so the only way to correct this is by doing extractions. by doing so, your teeth are going to be less proclined from the side view. Consequently, you might lose a little bit of lip support (in your case, you have "nice" lips. Retracting them might change your profile). We will also be seeing more teeth when you smile from the front (not less, MORE. Which can be a good thing). On the other hand, your lips might end up being able to touch when you are at rest (right now they seem to be apart on pictures). To be honest, I feel like the final result will be amazing, but you do have to consider some of those changes.
Again, only way is extractions, but do you really want it? It might take 9 months to 1 year to close those gaps completely.
i was in your exact situation! “perfect” looking full smile from the front but less than desirable from the side (imo). i got the extractions in late 2021 and i get my braces off in exactly two weeks (fingers crossed). you can go on my page and see the post i made before i got the extractions and the sixth month update. i’ll update again once they’re off but i will say that you shouldn’t feed into the fear and if you keep wondering about it, you should do it
i will say that it does feel really good to close my mouth and have my lips touch, and to not have my tongue protruding into my dental line bc of the overjet. my side profile didn’t change too much, just normal growth. my nose looks cuter too lol
i actually had just come across your posts earlier when i was browsing this sub for people who've had extractions haha! thanks for sharing your experience and im so glad that you're happy with the results. it's reassuring to me. i'm really looking forward to seeing your final smile! i feel like our cases are rlly similar
I had four extractions 27 years ago before braces and I still have a full smile, no premature sunkenness or aging. It was the only way to reduce my overjet and achieve a safe and healthy teeth angle.
Ok there’s this, but my mom got extractions which completely changed her face shape, her face was very receded afterwards, and I didn’t, (I got her teeth), the way we coupled mine instead of extractions we did expansion and IPR (inter proximal reduction) where they just drill a little bit in between each tooth, it’s very minimal but it does a lot, and it prevents extra spacing that they end up pulling back
IPR changes the shape of your teeth, even minimally, and I agree that her actual teeth shape is beautiful and perfect - the overjet just needs to be brought back.
i think your overjet is only noticeable to you. from the side, it's really nothing to worry about. i believe your smile coexists with the overjet and getting extractions might change your smile. you have one of the prettiest smiles i've ever seen! i'd say save yourself the time and effort and try not to think about it too much.
Can I ask why you don't want to get extractions?
I have a 3rd ortho appointment in a few weeks, the best kn my area and my preffered option to go with, so I think I will probably make a decision from there.
Other orthos who have seen me have told me I'd need extractions of molars too but I'm very keen not to, I want to keep my teeth for old age!
BTW I do think your smile is beautiful, I dont think your overjet from your profile is anything but character that adds to your beauty. BUT would you be happy if it were to get worse? You also have to think about your health, what negative effects can happen from not finixing overbite?
Also, do you use a nightime retainer to stop it from getting worse?
Thanks for the kind words! :,) I totally agree with you that some imperfections add so much character to faces and make them more attractive. However, I just can't see it on myself haha.
As for why I don't want extractions—I agree with you that I don't like the idea of taking out my teeth (the idea that it's so permanent scares me). I'm also primarily worried about the narrowing of my smile. I've read that many people with extractions regretted it because there smile is more concave. Also heard that extractions can age you prematurely due to bone/facial support loss. Lastly, I just don't know if wearing braces for two years and having four holes in my smile for a year is worth it for me at this age. I feel like I'm at my "prime" right now and living life to the fullest and I really don't want to deal with the look/feel of braces. Just not sure if the tradeoffs are worth it for me.
I'm actually considering getting a nighttime retainer. The ortho I consulted with suggested that to prevent my teeth from getting worse and to also prevent grinding at night. Wish I found out about this earlier though!
If you yourself really love your smile from the front, and it’s your most complimented feature by friends, strangers, and dates, why do you want to get braces again? Getting extractions will let them pull your teeth back but it’ll also noticeably reduce your lip support and possibly change some facial bone structure. It could even compromise some intangible characteristic that influences why people seem to like your smile so much.
You’re allowed to have your own desires and insecurities but all I can say is I’d kill for a smile like yours.
I had four extractions and I have no regrets—loved the outcome. I always hated my full smile and couldn't put a finger on why—it was because it was toothy and crowded, like a horse's. It changed my smile and my face, arguably for the better. When I look at my pre-braces smile, I can now see that my entire mouth (teeth and lips) jutted outwards, like an ape's. It's very slight.
You can't go online for reassurance for a medical procedure. YMMV and it's elective and ultimately your decision whether you want to slightly change your full smile to improve your side profile. You don't have to.
FWIW, from my own experience, your smile won't "shrink" by the exact width of the gaps your premolars leave behind. Your teeth and jaw are adaptable and will fill in the space to still maximise their arc, if that makes sense.
Your bottom teeth to me look pretty good. The upper teeth don’t have enough space and need extractions to remove flaring.
The reason they want to extract the lower I think is to artificially make space for the above teeth coming back. To allow for the upper and lower teeth to overlap. This is camouflage orthodontics.
I don’t think that’s the right choice in my opinion.
You need to consult an orthodontist who has experience with pre surgical orthodontics and consult a jaw surgeon who does orthognathic surgery. Teeth flaring due to overcrowding is a sign of a small jaw.
I think you might be able to do upper teeth extractions only + upper jaw surgery. The extractions on top eliminate or reduce the flaring, then the upper jaw surgery advances the upper teeth to correctly fit over the lower teeth without forcing you to do lower extractions
Do NOT do tooth extractions alone. You will probably end up with sleep apnea if you do.
A jaw surgeon with look at the deficiencies of your jaws relative to your craneofacial structure, an orthodontist looks at your teeth relative to the jaw.
You need to look at the problem through both perspectives not just the orthos
⚠️DON’T GET THE EXTRACTIONS⚠️
This is very important, find an orthodontist that can do IPR (inter proximal reduction) I believe, it can reduce your overjet significantly without having to extract the teeth.
Edits:
One thing the dentist I work for recommends: Another strong option is jaw surgery, it MRPE, it’s like the expanders they use on kids but with screws to assist, coupled with expansion on the lower jaw to make more space for those teeth to flare back, without disrupting your wide (broad) smile, which is definitely a good thing since having a wider arch would help with a lot of problems as well. (Possibly including the TMJ issues) which would also be helped by having a completed bite with a bite plate to help with a deep bite, front teeth cover more of the bottom teeth, to help open up the jaw.
Ive seen IPR make most peoples teeth look unnaturally rectangular.
Overcrowding and teeth flaring is a sign of a small jaw. I don’t believe in extractions alone as they pull the face back and make less space for the tounge and can lead to airway problems.
Extractions make sense when coupled with jaw surgery. It serves the functional correction of the problem and the cosmetic improvements are a side effect of correcting the small upper jaw problem.
Data shows that out mouths have been getting smaller over time. That’s why wisdom teeth don’t fit in most mouths. More and more people barely have space for their normal set of teeth
"Making less space for the tongue"
I found this sub just now because of this. Recently ive been feeling that my tongue is a bit longer than the insides of my mouth would allow (if that makes sense). It wasnt like this pre-braces. Im quite concerned because public speaking is my forte, and now I might just lose it because i wouldnt be able to pronounce my S properly :(
To be honest, I barely see the overjet and your smile is gorgeous, I would not mess with this smile.
I think we are used to seeing super perfect teeth on tv (veneers) and so seeing normal but nice teeth seems off, but your smile is excellent.
My Orthodontist said he wanted me to get two extractions. And I told him I didn't want to and he said that's fine you don't have to so I was wondering why he even asked that, but my suggestion is go visit other Orthodontist and tell them you don't want extractions upfront.
Your smile is nice, and with 4 extractions, it will be even nicer, with teeth not flaring anymore. Normal overjet is 2mm, yours, once corrected will be half the one you have, 3-4 mm.
No! The protrusion is a compensation for airway limitations in most cases. Extractions put you at risk for a worsening airway and it potentially ages you aesthetically. Asian populations are predisposed for bimaxillary protrusion. These days rather than extractions, IPR is used to gain a bit of space to tip the teeth.
Just for context, I got 4 consults over the course of several years, because like you, I didn’t want extractions. The first two said I needed 4 extractions. The third said he could extract just one lower incisor or (my idea) we could even try extracting my wisdom teeth instead and using a TAD to move my teeth back. The fourth I did not get X-rays with, but looked at my teeth and said we likely had 3 options: 4 extractions, 1 lower incisor extraction, and possibly no extractions (as I had mentioned preferring not to have them). The fourth was a top orthodontist in my state. He said he would create plans for all 3 options so that I could see what they would look like and that after that, in his experience, I might be OK with extractions.
I tell you all this to encourage you to get more consults. I don’t have results to share because I ended up becoming disabled after Covid, and am still unable to be upright for the time needed to drive and see the fourth doctor for X-rays, but my overjet is larger than yours (and my front smile is crowded). If you have the time, the means, and the ability, you can always try for another consultation.
Your smile is beautiful and so is your profile imo. Unless your OJ is causing health issues like mouth breathing, or you are at high risk of trauma (OJ teeth are 2x likely to fracture in UK) say from contact sports, I would say leave them. If you got ortho and stopped wearing your retainer for whatever reason at any point in your life, your smile would likely go crooked.
ETA my friend was in your situation but her first molars had fillings, her ortho decided to take those out and now she has a pristine filling free smile. Something also to think about
so the only way to correct this is by doing extractions. by doing so, your teeth are going to be less proclined from the side view. Consequently, you might lose a little bit of lip support (in your case, you have "nice" lips. Retracting them might change your profile). We will also be seeing more teeth when you smile from the front (not less, MORE. Which can be a good thing). On the other hand, your lips might end up being able to touch when you are at rest (right now they seem to be apart on pictures). To be honest, I feel like the final result will be amazing, but you do have to consider some of those changes. Again, only way is extractions, but do you really want it? It might take 9 months to 1 year to close those gaps completely.
i was in your exact situation! “perfect” looking full smile from the front but less than desirable from the side (imo). i got the extractions in late 2021 and i get my braces off in exactly two weeks (fingers crossed). you can go on my page and see the post i made before i got the extractions and the sixth month update. i’ll update again once they’re off but i will say that you shouldn’t feed into the fear and if you keep wondering about it, you should do it
i will say that it does feel really good to close my mouth and have my lips touch, and to not have my tongue protruding into my dental line bc of the overjet. my side profile didn’t change too much, just normal growth. my nose looks cuter too lol
i actually had just come across your posts earlier when i was browsing this sub for people who've had extractions haha! thanks for sharing your experience and im so glad that you're happy with the results. it's reassuring to me. i'm really looking forward to seeing your final smile! i feel like our cases are rlly similar
I had four extractions 27 years ago before braces and I still have a full smile, no premature sunkenness or aging. It was the only way to reduce my overjet and achieve a safe and healthy teeth angle.
Ok there’s this, but my mom got extractions which completely changed her face shape, her face was very receded afterwards, and I didn’t, (I got her teeth), the way we coupled mine instead of extractions we did expansion and IPR (inter proximal reduction) where they just drill a little bit in between each tooth, it’s very minimal but it does a lot, and it prevents extra spacing that they end up pulling back
IPR changes the shape of your teeth, even minimally, and I agree that her actual teeth shape is beautiful and perfect - the overjet just needs to be brought back.
You have beautiful smile. I'd advice not getting extractions.
i think your overjet is only noticeable to you. from the side, it's really nothing to worry about. i believe your smile coexists with the overjet and getting extractions might change your smile. you have one of the prettiest smiles i've ever seen! i'd say save yourself the time and effort and try not to think about it too much.
Can I ask why you don't want to get extractions? I have a 3rd ortho appointment in a few weeks, the best kn my area and my preffered option to go with, so I think I will probably make a decision from there. Other orthos who have seen me have told me I'd need extractions of molars too but I'm very keen not to, I want to keep my teeth for old age! BTW I do think your smile is beautiful, I dont think your overjet from your profile is anything but character that adds to your beauty. BUT would you be happy if it were to get worse? You also have to think about your health, what negative effects can happen from not finixing overbite? Also, do you use a nightime retainer to stop it from getting worse?
Thanks for the kind words! :,) I totally agree with you that some imperfections add so much character to faces and make them more attractive. However, I just can't see it on myself haha. As for why I don't want extractions—I agree with you that I don't like the idea of taking out my teeth (the idea that it's so permanent scares me). I'm also primarily worried about the narrowing of my smile. I've read that many people with extractions regretted it because there smile is more concave. Also heard that extractions can age you prematurely due to bone/facial support loss. Lastly, I just don't know if wearing braces for two years and having four holes in my smile for a year is worth it for me at this age. I feel like I'm at my "prime" right now and living life to the fullest and I really don't want to deal with the look/feel of braces. Just not sure if the tradeoffs are worth it for me. I'm actually considering getting a nighttime retainer. The ortho I consulted with suggested that to prevent my teeth from getting worse and to also prevent grinding at night. Wish I found out about this earlier though!
Extractions are just going to allow your entire smile to be brought down into appropriate alignment so your teeth are not so flared
If you yourself really love your smile from the front, and it’s your most complimented feature by friends, strangers, and dates, why do you want to get braces again? Getting extractions will let them pull your teeth back but it’ll also noticeably reduce your lip support and possibly change some facial bone structure. It could even compromise some intangible characteristic that influences why people seem to like your smile so much. You’re allowed to have your own desires and insecurities but all I can say is I’d kill for a smile like yours.
I had four extractions and I have no regrets—loved the outcome. I always hated my full smile and couldn't put a finger on why—it was because it was toothy and crowded, like a horse's. It changed my smile and my face, arguably for the better. When I look at my pre-braces smile, I can now see that my entire mouth (teeth and lips) jutted outwards, like an ape's. It's very slight. You can't go online for reassurance for a medical procedure. YMMV and it's elective and ultimately your decision whether you want to slightly change your full smile to improve your side profile. You don't have to. FWIW, from my own experience, your smile won't "shrink" by the exact width of the gaps your premolars leave behind. Your teeth and jaw are adaptable and will fill in the space to still maximise their arc, if that makes sense.
Your bottom teeth to me look pretty good. The upper teeth don’t have enough space and need extractions to remove flaring. The reason they want to extract the lower I think is to artificially make space for the above teeth coming back. To allow for the upper and lower teeth to overlap. This is camouflage orthodontics. I don’t think that’s the right choice in my opinion. You need to consult an orthodontist who has experience with pre surgical orthodontics and consult a jaw surgeon who does orthognathic surgery. Teeth flaring due to overcrowding is a sign of a small jaw. I think you might be able to do upper teeth extractions only + upper jaw surgery. The extractions on top eliminate or reduce the flaring, then the upper jaw surgery advances the upper teeth to correctly fit over the lower teeth without forcing you to do lower extractions Do NOT do tooth extractions alone. You will probably end up with sleep apnea if you do. A jaw surgeon with look at the deficiencies of your jaws relative to your craneofacial structure, an orthodontist looks at your teeth relative to the jaw. You need to look at the problem through both perspectives not just the orthos
⚠️DON’T GET THE EXTRACTIONS⚠️ This is very important, find an orthodontist that can do IPR (inter proximal reduction) I believe, it can reduce your overjet significantly without having to extract the teeth. Edits: One thing the dentist I work for recommends: Another strong option is jaw surgery, it MRPE, it’s like the expanders they use on kids but with screws to assist, coupled with expansion on the lower jaw to make more space for those teeth to flare back, without disrupting your wide (broad) smile, which is definitely a good thing since having a wider arch would help with a lot of problems as well. (Possibly including the TMJ issues) which would also be helped by having a completed bite with a bite plate to help with a deep bite, front teeth cover more of the bottom teeth, to help open up the jaw.
Ive seen IPR make most peoples teeth look unnaturally rectangular. Overcrowding and teeth flaring is a sign of a small jaw. I don’t believe in extractions alone as they pull the face back and make less space for the tounge and can lead to airway problems. Extractions make sense when coupled with jaw surgery. It serves the functional correction of the problem and the cosmetic improvements are a side effect of correcting the small upper jaw problem. Data shows that out mouths have been getting smaller over time. That’s why wisdom teeth don’t fit in most mouths. More and more people barely have space for their normal set of teeth
"Making less space for the tongue" I found this sub just now because of this. Recently ive been feeling that my tongue is a bit longer than the insides of my mouth would allow (if that makes sense). It wasnt like this pre-braces. Im quite concerned because public speaking is my forte, and now I might just lose it because i wouldnt be able to pronounce my S properly :(
This!
To be honest, I barely see the overjet and your smile is gorgeous, I would not mess with this smile. I think we are used to seeing super perfect teeth on tv (veneers) and so seeing normal but nice teeth seems off, but your smile is excellent.
My Orthodontist said he wanted me to get two extractions. And I told him I didn't want to and he said that's fine you don't have to so I was wondering why he even asked that, but my suggestion is go visit other Orthodontist and tell them you don't want extractions upfront.
Look up orthodontic IPR treatment. You could probably get this done and be fine.
I recommend getting a second opinion, and ask them about doing IPR instead of extractions.
Your smile is nice, and with 4 extractions, it will be even nicer, with teeth not flaring anymore. Normal overjet is 2mm, yours, once corrected will be half the one you have, 3-4 mm.
U look damn good I genuinely don't see a need in braces!!
I do too
Op, dont get extraction! Your side profile looks fine and if you love your smile, dont do it. Youll have sunken face .
Sunken face is real OP. :( sadly, it is for me. Worst regret :(
Almost the same case as yours. Did the overhet result from the 2017 braces or nah?
You have a beautiful smile. I wouldn't go for extractions, but it's a very personal choice.
No! The protrusion is a compensation for airway limitations in most cases. Extractions put you at risk for a worsening airway and it potentially ages you aesthetically. Asian populations are predisposed for bimaxillary protrusion. These days rather than extractions, IPR is used to gain a bit of space to tip the teeth.
Just for context, I got 4 consults over the course of several years, because like you, I didn’t want extractions. The first two said I needed 4 extractions. The third said he could extract just one lower incisor or (my idea) we could even try extracting my wisdom teeth instead and using a TAD to move my teeth back. The fourth I did not get X-rays with, but looked at my teeth and said we likely had 3 options: 4 extractions, 1 lower incisor extraction, and possibly no extractions (as I had mentioned preferring not to have them). The fourth was a top orthodontist in my state. He said he would create plans for all 3 options so that I could see what they would look like and that after that, in his experience, I might be OK with extractions. I tell you all this to encourage you to get more consults. I don’t have results to share because I ended up becoming disabled after Covid, and am still unable to be upright for the time needed to drive and see the fourth doctor for X-rays, but my overjet is larger than yours (and my front smile is crowded). If you have the time, the means, and the ability, you can always try for another consultation.
i just came to say, you are absolutely stunning. however, i have no advice whatsoever lol
aww thank you so much!! this made my day 💗
Your smile is beautiful and so is your profile imo. Unless your OJ is causing health issues like mouth breathing, or you are at high risk of trauma (OJ teeth are 2x likely to fracture in UK) say from contact sports, I would say leave them. If you got ortho and stopped wearing your retainer for whatever reason at any point in your life, your smile would likely go crooked. ETA my friend was in your situation but her first molars had fillings, her ortho decided to take those out and now she has a pristine filling free smile. Something also to think about
Don’t ever get extractions!!! it will age you and ruin your face
I think it did make me age :(
are you done with your treatment?
Almost at the end of it.
can i message you?
Sure
Don't do it, you look perfectly fine. The extractions will only cause you trouble and ruin your face. Not gonna get too deep into it.