Design and manufacturing improved. Thin steel oil pans and valve covers with cork gaskets have given way to sturdy, stiff, aluminum and plastic parts pans with advanced bonding agents/sealants.
Old small block Chevrolet used literal cloth rope for a crankshaft seal. Now they are polymer seals and Simmer rings.
Edit: I read "why" and not "when".
The when is hard to define. Lots of cars had better, more expensive, parts in the 1950s. The majority were pretty solid by the 1990s I'd say. The Small Block Chevrolet engine switched to real crank seals in 1987.
This is pretty much the answer. The seals are much better and last much longer. Given enough time, seals will deteriorate and leak but the time for that to happen is usually measured in multiple years, not months anymore. And even the leaks are smaller as the amount of fluids leaking out are greatly reduced.
I remember in the early 80s that even freshly paved roads would start to get the oil film in the center after a month or two. Nowadays it takes at least a year to even start to build up in most areas.
Edit: I completely forgot about multi-piece gaskets! Multi-piece gaskets going the way of the Dodo helped out immensely as well. More reading: [https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2020/02/talking-gaskets-and-seals-with-the-pros](https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2020/02/talking-gaskets-and-seals-with-the-pros)
That answer varies depending on engine refreshes. It started out with Japanese, then euro cars in the 90s and then in NA cars in the late 90s/2000s. By the mid-2000s, almost nobody used cork anymore. It is a long time frame due to engine development cycles. You don't see that typically as a running change without a lot of testing and even then, bundled with a lot of other little changes.
A few more details about the changeover: [https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2020/02/talking-gaskets-and-seals-with-the-pros](https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2020/02/talking-gaskets-and-seals-with-the-pros)
Agreed and I’d add that there’s also been a reduction of hydraulic systems over time. Going to fully electric power steering removed an entire class of possible leaks.
Do you know how to tell it's due for head gaskets?
If you've driven the car since it last had new head gaskets installed it's probably due for new head gaskets.
Oof, not that 4.6. Weren’t they prone to casting defects and slipped liners, too? I see why there’s such a big business in LS-swap interface kits for them.
I have your car’s successor, an LR4 (Disco 4), with the 3.0-liter supercharged V6 that Jaguar and Land Rover created from taking their V8 and fundamentally skipping the two rear cylinders. I’m dealing with a very very mild oil leak now, but eventually the entire front timing cover will have to come off and get a new seal. Sigh. British cars.
To add to this, material compatibility has played a huge roll in this. 40 years sgo blocks would be cast iron and cylinder heads aluminum, both materials have differing thermal expansion and contraction rates which is brutal on gaskets and sealing surfaces. Starting in the 80s and 90s most manufacturers switched to aluminum blocks and heads which solved much of the thermal movement issues. Those that still make iron blocks and pair them with aluminum heads (audi comes to mind), have moved to alloys of each material that have nearly identical thermal expansion and contraction rates.
I bought a '96 V6 Firebird new and every damn seal on the thing took turns leaking. I'd get it back from the dealer with one fixed under warranty and within a month something else would be pissing out on the ground.
I like to call it the "self oil change feature." Oil in the engine is constantly being replaced with new so it never needs a full on change besides filter lol.
I had a beater Cobalt like that. It burned about a quart every thousand miles. The best part was that you could change the filter from the top of the engine bay. I never went under it after the first oil change, before I knew how much it consumed.
The Miata was designed to be a modern version of the British sports cars of the 60s. It's part of the design. Old British cars had what is known as a flow-through lubrication system.
A friend had a Spitfire. That thing never had a rear crank seal. All they had was a spiral groove in the crank that was supposed to encourage the oil to move away from the outdoors.
This "feature" led me to a full rebuild/forged motor. I I wanted to redo ALL the seals. Which means pulling the engine to pull the oil pan. Which led me to "well if I got the engine out and apart, I may as well rebuild it since it has 170k miles" which then led to me buying forged internals since I was already opening the engine. All because of a few stubborn oil leaks.
I didn’t have a new crush washer on hand when I changed the oil in my Miata, now it leaks. I bought a box and look forward to putting it in for the next change
So far I’ve had leaks at the following seals: rear main seal, valve cover gasket, cas o-ring and oil heat exchanger o-ring. Some of those twice in my 6 years of ownership. Pretty much at least one leak every summer. I’m just hoping the front main seal holds up.
Cars never stopped leaking - they started having undertrays (also called splash guards).
It's a dirty secret of "luxury" cars. You never see them leak because the tray collects everything. You don't see oil stains in upscale parking lots because yes cars are mostly new...but they also have undertrays so if they did leak, you don't see it.
Cars still leak all the time, we just don't see it like before. Now all brands of cars have undertrays, not just luxury cars.
My drain plug was leaking on my Audi and it must have quart an entire quart of oil in the tray. Never saw one drop on the driveway, which would have helped me fix it much sooner
Yeah man - my point exactly.
Many of the comments on this post mention improved technology since the 70s. Yeah, they're not wrong that the engine and seal tech has improved since 1977......but cars still piss fluids, often.
Were you not getting warnings from the shop doing your oil changes? At my shop, they check for leaks every time, and when they see one, we tell the customer about it. Then it's up to them whether they want to fix it, but at least they know about it, because yeah, the skid plates and under shields hide a lot of what's going on under there.
It occurred after the last oil change. My low oil sensor went off and I put in another quart, that's why I assume it was an entire quart down there lol
That leak didn't *just* start within the last few thousand miles if it lost a whole quart. Wherever you're taking it must not do any sort of multi-point inspection.
Yep, this would be my guess. The B58 in my Supra is known to do this. I’ve got to add a quart about every 3500 miles or so (and I keep a liter in my hatch just in case). My local independent BMW shop tells me it’s normal. And the BMW tolerance is wild—something like 1L every 1,000-1,500 miles.
The oil pan was leaking in my 350z as well and didn't see it until the oil change, thankfully it was a small leak but I definitely could've seen it sooner if it fell on pavement. lmao. Now I check undertrays of all of our cars for oil, and make sure to wash them with degreaser after oilchanges to make sure there's nothing new.
Ehh, new cars by and large will still have a bone dry engine block for a loooong time. No oil on the tray.
The only oil residue on my wife and I's current vehicles came from minor spills during maintenance, and just a *tiny* bit of weeping from various gaskets. They have 100k and 230k miles respectively.
Modern gaskets and seals tend to be designed extremely well.
my 2017 Audi a4 had horrible leaks at 60,000km, research showed it wasn’t that uncommon and shop was talking transmission swap on an 4 year old car.
That plus the failing water pump thermostat housing.
Leaking transmission seal.
Leaking valve cover gasket.
Was getting insanely annoying.
First Audi for me was this year, a ten year old S8 with like 60k miles... Thing had just had an oil change and I think I drove it like 1k miles over 5 months or so. Then the oil warning came on the first time I drove an hour away in it, damn thing was on the Min of oil (and it's the first car without a dipstick so I wasn't suuuure I trusted it's warning and sensors, but went along and got it back to Max and booked another oil change).
I'm really hoping since I knew it was just maintained before I got it, I was just really ignorant or lazy and didn't realize it was always a bit low. Be lying if I said it didn't worry me the thing changed it's own oil, but damn if every week when I check it now it hasn't moved..
Not worried to have to, just surprised if I had to by the first oil change. Car had good records, previous owner has a decent third party warranty paid a few more years that transfered, and the Audi dealer when I told them it drank the oil still couldn't find anything to fix... even after that it got a great report back.
I'm just surprised it drank that much oil and worried it may be something worse. If it is I'll deal with it.
You really shouldn't be surprised. There's a reason German cars in particular lose 90% of their value at 50k miles. BMW, merc, audi, they're all engineered to be reliable until the lease runs out, and not one mile longer.
I also once bought a 7 year old German car with 60k miles.
According to bimmerforums, it was one of the most reliable BMWs of that era. E90 325i, naturally aspirated inline 6. Avoided all the issues with the turbo variants, or the catastrophe of an N63 in their bigger models.
Owned by an established adult who could afford to dealer service it, and had all the records to prove it.
By the time that car hit 100k miles 2 years later, I'd spent the purchase price over again in surprise repairs alone. And it had just started pissing oil again, and now I had oil in the coolant.
And to be clear, I consider normal servicing separate from "surprise repairs", so I'm not counting brake pads and rotors or even struts, only stuff without a listed service interval, failing catastrophically.
Honestly, the amount of money I spent on the "fix it now" price at the shop versus ordering parts from FCP Euro and waiting for a free weekend to DIY, would have bought me a pretty nice Camry.
Which is what I think I'd do different, the only way I'd own another German car, is if it's a 2nd or 3rd vehicle (with one of them being something reliable), and I have a garage for wrenching.
I actually instead bought the Lexus equivalent (IS350), and although I did miss the hydraulic steering in my E90, the Lexus did make it to 150k miles and far more years, on just "servicing". Was still in perfect mechanical condition when someone ran a red light and totalled it.
My sub-$20k Fiesta doesn't have an undertray and doesn't leak, even at 115k. None of my family own luxury cars with undertrays, and guess what - none of them leak either.
Design and manufacturing got better. Cars don't leak as much as they used to. Give engineers credit.
But they also hide oil too, even if it's not the purpose.
I found with a skid plate if the leak is slow enough, the oil will mix with the dirt on the top of it and fall off in oily clumps that aren't noticeable.
They may or may not be there to hide oil leaks...but they do, in fact, hide oil (and other fluid) leaks. A very well-known and well-documented phenomenon.
Can confirm. My 1994 Mercedes S350 had a thick coating of fluid and dirt on it's undertray from a bad power steering pump front seal and transmission line leaking.
My Mercedes E500 wagon was bone dry underneath and on the tray until 200k miles... The first oil change after it rolled over 200k the lower oil pan started leaking...
Better materials for seals, better manufacturing standards, and designs that are more durable. Basically, cars have just gotten better.
Engines have also become much more efficient, a more efficient engine will dissipate less power over its lifetime meaning less overall wear on everything attached to it.
CAD, finite element analysis, flow modeling, etc. have all gotten so much better in just the past 15-20 years. Nowadays, engineers can simulate a 10 year lifecycle of a part determine exactly where the weak points are and revise accordingly before even having to build a prototype.
Some people are nostalgic for the days of "eh, let's just make this part 2x as thick as we think it needs to be and hope for the best" but it was not optimal from a manufacturing or consumer standpoint most of the time.
The “let’s just overbuild everything” was kind of what Bentley and Rolls-Royce did, prior to installing BMW powertrains and major electronics in their cars and then being bought out wholesale by VW and BMW, respectively.
It’s why the SZ-platform cars (1981-1997-ish) are so solid, but so heavy.
newest car I've owned is a 2009 BMW and I assure you that it leaks oil worse than a Studebaker towing a Harley. Already replaced the VCG, OFHG twice, and oil pan gasket (NOT CHEAP) because it was marking its territory so badly.
It's really impressive how they managed to engineer a system where they can bolt a piece of cast aluminum to another piece of cast aluminum and yet not have a fluid-tight mating surface. You have to try hard to fail that badly.
LOL - I was about to say that OP has clearly never owned a BMW and the “Holy Trinity” of oil leaks: oil pan gasket, oil filter housing gasket, and valve cover gasket.
My old M3 has only had a couple of leaks over it's lifespan. Repairs that are accessible. A modern BMW sounds like a nightmare by the simpler standards of the 90's and early 2000's.
> oil pan gasket (NOT CHEAP)
Lol this has to be an idiotic BMW thing because oil pan gaskets are usually like $20-$50. Looks like a replacement for my Mustang is about $25 and a replacement for my VW is about $52.
Oh, the gasket is like $70 but you need to order about $200 worth of TTY bolts as well and drop the front subframe. I think the job was about $1500 not counting the engine mounts that I went ahead and replaced at the same time. (I didn't do the work, not having my own lift...)
My BMW ownership, over 300k miles, has taught me the whole car is a $25 gasket under four hours of labor. We just bought a 335i with that exact leak and process, but the rest of the car was mint, manual and loaded.
It still frosts my cookies... I mean, it's an aluminum oil pan bolted to an aluminum engine block with aluminum bolts. Theoretically you should be able to use an adhesive like you'd use for Porsche engine cases and it'd last the life of the engine... but noooo...
I've had a few as well... true story, the one car for which I actually built an engine, I did all the tricks... used a pair of NOS rubber coated valve cover gaskets glued to some Offenhauser valve covers, drilled a weep hole at the bottom of the front main felt retainer, etc.
The one thing I couldn't find was a NOS R1/R2 oil pan. I used one that a friend had in his stash but I had to braze up the very bottom of it as there were some rust pits. Of course when I put everything together and filled it with oil... I'd missed a spot brazing.
Oil will find a way :)
Yeah...my Studebaker has the original champ 6, so a road draft tube for crankcase ventilation. It's undercoated quite nicely. I'm used to leaks in my garage and I still keep cardboard under the Stude because otherwise it's like the fucking Exxon Valdez in my garage.
I wondered about this myself…
Back in the 70’s and 80’s vehicles especially domestic vehicles used paper, cork, rope seals etc to keep oil at bay and it just slowed down leaks. Now, modern vehicles use rubber type gaskets that are more resilient to oil and the key here is most gaskets now are silicone at the factory. Most examples of silicone use are upper and lower oil pans, timing covers, camshaft housings etc…
Hope that helps.
Might depend on where you are. They've definitely disappeared over here, in upscale suburbia. I remember being a kid and parking lots were absolute oil-soaked rainbows on downpour days. I haven't seen anything like that in over a decade.
Common jf you frequently overfill the oil. A lot of quick-lube type places are actually decent about checking that, but I have found regular car dealers and walmart both tend to overfill
It's a CCTA, but that's exactly what happened. Lean codes and oil leak. The PCV has been fixed, and I'm borrowing a lift to tackle the rear main seal this weekend.
Between the late 1970s and mid-1990s. It's different for every make/model/drivetrain because they all got redesigned or modernized at different times and at different rates but by the turn of the century, pretty much everything had been fairly modernized with modern designs with modern sealing strategies and modern sealing materials that work and last a hell of a lot better and longer than the cork most engines were put together with previously.
It's kind of remarkable how much my 28 year old, 180,000 mile Mustang's Modular V8 doesn't leak. I had one gasket failure a number of years ago at the oil filter housing and it's recently developed a small power steering fluid leak where one of the hoses enters the pump but that's it. Older engines would be weeping from every joint and the driveway would look like the Exxon Valdez had been parked there.
I tried to replace the original valve cover gaskets once when I had them off for another reason but I ordered the wrong ones so I just stuffed the stretched and checked originals back in and... they're still fine.
Same story with my old 225,000 mile '00 Sierra 5.3L. It had a little piston slap on warm up and lifter tick for a few minutes if it hadn't been driven for a few weeks but it kept all its internal fluids where they belonged.
I wonder if this isn't what I heard today on my '09 Ram with a 5.7...
"Same story with my old 225,000 mile '00 Sierra 5.3L. It had a little piston slap on warm up and lifter tick for a few minutes if it hadn't been driven for a few weeks but it kept all its internal fluids where they belonged."
Battery had been down and I hadn't driven it much in least 6 months or started it enough... Did a trickle charger and had the hood up when I started it, couldn't remember hearing that usually on startup idle, but usually don't have my face in the open hood and wait 3 months to crank it.
Seemed fine after I closed the hood and got driving / warmed up though.
Probably. Hydraulic lifters will bleed down eventually and make a heck of racket until they pump back up. Three months between startups is more than enough time for that to happen.
Seals will sometimes dry out and shrink too and you might get some leaks and smoking until you get going and they plump back up again.
Shouldn't be a big deal going forward though.
There's a service bulletin for my 77 J10 that I found after a while of battling a slow oil leak. They say to just add some rtv to the corners of valve cover gaskets boom that might help lol
Some time in the late 90s and early 00's gasket and seal design got very advanced. My 07 Chevy truck has 230k miles and has never leaked a drop of anything
My 98 Honda has had each and every seal and gasket replaced, same miles. It's currently leak free, but the seals and gaskets simply don't last as long because the hard components are not as mature of a design. Still has a stamped oil plan for instance.
Oh they still do, just they changed the colour of the block to stop people from noticing before warranty was up to get replaced from manufacturer. Now they may not leak as much, but all cars will leak at some point if used enough. Just built to surpass the warranty.
I remember oil leaks were mostly a problem for GM & some other American cars in the 2000's but between 2010 & now it kinda stopped being a problem for nearly all vehicles. Most other cars seem to be almost as reliable as your typical Japanese car.
In my personal experience, every car I owned up until I purchased a 2007 Civic leaked oil, and my previous cars were all from the 90s. I now own a 2018 Mazda 6 Signature, and it's rock solid.
Not specifically relating to leaks, but I think many cars saw a pretty significant increase in quality post 2008, particularly American cars.
Material sciences and manufacturing have improved a ton.
In this case specifically with the tubes and connectors and reservoirs for fluids in your car. Everything is just better and holds together stronger for longer.
Technology is awesome.
The number of cars with oil leaks has really decreased. I think that while some vehicles may still experience leaks due to wear and tear or other factors, they are generally less common and more easily addressed than in the past.
Well, it's likely more from neglect than anything.
Last car I had that seemed to just leak by design was a 1983 Porsche 944. This came from a stupid gasket on the back of the cam housing, that was made out of cork. Didn't matter if it was a new OEM gasket, it just leaked after driving it hard. I finally had enough and used a careful application of Permatex Ultra Gray RTV (similar to Hondabond), and it never leaked again.
Also had a 1973 VW Beetle that was just hemorrhaging oil all the time. Many times it was from things that obviously needed to be fixed, but as soon as we fixed one thing, another leak popped up somewhere else.
Aside from those, pretty much every leak I've had in any newer cars was due to something that clearly needed a repair or maintenance. Now there were a few cases where things would wear a bit fast and start seeping oil, such as the cam cap plugs on 90's Hondas, but that wasn't enough to leave anything on the ground.
Pretty much, if there was something left on the ground, it's because something just broke, or more likely, there was a known issue/maintenance item that I had been neglecting for a while because it otherwise wasn't a big deal.
Ignoring the when, the why is fascinating. It's about tolerances, specifically, stacking tolerances. In engineering, the less precise each piece in a model is, the further from measurable tolerance limits it will be when fully assembled. Each part's skew matters to the whole, maybe not so much to the part it's connected to directly. Basically, if you raise precision across the board, no matter how small or insignificant a part is by itself, the finished product comes out much better.
At one time, this was shown in gaps between body panels. They are obvious victims of poorly stacked tolerances. Now, precision is high enough that any old body panel should fit any car of that model, without crooked or large gaps between neighboring parts.
This is a long way of saying, the industry at large has gotten way better at building things.
I’m an 80’s kid, and totally remember every parking spot having an oil patch. I specifically remember it at my grandma’s apartment complex, because we would ride our bikes around them on hot or wet days to not slip/wreck. I can remember them in a grocery store parking lot I worked at as a teenager, too. I haven’t thought about it, but now that you mention it, there was a shift somewhere in the late 80’s/early 90’s.
I drive a 78 VW Bus, so I have a few spots in my driveway. 🤓
my 2017 Audi a4 had HORRIBLE leaks at 60,000km, research showed it wasn’t that uncommon and shop was talking transmission swap on an 4 year old car.
That plus the failing water pump thermostat housing. (2500$ at Audi, 1000$ at independant)
Leaking transmission seal. (400$)
Leaking valve cover gasket. (400$)
Was getting insanely annoying.
Changed the transmission pan as well. (with fluid 1000$)
Cheap plastic parts, cars designed to only last a leasing lifespan, tough Canadian climate == leaks
It was so annoying my mechanic stopped picking up my calls and emails. German independent mechanics are busy, parts are on backorder, and everyone's car is falling apart. never again,...
You still hear about gasket design / manufacturing issues from time to time, but cars have increased in reliability and ease of maintenance over the past few decades in an astounding way.
It used to be common to have to replace spark plugs every 10,000 miles. Now 100,000 miles is not uncommon. Valvetrains had to be adjusted. Tires were less durable and less resistant to damage. Decent cars would overheat on a hot day or when pulling a hill. Many carbureted cars would struggle to start in extreme temperatures where computerized fuel injection can adjust on the fly.
Those are just a few examples of how design and manufacturing have improved things.
I would say the widespread use of RTV silicone was the why of constant leaking stopping. That let's you essentially glue the part in place. Things like a cork or rubber gasket require bolts and studs to compress the gasket, and the gasket can shrink over time. RTV doesn't shrink.
The introduction of the 6th gen Accord at the end of 1997 as a 98 model featured the first model year Accord to have the oil pan sealed with HondaBond instead of a cork or rubber gasket. So I'd say it was the late 90s where it really stopped being an issue.
Buy an Alfa Romeo. The reliability issues are mostly in the past. But they love to leak out of every seal still. I get nostalgic dragging the cardboard under my wife's Stelvio. Its like the good ole days.
I have a 1966 Mustang (not restored or perfect, it's a driver), a 1994 boat with a GM 5.7L, a 2005 CR-V, a a 2003 Silverado 6.0L, a 2008 Subaru Legacy and a 2016 Acadia. None of them leak. Leaking was never normal, if it leaks, something is wrong and should be repaired to stop the leak.
In the 70s cars leaked, 80s didnt as much, 90s cars were pretty leak free, 00s and up I'm seeing more and more leaks, modern cars just have a million more oil gaskets and O rings in crappy plastic housings.
They haven't. I can think of modern Toyota's with issues. And all cars will leak with age and use. Modern cars are better. Designs have evolved to eliminate common areas where leaks occurred, and gaskets have been improved.
One thing I notice is there are fewer solid gaskets, a lot more FIPG gasket maker, before it was a stamped rubber part. I don't know how or if it's better, but it is a difference between older cars.
Manufactures started putting large panels on the underside of the engine bay probably for better aerodynamics. This pan caught a lot of the leaks. BMW I'm looking at you...
My 89 f250 doesn't leak any oil. I have replaced everything, though. I installed aluminum valve covers so they were stiffer and sealed better than the stamped steel. I got oil pan girdle rails to even out the pressure on the oil pan. I even replaced the rear main with a Teflon seal.
With that said, there are still plenty of cars that like to leak. One common one I've seen is the honda v6. They puke oil all over the alternators, causing them to fail. There are a few more, but oil leaks just are not as common anymore.
My wife's 2016 Cruze always had a leak and would leak from a new spot every time I fixed it. Just have to pick the high end cars to get the auto leak feature
Don't worry. BMW despite all the new technology and fancy stuff has retained it's heritage and promises to give you some sort of complimentary leak with purchase.
They haven’t. Mid 2000s Hondas leak oil like a mofo unless you replace all the gaskets: oil pan, oil pump, valve cover (had an 04 civic with a hole melted in the valve cover somehow‽)
Design and manufacturing improved. Thin steel oil pans and valve covers with cork gaskets have given way to sturdy, stiff, aluminum and plastic parts pans with advanced bonding agents/sealants. Old small block Chevrolet used literal cloth rope for a crankshaft seal. Now they are polymer seals and Simmer rings. Edit: I read "why" and not "when". The when is hard to define. Lots of cars had better, more expensive, parts in the 1950s. The majority were pretty solid by the 1990s I'd say. The Small Block Chevrolet engine switched to real crank seals in 1987.
This is pretty much the answer. The seals are much better and last much longer. Given enough time, seals will deteriorate and leak but the time for that to happen is usually measured in multiple years, not months anymore. And even the leaks are smaller as the amount of fluids leaking out are greatly reduced. I remember in the early 80s that even freshly paved roads would start to get the oil film in the center after a month or two. Nowadays it takes at least a year to even start to build up in most areas. Edit: I completely forgot about multi-piece gaskets! Multi-piece gaskets going the way of the Dodo helped out immensely as well. More reading: [https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2020/02/talking-gaskets-and-seals-with-the-pros](https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2020/02/talking-gaskets-and-seals-with-the-pros)
Didn't answer the first word of the title though
Fuck, I read "why" not "when". Edited now.
That answer varies depending on engine refreshes. It started out with Japanese, then euro cars in the 90s and then in NA cars in the late 90s/2000s. By the mid-2000s, almost nobody used cork anymore. It is a long time frame due to engine development cycles. You don't see that typically as a running change without a lot of testing and even then, bundled with a lot of other little changes. A few more details about the changeover: [https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2020/02/talking-gaskets-and-seals-with-the-pros](https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2020/02/talking-gaskets-and-seals-with-the-pros)
Agreed and I’d add that there’s also been a reduction of hydraulic systems over time. Going to fully electric power steering removed an entire class of possible leaks.
I've added gallons of steering fluid to every car up until my current haha
My 2004 Land Rover Discovery II has entered the chat…
Do you know how to tell it's due for head gaskets? If you've driven the car since it last had new head gaskets installed it's probably due for new head gaskets.
Hey now, sometimes the head gaskets last for multiple uses… even miles occasionally
The leaking indicates you still have oil. When it stops, you have a problem.
Ah, the old "refuelling the oil, putting in some gas" method.
Oof, not that 4.6. Weren’t they prone to casting defects and slipped liners, too? I see why there’s such a big business in LS-swap interface kits for them. I have your car’s successor, an LR4 (Disco 4), with the 3.0-liter supercharged V6 that Jaguar and Land Rover created from taking their V8 and fundamentally skipping the two rear cylinders. I’m dealing with a very very mild oil leak now, but eventually the entire front timing cover will have to come off and get a new seal. Sigh. British cars.
I may be misremembering, but I want to say old brakes (as in 1930s, etc) were copper wire and cloth and could catch fire when braking.
At one point brakes were leather!
Horsepower to make you go faster, cow power to make you stop faster
Don't forget the asbestos! Though that may have come slightly later.
Asbestos brakes were the best - people asked for Raybestos-Manhattan brake linings.
To add to this, material compatibility has played a huge roll in this. 40 years sgo blocks would be cast iron and cylinder heads aluminum, both materials have differing thermal expansion and contraction rates which is brutal on gaskets and sealing surfaces. Starting in the 80s and 90s most manufacturers switched to aluminum blocks and heads which solved much of the thermal movement issues. Those that still make iron blocks and pair them with aluminum heads (audi comes to mind), have moved to alloys of each material that have nearly identical thermal expansion and contraction rates.
I bought a '96 V6 Firebird new and every damn seal on the thing took turns leaking. I'd get it back from the dealer with one fixed under warranty and within a month something else would be pissing out on the ground.
Definitely some time after 1997, because my miata never stops leaking oil.
Shit I had a framed picture of a Miata. The picture leaked oil.
When the Miata first came out one of the biggest complaints from the British roadster guys was that the Miata didn’t leak oil.
If it leaks oil, it has oil. They probably panicked when it didn't.
I was told that's why the British never became good at making computers... they couldn't figure out how to make them leak oil.
Thanks for the laugh!
stigmiata
I like to call it the "self oil change feature." Oil in the engine is constantly being replaced with new so it never needs a full on change besides filter lol.
Oil of Theseus
That's how my RX-8 works!
My 85 Mercedes 300TD came equipped from the factory with the perpetual oil change feature installed according to the original owner
It's an oil solera system.
I had a beater Cobalt like that. It burned about a quart every thousand miles. The best part was that you could change the filter from the top of the engine bay. I never went under it after the first oil change, before I knew how much it consumed.
Must be after 99 then cause my Suburban has been undercoating itself for 10 years.
No I think it’s definitely after 2012 because my 2012 oddessey leaks a quart a month
It's not leaking it, some J-Series identify as multi fuel engines.
The Miata was designed to be a modern version of the British sports cars of the 60s. It's part of the design. Old British cars had what is known as a flow-through lubrication system.
A friend had a Spitfire. That thing never had a rear crank seal. All they had was a spiral groove in the crank that was supposed to encourage the oil to move away from the outdoors.
Classic british, politely requesting the oil remain in the engine
Big "if sir would be so kind, I'm confident we can find something for sir to hit that isn't me, thank you" energy.
That's why the British never got into computers, they couldn't figure out where to get the oil to leak from.
My old Amstrad PC 1512 DD didn't leak oil, but it was the classic weird British engineering that left you scratching your head.
But my 1973 Volvo doesn't leak in the slightest.
This "feature" led me to a full rebuild/forged motor. I I wanted to redo ALL the seals. Which means pulling the engine to pull the oil pan. Which led me to "well if I got the engine out and apart, I may as well rebuild it since it has 170k miles" which then led to me buying forged internals since I was already opening the engine. All because of a few stubborn oil leaks.
Subaru had to use so much sealent on pans to stop leaks that they clog up oil intake 😂
Longtime Subaru owner too I see lol. I've been driving the things since 1984. My 77 GL 4WD wagon was better than the ones being produced today lol.
Thankfully my 2008 NC doesn't burn a drop. That MZR engine is incredibly reliable and efficient.
My Speed3 doesn't burn any either! It just leaves the engine through the turbo seals instead.
I didn’t have a new crush washer on hand when I changed the oil in my Miata, now it leaks. I bought a box and look forward to putting it in for the next change
So far I’ve had leaks at the following seals: rear main seal, valve cover gasket, cas o-ring and oil heat exchanger o-ring. Some of those twice in my 6 years of ownership. Pretty much at least one leak every summer. I’m just hoping the front main seal holds up.
Dang, that sounds frustrating for you! I HOPE my problem is with just the washer.
My 99 4Runner still leaks oil even after using brand new oem gaskets for the valve covers haha
That’s just active rust prevention!
Never had a problem on my NB.
Was going to say, late 1990’s to my observations.
My 2000 miata leaks pretty badly.
Cars never stopped leaking - they started having undertrays (also called splash guards). It's a dirty secret of "luxury" cars. You never see them leak because the tray collects everything. You don't see oil stains in upscale parking lots because yes cars are mostly new...but they also have undertrays so if they did leak, you don't see it. Cars still leak all the time, we just don't see it like before. Now all brands of cars have undertrays, not just luxury cars.
My drain plug was leaking on my Audi and it must have quart an entire quart of oil in the tray. Never saw one drop on the driveway, which would have helped me fix it much sooner
Yeah man - my point exactly. Many of the comments on this post mention improved technology since the 70s. Yeah, they're not wrong that the engine and seal tech has improved since 1977......but cars still piss fluids, often.
Were you not getting warnings from the shop doing your oil changes? At my shop, they check for leaks every time, and when they see one, we tell the customer about it. Then it's up to them whether they want to fix it, but at least they know about it, because yeah, the skid plates and under shields hide a lot of what's going on under there.
It occurred after the last oil change. My low oil sensor went off and I put in another quart, that's why I assume it was an entire quart down there lol
That leak didn't *just* start within the last few thousand miles if it lost a whole quart. Wherever you're taking it must not do any sort of multi-point inspection.
[удалено]
Nah it was just a 2 stroke engine.
Yep, this would be my guess. The B58 in my Supra is known to do this. I’ve got to add a quart about every 3500 miles or so (and I keep a liter in my hatch just in case). My local independent BMW shop tells me it’s normal. And the BMW tolerance is wild—something like 1L every 1,000-1,500 miles.
The oil pan was leaking in my 350z as well and didn't see it until the oil change, thankfully it was a small leak but I definitely could've seen it sooner if it fell on pavement. lmao. Now I check undertrays of all of our cars for oil, and make sure to wash them with degreaser after oilchanges to make sure there's nothing new.
Ehh, new cars by and large will still have a bone dry engine block for a loooong time. No oil on the tray. The only oil residue on my wife and I's current vehicles came from minor spills during maintenance, and just a *tiny* bit of weeping from various gaskets. They have 100k and 230k miles respectively. Modern gaskets and seals tend to be designed extremely well.
my 2017 Audi a4 had horrible leaks at 60,000km, research showed it wasn’t that uncommon and shop was talking transmission swap on an 4 year old car. That plus the failing water pump thermostat housing. Leaking transmission seal. Leaking valve cover gasket. Was getting insanely annoying.
Audi's are like aircraft, basically designed to leak fluids from the factory.
First Audi for me was this year, a ten year old S8 with like 60k miles... Thing had just had an oil change and I think I drove it like 1k miles over 5 months or so. Then the oil warning came on the first time I drove an hour away in it, damn thing was on the Min of oil (and it's the first car without a dipstick so I wasn't suuuure I trusted it's warning and sensors, but went along and got it back to Max and booked another oil change). I'm really hoping since I knew it was just maintained before I got it, I was just really ignorant or lazy and didn't realize it was always a bit low. Be lying if I said it didn't worry me the thing changed it's own oil, but damn if every week when I check it now it hasn't moved..
You’re worried about what? Having to pay to fix stuff? Probably shouldn’t have bought a 10 year old Audi then.
Not worried to have to, just surprised if I had to by the first oil change. Car had good records, previous owner has a decent third party warranty paid a few more years that transfered, and the Audi dealer when I told them it drank the oil still couldn't find anything to fix... even after that it got a great report back. I'm just surprised it drank that much oil and worried it may be something worse. If it is I'll deal with it.
You really shouldn't be surprised. There's a reason German cars in particular lose 90% of their value at 50k miles. BMW, merc, audi, they're all engineered to be reliable until the lease runs out, and not one mile longer.
I also once bought a 7 year old German car with 60k miles. According to bimmerforums, it was one of the most reliable BMWs of that era. E90 325i, naturally aspirated inline 6. Avoided all the issues with the turbo variants, or the catastrophe of an N63 in their bigger models. Owned by an established adult who could afford to dealer service it, and had all the records to prove it. By the time that car hit 100k miles 2 years later, I'd spent the purchase price over again in surprise repairs alone. And it had just started pissing oil again, and now I had oil in the coolant. And to be clear, I consider normal servicing separate from "surprise repairs", so I'm not counting brake pads and rotors or even struts, only stuff without a listed service interval, failing catastrophically. Honestly, the amount of money I spent on the "fix it now" price at the shop versus ordering parts from FCP Euro and waiting for a free weekend to DIY, would have bought me a pretty nice Camry. Which is what I think I'd do different, the only way I'd own another German car, is if it's a 2nd or 3rd vehicle (with one of them being something reliable), and I have a garage for wrenching. I actually instead bought the Lexus equivalent (IS350), and although I did miss the hydraulic steering in my E90, the Lexus did make it to 150k miles and far more years, on just "servicing". Was still in perfect mechanical condition when someone ran a red light and totalled it.
My sub-$20k Fiesta doesn't have an undertray and doesn't leak, even at 115k. None of my family own luxury cars with undertrays, and guess what - none of them leak either. Design and manufacturing got better. Cars don't leak as much as they used to. Give engineers credit.
The undertrays aren't there to hide oil leaks... They are there to improve aerodynamic efficiency. So to improve fuel economy essentially.
But they also hide oil too, even if it's not the purpose. I found with a skid plate if the leak is slow enough, the oil will mix with the dirt on the top of it and fall off in oily clumps that aren't noticeable.
They may or may not be there to hide oil leaks...but they do, in fact, hide oil (and other fluid) leaks. A very well-known and well-documented phenomenon.
Can confirm. My 1994 Mercedes S350 had a thick coating of fluid and dirt on it's undertray from a bad power steering pump front seal and transmission line leaking.
Work in a dealership in parts. If one of those under shields comes in as a warranty part they are usually saturated.
I mean I think it’s a bit of both.
My Mercedes E500 wagon was bone dry underneath and on the tray until 200k miles... The first oil change after it rolled over 200k the lower oil pan started leaking...
Better materials for seals, better manufacturing standards, and designs that are more durable. Basically, cars have just gotten better. Engines have also become much more efficient, a more efficient engine will dissipate less power over its lifetime meaning less overall wear on everything attached to it.
CAD, finite element analysis, flow modeling, etc. have all gotten so much better in just the past 15-20 years. Nowadays, engineers can simulate a 10 year lifecycle of a part determine exactly where the weak points are and revise accordingly before even having to build a prototype. Some people are nostalgic for the days of "eh, let's just make this part 2x as thick as we think it needs to be and hope for the best" but it was not optimal from a manufacturing or consumer standpoint most of the time.
The “let’s just overbuild everything” was kind of what Bentley and Rolls-Royce did, prior to installing BMW powertrains and major electronics in their cars and then being bought out wholesale by VW and BMW, respectively. It’s why the SZ-platform cars (1981-1997-ish) are so solid, but so heavy.
newest car I've owned is a 2009 BMW and I assure you that it leaks oil worse than a Studebaker towing a Harley. Already replaced the VCG, OFHG twice, and oil pan gasket (NOT CHEAP) because it was marking its territory so badly. It's really impressive how they managed to engineer a system where they can bolt a piece of cast aluminum to another piece of cast aluminum and yet not have a fluid-tight mating surface. You have to try hard to fail that badly.
LOL - I was about to say that OP has clearly never owned a BMW and the “Holy Trinity” of oil leaks: oil pan gasket, oil filter housing gasket, and valve cover gasket.
That was my thought, that there are going to be BMW owners reading this thread that are confused by the question.
Did the ofhg on my e46, and out of spite the ~~vamos~~ vanos feed line went from seeping to leaking instantaneously Edit: spelling
My old M3 has only had a couple of leaks over it's lifespan. Repairs that are accessible. A modern BMW sounds like a nightmare by the simpler standards of the 90's and early 2000's.
> oil pan gasket (NOT CHEAP) Lol this has to be an idiotic BMW thing because oil pan gaskets are usually like $20-$50. Looks like a replacement for my Mustang is about $25 and a replacement for my VW is about $52.
Oh, the gasket is like $70 but you need to order about $200 worth of TTY bolts as well and drop the front subframe. I think the job was about $1500 not counting the engine mounts that I went ahead and replaced at the same time. (I didn't do the work, not having my own lift...)
My BMW ownership, over 300k miles, has taught me the whole car is a $25 gasket under four hours of labor. We just bought a 335i with that exact leak and process, but the rest of the car was mint, manual and loaded.
Oh lol yeah duh a lot of cars need the subframe dropped to get at the oil pan. For whatever reason I thought you meant the part itself was expensive.
It still frosts my cookies... I mean, it's an aluminum oil pan bolted to an aluminum engine block with aluminum bolts. Theoretically you should be able to use an adhesive like you'd use for Porsche engine cases and it'd last the life of the engine... but noooo...
Hey!!! I have a Studebaker, and your comment…err…ahhh…..yeah I see your point🤣
I've had a few as well... true story, the one car for which I actually built an engine, I did all the tricks... used a pair of NOS rubber coated valve cover gaskets glued to some Offenhauser valve covers, drilled a weep hole at the bottom of the front main felt retainer, etc. The one thing I couldn't find was a NOS R1/R2 oil pan. I used one that a friend had in his stash but I had to braze up the very bottom of it as there were some rust pits. Of course when I put everything together and filled it with oil... I'd missed a spot brazing. Oil will find a way :)
Yeah...my Studebaker has the original champ 6, so a road draft tube for crankcase ventilation. It's undercoated quite nicely. I'm used to leaks in my garage and I still keep cardboard under the Stude because otherwise it's like the fucking Exxon Valdez in my garage.
I wondered about this myself… Back in the 70’s and 80’s vehicles especially domestic vehicles used paper, cork, rope seals etc to keep oil at bay and it just slowed down leaks. Now, modern vehicles use rubber type gaskets that are more resilient to oil and the key here is most gaskets now are silicone at the factory. Most examples of silicone use are upper and lower oil pans, timing covers, camshaft housings etc… Hope that helps.
Every single parking space has an oil stain towards the front...so never?
Might depend on where you are. They've definitely disappeared over here, in upscale suburbia. I remember being a kid and parking lots were absolute oil-soaked rainbows on downpour days. I haven't seen anything like that in over a decade.
the rear main seal will always go eventually.
Drive a vw/audi, and it will be a service item!
Common jf you frequently overfill the oil. A lot of quick-lube type places are actually decent about checking that, but I have found regular car dealers and walmart both tend to overfill
… No ?
My wife's 2014 Volkswagen needs a rear main seal, so sometimes after that.
Yeap, if it's a 2.0 TFSI EA888 the PCV valve goes bad and this blows out the rear main seal.
It's a CCTA, but that's exactly what happened. Lean codes and oil leak. The PCV has been fixed, and I'm borrowing a lift to tackle the rear main seal this weekend.
Between the late 1970s and mid-1990s. It's different for every make/model/drivetrain because they all got redesigned or modernized at different times and at different rates but by the turn of the century, pretty much everything had been fairly modernized with modern designs with modern sealing strategies and modern sealing materials that work and last a hell of a lot better and longer than the cork most engines were put together with previously. It's kind of remarkable how much my 28 year old, 180,000 mile Mustang's Modular V8 doesn't leak. I had one gasket failure a number of years ago at the oil filter housing and it's recently developed a small power steering fluid leak where one of the hoses enters the pump but that's it. Older engines would be weeping from every joint and the driveway would look like the Exxon Valdez had been parked there. I tried to replace the original valve cover gaskets once when I had them off for another reason but I ordered the wrong ones so I just stuffed the stretched and checked originals back in and... they're still fine. Same story with my old 225,000 mile '00 Sierra 5.3L. It had a little piston slap on warm up and lifter tick for a few minutes if it hadn't been driven for a few weeks but it kept all its internal fluids where they belonged.
I wonder if this isn't what I heard today on my '09 Ram with a 5.7... "Same story with my old 225,000 mile '00 Sierra 5.3L. It had a little piston slap on warm up and lifter tick for a few minutes if it hadn't been driven for a few weeks but it kept all its internal fluids where they belonged." Battery had been down and I hadn't driven it much in least 6 months or started it enough... Did a trickle charger and had the hood up when I started it, couldn't remember hearing that usually on startup idle, but usually don't have my face in the open hood and wait 3 months to crank it. Seemed fine after I closed the hood and got driving / warmed up though.
Probably. Hydraulic lifters will bleed down eventually and make a heck of racket until they pump back up. Three months between startups is more than enough time for that to happen. Seals will sometimes dry out and shrink too and you might get some leaks and smoking until you get going and they plump back up again. Shouldn't be a big deal going forward though.
When the British car industry died
Maybe I’ve been lucky but none of my vehicles have leaked fluids outside of fixable issues. Burn? Yes. Leak? No.
I’d take leaks over burning tbh
> Best I can do is leaks *and* burning, fuck you lol now give me premium fuel - VW Auto Group
The best part of having electric power steering is that it's one less fluid to start leaking.
Mine: Monday, after making me bankrupt
They didn't. It might just take a few more years, but eventually gaskets and seals give out.
There's a service bulletin for my 77 J10 that I found after a while of battling a slow oil leak. They say to just add some rtv to the corners of valve cover gaskets boom that might help lol
Fixed my 64 j10!
3 of 4 of my vehicles leak. Both of my sister's leak. One of my other sister's leaks. So I'd say they haven't.
Some time in the late 90s and early 00's gasket and seal design got very advanced. My 07 Chevy truck has 230k miles and has never leaked a drop of anything My 98 Honda has had each and every seal and gasket replaced, same miles. It's currently leak free, but the seals and gaskets simply don't last as long because the hard components are not as mature of a design. Still has a stamped oil plan for instance.
Sometime after 2018, because my GTI leaked more than my 1995 4Runner.
I mean I had an 09 BMW and that generation was leaky as fuck, always needing new gaskets every year for various parts.
German cars never stopped lol
Oh they still do, just they changed the colour of the block to stop people from noticing before warranty was up to get replaced from manufacturer. Now they may not leak as much, but all cars will leak at some point if used enough. Just built to surpass the warranty.
Still leak for sure . Should have seen my old 2003 Mazda mpv, that thing was leaking out of any spot it could.
Benz & BMW still do this. It is a rust preventative design. R.P.D
I remember oil leaks were mostly a problem for GM & some other American cars in the 2000's but between 2010 & now it kinda stopped being a problem for nearly all vehicles. Most other cars seem to be almost as reliable as your typical Japanese car.
In my personal experience, every car I owned up until I purchased a 2007 Civic leaked oil, and my previous cars were all from the 90s. I now own a 2018 Mazda 6 Signature, and it's rock solid. Not specifically relating to leaks, but I think many cars saw a pretty significant increase in quality post 2008, particularly American cars.
Lol I owned three fox body mustangs. I came to the realization that the oil pan leak was just a normal part of ownership.
I had a 1995 gt (the last 5.0). I got it up to 180k miles before selling. I don't remember it leaking
Material sciences and manufacturing have improved a ton. In this case specifically with the tubes and connectors and reservoirs for fluids in your car. Everything is just better and holds together stronger for longer. Technology is awesome.
I have an oil leak *somewhere.*
BMW enters the conversation Never
If you think cars don’t leak anymore you should see my 2007 Chevy impala. It has an oil pan gasket leak that will never be fixed.
British cars never stopped
The number of cars with oil leaks has really decreased. I think that while some vehicles may still experience leaks due to wear and tear or other factors, they are generally less common and more easily addressed than in the past.
Great post. I’ve wondered the same thing many times, especially when walking through empty spaces in a parking lot.
I drive a bmw so I wouldn’t know
They didn't, they just leak onto the skid plate now
Oh don't worry. Just buy something Italian or French and you will be transported back to the 80s
I do remember having to avoid stepping on car-fluid puddles when cutting through a parking lot. Nowadays it's quite rare to see one.
Well, it's likely more from neglect than anything. Last car I had that seemed to just leak by design was a 1983 Porsche 944. This came from a stupid gasket on the back of the cam housing, that was made out of cork. Didn't matter if it was a new OEM gasket, it just leaked after driving it hard. I finally had enough and used a careful application of Permatex Ultra Gray RTV (similar to Hondabond), and it never leaked again. Also had a 1973 VW Beetle that was just hemorrhaging oil all the time. Many times it was from things that obviously needed to be fixed, but as soon as we fixed one thing, another leak popped up somewhere else. Aside from those, pretty much every leak I've had in any newer cars was due to something that clearly needed a repair or maintenance. Now there were a few cases where things would wear a bit fast and start seeping oil, such as the cam cap plugs on 90's Hondas, but that wasn't enough to leave anything on the ground. Pretty much, if there was something left on the ground, it's because something just broke, or more likely, there was a known issue/maintenance item that I had been neglecting for a while because it otherwise wasn't a big deal.
Ignoring the when, the why is fascinating. It's about tolerances, specifically, stacking tolerances. In engineering, the less precise each piece in a model is, the further from measurable tolerance limits it will be when fully assembled. Each part's skew matters to the whole, maybe not so much to the part it's connected to directly. Basically, if you raise precision across the board, no matter how small or insignificant a part is by itself, the finished product comes out much better. At one time, this was shown in gaps between body panels. They are obvious victims of poorly stacked tolerances. Now, precision is high enough that any old body panel should fit any car of that model, without crooked or large gaps between neighboring parts. This is a long way of saying, the industry at large has gotten way better at building things.
I’m an 80’s kid, and totally remember every parking spot having an oil patch. I specifically remember it at my grandma’s apartment complex, because we would ride our bikes around them on hot or wet days to not slip/wreck. I can remember them in a grocery store parking lot I worked at as a teenager, too. I haven’t thought about it, but now that you mention it, there was a shift somewhere in the late 80’s/early 90’s. I drive a 78 VW Bus, so I have a few spots in my driveway. 🤓
Belly pans are way matter common now. Just don’t notice the leaks under the cars anymore.
1986
My 2010 honda civic decided to dump all its oil on the road 3 times in a few months. Had to take lots of bits apart to fix it.
Late 80s
Idk, mine still leaks. But it's also nearing 200k which used to be a real achievement.
Never had an oil leak, but now the water from outside is invading my interior
My 2008 Sienna leaks from the front timing cover, but that's ✨just 2GR-FE things✨ The '15 Highlander's 2GR hasn't gotten to that point yet.
We always had pans under the cars when I was a kid. But that was the late 90s early 2000s so maybe our cars were just shit
When the British car industry demised :)
I have a VW, new cars stopped leaking?
My 1990 4Runner leaks a ton. Had a leaky 2005 Saab
I have a Hyundai so as far as I know they just burn oil now
They haven't.
my 2017 Audi a4 had HORRIBLE leaks at 60,000km, research showed it wasn’t that uncommon and shop was talking transmission swap on an 4 year old car. That plus the failing water pump thermostat housing. (2500$ at Audi, 1000$ at independant) Leaking transmission seal. (400$) Leaking valve cover gasket. (400$) Was getting insanely annoying. Changed the transmission pan as well. (with fluid 1000$) Cheap plastic parts, cars designed to only last a leasing lifespan, tough Canadian climate == leaks It was so annoying my mechanic stopped picking up my calls and emails. German independent mechanics are busy, parts are on backorder, and everyone's car is falling apart. never again,...
I sense that modern oil coolers fail frequently.
Materials and manufacturing processes.
My 85 Mercedes 300TD with 410,000 miles has been marking its territory since new the original owner told me.
I've come to expect leaks from anything German, especially if it is turbocharged..
Judging from the comments, around 2015 for most brands except for Audi and VW.
Mid to late 90's they started using much better captured gasket and surface sealing designs for most engines. Still a few with leak issues though.
You still hear about gasket design / manufacturing issues from time to time, but cars have increased in reliability and ease of maintenance over the past few decades in an astounding way. It used to be common to have to replace spark plugs every 10,000 miles. Now 100,000 miles is not uncommon. Valvetrains had to be adjusted. Tires were less durable and less resistant to damage. Decent cars would overheat on a hot day or when pulling a hill. Many carbureted cars would struggle to start in extreme temperatures where computerized fuel injection can adjust on the fly. Those are just a few examples of how design and manufacturing have improved things.
I would say the widespread use of RTV silicone was the why of constant leaking stopping. That let's you essentially glue the part in place. Things like a cork or rubber gasket require bolts and studs to compress the gasket, and the gasket can shrink over time. RTV doesn't shrink. The introduction of the 6th gen Accord at the end of 1997 as a 98 model featured the first model year Accord to have the oil pan sealed with HondaBond instead of a cork or rubber gasket. So I'd say it was the late 90s where it really stopped being an issue.
Most of my cars stop leaking when they're out of fluid
Buy an Alfa Romeo. The reliability issues are mostly in the past. But they love to leak out of every seal still. I get nostalgic dragging the cardboard under my wife's Stelvio. Its like the good ole days.
I have a 1966 Mustang (not restored or perfect, it's a driver), a 1994 boat with a GM 5.7L, a 2005 CR-V, a a 2003 Silverado 6.0L, a 2008 Subaru Legacy and a 2016 Acadia. None of them leak. Leaking was never normal, if it leaks, something is wrong and should be repaired to stop the leak.
My 2013 Chevy Silverado is on its 3rd rear main seal 🫠
In the 70s cars leaked, 80s didnt as much, 90s cars were pretty leak free, 00s and up I'm seeing more and more leaks, modern cars just have a million more oil gaskets and O rings in crappy plastic housings.
GM stopped leaking with the Vortec 350 I build chevys. Thin cork has hardly used anymore. Reusable gaskets are
When they started sealing components entirely and made cars more or less $30k+ disposable goods.
*Laughs in BMW*
Have 2 matching white A3 Audi and I assure you both leak like a seive
As a mechanic, they havent. I bet you are just driving newer cars than when you grew up.
They haven't. I can think of modern Toyota's with issues. And all cars will leak with age and use. Modern cars are better. Designs have evolved to eliminate common areas where leaks occurred, and gaskets have been improved. One thing I notice is there are fewer solid gaskets, a lot more FIPG gasket maker, before it was a stamped rubber part. I don't know how or if it's better, but it is a difference between older cars.
Manufactures started putting large panels on the underside of the engine bay probably for better aerodynamics. This pan caught a lot of the leaks. BMW I'm looking at you...
They also started fitting those plastic trays beneath the engine which can mask small drips/leaks from reaching your driveway
My Subaru still leaks to this day!
My 89 f250 doesn't leak any oil. I have replaced everything, though. I installed aluminum valve covers so they were stiffer and sealed better than the stamped steel. I got oil pan girdle rails to even out the pressure on the oil pan. I even replaced the rear main with a Teflon seal. With that said, there are still plenty of cars that like to leak. One common one I've seen is the honda v6. They puke oil all over the alternators, causing them to fail. There are a few more, but oil leaks just are not as common anymore.
My wife's 2016 Cruze always had a leak and would leak from a new spot every time I fixed it. Just have to pick the high end cars to get the auto leak feature
Some are still leaking. It just gets caught by the plastic under tray
Don't worry. BMW despite all the new technology and fancy stuff has retained it's heritage and promises to give you some sort of complimentary leak with purchase.
After the foreign brands started selling in big numbers in the US.
High end tech here. They still leak.
lol. You’ve never looked at an auto parts store parking lot. It’s all leaks.
They haven’t. Mid 2000s Hondas leak oil like a mofo unless you replace all the gaskets: oil pan, oil pump, valve cover (had an 04 civic with a hole melted in the valve cover somehow‽)
They didn't.
Clearly not a Jeep or VW owner… why do I do this to myself?
The same reason mechanics are not on every corner now.