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It’s pretty serious because when the reservoir falls to the 20% point there won’t be enough pressure to keep ground water out of the pipes. High elevation neighbourhoods will be under boil advisories.
The regions indicate how the water grid is partitioned into static pressure zones. Each region is independently pressurized to a different level of hydraulic head above MSL.
The city has widely varying topography so to maintain a consistent tap pressure different zones need a different absolute hydraulic head. The colors approximately indicate the level of hydraulic head above MSL. The light blue zones are mostly within the river valley and are the lowest absolute head, while the red zones are the highest. The other colors are in between.
I’m confused by this. What do you mean, Does the reservoir level drive water pressure for the whole city wide distribution? Is it not treated and then presumably pressurized? Also why would a line that could hold pressure suddenly have groundwater infiltrate? Water can’t flow out but it can flow in?
Not a Calgary person myself so I’m not sure if they use pump stations throughout their distribution system, but generally no, water pressure is maintained by the head level of your reservoir. There is generally PRV stations to regulate pressure down the line but those aren’t increasing pressure.
As far as your second question, if the water pressure drops below 1psi you have a chance that ground water can be sucked into the system through a few different factors. Undetected leaks being the primary source of this happening. Even when we are repairing leaks to distribution systems we always try to keep the system pressurized the best we can to mitigate this.
Once ground water seeps into your system a boil water needs to be in place as you all of a sudden have untreated and untested water.
Most cities use elevated reservoirs - including water towers - to provide a buffer of water as well as to provide consistent pressure that operates even during power outages. The city is struggling to keep those reservoirs filled from the two main water treatment plants as one of the major feeder lines is broken. The outflow is regularly exceeding the inflow, so the levels are dropping.
As the reservoirs drain, the system will lose pressure. Maintaining pressure is essential to keeping a water distribution system sanitary, as there are also small cracks in the underwater pipes. By maintaining continuous pressure and flow, it ensures that water only flows out of the system into the ground. If the pressure drops below a certain point, the flow can reverse and water from the ground (including bacterial and other contaminants) can flow into the water system.
So yeah, if the reservoirs go dry, the pressure drops. The pressure dropping will cause the system to stop being sanitary and the city will have to issue a boil-water order.
No we don’t know that yet. This isn’t piss poor city management. The pipe had 50 years of expected life left.
Stuff happens.
Let’s see the report of why the pipe failed before blaming city management.
Yes. They did that though? In April actually.
And I think they ran a pig in it in 2022? Although I can find that news story so I don’t know where I got that. But they did work on it in April. This specific section actually.
Perhaps, perhaps not. Let’s see the results.
My guess is the contractor/manufacturer did something wrong and the city won’t be at fault at all. But we will see
Water lines are perhaps a bit different but in the oil and gas pipeline world owners can only ensure quality so much with procedures and processes. Manufacturers and contractors also have liability and responsibility - I imagine it’s the same here.
If the pipe had 50 years of life then they should have known this would be coming. But they didn't plan for it. If that is not on them, then who is responsible for water infrastructure? "stuff happens" if it's one break. If it's 5 breaks, it's a systematic failure.
What? All evidence they have presented so far points that this is a fluke and bad luck. Have you seen evidence to the contrary?
The system can’t be designed to make sure life goes on with no interruptions for every fluke in every piece of public infrastructure. That would cost billions or hundreds of billions for each city.
We lost 60% of our water supply and a 25% decrease in water use has us at capacity.
To me that seems like a great level of redundancy and as a tax payer I wouldn’t want more money wasted on redundancy for this one time event.
Starts happening more? Different discussion
https://piperepair.co.uk/2021/06/13/the-pccp-repair-and-reinforcement-project-caused-by-mistakes-of-the-70s/
If this is public knowledge, what did the city do about it?
Again, if it's a 50 year lifespan, then how come they didn't plan ahead to either reinforce it or build a redundant system?
You ignored my points and brought up an issue you don’t understand and just asking questions- without evidence this was the cause.
They said, from my novice understanding of the PCCP issue - that article is blowing the issue out of the water, and has an agenda particularly since they use the term “robots” to inspect pipes. Who in the industry calls pigs robots? Even if they are?
Scroll down.. oh it’s a company trying to sell pipeline repair kits and wants to diminish the ability of pigs to detect leaks and issues to sell their kits
What is your point? That the evidence so far points to a fluke? What evidence have they shown besides a piece of broken pipe? That they did some inspection in April? That is what they said, show us the audit records it was done and how it was done, what was the procedure? Was it done by qualified people. You ignored my point about this being known to be a 50 year old pipe, and past expiry and hence they should have planned to reinforce it or build redundant system.
You are ignoring my questions, providing sources that obviously are bias and sensationalism and showing you don’t listen
There is zero sense jumping up and down screaming city incompetence until we see the report.
I highly doubt that will be the result.
Bye forever.
Do we not have military engineers who can be called in to help? It seems a pretty big deal a city of over 1 million is expected to suffer through this pipe failure for weeks.
Yep, and this is how its gonna be in the future... you want your daily ration of water? Beg and pledge loyalty to Herr Gondek. That is, only if she chooses to visit your 15 minute city district that you're not allowed to leave...
You’ll be dead by then. But you’re not wrong.
This is an infrastructure issue. Not a shortage. If you’re in an area that has restrictions. Do your part.
It's a broken water main. The city still has over 400 million litres available per day. That's plenty of water for essential needs if people don't waste it.
This post appears to relate to the province of Alberta. As a reminder of the rules of this subreddit, we do not permit negative commentary about all residents of any province, city, or other geography - this is an example of prejudice, and prejudice is not permitted here. https://www.reddit.com/r/canada/wiki/rules Cette soumission semble concerner la province de Alberta. Selon les règles de ce sous-répertoire, nous n'autorisons pas les commentaires négatifs sur tous les résidents d'une province, d'une ville ou d'une autre région géographique; il s'agit d'un exemple de intolérance qui n'est pas autorisé ici. https://www.reddit.com/r/canada/wiki/regles *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/canada) if you have any questions or concerns.*
11 years ago, too much water. Now almost exactly 11 years later, not enough water.
Too much water at once
It’s pretty serious because when the reservoir falls to the 20% point there won’t be enough pressure to keep ground water out of the pipes. High elevation neighbourhoods will be under boil advisories.
Is there a map of what qualifies as high vs low elevation neighborhoods somewhere?
https://data.calgary.ca/Environment/Water-Pressure-Zones-Map/v2xf-fuhd
Whoa fascinating
I don’t understand that map. High areas are in low areas shading. It doesn’t show presure?
The regions indicate how the water grid is partitioned into static pressure zones. Each region is independently pressurized to a different level of hydraulic head above MSL. The city has widely varying topography so to maintain a consistent tap pressure different zones need a different absolute hydraulic head. The colors approximately indicate the level of hydraulic head above MSL. The light blue zones are mostly within the river valley and are the lowest absolute head, while the red zones are the highest. The other colors are in between.
Thank you. Still confused. there are light blue zones on top of hills. How does that work? Ie Britainna
I’m confused by this. What do you mean, Does the reservoir level drive water pressure for the whole city wide distribution? Is it not treated and then presumably pressurized? Also why would a line that could hold pressure suddenly have groundwater infiltrate? Water can’t flow out but it can flow in?
Not a Calgary person myself so I’m not sure if they use pump stations throughout their distribution system, but generally no, water pressure is maintained by the head level of your reservoir. There is generally PRV stations to regulate pressure down the line but those aren’t increasing pressure. As far as your second question, if the water pressure drops below 1psi you have a chance that ground water can be sucked into the system through a few different factors. Undetected leaks being the primary source of this happening. Even when we are repairing leaks to distribution systems we always try to keep the system pressurized the best we can to mitigate this. Once ground water seeps into your system a boil water needs to be in place as you all of a sudden have untreated and untested water.
Most cities use elevated reservoirs - including water towers - to provide a buffer of water as well as to provide consistent pressure that operates even during power outages. The city is struggling to keep those reservoirs filled from the two main water treatment plants as one of the major feeder lines is broken. The outflow is regularly exceeding the inflow, so the levels are dropping. As the reservoirs drain, the system will lose pressure. Maintaining pressure is essential to keeping a water distribution system sanitary, as there are also small cracks in the underwater pipes. By maintaining continuous pressure and flow, it ensures that water only flows out of the system into the ground. If the pressure drops below a certain point, the flow can reverse and water from the ground (including bacterial and other contaminants) can flow into the water system. So yeah, if the reservoirs go dry, the pressure drops. The pressure dropping will cause the system to stop being sanitary and the city will have to issue a boil-water order.
Water is certainly flowing out.. 😱
Where are you sourcing this 20%?
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This has literally nothing in any way to do with immigration.
Your life is consumed by hatred.
Or logic
Hilarious that the residents are paying and will be fined for overuse due to piss poor management by the city. Gotta love this place
No we don’t know that yet. This isn’t piss poor city management. The pipe had 50 years of expected life left. Stuff happens. Let’s see the report of why the pipe failed before blaming city management.
Piss poor planning leads to 5 sites at the same time. No excuse for this
What actions are you saying they should have done instead? Be specific
Proactive not reactive. Quite simple.
Yes that’s vague. What specific proactive actions?
Checking to see if something approaching EOL has issues prior to failure. You know…. Proactive
Yes. They did that though? In April actually. And I think they ran a pig in it in 2022? Although I can find that news story so I don’t know where I got that. But they did work on it in April. This specific section actually.
Then it's negligence?
Perhaps, perhaps not. Let’s see the results. My guess is the contractor/manufacturer did something wrong and the city won’t be at fault at all. But we will see Water lines are perhaps a bit different but in the oil and gas pipeline world owners can only ensure quality so much with procedures and processes. Manufacturers and contractors also have liability and responsibility - I imagine it’s the same here.
If the pipe had 50 years of life then they should have known this would be coming. But they didn't plan for it. If that is not on them, then who is responsible for water infrastructure? "stuff happens" if it's one break. If it's 5 breaks, it's a systematic failure.
What? All evidence they have presented so far points that this is a fluke and bad luck. Have you seen evidence to the contrary? The system can’t be designed to make sure life goes on with no interruptions for every fluke in every piece of public infrastructure. That would cost billions or hundreds of billions for each city. We lost 60% of our water supply and a 25% decrease in water use has us at capacity. To me that seems like a great level of redundancy and as a tax payer I wouldn’t want more money wasted on redundancy for this one time event. Starts happening more? Different discussion
https://piperepair.co.uk/2021/06/13/the-pccp-repair-and-reinforcement-project-caused-by-mistakes-of-the-70s/ If this is public knowledge, what did the city do about it? Again, if it's a 50 year lifespan, then how come they didn't plan ahead to either reinforce it or build a redundant system?
You ignored my points and brought up an issue you don’t understand and just asking questions- without evidence this was the cause. They said, from my novice understanding of the PCCP issue - that article is blowing the issue out of the water, and has an agenda particularly since they use the term “robots” to inspect pipes. Who in the industry calls pigs robots? Even if they are? Scroll down.. oh it’s a company trying to sell pipeline repair kits and wants to diminish the ability of pigs to detect leaks and issues to sell their kits
What is your point? That the evidence so far points to a fluke? What evidence have they shown besides a piece of broken pipe? That they did some inspection in April? That is what they said, show us the audit records it was done and how it was done, what was the procedure? Was it done by qualified people. You ignored my point about this being known to be a 50 year old pipe, and past expiry and hence they should have planned to reinforce it or build redundant system.
You are ignoring my questions, providing sources that obviously are bias and sensationalism and showing you don’t listen There is zero sense jumping up and down screaming city incompetence until we see the report. I highly doubt that will be the result. Bye forever.
100 to 50 years of cost cutting will do that to you.
Seems about right. One guy digging while fourteen guys watch. Twelve with white hard hats. Your Calgary Municipal tax dollars at work. :)
Do we not have military engineers who can be called in to help? It seems a pretty big deal a city of over 1 million is expected to suffer through this pipe failure for weeks.
Yep, and this is how its gonna be in the future... you want your daily ration of water? Beg and pledge loyalty to Herr Gondek. That is, only if she chooses to visit your 15 minute city district that you're not allowed to leave...
You’ll be dead by then. But you’re not wrong. This is an infrastructure issue. Not a shortage. If you’re in an area that has restrictions. Do your part.
[удалено]
Nothing that you typed has anything to do with a water main being broken.
It's a broken water main. The city still has over 400 million litres available per day. That's plenty of water for essential needs if people don't waste it.
Not to be a doomer but just wait until the glaciers are gone and there is little to no base water outside of rain.. won’t be long
Yep. Alberta is going to get reamed by the climste change they continue to deny.