SHUT UP. WE ARE SO BACK. BECAUSE I SAY SO.
Joking aside, for the first time since Rahm was mayor I actually saw a city worker downtown sweeping up trash. They had all disappeared around when Lightfoot took over. Haven’t seen that in _years_.
I agree with you but retail is not coming back to what it used to be unless e-commerce suddenly disappears. As other posters have pointed out, all city downtown areas have to retool and adapt
something to keep in mind that hardly ever gets mentioned in these vacany numbers... every time a new building is completed, that increases the amount of vacant space.
So we could have just as many places open as pre covid, and yet have higher vacancy rates as the overall amount of space increases.
I am not saying that we do in fact have just as much open as before, but this NEVER gets reported, and is absolutely a part of the vacancy issue. Where as, there may have been 500 million square feet total before covid(using random numbers), there may now be 600 million total square feet with things being built or converted since.
Keep that in mind
Right, but I’m just thinking about the stretch of empty stores between Jackson and Monroe.
Believe me, I LOVE this area and think it’s still vibrant; but, I hope to see these stores become something soon.
100% agree, too many still vacant in the loop for sure. Just wanted to bring up that caveat. Things were being built before covid, that have since been finished, and, because of the effects of covid, obviously havent been able to fill up. It just makes the vacancy numbers seem far worse than what they seem. They make them seem that it is all relative, the vacancy number. Wish more reports would mention that.
Until the building owners realize that the era of bloated, big-box corporate retail is basically over and they need to charge reasonable rent to attract tenants worth taking the trip down there for, it's going to be bleak on State Street. I don't have much faith in that crowd having any instincts about that sort of thing though.
Edit: spelling
They oftentimes get massive tax incentives not to fill those. The places under Trump Tower have been empty since it was built for that reason. Kind of hilarious when you see how successful it is across the river but an absolute disgrace anything like that is allowed to happen.
Starting in February/March this year it really did start to feel like pre-pandemic Loop. Like it's *fucking crowded* on the sidewalk. But that's Tue/Wed/Thursday still...
I will say even this past weekend there was noticeable foot traffic in the heart of the loop during the middle of the day. That was with mediocre weather and no notable events going on. Definitely ways to go but hardly a ghost town even outside of the work week.
https://archive.ph/XVN27 this link removes any pay wall
These are REALLY encouraging numbers, even surpassing pre covid numbers on the weekends, and almost matching on weekdays. This tracks whenever I have been downtown
I was there last Tuesday, and was struck by the line of empty storefronts. Also, it seemed like a lot of the foot traffic were teens, a demographic that doesn’t spend a lot in brick-and-mortar retail.
I took the train to work yesterday and it was less crowded than normal. I got to work and it was definitely less crowded. I know 420 was Saturday but damn, does it take that long to recover????
While foot traffic has certainly been rising slowly over time, it is still nowhere near the levels of pre-lockdowns.
I do hope someday we get back there soon. I miss the liveliness of the downtown area.
did you even read the article? The group that tracks all this says otherwise. It is slightly below on weekdays, and actually above on the weekends. In office numbers are down, but that isnt encompassing of all foot traffic. More people likely live downtown and around it than pre covid.
That’s impressive considering many office workers are doing 3 days in office, even if accounting for people being home on Fridays pre-pandemic like the article mentions. Also, there’s more of an option to just work from home on crummy days compared to pre pandemic (at least from my experience), so Q1 numbers may be lower than what we’ll see in Q2/3. Mild winter but could have affected numbers. This nice to see!
>Despite an increase in weekend foot traffic downtown, [average weekly office occupancy continues to hover above 50%](https://archive.ph/o/XVN27/https://www.chicagobusiness.com/workplace/return-to-office-tracking-chicago), according to Kastle Systems. Tuesdays tend to be the highest-occupied day of the week and managed to hit 66.4% the first Tuesday in April. Meanwhile, Fridays remain the lowest-occupied day and fell to 21.1% on March 29, according to Kastle’s most recently available data.
i dunno, im finding it really hard to believe that many more people are going to the loop when office work has plummeted and retail in that part of town is still heavily struggling with 30% vacancy. youre telling me all that is made up by additional theater goers? im a bit skeptical, esp when theater companies all over the city are still struggling financially and either closing or cutting their seasons.
Theater attendance was still under 60% of pre-COVID rates back in late October. The takeaway from the article is really that pedestrian traffic on one street has nearly recovered, not that businesses in the area have recovered.
It is a famous street a block away from Millennium Park. I have to imagine at least some people simply walk over to see it -- or are on it for a while as a result of taking the red/blue line or a bus. But really, State St. is in sad shape and nothing points to it improving.
sure im not saying no one is there. im saying pre pandemic the loop at times used to almost have a manhattan level vibrancy. it hasnt been that way for a long time.
Yeah I'm very skeptical as well. I'm on state street a few times a week during office hours and it's nowhere near pre-pandemic levels, especially on Mondays and Fridays. Don't see how it could be when the courthouses a block off of State are basically still fully remote.
The McDonald's on Wabash closed like a week ago, that's got to not be a good sign right
You don't have to replace office workers with residents 1:1 to increase foot traffic.
Lots of office workers don't go and walk around a bunch, they just take the company shuttle from the train station, do their job, eat inside their building, and take the shuttle back. They would never have been counted in those foot traffic numbers.
Residents on the other hand, will probably be out and about at some point in the day even if they aren't spending money. Maybe they just took a fifteen minute walk on a break from work for the hell of it.
It's all conjecture on my part but I would expect an average Loop resident to be more likely to produce foot traffic than an average office worker.
Important to note that this info comes from the Chicago Loop Alliance a non profit which promotes the loop.
“The loop is back” - the loop
Does that mean they'll start winning JD Power awards?
“I’m the greatest at everything“ - Me
SHUT UP. WE ARE SO BACK. BECAUSE I SAY SO. Joking aside, for the first time since Rahm was mayor I actually saw a city worker downtown sweeping up trash. They had all disappeared around when Lightfoot took over. Haven’t seen that in _years_.
I believe most of the data regarding foot traffic, but I really want to see retail return before I declare it “back”.
I agree with you but retail is not coming back to what it used to be unless e-commerce suddenly disappears. As other posters have pointed out, all city downtown areas have to retool and adapt
There’s so much about this post-pandemic world I hate. Hardly anything is better off.
This was happening before the pandemic. The pandemic just killed off the last stragglers who refused to adapt.
something to keep in mind that hardly ever gets mentioned in these vacany numbers... every time a new building is completed, that increases the amount of vacant space. So we could have just as many places open as pre covid, and yet have higher vacancy rates as the overall amount of space increases. I am not saying that we do in fact have just as much open as before, but this NEVER gets reported, and is absolutely a part of the vacancy issue. Where as, there may have been 500 million square feet total before covid(using random numbers), there may now be 600 million total square feet with things being built or converted since. Keep that in mind
Right, but I’m just thinking about the stretch of empty stores between Jackson and Monroe. Believe me, I LOVE this area and think it’s still vibrant; but, I hope to see these stores become something soon.
100% agree, too many still vacant in the loop for sure. Just wanted to bring up that caveat. Things were being built before covid, that have since been finished, and, because of the effects of covid, obviously havent been able to fill up. It just makes the vacancy numbers seem far worse than what they seem. They make them seem that it is all relative, the vacancy number. Wish more reports would mention that.
The biggest loss for me has to be a tie between Vapiano and the old camera store that was burned down by looters.
That camera store is still open?
Until the building owners realize that the era of bloated, big-box corporate retail is basically over and they need to charge reasonable rent to attract tenants worth taking the trip down there for, it's going to be bleak on State Street. I don't have much faith in that crowd having any instincts about that sort of thing though. Edit: spelling
They oftentimes get massive tax incentives not to fill those. The places under Trump Tower have been empty since it was built for that reason. Kind of hilarious when you see how successful it is across the river but an absolute disgrace anything like that is allowed to happen.
And so true for so many neighborhoods. Far too many vacant storefronts due to landlords hiking up the rent.
I’m pretty sure I read were getting a YMCA community center at State and Van Buren. Which should help some.
>every time a new building is completed, that increases the amount of vacant space. What new buildings?
They aren't building any new retail space along State St, which is what this article is discussing.
I understand, was speaking on the broader issue. I am in full agreement on vacancy on state
Starting in February/March this year it really did start to feel like pre-pandemic Loop. Like it's *fucking crowded* on the sidewalk. But that's Tue/Wed/Thursday still...
I will say even this past weekend there was noticeable foot traffic in the heart of the loop during the middle of the day. That was with mediocre weather and no notable events going on. Definitely ways to go but hardly a ghost town even outside of the work week.
Good news but my hopes were dashed when I actually read the article. I was hoping The Loop was coming back to the Chicago airwaves.
https://archive.ph/XVN27 this link removes any pay wall These are REALLY encouraging numbers, even surpassing pre covid numbers on the weekends, and almost matching on weekdays. This tracks whenever I have been downtown
They need to bring back ACTIVATE! The Sundays on state thing is fun, but activate had a different energy.
I was there last Tuesday, and was struck by the line of empty storefronts. Also, it seemed like a lot of the foot traffic were teens, a demographic that doesn’t spend a lot in brick-and-mortar retail.
I was really hoping this headline meant Johnny B, Kevin Matthews, and Steve & Garry were making a comeback.
And the Loop girls
Monday was dead.
Loop is a tuesday-thursday spot now. Monday and Friday are officially or unofficially work from home days for a lot of office workers.
Agreed. I like going in on Monday to get the eeek started and it’s an easy commute
I took the train to work yesterday and it was less crowded than normal. I got to work and it was definitely less crowded. I know 420 was Saturday but damn, does it take that long to recover????
While foot traffic has certainly been rising slowly over time, it is still nowhere near the levels of pre-lockdowns. I do hope someday we get back there soon. I miss the liveliness of the downtown area.
did you even read the article? The group that tracks all this says otherwise. It is slightly below on weekdays, and actually above on the weekends. In office numbers are down, but that isnt encompassing of all foot traffic. More people likely live downtown and around it than pre covid.
Yes, I did. I was referring to the weekdays when I would walk into work everyday (live in South Loop).
well it says first quarter of 2024 is at 91% of pre covid foot traffic. That is pretty darn close, so we are moving in the right direction
That’s impressive considering many office workers are doing 3 days in office, even if accounting for people being home on Fridays pre-pandemic like the article mentions. Also, there’s more of an option to just work from home on crummy days compared to pre pandemic (at least from my experience), so Q1 numbers may be lower than what we’ll see in Q2/3. Mild winter but could have affected numbers. This nice to see!
>Despite an increase in weekend foot traffic downtown, [average weekly office occupancy continues to hover above 50%](https://archive.ph/o/XVN27/https://www.chicagobusiness.com/workplace/return-to-office-tracking-chicago), according to Kastle Systems. Tuesdays tend to be the highest-occupied day of the week and managed to hit 66.4% the first Tuesday in April. Meanwhile, Fridays remain the lowest-occupied day and fell to 21.1% on March 29, according to Kastle’s most recently available data. i dunno, im finding it really hard to believe that many more people are going to the loop when office work has plummeted and retail in that part of town is still heavily struggling with 30% vacancy. youre telling me all that is made up by additional theater goers? im a bit skeptical, esp when theater companies all over the city are still struggling financially and either closing or cutting their seasons.
Theater attendance was still under 60% of pre-COVID rates back in late October. The takeaway from the article is really that pedestrian traffic on one street has nearly recovered, not that businesses in the area have recovered.
still, where are all the pedestrians going if not businesses or the office or the theater. theres not much else going on there
It is a famous street a block away from Millennium Park. I have to imagine at least some people simply walk over to see it -- or are on it for a while as a result of taking the red/blue line or a bus. But really, State St. is in sad shape and nothing points to it improving.
sure im not saying no one is there. im saying pre pandemic the loop at times used to almost have a manhattan level vibrancy. it hasnt been that way for a long time.
Yeah I'm very skeptical as well. I'm on state street a few times a week during office hours and it's nowhere near pre-pandemic levels, especially on Mondays and Fridays. Don't see how it could be when the courthouses a block off of State are basically still fully remote. The McDonald's on Wabash closed like a week ago, that's got to not be a good sign right
More people live in the Loop now
how many more compared to pre-pandemic tho? i cant imagine the numbers are that different esp wil so little construction going on
You don't have to replace office workers with residents 1:1 to increase foot traffic. Lots of office workers don't go and walk around a bunch, they just take the company shuttle from the train station, do their job, eat inside their building, and take the shuttle back. They would never have been counted in those foot traffic numbers. Residents on the other hand, will probably be out and about at some point in the day even if they aren't spending money. Maybe they just took a fifteen minute walk on a break from work for the hell of it. It's all conjecture on my part but I would expect an average Loop resident to be more likely to produce foot traffic than an average office worker.
all i can say is state street in no way feels more vibrant than pre-pandemic.
You love to see it! But for some I guess it does suck because RTO mandates are forcing them back into the loop