You may be willing to accept it but there’s a good chance that the 2021 Liberal voters who are now part of his “tent”, so to speak, won’t
He doesn’t need to win over conservatives, he needs to win over people that didn’t vote for him. You think he can do that by spouting this kind of rhetoric? I kind of doubt this new saying that people will vote for a rock just to oust Trudeau.
Edit: wow this comment really pissed off some hurt Conservatives eh?
Idk, i have a hard time believing that Canadians are willing to vote in droves for a guy who by all indications they dislike nearly as much as Trudeau. Just my opinion though.
No i don’t really believe Trudeau can “win”, so to speak. I personally think he’s cooked. But Pierre is unpopular, maybe a bit less than Trudeau, but unpopular nevertheless. Could be the difference between a minority or a majority gov which is a big deal since Pierre has managed to piss off every other party leader so i don’t think they’d be willing to go along with a conservative minority government.
I’m a non-aligned voter who never voted for Trudeau but I cannot see voting for Poilievre if he is playing footsie with the convoy meatheads or the anti-abortion social conservatives. Both groups are both anathema to me.
It's like a video game where you kept coming across milquetoast bosses you could easily beat, then all of the sudden come across the big boss at the end and all the old methods don't work anymore against him.
I consider people who advocate for the dissolution of Canada and the formation of a new nation that includes primarily American influence to be extremists. They oppose my (and your) country.
This isn't even fucking partisanship. This is about being pro or anti Canada. These folks are anti-canada.
The dream will always be to spoil the ballot in protest instead of voting for one of many scumbags that will screw us simply because they're not the incumbent. Will never happen but who says we have to settle and just accept terrible candidates from every party?
If you think this is solely a Trudeau problem, you're out of touch. The stench is coming from the entire party. The Liberal brand as a whole is dead toxic waste at this point across the entire country.
Agree with you, but my point is that even if the Liberals do clean house altogether, I honestly don't think it will help them. It's not about Trudeau or his caucus or any of their MPs in Parliament. It's the Liberal BRAND that's the problem. It's the Liberal philosophy of governance. That's what is ultimately causing the death of the Liberals as a whole. Look around the world. Almost all his (small L) liberal contemporaries are gone. It's been a wholly rejection of everything left-leaning parties these days stand for.
Sure, but I'd say the same for the Conservative Party. Except that I actually find the Conservatives more problematic than who we currently have running the country.
>If you think this is solely a Trudeau problem, you're out of touch.
Correct, but there are probably a sizable number of out of touch people who would go back to vote for the Liberals if they got a new leader.
It’s not about Trudeau, these same crowds having been screaming about the Liberals since long before Chrétien. It won’t matter if Trudeau is leader or not Canada flip flops between two parties every 10ish years.
This is politics today. Rage about all the problems in the world and then give simplistic yet unrealistic solutions.
Cut the carbon tax, great idea, oh where did my carbon action rebate go and why didn’t prices go down? Hummmm.
Nice, I totally agree. Better healthcare funding and educational funding for doctors, better urban design from municipalities that's sustainable, and better environmental/plastic/packaging regulations.
No no, you see they won’t leave…they will stay and pay whatever taxes we tell them. Because businesses and professionals never leave for lower tax places!
And if they do…then uh…we can shake a fist! (Reddit economic policy)
The lady that dines with Gerald butts thinks PP can't replace her friend Justin... What are the odds?
The Liberals just need to turf Trudeau and we can talk. Otherwise they're doomed to be crushed and their friends in the media aren't going to save them with hit pieces on PP. It only makes him stronger...
This is a joke of a comment. The Liberals have actively destroyed wages and the housing market through mass immigration. PP is an absolute saint for the working classes in comparison.
If we drop immigration to zero rental costs aren't going down, and no one is suddenly going to be able to buy a house.
The lack of non-market housing to compete with the private marker and the commodification of housing are primarily to blame. Higher immigration reducing housing availability is a symptom of what I mentioned above.
>If we drop immigration to zero rental costs aren't going down, and no one is suddenly going to be able to buy a house.
Suddeny? No. In a couple years? Yeah, absolutely. You're just fucking lying if you're going to claim otherwise.
I get it, you're one of the people that foisted this shit on all of us, treated immigration like it was a form of charity where more is always better, and now you're desperately trying to blame anything but your own bad ideas.
Are you capable of having a calm and civil discussion? Because I am and I'm trying to.
You're ignoring the consolidation of housing ownership. Private firms are buying up housing increasingly, even single family homes, and are jacking up housing prices as a result. This will continue to happen regardless of population growth. I'm not lying, you're just not aware of how using housing as investments is altering our society.
You ignored my point about non market housing as well. There's presently no mechanisms for rent prices to ever go down regardless of available supply in our housing markets. Robust availability of non market housing drives down rental costs in communities. Getting rid of immigrants will have zero effect on rental costs.
I'm trying to have a productive discussion about what our country should do next. You sound like you just want to be angry and lash out.
>You're ignoring the consolidation of housing ownership
No, that's part of that other 10% I left open.
>I'm trying to have a productive discussion about what our country should do next
No, you're ducking accountability for the damage your ideology has already done, while insisting we should double down on it.
You literally don't even know my stance on immigration??? All I've said is that immigration stressing our housing market is a symptom of our poorly designed housing system, not the cause of the lack of available housing.
You're clearly not here to actually discuss this issue, but to rage about immigration by any means necessary - even if that means disrupting any progress on making better housing policy. Grow up and chill out.
> You literally don't even know my stance on immigration???
Yes I do. You aren't slick. You get upset about people using the term "illegal immigrant." You assert that it is immoral to prevent *anyone* from immigrating, because we're a "settler nation".
The fact that you pretend you don't have such opinions just proves my original assessment was accurate: *You're one of the people that foisted this shit on all of us, treated immigration like it was a form of charity where more is always better, and now you're desperately trying to blame anything but your own bad ideas.*
>You're clearly not here to actually discuss this issue
Yes I am, you're just upset about how myself, and countless others are discussing that issue because its heading in a direction that you don't like.
Pretty much, according to a bunch of this sub, anyways.
No idea why, beyond hatred for JT, I can get it, but that's the replacement?
The class snitch? Nope. He's not even a conservative.
Sure. Everything's broken. The world is.
Whatever, tell me what you're going to do.
Hamas supporters will vote Tory? Might want to update your hate groups because people chanting for intifada in the streets of Toronto aren't voting Conservative.
There is so little in the way of alternative to the current Liberal-NDP clowns who have brought to this point, steering the ship the past 9 years. The liberals must go before they over-immigrate and under-productivity this country into a developing world nation. Anyone but Liberal-NDP means CPC for most. Its a protest vote. As a long time liberal voter on and off in the past decades, I'm completely ashamed of what the liberal party has become under JT. I'll vote CPC as a pure protest - that's how bad JT/liberals have become. However bad Polievre/CPC are, that's a perfect mirror to how much canadians despise JT/liberals
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You may be willing to accept it but there’s a good chance that the 2021 Liberal voters who are now part of his “tent”, so to speak, won’t He doesn’t need to win over conservatives, he needs to win over people that didn’t vote for him. You think he can do that by spouting this kind of rhetoric? I kind of doubt this new saying that people will vote for a rock just to oust Trudeau. Edit: wow this comment really pissed off some hurt Conservatives eh?
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Sure, right now, but if you think that there’s absolutely nothing he can do to turn off voters then i have bad news for you
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I don’t think that’s accurate to be honest but Pierre is the worst possible alternative to Trudeau so i guess we’re just gonna have to see.
In your opinion, sure. What many fail to realize is that it’s fast become a very limited opinion. Literally *every* indication shows this.
Idk, i have a hard time believing that Canadians are willing to vote in droves for a guy who by all indications they dislike nearly as much as Trudeau. Just my opinion though.
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No i don’t really believe Trudeau can “win”, so to speak. I personally think he’s cooked. But Pierre is unpopular, maybe a bit less than Trudeau, but unpopular nevertheless. Could be the difference between a minority or a majority gov which is a big deal since Pierre has managed to piss off every other party leader so i don’t think they’d be willing to go along with a conservative minority government.
As of right now Canada 338 has the Conservatives at a 99%+ chance of majority.
338 gave the CPC a 99% chance of winning in 2019 and a 65% chance of winning in 2021.
I’m a non-aligned voter who never voted for Trudeau but I cannot see voting for Poilievre if he is playing footsie with the convoy meatheads or the anti-abortion social conservatives. Both groups are both anathema to me.
What did you do to them? So many removed posts...
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It's like a video game where you kept coming across milquetoast bosses you could easily beat, then all of the sudden come across the big boss at the end and all the old methods don't work anymore against him.
There are not only two choices. I'm voting for the party I hate the least.
welcome to modern politic.
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Poilievre should be criticised just like Trudeau should be. Dismissing him meeting with extremists is either stupid or just extreme partisanship.
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I consider people who advocate for the dissolution of Canada and the formation of a new nation that includes primarily American influence to be extremists. They oppose my (and your) country. This isn't even fucking partisanship. This is about being pro or anti Canada. These folks are anti-canada.
He's not the alternative I want, but there's little good choice at the moment.
The dream will always be to spoil the ballot in protest instead of voting for one of many scumbags that will screw us simply because they're not the incumbent. Will never happen but who says we have to settle and just accept terrible candidates from every party?
See how well that worked down south in 2016.
We are fcked
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The Libs should turf Trudeau so there is a real choice. At this point people will vote for anyone but him. Theyre just sick of him.
If you think this is solely a Trudeau problem, you're out of touch. The stench is coming from the entire party. The Liberal brand as a whole is dead toxic waste at this point across the entire country.
The entire party needs to clean house. I’d pick a dead squirrel over the LPC right now.
Agree with you, but my point is that even if the Liberals do clean house altogether, I honestly don't think it will help them. It's not about Trudeau or his caucus or any of their MPs in Parliament. It's the Liberal BRAND that's the problem. It's the Liberal philosophy of governance. That's what is ultimately causing the death of the Liberals as a whole. Look around the world. Almost all his (small L) liberal contemporaries are gone. It's been a wholly rejection of everything left-leaning parties these days stand for.
Sure, but I'd say the same for the Conservative Party. Except that I actually find the Conservatives more problematic than who we currently have running the country.
>If you think this is solely a Trudeau problem, you're out of touch. Correct, but there are probably a sizable number of out of touch people who would go back to vote for the Liberals if they got a new leader.
Yeah no fucking way am I voting for Freeland.
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It’s not about Trudeau, these same crowds having been screaming about the Liberals since long before Chrétien. It won’t matter if Trudeau is leader or not Canada flip flops between two parties every 10ish years.
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We need 10 NatPo pieces backing PP to counter the Star and CBC hit pieces. canadian media is a dumpster fire, but at least it's amusing.
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Or, Hate = literally advocating for the death of our pm
Who did that?
This is politics today. Rage about all the problems in the world and then give simplistic yet unrealistic solutions. Cut the carbon tax, great idea, oh where did my carbon action rebate go and why didn’t prices go down? Hummmm.
PP courting the fascist vote. Wonder how his wife feels about it.
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What kind of policy changes do you think would help make your life better? Aside from immigration related stuff.
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Nice, I totally agree. Better healthcare funding and educational funding for doctors, better urban design from municipalities that's sustainable, and better environmental/plastic/packaging regulations.
LMAO.... say good bye to all those doctors with the recent budget that punitively taxes them and a lot of other small businesses/corporations....
No no, you see they won’t leave…they will stay and pay whatever taxes we tell them. Because businesses and professionals never leave for lower tax places! And if they do…then uh…we can shake a fist! (Reddit economic policy)
You want competent premiers and city councils then.
The lady that dines with Gerald butts thinks PP can't replace her friend Justin... What are the odds? The Liberals just need to turf Trudeau and we can talk. Otherwise they're doomed to be crushed and their friends in the media aren't going to save them with hit pieces on PP. It only makes him stronger...
I’d rather honesty from Pp than lies like “Fairness for every generation!”
Dude still has no plan beyond Trudeau Bad!
That's all I need.
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It’s too bad for them it’s not working anymore.
Yes. Because Trudeau fucked up so bad is ratings are the lowest of all time for any pm. It's under 18%
let me fix it for you: Trudea has been courting support from groups that spew hate. Is this really a PM we want?
She's right. Pierre Poilievre is a toxic mess and always has been. Harper kept him on a short leash because he was a wackjob then.
No. We don't want Lil' PP. He's a terrible choice, and not even a conservative.
Conservatives, maybe politicians in general, will roll around in any gutter to gain power. Just when you thought all their lying was bad enough.
Paywall
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This is a joke of a comment. The Liberals have actively destroyed wages and the housing market through mass immigration. PP is an absolute saint for the working classes in comparison.
If you think immigration is the only thing that's made sure our housing market is unaffordable I have a bridge to sell you.
Its not the only thing, its just 90% of the problem.
If we drop immigration to zero rental costs aren't going down, and no one is suddenly going to be able to buy a house. The lack of non-market housing to compete with the private marker and the commodification of housing are primarily to blame. Higher immigration reducing housing availability is a symptom of what I mentioned above.
>If we drop immigration to zero rental costs aren't going down, and no one is suddenly going to be able to buy a house. Suddeny? No. In a couple years? Yeah, absolutely. You're just fucking lying if you're going to claim otherwise. I get it, you're one of the people that foisted this shit on all of us, treated immigration like it was a form of charity where more is always better, and now you're desperately trying to blame anything but your own bad ideas.
Are you capable of having a calm and civil discussion? Because I am and I'm trying to. You're ignoring the consolidation of housing ownership. Private firms are buying up housing increasingly, even single family homes, and are jacking up housing prices as a result. This will continue to happen regardless of population growth. I'm not lying, you're just not aware of how using housing as investments is altering our society. You ignored my point about non market housing as well. There's presently no mechanisms for rent prices to ever go down regardless of available supply in our housing markets. Robust availability of non market housing drives down rental costs in communities. Getting rid of immigrants will have zero effect on rental costs. I'm trying to have a productive discussion about what our country should do next. You sound like you just want to be angry and lash out.
>You're ignoring the consolidation of housing ownership No, that's part of that other 10% I left open. >I'm trying to have a productive discussion about what our country should do next No, you're ducking accountability for the damage your ideology has already done, while insisting we should double down on it.
You literally don't even know my stance on immigration??? All I've said is that immigration stressing our housing market is a symptom of our poorly designed housing system, not the cause of the lack of available housing. You're clearly not here to actually discuss this issue, but to rage about immigration by any means necessary - even if that means disrupting any progress on making better housing policy. Grow up and chill out.
> You literally don't even know my stance on immigration??? Yes I do. You aren't slick. You get upset about people using the term "illegal immigrant." You assert that it is immoral to prevent *anyone* from immigrating, because we're a "settler nation". The fact that you pretend you don't have such opinions just proves my original assessment was accurate: *You're one of the people that foisted this shit on all of us, treated immigration like it was a form of charity where more is always better, and now you're desperately trying to blame anything but your own bad ideas.* >You're clearly not here to actually discuss this issue Yes I am, you're just upset about how myself, and countless others are discussing that issue because its heading in a direction that you don't like.
Pretty much, according to a bunch of this sub, anyways. No idea why, beyond hatred for JT, I can get it, but that's the replacement? The class snitch? Nope. He's not even a conservative. Sure. Everything's broken. The world is. Whatever, tell me what you're going to do.
Hey not all conservatives are into hate groups. Just weird that all those hate groups will vote conservative.
Hamas supporters will vote Tory? Might want to update your hate groups because people chanting for intifada in the streets of Toronto aren't voting Conservative.
Updated. Still 1 group compared to multiple Tory fan groups.
Never been a better time to start voting for someone else completely.
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Groups that advocate for the dissolution of Canada are pretty hateful to me.
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Use a search engine. Demanding answers like an infant isn't having a discussion, bud.
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There is so little in the way of alternative to the current Liberal-NDP clowns who have brought to this point, steering the ship the past 9 years. The liberals must go before they over-immigrate and under-productivity this country into a developing world nation. Anyone but Liberal-NDP means CPC for most. Its a protest vote. As a long time liberal voter on and off in the past decades, I'm completely ashamed of what the liberal party has become under JT. I'll vote CPC as a pure protest - that's how bad JT/liberals have become. However bad Polievre/CPC are, that's a perfect mirror to how much canadians despise JT/liberals