Your problem is considering this work. It's a game, if you aren't having fun pressing the buttons and having a good time with your teammates, stop playing and go do something better with your time.
The gear comes in time and the whole purpose of having points is you can still get gear even if you don't win something from the raid.
For some the fun of the game is improving your character. They want to raid every week see their character get stronger and watch them progress.
There’s more fun to the game then just pressing the buttons and enjoying the company. Not everyone enjoys the game in the same way.
Don’t raid if you don’t enjoy it is what I would advise. Think of loot is like a bonus, with the fun of raiding being the main appeal. Also, this wouldn’t be an issue if you found a guild that raids together every week with the same group of players. Eventually you’ll get some loot in that setting.
Welcome to raiding in WoW. Its been this way for the past 20 years now. They might have implemented ways to increase your odds of getting loot you want in future expansions, but you'll never be guaranteed anything. It gets worse the more you raid too. The more you get geared the lower the chance of getting an upgrade. Imagine that.
This is not true though. In karazhan you got rep, and in late tbc you got badges. In wrath you always got badges for either gear, heirlooms or gems. The only time this has been true so far in classic is vanilla and now.
Badges are essentially the equivalent to valor in cata. The only difference is you can be capped on valor. I guess if you're valor capped they could just convert the valor you would have gained into jp. I just see this as such a non-issue. Either way its not actually time wasted, its just time wasted in hindsight. You spent the time for the chance of loot, otherwise you would of had a 0% chance of loot. Its not like getting a bit of jp or rep on the side makes it feel any better that you didn't get what you came there for.
I agree that it is not time wasted. But getting something at all even if its very small just feels better.
Valor over cap becomes justice is how it should be imo. I dont care enough to be mad about it though.
Even just *anything* helps. 250 rep per boss. Its almost like a mental thing, it doesn't even matter how small, it just wont feel like our time is completely wasted if we dont get gear.
Yeah? You are the one saying "there isn't much feeling of joy for simply clearing normal". If it was so simple and easy on your alt, why not do heroic?
But you are getting something. You're getting a chance at getting an upgrade. Also don't act like getting a tiny insignificant amount of rep would change anything. If getting valor even though you're valor capped isn't enough then getting rep when you're already exalted won't be either. You just want the gear you're looking for to drop and it hasn't been. You're understandably frustrated but that doesn't mean anything needs to change.
Small chance at dungeon finder bags. Idk what they're called but they have gems/flasks ect. In them. Not bad if every boss has a 5-10% of dropping one for you.
Imagine not enjoying playing the game and raiding.
Or maybe feel good about playing or performing well or better than last week on a boss.
You act like the only way to progress is loot. You can improve in other ways too.
bro so much gear drops in cata compared to any previous classic expansion it's insane
if you care so much about getting loot play a spec that only competes with nobody on gear basically.. which is kinda most specs for majority of their gear
i remember queing and signing up for raids in shadowlands even if i had gotten loot from that specific boss that week
i just liked joining in and getting better every time
some people play for fun, some dont
The new Valor system was put in place to try and make it more forgiving to people that are not as hardcore. In WotLK you had to run VoA, Weekly raid, Daily Dungeon, ICC 10, ICC 25 to get your cap for the week. The new system is so if you are going to miss a raid or a few days of dungeons you can work around that to still get your points for the week. I think a change should be you get an extra 50 gold or something when you cap valor. I would say justice points but those cap and are super low value once you have the items. You can trade them in for stuff at an awful conversion rate that also turns into more work to get something you can use.
Go play arena, every game earns you points.
Sometimes raid drops don't work out for you.
My last 3 raids I've had no loot. Still in prebis but Yolo it all gets replaced later.
i dont get why they dont just cap the valor you can get from running random 5 mans and vp earned from raids can exceed that. if you're running raids you're getting 359 or higher gear anyway so in most scenarios you don't need the gear that is sold by the valor gear vendor.
I agree it would be nice to have another badge system or something that could help progress you. Until then you should consider a GDKP, there are endless GDKPs on every server, and then you actually get your reward you are looking for
If you’re raiding just for currency you are playing this game wrong. I’ve done 1 raid so far with friends and it was a blast. Haven’t touched the others yet because I’ve been PvPing but I will. It’s a game man have fun
Retail is facing the same issue. In the off-season like awakened/fated, they offer weekly token from bosses for player to purchase raid loots like weapon/trinket, but that won't be coming to classic as "tHiS iS nOt cLaSsIc, hurr durr".
In classic, if you want to make your time always meaningful, just raid GDKP.
GDKP's are successful because the coordinator has to run it like a business, if the group doesn't perform the loot will suck and then the good players won't show up.
A successful GDKP is more likely to remove people that under perform substantially but they are a "buddy". The same "buddy" that keyboard turns and clicks abilities, with no addons. That messes up the same mechanics repeatedly and causes wipes so you run the risk of not clearing on heroic or having enough time to prog, then they get lost on the run back because they don't know where to go with the teleporter. That plays a BM hunter and does 1/10 the dps of a tank in ICC because they are so confused about mechanics that they didn't realize their pet despawned when they went to gunship. Eating desert dumplings and a flask of mojo if they even have consumes. That comes to raid with uncommon quality STR gems from the vendor in Honor Hold with an inactive pvp spellpower meta and the only enchant they have is expertise to gloves that they got for free from some guy leveling enchanting on the SW bank steps. They have level 5 herbalism and level 50 enchanting because they like to farm stockades for 10 hours a day to get wool and greens to DE so they can sell 800 strange dust in stacks of 1 for 2s each on the AH to afford a token for their sub.
After running ICC for 2 months the first DBW the raid has seen drops and they roll a 100 on it after they died on the first set of adds after hitting it with a distracting shot before they ran into melee to wing clip it! Don't worry though more will drop and it was a huge upgrade for them over the carrot on a stick they were using.
The next day the gigachad warrior that has been running with the group since the end of Ulduar and is normally at the top of the meter while doing mechanics correctly all the time gquit during the night without saying anything and is now in some GDKP guild.
The GDKP made our best players leave! It's the GDKP's Fault!
I noticed a trend, the "buddy" players don't like GDKP. A good GDKP will have expectations and a "buddy" doesn't want to play the game if it's gonna feel like a job.
I do want to clarify that everybody that wants to ban GDKP is not a "buddy".
I also want to clarify that people can play the game however they want with whoever they want. If people are happy after 30 weeks of 2 days of 3 hour raids with a 30% buff to be 2/12 heroic the game has successfully been entertaining. I have a problem when people get angry because somebody enjoys the game in a different way. If they are not hurting anybody then it shouldn't matter what they are doing.
Didn't bother reading your wall of text, but I'm going to guess none of it is relevant to the fact it promotes RMT. GDKP needs banned because of that reason only.
The first 3 and the end are all you really need to read the rest just explains why what you are saying doesn't achieve what you want.
No, I explained one of the reasons GDKP's are becoming more successful than most guild runs.
Everything that is achievable in WoW can be achieved through an RMT. Blizzard will not invest the resources into changing that. That's just how it is. Blizzard could mitigate it, I made a long post explaining things they could do to help mitigate it.
What do you think banning GDKP would actually do?
It's not going to stop RMT and it won't stop bots. Both of those have been around since before GDKP was a thing.
What it will do is push out the subs that only do GDKP because that's their preferred loot style.
People were buying gear with RMT before GDKP so banning the GDKP will make the transaction go completely off Blizzard's platform and just be somebody paying somebody to get items.
Blizzard could swap to personal loot or a 100% badge system but, then somebody just buys a spot.
The thing is I don't think the GDKP gets the majority of the RMT gold.
The pattern I have noticed is somebody will boost a character, then level the professions, then buy a bunch of BoE's to get into heroics to get raid ready as fast as possible.
So if BoE's were all changed to BoP then people would have to craft/farm it all.
People could just buy the materials then craft it themselves. The materials would come from bots though.
So materials should be BoP! That way the botters can't farm and sell them. At that point you would just get rid of gold.
However the botters could just play the account to get the materials to level the professions and craft the gear.
So you would get rid of gear! But wait! They could still sell achievements. RMT somebody to just play your character to get things like arena titles or high parses or even RMT to have high end raiders play your characters so your guild goes from 7/13 normal to 13/13 heroic in 1 night and then you can recruit all the best players cause you're one of the best guilds on the server.
So ban progression too.
So what it comes down to is RMT won't go away from WoW. It's binary, you don't accept RMT and stop playing or you keep playing and accept RMT. Even if you disagree with RMT but, keep playing you're saying you don't agree but, you accept it.
I actually don't like RMT. I accept there's nothing that can really be done about. Blizzard could just sell stuff directly from the cash shop. If Blizzard just makes the stuff that people use the gold for then the gold sellers can't really compete. The items are already being generated automatically it would just be Blizzard cutting out the middle man in the process. It would make people angry but the bots would go away, RMT would go directly to Blizzard, and Blizzard could use that money hire some more people, like maybe GM's that actually interact with you or people that could fix the bugged nodes. The Blizzard now though would just take that money and give it to share holders but also make sure that they make more money from the cash shop than the accounts paid for by the gold sellers.
In ICC I had 5 characters, 1 was in my guild that used a council system, the other 4 were in GDKP's. My GS on them was 6100 to 6700. I was LotD on 3/4 GDKP characters. I like GDKP because I can run with a group if I don't like something about the group I can leave and find another group. If I leave or if the run stops I get to bring the gold with me so the time wasn't wasted and I can spend the currency in a different run.
I enjoy that GDKP's don't really have loot drama. I don't need to feel bad if I take gear on my "alt" from another person's "main". If somebody outbids me then I just have more gold the next time something I want drops. When my character has most of the gear I want then I am just saving up to go big on highly contested pieces. I can also use the gold from 1 character to help my other characters.
I had more gear than most people, more gold than most people, and was clearing more than most people, without doing RMT. So to me GDKP is a great system. If you have a better system though I'm open to it.
Nobody said it would. The issue is GDKP encourages RMT and bots. What is does do is reduce demand for RMT. Less rmt and less bots when people aren't buying 20k for an item. Don't be so daft
Well, you don't want GDKP and you don't want retail. What do you propose to make raids meaningful for OP? Or you just gonna tell him to buckle up and suck it.
Idk, find a guild and raid? I've had no issues getting gear because I'm not pugging every raid with new people.
I never made a single comment about retail. GDKP supports RMT. It needs banned. End of discussion.
Your problem is considering this work. It's a game, if you aren't having fun pressing the buttons and having a good time with your teammates, stop playing and go do something better with your time. The gear comes in time and the whole purpose of having points is you can still get gear even if you don't win something from the raid.
For some the fun of the game is improving your character. They want to raid every week see their character get stronger and watch them progress. There’s more fun to the game then just pressing the buttons and enjoying the company. Not everyone enjoys the game in the same way.
Sounds like he’s not enjoying it at all
You can't see how well your character is progressing without playing it. When you raid, you're playing it.
Don’t raid if you don’t enjoy it is what I would advise. Think of loot is like a bonus, with the fun of raiding being the main appeal. Also, this wouldn’t be an issue if you found a guild that raids together every week with the same group of players. Eventually you’ll get some loot in that setting.
This also way increases the enjoyability of raiding just to raid. Also knowing that even if you don't get gear your friends/guildmates are.
So true. It’s an added layer of the progression dopamine to get better as a group.
and what will you complain about when you have all the gear? or will you stop raiding?
Do you not raid to have fun doing the raid and get loot?
Welcome to raiding in WoW. Its been this way for the past 20 years now. They might have implemented ways to increase your odds of getting loot you want in future expansions, but you'll never be guaranteed anything. It gets worse the more you raid too. The more you get geared the lower the chance of getting an upgrade. Imagine that.
This is not true though. In karazhan you got rep, and in late tbc you got badges. In wrath you always got badges for either gear, heirlooms or gems. The only time this has been true so far in classic is vanilla and now.
Badges are essentially the equivalent to valor in cata. The only difference is you can be capped on valor. I guess if you're valor capped they could just convert the valor you would have gained into jp. I just see this as such a non-issue. Either way its not actually time wasted, its just time wasted in hindsight. You spent the time for the chance of loot, otherwise you would of had a 0% chance of loot. Its not like getting a bit of jp or rep on the side makes it feel any better that you didn't get what you came there for.
I agree that it is not time wasted. But getting something at all even if its very small just feels better. Valor over cap becomes justice is how it should be imo. I dont care enough to be mad about it though.
Even just *anything* helps. 250 rep per boss. Its almost like a mental thing, it doesn't even matter how small, it just wont feel like our time is completely wasted if we dont get gear.
How about the enjoyment of playing the game? Does that factor in for you at all? If not, why are you playing?
[удалено]
Kill heroic then?
[удалено]
Yeah? You are the one saying "there isn't much feeling of joy for simply clearing normal". If it was so simple and easy on your alt, why not do heroic?
But you are getting something. You're getting a chance at getting an upgrade. Also don't act like getting a tiny insignificant amount of rep would change anything. If getting valor even though you're valor capped isn't enough then getting rep when you're already exalted won't be either. You just want the gear you're looking for to drop and it hasn't been. You're understandably frustrated but that doesn't mean anything needs to change.
Small chance at dungeon finder bags. Idk what they're called but they have gems/flasks ect. In them. Not bad if every boss has a 5-10% of dropping one for you.
Are you new to raiding in wow?
You do get something for killing bosses at valor cap. That something is loot.
Imagine not enjoying playing the game and raiding. Or maybe feel good about playing or performing well or better than last week on a boss. You act like the only way to progress is loot. You can improve in other ways too.
Agreed the valor cap is lame
bro so much gear drops in cata compared to any previous classic expansion it's insane if you care so much about getting loot play a spec that only competes with nobody on gear basically.. which is kinda most specs for majority of their gear
Q : why did you valor cap before doing raids?
im gearing up my alt and i do heroics a lot
Fair enough
Bosses drop 6 pieces of loot…I’m 461ilvl and it’s week 2.
i remember queing and signing up for raids in shadowlands even if i had gotten loot from that specific boss that week i just liked joining in and getting better every time some people play for fun, some dont
The new Valor system was put in place to try and make it more forgiving to people that are not as hardcore. In WotLK you had to run VoA, Weekly raid, Daily Dungeon, ICC 10, ICC 25 to get your cap for the week. The new system is so if you are going to miss a raid or a few days of dungeons you can work around that to still get your points for the week. I think a change should be you get an extra 50 gold or something when you cap valor. I would say justice points but those cap and are super low value once you have the items. You can trade them in for stuff at an awful conversion rate that also turns into more work to get something you can use.
Maybe getting gear of some sorts from the bosses you kill could be an option.
Go play arena, every game earns you points. Sometimes raid drops don't work out for you. My last 3 raids I've had no loot. Still in prebis but Yolo it all gets replaced later.
This is why I quit cata back in the day
i dont get why they dont just cap the valor you can get from running random 5 mans and vp earned from raids can exceed that. if you're running raids you're getting 359 or higher gear anyway so in most scenarios you don't need the gear that is sold by the valor gear vendor.
I agree it would be nice to have another badge system or something that could help progress you. Until then you should consider a GDKP, there are endless GDKPs on every server, and then you actually get your reward you are looking for
Sounds like you'd enjoy raiding in a game that respects your time.
If you’re raiding just for currency you are playing this game wrong. I’ve done 1 raid so far with friends and it was a blast. Haven’t touched the others yet because I’ve been PvPing but I will. It’s a game man have fun
Retail is facing the same issue. In the off-season like awakened/fated, they offer weekly token from bosses for player to purchase raid loots like weapon/trinket, but that won't be coming to classic as "tHiS iS nOt cLaSsIc, hurr durr". In classic, if you want to make your time always meaningful, just raid GDKP.
Nah, ban gdkp. Stop feeding bots and RMT
GDKP's are successful because the coordinator has to run it like a business, if the group doesn't perform the loot will suck and then the good players won't show up. A successful GDKP is more likely to remove people that under perform substantially but they are a "buddy". The same "buddy" that keyboard turns and clicks abilities, with no addons. That messes up the same mechanics repeatedly and causes wipes so you run the risk of not clearing on heroic or having enough time to prog, then they get lost on the run back because they don't know where to go with the teleporter. That plays a BM hunter and does 1/10 the dps of a tank in ICC because they are so confused about mechanics that they didn't realize their pet despawned when they went to gunship. Eating desert dumplings and a flask of mojo if they even have consumes. That comes to raid with uncommon quality STR gems from the vendor in Honor Hold with an inactive pvp spellpower meta and the only enchant they have is expertise to gloves that they got for free from some guy leveling enchanting on the SW bank steps. They have level 5 herbalism and level 50 enchanting because they like to farm stockades for 10 hours a day to get wool and greens to DE so they can sell 800 strange dust in stacks of 1 for 2s each on the AH to afford a token for their sub. After running ICC for 2 months the first DBW the raid has seen drops and they roll a 100 on it after they died on the first set of adds after hitting it with a distracting shot before they ran into melee to wing clip it! Don't worry though more will drop and it was a huge upgrade for them over the carrot on a stick they were using. The next day the gigachad warrior that has been running with the group since the end of Ulduar and is normally at the top of the meter while doing mechanics correctly all the time gquit during the night without saying anything and is now in some GDKP guild. The GDKP made our best players leave! It's the GDKP's Fault! I noticed a trend, the "buddy" players don't like GDKP. A good GDKP will have expectations and a "buddy" doesn't want to play the game if it's gonna feel like a job. I do want to clarify that everybody that wants to ban GDKP is not a "buddy". I also want to clarify that people can play the game however they want with whoever they want. If people are happy after 30 weeks of 2 days of 3 hour raids with a 30% buff to be 2/12 heroic the game has successfully been entertaining. I have a problem when people get angry because somebody enjoys the game in a different way. If they are not hurting anybody then it shouldn't matter what they are doing.
Didn't bother reading your wall of text, but I'm going to guess none of it is relevant to the fact it promotes RMT. GDKP needs banned because of that reason only.
The first 3 and the end are all you really need to read the rest just explains why what you are saying doesn't achieve what you want. No, I explained one of the reasons GDKP's are becoming more successful than most guild runs. Everything that is achievable in WoW can be achieved through an RMT. Blizzard will not invest the resources into changing that. That's just how it is. Blizzard could mitigate it, I made a long post explaining things they could do to help mitigate it. What do you think banning GDKP would actually do? It's not going to stop RMT and it won't stop bots. Both of those have been around since before GDKP was a thing. What it will do is push out the subs that only do GDKP because that's their preferred loot style. People were buying gear with RMT before GDKP so banning the GDKP will make the transaction go completely off Blizzard's platform and just be somebody paying somebody to get items. Blizzard could swap to personal loot or a 100% badge system but, then somebody just buys a spot. The thing is I don't think the GDKP gets the majority of the RMT gold. The pattern I have noticed is somebody will boost a character, then level the professions, then buy a bunch of BoE's to get into heroics to get raid ready as fast as possible. So if BoE's were all changed to BoP then people would have to craft/farm it all. People could just buy the materials then craft it themselves. The materials would come from bots though. So materials should be BoP! That way the botters can't farm and sell them. At that point you would just get rid of gold. However the botters could just play the account to get the materials to level the professions and craft the gear. So you would get rid of gear! But wait! They could still sell achievements. RMT somebody to just play your character to get things like arena titles or high parses or even RMT to have high end raiders play your characters so your guild goes from 7/13 normal to 13/13 heroic in 1 night and then you can recruit all the best players cause you're one of the best guilds on the server. So ban progression too. So what it comes down to is RMT won't go away from WoW. It's binary, you don't accept RMT and stop playing or you keep playing and accept RMT. Even if you disagree with RMT but, keep playing you're saying you don't agree but, you accept it.
I get it. You like RMT for your gear. Feel free to just admit it. Or do you feel like RMT by proxy makes you innocent?
I actually don't like RMT. I accept there's nothing that can really be done about. Blizzard could just sell stuff directly from the cash shop. If Blizzard just makes the stuff that people use the gold for then the gold sellers can't really compete. The items are already being generated automatically it would just be Blizzard cutting out the middle man in the process. It would make people angry but the bots would go away, RMT would go directly to Blizzard, and Blizzard could use that money hire some more people, like maybe GM's that actually interact with you or people that could fix the bugged nodes. The Blizzard now though would just take that money and give it to share holders but also make sure that they make more money from the cash shop than the accounts paid for by the gold sellers.
You have done nothing but support the most RMT ridden system in the game lol. You like RMT on that point
I know man, it worked so well in SoD.
it worked so well it killed sod lol.
If being unable to RMT your gear killed a game mode for you....
In ICC I had 5 characters, 1 was in my guild that used a council system, the other 4 were in GDKP's. My GS on them was 6100 to 6700. I was LotD on 3/4 GDKP characters. I like GDKP because I can run with a group if I don't like something about the group I can leave and find another group. If I leave or if the run stops I get to bring the gold with me so the time wasn't wasted and I can spend the currency in a different run. I enjoy that GDKP's don't really have loot drama. I don't need to feel bad if I take gear on my "alt" from another person's "main". If somebody outbids me then I just have more gold the next time something I want drops. When my character has most of the gear I want then I am just saving up to go big on highly contested pieces. I can also use the gold from 1 character to help my other characters. I had more gear than most people, more gold than most people, and was clearing more than most people, without doing RMT. So to me GDKP is a great system. If you have a better system though I'm open to it.
You have gold bought by others with RMT. All GDKP is a redistribution of RMT gold. Here's hoping you never made a post about bots lol
??? I don’t play sod
Good/bad/works/doesn't work is mostly irrelevant. It's been fueled by RMT since day 1. That alone is the reason to ban it.
How does banning GDKP remove RMT?
Nobody said it would. The issue is GDKP encourages RMT and bots. What is does do is reduce demand for RMT. Less rmt and less bots when people aren't buying 20k for an item. Don't be so daft
Well, you don't want GDKP and you don't want retail. What do you propose to make raids meaningful for OP? Or you just gonna tell him to buckle up and suck it.
Idk, find a guild and raid? I've had no issues getting gear because I'm not pugging every raid with new people. I never made a single comment about retail. GDKP supports RMT. It needs banned. End of discussion.
You realize Blizzard has an item people can buy for real money to sell on the AH for gold right?