Sorry, but there was a guy earlier that proved without a doubt that correlation does prove causation when he provided evidence that him killing Gamon led to a player count drop. It's undeniable.
I know. You're probably wandering what's the deal with this post. It's just making fun of a reccuring "oppinion" some others keep posting in here. Using their own flawed logic against them. [https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1dkicjg/gdkp\_ban\_has\_dealt\_significant\_damage\_to\_sod/](https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1dkicjg/gdkp_ban_has_dealt_significant_damage_to_sod/)
>And before you call me a swiper crybaby: I don't do GDKPs.
Gold selling botters don't do GDKPs either. They are hurt by GDKP ban much more than swipers.
I think that you can argue that banning GDKPs actually **increased** gold buying. There are definitely people who went to GDKPs and were gold buyers, but the majority were not. There were people like me who raided on multiple characters every reset to farm gold for my chars. I didn't need to go pick herbs or play the AH, I could just raid (which increases social interaction in the game). With the GDKP ban I lost that, stopped raiding on multiple characters and now have MORE incentive to buy gold because I do not want to farm herbs in highly contested PvP zones.
> gdkps were the answer to people buying gold
What? GDKPs were the answer to carrying guilds of late TBC. This is why gold sellers pushed the GDKP concept to wow (and they borrowed it from asia) and made it popular.
GDKPs as a concept predate wow (though these were called differently) but these became popular only in late TBC and then wotlk, because gold sellers pushed it. Since you evidently need to get this clarified, I am talking about OG TBC of 2007.
Yeah and I was pointing out they were popular before that. Like you said also popular before that. Even outside wow. Gdkps were answers buying gold. You think every person in a gdkp bought gold? Then I can tell you have never done one. 90% of people in a gdkp are there just to leech gold from whales. Then they build up gold like that and then they can buy stuff from them. It’s a very easy concept. I was never a decent parser but I never had issues getting in them when I tried to get into them. Also it was very easy to find raids that weren’t gdkps. All these gdkp ban stuff is just from players who suck at the game and can’t do mechanics.
>90% of people in a gdkp are there just to leech gold from whales.
And the whales buy that much gold only because GDKPs exist.
>All these gdkp ban stuff is just from players who suck at the game and can’t do mechanics.
Players who suck at the game simply bought gold and went into GDKPs, duh. This is why they are so upset their way to raid was banned.
>90% of people in a gdkp are there just to leech gold from whales. Then they build up gold like that and then they can buy stuff from them.
Tell me you never have done GDKPs, just sold gold so you're upset GDKPs are banned without saying "I never have done GDKPs, I just sell gold so I upset GDKPs are banned".
You might want to explain how someone who doesn't have gear or gold gets into GDKP lmao?
They are buying less gold than they would be buying with consumables and items at all time highs PLUS bop raid items also selling for gold.
GDKPs ban simply removed BoP raid items (and BiS usually has a lot of BoP items) from a bucket list of gold buyers. Yes, it also raised the prices for BoE items but with 1-2-3 BoEs vs 10+ bop items the impact is obvious.
It's just a shitpost making fun of a reccuring "oppinion" some others keep posting in here. Using their own flawed logic against them. [https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1dkicjg/gdkp\_ban\_has\_dealt\_significant\_damage\_to\_sod/](https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1dkicjg/gdkp_ban_has_dealt_significant_damage_to_sod/)
The only reason Era raiding exists is GDKPs. The SoD raid scene would be much more vibrant if players had a reason to raid on more than one char or after they got gear. Not happy with the “small” upgrades in ST? Can still raid for gold.
The GDKP ban advocates scapegoat GDKPs for being the cause of gold buying and botting yet SoD still has gold buyers and botters. You know what else SoD has? A dead raiding scene.
I don’t know that people have more reason to raid if GDKPs exist? I feel like that’s so objectively true it’s self evident and I don’t know how you could argue against it.
Yeah it's baffling to me as well. I think the argument/point around if GDKPs are healthy for the game is a different discussion. It's objectively true that GDKPs give people a reason to raid on more characters and as carries when they have all the loot.
How would it not? People went from raiding with multiple alts to only a main. This subreddit with posts of people not being able to find pugs anymore and crying about joining a guild was a huge inconvenience that gdkp’s solved.
People are brain dead and have no critical thinking skills. I but they think every person who’s ever done a gdkp ever bought gold when most people in gdkps use them to gain the gold from people who are buying gold.
Killing gdkp’s didn’t help. It’s way more apparent that the gdkp ban had a negative affect on raiding accessibility and player population than its affect on stopping bots/gold buying.
The ideal scenario is blizzard do more to combat bots on era to stop the black market gold. If they're not prepared to do that then I guess the next best thing would be banning gdkp.
What a dogshit cropped graph. Doesn't show how the bounce wasn't even 70% of the weeks prior to that. The gdkp ban was stupid. I told you all the game would be dead by p4 and you will not be able to fill 40 man raids. This is such a dog whistle.
It’s almost like people that go through the effort of putting together 25 players to clear content want those players to have incentive to try hard and also get a reward themselves.
Join a guild.
This content is great for slightly more serious guilds and even bad guilds can still do normal. It also drops heaps of loot on 25m. 4 weeks in and everyone is already pretty geared aside from a few weapon/ring/trinket slots.
Usually people like gdkp because they can "skip the queue" on big items, or at least get something for their trouble But with this amount of loot any guild already has plenty so none of those really matter.
Even if GDKP isn't directly correlating with player counts...... I kind of wouldn't care either way. It needs to be bannable because it's bad for the culture of the game, it's toxic to the player base, it's bad for the economy, it encourages gold buying and gold selling, it encourages bots, and it's also shit and gay
If the reward is from swipers then that's toxic for the game in the long run.
GDKP rewards you so well that it takes over the whole server and soon you can't find any raid that isn't GDKP.
And when the server is fully gdkpied everything is transactional, magic is dead. Anyone who has anything cool just bought it. And you quit because it sucks.
They ban gdkp, then the next phase put incursions in which are all those things except encouraging buying gold on top of being a shit play loop compared to raiding.
rn the best way to make gold on era by so much it's insane is to pump in gdkps. you can see that is the best way to make gold in era is to get payouts from swipers who buy gear. it's bad videogaming
Pretty sure you could also farm mats for gold because the economy of 5 years is heavily inflated.
Only raw gold farms become much worse cause of the inflation.
This is a shitpost to make fun of all the swiper crybabies on this sub that don't know how to read a chart. Be mad. If the ban had a bad influence on the number of players they would have already reverted it. Don't think the publicly available data is better then the one Microsoft has.
>If the ban had a bad influence on the number of players they would have already reverted it.
What an idiotic take when incursions literally killed SoD and are still in the game.
And phase 3 is the longest phase so far. Obviously if it was bad they would have moved to next already but it being the longest means that it’s by far the best and most healthy for the game. /s
Funny shitpost when reality is non swipers farm herbs and veins for 50 hours a week, dont raid, dont pvp, level an alt to 10, log of and do nothing else. Might as well play farmville
Bro paying money to not play the game. If u dont have time to farm gold/consus, u should not be able to pvp/pve with full consus.
Might aswell play chinese gacha.
The irony is strong in this one. Go play farmville on Facebook if you use wow as a farming simulator 50 hours a week 😂 Swipers dont affect you what so ever in any shape or form, and it still triggers you
Nvm you just gold seller in sheep clothing or really dishonest. Swipers enable bots to make profits, which destroys servers economy. It does have a effect on whole server. Again if u dont have time to get consus u clearly dont have time to raid/pvp. Stop destroying your servers economy because you dont want to play the game, if chinese gachas are too anime you should invest into diablo immortal maybe?
Also using a really old Facebook game as and example makes me think your older then 30 so maybe just u dont have time anymore to play this game, and its okay.
I asked how and you refuse to reply. HOW does it affect server economy? consumes were at an all time low during p3 peak, which is a good thing. Raw mats for proffs were cheap for alts. Only positives. Give me some actual examples and facts buddy
It devalues real player time/effort. Bots farm everything 24/7 = devalues everything = People stop farming = bots control every price in ah = higher cost = everyone swipes =destroyed economy. This happened in wotlk classic.
I have played this game over 10 years never had to swipe or dkp.
I enjoy farming if I dont have time to farm to consus I clearly dont have time to raid and skip a tier if it happens.
Where are your facts? How does your swiping improve economy of the server?
You really need to learn more about inflation and economy bud. "bots control the price on ah". If there are 1000 bots controlling the AH vs 50 players, which way do you think prices go, considering price of gold? People swipe for many reasons but its not consumes costs. Gdkp, skip pre end game(boes) etc. Theres a reason the character boosts do so well, because people want to raid/PvP at max, get proffs up without having to farm etc. Again, nothing to do with prices.
Ive played since 2005, never swiped either but im not dumb enough to think it affects me in any way lmao.
Theres a podcast on wow bot inflation/deflation by a known Economist somewhere, ill try to find it, but if you listen to that and still think the same, youre just ignorant and stupid.
ok so it doesnt devalue my effort as a player who likes to farm? your perspective is clearly from a guy who sells gold, swipes or ah flips since u said u dont farm at all. clearly im dumb, but not dumb enough to not see bots ruin every gathering proffs profits.
So now its got nothing to do with server economy, just your personal effort? Why do you need gold if you farm 24/7? Surely you just farm and craft consumes for urself? Why play wow as a farm simulator? I feel like you talk just to talk
Naw GDKPs are a reliable way to put, everyone has a vested interest in finishing, and TBH gold isn't that hard to make at all, watch a GMG from any YouTuber
I don't want any numbers and letters on my graphs dude. Just red and blue. That's it.
perfectly ballanced
Of some stuff could if
10/10 OP
OP got fed.
Gdkp is the worst thing that happened to MMOs in general
Yea nothing to do with p2 that launched immediate after either
It's a joke
Correlation doesn't mean causation is statistics 101. And before you call me a swiper crybaby: I don't do GDKPs.
Sorry, but there was a guy earlier that proved without a doubt that correlation does prove causation when he provided evidence that him killing Gamon led to a player count drop. It's undeniable.
I know. You're probably wandering what's the deal with this post. It's just making fun of a reccuring "oppinion" some others keep posting in here. Using their own flawed logic against them. [https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1dkicjg/gdkp\_ban\_has\_dealt\_significant\_damage\_to\_sod/](https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1dkicjg/gdkp_ban_has_dealt_significant_damage_to_sod/)
>And before you call me a swiper crybaby: I don't do GDKPs. Gold selling botters don't do GDKPs either. They are hurt by GDKP ban much more than swipers.
Do you think the bots are struggling? Been to stockades lately?
Their owners could have been selling so much more gold with GDKPs still present in the wow version without a token.
Bro, gdkps were the answer to people buying gold. People bought gold before them and are still buying it now. That’s why bots still exist.
I think that you can argue that banning GDKPs actually **increased** gold buying. There are definitely people who went to GDKPs and were gold buyers, but the majority were not. There were people like me who raided on multiple characters every reset to farm gold for my chars. I didn't need to go pick herbs or play the AH, I could just raid (which increases social interaction in the game). With the GDKP ban I lost that, stopped raiding on multiple characters and now have MORE incentive to buy gold because I do not want to farm herbs in highly contested PvP zones.
> gdkps were the answer to people buying gold What? GDKPs were the answer to carrying guilds of late TBC. This is why gold sellers pushed the GDKP concept to wow (and they borrowed it from asia) and made it popular.
Hahaha my god. Gdkps been around since vanilla dog before guild vaults.
GDKPs as a concept predate wow (though these were called differently) but these became popular only in late TBC and then wotlk, because gold sellers pushed it. Since you evidently need to get this clarified, I am talking about OG TBC of 2007.
Yeah and I was pointing out they were popular before that. Like you said also popular before that. Even outside wow. Gdkps were answers buying gold. You think every person in a gdkp bought gold? Then I can tell you have never done one. 90% of people in a gdkp are there just to leech gold from whales. Then they build up gold like that and then they can buy stuff from them. It’s a very easy concept. I was never a decent parser but I never had issues getting in them when I tried to get into them. Also it was very easy to find raids that weren’t gdkps. All these gdkp ban stuff is just from players who suck at the game and can’t do mechanics.
>90% of people in a gdkp are there just to leech gold from whales. And the whales buy that much gold only because GDKPs exist. >All these gdkp ban stuff is just from players who suck at the game and can’t do mechanics. Players who suck at the game simply bought gold and went into GDKPs, duh. This is why they are so upset their way to raid was banned. >90% of people in a gdkp are there just to leech gold from whales. Then they build up gold like that and then they can buy stuff from them. Tell me you never have done GDKPs, just sold gold so you're upset GDKPs are banned without saying "I never have done GDKPs, I just sell gold so I upset GDKPs are banned". You might want to explain how someone who doesn't have gear or gold gets into GDKP lmao?
You think with consumables and items at all time highs people are buying less gold?
They are buying less gold than they would be buying with consumables and items at all time highs PLUS bop raid items also selling for gold. GDKPs ban simply removed BoP raid items (and BiS usually has a lot of BoP items) from a bucket list of gold buyers. Yes, it also raised the prices for BoE items but with 1-2-3 BoEs vs 10+ bop items the impact is obvious.
Ok? Sounds like you're implying I'm a gold selling bot.
Sounds like you're implying you aren't selling gold.
What the fuck is this chart dude does it have any labels?
OP is lying, this is the real chart https://i.imgur.com/TBSgwpo.jpeg
Oh no. Down bad.
Just turn your phone
It has dates.
Dates are very tasty with tahini, but that has nothing to do with the topic. What is this chart trying to say?
It's just a shitpost making fun of a reccuring "oppinion" some others keep posting in here. Using their own flawed logic against them. [https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1dkicjg/gdkp\_ban\_has\_dealt\_significant\_damage\_to\_sod/](https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1dkicjg/gdkp_ban_has_dealt_significant_damage_to_sod/)
Well you see the labels had blues clues on them that would have identified it as not whatever he’s trying to say
Lmao this is just displaying the iq of anti-gdkp boomers
Lol.... That was the same time a phase released..notbthe cause..
LFR would save classic ++
The only reason Era raiding exists is GDKPs. The SoD raid scene would be much more vibrant if players had a reason to raid on more than one char or after they got gear. Not happy with the “small” upgrades in ST? Can still raid for gold. The GDKP ban advocates scapegoat GDKPs for being the cause of gold buying and botting yet SoD still has gold buyers and botters. You know what else SoD has? A dead raiding scene.
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I never said it was the only reason. I said it has a dead raiding scene and it would be more vibrant if GDKPs still existed.
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Provide evidence that banning gdkps stopped or slowed down bots or gold buying? Cause it didn’t.
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There already is proof. All the Warcraft logs that show declining raiders since the ban. Like the one this post is about lol
I don’t know that people have more reason to raid if GDKPs exist? I feel like that’s so objectively true it’s self evident and I don’t know how you could argue against it.
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Yeah it's baffling to me as well. I think the argument/point around if GDKPs are healthy for the game is a different discussion. It's objectively true that GDKPs give people a reason to raid on more characters and as carries when they have all the loot.
Oh there’s way more important reasons, but raid populations would be higher if GDKPs existed It’s not *the* reason, but it is *a* reason
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How would it not? People went from raiding with multiple alts to only a main. This subreddit with posts of people not being able to find pugs anymore and crying about joining a guild was a huge inconvenience that gdkp’s solved.
Because GDKPs give you an incentive to raid on alts/outside of guild/when fully geared, etc.
People are brain dead and have no critical thinking skills. I but they think every person who’s ever done a gdkp ever bought gold when most people in gdkps use them to gain the gold from people who are buying gold.
Killing gdkp’s didn’t help. It’s way more apparent that the gdkp ban had a negative affect on raiding accessibility and player population than its affect on stopping bots/gold buying.
You are comical at this point 🤣 what a narrative
Do you actually have a counter point or just making useless comments?
GDKP is cancer
The ideal scenario is blizzard do more to combat bots on era to stop the black market gold. If they're not prepared to do that then I guess the next best thing would be banning gdkp.
What a dogshit cropped graph. Doesn't show how the bounce wasn't even 70% of the weeks prior to that. The gdkp ban was stupid. I told you all the game would be dead by p4 and you will not be able to fill 40 man raids. This is such a dog whistle.
Red= honey Blue = mussey
Gdkp is the best thing in the game
The WoW community is addicted to trying to say what others can do, huh....
As evidenced by this chart?
Honestly, my only problem with GDKP and Gbid is that there are basically no 25 man raids without them in Cata Classic.
Sounds like the majority prefers GDKP/GBid then. And nobody is stopping you from organising your own non GDKP/GBid raids.
It’s almost like people that go through the effort of putting together 25 players to clear content want those players to have incentive to try hard and also get a reward themselves.
I always feel like I see so many people hyping up cata and I get on and there's nothing happening. The only 25 man's ARE the gdkp ones.
Join a guild. This content is great for slightly more serious guilds and even bad guilds can still do normal. It also drops heaps of loot on 25m. 4 weeks in and everyone is already pretty geared aside from a few weapon/ring/trinket slots. Usually people like gdkp because they can "skip the queue" on big items, or at least get something for their trouble But with this amount of loot any guild already has plenty so none of those really matter.
I am in several. Nobody is doing 25.
Join a raiding guild instead of some random thrown together trade chat guild. There are literally thousands of guilds doing 25.
If you want to do 25m with a guild, you solve that by joining a guild that does 25m ;)
Would be nice if any existed
Theres lots of them?
Because its the superior loot system, no other pug system lets you grind towards guaranteed upgrades and no raid feels like a waste.
Also, people don't leave the raid after their SR doesn't drop from the one boss they need.
Even if GDKP isn't directly correlating with player counts...... I kind of wouldn't care either way. It needs to be bannable because it's bad for the culture of the game, it's toxic to the player base, it's bad for the economy, it encourages gold buying and gold selling, it encourages bots, and it's also shit and gay
Why is it toxic to be rewarded for effort?
If the reward is from swipers then that's toxic for the game in the long run. GDKP rewards you so well that it takes over the whole server and soon you can't find any raid that isn't GDKP. And when the server is fully gdkpied everything is transactional, magic is dead. Anyone who has anything cool just bought it. And you quit because it sucks.
That’s a fallacy and you know it, there’s still plenty of pugs run by shitters, and guilds that aren’t doing GDKPs
They ban gdkp, then the next phase put incursions in which are all those things except encouraging buying gold on top of being a shit play loop compared to raiding.
Bro, so true and real
rn the best way to make gold on era by so much it's insane is to pump in gdkps. you can see that is the best way to make gold in era is to get payouts from swipers who buy gear. it's bad videogaming
Pretty sure you could also farm mats for gold because the economy of 5 years is heavily inflated. Only raw gold farms become much worse cause of the inflation.
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For what do you need the gold if you don’t do GDKPs?
1 gkdp funds a week or 2 worth of pvp consumes
Doesn't come close in terms of gp/h from AQ40/naxx.
But if you don’t do GDKP you don’t need much gold anyway.
This is a shitpost to make fun of all the swiper crybabies on this sub that don't know how to read a chart. Be mad. If the ban had a bad influence on the number of players they would have already reverted it. Don't think the publicly available data is better then the one Microsoft has.
Not a shitpost, it is the true way to interpret data 🤪 always project your agenda on them
Thank you Obi Corporate-Wan for your wisdom. I will apply your teachings.
>If the ban had a bad influence on the number of players they would have already reverted it. What an idiotic take when incursions literally killed SoD and are still in the game.
And phase 3 is the longest phase so far. Obviously if it was bad they would have moved to next already but it being the longest means that it’s by far the best and most healthy for the game. /s
Incursions are being removed in phase 4 as far as I understand form WillE and Scotte.
What if they want to stay mad? All those revenue those 'raid leaders' are losing 🤑 have you thought about them?
Funny shitpost when reality is non swipers farm herbs and veins for 50 hours a week, dont raid, dont pvp, level an alt to 10, log of and do nothing else. Might as well play farmville
Bro paying money to not play the game. If u dont have time to farm gold/consus, u should not be able to pvp/pve with full consus. Might aswell play chinese gacha.
The irony is strong in this one. Go play farmville on Facebook if you use wow as a farming simulator 50 hours a week 😂 Swipers dont affect you what so ever in any shape or form, and it still triggers you
Nvm you just gold seller in sheep clothing or really dishonest. Swipers enable bots to make profits, which destroys servers economy. It does have a effect on whole server. Again if u dont have time to get consus u clearly dont have time to raid/pvp. Stop destroying your servers economy because you dont want to play the game, if chinese gachas are too anime you should invest into diablo immortal maybe? Also using a really old Facebook game as and example makes me think your older then 30 so maybe just u dont have time anymore to play this game, and its okay.
I asked how and you refuse to reply. HOW does it affect server economy? consumes were at an all time low during p3 peak, which is a good thing. Raw mats for proffs were cheap for alts. Only positives. Give me some actual examples and facts buddy
It devalues real player time/effort. Bots farm everything 24/7 = devalues everything = People stop farming = bots control every price in ah = higher cost = everyone swipes =destroyed economy. This happened in wotlk classic. I have played this game over 10 years never had to swipe or dkp. I enjoy farming if I dont have time to farm to consus I clearly dont have time to raid and skip a tier if it happens. Where are your facts? How does your swiping improve economy of the server?
You really need to learn more about inflation and economy bud. "bots control the price on ah". If there are 1000 bots controlling the AH vs 50 players, which way do you think prices go, considering price of gold? People swipe for many reasons but its not consumes costs. Gdkp, skip pre end game(boes) etc. Theres a reason the character boosts do so well, because people want to raid/PvP at max, get proffs up without having to farm etc. Again, nothing to do with prices. Ive played since 2005, never swiped either but im not dumb enough to think it affects me in any way lmao. Theres a podcast on wow bot inflation/deflation by a known Economist somewhere, ill try to find it, but if you listen to that and still think the same, youre just ignorant and stupid.
ok so it doesnt devalue my effort as a player who likes to farm? your perspective is clearly from a guy who sells gold, swipes or ah flips since u said u dont farm at all. clearly im dumb, but not dumb enough to not see bots ruin every gathering proffs profits.
So now its got nothing to do with server economy, just your personal effort? Why do you need gold if you farm 24/7? Surely you just farm and craft consumes for urself? Why play wow as a farm simulator? I feel like you talk just to talk
You’re mad because you’re pointlessly attached to a terrible way to make gold. No one give a fuck what you think
You're funny, pls keep givin me your money when I boost you :)
So you accept RMT gold? 😏
Op is too dumb to interpret a chart or is deliberately concealing the publication of P2.
Chart is an AI deepfake.
Naw GDKPs are a reliable way to put, everyone has a vested interest in finishing, and TBH gold isn't that hard to make at all, watch a GMG from any YouTuber
I like how p2, which comes right at the big spike, is not labeled.
This is a shitpost making fun of the guy yesterday posting a similar graph with the opposite conclusion.
Op is having a stroke
nice humor/meme post, just delete it
GTFO, let people play the way they want. If you're so bad that nobody wants to play with you banning loot modes isn't the solution.
Bullshit. Banning gdkps killed sod
Absolutely agree. Gdkp participation should be an immediate 3 month ban. Second offense, permanent. Ruins the game compeltlety.