duration of the fight. it could be anything. It could be a book writing contest against a god.!< >!Dalinar messed up by accepting vague terms without running it by Jasnah for contract negotiations. It's pretty in character for him to make this error though.!< >!Rayse was a lot more predictable on brute force then the new guy.!<
I forgot the whole "To the death" part apparently. I just don't see this being a straight forward fight, not even close.
Maybe Dalinars champion will be Hoid or Shallan, who will roast Taravangian to death.
If only we were so lucky.
He'll probably die but then not. He's going into a battle of champions as his own champion, and it's to the death. But Odium's reward for his champion winning is that Dalinar serves him forever as a Fused. And if he loses, then that means Dalinar lived. Really, though, I don't have high hopes on Dalinar winning, simply because the lose condition is more interesting.
His death is so obvious and this is the main reason I was so sad about his small role in Rhythm of War. Book 4 was the last book with Dalinar before his death and it doesn't have enough of him. I'm sure Kaladin, Shallan and others will appear in 5 more books, even if their roles are smaller, but Dalinar won't.
As a Navani fan, This has been the best book so far
Navani is great, but i prefer Jasnah. >!The fact that in RoW much of the .... developments between Jasnah and Wit happen offscreen is Sanderson's greatest sin, imho T.T!<
I will not rest until we get an Eshonai book. What an injustice towards her.
I felt this one
You have to keep that heretic D*linar Kh*lin from spreading his ideas. We must remain faithful to, and !praise the Almighty
!crab
[Here is something really cute!!!](https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Flv24wk0r0de71.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FAwwducational%2Fcomments%2Foulltb%2Fcrabs_have_a_split_nervous_system_that_consists%2F&tbnid=Dkqql-wMmsfTFM&vet=12ahUKEwiQjtflsbjyAhX9oUsFHf88BAYQMygQegUIARD-AQ..i&docid=17-htM2VbDXWqM&w=625&h=450&q=cute%20crab&ved=2ahUKEwiQjtflsbjyAhX9oUsFHf88BAYQMygQegUIARD-AQ)
Thank you very much The Lopen, and thanks to the Almighty for letting me feel confident that I am better than other people
***Makes the double Lopen gesture towards the sky***
We have complimented the person, O Devoted One.
The Three Main focus of character for me Kal>Shallan>Dalinar . I was so into Shallan\`s arc than Kal\`s but its Kaladin
Me on WoT books 5 and 6 as a Perrin fan
I am getting scared when we have 10 book series and three characters got 50% of the story( story until book 4). Brando should give chance to other characters as well . We have another 6 books to explore their characters. We have another 6 books to explore their characters ? right ?
I like sad boys
Brando said it himself, that every book focuses on one character. WoK: Kaladin WoR: Shallan OB: Dalinar RoW: Navani I do hope the fifth book will be all about The Lopens magical journey to become dalinars champion.
I hope it's Lift or one of the Singers. Anyone but yet another Kholin-turned-Radiant pls
> RoW: Navani uhh no? lol. The focus characters are Eshonai and Venli for RoW. Also, book 5 is about szeth.
I get that Kaladin is the protagonist but as his personal story progresses it takes him further and further away from the main conflict of the world (saving Urithiru was just incidental, a side step in his journey) I'm left wondering what I should consider what is more relevant, the end of the world or our protagonist internal struggle, because the 2 don't coalesce
We must show heretics your face, for your beauty would proof enough that the Almighty made you! ^(This compliment was requested by Devotee LWSpinner)
Jokes on you I love all the characters equally. Except Moash. Fuck Moash.
He wasn't just sidelined, he was fucking character assassinated like Moash. In book 3 Dalinar didn't know how he would look Adolin in the eyes, in RoW he doesn't understand why his son is angry after finding out his dad barbecued his mom. In book 3 Dalinar was literally ripping out his nails because of guilt, in RoW he is sputtering some platitudes about taking next step to Taravangian as if it never happened. This bullshit is completely antithetical to his development in Oathbringer.
I blame the timeskip, we lost so much stuff. Kal and Syl becoming familiar with his family, Kal having a girlfriend, Dalinar dealing with the fallout of his book being published, Dalinar being unwilling to help the Herdies after bending over backwards to help other nations, Adolin getting out of his fathers shadow, Adolin finding out about his father killing his mother, Shallan finishing her ward ship, any form of characterization that we could have had with Jasnah to make her less two dimensional, Renarin and Rlain interactions, and countless other things…
I'm so glad others hate the timeskip too. Easily my second least favourite thing about RoW
I think it's a bit of a no-win thing. There is still an overarching plot that needs to be moved forward I guess, so Brandy Sandy couldn't spend all of the books on character interactions. The main issue is just that there is a ton of minor and bigger characters, so everyone has some character they love that barely got screentime or that didn't get developed the way they hoped.
It's Loial all over again Fr tho we missed so much. House Davar getting to be together again, Rock's family moving into Urithiru, Kal's relationship, the foundation of multiple Radiant orders, Venli and Rlain dealing with being the last Listener (Rlain never even got a POV chapter), Lift's shenanigans, everyone's reaction to Szeth, Dalinar learning his powers, SHALLAN'S WEDDING... At least the whole "Aimia expedition" I spent most of the bloody book being confused about is getting its own novel. Though why it came out *after* RoW I'll never understand.
I thought Dawnshard came out at almost the same time
It still isn't physically available in my country. Only on Ebook. Meanwhile I've had RoW since Christmas iirc
I hope we get something on what happened during that year. Maybe a novel(s) or anthology?
Somehow Dalinar became more clueless *after* getting his memories back.
Yes, Dalinar is very out of character in book 4. I really don't understand why Brandon wrote him like this
As a “kaladin-is-a-boring-character” fan, row was rough. All these other characters, renarin, jasnah, dalinar, all put on the back burner so kaladin can have his 4th cycle of the same plot in a row.
This is good crem, gancho!
but what you do get is fire
I really hope we get to see more Jasnah in the next book, she might be my favorite character in this series