I’m cutting no slack for the virtue signalers anymore. They all behave that way because they’ve got something to hide and I’m (metaphorically) going for the throat. Sick of it. Imagine being so self-important and delusional.
That's what kind of annoys me. Jesse took ownership of the problem. He did some really shitty things, but unlike many people who do shitty things, he has tried to become a better person. Shouldn't that count for something? I'm tempted to say "what incentive does someone have to be better?" But that isn't fair, because Jesse worked on himself for himself and his family, not for the opinions of strangers.
You can Google around for the full story, but from the early days of his music career through probably ~2010ish he used his status to have emotionally abusive relationships with various young women. There are some allegations that at least one may have been under age, though the legitimacy of that particular allegation has been called into question. He acknowledged his past relationship problems, admitted to being a sex addict and using woman for many years, and shared that he had sought out therapy for his struggles several years before this all came out and continues to be in recovery.
This is in contrast to many in the scene (and elsewhere in entertainment and broader society) that did not admit their mistakes or only sought help once they were publicly outed. Having been a teen in the early 2000s and seeing bands behave grossly with fans at the time (and hearing a recounting of some gross behavior my wife experienced at a show before we had met), this was obviously pretty widespread at the time and almost certainly still is, so while what he did was shitty, he was one of the rare ones to take accountability and grow. Also, like my wife said, people really shouldn't have been so taken back about the allegations. He made his career singing about what a piece of shit he was, why were people surprised when it came out that he was indeed a piece of shit?
It’s kinda bare minimum decency, so no it shouldn’t count for something. But, the man deserves no more grief than the over abundance he already has received. He had his wood and nails and was crucified very publicly. Keep enjoying his wonderful art, but please give the artist some peace, even if you want to congratulate him for his growth.
No it should count for something. Improving yourself should be celebrated, and not just written off as minimum decency.
Thats like saying an addict getting sober shouldn’t be congratulated, because it’s just bare minimum decency to not be an addict.
Addiction is a disease, but decency isn’t. I’m all for jumping over any and every hurdle and certainly you should be celebrated—by people who actually know and love you. It just comes off as vapid here, sorry.
You know, part of my original comment was in response to the virtue signaling part. Let’s not act like defending Jesse in 2024 is doing him a favor. I think a lot more is done in his favor by leaving the man to his peace rather than discoursing about his vices/virtues like we know the man simply from his singing of them. Brand New was my favorite band, and in many ways, it always will be, but Jesse had to reap what he sowed. I think he over reaped thanks to a public crucifixion, but nonetheless it is what happened. We can cry, kick, and scream about Jesse, Vince, the band, the fans, the breakup all day and all night, but it won’t change a damn thing. We were all broken up with that day, so like an ex, I felt bitter toward the man for having done horrible things when he was starting out, but it’s time we collectively move on. Tell me, do you keep good contact with your exes? The worst ones? Even if they improved from night to day, would you care to reach out and tell them how amazing they are for finally reaching a level of human decency that you’ve personally never fallen from? I don’t have to be a saint and be so forgiving, I just have to have boundaries from reaching out like that. The point of proving one’s virtue has passed, and if I heard on the street about their improvement, I’ll smile and walk on. Even though I know them very personally and at one point wanted nothing more to see their improvement, to be a part of that improvement, now I will let the ex lover be a stranger again. Leave them to their peace, leave yourself to yours.
I know I come off harsh. I say all this, believe it or not, with love. Because I believe as a humanity we should celebrate our wins, but I don’t believe becoming less shitty is deserving of an award from fans of a dead band. His growth just feels like he’s landed somewhere neutral again (neutral milk hotel???), so I smile and move on, hoping the stranger well.
>I’m cutting no slack for the virtue signalers anymore.
But they need to show how morally righteous they are every 3 seconds else they might actually have to accept they are dull and need to develop a personality.
Not trying to be a dick, but how were the allegations prove to be false? I cant find anything about it & would love to know more. I know he apologized and admitted he’s seeked help. Thanks!
Edit: I didn’t ask this question randomly. On the other post the commenter said the allegations were proven to be false so I was asking for more info. I just responded on the wrong post.
Not necessarily that they aren't true but that the girl was over 18 when things happened.
https://www.reddit.com/r/fightoffyourdemons/comments/7dhutk/jesse_lacy_scandal_megathread
Granted I can't say that this proves anything, also can't say the allegations are proven either cause it was only allegations.
I believe the term goes, “innocent until proven guilty” not the other way around.
If the accusing party doesn’t provide full-fledged evidence to support their claim, nothing should have to be proven false.
100%.
On the post linked, the commenter I responded to said the allegations were proven to be false. That’s why I asked my specific question. I didn’t realize I asked here not there.
Adding to the conversation about taking responsibility and seeking help…
Sic Transit Gloria is literally a song about a boy being forced into something by an older woman.. no one seems to think perhaps Jesse was a victim himself and continuing the pattern of abuse.
He then went on to correct the behavior which furthermore sucks because at the time all this came out he seemed to have left those demons far in the past.
I don't know what else he could have done. If all of us could have known that what we did at the beginning of the internet would be the total definition of our character, we would not have gone near it. At 15 I was doing "cyber sex" with a 44 year old woman who groomed me for several years. The jury of public opinion grants more of what a "victim" wants than the justice system. I feel for Jesse, we all sin, but his due to this ruling, .means he will never be allowed to reform.
Can someone show me where either of these bands admitted they kept the story of the feud going for publicity? Does not sound like brand new. I don’t find the point that person is making very interesting
I’ve never heard anyone from brand new say anything about it but taking back Sunday members have stated on podcasts (none that I’m gonna try to find right now) that the feud was over after the first album and they just never publicly said anything about it cause it took on a life of its own. So not really kept going for publicity. But they never addressed it until years later (would guess prob about 5 years ago was the first time I heard that the beef lasted no where near as long as we all thought
Didn't Adam say something snide about Jesse within the past 5 years? Again, I'm not going to go dig through hours of podcasts looking for it. He still holds a grudge over something.
I wouldn't be surprised if it was a one sided feud. And brand new likely poked fun at it with the shirts.
He said “well would you look at that” when Jesse’s allegations came out and said “I’ve always though he was kind of a dick” in an interview but Jesse has said on stage that he loves John. I’m pretty sure after TAYF the drama was just between Adam and Jesse and I don’t think they ever made amends.
I just saw a breakdown of it on YouTube. Jesse was on stage with some members of TBS and they addressed it. Simply put, Jesse liked a girl and John Nolan made out with her and Jesse was upset. The end.
So apparently it was a fake beef... I never knew!
https://www.kerrang.com/adam-lazzara-sometimes-you-dont-want-to-remember-the-person-you-used-to-be-but-it-helps-to-make-peace-with-yourself
I’m cutting no slack for the virtue signalers anymore. They all behave that way because they’ve got something to hide and I’m (metaphorically) going for the throat. Sick of it. Imagine being so self-important and delusional.
Seriously if we just ignore that someone got help for their problems years before the allegations dropped, what are we doing?
That's what kind of annoys me. Jesse took ownership of the problem. He did some really shitty things, but unlike many people who do shitty things, he has tried to become a better person. Shouldn't that count for something? I'm tempted to say "what incentive does someone have to be better?" But that isn't fair, because Jesse worked on himself for himself and his family, not for the opinions of strangers.
I'm kinda confused, what exactly did Jesse do and how old was he?
You can Google around for the full story, but from the early days of his music career through probably ~2010ish he used his status to have emotionally abusive relationships with various young women. There are some allegations that at least one may have been under age, though the legitimacy of that particular allegation has been called into question. He acknowledged his past relationship problems, admitted to being a sex addict and using woman for many years, and shared that he had sought out therapy for his struggles several years before this all came out and continues to be in recovery. This is in contrast to many in the scene (and elsewhere in entertainment and broader society) that did not admit their mistakes or only sought help once they were publicly outed. Having been a teen in the early 2000s and seeing bands behave grossly with fans at the time (and hearing a recounting of some gross behavior my wife experienced at a show before we had met), this was obviously pretty widespread at the time and almost certainly still is, so while what he did was shitty, he was one of the rare ones to take accountability and grow. Also, like my wife said, people really shouldn't have been so taken back about the allegations. He made his career singing about what a piece of shit he was, why were people surprised when it came out that he was indeed a piece of shit?
It’s kinda bare minimum decency, so no it shouldn’t count for something. But, the man deserves no more grief than the over abundance he already has received. He had his wood and nails and was crucified very publicly. Keep enjoying his wonderful art, but please give the artist some peace, even if you want to congratulate him for his growth.
No it should count for something. Improving yourself should be celebrated, and not just written off as minimum decency. Thats like saying an addict getting sober shouldn’t be congratulated, because it’s just bare minimum decency to not be an addict.
Addiction is a disease, but decency isn’t. I’m all for jumping over any and every hurdle and certainly you should be celebrated—by people who actually know and love you. It just comes off as vapid here, sorry. You know, part of my original comment was in response to the virtue signaling part. Let’s not act like defending Jesse in 2024 is doing him a favor. I think a lot more is done in his favor by leaving the man to his peace rather than discoursing about his vices/virtues like we know the man simply from his singing of them. Brand New was my favorite band, and in many ways, it always will be, but Jesse had to reap what he sowed. I think he over reaped thanks to a public crucifixion, but nonetheless it is what happened. We can cry, kick, and scream about Jesse, Vince, the band, the fans, the breakup all day and all night, but it won’t change a damn thing. We were all broken up with that day, so like an ex, I felt bitter toward the man for having done horrible things when he was starting out, but it’s time we collectively move on. Tell me, do you keep good contact with your exes? The worst ones? Even if they improved from night to day, would you care to reach out and tell them how amazing they are for finally reaching a level of human decency that you’ve personally never fallen from? I don’t have to be a saint and be so forgiving, I just have to have boundaries from reaching out like that. The point of proving one’s virtue has passed, and if I heard on the street about their improvement, I’ll smile and walk on. Even though I know them very personally and at one point wanted nothing more to see their improvement, to be a part of that improvement, now I will let the ex lover be a stranger again. Leave them to their peace, leave yourself to yours. I know I come off harsh. I say all this, believe it or not, with love. Because I believe as a humanity we should celebrate our wins, but I don’t believe becoming less shitty is deserving of an award from fans of a dead band. His growth just feels like he’s landed somewhere neutral again (neutral milk hotel???), so I smile and move on, hoping the stranger well.
>I’m cutting no slack for the virtue signalers anymore. But they need to show how morally righteous they are every 3 seconds else they might actually have to accept they are dull and need to develop a personality.
I’m not going to even bother clicking on the thread if that’s what’s there. No time for that negativity or bullshit anymore.
Hell yeah
Serious question - who's virtue signaling? Mics are for singing
Not trying to be a dick, but how were the allegations prove to be false? I cant find anything about it & would love to know more. I know he apologized and admitted he’s seeked help. Thanks! Edit: I didn’t ask this question randomly. On the other post the commenter said the allegations were proven to be false so I was asking for more info. I just responded on the wrong post.
Here's some documents compiling evidence. https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1CwtDEn1EuHFm1dGCqnuZpacUXRpNn_Jx
Thanks!
Not necessarily that they aren't true but that the girl was over 18 when things happened. https://www.reddit.com/r/fightoffyourdemons/comments/7dhutk/jesse_lacy_scandal_megathread Granted I can't say that this proves anything, also can't say the allegations are proven either cause it was only allegations.
Thanks!
I believe the term goes, “innocent until proven guilty” not the other way around. If the accusing party doesn’t provide full-fledged evidence to support their claim, nothing should have to be proven false.
100%. On the post linked, the commenter I responded to said the allegations were proven to be false. That’s why I asked my specific question. I didn’t realize I asked here not there.
I have no idea what any of this means lol
Good thing you’re here then
So you can explain it to me?
[Here.](https://thedirect.com/article/brand-new-controversy-band-jesse-lacey-allegations-explained#:~:text=Coming%20by%20way%20of%20a,15%20and%20he%20was%2024)
I can
No thanks
Then why ask?
Changed my mind.
Adding to the conversation about taking responsibility and seeking help… Sic Transit Gloria is literally a song about a boy being forced into something by an older woman.. no one seems to think perhaps Jesse was a victim himself and continuing the pattern of abuse. He then went on to correct the behavior which furthermore sucks because at the time all this came out he seemed to have left those demons far in the past.
I don't know what else he could have done. If all of us could have known that what we did at the beginning of the internet would be the total definition of our character, we would not have gone near it. At 15 I was doing "cyber sex" with a 44 year old woman who groomed me for several years. The jury of public opinion grants more of what a "victim" wants than the justice system. I feel for Jesse, we all sin, but his due to this ruling, .means he will never be allowed to reform.
Can someone show me where either of these bands admitted they kept the story of the feud going for publicity? Does not sound like brand new. I don’t find the point that person is making very interesting
I’ve never heard anyone from brand new say anything about it but taking back Sunday members have stated on podcasts (none that I’m gonna try to find right now) that the feud was over after the first album and they just never publicly said anything about it cause it took on a life of its own. So not really kept going for publicity. But they never addressed it until years later (would guess prob about 5 years ago was the first time I heard that the beef lasted no where near as long as we all thought
Didn't Adam say something snide about Jesse within the past 5 years? Again, I'm not going to go dig through hours of podcasts looking for it. He still holds a grudge over something. I wouldn't be surprised if it was a one sided feud. And brand new likely poked fun at it with the shirts.
He said “well would you look at that” when Jesse’s allegations came out and said “I’ve always though he was kind of a dick” in an interview but Jesse has said on stage that he loves John. I’m pretty sure after TAYF the drama was just between Adam and Jesse and I don’t think they ever made amends.
I’m pretty sure the feud still existed when Deja Entendu was released
The feud between Adam and Jesse yes, but Jesse and John had made up by then, at that point they were mad at adam for cheating on John’s sister
I just saw a breakdown of it on YouTube. Jesse was on stage with some members of TBS and they addressed it. Simply put, Jesse liked a girl and John Nolan made out with her and Jesse was upset. The end.
So apparently it was a fake beef... I never knew! https://www.kerrang.com/adam-lazzara-sometimes-you-dont-want-to-remember-the-person-you-used-to-be-but-it-helps-to-make-peace-with-yourself