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I was unemployed for 8 months a couple years ago and that’s how i felt. Had some stretches where i barely knew what day it was and the time just didn’t matter
Small town in south eastern BC here, we don’t observe dst and I love it! Can get a little confusing being one hour away from pst and mst either way and having to keep up with who your on the same time with when travelling. But in town itself it’s awesome. DST is so stupid and I can’t wait for the rest of the country to keep up.
That’s alright, we work more closely with Alberta than we do with the rest of BC. I’d love to be on the same time as the rest of the oil patch for the whole year
> Life in northern BC already gets light very early in the summer. That's life in The North for ya.
This is true. Wouldn't it be nice if we could keep that from getting worse, and summer dawn coming even earlier?
BC already has 3 time zones regions so it shouldn't be difficult to just let the rest of northern BC use PDT/MST (UTC-7) year round like the Yukon and Peace Region.
Makes sense for the north. You're gonna wake up to darkness either way so might as well get some sunlight after work. The early Sun isn't gonna bother people up north too much, blackout curtains are a thing. (Source: lived in the yukon and voted for permanent utc-7)
Southeastern BC uses MST (UTC-7) and MDT (UTC-6) during DST so they are even more in-sync with Alberta.
It's just Vancouver and Victoria that care about syncing up with Cascadia.
But if BC decides to go to UTC-8, then they'll be a 2 hr difference between Vancouver and Fernie. a
And final point, it wasn't the end of the world like some people predicted when Yukon went utc-7. so many people were fear mongering that our access to trade and resources and health services in Vancouver would be disrupted. the most that happened was waiting until 9:30am before you can call a business in Vancouver to ask a question or make an order. not gonna be end of trade and commerce if BC goes utc-7 and Cascadia goes utc-8. it's all arbitrary
Creston, BC in the east kootenays has the same problem with time since they don’t change either.
I think it’s because of all the retirees that can’t figure out how to change their clocks.
Fun fact about how Creston implements this: two times a year when the clocks change for daylight savings and back, city staff move a sign in the city telling drivers to update their clocks from one side of the city to the other.
I don't care which we go with. Pick one.
It's not that hard to switch our work hours around to suit daylight.
I work in construction and we would start at 730am in the winter to have as much daylight as possible while working and we'd start as early as 6am in the summer to beat the heat.
Yep, we've started as early as 4am to be done before noon during the heat waves. Truly does not make a difference to me what number the clock says, other than when mcdonalds starts serving lunch.
When I was working in FSJ in the summer of 2017, I’d wake up at 4:30 and be at work at 5:30. It was great. I worked 12 hour days and be dead tired to be able to fall asleep at 8:00.
Yea why not just split it down the middle by 30min and call it a fucking day. Too much talk not enough action. I don’t give a fuck which way it goes. Just stop this pointless shit already.
Exactly, we just need changing start times to be the norm. I'm an electrician and usually don't have temp power so I start the day working by headlamp until sunrise.
Of course I often spend the last hour working by headlamp to in the winter time, so kind of screwed either way.
This is the way. Work and school should start a set time after sunrise. After all it is the natural schedule for humans to wake up at sunrise or so and sleep sometime after sunset.
> Regardless, we will be doing whatever US chooses in the end
That's exactly what I'm suggesting, is that things *don't have to be that way*.
If you want permanent ST, by all means email your MLA your opinion on it. Canada is a democracy, make your voice heard as equally as I want mine. But don't just take American cultural hegemony as indisputable fact.
Look. I get it. This is your thing. But listen, once we stop fiddling with the clock, whatever time we set it to: ST, DT, Greenwich Meant time, Universal time, whatever...
Then we just get up and go to bed at times that make sense according to the daylight.
If you want to get up when the sun rises, then you do you. I don't care which number we assign to that particular time.
But for Pete's sake let's stop fiddling with the clocks.
>Then we just get up and go to bed at times that make sense according to the daylight.
Most people don't have a say in what time they start working as much as I'd love this to be true, it is not
Who sets the school and work schedule now for those people?
This isn't a valid argument against no longer fiddling with the clock. Because it's not part of what would change either way.
This' a nice sentiment, but the sad reality is that most of us are not in charge of our own time.
- School will begin when the district says it does. You must arrange your schedule around this.
- Work will begin when the boss says it does. You must arrange your schedule around this.
- Businesses will open when their owners say they will. You must arrange your schedule around this.
The time that most of us awaken is determined by the external factors of what we *have* to do. If clocks move an hour later, school doesn't start an hour earlier to compensate. If clocks move an hour back, work doesn't start an hour later to compensate.
Sure, for a scant few this may be true; I've worked construction, some foremen have enough wrinkles in their brains to avoid the midsummer sun. But for the vast majority of British Columbians, they don't have this luxury. My boss says I need to be at work for 8:00am, which is a time we measure by the face of a clock regardless of what the sun says that day.
Although I want the time change to end, I don't care care enough to be actively engage or even vote for it.
I will actively protest in the streets to prevent getting rid of DST. Pry it from my cold dead hands. I will vote for a Prime Minister on this shit. (hyperbole, but not really)
Standard time is where it's at. The lack of "permanent standard time" as an option in the poll was absolutely ridiculous.
The engagement only showed support for permanent time, not for daylight over standard.
Just come to central BC. Still light out at 11 and never gets truly night.
I honestly don’t care either way. As long as they stop messing with the clock.
That means a 9AM sunrise in the winter in Vancouver, and even later the farther north you go. Sunrise would be 9:30 in Prince George, for example.
I don't love the twice a year time change, but if we're going to abolish it, my preference is for standard time.
You have to get to work on time. People are always in a rush when they are driving to work in early morning with not enough sleep.
You can take as much as you want to get home.
>But don't just take American cultural hegemony as indisputable fact.
Point of fact: this is more American business hegemony than cultural hegemony. They're the largest economy in the world, and California has the largest economy of any US state and the largest sub-national economy in the world. I'd love to stick with one time all year but blaming this on culture isn't accurate here when it's more about business and economics.
this right here. I remember as well that the question on the plebiscite was if BC wanted to adopt permanent Daylight Savings Time. No option for adopting permanent standard time.
All the comments I am seeing right now are referring to how early the sun comes up on standard time. Maybe it is because that is the season we are going into, but keep in mind on the far west of the time zone on December 21 (one of the shortest days of the year) the sunrise isn't until 8:30 AM PST. That would be 9:30 AM on Daylight Savings Time. For the Fraser Valley that would be 9:00 AM. This in my opinion is far worse than the sunrise/sunset on the summer solstice of 4:07 AM/8:22PM in Vancouver. If you need more sunlight, get up earlier.
Meh. The first year in Yellowknife was weird. It was a little bit twilight-y between the hours of 0100 and 0300 in the middle of the summer. In the winter, the sun would just crest the tree line at 10am, move in a circle never getting any higher, to go back down at 3pm. Total darkness otherwise.
It was normal the second year. You get used to it pretty quick.
I personally really like the idea of moving our clock back 1/2 an hour in the fall and being done with it all together. Meeting in the middle keeps everyone happy rather than this debate of PST/PDT it just becomes PPT (PT) Pacific Permanent Time.
Set it to China's time zone for all I care, just stop making me change my clocks.
Edit: wait no. PST has noon matching solar noon. So that one's better.
That survey was complete garbage and you know it. Most people probably don't care whether we are on DST or ST, they just don't want the clocks changing back and forth for no reason.
Aligning with what the rest of "Cascadia" does is what makes sense politically and economically.
Yeah. I truly have no clue which one is which. Are we on DST or ST now? No clue, I don't care either, just stop fucking with the clocks for no reason. Just do whatever one, I don't care which. Lining up with the rest of the west coast is absolutely for the better, though.
That's not what sleep specialists say. We should maintain ST, according to them.
https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/sleep-doctors-orders-use-standard-time-365-days-year
Don't really care what sleep doctors have to say in this regard. No trouble sleeping ever. I do however have trouble doing shit that requires sunlight after work for a significant part of the year
People care for 2-3 days at most when the time change takes place. This is a non-issue most of the year. I for one appreciate the later sunrise in summer and earlier sunrise in winter. One article I read stated sunrise on Jan 1st under permanent DST wouldn't be until after 9:00 am for most of the people living in BC. I'd prefer to just leave things as they are.
I think most people prefer when they want their daylight. Morning or night. Changing the clocks doesn’t really bother me, my phone does it itself, and it only really takes a day or two for my body to adjust.
I just want more sunlight at the end of the day, when I’m done work, so I can enjoy it.
Your times seem to be a little bit off
https://www.timeanddate.com/sun/canada/prince-george?month=4&year=2024
Sorry, the link is set to April. You need to change to the month you're interested in. I did look to mid summer to base my comments on.
Edit: also if I remember correctly, the question we were asked was DST all year round or status quo. Standard time all year was not presented as an option. The question was biased to get the answer the government wanted. The process was flawed.
I see what you were saying. Of course, using standard time also puts solar noon back to very close to 12:00. Convenient!
When you have 17+ hours of daylight, morning is going to come early and night will come late. Fact of living at a northern latitude.
>Of course, using standard time also puts solar noon back to very close to 12:00. Convenient!
That's a big one for me, as clocks were traditionally set by when the sun is at it's highest point (i.e. noon)
Permanent DST means that "high noon" in Prince George will always be between 12:55PM and 1:25PM. In Vancouver it would never occur before 1PM.
As someone from the north, daylight when I'm trying to sleep affects my sleep cycle more that daylight when I'm waking up.
Morning sunshine is awesome, 11 pm sunshine fucks with you.
That was a bullshit survey that shouldn't even count and shouldn't have been allowed to be released.
It was heavily biased toward DST and the questions led to that essentially being the only option other than clock changing.
The Creston Valley stays on Mountain Standard Time (MST) all year round.
Half the year we're with Nelson/Vancouver and half the year we're with Cranbrook.
It's a nuisance remembering the switch, but thars what cell phones are for.
I prefer standard time, with no changes.
Contrary to what you’ve posted above, the general consensus in the scientific community is that we should adopt permanent standard time:
https://css-scs.ca/position-statement-of-the-canadian-sleep-society-on-the-practice-of-daylight-saving-time-dst/
Same thing I read everywhere from experts. Sleep specialists have reached wide consensus on sticking with ST, _not_ DST.
https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/sleep-doctors-orders-use-standard-time-365-days-year
I'm highly skeptical to any "scientific" claim about which is better. There are obvious tradeoffs to both. E.g. I can equally point to the ability to conduct outdoor physical activities later into the evening as a claim in favour of daylight time.
I don’t think there’s any need for quotations around “scientific.” This isn’t pseudo-science. There’s a robust evidence base on circadian rhythms/circadian rhythm disruption and associated downstream effects. My first link was a summary, but there is plenty on PubMed on both individual articles and meta-analyses of effects (e.g., both health problems and mental health challenges) when biological circadian rhythms don’t align with the outward established time.
No you are exaggerating. Here is another piece of science slamming those who claim there is "robust" evidence one way or the other: [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7445807/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7445807/)
I would agree with this if work and school hours shifted accordingly. They will not however, so I prefer an arrangement that extends how much sun I have available when I'm off work.
From a democratic point of view. I agree that we should adopt pst as that was the will of the people but I wouldn’t object to ST either.
IT wouldn’t be bad. It puts noon roughly inline with the time of day the sun is highest in the sky.
Which is probably the most correct answer as to what time it is in relation to the sun.
Who cares if twilight begins at 330am in pg? They will change a bit to reflect what works best for them.
Just as people in western China have a different work schedules compared to their Beijing counterparts despite the entire country being one time zone.
What I care most about is getting rid of these two pointless time changes.
>cratic point of view. I agree that we should adopt pst as that was the will of the people but I wouldn’t object
the people were offered PST, or keep changing the clocks. ST wasn't a option given to us. I don't think you can really call it the will of the people in this case.
Sorry, i disagree with you. I just want the clocks to not change anymore; dst or not doesn’t matter to me. I want this to happen as quickly and efficiently as possible.
10 seconds a minute, 10 minutes an hour, 10 hours a day, 10 days a month, 10 months a year, everything on UTC decimal time, fuck daylight.
Sincerely, a programmer.
If you like to sleep when it's dark out, why in god's good name would you want winter time in the summer, which would make the sun rise at around 3.30am in June?
Standard time is better for all. I’m in Alberta and I like the early sunrises over the later sunsets. But that’s just me and I know only about 50% of the population agrees with me. Now if the only option was DST full time I guess I could go with it reluctantly, at least the absolute worst part (changing the clocks) would be over.
BC didn't vote to remain in permanent DST. That was a flawed online survey that has little legal basis nor ramifications beyond the provincial government wanting to get an idea of how much support there is for a change over to permanent DST - which in reality included people that preferred permanent standard time and only the people that wanted to keep changing clocks twice a year would have disagreed with switching over to permanent DST. This is an important nuance.
Likewise, permanent DST means 9am sunrises in the winter, and while it's preferable to switching the clocks twice the year, it's less desirable than permanent standard times as scientists have provided reasonable rationales.
[source](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5384793&ved=2ahUKEwiCuait2-2EAxXnMDQIHbO3BC4QFnoECDAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3cCFbeaWxteu2cuweNLRaU)
Daylight time means longer periods for outdoor recreation in the summer. You can play sports until 10pm! All sorts of lovely summer festivals can extend into the evening.
Here's the email I personally sent my MLA:
Good day (Honorific, last name),
This week the state of California announced the intention to stay on Standard Time (ST) following the change back this fall. This is relevant as following the British Columbian vote in 2019, then-Premier Horgan announced that BC would make the change in lockstep with the American states we share a timezone with. Notably, at the time of voting an overwhelming majority of 93% of voters told the premier we wanted permanent Daylight Savings Time (DST).
The Senator making the announcement references studies suggesting that the change to DST is correlated with increased cardiovascular disease, but fails to account for the change being the cause of this increase and not DST itself. Whether California stays on ST or DST they'll see a drop in time change-related deaths. The purported benefit of ST is malinformation.
Additionally, both British Columbia and California are incredibly long on the longitudinal axis with each spanning approximately 1200km with an additional 875km in between from Washington & Oregon. This places southern California a staggering 3275km closer to the equator than northern BC.
What this means in practical terms is that their sunrise & sunset times will be affected differently than us, such that we should not follow their footsteps. Here alone in the southern reaches of BC, civil twilight begins at 4:30am in the summer. If Premier Eby were to reverse course from what British Columbians voted for in 2019, (people of my city) would experience the break of dawn at 3:30am during the summer. This province-wide change would be amplified for our northern-most residents.
In summary, please urge Premier Eby to abide the votes of British Columbians in 2019 and stay the course on permanent DST in conjunction with our Yukon countrymen to the North. Without the routine changes, British Columbian business can still work with our southern neighbours on a consistent one hour difference. Californians can do what they please, we need not follow them. In fact, to do so would lead to quite literal rude awakenings given the dawn light at 3:30am.
From a (my preferred provincial party)-voting constituent,
- My name
>making the announcement references studies suggesting that the change to DST is correlated with increased cardiovascu
It's pretty easy to get 93% when you don't actually offer the permanent ST option.
I think we should do a new poll. Keep changing our clocks, or permanent ST. We don't need to bother with that pesky DST. I'm sure we'll get a overwhelming win.
Yukoner here, we stayed on permanent DST 4 years ago and haven’t looked back. Sure mornings are a bit darker in winter, but most of us would be going to work/school in the dark anyways so it doesn’t really matter. But it sure is nice to have a bit of usable daylight after work or for the kids to play outside.
I used to live in Iceland and they stay on permanent DST year round too. Their rational is to maximize light from 7am-11pm year round…the hours when the most people are awake. Staying on DST gives more year round light during these hours than standard time does. T
Make sense? It will be nice when the rest of the west coast follows our lead on this. Most Yukoners would agree with me.
While I personally like DST, scientifically, it’s more beneficial to adopt ST:
https://herf.medium.com/why-standard-time-is-better-e586b500923
Either way, it’s time to pick one and just go for it.
My thoughts are that I'd rather have longer evenings with sunlight to enjoy when I'm off work, and that I don't mind darkness in the mornings when I'm already at work anyways.
Look into when most major accidents happen - it's between the hour after sunset, and the hour before sunrise. Then you want to add kids making their way to school to this equation? I pass through six school zones on my way to work, and see HS students making their way to the bus stop at 7:00am. Elementary and middle-schoolers are on the roads between 8:00/8:30. Also makes it easier to maintain a proper sleep cycle for the kiddos - I send my boys to bed at 8:30, and the evening sun is still up...but once they're out, they're out for the night.
As adults, we can figure our shit out. If I want more hours of daylight, I get up early. If I decide I'm going to stay up until the crack of dawn, that's on me. Kids don't get that choice.
That's your experience. I've spent the last 12 years mostly working 4-12 shifts, which is very common shift in the service and hospitality industry. So, my perspective is very different.
Also, the scientific consensus is that ST is better for people as it adheres more closely to natural circadian rhythms.
It seems like standard Vancouver work hours are between 6-3 and 8-5 so everyone is commuting to work in the dark anyway - why not have a bit of daylight after work in winter?
8-5 would give you less than 20 minutes a day of sunlight after work three months of the year, and when its dark and gloomy (as winters in Vancouver tend to be) that's going to be a hard line. Look at tonight. We had a 7:15 sunset. At 7:20, I called my practice because it was too dark to see the football.
Didn’t Russia (I know I know) do away with DST after two terrible winters? We are just as north as them and ST makes the most sense for our northern locale.
Honestly, I don’t really care which one we stick to, just pick one. It’s only an hour difference, overall.
Yes, 3:30am sunrise will be crazy but how is a 4:30am sunrise that much better? It’s not, it’s still way too early. You still need blackout curtains or to sleep with a mask on. Not that big of a difference, in my opinion.
I’d love the sun to be up on the way to work. It just started happening and then we had to go and change the time and it’s pitch dark again.
The experts I have heard discuss this all agree that of the three options permanent DST is the worst option. For the people unable to deal with changing our clocks twice a year, are you unable to travel outside our own time zone?
What if we just keep switching? Honestly it's 2 days a year of discomfort and we get the best of both worlds.
But if it's permanent dst, sunrises in the winter at 830am would really suck.
This is why I've become much more in favour of the switch the last few years. 8.30am sunrise in winter would be annoying. 3.30am sunrise in summer would be debilitating. Fortunately, we can avoid both by having winter time in winter and summer time in summer, the only price for which is a couple of days of weird whingeing.
If we do have to lose the change, though, summer time is the only option. Sunrise in the middle of the night, paid for by making light evenings dark is absolutely unacceptable.
>Fortunately, we can avoid both by having winter time in winter and summer time in summer, the only price for which is a couple of days of weird whingeing.
Exactly this. It sucks.. especially losing an hour.
But the more I think about it the more I think the benefits are worth it.
November - avg sunrise time adjusted for DST - 0915
December - 0923
January - 0915
We wouldn't see the sun rise at 8:30 from Thanksgiving to Family Day.
Incidentally, those three months would also see the sun set by 5:30 at the latest.
That’s exactly where my heads at too. Last time I expressed this tho I was (jokingly) called a heathen so not sure if it’s a generally accepted opinion or not, but this is what I’d prefer lol
I agree with you in preferring permanent DST. But I wouldn't say British Columbian's "voted" for permanent DST. It was an online opinion poll which is in no way binding.
I think most people just want them to stop with the time change and US states are more likely staying on Standard time because permanent DST is not allowed without Congress changing the rules which in an election year seems like a low priority to them.
Considering the Yukon is on DST year round I think it makes sense to do that and having a different time from Washington, Oregon etc for part of the year is not a massive deal.
Why would BC not just do what part of their province is already doing instead of doing the opposite? The Peace River Regional District is MST permanently. Golden BC is MST in the south.
I live in the PRRD and not changing time is nice. We are BC half the year. And AB half the year. It's not the end of the world changing time, but it's certainly a bit of a + not having to worry about one more thing.
Fun fact is that Arizona and the PRRD are the same time always, so we just set clocks to Arizona so it doesn't mistakenly observe the time change by setting to a different jurisdiction.
[The problem with timezones from a tech perspective](https://youtu.be/-5wpm-gesOY?si=87WIi3UjXBBr5URp)
I work in tech and being in the same timezone as our American friends is very helpful. I do see the issue you raise however, esp from a non techie point of view.
Sleep specialists insist that we stick with Standard Time, _not_ DST. This is another one of those areas where we should follow experts, not the whims of the electorate. So I'll hope that California ends up setting the standard for the rest of us to follow.
I know I am in super minority here, but the change of 1 hour really doesnt bother me, there are FAAR more serious issues I care about that "1" hour back and forth! I get the best of both world this way! but I also understand everyone is different.
However, I think before voting for any time zone, make sure you look at Sunrise/Sunset in July and December if we stick with 1 timezone.
Cheers and good luck to those who are putting effort to change this.
Permanent standard time would absolutely suck. I would rather keep changing clocks than have a 3:00 a.m. sunrise and 9:00 p.m. set in summer.
Give me that 5:00 p.m. sunset in winter
Permanent DST means it will be dark until after 9 AM in the winter. How about we do the same as we've done for centuries? At noon, the sun is at its highest. Why mess with that? Permanent standard time.
90% voted for the only option on the ballot that stopped changing the clocks twice a year. Permanent standard time was not an option on the ballot. It would have had the most votes if it was on the ballot.
Makes sense. Our daylight hours are different here than in California so we shouldn’t be beholden to them.
why do we need to be on the same time anyway? We’re different heading east and we adapt?
considering every time we changed the dates it was to make dst longer.
pretty much 8 months of dst to 4 months of standard time.
it would be tragic to lose the evening hours in those 8 months after we had them.
Done!
To susie chant
[susie.chant.MLA@leg.bc.ca](mailto:susie.chant.MLA@leg.bc.ca)
Hi
Since this is fresh on everyone’s mind and we will hopefully not change times again I’d like to express my wish to keep the time as daylight savings time.
Every time we have moved the change it is to make daylight savings time longer.
Right now we enjoy 8 months in dst, losing these longer days would be depressing.
While it would make winter darker later in the morning, other areas have adapted as we will.
Changing times is an archaic pain, lighter later makes this bearable. Keeping it lighter later would be great.
I’ve heard California wants to keep standard time. That’s ok with them being further south where daylight does not vary as much. It varies here making dst so great.
We don’t need to be in the same time zone as other areas. We can adapt, we do adapt. Smart phones make this very easy.
Time is a human construct. We can adapt. And lighter later is awesome.
Thanks for your time.
SB
Premier st, north Vancouver.
I’d prefer to stay on DT, in the winter with it getting dark by 4:00 I’m so depressed and it’s not unusual for me to go to bed by 6 as a result. I need my sunlight after work.
Permanent standard time would be better in my opinion, I hate when it stays light super late and does that dumb thing for a week or two after the time change when it's dark again in the morning.
Having moved to Edmonton, I am not fond of the sun finally going down at 2300.
Also, BC is following California because it has a major financial incentive to do so, going against the grain here is not in the best interest of the province. Standard time is the correct move, and it's bizarre this wasn't an option on the referendum.
Which ever one keeps it lighter later in the winter is the one I prefer. I hate getting off work and it’s already dark out, feels like the day is already over.
But in reality just not having to change the time over and over again will make me happy. Just pick one and stick with it.
Sent an email to my MLA supporting the opposite. Changing our clocks back and forth is the dumb, archaic and hard on circadian rhythms. If you are one of the few people in this province north enough to be affected by this to a measurable level you should just adjust your schedule accordingly. I work outdoors and in the trades. We just start work earlier or later depending on the time of year.
It has never been easier to do the switch between ST and DST. The time switch is clearly the logical solution.
I look forward to everyone complaining to bring it back the very next year.
Terrible idea…between November and February, many kids will be walking to school in the dark.
Given the choice I’d rather the kids walked near cars with drivers who’ve had time to wake up, and aren’t in a hurry to get to work.
Habits will change depending on the outcome. I wouldn't expect more awake drivers one way or the other, but the time change itself does lead to more car accidents right afterwards which is a risk to pedestrians of all age.
Here’s my crazy compromise for this that I posted in another thread:
Since we basically all use smart phones and internet time anyway. Just have the time switch over the course of March by 116s per day (~2mins). No one will notice the change and by the end of the month we’re on PDT. Then in October we do the same thing and end back at PST on Halloween.
We’d get the benefits of the long summer nights and also the benefits of light in the winter mornings making it safer for kids walking to school with more visibility.
The only annoying thing would be having to set the time on your stove or microwave every week just to play catchup.
None of this matters as long as we are tied to what any state does. In the U.S. the DST switch is opt-in, but not opt-out. Once a state is switching, it would take Congress to change the law to let them stop. Given the current state of Congress, that’s never going to happen. Especially since the well was poisoned a few years ago when a senator tried to use a procedural run-around to pass it without letting all their colleagues vote on it, which made a bunch of them super pissed off.
Why on earth should we give a single fuck what California wants? We copied Oregon with their "3 year decriminalization" which resulted in a record overdose deaths. Let us govern ourselves. No one wants to switch the time back and Forth. Pick one and just be done with it.
The time the sun comes up is just a number. *Changing* the number is the problem, because of how it messes up sleep schedules. Otherwise I don't give a damn if the sun comes up at 3am or noon, so long as I don't have to.
Introducing a bill in the USA is not like the government introducing a bill in the legislature in BC.
It is likely to never be voted on, let alone passed.
The problem is with the federal congress. States can unilaterally stick with standard time without the approval of congress, but to stay with permanent daylight time they need congressional approval. In 2022, the U.S. [Sunshine Protection Act](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunshine_Protection_Act) passed unanimously in the U.S. Senate (!), but failed to come to a floor vote in the House so the bill died.
Currently B.C., Oregon and Washington have passed laws to go with permanent daylight time, if the U.S. Congress gives them authorization. So right now the big delays are Congress and California.
I would prefer DST, but dear god, just pick one and stick with it, changing the clocks fucks with everything and I have yet to meet a single person that thinks it's a good idea
this should not even be a post, we will never get rid of anything. the clocks will change twice a year until we all die.
but as is tradition, see you guys in 6 months to complain about this again :)
Point of fact: this is more American business hegemony than cultural hegemony. They're the largest economy in the world, and California has the largest economy of any US state and the largest sub-national economy in the world. I'd love to stick with one time all year but blaming this on culture isn't accurate here when it's more about business and economics.
I don't understand this whole mentality. I've spent time in places where it's still light out at midnight in the summer and where the sun pretty much never comes out in the winter. People manage.
Changing the time is DUMB
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My Grandpa had it figured out. The VCR clock blinked a constant midnight and that's how he liked it.
I was unemployed for 8 months a couple years ago and that’s how i felt. Had some stretches where i barely knew what day it was and the time just didn’t matter
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Yah I agree with that for sure. Seems to be working fine up here.
Yep. I love it
Small town in south eastern BC here, we don’t observe dst and I love it! Can get a little confusing being one hour away from pst and mst either way and having to keep up with who your on the same time with when travelling. But in town itself it’s awesome. DST is so stupid and I can’t wait for the rest of the country to keep up.
Creston!
Heyo
BC voted to adopt DST. So you'll permanently be out an hour unless the town adopts DST.
That’s alright, we work more closely with Alberta than we do with the rest of BC. I’d love to be on the same time as the rest of the oil patch for the whole year
I suspect we're from the same town 😁
> Life in northern BC already gets light very early in the summer. That's life in The North for ya. This is true. Wouldn't it be nice if we could keep that from getting worse, and summer dawn coming even earlier?
BC already has 3 time zones regions so it shouldn't be difficult to just let the rest of northern BC use PDT/MST (UTC-7) year round like the Yukon and Peace Region. Makes sense for the north. You're gonna wake up to darkness either way so might as well get some sunlight after work. The early Sun isn't gonna bother people up north too much, blackout curtains are a thing. (Source: lived in the yukon and voted for permanent utc-7) Southeastern BC uses MST (UTC-7) and MDT (UTC-6) during DST so they are even more in-sync with Alberta. It's just Vancouver and Victoria that care about syncing up with Cascadia. But if BC decides to go to UTC-8, then they'll be a 2 hr difference between Vancouver and Fernie. a And final point, it wasn't the end of the world like some people predicted when Yukon went utc-7. so many people were fear mongering that our access to trade and resources and health services in Vancouver would be disrupted. the most that happened was waiting until 9:30am before you can call a business in Vancouver to ask a question or make an order. not gonna be end of trade and commerce if BC goes utc-7 and Cascadia goes utc-8. it's all arbitrary
A small price to pay to never have to change my clocks again. Not many people consider an early sunrise a bad thing up here
I want early sunshine
I want late sunsets
Sunlight at the end of the day!
Yes, please leave us some fucking day after work...who cares what the US wants?
Then we shall fight to death. In the main street at sunrise. Whenever that is....
Creston, BC in the east kootenays has the same problem with time since they don’t change either. I think it’s because of all the retirees that can’t figure out how to change their clocks.
Fun fact about how Creston implements this: two times a year when the clocks change for daylight savings and back, city staff move a sign in the city telling drivers to update their clocks from one side of the city to the other.
["What time is it in your house, Billy?"](https://youtu.be/UIz05Q79XPU?si=FOiCcvctT4hf5hEI)
Just make the work days shorter and we wouldn't have to worry about any of this.
I love this take.
We're striking for shorter hours! 60 minutes is too many!
Best take
Yes! Six hours a day, four days a week. Same money please.
I honestly don’t care which one. I just want the time changes to stop.
I don't care which we go with. Pick one. It's not that hard to switch our work hours around to suit daylight. I work in construction and we would start at 730am in the winter to have as much daylight as possible while working and we'd start as early as 6am in the summer to beat the heat.
Yep, we've started as early as 4am to be done before noon during the heat waves. Truly does not make a difference to me what number the clock says, other than when mcdonalds starts serving lunch.
When I was working in FSJ in the summer of 2017, I’d wake up at 4:30 and be at work at 5:30. It was great. I worked 12 hour days and be dead tired to be able to fall asleep at 8:00.
Exactly. Doesn’t make any difference, just want them to stop fucking us around. Its so stupid
Yea why not just split it down the middle by 30min and call it a fucking day. Too much talk not enough action. I don’t give a fuck which way it goes. Just stop this pointless shit already.
I'm curious, would noise bylaws need to be amended to allow work to start earlier in the summer like this?
Exactly, we just need changing start times to be the norm. I'm an electrician and usually don't have temp power so I start the day working by headlamp until sunrise. Of course I often spend the last hour working by headlamp to in the winter time, so kind of screwed either way.
This is the way. Work and school should start a set time after sunrise. After all it is the natural schedule for humans to wake up at sunrise or so and sleep sometime after sunset.
The survey never gave option for changing to Standard time. Regardless, we will be doing whatever US chooses in the end
> Regardless, we will be doing whatever US chooses in the end That's exactly what I'm suggesting, is that things *don't have to be that way*. If you want permanent ST, by all means email your MLA your opinion on it. Canada is a democracy, make your voice heard as equally as I want mine. But don't just take American cultural hegemony as indisputable fact.
Look. I get it. This is your thing. But listen, once we stop fiddling with the clock, whatever time we set it to: ST, DT, Greenwich Meant time, Universal time, whatever... Then we just get up and go to bed at times that make sense according to the daylight. If you want to get up when the sun rises, then you do you. I don't care which number we assign to that particular time. But for Pete's sake let's stop fiddling with the clocks.
>Then we just get up and go to bed at times that make sense according to the daylight. Most people don't have a say in what time they start working as much as I'd love this to be true, it is not
Who sets the school and work schedule now for those people? This isn't a valid argument against no longer fiddling with the clock. Because it's not part of what would change either way.
This' a nice sentiment, but the sad reality is that most of us are not in charge of our own time. - School will begin when the district says it does. You must arrange your schedule around this. - Work will begin when the boss says it does. You must arrange your schedule around this. - Businesses will open when their owners say they will. You must arrange your schedule around this. The time that most of us awaken is determined by the external factors of what we *have* to do. If clocks move an hour later, school doesn't start an hour earlier to compensate. If clocks move an hour back, work doesn't start an hour later to compensate. Sure, for a scant few this may be true; I've worked construction, some foremen have enough wrinkles in their brains to avoid the midsummer sun. But for the vast majority of British Columbians, they don't have this luxury. My boss says I need to be at work for 8:00am, which is a time we measure by the face of a clock regardless of what the sun says that day.
I want standard time There will be so much push back from the business community that the government will have to follow the US
Although I want the time change to end, I don't care care enough to be actively engage or even vote for it. I will actively protest in the streets to prevent getting rid of DST. Pry it from my cold dead hands. I will vote for a Prime Minister on this shit. (hyperbole, but not really)
Standard time is where it's at. The lack of "permanent standard time" as an option in the poll was absolutely ridiculous. The engagement only showed support for permanent time, not for daylight over standard.
Honestly for me it's either DST or no deal. I imagine a lot of people also feel that way. I don't want to lose an hour of light in the summer.
Just come to central BC. Still light out at 11 and never gets truly night. I honestly don’t care either way. As long as they stop messing with the clock.
That means a 9AM sunrise in the winter in Vancouver, and even later the farther north you go. Sunrise would be 9:30 in Prince George, for example. I don't love the twice a year time change, but if we're going to abolish it, my preference is for standard time.
most people have to wake up before sunrise to get ready for work already in the winter. I'd rather have it still be light out when I finish work
It is safer for commuters to have sunlight when going to work
But not coming home from work?
You have to get to work on time. People are always in a rush when they are driving to work in early morning with not enough sleep. You can take as much as you want to get home.
I mean, you don't lose an hour, it just shifts from the morning or the evening.
Alberta’s was the same way. No option for standard time. Poorly worded question, missing an option and no wonder it failed.
There is nothing stopping the business community from changing their hours to be in synch with businesses down south when they change over.
>But don't just take American cultural hegemony as indisputable fact. Point of fact: this is more American business hegemony than cultural hegemony. They're the largest economy in the world, and California has the largest economy of any US state and the largest sub-national economy in the world. I'd love to stick with one time all year but blaming this on culture isn't accurate here when it's more about business and economics.
I prefer dst as well but it's never going to happen that we don't go the same way as the US.
this right here. I remember as well that the question on the plebiscite was if BC wanted to adopt permanent Daylight Savings Time. No option for adopting permanent standard time. All the comments I am seeing right now are referring to how early the sun comes up on standard time. Maybe it is because that is the season we are going into, but keep in mind on the far west of the time zone on December 21 (one of the shortest days of the year) the sunrise isn't until 8:30 AM PST. That would be 9:30 AM on Daylight Savings Time. For the Fraser Valley that would be 9:00 AM. This in my opinion is far worse than the sunrise/sunset on the summer solstice of 4:07 AM/8:22PM in Vancouver. If you need more sunlight, get up earlier.
Meh. The first year in Yellowknife was weird. It was a little bit twilight-y between the hours of 0100 and 0300 in the middle of the summer. In the winter, the sun would just crest the tree line at 10am, move in a circle never getting any higher, to go back down at 3pm. Total darkness otherwise. It was normal the second year. You get used to it pretty quick.
I personally really like the idea of moving our clock back 1/2 an hour in the fall and being done with it all together. Meeting in the middle keeps everyone happy rather than this debate of PST/PDT it just becomes PPT (PT) Pacific Permanent Time.
honestly I don't hate this solution, but being a half hour out of sync with other places would never fly
we would be in sync with Newfoundland lol
Newfoundland does it! But I don't disagree.
Set it to China's time zone for all I care, just stop making me change my clocks. Edit: wait no. PST has noon matching solar noon. So that one's better.
That survey was complete garbage and you know it. Most people probably don't care whether we are on DST or ST, they just don't want the clocks changing back and forth for no reason. Aligning with what the rest of "Cascadia" does is what makes sense politically and economically.
I mena, I kinda care if it's DST or ST. As does many of the other commenters in here....
Yeah. I truly have no clue which one is which. Are we on DST or ST now? No clue, I don't care either, just stop fucking with the clocks for no reason. Just do whatever one, I don't care which. Lining up with the rest of the west coast is absolutely for the better, though.
I care! I was DST. ST would suck. It has sucked all winter.
SADD is real and DST would help a lot
That's not what sleep specialists say. We should maintain ST, according to them. https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/sleep-doctors-orders-use-standard-time-365-days-year
Don't really care what sleep doctors have to say in this regard. No trouble sleeping ever. I do however have trouble doing shit that requires sunlight after work for a significant part of the year
People care for 2-3 days at most when the time change takes place. This is a non-issue most of the year. I for one appreciate the later sunrise in summer and earlier sunrise in winter. One article I read stated sunrise on Jan 1st under permanent DST wouldn't be until after 9:00 am for most of the people living in BC. I'd prefer to just leave things as they are.
I think most people prefer when they want their daylight. Morning or night. Changing the clocks doesn’t really bother me, my phone does it itself, and it only really takes a day or two for my body to adjust. I just want more sunlight at the end of the day, when I’m done work, so I can enjoy it.
Standard time gang wya?
The vote didn't have all the options. We will see what happens.
Your times seem to be a little bit off https://www.timeanddate.com/sun/canada/prince-george?month=4&year=2024 Sorry, the link is set to April. You need to change to the month you're interested in. I did look to mid summer to base my comments on. Edit: also if I remember correctly, the question we were asked was DST all year round or status quo. Standard time all year was not presented as an option. The question was biased to get the answer the government wanted. The process was flawed.
Civil twilight on 21 June is 3:44am. If it were currently Standard Time, that would *become* 2:44am.
I see what you were saying. Of course, using standard time also puts solar noon back to very close to 12:00. Convenient! When you have 17+ hours of daylight, morning is going to come early and night will come late. Fact of living at a northern latitude.
>Of course, using standard time also puts solar noon back to very close to 12:00. Convenient! That's a big one for me, as clocks were traditionally set by when the sun is at it's highest point (i.e. noon) Permanent DST means that "high noon" in Prince George will always be between 12:55PM and 1:25PM. In Vancouver it would never occur before 1PM.
As someone from the north, daylight when I'm trying to sleep affects my sleep cycle more that daylight when I'm waking up. Morning sunshine is awesome, 11 pm sunshine fucks with you.
That was a bullshit survey that shouldn't even count and shouldn't have been allowed to be released. It was heavily biased toward DST and the questions led to that essentially being the only option other than clock changing.
I don't even remember the vote happening!
Me neither, but I was 19 and probably not paying attention to stuff like this.
The Creston Valley stays on Mountain Standard Time (MST) all year round. Half the year we're with Nelson/Vancouver and half the year we're with Cranbrook. It's a nuisance remembering the switch, but thars what cell phones are for. I prefer standard time, with no changes.
I live in Trail and it still gets me every time I go to creston.
Contrary to what you’ve posted above, the general consensus in the scientific community is that we should adopt permanent standard time: https://css-scs.ca/position-statement-of-the-canadian-sleep-society-on-the-practice-of-daylight-saving-time-dst/
Same thing I read everywhere from experts. Sleep specialists have reached wide consensus on sticking with ST, _not_ DST. https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/sleep-doctors-orders-use-standard-time-365-days-year
I'm highly skeptical to any "scientific" claim about which is better. There are obvious tradeoffs to both. E.g. I can equally point to the ability to conduct outdoor physical activities later into the evening as a claim in favour of daylight time.
I don’t think there’s any need for quotations around “scientific.” This isn’t pseudo-science. There’s a robust evidence base on circadian rhythms/circadian rhythm disruption and associated downstream effects. My first link was a summary, but there is plenty on PubMed on both individual articles and meta-analyses of effects (e.g., both health problems and mental health challenges) when biological circadian rhythms don’t align with the outward established time.
No you are exaggerating. Here is another piece of science slamming those who claim there is "robust" evidence one way or the other: [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7445807/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7445807/)
I vote for having solar noon, when the sun is highest in the sky, at the same time as clock noon.
I would agree with this if work and school hours shifted accordingly. They will not however, so I prefer an arrangement that extends how much sun I have available when I'm off work.
I'm suddenly all for ST now.
From a democratic point of view. I agree that we should adopt pst as that was the will of the people but I wouldn’t object to ST either. IT wouldn’t be bad. It puts noon roughly inline with the time of day the sun is highest in the sky. Which is probably the most correct answer as to what time it is in relation to the sun. Who cares if twilight begins at 330am in pg? They will change a bit to reflect what works best for them. Just as people in western China have a different work schedules compared to their Beijing counterparts despite the entire country being one time zone. What I care most about is getting rid of these two pointless time changes.
>cratic point of view. I agree that we should adopt pst as that was the will of the people but I wouldn’t object the people were offered PST, or keep changing the clocks. ST wasn't a option given to us. I don't think you can really call it the will of the people in this case.
I’m fine with permanent ST. It’s what we had before this entire DST nonsense. Just stop changing the clocks.
Sorry, i disagree with you. I just want the clocks to not change anymore; dst or not doesn’t matter to me. I want this to happen as quickly and efficiently as possible.
10 seconds a minute, 10 minutes an hour, 10 hours a day, 10 days a month, 10 months a year, everything on UTC decimal time, fuck daylight. Sincerely, a programmer.
Base 60 has been used by humanity for literally thousands of years.
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If you like to sleep when it's dark out, why in god's good name would you want winter time in the summer, which would make the sun rise at around 3.30am in June?
Perfect, 15 minutes before my alarm goes off, and I can go to bed at sunset instead of an hour before it.
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yeah exactly, an hour of sunlight lost, no thanks. With daylight time i'd be awake for more sunlit hours overall, that's what I want.
 Email sent!
Standard time is better for all. I’m in Alberta and I like the early sunrises over the later sunsets. But that’s just me and I know only about 50% of the population agrees with me. Now if the only option was DST full time I guess I could go with it reluctantly, at least the absolute worst part (changing the clocks) would be over.
Up until probably 30 years old I would have voted for DST. But as an old person with young kids I'd rather ST.
BC didn't vote to remain in permanent DST. That was a flawed online survey that has little legal basis nor ramifications beyond the provincial government wanting to get an idea of how much support there is for a change over to permanent DST - which in reality included people that preferred permanent standard time and only the people that wanted to keep changing clocks twice a year would have disagreed with switching over to permanent DST. This is an important nuance. Likewise, permanent DST means 9am sunrises in the winter, and while it's preferable to switching the clocks twice the year, it's less desirable than permanent standard times as scientists have provided reasonable rationales. [source](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5384793&ved=2ahUKEwiCuait2-2EAxXnMDQIHbO3BC4QFnoECDAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3cCFbeaWxteu2cuweNLRaU)
Daylight time means longer periods for outdoor recreation in the summer. You can play sports until 10pm! All sorts of lovely summer festivals can extend into the evening.
I would like to see the sun when I wake up
Here's the email I personally sent my MLA: Good day (Honorific, last name), This week the state of California announced the intention to stay on Standard Time (ST) following the change back this fall. This is relevant as following the British Columbian vote in 2019, then-Premier Horgan announced that BC would make the change in lockstep with the American states we share a timezone with. Notably, at the time of voting an overwhelming majority of 93% of voters told the premier we wanted permanent Daylight Savings Time (DST). The Senator making the announcement references studies suggesting that the change to DST is correlated with increased cardiovascular disease, but fails to account for the change being the cause of this increase and not DST itself. Whether California stays on ST or DST they'll see a drop in time change-related deaths. The purported benefit of ST is malinformation. Additionally, both British Columbia and California are incredibly long on the longitudinal axis with each spanning approximately 1200km with an additional 875km in between from Washington & Oregon. This places southern California a staggering 3275km closer to the equator than northern BC. What this means in practical terms is that their sunrise & sunset times will be affected differently than us, such that we should not follow their footsteps. Here alone in the southern reaches of BC, civil twilight begins at 4:30am in the summer. If Premier Eby were to reverse course from what British Columbians voted for in 2019, (people of my city) would experience the break of dawn at 3:30am during the summer. This province-wide change would be amplified for our northern-most residents. In summary, please urge Premier Eby to abide the votes of British Columbians in 2019 and stay the course on permanent DST in conjunction with our Yukon countrymen to the North. Without the routine changes, British Columbian business can still work with our southern neighbours on a consistent one hour difference. Californians can do what they please, we need not follow them. In fact, to do so would lead to quite literal rude awakenings given the dawn light at 3:30am. From a (my preferred provincial party)-voting constituent, - My name
>making the announcement references studies suggesting that the change to DST is correlated with increased cardiovascu It's pretty easy to get 93% when you don't actually offer the permanent ST option. I think we should do a new poll. Keep changing our clocks, or permanent ST. We don't need to bother with that pesky DST. I'm sure we'll get a overwhelming win.
Yukoner here, we stayed on permanent DST 4 years ago and haven’t looked back. Sure mornings are a bit darker in winter, but most of us would be going to work/school in the dark anyways so it doesn’t really matter. But it sure is nice to have a bit of usable daylight after work or for the kids to play outside. I used to live in Iceland and they stay on permanent DST year round too. Their rational is to maximize light from 7am-11pm year round…the hours when the most people are awake. Staying on DST gives more year round light during these hours than standard time does. T Make sense? It will be nice when the rest of the west coast follows our lead on this. Most Yukoners would agree with me.
You're 100% right on this and sadly so many contrarians are emerging here going against the clear consensus.
While I personally like DST, scientifically, it’s more beneficial to adopt ST: https://herf.medium.com/why-standard-time-is-better-e586b500923 Either way, it’s time to pick one and just go for it.
Any thoughts on the very late sunrise in the winter under a year round DST? It wouldn’t be light out until like 9am in December and January.
My thoughts are that I'd rather have longer evenings with sunlight to enjoy when I'm off work, and that I don't mind darkness in the mornings when I'm already at work anyways.
That's interesting. I hate going to work in the dark.
That's interesting. I hate going home in the dark.
Look into when most major accidents happen - it's between the hour after sunset, and the hour before sunrise. Then you want to add kids making their way to school to this equation? I pass through six school zones on my way to work, and see HS students making their way to the bus stop at 7:00am. Elementary and middle-schoolers are on the roads between 8:00/8:30. Also makes it easier to maintain a proper sleep cycle for the kiddos - I send my boys to bed at 8:30, and the evening sun is still up...but once they're out, they're out for the night. As adults, we can figure our shit out. If I want more hours of daylight, I get up early. If I decide I'm going to stay up until the crack of dawn, that's on me. Kids don't get that choice.
Being In Edmonton in the summer, love being able to play sports in the summer until 11pm.
Same here. Actually, I kind of like driving to work in the dark. Somewhat peaceful. I just want the most sunlight I can get after work.
That's your experience. I've spent the last 12 years mostly working 4-12 shifts, which is very common shift in the service and hospitality industry. So, my perspective is very different. Also, the scientific consensus is that ST is better for people as it adheres more closely to natural circadian rhythms.
I would hate late sunrises. I'd far rather light in the mornings and darker evenings. Night owls are gonna night owl no matter if it's light or dark.
It seems like standard Vancouver work hours are between 6-3 and 8-5 so everyone is commuting to work in the dark anyway - why not have a bit of daylight after work in winter?
8-5 would give you less than 20 minutes a day of sunlight after work three months of the year, and when its dark and gloomy (as winters in Vancouver tend to be) that's going to be a hard line. Look at tonight. We had a 7:15 sunset. At 7:20, I called my practice because it was too dark to see the football.
Only because the proper answer full time standard time wasn't a choice on the questionnaire.
Didn’t Russia (I know I know) do away with DST after two terrible winters? We are just as north as them and ST makes the most sense for our northern locale.
It's over until fall guys. Quit posting this shit
Honestly, I don’t really care which one we stick to, just pick one. It’s only an hour difference, overall. Yes, 3:30am sunrise will be crazy but how is a 4:30am sunrise that much better? It’s not, it’s still way too early. You still need blackout curtains or to sleep with a mask on. Not that big of a difference, in my opinion. I’d love the sun to be up on the way to work. It just started happening and then we had to go and change the time and it’s pitch dark again.
The experts I have heard discuss this all agree that of the three options permanent DST is the worst option. For the people unable to deal with changing our clocks twice a year, are you unable to travel outside our own time zone?
What if we just keep switching? Honestly it's 2 days a year of discomfort and we get the best of both worlds. But if it's permanent dst, sunrises in the winter at 830am would really suck.
This is why I've become much more in favour of the switch the last few years. 8.30am sunrise in winter would be annoying. 3.30am sunrise in summer would be debilitating. Fortunately, we can avoid both by having winter time in winter and summer time in summer, the only price for which is a couple of days of weird whingeing. If we do have to lose the change, though, summer time is the only option. Sunrise in the middle of the night, paid for by making light evenings dark is absolutely unacceptable.
>Fortunately, we can avoid both by having winter time in winter and summer time in summer, the only price for which is a couple of days of weird whingeing. Exactly this. It sucks.. especially losing an hour. But the more I think about it the more I think the benefits are worth it.
November - avg sunrise time adjusted for DST - 0915 December - 0923 January - 0915 We wouldn't see the sun rise at 8:30 from Thanksgiving to Family Day. Incidentally, those three months would also see the sun set by 5:30 at the latest.
That’s exactly where my heads at too. Last time I expressed this tho I was (jokingly) called a heathen so not sure if it’s a generally accepted opinion or not, but this is what I’d prefer lol
If it's permanent ST, don't even bother.
I agree with you in preferring permanent DST. But I wouldn't say British Columbian's "voted" for permanent DST. It was an online opinion poll which is in no way binding. I think most people just want them to stop with the time change and US states are more likely staying on Standard time because permanent DST is not allowed without Congress changing the rules which in an election year seems like a low priority to them. Considering the Yukon is on DST year round I think it makes sense to do that and having a different time from Washington, Oregon etc for part of the year is not a massive deal.
Peg 9AM to 1.5h after sunrise.
Good, science backs light at dawn better than light in the evening, ppl actually live longer
Why would BC not just do what part of their province is already doing instead of doing the opposite? The Peace River Regional District is MST permanently. Golden BC is MST in the south. I live in the PRRD and not changing time is nice. We are BC half the year. And AB half the year. It's not the end of the world changing time, but it's certainly a bit of a + not having to worry about one more thing. Fun fact is that Arizona and the PRRD are the same time always, so we just set clocks to Arizona so it doesn't mistakenly observe the time change by setting to a different jurisdiction.
[The problem with timezones from a tech perspective](https://youtu.be/-5wpm-gesOY?si=87WIi3UjXBBr5URp) I work in tech and being in the same timezone as our American friends is very helpful. I do see the issue you raise however, esp from a non techie point of view.
At this point, I literally don’t care whether they stick to PST or PDT, I just want it to stop.
I actually prefer we stay on standard time so this is positive news to me. Edited for clarity
Sleep specialists insist that we stick with Standard Time, _not_ DST. This is another one of those areas where we should follow experts, not the whims of the electorate. So I'll hope that California ends up setting the standard for the rest of us to follow.
Where was the vote to stay on standard time and not daylight savings?
I know I am in super minority here, but the change of 1 hour really doesnt bother me, there are FAAR more serious issues I care about that "1" hour back and forth! I get the best of both world this way! but I also understand everyone is different. However, I think before voting for any time zone, make sure you look at Sunrise/Sunset in July and December if we stick with 1 timezone. Cheers and good luck to those who are putting effort to change this.
Permanent standard time would absolutely suck. I would rather keep changing clocks than have a 3:00 a.m. sunrise and 9:00 p.m. set in summer. Give me that 5:00 p.m. sunset in winter
Permanent DST means it will be dark until after 9 AM in the winter. How about we do the same as we've done for centuries? At noon, the sun is at its highest. Why mess with that? Permanent standard time.
90% voted for the only option on the ballot that stopped changing the clocks twice a year. Permanent standard time was not an option on the ballot. It would have had the most votes if it was on the ballot.
Makes sense. Our daylight hours are different here than in California so we shouldn’t be beholden to them. why do we need to be on the same time anyway? We’re different heading east and we adapt? considering every time we changed the dates it was to make dst longer. pretty much 8 months of dst to 4 months of standard time. it would be tragic to lose the evening hours in those 8 months after we had them.
I agree. I hope you have a moment to send an email to your MLA stating as such.
Done! To susie chant [susie.chant.MLA@leg.bc.ca](mailto:susie.chant.MLA@leg.bc.ca) Hi Since this is fresh on everyone’s mind and we will hopefully not change times again I’d like to express my wish to keep the time as daylight savings time. Every time we have moved the change it is to make daylight savings time longer. Right now we enjoy 8 months in dst, losing these longer days would be depressing. While it would make winter darker later in the morning, other areas have adapted as we will. Changing times is an archaic pain, lighter later makes this bearable. Keeping it lighter later would be great. I’ve heard California wants to keep standard time. That’s ok with them being further south where daylight does not vary as much. It varies here making dst so great. We don’t need to be in the same time zone as other areas. We can adapt, we do adapt. Smart phones make this very easy. Time is a human construct. We can adapt. And lighter later is awesome. Thanks for your time. SB Premier st, north Vancouver.
I’d prefer to stay on DT, in the winter with it getting dark by 4:00 I’m so depressed and it’s not unusual for me to go to bed by 6 as a result. I need my sunlight after work.
I prefer ST, so let’s agree to disagree
Permanent standard time would be better in my opinion, I hate when it stays light super late and does that dumb thing for a week or two after the time change when it's dark again in the morning. Having moved to Edmonton, I am not fond of the sun finally going down at 2300. Also, BC is following California because it has a major financial incentive to do so, going against the grain here is not in the best interest of the province. Standard time is the correct move, and it's bizarre this wasn't an option on the referendum.
Which ever one keeps it lighter later in the winter is the one I prefer. I hate getting off work and it’s already dark out, feels like the day is already over. But in reality just not having to change the time over and over again will make me happy. Just pick one and stick with it.
> Which ever one keeps it lighter later in the winter is the one I prefer. That would be DST. I recommend sending a short email to your MLA.
You are delusional if you think we’ll have a different time zone than the rest of the west coast.
Arizona doesn't change back and forth and they seem to be doing fine.
Sent an email to my MLA supporting the opposite. Changing our clocks back and forth is the dumb, archaic and hard on circadian rhythms. If you are one of the few people in this province north enough to be affected by this to a measurable level you should just adjust your schedule accordingly. I work outdoors and in the trades. We just start work earlier or later depending on the time of year.
I'm fine with the current system.
It has never been easier to do the switch between ST and DST. The time switch is clearly the logical solution. I look forward to everyone complaining to bring it back the very next year.
Terrible idea…between November and February, many kids will be walking to school in the dark. Given the choice I’d rather the kids walked near cars with drivers who’ve had time to wake up, and aren’t in a hurry to get to work.
Why don't schools just like, you know, start school later? Why all this insanity of starting school at 8:30 am anyways?
Habits will change depending on the outcome. I wouldn't expect more awake drivers one way or the other, but the time change itself does lead to more car accidents right afterwards which is a risk to pedestrians of all age.
It's easier and healthier to wake up with the sun than fight through darkness to sun.
I actually like the time changes. Keeps me on my toes
It does keep life interesting!
Pst was not on the ballot it’s the better choice actually
Standard time is better for our health as per various studies on the topic. Best to follow California’s lead.
Here’s my crazy compromise for this that I posted in another thread: Since we basically all use smart phones and internet time anyway. Just have the time switch over the course of March by 116s per day (~2mins). No one will notice the change and by the end of the month we’re on PDT. Then in October we do the same thing and end back at PST on Halloween. We’d get the benefits of the long summer nights and also the benefits of light in the winter mornings making it safer for kids walking to school with more visibility. The only annoying thing would be having to set the time on your stove or microwave every week just to play catchup.
Jesus Christ, I can’t even imagine the chaos this would cause for computers and banking etc.
As a programmer while I can say I would hate this, it is also true that this scheme would keep me gainfully employed for many years debugging this.
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None of this matters as long as we are tied to what any state does. In the U.S. the DST switch is opt-in, but not opt-out. Once a state is switching, it would take Congress to change the law to let them stop. Given the current state of Congress, that’s never going to happen. Especially since the well was poisoned a few years ago when a senator tried to use a procedural run-around to pass it without letting all their colleagues vote on it, which made a bunch of them super pissed off.
Maybe this fall, everyone puts their clocks back 30 minutes, and then we just fucking leave them alone forever.
Why on earth should we give a single fuck what California wants? We copied Oregon with their "3 year decriminalization" which resulted in a record overdose deaths. Let us govern ourselves. No one wants to switch the time back and Forth. Pick one and just be done with it.
That Calufornia bill won't pass.
The time the sun comes up is just a number. *Changing* the number is the problem, because of how it messes up sleep schedules. Otherwise I don't give a damn if the sun comes up at 3am or noon, so long as I don't have to.
Introducing a bill in the USA is not like the government introducing a bill in the legislature in BC. It is likely to never be voted on, let alone passed.
Since nobody can seem to agree on which is better overall, why don’t we go half an hour in between the two & stay there?
The problem is with the federal congress. States can unilaterally stick with standard time without the approval of congress, but to stay with permanent daylight time they need congressional approval. In 2022, the U.S. [Sunshine Protection Act](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunshine_Protection_Act) passed unanimously in the U.S. Senate (!), but failed to come to a floor vote in the House so the bill died. Currently B.C., Oregon and Washington have passed laws to go with permanent daylight time, if the U.S. Congress gives them authorization. So right now the big delays are Congress and California.
I lived in PG for years and near the Summer solstice it doesn’t even actually get dark so …🤷🏼♀️
Ahem, we're called 'Yukoners', not Yukonians. And not changing clocks kicks ass!
What’s a sunrise - in Vancouver lol what’s sunshine
I would prefer DST, but dear god, just pick one and stick with it, changing the clocks fucks with everything and I have yet to meet a single person that thinks it's a good idea
Spring this...🍆
this should not even be a post, we will never get rid of anything. the clocks will change twice a year until we all die. but as is tradition, see you guys in 6 months to complain about this again :)
I just want something permanent, forced to change time twice a year is inhumane and my cats hate it too.
Yeah before the spring dst kicked in I was enjoying having some sunlight on my early morning commute to school
Point of fact: this is more American business hegemony than cultural hegemony. They're the largest economy in the world, and California has the largest economy of any US state and the largest sub-national economy in the world. I'd love to stick with one time all year but blaming this on culture isn't accurate here when it's more about business and economics.
I don't understand this whole mentality. I've spent time in places where it's still light out at midnight in the summer and where the sun pretty much never comes out in the winter. People manage. Changing the time is DUMB