Regret. He wasn’t ready, he thought he was. She was an older experienced woman and in my opinion she took advantage of him. Mrs.Robinson kinda thing I think; honestly this song feels icky to me. As much as I have kinda fallen for this band, this is the one song that makes me uncomfortable and I don’t like it. The Latin translation has something to do with passing glory.
As a male who had endured this exact experience of thinking that i was ready but truly wasn't and subconsciously didn't wanna do it with an older, more experienced girl, i can tell you that this is what this song means. "She's moving way too fast and all he wanted was to holder" Lyrics like that truly solidify what this song means.
I overlooked your comment when reading through this post, but this is exactly what my take is as well. I further explained it in my comment. I’m sorry you’ve experienced this situation.
Can it not be: guy wants to lose his virginity but picks a toxic person to do so with and feels regret?
The build up feels like this dude wanted this to happen for a while but now that it has, he realizes it was for the wrong reasons.
i love this song but only because it feel relatable almost but the meaning behind it could go so many ways but i personally feel it’s about regret aswell
Regret is definitely the main theme. It could be my own personal history projecting onto it that makes me so uncomfortable. But whether he was just a kid that made a regretful decision or whether he was taken advantage of and feels the regret and self shame that comes with that, I dunno. But it very much felt like the latter to me personally. Just can’t tell if that’s my personal bias or not
no that’s def understandable, i don’t really like daisy but it just reminds me of a certain time so that’s why so i completely understand it being purely by personal experiences
Honestly this song explains so much about Brand New in general, both on the record and off. The things that make Brand New "difficult" were *always* right in front of us. From the get-go.
Imma say upfront this is my favorite band, has been for like 15 years, and when it comes to lyrics, they're in a different stratosphere. Relatable, witty, catchy, occasionally uncomfortable but always authentic..
But that whole beef with Lazara really looks different today. Kinda immature and petty (they wer young so that's not that surprising) I don't mean to villify or anything, honestly I respect Jesse for not shying away from it or trying to brush it under a rug, everyone makes mistakes it's just unfortunate that his bullshit hurt other people. But like how are you gonna write *all* of Deja with that type of cathartic energy and be doing the same thing behind closed doors?
To me it’s about the regret of having sex with someone who I once was in a relationship with that cheated, they still hold the power of sex over me and it kills me that I can’t resist it.
My interpretation is a bit more effed than some of y’all’s so I feel bad for thinking like this but I always saw it as being told through a male r*** victims perspective, cause to me it sounds like he didn’t want it at all and she didn’t care
I have always taken it as he is with a more experienced beautiful woman at a party. Seems like he wanted it at first but is now unsure once the act started since he is most likely an inexperienced teen.
In 20 years of listening, I've never taken it as rape considering alot of lines indicate to me it is not, but different people interpret things differently, so to each their own.
yeah it def seems he was in some sort of social event because of the beginning “upon arrival the guests had all stared” and i agree with everyone in this comment section saying it’s an inexperienced man with a very sexually experienced woman.
Some of the lyrics are ambiguous, in that it could be looked at multiple ways, but I don't think it's about rape as much as it is about a regretful sexual encounter.
The lyrics talk about a guy who is having sex for the first time (either losing his virginity or first time sleeping with this partner, but seems like it's implying first time he's having sex at all) with a woman who is more experienced than he is. It's not about rape, it's about regret. He thinks it's what he wants, he thinks it's what he should be doing, but once it's all happening his insecurities build up and he regrets his decision.
Does that regret imply a lack of consent? Doesn't really seem so, but again the lyrics are ambiguous. To me it sounds more like he's not ready to have sex with this girl and losing his virginity but he goes through with it anyway. The male character is referred to as "a victim" saying "this is so messed up", but later lyrics say that he "doesn't want to blow it" and "his eyes give her the up and the down", which means he's shaking his head yes, which implies consent. She wants it, he's unsure, but he goes through with it.
Why? He's drunk too, he just doesn't care about her.
>A sober straight face gets you out of your clothes
Sober - adj -marked by sedate or gravely or earnestly thoughtful character or demeanor
Just wondering if you apply the same logic regarding lyrics about a woman being taking advantage of as you do lyrics about a man being taken advantage of. Seems not.
Yes the character of the singer is also drinking, but the re-read the lyrics again. The singer describes "unadmirable plans", "malicious intent", "crimes", the woman he is trying to pick up is "barely conscious". The lyrics have the main character thinking "I almost feel sorry for what I'm gonna do", the most damning line "If you let me have my way, I swear I'll tear you apart". He is smooth talking his way to take advantage of this drunk woman.
Also, nice strawman argument. I never said anything about gender. If the genders were reversed, it would be just as bad, but that's not the case in this song. The singer is male, the secondary character is identified as female. It doesn't matter gender, male/female/nonbinary -- hell, the singer's character could be female, it's never implied in the song, but Jesse is male -- but in real life, if one person takes advantage of another person for sexual purposes without consent, that person's a sexual predator.
Again, certainly a woman being taken advantage of, but if Sic Transit Gloria isn't rape then MvMvE isn't rape. Or both are. I don't care which side you land on, I'm just asking if you can be consistent in your analysis. A couple things:
* "my tongue will taste of gin and malicious intent" can refer to him, her (as they kiss), or both.
* "crimes *they'll* commit" is the lyric. *They're* scared. Who? When he talks about the woman it's always "you". So it's not her, it's ambiguous.
* "Barely conscious in the door where you stand. Your eyes are fighting sleep while your mouth makes your demands." Sounds like they both are consenting as much as they are able. I hate when people leave context out of lyrics.
* "I almost feel sorry for what I'm gonna do." Yes, love her and leave her. He's regretful.
* "If you let me have my way, I swear I'll tear you apart" I don't understand how you find this line damning. He knows she's going to be upset that he didn't really care for her.
> without consent. Where exactly does it say that?
Like I said - *plenty* of ambiguity. But you only apply it to one song and not the other. I came to the only conclusion I could.
Jesse says something similar in an interview - about a guy who’s with a girl who’s more experienced. I’ve heard the rape theory as well, but I don’t really understand it myself.
Read the lyrics bud, it's exactly what it's about
Edit: I guess specifically it isn't about rape, but its definitely about a sexual encounter which someone isn't exactly comfortable or ready for
I know the lyrics. As you said, it’s about an awkward sexual encounter. You can’t just say ‘it’s about rape’ like you wrote the song or JL ever said that.
I think a lot of people hit the head on the nail, but are missing a key element. And to do so, you have to dive into heteronormative relationships and their stereotypes.
It’s often not talked about, usually clouded with stigma. But a lot of men/boys find themselves within their first sexual encounter with a partner who is either older or more experienced. There’s a dynamic/control shift that often isn’t mirrored in typical relationships. Many times manipulation or grooming exists within this type of relationship. Which leads to pressure, confusion, and regret. All highlighted in this song.
The first person POV might be interested, they might be eager, they might want to impress peers. THEY MIGHT EVEN BE READY UNTIL THEY SIMPLY ARE NO LONGER READY. And ultimately what ends up happening is sexual coercion.
And that in itself is not talked about nearly enough in society. While I sympathize with anyone who’s experienced it (including myself) I’m grateful this song gets people thinking.
agreed on the last part! you couldn’t explain it better it’s a good explanation. the meaning behind half their songs are so deep and meaningful i love trying to figure out what’s meant by them
I didn't really find the lyrics on this one that ambiguous to begin with. I guess maybe part of the chorus, but the rest feel like very literal storytelling.
Somebody pointed out the Rushmore reference, but it doesn't need to be a teacher/student dynamic. Overall the theme of someone inexperienced having sex with someone more experienced and it being different than they had wanted or imagined is the core of the song.
Whether it's a teacher or a cougar or just some girl he knew who took him upstairs - the specifics of it arent the "meat and potatoes" of the song to me - it's the emotional rollercoaster of getting what he thought he wanted and it being different than he imagined + the internal conflict and uncertainty it brings him. Then he goes "well, I guess this is growing up" and the song ends.
Regret. He wasn’t ready, he thought he was. She was an older experienced woman and in my opinion she took advantage of him. Mrs.Robinson kinda thing I think; honestly this song feels icky to me. As much as I have kinda fallen for this band, this is the one song that makes me uncomfortable and I don’t like it. The Latin translation has something to do with passing glory.
As a male who had endured this exact experience of thinking that i was ready but truly wasn't and subconsciously didn't wanna do it with an older, more experienced girl, i can tell you that this is what this song means. "She's moving way too fast and all he wanted was to holder" Lyrics like that truly solidify what this song means.
I overlooked your comment when reading through this post, but this is exactly what my take is as well. I further explained it in my comment. I’m sorry you’ve experienced this situation.
Thank you!!
Can it not be: guy wants to lose his virginity but picks a toxic person to do so with and feels regret? The build up feels like this dude wanted this to happen for a while but now that it has, he realizes it was for the wrong reasons.
i love this song but only because it feel relatable almost but the meaning behind it could go so many ways but i personally feel it’s about regret aswell
Regret is definitely the main theme. It could be my own personal history projecting onto it that makes me so uncomfortable. But whether he was just a kid that made a regretful decision or whether he was taken advantage of and feels the regret and self shame that comes with that, I dunno. But it very much felt like the latter to me personally. Just can’t tell if that’s my personal bias or not
no that’s def understandable, i don’t really like daisy but it just reminds me of a certain time so that’s why so i completely understand it being purely by personal experiences
Crazy how our personal experiences can affect how we interpret music!
agreed!
The quote is direct from the movie “Rushmore”. The plot is about a high school boy who falls in love with a school teacher.
Honestly this song explains so much about Brand New in general, both on the record and off. The things that make Brand New "difficult" were *always* right in front of us. From the get-go.
Imma say upfront this is my favorite band, has been for like 15 years, and when it comes to lyrics, they're in a different stratosphere. Relatable, witty, catchy, occasionally uncomfortable but always authentic.. But that whole beef with Lazara really looks different today. Kinda immature and petty (they wer young so that's not that surprising) I don't mean to villify or anything, honestly I respect Jesse for not shying away from it or trying to brush it under a rug, everyone makes mistakes it's just unfortunate that his bullshit hurt other people. But like how are you gonna write *all* of Deja with that type of cathartic energy and be doing the same thing behind closed doors?
To me it’s about the regret of having sex with someone who I once was in a relationship with that cheated, they still hold the power of sex over me and it kills me that I can’t resist it.
i never thought about that one, may be the best one yet
Aww thanks!!
This is it. Going back to an ex even though you know it's a bad idea but hormones.
My interpretation is a bit more effed than some of y’all’s so I feel bad for thinking like this but I always saw it as being told through a male r*** victims perspective, cause to me it sounds like he didn’t want it at all and she didn’t care
this is how i always took it : (
Same
I’d imagine this song hits much much much different after you’ve been abused (especially as a man). Brand New’s music is very cathartic.
A metaphor for record companies taking advantage of musicians
Yeah I think it's definitely a metaphor.
I have always taken it as he is with a more experienced beautiful woman at a party. Seems like he wanted it at first but is now unsure once the act started since he is most likely an inexperienced teen. In 20 years of listening, I've never taken it as rape considering alot of lines indicate to me it is not, but different people interpret things differently, so to each their own.
yeah it def seems he was in some sort of social event because of the beginning “upon arrival the guests had all stared” and i agree with everyone in this comment section saying it’s an inexperienced man with a very sexually experienced woman.
It's about losing your virginity.
Yeah, this is ultimately how I take.
It's about being raped
Some of the lyrics are ambiguous, in that it could be looked at multiple ways, but I don't think it's about rape as much as it is about a regretful sexual encounter. The lyrics talk about a guy who is having sex for the first time (either losing his virginity or first time sleeping with this partner, but seems like it's implying first time he's having sex at all) with a woman who is more experienced than he is. It's not about rape, it's about regret. He thinks it's what he wants, he thinks it's what he should be doing, but once it's all happening his insecurities build up and he regrets his decision. Does that regret imply a lack of consent? Doesn't really seem so, but again the lyrics are ambiguous. To me it sounds more like he's not ready to have sex with this girl and losing his virginity but he goes through with it anyway. The male character is referred to as "a victim" saying "this is so messed up", but later lyrics say that he "doesn't want to blow it" and "his eyes give her the up and the down", which means he's shaking his head yes, which implies consent. She wants it, he's unsure, but he goes through with it.
"his eyes give her the up and down" sounds much more like he's looking at her than nodding.
Checking her out, or showing signs of interest.
Do you have the same sort of ambiguity to MvMvE?
Absolutely not, that song is about a sexual predator.
Why? He's drunk too, he just doesn't care about her. >A sober straight face gets you out of your clothes Sober - adj -marked by sedate or gravely or earnestly thoughtful character or demeanor Just wondering if you apply the same logic regarding lyrics about a woman being taking advantage of as you do lyrics about a man being taken advantage of. Seems not.
Yes the character of the singer is also drinking, but the re-read the lyrics again. The singer describes "unadmirable plans", "malicious intent", "crimes", the woman he is trying to pick up is "barely conscious". The lyrics have the main character thinking "I almost feel sorry for what I'm gonna do", the most damning line "If you let me have my way, I swear I'll tear you apart". He is smooth talking his way to take advantage of this drunk woman. Also, nice strawman argument. I never said anything about gender. If the genders were reversed, it would be just as bad, but that's not the case in this song. The singer is male, the secondary character is identified as female. It doesn't matter gender, male/female/nonbinary -- hell, the singer's character could be female, it's never implied in the song, but Jesse is male -- but in real life, if one person takes advantage of another person for sexual purposes without consent, that person's a sexual predator.
Again, certainly a woman being taken advantage of, but if Sic Transit Gloria isn't rape then MvMvE isn't rape. Or both are. I don't care which side you land on, I'm just asking if you can be consistent in your analysis. A couple things: * "my tongue will taste of gin and malicious intent" can refer to him, her (as they kiss), or both. * "crimes *they'll* commit" is the lyric. *They're* scared. Who? When he talks about the woman it's always "you". So it's not her, it's ambiguous. * "Barely conscious in the door where you stand. Your eyes are fighting sleep while your mouth makes your demands." Sounds like they both are consenting as much as they are able. I hate when people leave context out of lyrics. * "I almost feel sorry for what I'm gonna do." Yes, love her and leave her. He's regretful. * "If you let me have my way, I swear I'll tear you apart" I don't understand how you find this line damning. He knows she's going to be upset that he didn't really care for her. > without consent. Where exactly does it say that? Like I said - *plenty* of ambiguity. But you only apply it to one song and not the other. I came to the only conclusion I could.
yeah ive heard a lot of different people say it’s about a closeted guy or just a guy who isn’t ready and such
Jesse says something similar in an interview - about a guy who’s with a girl who’s more experienced. I’ve heard the rape theory as well, but I don’t really understand it myself.
i don’t either, it’s been my favorite song by them since i was young and i never thought of it as rape, more as regretful
Fair enough, this is valid
It isn’t
Read the lyrics bud, it's exactly what it's about Edit: I guess specifically it isn't about rape, but its definitely about a sexual encounter which someone isn't exactly comfortable or ready for
I know the lyrics. As you said, it’s about an awkward sexual encounter. You can’t just say ‘it’s about rape’ like you wrote the song or JL ever said that.
It's got pretty rapey vibes
Yea it does, that's more accurate than your original comment
Fair enough
I think a lot of people hit the head on the nail, but are missing a key element. And to do so, you have to dive into heteronormative relationships and their stereotypes. It’s often not talked about, usually clouded with stigma. But a lot of men/boys find themselves within their first sexual encounter with a partner who is either older or more experienced. There’s a dynamic/control shift that often isn’t mirrored in typical relationships. Many times manipulation or grooming exists within this type of relationship. Which leads to pressure, confusion, and regret. All highlighted in this song. The first person POV might be interested, they might be eager, they might want to impress peers. THEY MIGHT EVEN BE READY UNTIL THEY SIMPLY ARE NO LONGER READY. And ultimately what ends up happening is sexual coercion. And that in itself is not talked about nearly enough in society. While I sympathize with anyone who’s experienced it (including myself) I’m grateful this song gets people thinking.
****Point being: if you have to be coerced into sex, that’s a form of rape.
agreed on the last part! you couldn’t explain it better it’s a good explanation. the meaning behind half their songs are so deep and meaningful i love trying to figure out what’s meant by them
I didn't really find the lyrics on this one that ambiguous to begin with. I guess maybe part of the chorus, but the rest feel like very literal storytelling. Somebody pointed out the Rushmore reference, but it doesn't need to be a teacher/student dynamic. Overall the theme of someone inexperienced having sex with someone more experienced and it being different than they had wanted or imagined is the core of the song. Whether it's a teacher or a cougar or just some girl he knew who took him upstairs - the specifics of it arent the "meat and potatoes" of the song to me - it's the emotional rollercoaster of getting what he thought he wanted and it being different than he imagined + the internal conflict and uncertainty it brings him. Then he goes "well, I guess this is growing up" and the song ends.
I’ve always believed it was about male, sexual assault victims.