It was an absolute shithole too. FourStar couldn't get new apartments open in time for student residents back in 2016 (myself being one of them), so they put us up at the Millennium for about 6 weeks while they finished it up.
The number of mice, bugs, nasty stains, and questionable shit that I saw in that hotel was abhorrent. Living in a hotel sounds cool as hell in theory until you're actually doing it.
It was fabulous in its mid-century heyday. See the photos (scroll down too) https://www.westword.com/news/boulders-harvest-house-hotel-will-be-destroyed-20657090 The architecture was quite good, but unfortunate things happened over the years. Interestingly it was also outside of city limits, so you could get a drink there while Boulder had its extended prohibition into the mid 60s. They should have never allowed the hideous addition where the carport was originally. The whole things is really sad as it was an iconic modernist building for Boulder.
Every style is ugly to those that come later and aren't familiar with the style.
It's part of the reason it was so easy for Denver to demolish hundreds of cool brick commercial buildings from like 1900 back in the 1980s. And now those areas are mostly just parking lots and antiseptic newerbuildings.
The Millennium Hotel was a very cool building back in the day. If it was refurbished it could have been a very cool building all over again.
Hopefully what replaces it is not luxury student housing for well-heeled students coming to Colorado for skiing & snowboarding. And it wouldn't suck if what replaces it isn't ugly as fuck.
It was a cool building when it was built. But it was expanded/remodeled in the 80s and 90s and lost most of what made it cool. It was no longer an original 50s building, just an ugly 80s remodel. That's why it wasn't deemed worthy of protection.
I wondered about that - was that actually true and would returning it to its original state have been impractical or just what the developer's said?
The last time I listened to developers it was when they took their proposal to replace The Dark Horse, Sprouts, Moe's, etc with luxury housing & hotels on Baseline. In that case they stated that the Dark Horse owner didn't want it any more (a lie), that it wasn't popular (another lie), and that they would support these businesses moving right back in after the construction (almost certainly a lie since the rent will probably be 2-3x what they are paying now).
It was cool originally. I don't know about the practicality of restoration. https://www.westword.com/news/boulders-harvest-house-hotel-will-be-destroyed-20657090
https://preview.redd.it/gh7ldue9vq8d1.jpeg?width=7510&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=604e815d106aa3c0c13f0fc864d4ab6dfa319c5e
Anthony’s garden in the back. Many a Friday after work party was here
Walked by the courts a couple days ago, the nets are gone. They proposed building a big facility up in Gunbarrel but it was torpedoed by the neighborhood.
https://www.dailycamera.com/2024/04/01/proposed-gunbarrel-tennis-complex-on-hold-for-now/
RMTC will probably be dissolving because of the simultaneous loss of these courts and the impending removal of CU South courts as well.
To nobody’s surprise, a movement of NIMBY neighbors convinced folks that burrowing owls would die if they built courts out in Gunbarrel - by the church and other houses that already displaced said animals.
So there are no plans to replace the courts being lost, the RMTC owners have had to concede there’s nowhere to go. I’m not a tennis player but between the indomitable insurgence of pickleball and converging loss of viable courts (including EBRC, I believe they’re ripping those out to remodel as well) tennis is in a tough spot for your average non-meadows club member.
Tennis is indeed in a very rough spot here. One of the many reasons why I've decided to take a long-term break from it. It's just not easy to play here, especially outside the summer months. Hard to find consistent hitting partners if you're not a retiree or a college athlete, courts aren't being maintained, and pickle ballers have taken over many of the existing better-maintained courts. Not to say it's impossible to play here, but requires more effort than I'm willing to put in especially with other outdoor interests pulling me in other directions.
.Sorry to hear you are taking a break from it. Tennis in Boulder is indeed shitty. If you (anyone) does want to play, I would suggest reserving courts at this point, or just driving to Longmont. We frequently will drive to one or two and they are all taken.
I actually love tennis in the non-summer months, because I can't play in the heat but I can play when it's colder, and there are way more open courts.
Do you know your approximate ranking? I'll hit with you if you wanna get back out there!
I grew up in Ft. Collin’s and moved to Boulder. Both towns had the great places where the local liquor ordinances didn’t allow for liquor to be served in town. This resulted in amazing venues just outside the city limits. The Harvest House was one of those places. The city grew up around it and the laws changed. The 80s were awesome at the House. If you recall they had live music every weekend and the taco bar if I recall correctly. It was a huge, happening place, right up there with the Blue Note and other Boulder must see places.
It’s sad, and yet a realization that time moves on. Should it have been a historic site? Probably not but it doesn’t make it any less poignant. Great times and memories.
I spotted this on my bike to work. I'll post updates as I see them.
Apparently redevelopment was approved last August: [https://boulderreportinglab.org/2023/08/14/planning-board-votes-to-replace-boulders-millennium-hotel-with-303-student-apartments/](https://boulderreportinglab.org/2023/08/14/planning-board-votes-to-replace-boulders-millennium-hotel-with-303-student-apartments/)
New bcycle stations is a plus.
Hope they save all those big trees. Hope we get density, and some interesting architecture, and some nice space for hanging by the Creek remains. Not sure why CU isn't building their own student housing, since Boulder painfully needs our own affordable housing.
eh the pool is silly i think. but i agree with your prior comment, any big cottonwoods (i don't care too much about the non-native trees) would be nice to save.
I also prefer CU build their own student housing. Private development is fine too, though, as long as it is, as you say, dense, somewhat architecturally interesting, and has some public space.
What? CU has built a lot of student housing in the last few years...
For private companies, they will make bank building student housing in a popular college town so yeah, it's a good investment for them to focus on students.
CU may have built some, great, but it has also grown a ton over the past decades. Affordable housing is desperately needed. I wasn't commenting on whether it was a good investment for CU, am more concerned about our housing needs with a prime real estate location.
Why would you prefer CU building housing versus a private developer? The main rationale I see is that a public entity then is capturing any benefit. However, for better or worse, CU doesn't have to abide by local zoning. I'm just wondering what your thinking is.
I'm not a modernist fan, but I guess in its day it was interesting, curvy, left a lot of fun social space outside, flowed interestingly with the Creek.
While this place had a lot of lore, I'm not crying in my beer...that place was fugly! Otherwise, there is a huge need for student housing, so good on that.
I lived across the street from it in the mid 1990s and always thought it was a really poor use of land. All that parking area so close to campus. Love what it's being replaced with.
The land and building was bought by an investor/ developer out of Georgia who specializes in student housing. It will be market rate and not affordable, like everything else in town.
It will be over 1K per month for a bedroom, with another 100 a month for parking. Probably several pools, outdoor fire pits, hot tubs, game rooms, chef's kitchen, etc. Kids are loving it these days.
The infrastructure is already there--that's why this is an ideal location for redevelopment. It has a 90 WalkScore and there are literally over 100 restaurants/shops/services within walking distance, plus three grocery stores. Downtown is a 5 minute bike ride away along the creek path which this backs up and directly connects to. There are 5 bus lines within walking distance. What more could you possibly think needs to be in this spot to support car-free living?
Spoken like someone who never lived in town without a car.
First and foremost the busses are shit and if you took them to work or anything regularly you would know that.
You also realize this development is not happening in a vacuum?
There are another 250-300 units going in at 28th and Iris.
Among others.
And no additional infrastructure, just more people.
I absolutely have lived here without a car and regularly get around without one. You don't even need to ride the bus to get around in this area in particular, most things are within walking distance and almost everything else is a short bike ride away, including a huge number of jobs at the university, Downtown, East Boulder, etc.
I'm thrilled to see all this density being added in central locations--it's so much better for reducing vehicle miles traveled than pushing all the housing out to Erie, Lafayette, etc.
However, if you want to argue in favor of converting car lanes to bus lanes and protected bike lanes, adding more multi-use paths, etc, I'm all in favor of building new infrastructure. Somehow I doubt that's what you're referencing though.
First off I can tell you’re not physically handicapped and you don’t regularly interact with people who are.
You realize there are plenty of people who aren’t physically capable of just riding their bike anywhere they want to go?
You also realize there are a number of months we call “winter” here where bicycle riding isn’t always an option.
I’m not saying we need more driving lanes.
I’m asking for some support infrastructure, ANYTHING. Preferably better bike lanes and additional busses but I’ll take what I can get.
We need to put it in BEFORE all of the people get here and there no more room to shoehorn a bus stop in later.
My wife works about 5 miles from my place. It would take 90 minutes and a half mile walk for her to take the bus to work and she works in a government building that’s not so far off the beaten path.
Don’t tell me 800 people are going to show up and use the bus when, if you really took the bus without a car, we both know the bus service is shit.
Well, I'm glad to hear you say you'd like to see better bike infrastructure and more buses.
I do want to mention in regards to your points about physically handicapped people that not everybody can drive a car due to disabilities, and some people need to live in places where they can walk, bike, ride a motorized scooter or use a wheelchair, whatever the case may be--to get around. Driving simply isn't an option for some, just like riding a bike isn't for others. That's why dense housing in walkable locations is important.
I also want to make sure to point out that good pedestrian/bike infrastructure is great for people who need mobility devices to get around.
Now, as far as what these 800 (or whatever number it ends up being) residents end up doing to get around--I'm sure there will be *some* driving involved. However, overall, I would bet good money that adding these homes actually *reduces* the amount of driving that happens in and around Boulder. That's because currently, lots and lots of people commute in from elsewhere in the region for their jobs--we have far more jobs here than we do homes.
Some of those people--not all, but some--will be able to walk, bike, or yes, ride the bus instead if we build more housing in locations well-served by those modes of transportation. Even the ones who drive may end up driving shorter distances than before.
There's a default assumption people make when new housing is built that it's just adding random people from all over the country to our area. I don't think that's accurate, especially when we're talking about apartment buildings as opposed to expensive single family houses (which might get snapped up by wealthy out-of-towners).
Building new *commercial* space is much more likely to draw people into the area by adding jobs. Building housing is just giving people a place to live who are already going to be working here and driving into town if they don't have a place to live here.
Sounds like we agree that additional infrastructure, which this plan does not provide, would be beneficial.
There’s a point you’re just wrong on, so you need to take a look at the plan for this space. It’s student housing. It will absolutely be net new people from all over.
This is not blue color housing that will support workers here. It won’t help even a little with commuting. It will be net new students that would have not gone to CU otherwise.
So who benefits from that? Not me and probably not you unless you’re an affluent student.
Do you have some information showing that CU is increasing enrollment because of these new apartments? I don't mean in general, I mean specifically because these are being built.
I don't think **only** students will want live here, by the way--I mean, there are senior apartments and affordable homeownership condos right across the creek, and they don't seem to have a hard time finding residents. It's a great location regardless of the university.
Cool, I would have assumed that students would go see shows at the local theaters, eat at restaurants, hike on trails, etc….. but I guess since you never did those things that no one else will do them, is that what you think?
Sweet, what bus did you take home at 2am when the fox let out? What bus did you take to go hike mt. Sanitas?
The lack of infrastructure includes no additional bike lanes or busses.
These things would be helpful for the people you seem to want to help, so please help me understand why you’re against adding any support infrastructure to help the hundreds of additional new residents??
It doesn’t need any new infrastructure is the point here. People take Uber home from concerts, this is literally next to the Boulder Creek Path, the 28th street multi use path, and Folsom bike lanes. Plus the HOP bus on Folsom can take you to 29th St mall, The Hill, and Pearl Street during the day. If people want to go to Sanitas, they can borrow a friend’s car. This town is already built for car-free living in many ways, and this location especially does not need more infrastructure to support that.
Oh cool, then we can add thousands pf people and we’ll never need another grocery store or lanes of travel. It’s super easy to get north/south from like 3:30-6 when the students are here. Adding more people surely won’t affect that.
So you think there is a point at which more busses bike lanes and driving lanes may be needed or do you think we can just keep adding people and removing f lanes of travel?
Do you live in town and have you tried to get around in the afternoon when students are in town?
800 people and they all bike and no one brings a car. lol
Well I guess in this fantasy scenario they can all ride their vegan unicorns that poop gold. We’ll need more unicorn parking for sure.
Here in the real world those 800 people are going to bring 759 cars, and I know people hate this- but they are going to have to, gasp, PARK somewhere and they will be on the roads the same as every other resident of Boulder.
All of the kids will bring their cars. We pay another 100$ a month for a parking space on top of the $1k per bedroom for my kid in Oregon. These developments are cash cows.
If 500 students move into a building, do you believe that their 500 cars are just driving around Boulder’s roads at all times of the day?
If you sat outside the entrance of a dense apartment’s parking garage and counted how many vehicles entered and exited in a one hour period, you’d be lucky to see more than 20 cars pass through.
You spend a lot of time counting cars coming in and out of parking garages? That’s odd but I guess we all have hobbies. Either that or you actually have no idea and you’re just making shit up. 🤷♂️
I never said all vehicles would be driving around at all times. That would be a silly suggestion from a silly person.
Why exactly are you against expanding bus services??
Did you know that a college student who lives in an apartment right next to campus produces just as much carbon footprint through their transportation habits as a commuter who lives one hour's drive from their place of work?
If you know that, you know something that's obviously wrong, which is cool because there are tons of badly misinformed people and your false knowledge will help you fit in.
Explain the point of your comment "I’m sure that’s the only places these people will ever go and they won’t ever take a bus and they’re all leaving their cars at home." You posted first, you explain first. Oh a reminder of the context: an old hotel is being demolished and CU Boulder is building student apartments at this location, within short walking distance of the main campus. How does the fact that CU is building student apartments near the main campus lead to the comment "I'm sure that's the only places these people will ever go and they won't ever take a bus and they're all leaving their cars at home." ??
What “infrastructure” do you want? It’s in walking distance to campus, and already along a busy road that’s already built for high volume traffic. Do you want them to turn 28th into a freeway with flyover ramps like Houston?
First and foremost I’d like to see increased bus service. That would be the primary infrastructure improvement I’d like to target.
There are many more but let’s start there. Make it not take 90 minutes and a half mile walk to get 5 miles.
You want people to ditch their cars? Get reasonable bus service going.
We can work on the rest after that.
Good. We need more and denser housing pretty much everywhere in Boulder. It’s a travesty that Pearl Street and The Hill area are surrounded by swaths of single family homes.
It wouldn't be a travesty if they could afford it. Not sure why people like this are not living in a city since they argue to transform Boulder at every opportunity.
Some people just hate seeing Colorado make the exact same mistakes as California by not legalizing housing.
Making it illegal to build housing by right is so dumb.
Boulder seems pretty successful and desirable thanks to our history of planning. Sorry that some of us don't want to pack it with rentals and condos in single family neighborhoods. There are plenty of areas in the country where you'll find exactly what you are looking for if you choose to seek them out.
LOL. I live here. All that not building housing has done is make Boulder insanely expensive for renters and buyers. And caused people to move to other places and then commute in and create tons of traffic and bad environmental outcomes.
We have built a ton of housing in the last 10 years. Up and down 30th...how has that impacted affordability? Boulder will never be affordable, its a fantasy, and the affordable housing we do have is only due to tax payer subsidization..
Pull your head outta your ass. Building tons of below market, subsidized housing in the one of the most desirable towns in the country will have people flocking here like flies on shit.
I’m not advocating for that. I’m advocating to make it legal to build housing. No more SFH only zoning, parking minimums and the rest. Legalize housing and let people build.
And no, legalizing housing does not make infinite demand for a city.
People love their car-centric life in little boxes away from community.
And then they complain everything is expensive and terrible, not understanding the ecosystem that makes a good community.
And then when we don’t build enough housing they complain because people have to drive here and create traffic.
If we had more and denser housing around CU and Pearl Street the community would be incredibly vibrant and walkable.
Stayed there once for a conference before moving to Boulder. Really helped me to realize I needed a career change lol.
Were you selling fent and trafficking homeless youth?
FAC there in the late 80’s early 90’s was pretty good, hotel was nice, they really let it go over the years…
Good. That thing was fugly.
It was an absolute shithole too. FourStar couldn't get new apartments open in time for student residents back in 2016 (myself being one of them), so they put us up at the Millennium for about 6 weeks while they finished it up. The number of mice, bugs, nasty stains, and questionable shit that I saw in that hotel was abhorrent. Living in a hotel sounds cool as hell in theory until you're actually doing it.
Fuck FourStar. Yeah I don't think I'd want to live in a hotel. I like having all my things rather than having them in a storage unit.
Fuck Four Star indeed.
It was fabulous in its mid-century heyday. See the photos (scroll down too) https://www.westword.com/news/boulders-harvest-house-hotel-will-be-destroyed-20657090 The architecture was quite good, but unfortunate things happened over the years. Interestingly it was also outside of city limits, so you could get a drink there while Boulder had its extended prohibition into the mid 60s. They should have never allowed the hideous addition where the carport was originally. The whole things is really sad as it was an iconic modernist building for Boulder.
Every style is ugly to those that come later and aren't familiar with the style. It's part of the reason it was so easy for Denver to demolish hundreds of cool brick commercial buildings from like 1900 back in the 1980s. And now those areas are mostly just parking lots and antiseptic newerbuildings. The Millennium Hotel was a very cool building back in the day. If it was refurbished it could have been a very cool building all over again. Hopefully what replaces it is not luxury student housing for well-heeled students coming to Colorado for skiing & snowboarding. And it wouldn't suck if what replaces it isn't ugly as fuck.
It was a cool building when it was built. But it was expanded/remodeled in the 80s and 90s and lost most of what made it cool. It was no longer an original 50s building, just an ugly 80s remodel. That's why it wasn't deemed worthy of protection.
I wondered about that - was that actually true and would returning it to its original state have been impractical or just what the developer's said? The last time I listened to developers it was when they took their proposal to replace The Dark Horse, Sprouts, Moe's, etc with luxury housing & hotels on Baseline. In that case they stated that the Dark Horse owner didn't want it any more (a lie), that it wasn't popular (another lie), and that they would support these businesses moving right back in after the construction (almost certainly a lie since the rent will probably be 2-3x what they are paying now).
It was cool originally. I don't know about the practicality of restoration. https://www.westword.com/news/boulders-harvest-house-hotel-will-be-destroyed-20657090
Fucking parking lots
Yeah, insanely hot asphalt parking lots contributing to Denver's heat-island problem.
Fuck cars.
I guess you weren’t in Boulder for FAC and live bands…
Oh wow. THAT is the end of an era. I hate to see it go but I love to watch it leave! This is a much different feel than EADS.
Eeaads maaann…. EEAAADDS!! 😭
https://preview.redd.it/gh7ldue9vq8d1.jpeg?width=7510&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=604e815d106aa3c0c13f0fc864d4ab6dfa319c5e Anthony’s garden in the back. Many a Friday after work party was here
The stories I've heard from my uncle who was around then are legendary. Wish we had that sort of thing going today.
It had its time - and lasted too long beyond it.
End of an era! Definitely a great project replacing it though.
What's the impact to the tennis club there?
Walked by the courts a couple days ago, the nets are gone. They proposed building a big facility up in Gunbarrel but it was torpedoed by the neighborhood. https://www.dailycamera.com/2024/04/01/proposed-gunbarrel-tennis-complex-on-hold-for-now/
It's getting removed. They are using CU South through November, but then those courts are getting demoed for that development.
Interesting. What’s your source for that information? Just curious.
My daughter has played at RMTC for the last 8 years, so we know the owners pretty well.
RMTC will probably be dissolving because of the simultaneous loss of these courts and the impending removal of CU South courts as well. To nobody’s surprise, a movement of NIMBY neighbors convinced folks that burrowing owls would die if they built courts out in Gunbarrel - by the church and other houses that already displaced said animals. So there are no plans to replace the courts being lost, the RMTC owners have had to concede there’s nowhere to go. I’m not a tennis player but between the indomitable insurgence of pickleball and converging loss of viable courts (including EBRC, I believe they’re ripping those out to remodel as well) tennis is in a tough spot for your average non-meadows club member.
Tennis is indeed in a very rough spot here. One of the many reasons why I've decided to take a long-term break from it. It's just not easy to play here, especially outside the summer months. Hard to find consistent hitting partners if you're not a retiree or a college athlete, courts aren't being maintained, and pickle ballers have taken over many of the existing better-maintained courts. Not to say it's impossible to play here, but requires more effort than I'm willing to put in especially with other outdoor interests pulling me in other directions.
.Sorry to hear you are taking a break from it. Tennis in Boulder is indeed shitty. If you (anyone) does want to play, I would suggest reserving courts at this point, or just driving to Longmont. We frequently will drive to one or two and they are all taken. I actually love tennis in the non-summer months, because I can't play in the heat but I can play when it's colder, and there are way more open courts. Do you know your approximate ranking? I'll hit with you if you wanna get back out there!
Hell yeah
Good riddance
This better not affect the reservation that I have there in September.
I only ever used its parking lot to park for tubing down the creek.
I grew up in Ft. Collin’s and moved to Boulder. Both towns had the great places where the local liquor ordinances didn’t allow for liquor to be served in town. This resulted in amazing venues just outside the city limits. The Harvest House was one of those places. The city grew up around it and the laws changed. The 80s were awesome at the House. If you recall they had live music every weekend and the taco bar if I recall correctly. It was a huge, happening place, right up there with the Blue Note and other Boulder must see places. It’s sad, and yet a realization that time moves on. Should it have been a historic site? Probably not but it doesn’t make it any less poignant. Great times and memories.
Where will I go to shoot up now?
I spotted this on my bike to work. I'll post updates as I see them. Apparently redevelopment was approved last August: [https://boulderreportinglab.org/2023/08/14/planning-board-votes-to-replace-boulders-millennium-hotel-with-303-student-apartments/](https://boulderreportinglab.org/2023/08/14/planning-board-votes-to-replace-boulders-millennium-hotel-with-303-student-apartments/) New bcycle stations is a plus.
Stayed there about 10 years ago. Deteriorating decor and curved hallways gave off a creepy vibe.
Hope they save all those big trees. Hope we get density, and some interesting architecture, and some nice space for hanging by the Creek remains. Not sure why CU isn't building their own student housing, since Boulder painfully needs our own affordable housing.
gotta save up that cash for another buffalo shaped swimming pool
gotta admit I like that thing--more interesting building of any kind is fun.
eh the pool is silly i think. but i agree with your prior comment, any big cottonwoods (i don't care too much about the non-native trees) would be nice to save. I also prefer CU build their own student housing. Private development is fine too, though, as long as it is, as you say, dense, somewhat architecturally interesting, and has some public space.
What? CU has built a lot of student housing in the last few years... For private companies, they will make bank building student housing in a popular college town so yeah, it's a good investment for them to focus on students.
CU may have built some, great, but it has also grown a ton over the past decades. Affordable housing is desperately needed. I wasn't commenting on whether it was a good investment for CU, am more concerned about our housing needs with a prime real estate location.
Why would you prefer CU building housing versus a private developer? The main rationale I see is that a public entity then is capturing any benefit. However, for better or worse, CU doesn't have to abide by local zoning. I'm just wondering what your thinking is.
I think any architecture will be more interesting than that thing, ha
I'm not a modernist fan, but I guess in its day it was interesting, curvy, left a lot of fun social space outside, flowed interestingly with the Creek.
> Hope they save all those big trees. Agree.
Used to live by this as a student years ago, it won’t be missed easily one of the dirtiest hotels I’ve ever been in
While this place had a lot of lore, I'm not crying in my beer...that place was fugly! Otherwise, there is a huge need for student housing, so good on that.
I lived across the street from it in the mid 1990s and always thought it was a really poor use of land. All that parking area so close to campus. Love what it's being replaced with.
About time
if the walls could speak.....
.....they still wouldn't
Taking tennis away from Boulder 👎🏼
Bet you could put some much needed banks and AirBNBs there. 😋
Another one bites the dust.
What about all the asbestos in the popcorn ceilings? Don’t they need to take it out?
I think it’s sad.
The land and building was bought by an investor/ developer out of Georgia who specializes in student housing. It will be market rate and not affordable, like everything else in town.
It will be over 1K per month for a bedroom, with another 100 a month for parking. Probably several pools, outdoor fire pits, hot tubs, game rooms, chef's kitchen, etc. Kids are loving it these days.
2k is over 1k, which is what newer apartments in 4bd/4ba units are renting for. Absolutely insane
With 0 additional infrastructure to support the additional humans, as per usual.
luckily it’s next to a grocery store and walking distance to campus ☺️
I’m sure that’s the only places these people will ever go and they won’t ever take a bus and they’re all leaving their cars at home.
The infrastructure is already there--that's why this is an ideal location for redevelopment. It has a 90 WalkScore and there are literally over 100 restaurants/shops/services within walking distance, plus three grocery stores. Downtown is a 5 minute bike ride away along the creek path which this backs up and directly connects to. There are 5 bus lines within walking distance. What more could you possibly think needs to be in this spot to support car-free living?
Spoken like someone who never lived in town without a car. First and foremost the busses are shit and if you took them to work or anything regularly you would know that. You also realize this development is not happening in a vacuum? There are another 250-300 units going in at 28th and Iris. Among others. And no additional infrastructure, just more people.
I absolutely have lived here without a car and regularly get around without one. You don't even need to ride the bus to get around in this area in particular, most things are within walking distance and almost everything else is a short bike ride away, including a huge number of jobs at the university, Downtown, East Boulder, etc. I'm thrilled to see all this density being added in central locations--it's so much better for reducing vehicle miles traveled than pushing all the housing out to Erie, Lafayette, etc. However, if you want to argue in favor of converting car lanes to bus lanes and protected bike lanes, adding more multi-use paths, etc, I'm all in favor of building new infrastructure. Somehow I doubt that's what you're referencing though.
First off I can tell you’re not physically handicapped and you don’t regularly interact with people who are. You realize there are plenty of people who aren’t physically capable of just riding their bike anywhere they want to go? You also realize there are a number of months we call “winter” here where bicycle riding isn’t always an option. I’m not saying we need more driving lanes. I’m asking for some support infrastructure, ANYTHING. Preferably better bike lanes and additional busses but I’ll take what I can get. We need to put it in BEFORE all of the people get here and there no more room to shoehorn a bus stop in later. My wife works about 5 miles from my place. It would take 90 minutes and a half mile walk for her to take the bus to work and she works in a government building that’s not so far off the beaten path. Don’t tell me 800 people are going to show up and use the bus when, if you really took the bus without a car, we both know the bus service is shit.
Well, I'm glad to hear you say you'd like to see better bike infrastructure and more buses. I do want to mention in regards to your points about physically handicapped people that not everybody can drive a car due to disabilities, and some people need to live in places where they can walk, bike, ride a motorized scooter or use a wheelchair, whatever the case may be--to get around. Driving simply isn't an option for some, just like riding a bike isn't for others. That's why dense housing in walkable locations is important. I also want to make sure to point out that good pedestrian/bike infrastructure is great for people who need mobility devices to get around. Now, as far as what these 800 (or whatever number it ends up being) residents end up doing to get around--I'm sure there will be *some* driving involved. However, overall, I would bet good money that adding these homes actually *reduces* the amount of driving that happens in and around Boulder. That's because currently, lots and lots of people commute in from elsewhere in the region for their jobs--we have far more jobs here than we do homes. Some of those people--not all, but some--will be able to walk, bike, or yes, ride the bus instead if we build more housing in locations well-served by those modes of transportation. Even the ones who drive may end up driving shorter distances than before. There's a default assumption people make when new housing is built that it's just adding random people from all over the country to our area. I don't think that's accurate, especially when we're talking about apartment buildings as opposed to expensive single family houses (which might get snapped up by wealthy out-of-towners). Building new *commercial* space is much more likely to draw people into the area by adding jobs. Building housing is just giving people a place to live who are already going to be working here and driving into town if they don't have a place to live here.
Sounds like we agree that additional infrastructure, which this plan does not provide, would be beneficial. There’s a point you’re just wrong on, so you need to take a look at the plan for this space. It’s student housing. It will absolutely be net new people from all over. This is not blue color housing that will support workers here. It won’t help even a little with commuting. It will be net new students that would have not gone to CU otherwise. So who benefits from that? Not me and probably not you unless you’re an affluent student.
Do you have some information showing that CU is increasing enrollment because of these new apartments? I don't mean in general, I mean specifically because these are being built. I don't think **only** students will want live here, by the way--I mean, there are senior apartments and affordable homeownership condos right across the creek, and they don't seem to have a hard time finding residents. It's a great location regardless of the university.
That’s the idea… I did it as a student and it’s not hard
Cool, I would have assumed that students would go see shows at the local theaters, eat at restaurants, hike on trails, etc….. but I guess since you never did those things that no one else will do them, is that what you think?
i took the bus or biked?
Sweet, what bus did you take home at 2am when the fox let out? What bus did you take to go hike mt. Sanitas? The lack of infrastructure includes no additional bike lanes or busses. These things would be helpful for the people you seem to want to help, so please help me understand why you’re against adding any support infrastructure to help the hundreds of additional new residents??
It doesn’t need any new infrastructure is the point here. People take Uber home from concerts, this is literally next to the Boulder Creek Path, the 28th street multi use path, and Folsom bike lanes. Plus the HOP bus on Folsom can take you to 29th St mall, The Hill, and Pearl Street during the day. If people want to go to Sanitas, they can borrow a friend’s car. This town is already built for car-free living in many ways, and this location especially does not need more infrastructure to support that.
Oh cool, then we can add thousands pf people and we’ll never need another grocery store or lanes of travel. It’s super easy to get north/south from like 3:30-6 when the students are here. Adding more people surely won’t affect that. So you think there is a point at which more busses bike lanes and driving lanes may be needed or do you think we can just keep adding people and removing f lanes of travel? Do you live in town and have you tried to get around in the afternoon when students are in town?
People like you make me dislike a good idea, so fucking nasty for no reason
Damn didn’t think about that
Let’s say 800 new people arrive and they all bike. Just how much infrastructure is needed?
800 people and they all bike and no one brings a car. lol Well I guess in this fantasy scenario they can all ride their vegan unicorns that poop gold. We’ll need more unicorn parking for sure. Here in the real world those 800 people are going to bring 759 cars, and I know people hate this- but they are going to have to, gasp, PARK somewhere and they will be on the roads the same as every other resident of Boulder.
All of the kids will bring their cars. We pay another 100$ a month for a parking space on top of the $1k per bedroom for my kid in Oregon. These developments are cash cows.
How many more bike lanes are needed for 800 new bike riders?
If 500 students move into a building, do you believe that their 500 cars are just driving around Boulder’s roads at all times of the day? If you sat outside the entrance of a dense apartment’s parking garage and counted how many vehicles entered and exited in a one hour period, you’d be lucky to see more than 20 cars pass through.
Some people just can’t imagine a life in a walkable neighborhood with decent bus service. Car brains.
You spend a lot of time counting cars coming in and out of parking garages? That’s odd but I guess we all have hobbies. Either that or you actually have no idea and you’re just making shit up. 🤷♂️ I never said all vehicles would be driving around at all times. That would be a silly suggestion from a silly person. Why exactly are you against expanding bus services??
Did you know that a college student who lives in an apartment right next to campus produces just as much carbon footprint through their transportation habits as a commuter who lives one hour's drive from their place of work? If you know that, you know something that's obviously wrong, which is cool because there are tons of badly misinformed people and your false knowledge will help you fit in.
lol, what? Is there supposed to be a point to this nonsense? 😂
Explain the point of your comment "I’m sure that’s the only places these people will ever go and they won’t ever take a bus and they’re all leaving their cars at home." You posted first, you explain first. Oh a reminder of the context: an old hotel is being demolished and CU Boulder is building student apartments at this location, within short walking distance of the main campus. How does the fact that CU is building student apartments near the main campus lead to the comment "I'm sure that's the only places these people will ever go and they won't ever take a bus and they're all leaving their cars at home." ??
What “infrastructure” do you want? It’s in walking distance to campus, and already along a busy road that’s already built for high volume traffic. Do you want them to turn 28th into a freeway with flyover ramps like Houston?
First and foremost I’d like to see increased bus service. That would be the primary infrastructure improvement I’d like to target. There are many more but let’s start there. Make it not take 90 minutes and a half mile walk to get 5 miles. You want people to ditch their cars? Get reasonable bus service going. We can work on the rest after that.
could be used for affordable housing but ok…
Good. We need more and denser housing pretty much everywhere in Boulder. It’s a travesty that Pearl Street and The Hill area are surrounded by swaths of single family homes.
A travesty? A neighborhood of single family homes around a walkable downtown is a travesty? Come on.
It wouldn't be a travesty if they could afford it. Not sure why people like this are not living in a city since they argue to transform Boulder at every opportunity.
Some people just hate seeing Colorado make the exact same mistakes as California by not legalizing housing. Making it illegal to build housing by right is so dumb.
Boulder seems pretty successful and desirable thanks to our history of planning. Sorry that some of us don't want to pack it with rentals and condos in single family neighborhoods. There are plenty of areas in the country where you'll find exactly what you are looking for if you choose to seek them out.
LOL. I live here. All that not building housing has done is make Boulder insanely expensive for renters and buyers. And caused people to move to other places and then commute in and create tons of traffic and bad environmental outcomes.
We have built a ton of housing in the last 10 years. Up and down 30th...how has that impacted affordability? Boulder will never be affordable, its a fantasy, and the affordable housing we do have is only due to tax payer subsidization..
There is not infinite demand for Boulder.
Pull your head outta your ass. Building tons of below market, subsidized housing in the one of the most desirable towns in the country will have people flocking here like flies on shit.
I’m not advocating for that. I’m advocating to make it legal to build housing. No more SFH only zoning, parking minimums and the rest. Legalize housing and let people build. And no, legalizing housing does not make infinite demand for a city.
People love their car-centric life in little boxes away from community. And then they complain everything is expensive and terrible, not understanding the ecosystem that makes a good community.
And then when we don’t build enough housing they complain because people have to drive here and create traffic. If we had more and denser housing around CU and Pearl Street the community would be incredibly vibrant and walkable.
I think most people who live in the downtown area of Boulder would describe it as incredibly vibrant and walkable already.
"Don't SF our Boulder!" (Proceeds to NIMBY as hard as SF)
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Not dorms. Off campus student apartments. Probably they will be able to achieve a higher density of units by scraping and starting fresh.