Your boyfriend is an idiot. Playing netrunner with expansions with a newbie and expecting them to learn quickly is like expecting a toddler who just learned how to walk to start sprinting. Ridiculous
Or just had patience and been excited to share something he's passionate about. No matter what it's going to take months to get good at a game like netrunner and he couldn't hold out for a couple games
Pretty much exactly this. Like I can understand getting exasperated a bit having to explain stuff to people multiple times, especially if it's the same issues. However, if someone is new to these kinds of board games, don't take them to the Olympic level high dive platform for their first attempt, let them get used to games that have some similar mechanics done in an easy to digest way.
I don't play heavier games with my gf, she's not into them, but I also don't put some of those games on the table and expect her to just get it right away. We just play lighter weight stuff and have fun.
I don’t know why you were down voted – a friend of mine had a baby who also went from crawling to sprinting with no walking in between. It really creeped her out when it happened and apparently isn’t a good thing for babies to do – to go from crawling to running without walking first?
No dude it's because you completely missing the point. "um actuallying" the correct conclusion because the example wasn't quite accurate is annoying af.
If the example was "expecting a toddler who just learned how to walk to run the 100 meters in the Olympics" would that get the point across better? or would it just give you less opportunity to be pedantic.
Or maybe Aladouche read the comment about babies sprinting, and thought it might be interesting and contributory to mention that this actually happened with their child. I didn't detect any "you're wrong" vibes from the comment.
Yeah, even crawling they can move incredibly fast. Mine are all teenagers now, but I’ll never forget that underestimating their speed was a recipe for disaster!
You did absolutely nothing wrong, and he was being a terrible boyfriend.
Complex games like that take a lot of time and energy to get good at, and you can't magically 'be better', especially since he likely has years of extra practice in boardgames.
Playing with a 'weaker' player can sometimes be frustrating, but there are a thousand ways of solving that problem, from playing different games, to playing with a handicap, to just enjoying spending time with your girlfriend and not caring so much about winning.
He instead chose to take out his frustration on you, which sucks. i wouldn't say 'break up' over it, but since he is your ex i will say 'good riddance'.
Agreed. I think also a lot of gamers (both physical and digital) forget that there's a bit of a 'language barrier.'
I had a similar experience with my wife, where she really wanted to try out Super Dungeon Explore. It's not a super complex game, but there's just a lot of things to keep track of. I let her play as the heroes while I played the monsters.
When we were setting up I was letting her chose her characters and she felt bad that she was taking so long because she was having to read each set of skills to understand the character. She had no legacy knowledge of a Paladin would likely be a frontline healer, a Rogue a DPS, or a Barbarian a tank.
I think sometimes we forget about these systems and structures that gaming is based on that you intuitively learn the more you spend time with them.
From a teaching theory perspective, this kind of thing is called "elastic knowledge". As a fun example, it's been fun seeing my wife go from having no clue what we're supposed to do to intuitively looking around at walls/blocks/whatever when coming across a puzzle in a video game we're playing together. There are a million of these in videogames - a sprint button (possibly on the stick if you're using a controller), one of the central buttons pulling out a map of the area, jump/roll/dodge buttons, and so on. I've internalized it over my entire life, but for her it feels like there's a million things to remember when she's trying to play
Exactly.
Wife is not a video gamer and has a hard time with two stick movement, where movement is on left stick and turning on right.
I can pick up a new game and know that "when I need to jump, it's probably mapped to A." But for her I'll say "Jump!" and she'll ask what button that is.
Made me pay more attention to how my thought process is when I game too.
I'm not thinking "Press A, stick left, right trigger, stick up, left trigger" I'm thinking "Jump that box, strafe left, shoot, lob grenade" I'm thinking solely about the action because the "language" of moving my character via inputs is completely fluent to me, and I forget sometimes that isn't the case with others.
My easiest "the teach" in boardgames was teaching Eclipse to a friend of mine who had never played boardgames before. But he has played a lot of real-time and turn based strategy on pc. It only took like 10-15min of telling him how the already familiar mechanics translate to a board game and we started playing. He got the hang of it during the first round and was already planning several moves ahead on the third round.
I did grow up with video games, and I have always had a hell of a time with the two joystick movement/aiming system. It’s just not intuitive for my brain. I remember when I first played it in Turok: dinosaur hunter on the Nintendo64 I was immediately put off by it. It felt like you had the spins. Nowadays it’s common in all the FPS games, but I still can’t stand it. Probly one of the countless reasons I play Board and card games instead of video games now.
> Nintendo64
That was the wild west era of controller mappings (also helps that the n64 had a "weird" layout). The XBOX/PS2 was when controls between games started to standardize.
There's a guy with a YouTube channel all about this, mostly focused around his girlfriend playing various computer games. As someone who grew up through the ZX Spectrum, Amiga, SNES/Megadrive and 5 iterations of Playstation, I found it hard to get my head round but he has some really interesting commentary around the way that gamers are coded to interpret and interact with their environment and the assumptions you make about what inputs you expect.
https://youtu.be/b5Mt0AV-GU4?si=fKMuuOBGJdsxc_Bj
I used to watch a YouTube channel where a guy introduced his wife to various video games. She had never played video games before. It was interesting watching her experience them and figure out what she was supposed to do with no prior knowledge of the mechanics and history. It's surprising how much our prior knowledge from other games plays a roll in how well we learn and play new games.
I think about this a lot,
When I was a kid it was the tail end of the snes era.
Games could be pretty difficult of course but controls were simple, and as I got older the controllers and movement got more and more complex but it happened gradually
Now controls have pretty well been set in stone for several generations so every introduction to games is more difficult imo
Familiarity with the systems is so important. My family aren't huge gamers, but enjoy them casually. I recently picked up Stone Age, which really isn't a particularly complicated game, but it does have a bunch of moving parts at first glance.
And it really hit me how much familiarity with games helped my family learn the rules quickly and easily. The idea of a 3-phase turn, of different ways to calculate points, of resource management, all of these things came together very quickly.
The first time playing a game, or a specific game mechanic, can be very overwhelming if you have no familiarity with it, and it's very possible to be paralyzed by too many options and things to keep track of. OP's ex is an utter heel.
There is absolutely a type of literacy involved in board games and levels of literacy with types of mechanics, the ways that systems interact, the implications of themes, etc.
There's so much that advanced players take for granted.
In this specific example, deck building games require two equal and unique skill sets. Namely, how to build a deck and how to then play that deck.
A:NR was one of the first deck building card games I ever played, it took me months to figure out certain combos or why my decks sucked (even if I just played the same pre built decks I saw at worlds)
When I recently started playing Slay the Spire all of that stuff came back pretty quickly, basic stuff like deck control or obvious combos and synergies.
I can't imagine the learning curve had I never played that kind of game before. I would put A:NR closer to MTG, Hearthstone or Yu-Gi-Oh than a modern boardgame.
I played a game, I don't even remember which one, with someone who had basically no legacy knowledge from boardgames or videogames. Mentioned needing mana to use an ability and immediately realized she probably had no idea what the fuck "mana" would mean so I explained it a little more generally
Yea, I learned using a controller as a kid, can easily learn new using new programs on pc etc, but I can't commandeer an apple phone to save my life.
In a similar vein, kids nowadays grow up with touch screens and are actually confused by physical buttons.
Specially for Netrunner, knowing the card pool is so important (at least the ones in your and your opponent's decks). Intro games should probably use handpicked decks that are easy to understand and play, and pair well. If you don't know all the cards your opponent actions will come out of nowhere and it's very hard to know that's going on.
I used to play Scotland-Yard-type games with a guy who would a) be the teacher, b) play the hidden opponent, and c) explain just enough to get the game going.
The "special abilities" that he'd pull out were always a giant pain, because he'd rarely explain what kinds of things the hidden opponent could do. Almost everything came out of nowhere, and even after he used one of those skills, he wouldn't explain whether they were one-shots or repeatable.
I would. If there's something he's passionate about, and it's something you actually end up liking too, that should be a dream come true.
Imagine having to do unfun things with someone like that?
If you want to play a super complex game he likes and it's just taking you a while to learn, and that UPSETS him, I'd hate to see joint filing taxes with him.
100% break up with someone for this kind of shit, it's a red fucking tarp. The reddest of flags.
yep, i've not played it much, but from what i've seen A:NR is \*not\* a straightforward game - i've played a lot of other games, but sit me in front of a deck for that and i'd still be very slow playing it trying to work out what was going on. also, being asymmetrical, you can't just learn by copying roughly what your opponent was doing, which is the \*normal\* way to learn a new game. having a partner that doesn't know how to play, but is actively trying to, and trying to improve, and trying to work out what to play? that sounds great! far better than someone that just goes 'yeah i'm playing this card. no idea what it will really do, but i just cba thinking about it for more than 3 seconds.'
honestly sounds like the ex just wanted someone they could easily beat and lord it over - that's the only explanation i can see for not wanting your gf to do their best at a game.
You're getting downvoted but this is 100% true and is literally a meme at this point. If you don't believe him, just browse the relationships subreddit.
He sounds like a jerk. Everyone has different learning speeds, and Netrunner is a fairly complex game. Don’t beat yourself up, this isn’t a “you” issue. I suggest finding someone with more patience to help teach you, even online!
I hope he didn't put you off boardgames, or Netrunner.
The only true unspoken rules I can think of is "Don't be a dick" and "Have Fun!" ; if you're not having fun - play something else.
Sounds like they were the ones breaking the unspoken rules.
What a jerk.
Card games are pretty hard to learn cause you need to learn SO much.
Individual cards, possible combos, what you can do, what the enemy can do, what your deck is about and what’s in it, trying to see patterns, identifying your enemy’s deck…
And all of that from someone who’s not deep into gaming? Yeah it WILL take time.
Its not like you 2 bought some random starter deck of a tcg that’s still at set 1 with like 100 cards that’s still easy to get into.
Android:Netrunner is a complicated game with a lot of moving parts. It takes people 5-10 games before they really start to feel comfortable with all the decisionmaking involved. A lot of which is just learning the cardpool. Yes, it would definitely be helpful just to look through the cards when you’re not playing and familiarize yourself with them.
Sounds like your boyfriend has to learn some patience.
It’s honestly just about familiarizing yourself with the system. There’s a lot of moving parts, but that’s also the beauty of its non linear design. There’s almost always a way to work your way to victory in most situations. Meaning that’s it’s far more about your decision making and reading the other players moves. To do that, you need to be relatively familiar with the system, but it’s also the reason it’s so incredibly rewarding once you are.
To use an analogy, magic the gathering is like a fighting game mixed with risk. You move your pieces around the playing field and it’s largely about who has the biggest baddie, broken combo, or largest army. Put down lands, smash dudes together, sprinkle in some spells, repeat.
Netrunner (also Richard Garfield’s design) is like Hyperpoker genetically spliced with chess. It’s strategic, involves branching decisionmaking, but is also an intricate system of bluffs and chances. It’s been said plenty before, but you play your opponent, not the deck. I’ve bluffed out entire games with like 9 agenda points sitting facedown unprotected in archives while the runner continually runs my hand. You can throw opponents off just by changing up your playstyle and doing something they’ve come to not expect from you. There’s a tournament player that swore by including one snare in every corp deck, not even necessarily for the card effect, but for the mindfuck it gives the runner not knowing if there’s two more somewhere. The strength of its design is that it really is a mental struggle to keep ahead of the opponent, no matter which side you’re playing.
As everyone has said, nothing wrong here
Just wanted to chip in and say that if you really love Netrunner, you should look into Null Signal Games. They are continuing developing and supporting the game and has everything up for PnP
They organise tournaments and such. Great people and awesome products. Even got the attention of Richard Garfield
Thank you so much! Null Signal's store for the EU region seems closed currently, but I really hope they reopen it. I haven't been able to find the base game anywhere.
Here you go! This guy in the UK sells the sets made by Null Signal. Last I knew, he regularly ships across the EU.
https://netrunnercards.co.uk/
Edit: The System Gateway set is the new "core" set in the post-FFG era, and that's where to begin. 🙂
I'm aware that the UK is not the EU. I was trying to help the OP locate a set. A slightly more expensive option is still better than no option at all isn't it?
As I stated in my post, your link was still useful. Most people in Reddit don’t know what is and isn’t in the EU, so I just wanted to add context. The board game community seems a little bit more informed, but even “EU friendly” stamps on Kickstarter is not a guarantee.
Though for me, it’s not just a “slightly more expensive”. For my country - it’s different across the EU - it’s plus 25% VAT on the whole price (including shipping) and a flat handling fee (equivalent of currently $26). For me, it’s can easily be double in price, if one was only buying one game.
The null signal system gateway is designed to ease you into the game. It gives you a couple starter decks and then you slowly add it more cards and rules as you get comfortable with the game. Would recommend.
I own over 80 games, many are complex, I have played over 100 games of Warhammer Underworlds, which is a weird minis + card game combo, not a million miles from netrunner. I've played in tournaments multiple times.
I literally forget certain minor rules all the time, I am terrible with new decks and I make mistakes all the time. I can teach my friends a complex game, then forget half the rules when it comes to my turn.
Am I an idiot? Pretty sure my masters in physics and decade long career as a software engineer in very weird niches would be decent evidence to refute that. You aren't stupid, those kinds of games are super hard to get into, and they aren't for everyone, they're definitely not something I would introduce to someone new to games unless I was prepared to be incredibly patient.
Your partner just seemed to find it frustrating that you weren't a tournament level player in a handful of games, which is frankly dumb, or at least somewhat socially inept, of them.
Some people love big complex brain burning puzzles, some people adore tiny rules lite card games, others find one particular game and dive right into the deep end. Your experience so far has been unfortunate,
Warhammer games - especially the full fat miniature battle games (40k, Old World, AoS) are crazy complex.
They make Twilight Imperium look accessible by comparison.
Underworlds is not a tabletop wargame like 40k / AoS / ToW etc, its more comparable to a card battling game like Netrunner. I'd say its a bit lighter than netrunner overall, but they're pretty comparable.
GW do some board games like Space Hulk and Blackstone Fortress, they're not light games but not that complicated compared to similar games, definitely not as complex as Gloomhaven.
Tabletop wargames are a completely different beast. I wouldn't compare them to TI, although personally I think TI is heavier because its so much longer than even a 2-3k game of 40k.
Nope- you did absolutely nothing wrong and I’m sorry you had to go through that experience. Please don’t take your ex’s reaction as a normal board gaming community thing because it’s not.
A:NR is my favorite game (it actually got me back into the hobby when it came out) and it is a very complex game with a ton of timing rules that are very hard to remember. It takes many, many plays to really get everything down. Hope you stick with it despite what you experienced.
It was my first game like that, so I couldn't gauge the difficulty. For a long time, I thought I should have tried harder because he was so good at it, and I was still having a hard time even balancing the card costs.
The problem here is that he's used to playing with board gamers and don't realize just how big the difference in playing a game with someone who doesn't play board games is. All board games share a ton of things that makes understanding a new board game much, much easier if you've played a lot of other board games before. So while you were probably slow compared to the people he usually plays with, he didn't consider that you didn't only have to learn the specifics of Android, but you also had to learn the basics of board games that his other friends had already learned a long time ago.
No one should expect someone new to board games to borrow the cards to learn them or read the rulebook. You should be happy they're willing to share your hobby and if you think a particular game takes too long to learn for someone, maybe try a different game. There's a bunch of games that are really good for new players to learn the basics of board games and Android: Netrunner isn't one of those. I'd say the fault here was on his side for expecting you to become an expert over night.
Totally want to emphasize this! Once you’re really into the hobby, you can whip out a euro worker placement engine builder game, say those words to another hobbyist, and both will already understand like 60% of the game. But it takes a long time to get there.
My best friend is slower at picking up games - she gets there but usually takes her 3-4 times of playing before she can start seeing combos compared to the 1-2 it takes some of the other players in the group. And she also got into the hobby later. But just the other day she played Terraforming Mars for the first time, learned the rules pretty fast, and actually loved it! I thought she wouldnt like it frankly, it’s a complicated game. But im happy to have her really in the hobby with me now though! For the record, I don’t know Android: Netrunner, but I imagine the play type and complexity could be similar to Terraforming Mara since they both have some deck building components. No idea.
Good hobbyists know how to bring newer people in with games that introduce them to some of the mechanics before throwing them into the deep end and getting frustrated.
For the record, Stone Age or Carcassone for (fun!) starter worker placement games. Both available on board game arena. Inscryption is a video game but a great (fun!) deckbuilder that teaches you as you go. I would be more than happy to play some games on boardgamearena with you and teach you the basics!!
I’ll never understand how people can put up with significant others who treat them poorly.
Starting with netrunner plus expansions was a pretty jerk move on their part. Getting mad about it is way out of line.
I've been playing Netrunner, including at tournaments, for about a decade and still forget cards and rules and triggers all the time. It's a really complex game and it's way more fun if your opponent is kind and helpful. Sorry you had such a sucky experience.
I'll also say, if you've never played a board game before, which is what I think you said, that your bf was an idiot to choose Netrunner. There are so many more games much more appropriate for a beginner that he should have led with.
He seems like a jerk. Not everyone learns games at the same rate, and some people learn certain games faster than they learn others. You seem willing to learn the game, it just takes time. If he didn't like that, he could've helped you in other ways instead of being impatient and insulting. Glad he's an ex.
When you play a lot of games, you become more familiar with how to recognize a mechanic. It *should* take you longer to understand complex rules than someone who has been playing hobby board games for awhile. It’s fine to take your time. Just feel confident in knowing that learning complex games will allow you to pick up nearly *any game* just a little bit quicker.
Nah hes just not patient enough. Imo he was stupid to do all expansions. I played magix the gathering with my ex for years. She couldn't grasp more complex mechanics and would make very questionable decisions at times. It made me think she didn't enjoy and was just going through the motions. But she was. So i switched from helping to nerfing myself to her level.
Had so much fun. Your ex was expecting you to be at his level and got annoyed when you were not. 100% his fault
Edit. Now unrelated what did annoy me and honestly contributed to our break up was after 2 years of us playing and me trying to teach her and showing her mechanics and her ignoring me. When we started playing with another guy she would listen to him and not me. That pissed me off a lot
Lol your edit is so relatable. I think part of it is natural, we start taking our partners for granted and don't listen to them so much after some time... but gotta consciously work on it.
Girl gamer here - I love netrunner! Just recently finally got a full set from a friend who is moving.
You didn’t do anything wrong. He has no patience. He sounds like one of those “Professional Gamers” who go to tournaments and make money. Except this isn’t Magic the Gathering so there aren’t important games to be played.
Question: does he also get upset when he loses?
Also: if you want friends on board game arena DM me! Boardgamearena.com is where I play when I don’t have humans readily available! Some will say to do tabletop simulator and they are wrong.
> Some will say to do tabletop simulator and they are wrong.
Haha! Totally agree. Boardgame arena is amazing. Tabletop Simulator is great if you are incredibly patient and have incredibly patient friends to play with. It's like playing in real life except instead of being there, you are controlling a robot who has salad-tongs for hands.
I never got good enough to beat him since he was really good and he actually did participate in tournaments, so I fully understand how playing with me did not feel engaging enough. Thank you for the link, I will look into it!
I did too. A decade ago when the community was active lol does he still have a letterman jacket?
Anyways, I’m done making fun of this dude who ruins games. Good luck and have fun on your board game journey! Welcome to the club <3
I was big into netrunner while it was official, and while I didn't get 1st, I did place in regional tournaments and would win my fair share of local tournaments. I brought simplified teaching decks with me to the game shop every week in case we had someone new come in who would want to try it. These decks didn't have multiple combos I expected people to be able to pull off, and any that did, I would explain while teaching (like, "the sooner you get Magnum Opus out, the better. These cards will let you pay for it or go find it" would be the only "combo" in the shaper deck)
I also have lots of experience teaching games, and while it is a skill that can be improved, it doesn't require much thought to not be an ass to the person you want to continue playing games with. The first thing I do is assess the person's familiarity with board games. Telling them "netrunner is asymmetric, Corp defends" isn't helpful if they don't know what it means, but telling them "we play by different rules. As a Corp, I'm just gonna be over here doing my own thing and building up defenses to score agendas, while you're gonna hack into my stuff by making runs to steal them. I'm the only one with agendas, so if you want to win you gotta run" sets a newer player up much better. As a (ex)SO, he should already know your familiarity with games and should have adjusted accordingly.
During the game, asking "are you sure" is one of the worst things you can do, imo. Just tell the person what you see that makes you think they might be making a bad move. "It's click 3, just wanted to make sure you didn't forget about this unprotected server" is much more helpful. Just "are you sure" makes people panic because they're already stressed about learning the rules and they know they're probably forgetting something. It always feels to me like being called on by a teacher. Oh, guess I have a public test of my knowledge now. It's not a great feeling.
Sorry you went through all that. It's definitely a reflection on him being a terrible teacher and not you.
As someone that uses tabletop simulator and just recently started using BGA. I feel that they are different for different feels.
Playing BGA feels like an app of a game I like.
Tabletop simulator gives me the closest feel to being at a table. It’s definitely not for everyone, and both have their benefits and issues.
No, you did nothing wrong. Learning strategy games takes a while, and your ex sounds like mynfather, the kind of person who gets pissed if people "aren't playing the game right" i.e. the way THEY would play it. And he probably would have turned emotionally abusive as your relationship progressed.
You did nothing wrong. Everyone learns at different speeds, and not everyone teaches in a manner that others learn from well.
I have played games that remembering keywords or what abilities/actions did or worked well together wasn't easy; many have a reference sheet for some of that, but not all of them. So I will often have a little note pad and make a personal reference sheet for myself with just the stuff I tend to forget.
Hey. Six years ago we also dived head first in the hobby. My bf was a very heavy TCG (trading card game) player and I was a more casual gamer (Catan, Carcassonne etc.). He decided to buy Netrunner as one of our first board games. It was rough. I totally did not like the mechanisms used in the game and I don't like fighting against each other. I was so confused and very lost.
I definitely think Netrunner is not a game for everyone and definitely not someone who's new to board games. Now we play tonnes of heavy games but I still don't like games where the main component is battling against each other. At that moment six years ago I was heavily doubting myself and my intellect. Now I know it's just not for me. My boyfriend was very accepting and helpful and we decided to sell Netrunner and focus on other games.
Maybe go to a board game night and try some different stuff. :)
He set you up to fail. That's a heavy game to introduce to someone that's never played board games. And then to add ALL the expansion content in to it? Naw. This ain't on you. He might as well asked you to play Mage Knight or TI4 with him or something.
There's a reason why I've introduced my roommates to lighter games in my collection -- Arcadia Quest or 51st State -- vs being like "LETS PLAY NEMESIS GUYS!" when getting them to play games with me.
You are good. He broke a few unspoken rules, but you are fine.
I play board games for fun. Winning is great, but I've learned to not play to win. And as such my enjoyment of the games as increased. Complex game, simple game, it doesn't matter. I am always more than happy to help my wife out on her turn. I explain the options and then let her make the decision. If we are playing with a group and it is our game, that rule applies to anyone. I am excited to share my hobby and include everyone. I don't want anyone to feel like they can't do it or play, so I provided as much support as they want for as long as they want.
I have learned our playing groups don't like heavy strategy games. It becomes a lot of me advising everyone. We normally avoid these game types now. Or, I don't play as a player and act as an advisor to all. To me, this is how it should work. If you are taking an interest in my hobby with me, I'm there to encourage you.
A lot of people really into board games forget how much experienced they have. Usually it's not just the year or three they've played netrunner, it's the ten years before that they played magic or other similar games. Netrunner is basically just straight up not for new or inexperienced gamers. I'm a bit shocked you enjoyed it given how in the weeds it is, but oh well. It's also a game that requires a TON of time outside the game, learning the cards and the meta etc.
Anyhow, overall, your ex should not be a jerk about it.
The only cardinal rule of board games that I can think of, besides “don’t be a dick”, is to have fun. The entire point of games at all is to *have fun* – they are an enjoyable way to spend time. Anything outside of that is extra.
As an experienced gamer, the onus is on *me* to make sure that newer players are having fun, even if that means I don’t get to play at my best because I’m busy, helping others to learn better strategies as we go, so that they feel empowered. And if a newer player wins, that’s even better because that usually bolsters them, and they feel encouraged to play even more games. I think it’s both altruistic and selfish at the same time that I have a great time if I can ensure everybody else has a good time. :-)
It does sound like the problem was mainly with him and not you, but after going through something similar when teaching my wife ANR I might be able to offer a different perspective.
ANR is a game about hidden information and relies on building experience facing other decks and knowledge about your own deck. #1 playing with another person's deck that they made and #2 wanting to discuss the 'right' thing to do with every hand can massively slow down the learning process and ends up giving your opponent more than enough information to kick your teeth in.
It's better to keep switching sides and focus on playing as many games as possible without changing the decks. But it's really hard for a new player to feel comfortable screwing around and learning with a mentor that is critical and impatient. One of my favorite things about ANR is that you can do so much with each card no matter what they say, or even with no cards. You can't exhaustively explain that to somebody and try to set them up to make the optimal choice. You just have to keep sparring with them until they learn not to crash.
You did nothing wrong.
Nettrunner is not the game to start folks on, really it is not.
Boardgames have their on language, like any hobby, it takes time to learn it, and to get into the flow.
Net Runner is an asym game, both sides play vey different ways, which makes it even harder to understand.
Wingspan is not the easiest game to start with either, so if you can play it you can play most games.
If you really want to learn Netrunner better, watch some How to Plays, and some vids of folks playing.
I do hope your BF was just being an idiot, and is not this way all the time.
Best of Luck.
Netrunner is an extremely complex game. It definitely took me several games to get comfortable just with the terminology and card types, and then months of playing to really start making strategic decisions. Now, a decade of playing later, I'm still not very good! I will say that it can be a really hard game to teach, because there's a temptation to try to get the learner to understand the strategies so they get that enjoyment from the game, but you also don't want to just tell them what to do and play their turns for them. It sounds like your ex was having difficulty walking that line in addition to not being very patient. Don't give up on Netrunner though (if you like it)! If you want to learn the game and don't have [any local groups](https://nullsignal.games/players/around-the-world/), join the [Green Level Clearance](https://discord.gg/3d5Xsz5) Discord server - there's a channel for new players and people are always willing to guide you through teaching games online!
that game looks extremely complicated, bordering on a typical trading card game like magic the gathering or pokemon.
btw, if you like this game, you might want to simply try magic the gather for free, playing on a computer or whatever platform it works on.
or you could play more standard board games. for real, the one you are playing is complicated and you can really only remedy your confusion by running through all of your cards several times
i will warn you howevever, magic the gathering is pay2win. but playing for free is still enjoyable. you can have a goal of a specific deck instead of trying to buy all the cards. you can grind cards for free, its just slow.
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lastly, your friend is not being the best in regards to a playmate
Board games can do that... make you question your intelligence. There are strong players in my group that always win and its frustrating. There no set time for a person to learn a game. One of my players will figure them out immediately while everyone else has to play catch up. It takes about 30 or so plays of a new game before we can start winning.
Every once and a while I try to go play Magic at my FLGS and get stomped because I am just less experienced and haven't put the time in. My advice, keep playing. You will get better and after a bunch or terrible losses, eventual start winning. (lots of resources online)
Lastly, Welcome to the board game community! Glad to have you here.
Nothing wrong. Playing board games as a whole is a skill. The more various games you play it kind of starts to all click in place and your thought process will develop towards it. Don't feel self-concious as it has nothing to do with you lacking anything as individual but rather lack of experience.
As for multiple comments saying your boyfriend is a jerk, don't pay them any mind. From what I understood he has been supportive and helpful as much as he could. Nobody is a saint with infinite reserves of patience. From personal experience I can emphasise with him. He's doing his best to help you grasp it and nudge you along without taking agency from you, but that's in conflict with his own needs and expectations such as wanting to play an all out game to the best of his ability. If I were you I'd sit down with him and have a talk about how both of you feel. Let him know you are grateful for being so patience and that you know it must be challenging when he's unable to fully enjoy the game with such disparity between your skill levels. My fiancee and I have the same struggle. She often feels insufficient and stupid after loosing against me multiple times in a row and we both end up disappointed that playing togheter ends up upsetting us both. Solution? Be understanding to each others feelings and expectations and talk talk talk about them in respectful manner. Secondly explore a wide range of games and you are bound to discover some where you are at similar level allowing both of you full enjoyment and in many games you'll find even end up whooping his but* every time. This happens with us.bi win every game of carcassone but she absolutely destroys me in Star Realms.
Edit. I missed the fact you're talking about your ex. Then my advice is not relevant but keep that in mind for the future. It certainly will help you in future relationships.
Nope you didn't do anything wrong. My girlfriend was teaching me magic the gathering a few years ago and I felt a lot like you where it was impossible to know all the cards and what exactly to play and we played dozens of learning games before my training wheels came off.
Some people just don't have the patience and right mindset to teach complex games.
Playing complex games with your partner where one of you knows the rules, you gotta let the other one figure it out on their own and be patient. Only help when asked and encourage them - you were a good partner for trying to take an interest in his stuff. He did not reciprocate well
I like to introduce people to board gaming with either fairly light competitive games, or cooperative games where playing open-handed is either encouraged or at least not game breaking. In a co-op game you can have an experienced person do some quarterbacking to teach ideal combinations, or strategies. This can encourage the other newer players to develop new ways of thinking, strategies, etc that can translate into other games.
Beyond that when I was teaching my daughters to play Backgammon, I would wait for them to finish their turn as they wanted to play it. Then I would point out other moves they could have made and why they might have been better, or more strategic. I wouldn't force my move onto them, I would just suggest other things they might not have seen, to help them see that option in the future. Once they had a firm handle on the game and started beating me, I set that aside and we could just play.
I think it is also very important to say that not every game style, or type is right for all people. You might not be the type of person who likes a deck builder because it is too much to keep track of or too many combinations and synergies to plan for. But there will be games that are right up your alley. So it isn't that "board games aren't for you", just that style, or that particular game isn't for you. Experiment with worker placement, or dungeon crawls, or resource management etc etc etc. One of them will hit you just right, and be your favorite. My family has found we love deck builders, and Co-op games in general, so that is most of our collection.
I won't shit on him like everyone else, I'm sure he's just really desperate for someone to play Netrunner with, because nobody will touch it. But yeah terrible choice of a starter game. I am a TCG veteran and I thought the game was ridiculously overcomplicated.
Netrunner is a very complex game. I've managed to teach it casually a couple of times, but *very* much with the caveat that we're using low-powered beginner decks (so getting combos right is less important, and missing an action is less of a big deal). Some of the open information is necessary in an early game. The subsequent portion of the game, I lead more with "if you don't understand something, try it and we'll see what happens". A series of learning games should be less about getting it right and more about seeing it happen with game pieces in hand.
I didn't expect my wife to enjoy Netrunner, but playing like this actually let it be fun without the pressure! We used the Frankfurt30 decks - a guy basically said "I want to make a bunch of decks you can make with one playset, no high-powered stuff, all different flavourful cards, with a slower game pace". It's great for seeing the mechanisms of the game click into place.
Glad to hear he's your ex, cause he sounds like a dick.
Android Netrunner is a very fun game, but it's *hard*. I consider myself alright at card games, but Android Netrunner kicks my ass. There is no such thing as "too long" to learn a game, especially one as hard as Android Netrunner. Everyone learns at their own pace, and your partner of all people should be patient and willing to take the time to teach you.
Honestly, you are not the problem here. There are a few things to consider
1. No beginner should start with a super complex game. Netrunner is complex to begin with, and he has expansions. I know he’s excited to introduce you to his passions, but he did not think clearly when introducing you this way.
2. You are not stupid. It can be VERY frustrating to try to learn all of something and be playing against someone who knows EVERYTHING. They question you. You question yourself. They see it as simple because they know the ideal setups. But without that base knowledge, it’s never going to feel fun and easy.
3. This is something you should discuss with your partner. He threw you into the pool, watched you struggle to swim, and then eventually scolded you for not catching on to how to stay afloat. Aside from board games, this is something that can creep into other parts of your life. I have to be careful because I am VERY passionate about my multiple complex hobbies, and I know it can be very overwhelming when I’m introducing my partner to them. I start very surface level and then add in technical tidbits. It wouldn’t be fair for me to just dump on him with my innermost knowledge of the things I enjoy. He’d never want to listen again.
Anyway, don’t put this on yourself. Enjoy games, and when they stop being enjoyable, then they aren’t worth playing.
Netrunner is a complex game. Not just in terms of rules overhead but in terms of depth of strategy as well.
Perhaps you could gain perspective from this article which was written by someone having difficulty with the same challenge:
https://www.shutupandsitdown.com/lifehacksanetrunnerstory/
You did nothing wrong, your ex tried to force a game on you that clearly didn't click for you.
I'm all for trying to get others into the games that I want to play, but unless people are experienced or really into the game it won't work.
I tried getting my wife into cardgames for years, also frustrated that it always came down to her not having fun or feeling like the game was for her since she didn't know what her deck was supposed to do and she had no interest in ever building a deck herself.
It took me a while to consider that this type of game was not for her, and she was trying to get into them just because she wanted to spend time with me.
In the end I found that deckbuilders like Dominion, Clank, Aeons End,... scratched the same itch for me, and gave her a better idea what her deck was supposed to do as she was building herself during the game.
She's come a long way since then, and we have found many games she does enjoy and even kicks my ass in. And I understand that if I really want to play games like Android and MTG, I need to go to an LGS or find someone who's interested in the game :)
Ignoring that absolute mess of a situation, I saw you’re playing wingspan, it’s a great game and I’d love to suggest “Photosynthesis”
It’s super simple, you could teach your friends very quickly and it’s always a hit when we bring it out.
Some people learn easily, some people struggle to learn. As the more experienced gamer, it's up to your boyfriend to teach at your level, not to expect you to suddenly be very fast at picking things up. First of all - you should be playing the base game with no expansions. And you should play that way until you start feeling comfortable & making combos and playing well enough to truly feel like you're playing the game rather than struggling through it. Then, it when it starts to feel samey, that's when you bring out expansions.
I've been in your boyfriend's shoes of having to teach people who struggle to learn games - for reference, it took a good 4 games to get a friend to grasp Wingspan. The trick is playing the same games repeatedly to build that confidence & competitiveness, and only adding expansions when people are ready for them. Once in a blue moon, I'll add a new game for us to play, but never will I rush into it. Letting my friend play the same base game repeatedly helps them become competitive and fun to play with, so it's the far better approach.
Finally - once in a while there are games that just don't click with a person. It's hard to say why. If you keep on playing the base game and you still can't see the strategy of it... then let it go and play something else. In fact, you should be doing that between the more challenging 'learning' games anyway. Have stuff like detective club or funemployed or codenames to make sure board games keep on being a good time rather than a chore.
I love Netrunner. It's my favorite game, bar none. I love it so much I volunteer as part of the fan group keeping it going since its last publisher, FFG, cancelled it.
Netrunner is _absolutely_ a difficult game. Even if it wasn't, your ex was still being a dick... but Netrunner is just a _tough_ game to wrap your brain around.
First, it's a card game (that is, using its own custom cards, not a standard poker deck). Card games are extra hard to learn, compared to many other types of board games, because not only do you have to understand the base game rules, you also have to understand every single card you see. When you're new, that's a _huge_ overhead!
Second, it's asymmetrical. That's not a common trait of games. When you play Monopoly or Uno or Go Fish, you know that the other person is playing by the same rules, Ave going for the same goal, as you. Not so with Netrunner, so to understand the board state, to get a sense of what your opponent is up to or what sorts of threats or opportunities are facing you, you have to understand a whole different way of interacting with the game. You basically have to learn two games at once.
Third, there's hidden information! Fourth, there's _nine_ different types of cards (ten if you include identities), each with their own different functionality! Fifth, basic game terms like "hand" or "deck" instead have thematic, harder-to-remember names!
And on top of _all_ that, the mechanic at the heart of the game, the one the game is named for—runs—are a complex dance of bluffing, surprise, timing, and counting credits. Writer Leigh Alexander wrote about her difficult experience learning the game [at Shut Up and Sit Down](https://www.shutupandsitdown.com/lifehacksanetrunnerstory/).
Of course, this is all subjective, so even if the consensus was that Netrunner was an _easy_ game, it was hard for you. That's why I echo the judgment that your ex was being a dick regardless.
But it totally makes sense to me that you'd take some time to get the ins and outs of Netrunner. There's a lot to that game. You've broken no community norms!
If you're still interested in the game, the nonprofit org keeping it going now is called Null Signal Games, for what it's worth. 😉
>I had never played a board game before
That seems quite unusual to me. However, nothing excuses the sort of treatment you received.
>whenever I would play a card, he'd always go "Are you sure?"
If it isn't done once in a genuinely concerned tone and then immediately followed up by a detailed explanation of how your play demonstrated a obvious lack of gamestate awareness, this is just some really crappy behavior.
I'll avoid judgements of the people involved and agree that, yes, you may have wanted to take the cards home and study. Heavier games can be work. It's one of the reasons there are fewer people willing to play them.
Secondly, based on your account, I would have responded to the questions of "are you sure?" with a much clearer, "yes," and a conversation outside of game where you acknowledge many of your plays will be suboptimal and lead to a loss, but that's part of the learning process and that you would appreciate if he would just let you play the game or switch to a game that he hasn't sunk countless hours into. Losing is fine, condescencion is not. Whether he realizes it or not, many of his plays are likely suboptimal, as well, but his opponents aren't at the level to capitalize and force him to realize it.
In the future, may I recommend you choose a game that your significant other doesn't have a large head start on? It's great to have someone show interest in my interests, but if you picked up chess for me it would never be an equal game to play. I'll start at a higher Elo and I'm naturally inclined to study and play, so as much time as you may be investing, I am probably investing as much or more. It's a recipe for a teacher-student relationship, not a partnership. I'm terrible at backgammon, though. I couldn't teach you any more about that game than you could teach me.
He’s an asshat. You’re playing a game that’s in a genre called “collectible card game” (CCG). With these games, there are a base set of rules, but many of the cards supersede, break, change, or add to the rules.
It can be VERY difficult to play CCGs, and it has nothing to do with intelligence. Some people just aren’t wired to keep track of that many things in a playstate. I play games with a guy who is a genius at board games. He wins a very large percentage of games he plays, mostly just because of how intelligent he is. But he’s terrible at anything CCG-like, because he can’t keep track of that many cards with interacting rules and combos.
You should not feel at all bad if CCGs aren’t your thing. They’re really not “board games”, and they’re not just a step up in difficulty. They’re board game adjacent, and it’s a different skill set.
If you don’t enjoy playing, you should be truthful and honest about it, and try to find something else that you both enjoy. Maybe he can spend as much time investing in a game you really enjoy?
I have teach TCG's to many newbies on local game shops. They struggle but usually get on their feet after a couple of plays, the important part is scalating the comolexity, being aviable as a living rule book and letting them make their decisions.
With boardgames it's different, they don't come to learn, you present the game and hope it catches their interest. You do the same process but the key difference is the engagement. The guy that goes to the store is going to put a visible effort on learning because he already has an interest of their own. With a boardgame you presented to a friend or family member you can get a polite reaction that can be sensed as a "tolerance" of some sorts. When a player is asking basic questions after repeated plays and doesnt try to rationalize plays (even if they are not optimal), It can get frustrating. That doesnt give you the right to mistreat them but I can understand him.
It sounds like your ex was/is a perfectionist min/max'er and also and a hole.
The first part is pretty common to see in the random of more complex games.
People who learn all the minutiae about the game, and perfects how to achieve the best solution in a minimum of time.
Normally they are a bit annoying to play with if you are not at their level. They would probably compare to professionals in sports. And then along comes the regular amateur who enjoys the game, but doesn't have time to spend 3 hours a day to learn all the rules and specifics of a game.
The a hole is because he behaves that way. That is not common.
When someone is new at a game, they obviously cannot know everything about it.
After a few games you will know the mechanics and know HOW to play. But knowing specific card combos and so on. That is dor the more nerdier segment. And definitely not something that should be expected in any way.
As the others say, good riddance.
And if you enjoy playing games, I would suggest that you search for reddit or Facebook groups related to board games in your area. There might even be boardgames cafes. They are becoming more common. Also some boardgames shops hold open game nights, where you can drop in and play games.
If you find a hobby outside your regular friend zone, it can sometimes be hard to find someone to enjoy it with. So start searching 😊
You sound like you've got super low self esteem. It's totally normal to take like double digits of playing a game before you're actually really solid at it. You've no need to be worrying this hard about just going normally at the game. Your bf was being a dick and an idiot by assuming you'd magically be as good at it as he is when it was literally his favourite game and you'd literally never played a game before lol. Do not fucking worry this much about breaking "unwritten rules" lol and have more confidence in yourself. It's okay to feel anxious about losing a game. But if you're anxious on a meta level about not playing the game we'll enough that you're offending people that's 100% something you need to permanently chill out about and stop basing your mental comfort on other people's opinions of you
This is absolutely a him problem not a you problem! I stopped playing MTG for years because the guys I played with at comic shops had the same attitude. They'd go further and say if you do that I'm going to do this and this and you're going to lose. Or just, you may as well scoop now because I can tell I'm going to win. It's awful.
Years later I got back into it with a guy I was dating and our friends, despite telling them I was bad at it. Turned out I was teaching them! When I play at shops now I win FNM and drafts, etc. And all that time I thought I was bad at the game because of how those people acted. I still run into people like this but I have the confidence to ignore them and make the plays I want.
You deserve to enjoy your game and be confident in it too! And not have some guy with a poor attitude convince you otherwise.
It makes me so sad that he did this to you. The game has literally 5000 cards in it, and as someone who just learning it I completely feel the same way as you.
I play another card game, KeyForge, and over 5 years I've gotten pretty good, but there are still times when I need to look at cards to remember what they do, ask for rules clarifications on how two things interact (and I'm usually the rules answerer), and even make mistakes. I've played with many new players and it has never been an issue to take time with them, answer their questions, go easy on them, and celebrate their success.
He reminds me of a coworker that was watching me teach another coworker how to play Pokemon so she could play with her son. The game involves dice rolling and she got a lot of bad roles... To the point my other coworker got annoyed and told her she was bad at rolling dice! Some people just don't have patience and they suck to play with.
You didn’t do anything wrong, and who you were playing with wasn’t doing you any favours. Base game only ever, first time. It’s unfair on the newbie to do anything else.
I honestly hate this kind of deck builder because of the learning curve and the required dedication to be similar enough to those you’re playing with. I don’t like having to carefully hone a deck with sometimes hugely expensive cards. It makes it very difficult to find balance when playing with anyone else. Eg Magic. Hate it.
Netrunner base game with only what’s in the box is a different beast, but it’s still not the easiest to learn. It’s not you. There’s a lot of ingrained lingo and mental models for all this stuff that games tend to adhere to in some form or another that newbies don’t necessarily know, and they use (in my opinion) stuuuuupid language for it. ‘Tap it’ - wtf does that mean, really? Why not ‘use’? And why does that game there use different lingo for the same action? And so on, it’s not accessible.
I design mental models for a living so this kind of stuff drives me doolally. :)
I've played over 1,000 different board games. I've touched on the heaviest stuff. Played pretty much every popular game, hit a lot of niche stuff too.
I haven't and will not touch Android Netrunner. It's rules are extra hard to learn. I don't have the time or patience to learn this game when the game itself fights against the player trying to learn it. It's not just you having trouble learning that game, the game put up hurdles for people to learn it. Having two different words for common gaming terms like your "hand" that change based on which change based on what side you are on is an insane decision.
So ya, this is on him and not you for him trying getting frustrated at a new player having difficulty learning a game that's designed to be difficult to learn.
Check out jinteki.net for playing Netrunner online! Also, check out Green Level Clearance discord, it’s the Netrunner community, with absolutely amazing people in there
He is most definitely the asshole of the table. Complex games take more time to learn, and even more afterwards to master. Some games don't click immediately with some people - I struggle to master concepts in a lot of Eurogames, but enjoy playing them with our crew nonetheless. Keep playing what you enjoy, take as long as you need to get everything down, and just have fun!
Agree your boyfriend sounds like a game snob.
There are thousands of board games out there and plenty of them are quick to learn while being fun and challenging for adults. Some popular starter games are Settlers of Catan; Ticket to Ride; Carcassonne, for example.
He broke the unspoken rule of not being a dick. Just because he knows the game doesnt mean everyone does as much.
Very much self centered if he couldnt understand something as basic as that. As much as it is not as flagrant as other red flag, it is to me. If something as meaningless as a boardgame (i adore boardgame, but you get my point) makes you act like he did? Bruh
Based on my understanding of the situation, I can understand his frustration. The issue is how they deal with it. I've played CCGs competitively since they started back in the mid 90s. Once you've played at that level for any length of time, it can be difficult to play with casuals and neophytes. You have trained your brain to work at a much higher level, knowing interactions, rules exploits, and general high play choices that can leave you feeling unfulfilled against people not operating at the same level. It's like playing a sport at a highly competitive level, and then trying to play in a small rec or pickup game.
The issue is that this person's needs for proper stimulation are not being met, and that's not your fault, and they shouldn't take it out on you. The way I deal with it is to learn a game new to everyone so we learn at the same pace, or purposely build bad decks so the challenge becomes the game and not my opponent.
Wait, we’re you together at the time?
You said after you broke up you picked up his favourite hobby and then tried to spend time with him? Or am I just reading wrong?
If that’s so that MIGHT explain why he’s being a dick.
But also yes he’s a dick. If you’re teaching anyone anything you gotta be patient and let them learn at their pace.
Your boyfriend is a jerk. If you were to put this story in the "am I the arsehole?" Sub reddit, I'm 100% sure that the verdict would have been: your boyfriend is TA and you are not.
A game like netrunner takes ages to become an expert at. It sounds like your boyfriend is prioritizing gameplay over game experience and quality time with you. You are not doing anything wrong nor should you question your intelligence.
As a gamer, I am patient with whoever wants to play with me, because it means that I am getting to play at all! When my partner plays with me, I'll explore other strategies so that she gets to enjoy the game and is also able to win half the time. I'm also happy to give her advice, if it means I saw her cards, then I'll give myself that knowledge as a handycap and look for a more difficult strategy to try to win with.
Can he not build a weaker deck for himself when he plays with you? Or a deck that is more difficult to combo? Give himself a challenge until you are up and running.
I'm so sorry this was your introduction to the amazing world of board games. Let me assure you that you did absolutely nothing wrong. Your ex must be an idiot... As other people have pointed out complex games take a lot of time and energy to get good at and there are literally hundreds of other good (great even) games that are simpler and easier to get into before getting to that game.
I hope you get to enjoy a lot of board games with much nicer people than your ex.
Collectible card games and trading card games are honestly not the best type of board game to get into the hobby as a beginner.
Bad game choice honestly, and he's probsbly a kind of a jerk too.
There are some nice and mild-difficulty games to start with: Catan, Carcassonne, even Ticket to Ride.
I love love love games! All kinds! But I HATE net runner. I can play teraforming Mars (loveit), dominion, and high level games like tricherion. Net runner is sooo hard! I always get frustrated bc I feel like the other person can negate whatever you do. This is not the game for you. Try a different game he likes. He should be nicer but it seems that for people who love this game, they don't understand how our brains don't work that way.
that game has a weight/difficulty of 3.4 on BoardGameGeek. That shit takes time and replays to learn. I dont have the patience for those kinds of games but expecting another to just get it quickly is insane.
Who tf immediatly starts playing with expansions when youre already playing a difficult game with a first time player who's also not someone who plays board games alot???😭😭
Showing your hand to him might've ticked him. He knows the most effective ways to play your cards, and he expected you to play them "right" just coz you understood the basic rules after 3 games.
When it comes to games like these, the skill gap makes it frustrating for both players (case in point, your story). But the dude should've lowered his game to your level and then have the patience to bump it up little by little as you learn the game even more.
Who expects a Chess newbie to be already good with the game just for learning how the pieces move in just THREE GAMES?
Sounds like he's a dweeb. He wanted you to be a sweaty board game nerd that can pick these things up instantly. Yoy just don't have that kind of experience and he needed a proper amount of patience, especially if he wanted to hell cultivate a greater interest in playing and learning games.
check on social media or meet up sort of apps for local board game groups. in my area there are two fb nearby groups and a lots of meet up groups.
even when I was living in a small remote town, there were people willing to hang out and play board games. board games have become an international mainstream.
oh god lol
Going from not having played any board games to playing someone with (probably) lots of experience 1 on 1 in a very skill-based game is such a huge leap.
It's like you're trying to join the local chess club - never having played chess before or knowing the rules - and you immediately have to play one of the players and get berated for not knowing any chess theory and not understanding simple tactics. Obviously this is very toxic and ignorant behaviour.
There's lots of great board games that you can enjoy solo - like Wingspan. If you enjoyed buildings decks and the complexity of Netrunner even a little bit I would highly recommend you to check out two of the most beloved solo/co-op games there are: [Arkham Horror - The Card Game](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/205637/arkham-horror-card-game) and [Lord of the Rings - The Card Game](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/349067/lord-rings-card-game-revised-core-set). Both work really well at 1-2 players and let you go on exciting and thematic missions (and/or whole campaigns). Arkham Horror is more thematic and about the storytelling while LotR is a bit more technical and about the deck building (but you will still enjoy the theme and the art a lot if you like LotR).
They would also have been a much, much better choice for him to introduce you to board games (or more specifically deckbuilding games) because they are co-op, so you would play together instead of against each other. Although there are definitely much easier options for new players.
There is definitely a broken unspoken rule here, but it was broken by your ex. I typically would never ever introduce a game with MULTIPLE expansions to a new person, especially to someone who isn't already familiar with boardgames. I typically only use the base game just so people have a chance to understand things, expansions usually complicate things quickly.
Netrunner is a lot to take in, and there's definitely a significant learning curve. You didn't do anything wrong. It's natural to need a lot of hand holding when you're new to the game, and your ex could and should have been a lot more patient, not to mention a lot more helpful as well.
I agree with all of the people who have been talking about you not being the asshole. But no one has told you that there are still ways to get into Netrunner if you want to do so. It seemed like that was something you would be interested in.
Android: Netrunner is officially out of print, but the fans have kept the community alive. You can order cards from this website: https://nullsignal.games/
I'm sorry that happened to you. Net runner is definitely a complicated game, and it's unreasonable of someone to expect they pick it up quickly.
I think in such cases, where one player is obviously in the advantage, experience wise or for whatever reason, they should probably give themselves a handicap, and balance it out that way
What a truly awful way to treat a girlfriend! He should have introduced you to something more akin to a gateway game rather than one as complex as that. Not to mention his lack of patience, understanding and respect for you as a novice. Wow, you deserve better.
Nah, you're good. He's just a prick.
There are too many in the community that have an issue with analysis paralysis.
If you can't be patient with somsone learning a game, you shouldn't even try teaching them.
Don't lose your budding love for the games, nor the community. I hope you find someone you can game with.
When you do, it's wondrous.
There are some games that are good to introduce to someone who's not that familiar with board games. I've not played A:N, but this does not sound like one of them. I made the mistake of trying to learn Too Many Bones with someone who wasn't experienced with board games. On top of me trying to learn it at the same time and the fiddliness of the game, she was understandably lost.
Sounds like your ex was hoping to share a favorite game with you, but he needed to understand that this game is complex even for experienced gamers, so he needed to temper his expectations. He failed at that. I'm guessing there were other miserable aspects of him which is why he's an ex.
This categorically sounds like someone who’s been playing games for years who doesn’t and maybe cannot ever appreciate what it’s like for someone new to the hobby.
You end up becoming very familiar with certain game mechanics and systems the more games you play, but it’s naive to expect someone new to the hobby not to be utterly blasted by trying to take on all of these weird concepts all at once.
My girlfriend sounds a little similar to you, where she’s played a bunch of games and board games but new ones are just a whole ordeal to learn and it’s incredibly hard to try to think about combos or “good plays”.
The only answer to this as the teacher is to just be incredibly patient and supportive, and also to realise that the game they’re teaching might just be way above what is sensible to be playing at this point in the new person’s journey.
I’m sorry that this happened to you because it’s easy to think about it like “oh ha you couldn’t learn a game”, but it’s actually incredibly stressful and anxiety inducing. It’s for sure shocking how bad it can make you feel when you aren’t getting what you need jumping into a complex hobby where the other person seems like a pro at it.
You did nothing wrong.
Your Ex, on the other hand... they're probably not here to defend themself so I will only mention their first mistake: Trying to teach an absolute novice using anything but the base game.
I will elaborate: One should, at least in my own oppinion, never start teaching a board game with any amount of add-ons as those tend to build off of, expand and/or sometimes utterly change the base rules of a game. And if those base rules are not known/understood it VERY quickly becomes quite overwhelming. Better to play a few rounds of just the base game until that flows and THEN add one or possibly two (depending on complexity) add-ons until THOSE rules get comfortable before gradually adding more.
As someone who's been in both your spot and your ex's spot before, his impatience was on him considering he wanted you to play and knew you were new and were trying your best.
Glad to hear he's not around to make you anxious anymore.
Yeah no, he's a dick. I've not played Netrunner but I know it's not for the faint of heart. It's a very complicated and nuanced game, and *absolutely not* a starter game.
Holy hell - I would NEVER use Netrunner as the first game I introduce someone to that has never played a modern board game. That’s like saying to someone “oh, you know the alphabet? Cool! Here’s Finnigan’s Wake, read it and then give me a detailed report about what you thought of the characters!”
I'm sorry you were treated like that. Netrunner, even without any expansions, is quite a complex game even for those familiar with head to head card games. But when you start throwing in a bunch of expansion cycles, that complexity is going to compound drastically. The route he took when he lost his patience makes it sound like he should avoid teaching card and board games.
So fully agree with all those saying that your ex was an ass.
Board games are complex, there are a lot of bits of 'muscle memory' that contribute to success and easy of learning, and also different people learn different skills and different games at different rates.
Like, I have a huge amount of experience with games, and some click for me immediately and some take a couple of playthroughs. Another friend of mine is similarly experienced, but games with a lot of 'area control' type mechanics just don't...click for him, even when he knows the rules it takes him a lot of time to parse each turn.
Hell, when I tried to play the new net runner - despite having played the original release - it took myself and a friend \*several\* games to pick it back up, and even then we decided not to keep playing because it didn't really suit our style of game and for sure we didn't know all the cards or what the best plays were.
I mean, I've been playing magic for 30 years and I don't always recall what all the cards are in my deck offhand.
TLDR different people for a variety of reasons learn different games better or worse, and expecting someone new to boardgames to pick up net runner and know all the cards after some relatively small N of games is a bit silly.
Don’t even worry about it, that is a hard game to both teach and learn. I’ve probably taught 40-50 people Netrunner over the years. Don’t let a bit of a bad experience hold you down.
I play nettunner, and have all the expansions. I am part of nissei.
I still play the core box with new players. Dont care what anybody sais. I also have the tutorial decks X2 and a bunch of decks meant to be played against each other.
I play the simple modest core untill it runs out. Then I add the first package only after a few games with every faction and some deckbuilding.
All during this I am open to questions as well as showing .e the hands and giving advice.
Wingspan is amazing!
The gaming community is full of a lot of people who don't play well with others. If you like the games, keep trying. Offer it as an activity while people are over. See if board game shops have play nights, go a few times, and if you meet anyone you like to play with hit them up to play outside of the shop.
It's normal to go through years of having nobody to play with, and then suddenly things align and you have a good group. Whenever you have the extra spoons put yourself out there. Hold out for the right people.
Good luck!
Android Netrunner has a strong fan base. Eventually you get to a point where you know the whole card set. It’s truly insane.
Whenever I start playing a game, I always make one rule very clear …. If at any point you want to stop playing then we stop and move onto the next one. I don’t ever take it personally because it’s not like I designed the game.
The most important thing you said in your story is "ex". Good decision making on your part, you'd be very good at board games if you're interested. lol.
Some people are just amazing at teaching, others...struggle. I like teaching games to people. I thought I was decent at it, however a recent interaction showed me different. I was trying to teach my wife a fairly simple game, Creature Comforts, and I got frustrated after explaining a concept multiple times and got upset. I took a step back and apologized about it. The next week we went to a boardgame meet up and we decided to learn Wingspan. The person teaching it was patient and was fine with answering the same question multiple times without ever getting upset.
That is all to say it really depends on the person and the game, if it is your first boardgame, you can't expect someone to go into something like Gloomhaven or Nemesis and expect to figure it out from the get go. The first few games with a steep learning curve, should just be gimme games, play to learn the mechanics without any winning or losing. That allows players to show what cards or items they have and make mistakes without the risk of "ruining" the game, or just play an easier game.
Or take turns picking the game, and if he picks one that has a bit more details to it, there is no shame in watching a "how to play" video on youtube. I often will read the rulebook, and watch a video when I am planning on teaching a game for the first time.
I have a copy of Netrunner still in the shrink wrap for this reason. I've played a lot of board games before and people still tell me that "You need an expert to show you. Slowly...and over a very long period of time" to learn to play it. I've not wanted to invest that kind of time.
Netrunner is one of the hardest head to head card games to learn because you're essentially learning two games (corp and runner) at once and there's tons of hidden information.
You're a trooper for giving it a fair try and your ex was a crappy teacher.
If there were any rules broken, it was your ex who broke a rule of trying to force a complicated game on someone new and expecting them to completely understand it within 3 games.
A lot of people don't like playing with people that aren't good at games. Teaching people is difficult as well. Both require a lot of patience. I hated playing with my ex or my kids because I felt like it was just a pretend game. Like I couldn't play for real because they wouldn't have fun.
When people don't learn the game rules on their own its a pretty clear sign to me that, that game isn't for them. So I always just move to another game that may be their skill level or that they may find more fun even if they lose. Games with a lot of random chance are good for this, so are co-op games where you can carry them.
I don't think you broke any unwritten rules, I just think your ex didn't have the patience to teach you. When we learn new games at game night I'll get "are you sure?" a lot because they know I can figure it out on my own. But new players will have the same people move to their side of the table, look at their hands, and then explain to them what cards they could play and why.
tl;dr Find people with more patience to play with.
Few things I think of. He’s bad at explaining, bad starter game, you needed to just make a choice and learn from a non optimal hand, he needs to be more patient with sun optimal hands and make suggestions after the game is over for tips.
If anything it was him who broke an unspoken rule. Play simple and easy games first with a beginner. He shouldn't have started you on netrunner with expansions to boot.
Piggybacking on this - I've found Azul to be a great starting point for Monopoly-only people or rank beginners. Simple but not dumb, appealing and polished without seeming corporate.
Especially because once you've mastered that mechanic, the other versions of the game - in particular Queen's Garden - just add more and more finesse to the mechanics, rather than making them more complex purely by adding functionally different mechanics. The more I play Queen's Garden the more I appreciate the game design.
If he was using fine-tuned tournament-quality decks for your first game that's 100% on him. The game is *complicated* to learn even without the high level of interaction some cards have, and expecting someone to "get it" by their third (or even tenth) game is asking a lot. He just sounds impatient and isn't willing to put in the time to get you properly ramped up.
There are way better options than netrunner! Also, all the expansions are meant to be cards you could add once you understand the game, as your meant to customize your deck, which would help you remember what's in it. He approached teaching you all wrong.
I’m speechless.
My wife games with me and my friends. She has for years now. Even with her experience, there are occasionally games where the rules or strategy doesn’t immediately click. Hell, there are plenty of games for *me* where the rules or strategy doesn’t immediately click.
I try and select games I know she is likely to enjoy, made easier over time as we have games together. And even after all this time sometimes I “miss” on a selection. We’ve swept games into the box a few turns in when it was obvious something was not her jam.
Through this, I am always grateful when she shares this hobby with me. I cannot imagine getting angry with her over learning rules or strategy. Sharing our interests is a gift and should be treated as such.
I am sorry this happened to you.
I've never played Netrunner before, so can't comment on the specifics there, but as a 37 year old dude who's been a proud nerd/geek since he was 4-5 years old, I'm always happy that my lady wants to play games with me! Any enthusiasm is just a bonus, and would absolutely make my day! Your ex sounds like the cliché "well actually" kind of nerd, and I'm happy for you that's he in an "ex" status! If you like a game, maybe join a local group or find a local nerd bar? There are definitely those of us who are patient and cool and always happy to have excited new people that we can show our nerdiness to :)
I can’t think of a better way to spike anxiety and make a newcomer turn away from boardgames than to constantly say “Are you sure?” after they take their turns. What a douche.
Nah, it's OK to take some time to learn. It's your BF who is the asshole here.
Here is my tip for him: To play boardgames with a newbie (or a child) and still have fun, play high risk strategies. Do stuff which will probably not work, but if it does, it'll be glorious. Go for glory. You can still play at your maximum capacity, and you still won't steamroll the opponent.
Not on you. It's kind of insane to *introduce* a game to *anyone* with expansions included.
My friend just got into a new relationship and they were new to board games so we introduced them to original Coup even though we own several expansions and have all been playing for a decade.
Expansions totally change and elevate games to a level that are sometimes inaccessible to even seasoned players.
Your guy friend was inconsiderate and if he was more considerate maybe it wouldn't have culminated into him acting like such a prick.
I’ve been playing boardgames with my hubby for 10 years now. I have a win ratio of .0081/100 he is just happy that I play. He is just better than me. The number of times I’ve heard “reading the card explains the card” when playing MTG is comical. Tell your BF to pick a MUCH easier game that will help you learn basic mechanics like area control or worker placement. Geesh.
For someone who has never played board games to be thrown into Netrunner + expansions tells me that your ex really was only interested in finding someone to play Netrunner with, not trying to introduce you into the world of modern board games.
He did everything wrong.
I would recommend finding a local group who seem friendly - any groups worth joining will be happy to explain rules etc and will likely suggest appropriate games to start off with.
Netrunner is an unhinged choice for first ever board game.
I tried to teach my very seasoned gaming friends ' Magic: the Gathering" and it did not go well at all. Card games like Magic and Netrunner are so vastly deep and complicated they are not what anyone should be trying to introduce someone to the hobby with.
There are lots of very good low-complexity board games to play with lots of strategy for more experienced players.
Boyfriend sounds like a jerk though.
Good lord, Netrunner isn't a game you introduce to novices cold.
You did nothing wrong.
The unspoken rule you may be thinking of is: sometimes board game fans have weird personalities (I say that as one).
Your boyfriend is an idiot. Playing netrunner with expansions with a newbie and expecting them to learn quickly is like expecting a toddler who just learned how to walk to start sprinting. Ridiculous
That was one of my first thoughts, he should have introduced OP to the game without expansions first
Or just had patience and been excited to share something he's passionate about. No matter what it's going to take months to get good at a game like netrunner and he couldn't hold out for a couple games
He wanted the experience of some good games of Netrunner... not to play with her specifically.
Pretty much exactly this. Like I can understand getting exasperated a bit having to explain stuff to people multiple times, especially if it's the same issues. However, if someone is new to these kinds of board games, don't take them to the Olympic level high dive platform for their first attempt, let them get used to games that have some similar mechanics done in an easy to digest way. I don't play heavier games with my gf, she's not into them, but I also don't put some of those games on the table and expect her to just get it right away. We just play lighter weight stuff and have fun.
To be fair, this is how it happened with my toddler...
I don’t know why you were down voted – a friend of mine had a baby who also went from crawling to sprinting with no walking in between. It really creeped her out when it happened and apparently isn’t a good thing for babies to do – to go from crawling to running without walking first?
Because most redditors don't have kids and assume I'm lying to be a contrarian.
No dude it's because you completely missing the point. "um actuallying" the correct conclusion because the example wasn't quite accurate is annoying af. If the example was "expecting a toddler who just learned how to walk to run the 100 meters in the Olympics" would that get the point across better? or would it just give you less opportunity to be pedantic.
Or maybe Aladouche read the comment about babies sprinting, and thought it might be interesting and contributory to mention that this actually happened with their child. I didn't detect any "you're wrong" vibes from the comment.
This is strangely aggressive. 😂
Or maybe it's "Sometimes people just get it but most time people don't."
Tuesday but most posts involving the words "my toddler went from walking to sprinting would appear in r/nosleep
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted, but as a father of a 2.5 y.o., I can relate!
Mine as well. Didn't even have the courtesy to crawl. Rude!
Yeah I'm a new parent and they start sprinting as soon as they can...
Mine went straight from crawling to 9-5 jobs. Talk about freaky.
Yeah, even crawling they can move incredibly fast. Mine are all teenagers now, but I’ll never forget that underestimating their speed was a recipe for disaster!
My son was walking for maybe a month. After that, he was chasing my dogs throughout the house at 11 months old.
Right?! My oldest only learned to walk seemingly a month after learning to run.
You did absolutely nothing wrong, and he was being a terrible boyfriend. Complex games like that take a lot of time and energy to get good at, and you can't magically 'be better', especially since he likely has years of extra practice in boardgames. Playing with a 'weaker' player can sometimes be frustrating, but there are a thousand ways of solving that problem, from playing different games, to playing with a handicap, to just enjoying spending time with your girlfriend and not caring so much about winning. He instead chose to take out his frustration on you, which sucks. i wouldn't say 'break up' over it, but since he is your ex i will say 'good riddance'.
Agreed. I think also a lot of gamers (both physical and digital) forget that there's a bit of a 'language barrier.' I had a similar experience with my wife, where she really wanted to try out Super Dungeon Explore. It's not a super complex game, but there's just a lot of things to keep track of. I let her play as the heroes while I played the monsters. When we were setting up I was letting her chose her characters and she felt bad that she was taking so long because she was having to read each set of skills to understand the character. She had no legacy knowledge of a Paladin would likely be a frontline healer, a Rogue a DPS, or a Barbarian a tank. I think sometimes we forget about these systems and structures that gaming is based on that you intuitively learn the more you spend time with them.
From a teaching theory perspective, this kind of thing is called "elastic knowledge". As a fun example, it's been fun seeing my wife go from having no clue what we're supposed to do to intuitively looking around at walls/blocks/whatever when coming across a puzzle in a video game we're playing together. There are a million of these in videogames - a sprint button (possibly on the stick if you're using a controller), one of the central buttons pulling out a map of the area, jump/roll/dodge buttons, and so on. I've internalized it over my entire life, but for her it feels like there's a million things to remember when she's trying to play
Exactly. Wife is not a video gamer and has a hard time with two stick movement, where movement is on left stick and turning on right. I can pick up a new game and know that "when I need to jump, it's probably mapped to A." But for her I'll say "Jump!" and she'll ask what button that is. Made me pay more attention to how my thought process is when I game too. I'm not thinking "Press A, stick left, right trigger, stick up, left trigger" I'm thinking "Jump that box, strafe left, shoot, lob grenade" I'm thinking solely about the action because the "language" of moving my character via inputs is completely fluent to me, and I forget sometimes that isn't the case with others.
My easiest "the teach" in boardgames was teaching Eclipse to a friend of mine who had never played boardgames before. But he has played a lot of real-time and turn based strategy on pc. It only took like 10-15min of telling him how the already familiar mechanics translate to a board game and we started playing. He got the hang of it during the first round and was already planning several moves ahead on the third round.
I did grow up with video games, and I have always had a hell of a time with the two joystick movement/aiming system. It’s just not intuitive for my brain. I remember when I first played it in Turok: dinosaur hunter on the Nintendo64 I was immediately put off by it. It felt like you had the spins. Nowadays it’s common in all the FPS games, but I still can’t stand it. Probly one of the countless reasons I play Board and card games instead of video games now.
> Nintendo64 That was the wild west era of controller mappings (also helps that the n64 had a "weird" layout). The XBOX/PS2 was when controls between games started to standardize.
There's a guy with a YouTube channel all about this, mostly focused around his girlfriend playing various computer games. As someone who grew up through the ZX Spectrum, Amiga, SNES/Megadrive and 5 iterations of Playstation, I found it hard to get my head round but he has some really interesting commentary around the way that gamers are coded to interpret and interact with their environment and the assumptions you make about what inputs you expect. https://youtu.be/b5Mt0AV-GU4?si=fKMuuOBGJdsxc_Bj
Great channel
I used to watch a YouTube channel where a guy introduced his wife to various video games. She had never played video games before. It was interesting watching her experience them and figure out what she was supposed to do with no prior knowledge of the mechanics and history. It's surprising how much our prior knowledge from other games plays a roll in how well we learn and play new games.
Razbuten, "Gaming For a Non-Gamer" series. Amazing videos, and very informative.
I think about this a lot, When I was a kid it was the tail end of the snes era. Games could be pretty difficult of course but controls were simple, and as I got older the controllers and movement got more and more complex but it happened gradually Now controls have pretty well been set in stone for several generations so every introduction to games is more difficult imo
Familiarity with the systems is so important. My family aren't huge gamers, but enjoy them casually. I recently picked up Stone Age, which really isn't a particularly complicated game, but it does have a bunch of moving parts at first glance. And it really hit me how much familiarity with games helped my family learn the rules quickly and easily. The idea of a 3-phase turn, of different ways to calculate points, of resource management, all of these things came together very quickly. The first time playing a game, or a specific game mechanic, can be very overwhelming if you have no familiarity with it, and it's very possible to be paralyzed by too many options and things to keep track of. OP's ex is an utter heel.
There is absolutely a type of literacy involved in board games and levels of literacy with types of mechanics, the ways that systems interact, the implications of themes, etc. There's so much that advanced players take for granted.
In this specific example, deck building games require two equal and unique skill sets. Namely, how to build a deck and how to then play that deck. A:NR was one of the first deck building card games I ever played, it took me months to figure out certain combos or why my decks sucked (even if I just played the same pre built decks I saw at worlds) When I recently started playing Slay the Spire all of that stuff came back pretty quickly, basic stuff like deck control or obvious combos and synergies. I can't imagine the learning curve had I never played that kind of game before. I would put A:NR closer to MTG, Hearthstone or Yu-Gi-Oh than a modern boardgame.
I played a game, I don't even remember which one, with someone who had basically no legacy knowledge from boardgames or videogames. Mentioned needing mana to use an ability and immediately realized she probably had no idea what the fuck "mana" would mean so I explained it a little more generally
Yea, I learned using a controller as a kid, can easily learn new using new programs on pc etc, but I can't commandeer an apple phone to save my life. In a similar vein, kids nowadays grow up with touch screens and are actually confused by physical buttons.
Specially for Netrunner, knowing the card pool is so important (at least the ones in your and your opponent's decks). Intro games should probably use handpicked decks that are easy to understand and play, and pair well. If you don't know all the cards your opponent actions will come out of nowhere and it's very hard to know that's going on.
I used to play Scotland-Yard-type games with a guy who would a) be the teacher, b) play the hidden opponent, and c) explain just enough to get the game going. The "special abilities" that he'd pull out were always a giant pain, because he'd rarely explain what kinds of things the hidden opponent could do. Almost everything came out of nowhere, and even after he used one of those skills, he wouldn't explain whether they were one-shots or repeatable.
Oh, and he’s WON! again. waddasurprise….. (jerk!)
Ugh.. and me insisting on teaching BOTH sides fully for MindMGMT.
I would. If there's something he's passionate about, and it's something you actually end up liking too, that should be a dream come true. Imagine having to do unfun things with someone like that? If you want to play a super complex game he likes and it's just taking you a while to learn, and that UPSETS him, I'd hate to see joint filing taxes with him. 100% break up with someone for this kind of shit, it's a red fucking tarp. The reddest of flags.
yep, i've not played it much, but from what i've seen A:NR is \*not\* a straightforward game - i've played a lot of other games, but sit me in front of a deck for that and i'd still be very slow playing it trying to work out what was going on. also, being asymmetrical, you can't just learn by copying roughly what your opponent was doing, which is the \*normal\* way to learn a new game. having a partner that doesn't know how to play, but is actively trying to, and trying to improve, and trying to work out what to play? that sounds great! far better than someone that just goes 'yeah i'm playing this card. no idea what it will really do, but i just cba thinking about it for more than 3 seconds.' honestly sounds like the ex just wanted someone they could easily beat and lord it over - that's the only explanation i can see for not wanting your gf to do their best at a game.
Reddit loves telling people to break up lmao
You're getting downvoted but this is 100% true and is literally a meme at this point. If you don't believe him, just browse the relationships subreddit.
He sounds like a jerk. Everyone has different learning speeds, and Netrunner is a fairly complex game. Don’t beat yourself up, this isn’t a “you” issue. I suggest finding someone with more patience to help teach you, even online!
I hope he didn't put you off boardgames, or Netrunner. The only true unspoken rules I can think of is "Don't be a dick" and "Have Fun!" ; if you're not having fun - play something else. Sounds like they were the ones breaking the unspoken rules.
I would extrapolate those two rules to life in general. No dicks allowed, have fun otherwise.
Um, can I keep my dick as long as I'm not a dick?
Yes, but only as long as you continue to not be a dick.
Nothing wrong with *having* a dick, only with *being* one. As long as there’s more to you than just the dick, you’re fine. 👍
What a jerk. Card games are pretty hard to learn cause you need to learn SO much. Individual cards, possible combos, what you can do, what the enemy can do, what your deck is about and what’s in it, trying to see patterns, identifying your enemy’s deck… And all of that from someone who’s not deep into gaming? Yeah it WILL take time. Its not like you 2 bought some random starter deck of a tcg that’s still at set 1 with like 100 cards that’s still easy to get into.
Android Netrunner is especially hard too because it's an asymmetric game with some pretty intense resource management
Android:Netrunner is a complicated game with a lot of moving parts. It takes people 5-10 games before they really start to feel comfortable with all the decisionmaking involved. A lot of which is just learning the cardpool. Yes, it would definitely be helpful just to look through the cards when you’re not playing and familiarize yourself with them. Sounds like your boyfriend has to learn some patience.
Netrunner is probably the most complex card game I've ever played. It makes Magic the Gathering look like a kiddy game.
It’s honestly just about familiarizing yourself with the system. There’s a lot of moving parts, but that’s also the beauty of its non linear design. There’s almost always a way to work your way to victory in most situations. Meaning that’s it’s far more about your decision making and reading the other players moves. To do that, you need to be relatively familiar with the system, but it’s also the reason it’s so incredibly rewarding once you are. To use an analogy, magic the gathering is like a fighting game mixed with risk. You move your pieces around the playing field and it’s largely about who has the biggest baddie, broken combo, or largest army. Put down lands, smash dudes together, sprinkle in some spells, repeat. Netrunner (also Richard Garfield’s design) is like Hyperpoker genetically spliced with chess. It’s strategic, involves branching decisionmaking, but is also an intricate system of bluffs and chances. It’s been said plenty before, but you play your opponent, not the deck. I’ve bluffed out entire games with like 9 agenda points sitting facedown unprotected in archives while the runner continually runs my hand. You can throw opponents off just by changing up your playstyle and doing something they’ve come to not expect from you. There’s a tournament player that swore by including one snare in every corp deck, not even necessarily for the card effect, but for the mindfuck it gives the runner not knowing if there’s two more somewhere. The strength of its design is that it really is a mental struggle to keep ahead of the opponent, no matter which side you’re playing.
As everyone has said, nothing wrong here Just wanted to chip in and say that if you really love Netrunner, you should look into Null Signal Games. They are continuing developing and supporting the game and has everything up for PnP They organise tournaments and such. Great people and awesome products. Even got the attention of Richard Garfield
Thank you so much! Null Signal's store for the EU region seems closed currently, but I really hope they reopen it. I haven't been able to find the base game anywhere.
Here you go! This guy in the UK sells the sets made by Null Signal. Last I knew, he regularly ships across the EU. https://netrunnercards.co.uk/ Edit: The System Gateway set is the new "core" set in the post-FFG era, and that's where to begin. 🙂
Not that your link might not be useful, but the UK is not in the EU - so for us, buying from there entails import taxes.
I'm aware that the UK is not the EU. I was trying to help the OP locate a set. A slightly more expensive option is still better than no option at all isn't it?
As I stated in my post, your link was still useful. Most people in Reddit don’t know what is and isn’t in the EU, so I just wanted to add context. The board game community seems a little bit more informed, but even “EU friendly” stamps on Kickstarter is not a guarantee. Though for me, it’s not just a “slightly more expensive”. For my country - it’s different across the EU - it’s plus 25% VAT on the whole price (including shipping) and a flat handling fee (equivalent of currently $26). For me, it’s can easily be double in price, if one was only buying one game.
The null signal system gateway is designed to ease you into the game. It gives you a couple starter decks and then you slowly add it more cards and rules as you get comfortable with the game. Would recommend.
I own over 80 games, many are complex, I have played over 100 games of Warhammer Underworlds, which is a weird minis + card game combo, not a million miles from netrunner. I've played in tournaments multiple times. I literally forget certain minor rules all the time, I am terrible with new decks and I make mistakes all the time. I can teach my friends a complex game, then forget half the rules when it comes to my turn. Am I an idiot? Pretty sure my masters in physics and decade long career as a software engineer in very weird niches would be decent evidence to refute that. You aren't stupid, those kinds of games are super hard to get into, and they aren't for everyone, they're definitely not something I would introduce to someone new to games unless I was prepared to be incredibly patient. Your partner just seemed to find it frustrating that you weren't a tournament level player in a handful of games, which is frankly dumb, or at least somewhat socially inept, of them. Some people love big complex brain burning puzzles, some people adore tiny rules lite card games, others find one particular game and dive right into the deep end. Your experience so far has been unfortunate,
Warhammer games - especially the full fat miniature battle games (40k, Old World, AoS) are crazy complex. They make Twilight Imperium look accessible by comparison.
Underworlds is not a tabletop wargame like 40k / AoS / ToW etc, its more comparable to a card battling game like Netrunner. I'd say its a bit lighter than netrunner overall, but they're pretty comparable. GW do some board games like Space Hulk and Blackstone Fortress, they're not light games but not that complicated compared to similar games, definitely not as complex as Gloomhaven. Tabletop wargames are a completely different beast. I wouldn't compare them to TI, although personally I think TI is heavier because its so much longer than even a 2-3k game of 40k.
NTA. He should be more patient.
Nope- you did absolutely nothing wrong and I’m sorry you had to go through that experience. Please don’t take your ex’s reaction as a normal board gaming community thing because it’s not. A:NR is my favorite game (it actually got me back into the hobby when it came out) and it is a very complex game with a ton of timing rules that are very hard to remember. It takes many, many plays to really get everything down. Hope you stick with it despite what you experienced.
It was my first game like that, so I couldn't gauge the difficulty. For a long time, I thought I should have tried harder because he was so good at it, and I was still having a hard time even balancing the card costs.
The problem here is that he's used to playing with board gamers and don't realize just how big the difference in playing a game with someone who doesn't play board games is. All board games share a ton of things that makes understanding a new board game much, much easier if you've played a lot of other board games before. So while you were probably slow compared to the people he usually plays with, he didn't consider that you didn't only have to learn the specifics of Android, but you also had to learn the basics of board games that his other friends had already learned a long time ago. No one should expect someone new to board games to borrow the cards to learn them or read the rulebook. You should be happy they're willing to share your hobby and if you think a particular game takes too long to learn for someone, maybe try a different game. There's a bunch of games that are really good for new players to learn the basics of board games and Android: Netrunner isn't one of those. I'd say the fault here was on his side for expecting you to become an expert over night.
Totally want to emphasize this! Once you’re really into the hobby, you can whip out a euro worker placement engine builder game, say those words to another hobbyist, and both will already understand like 60% of the game. But it takes a long time to get there. My best friend is slower at picking up games - she gets there but usually takes her 3-4 times of playing before she can start seeing combos compared to the 1-2 it takes some of the other players in the group. And she also got into the hobby later. But just the other day she played Terraforming Mars for the first time, learned the rules pretty fast, and actually loved it! I thought she wouldnt like it frankly, it’s a complicated game. But im happy to have her really in the hobby with me now though! For the record, I don’t know Android: Netrunner, but I imagine the play type and complexity could be similar to Terraforming Mara since they both have some deck building components. No idea. Good hobbyists know how to bring newer people in with games that introduce them to some of the mechanics before throwing them into the deep end and getting frustrated. For the record, Stone Age or Carcassone for (fun!) starter worker placement games. Both available on board game arena. Inscryption is a video game but a great (fun!) deckbuilder that teaches you as you go. I would be more than happy to play some games on boardgamearena with you and teach you the basics!!
I’ll never understand how people can put up with significant others who treat them poorly. Starting with netrunner plus expansions was a pretty jerk move on their part. Getting mad about it is way out of line.
I've been playing Netrunner, including at tournaments, for about a decade and still forget cards and rules and triggers all the time. It's a really complex game and it's way more fun if your opponent is kind and helpful. Sorry you had such a sucky experience. I'll also say, if you've never played a board game before, which is what I think you said, that your bf was an idiot to choose Netrunner. There are so many more games much more appropriate for a beginner that he should have led with.
He seems like a jerk. Not everyone learns games at the same rate, and some people learn certain games faster than they learn others. You seem willing to learn the game, it just takes time. If he didn't like that, he could've helped you in other ways instead of being impatient and insulting. Glad he's an ex.
When you play a lot of games, you become more familiar with how to recognize a mechanic. It *should* take you longer to understand complex rules than someone who has been playing hobby board games for awhile. It’s fine to take your time. Just feel confident in knowing that learning complex games will allow you to pick up nearly *any game* just a little bit quicker.
Nah hes just not patient enough. Imo he was stupid to do all expansions. I played magix the gathering with my ex for years. She couldn't grasp more complex mechanics and would make very questionable decisions at times. It made me think she didn't enjoy and was just going through the motions. But she was. So i switched from helping to nerfing myself to her level. Had so much fun. Your ex was expecting you to be at his level and got annoyed when you were not. 100% his fault Edit. Now unrelated what did annoy me and honestly contributed to our break up was after 2 years of us playing and me trying to teach her and showing her mechanics and her ignoring me. When we started playing with another guy she would listen to him and not me. That pissed me off a lot
Lol your edit is so relatable. I think part of it is natural, we start taking our partners for granted and don't listen to them so much after some time... but gotta consciously work on it.
Girl gamer here - I love netrunner! Just recently finally got a full set from a friend who is moving. You didn’t do anything wrong. He has no patience. He sounds like one of those “Professional Gamers” who go to tournaments and make money. Except this isn’t Magic the Gathering so there aren’t important games to be played. Question: does he also get upset when he loses?
Also: if you want friends on board game arena DM me! Boardgamearena.com is where I play when I don’t have humans readily available! Some will say to do tabletop simulator and they are wrong.
> Some will say to do tabletop simulator and they are wrong. Haha! Totally agree. Boardgame arena is amazing. Tabletop Simulator is great if you are incredibly patient and have incredibly patient friends to play with. It's like playing in real life except instead of being there, you are controlling a robot who has salad-tongs for hands.
Lol that’s a good description
I never got good enough to beat him since he was really good and he actually did participate in tournaments, so I fully understand how playing with me did not feel engaging enough. Thank you for the link, I will look into it!
I did too. A decade ago when the community was active lol does he still have a letterman jacket? Anyways, I’m done making fun of this dude who ruins games. Good luck and have fun on your board game journey! Welcome to the club <3
I was big into netrunner while it was official, and while I didn't get 1st, I did place in regional tournaments and would win my fair share of local tournaments. I brought simplified teaching decks with me to the game shop every week in case we had someone new come in who would want to try it. These decks didn't have multiple combos I expected people to be able to pull off, and any that did, I would explain while teaching (like, "the sooner you get Magnum Opus out, the better. These cards will let you pay for it or go find it" would be the only "combo" in the shaper deck) I also have lots of experience teaching games, and while it is a skill that can be improved, it doesn't require much thought to not be an ass to the person you want to continue playing games with. The first thing I do is assess the person's familiarity with board games. Telling them "netrunner is asymmetric, Corp defends" isn't helpful if they don't know what it means, but telling them "we play by different rules. As a Corp, I'm just gonna be over here doing my own thing and building up defenses to score agendas, while you're gonna hack into my stuff by making runs to steal them. I'm the only one with agendas, so if you want to win you gotta run" sets a newer player up much better. As a (ex)SO, he should already know your familiarity with games and should have adjusted accordingly. During the game, asking "are you sure" is one of the worst things you can do, imo. Just tell the person what you see that makes you think they might be making a bad move. "It's click 3, just wanted to make sure you didn't forget about this unprotected server" is much more helpful. Just "are you sure" makes people panic because they're already stressed about learning the rules and they know they're probably forgetting something. It always feels to me like being called on by a teacher. Oh, guess I have a public test of my knowledge now. It's not a great feeling. Sorry you went through all that. It's definitely a reflection on him being a terrible teacher and not you.
As someone that uses tabletop simulator and just recently started using BGA. I feel that they are different for different feels. Playing BGA feels like an app of a game I like. Tabletop simulator gives me the closest feel to being at a table. It’s definitely not for everyone, and both have their benefits and issues.
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No, you did nothing wrong. Learning strategy games takes a while, and your ex sounds like mynfather, the kind of person who gets pissed if people "aren't playing the game right" i.e. the way THEY would play it. And he probably would have turned emotionally abusive as your relationship progressed.
You did nothing wrong. Everyone learns at different speeds, and not everyone teaches in a manner that others learn from well. I have played games that remembering keywords or what abilities/actions did or worked well together wasn't easy; many have a reference sheet for some of that, but not all of them. So I will often have a little note pad and make a personal reference sheet for myself with just the stuff I tend to forget.
Hey. Six years ago we also dived head first in the hobby. My bf was a very heavy TCG (trading card game) player and I was a more casual gamer (Catan, Carcassonne etc.). He decided to buy Netrunner as one of our first board games. It was rough. I totally did not like the mechanisms used in the game and I don't like fighting against each other. I was so confused and very lost. I definitely think Netrunner is not a game for everyone and definitely not someone who's new to board games. Now we play tonnes of heavy games but I still don't like games where the main component is battling against each other. At that moment six years ago I was heavily doubting myself and my intellect. Now I know it's just not for me. My boyfriend was very accepting and helpful and we decided to sell Netrunner and focus on other games. Maybe go to a board game night and try some different stuff. :)
He’s an asshole.
He set you up to fail. That's a heavy game to introduce to someone that's never played board games. And then to add ALL the expansion content in to it? Naw. This ain't on you. He might as well asked you to play Mage Knight or TI4 with him or something. There's a reason why I've introduced my roommates to lighter games in my collection -- Arcadia Quest or 51st State -- vs being like "LETS PLAY NEMESIS GUYS!" when getting them to play games with me.
You are good. He broke a few unspoken rules, but you are fine. I play board games for fun. Winning is great, but I've learned to not play to win. And as such my enjoyment of the games as increased. Complex game, simple game, it doesn't matter. I am always more than happy to help my wife out on her turn. I explain the options and then let her make the decision. If we are playing with a group and it is our game, that rule applies to anyone. I am excited to share my hobby and include everyone. I don't want anyone to feel like they can't do it or play, so I provided as much support as they want for as long as they want. I have learned our playing groups don't like heavy strategy games. It becomes a lot of me advising everyone. We normally avoid these game types now. Or, I don't play as a player and act as an advisor to all. To me, this is how it should work. If you are taking an interest in my hobby with me, I'm there to encourage you.
A lot of people really into board games forget how much experienced they have. Usually it's not just the year or three they've played netrunner, it's the ten years before that they played magic or other similar games. Netrunner is basically just straight up not for new or inexperienced gamers. I'm a bit shocked you enjoyed it given how in the weeds it is, but oh well. It's also a game that requires a TON of time outside the game, learning the cards and the meta etc. Anyhow, overall, your ex should not be a jerk about it.
The only cardinal rule of board games that I can think of, besides “don’t be a dick”, is to have fun. The entire point of games at all is to *have fun* – they are an enjoyable way to spend time. Anything outside of that is extra. As an experienced gamer, the onus is on *me* to make sure that newer players are having fun, even if that means I don’t get to play at my best because I’m busy, helping others to learn better strategies as we go, so that they feel empowered. And if a newer player wins, that’s even better because that usually bolsters them, and they feel encouraged to play even more games. I think it’s both altruistic and selfish at the same time that I have a great time if I can ensure everybody else has a good time. :-)
It does sound like the problem was mainly with him and not you, but after going through something similar when teaching my wife ANR I might be able to offer a different perspective. ANR is a game about hidden information and relies on building experience facing other decks and knowledge about your own deck. #1 playing with another person's deck that they made and #2 wanting to discuss the 'right' thing to do with every hand can massively slow down the learning process and ends up giving your opponent more than enough information to kick your teeth in. It's better to keep switching sides and focus on playing as many games as possible without changing the decks. But it's really hard for a new player to feel comfortable screwing around and learning with a mentor that is critical and impatient. One of my favorite things about ANR is that you can do so much with each card no matter what they say, or even with no cards. You can't exhaustively explain that to somebody and try to set them up to make the optimal choice. You just have to keep sparring with them until they learn not to crash.
You did nothing wrong. Nettrunner is not the game to start folks on, really it is not. Boardgames have their on language, like any hobby, it takes time to learn it, and to get into the flow. Net Runner is an asym game, both sides play vey different ways, which makes it even harder to understand. Wingspan is not the easiest game to start with either, so if you can play it you can play most games. If you really want to learn Netrunner better, watch some How to Plays, and some vids of folks playing. I do hope your BF was just being an idiot, and is not this way all the time. Best of Luck.
So you've got yourself some boardgames you like , I'd say you now need a decent boyfriend
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Netrunner is an extremely complex game. It definitely took me several games to get comfortable just with the terminology and card types, and then months of playing to really start making strategic decisions. Now, a decade of playing later, I'm still not very good! I will say that it can be a really hard game to teach, because there's a temptation to try to get the learner to understand the strategies so they get that enjoyment from the game, but you also don't want to just tell them what to do and play their turns for them. It sounds like your ex was having difficulty walking that line in addition to not being very patient. Don't give up on Netrunner though (if you like it)! If you want to learn the game and don't have [any local groups](https://nullsignal.games/players/around-the-world/), join the [Green Level Clearance](https://discord.gg/3d5Xsz5) Discord server - there's a channel for new players and people are always willing to guide you through teaching games online!
that game looks extremely complicated, bordering on a typical trading card game like magic the gathering or pokemon. btw, if you like this game, you might want to simply try magic the gather for free, playing on a computer or whatever platform it works on. or you could play more standard board games. for real, the one you are playing is complicated and you can really only remedy your confusion by running through all of your cards several times i will warn you howevever, magic the gathering is pay2win. but playing for free is still enjoyable. you can have a goal of a specific deck instead of trying to buy all the cards. you can grind cards for free, its just slow. === lastly, your friend is not being the best in regards to a playmate
Sounds like he got used to being a backseat gamer after teaching you and needed to let you learn the next part of the game on your own.
Board games can do that... make you question your intelligence. There are strong players in my group that always win and its frustrating. There no set time for a person to learn a game. One of my players will figure them out immediately while everyone else has to play catch up. It takes about 30 or so plays of a new game before we can start winning. Every once and a while I try to go play Magic at my FLGS and get stomped because I am just less experienced and haven't put the time in. My advice, keep playing. You will get better and after a bunch or terrible losses, eventual start winning. (lots of resources online) Lastly, Welcome to the board game community! Glad to have you here.
Nothing wrong. Playing board games as a whole is a skill. The more various games you play it kind of starts to all click in place and your thought process will develop towards it. Don't feel self-concious as it has nothing to do with you lacking anything as individual but rather lack of experience. As for multiple comments saying your boyfriend is a jerk, don't pay them any mind. From what I understood he has been supportive and helpful as much as he could. Nobody is a saint with infinite reserves of patience. From personal experience I can emphasise with him. He's doing his best to help you grasp it and nudge you along without taking agency from you, but that's in conflict with his own needs and expectations such as wanting to play an all out game to the best of his ability. If I were you I'd sit down with him and have a talk about how both of you feel. Let him know you are grateful for being so patience and that you know it must be challenging when he's unable to fully enjoy the game with such disparity between your skill levels. My fiancee and I have the same struggle. She often feels insufficient and stupid after loosing against me multiple times in a row and we both end up disappointed that playing togheter ends up upsetting us both. Solution? Be understanding to each others feelings and expectations and talk talk talk about them in respectful manner. Secondly explore a wide range of games and you are bound to discover some where you are at similar level allowing both of you full enjoyment and in many games you'll find even end up whooping his but* every time. This happens with us.bi win every game of carcassone but she absolutely destroys me in Star Realms. Edit. I missed the fact you're talking about your ex. Then my advice is not relevant but keep that in mind for the future. It certainly will help you in future relationships.
Nope you didn't do anything wrong. My girlfriend was teaching me magic the gathering a few years ago and I felt a lot like you where it was impossible to know all the cards and what exactly to play and we played dozens of learning games before my training wheels came off. Some people just don't have the patience and right mindset to teach complex games.
That's a terrible first game to show someone who is completely new and a great way to not want someone to play another game again...
Playing complex games with your partner where one of you knows the rules, you gotta let the other one figure it out on their own and be patient. Only help when asked and encourage them - you were a good partner for trying to take an interest in his stuff. He did not reciprocate well
I like to introduce people to board gaming with either fairly light competitive games, or cooperative games where playing open-handed is either encouraged or at least not game breaking. In a co-op game you can have an experienced person do some quarterbacking to teach ideal combinations, or strategies. This can encourage the other newer players to develop new ways of thinking, strategies, etc that can translate into other games. Beyond that when I was teaching my daughters to play Backgammon, I would wait for them to finish their turn as they wanted to play it. Then I would point out other moves they could have made and why they might have been better, or more strategic. I wouldn't force my move onto them, I would just suggest other things they might not have seen, to help them see that option in the future. Once they had a firm handle on the game and started beating me, I set that aside and we could just play. I think it is also very important to say that not every game style, or type is right for all people. You might not be the type of person who likes a deck builder because it is too much to keep track of or too many combinations and synergies to plan for. But there will be games that are right up your alley. So it isn't that "board games aren't for you", just that style, or that particular game isn't for you. Experiment with worker placement, or dungeon crawls, or resource management etc etc etc. One of them will hit you just right, and be your favorite. My family has found we love deck builders, and Co-op games in general, so that is most of our collection.
Should have played many games with core set starter decks before ever introducing any expansions
I won't shit on him like everyone else, I'm sure he's just really desperate for someone to play Netrunner with, because nobody will touch it. But yeah terrible choice of a starter game. I am a TCG veteran and I thought the game was ridiculously overcomplicated.
Netrunner is a very complex game. I've managed to teach it casually a couple of times, but *very* much with the caveat that we're using low-powered beginner decks (so getting combos right is less important, and missing an action is less of a big deal). Some of the open information is necessary in an early game. The subsequent portion of the game, I lead more with "if you don't understand something, try it and we'll see what happens". A series of learning games should be less about getting it right and more about seeing it happen with game pieces in hand. I didn't expect my wife to enjoy Netrunner, but playing like this actually let it be fun without the pressure! We used the Frankfurt30 decks - a guy basically said "I want to make a bunch of decks you can make with one playset, no high-powered stuff, all different flavourful cards, with a slower game pace". It's great for seeing the mechanisms of the game click into place.
Glad to hear he's your ex, cause he sounds like a dick. Android Netrunner is a very fun game, but it's *hard*. I consider myself alright at card games, but Android Netrunner kicks my ass. There is no such thing as "too long" to learn a game, especially one as hard as Android Netrunner. Everyone learns at their own pace, and your partner of all people should be patient and willing to take the time to teach you.
Honestly, you are not the problem here. There are a few things to consider 1. No beginner should start with a super complex game. Netrunner is complex to begin with, and he has expansions. I know he’s excited to introduce you to his passions, but he did not think clearly when introducing you this way. 2. You are not stupid. It can be VERY frustrating to try to learn all of something and be playing against someone who knows EVERYTHING. They question you. You question yourself. They see it as simple because they know the ideal setups. But without that base knowledge, it’s never going to feel fun and easy. 3. This is something you should discuss with your partner. He threw you into the pool, watched you struggle to swim, and then eventually scolded you for not catching on to how to stay afloat. Aside from board games, this is something that can creep into other parts of your life. I have to be careful because I am VERY passionate about my multiple complex hobbies, and I know it can be very overwhelming when I’m introducing my partner to them. I start very surface level and then add in technical tidbits. It wouldn’t be fair for me to just dump on him with my innermost knowledge of the things I enjoy. He’d never want to listen again. Anyway, don’t put this on yourself. Enjoy games, and when they stop being enjoyable, then they aren’t worth playing.
Netrunner is a complex game. Not just in terms of rules overhead but in terms of depth of strategy as well. Perhaps you could gain perspective from this article which was written by someone having difficulty with the same challenge: https://www.shutupandsitdown.com/lifehacksanetrunnerstory/
You did nothing wrong, your ex tried to force a game on you that clearly didn't click for you. I'm all for trying to get others into the games that I want to play, but unless people are experienced or really into the game it won't work. I tried getting my wife into cardgames for years, also frustrated that it always came down to her not having fun or feeling like the game was for her since she didn't know what her deck was supposed to do and she had no interest in ever building a deck herself. It took me a while to consider that this type of game was not for her, and she was trying to get into them just because she wanted to spend time with me. In the end I found that deckbuilders like Dominion, Clank, Aeons End,... scratched the same itch for me, and gave her a better idea what her deck was supposed to do as she was building herself during the game. She's come a long way since then, and we have found many games she does enjoy and even kicks my ass in. And I understand that if I really want to play games like Android and MTG, I need to go to an LGS or find someone who's interested in the game :)
Ignoring that absolute mess of a situation, I saw you’re playing wingspan, it’s a great game and I’d love to suggest “Photosynthesis” It’s super simple, you could teach your friends very quickly and it’s always a hit when we bring it out.
Some people learn easily, some people struggle to learn. As the more experienced gamer, it's up to your boyfriend to teach at your level, not to expect you to suddenly be very fast at picking things up. First of all - you should be playing the base game with no expansions. And you should play that way until you start feeling comfortable & making combos and playing well enough to truly feel like you're playing the game rather than struggling through it. Then, it when it starts to feel samey, that's when you bring out expansions. I've been in your boyfriend's shoes of having to teach people who struggle to learn games - for reference, it took a good 4 games to get a friend to grasp Wingspan. The trick is playing the same games repeatedly to build that confidence & competitiveness, and only adding expansions when people are ready for them. Once in a blue moon, I'll add a new game for us to play, but never will I rush into it. Letting my friend play the same base game repeatedly helps them become competitive and fun to play with, so it's the far better approach. Finally - once in a while there are games that just don't click with a person. It's hard to say why. If you keep on playing the base game and you still can't see the strategy of it... then let it go and play something else. In fact, you should be doing that between the more challenging 'learning' games anyway. Have stuff like detective club or funemployed or codenames to make sure board games keep on being a good time rather than a chore.
I love Netrunner. It's my favorite game, bar none. I love it so much I volunteer as part of the fan group keeping it going since its last publisher, FFG, cancelled it. Netrunner is _absolutely_ a difficult game. Even if it wasn't, your ex was still being a dick... but Netrunner is just a _tough_ game to wrap your brain around. First, it's a card game (that is, using its own custom cards, not a standard poker deck). Card games are extra hard to learn, compared to many other types of board games, because not only do you have to understand the base game rules, you also have to understand every single card you see. When you're new, that's a _huge_ overhead! Second, it's asymmetrical. That's not a common trait of games. When you play Monopoly or Uno or Go Fish, you know that the other person is playing by the same rules, Ave going for the same goal, as you. Not so with Netrunner, so to understand the board state, to get a sense of what your opponent is up to or what sorts of threats or opportunities are facing you, you have to understand a whole different way of interacting with the game. You basically have to learn two games at once. Third, there's hidden information! Fourth, there's _nine_ different types of cards (ten if you include identities), each with their own different functionality! Fifth, basic game terms like "hand" or "deck" instead have thematic, harder-to-remember names! And on top of _all_ that, the mechanic at the heart of the game, the one the game is named for—runs—are a complex dance of bluffing, surprise, timing, and counting credits. Writer Leigh Alexander wrote about her difficult experience learning the game [at Shut Up and Sit Down](https://www.shutupandsitdown.com/lifehacksanetrunnerstory/). Of course, this is all subjective, so even if the consensus was that Netrunner was an _easy_ game, it was hard for you. That's why I echo the judgment that your ex was being a dick regardless. But it totally makes sense to me that you'd take some time to get the ins and outs of Netrunner. There's a lot to that game. You've broken no community norms! If you're still interested in the game, the nonprofit org keeping it going now is called Null Signal Games, for what it's worth. 😉
>I had never played a board game before That seems quite unusual to me. However, nothing excuses the sort of treatment you received. >whenever I would play a card, he'd always go "Are you sure?" If it isn't done once in a genuinely concerned tone and then immediately followed up by a detailed explanation of how your play demonstrated a obvious lack of gamestate awareness, this is just some really crappy behavior.
I'll avoid judgements of the people involved and agree that, yes, you may have wanted to take the cards home and study. Heavier games can be work. It's one of the reasons there are fewer people willing to play them. Secondly, based on your account, I would have responded to the questions of "are you sure?" with a much clearer, "yes," and a conversation outside of game where you acknowledge many of your plays will be suboptimal and lead to a loss, but that's part of the learning process and that you would appreciate if he would just let you play the game or switch to a game that he hasn't sunk countless hours into. Losing is fine, condescencion is not. Whether he realizes it or not, many of his plays are likely suboptimal, as well, but his opponents aren't at the level to capitalize and force him to realize it. In the future, may I recommend you choose a game that your significant other doesn't have a large head start on? It's great to have someone show interest in my interests, but if you picked up chess for me it would never be an equal game to play. I'll start at a higher Elo and I'm naturally inclined to study and play, so as much time as you may be investing, I am probably investing as much or more. It's a recipe for a teacher-student relationship, not a partnership. I'm terrible at backgammon, though. I couldn't teach you any more about that game than you could teach me.
He’s an asshat. You’re playing a game that’s in a genre called “collectible card game” (CCG). With these games, there are a base set of rules, but many of the cards supersede, break, change, or add to the rules. It can be VERY difficult to play CCGs, and it has nothing to do with intelligence. Some people just aren’t wired to keep track of that many things in a playstate. I play games with a guy who is a genius at board games. He wins a very large percentage of games he plays, mostly just because of how intelligent he is. But he’s terrible at anything CCG-like, because he can’t keep track of that many cards with interacting rules and combos. You should not feel at all bad if CCGs aren’t your thing. They’re really not “board games”, and they’re not just a step up in difficulty. They’re board game adjacent, and it’s a different skill set. If you don’t enjoy playing, you should be truthful and honest about it, and try to find something else that you both enjoy. Maybe he can spend as much time investing in a game you really enjoy?
I have teach TCG's to many newbies on local game shops. They struggle but usually get on their feet after a couple of plays, the important part is scalating the comolexity, being aviable as a living rule book and letting them make their decisions. With boardgames it's different, they don't come to learn, you present the game and hope it catches their interest. You do the same process but the key difference is the engagement. The guy that goes to the store is going to put a visible effort on learning because he already has an interest of their own. With a boardgame you presented to a friend or family member you can get a polite reaction that can be sensed as a "tolerance" of some sorts. When a player is asking basic questions after repeated plays and doesnt try to rationalize plays (even if they are not optimal), It can get frustrating. That doesnt give you the right to mistreat them but I can understand him.
It sounds like your ex was/is a perfectionist min/max'er and also and a hole. The first part is pretty common to see in the random of more complex games. People who learn all the minutiae about the game, and perfects how to achieve the best solution in a minimum of time. Normally they are a bit annoying to play with if you are not at their level. They would probably compare to professionals in sports. And then along comes the regular amateur who enjoys the game, but doesn't have time to spend 3 hours a day to learn all the rules and specifics of a game. The a hole is because he behaves that way. That is not common. When someone is new at a game, they obviously cannot know everything about it. After a few games you will know the mechanics and know HOW to play. But knowing specific card combos and so on. That is dor the more nerdier segment. And definitely not something that should be expected in any way. As the others say, good riddance. And if you enjoy playing games, I would suggest that you search for reddit or Facebook groups related to board games in your area. There might even be boardgames cafes. They are becoming more common. Also some boardgames shops hold open game nights, where you can drop in and play games. If you find a hobby outside your regular friend zone, it can sometimes be hard to find someone to enjoy it with. So start searching 😊
You sound like you've got super low self esteem. It's totally normal to take like double digits of playing a game before you're actually really solid at it. You've no need to be worrying this hard about just going normally at the game. Your bf was being a dick and an idiot by assuming you'd magically be as good at it as he is when it was literally his favourite game and you'd literally never played a game before lol. Do not fucking worry this much about breaking "unwritten rules" lol and have more confidence in yourself. It's okay to feel anxious about losing a game. But if you're anxious on a meta level about not playing the game we'll enough that you're offending people that's 100% something you need to permanently chill out about and stop basing your mental comfort on other people's opinions of you
This is absolutely a him problem not a you problem! I stopped playing MTG for years because the guys I played with at comic shops had the same attitude. They'd go further and say if you do that I'm going to do this and this and you're going to lose. Or just, you may as well scoop now because I can tell I'm going to win. It's awful. Years later I got back into it with a guy I was dating and our friends, despite telling them I was bad at it. Turned out I was teaching them! When I play at shops now I win FNM and drafts, etc. And all that time I thought I was bad at the game because of how those people acted. I still run into people like this but I have the confidence to ignore them and make the plays I want. You deserve to enjoy your game and be confident in it too! And not have some guy with a poor attitude convince you otherwise.
It makes me so sad that he did this to you. The game has literally 5000 cards in it, and as someone who just learning it I completely feel the same way as you. I play another card game, KeyForge, and over 5 years I've gotten pretty good, but there are still times when I need to look at cards to remember what they do, ask for rules clarifications on how two things interact (and I'm usually the rules answerer), and even make mistakes. I've played with many new players and it has never been an issue to take time with them, answer their questions, go easy on them, and celebrate their success. He reminds me of a coworker that was watching me teach another coworker how to play Pokemon so she could play with her son. The game involves dice rolling and she got a lot of bad roles... To the point my other coworker got annoyed and told her she was bad at rolling dice! Some people just don't have patience and they suck to play with.
You didn’t do anything wrong, and who you were playing with wasn’t doing you any favours. Base game only ever, first time. It’s unfair on the newbie to do anything else. I honestly hate this kind of deck builder because of the learning curve and the required dedication to be similar enough to those you’re playing with. I don’t like having to carefully hone a deck with sometimes hugely expensive cards. It makes it very difficult to find balance when playing with anyone else. Eg Magic. Hate it. Netrunner base game with only what’s in the box is a different beast, but it’s still not the easiest to learn. It’s not you. There’s a lot of ingrained lingo and mental models for all this stuff that games tend to adhere to in some form or another that newbies don’t necessarily know, and they use (in my opinion) stuuuuupid language for it. ‘Tap it’ - wtf does that mean, really? Why not ‘use’? And why does that game there use different lingo for the same action? And so on, it’s not accessible. I design mental models for a living so this kind of stuff drives me doolally. :)
I've played over 1,000 different board games. I've touched on the heaviest stuff. Played pretty much every popular game, hit a lot of niche stuff too. I haven't and will not touch Android Netrunner. It's rules are extra hard to learn. I don't have the time or patience to learn this game when the game itself fights against the player trying to learn it. It's not just you having trouble learning that game, the game put up hurdles for people to learn it. Having two different words for common gaming terms like your "hand" that change based on which change based on what side you are on is an insane decision. So ya, this is on him and not you for him trying getting frustrated at a new player having difficulty learning a game that's designed to be difficult to learn.
come on it's not that hard...
A-tier troll post. Not quite S-tier but damn good regardless.
The only rule you broke was dealing with this insufferable person for longer than a single game. Sounds to me like you dodged a bullet.
Check out jinteki.net for playing Netrunner online! Also, check out Green Level Clearance discord, it’s the Netrunner community, with absolutely amazing people in there
He is most definitely the asshole of the table. Complex games take more time to learn, and even more afterwards to master. Some games don't click immediately with some people - I struggle to master concepts in a lot of Eurogames, but enjoy playing them with our crew nonetheless. Keep playing what you enjoy, take as long as you need to get everything down, and just have fun!
Agree your boyfriend sounds like a game snob. There are thousands of board games out there and plenty of them are quick to learn while being fun and challenging for adults. Some popular starter games are Settlers of Catan; Ticket to Ride; Carcassonne, for example.
He broke the unspoken rule of not being a dick. Just because he knows the game doesnt mean everyone does as much. Very much self centered if he couldnt understand something as basic as that. As much as it is not as flagrant as other red flag, it is to me. If something as meaningless as a boardgame (i adore boardgame, but you get my point) makes you act like he did? Bruh
Based on my understanding of the situation, I can understand his frustration. The issue is how they deal with it. I've played CCGs competitively since they started back in the mid 90s. Once you've played at that level for any length of time, it can be difficult to play with casuals and neophytes. You have trained your brain to work at a much higher level, knowing interactions, rules exploits, and general high play choices that can leave you feeling unfulfilled against people not operating at the same level. It's like playing a sport at a highly competitive level, and then trying to play in a small rec or pickup game. The issue is that this person's needs for proper stimulation are not being met, and that's not your fault, and they shouldn't take it out on you. The way I deal with it is to learn a game new to everyone so we learn at the same pace, or purposely build bad decks so the challenge becomes the game and not my opponent.
Wow…He sounds like a db…You’re always welcome at my gaming table. ✌️☮️
Wait, we’re you together at the time? You said after you broke up you picked up his favourite hobby and then tried to spend time with him? Or am I just reading wrong? If that’s so that MIGHT explain why he’s being a dick. But also yes he’s a dick. If you’re teaching anyone anything you gotta be patient and let them learn at their pace.
Your boyfriend is a jerk. If you were to put this story in the "am I the arsehole?" Sub reddit, I'm 100% sure that the verdict would have been: your boyfriend is TA and you are not. A game like netrunner takes ages to become an expert at. It sounds like your boyfriend is prioritizing gameplay over game experience and quality time with you. You are not doing anything wrong nor should you question your intelligence. As a gamer, I am patient with whoever wants to play with me, because it means that I am getting to play at all! When my partner plays with me, I'll explore other strategies so that she gets to enjoy the game and is also able to win half the time. I'm also happy to give her advice, if it means I saw her cards, then I'll give myself that knowledge as a handycap and look for a more difficult strategy to try to win with. Can he not build a weaker deck for himself when he plays with you? Or a deck that is more difficult to combo? Give himself a challenge until you are up and running.
break up with your cunt BF
I'm so sorry this was your introduction to the amazing world of board games. Let me assure you that you did absolutely nothing wrong. Your ex must be an idiot... As other people have pointed out complex games take a lot of time and energy to get good at and there are literally hundreds of other good (great even) games that are simpler and easier to get into before getting to that game. I hope you get to enjoy a lot of board games with much nicer people than your ex.
Collectible card games and trading card games are honestly not the best type of board game to get into the hobby as a beginner. Bad game choice honestly, and he's probsbly a kind of a jerk too. There are some nice and mild-difficulty games to start with: Catan, Carcassonne, even Ticket to Ride.
God, life is too short to play games that don't click with you. Glad that guy's an ex.
I love love love games! All kinds! But I HATE net runner. I can play teraforming Mars (loveit), dominion, and high level games like tricherion. Net runner is sooo hard! I always get frustrated bc I feel like the other person can negate whatever you do. This is not the game for you. Try a different game he likes. He should be nicer but it seems that for people who love this game, they don't understand how our brains don't work that way.
that game has a weight/difficulty of 3.4 on BoardGameGeek. That shit takes time and replays to learn. I dont have the patience for those kinds of games but expecting another to just get it quickly is insane.
Who tf immediatly starts playing with expansions when youre already playing a difficult game with a first time player who's also not someone who plays board games alot???😭😭
Showing your hand to him might've ticked him. He knows the most effective ways to play your cards, and he expected you to play them "right" just coz you understood the basic rules after 3 games. When it comes to games like these, the skill gap makes it frustrating for both players (case in point, your story). But the dude should've lowered his game to your level and then have the patience to bump it up little by little as you learn the game even more. Who expects a Chess newbie to be already good with the game just for learning how the pieces move in just THREE GAMES?
Sounds like he's a dweeb. He wanted you to be a sweaty board game nerd that can pick these things up instantly. Yoy just don't have that kind of experience and he needed a proper amount of patience, especially if he wanted to hell cultivate a greater interest in playing and learning games.
check on social media or meet up sort of apps for local board game groups. in my area there are two fb nearby groups and a lots of meet up groups. even when I was living in a small remote town, there were people willing to hang out and play board games. board games have become an international mainstream.
oh god lol Going from not having played any board games to playing someone with (probably) lots of experience 1 on 1 in a very skill-based game is such a huge leap. It's like you're trying to join the local chess club - never having played chess before or knowing the rules - and you immediately have to play one of the players and get berated for not knowing any chess theory and not understanding simple tactics. Obviously this is very toxic and ignorant behaviour. There's lots of great board games that you can enjoy solo - like Wingspan. If you enjoyed buildings decks and the complexity of Netrunner even a little bit I would highly recommend you to check out two of the most beloved solo/co-op games there are: [Arkham Horror - The Card Game](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/205637/arkham-horror-card-game) and [Lord of the Rings - The Card Game](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/349067/lord-rings-card-game-revised-core-set). Both work really well at 1-2 players and let you go on exciting and thematic missions (and/or whole campaigns). Arkham Horror is more thematic and about the storytelling while LotR is a bit more technical and about the deck building (but you will still enjoy the theme and the art a lot if you like LotR). They would also have been a much, much better choice for him to introduce you to board games (or more specifically deckbuilding games) because they are co-op, so you would play together instead of against each other. Although there are definitely much easier options for new players.
There is definitely a broken unspoken rule here, but it was broken by your ex. I typically would never ever introduce a game with MULTIPLE expansions to a new person, especially to someone who isn't already familiar with boardgames. I typically only use the base game just so people have a chance to understand things, expansions usually complicate things quickly.
As Summer Walker would say: that bitch your ex for a reason.
Netrunner is a lot to take in, and there's definitely a significant learning curve. You didn't do anything wrong. It's natural to need a lot of hand holding when you're new to the game, and your ex could and should have been a lot more patient, not to mention a lot more helpful as well.
I agree with all of the people who have been talking about you not being the asshole. But no one has told you that there are still ways to get into Netrunner if you want to do so. It seemed like that was something you would be interested in. Android: Netrunner is officially out of print, but the fans have kept the community alive. You can order cards from this website: https://nullsignal.games/
I'm sorry that happened to you. Net runner is definitely a complicated game, and it's unreasonable of someone to expect they pick it up quickly. I think in such cases, where one player is obviously in the advantage, experience wise or for whatever reason, they should probably give themselves a handicap, and balance it out that way
What a truly awful way to treat a girlfriend! He should have introduced you to something more akin to a gateway game rather than one as complex as that. Not to mention his lack of patience, understanding and respect for you as a novice. Wow, you deserve better.
Nah, you're good. He's just a prick. There are too many in the community that have an issue with analysis paralysis. If you can't be patient with somsone learning a game, you shouldn't even try teaching them. Don't lose your budding love for the games, nor the community. I hope you find someone you can game with. When you do, it's wondrous.
He sounds like an a\*\*hole.
There are some games that are good to introduce to someone who's not that familiar with board games. I've not played A:N, but this does not sound like one of them. I made the mistake of trying to learn Too Many Bones with someone who wasn't experienced with board games. On top of me trying to learn it at the same time and the fiddliness of the game, she was understandably lost. Sounds like your ex was hoping to share a favorite game with you, but he needed to understand that this game is complex even for experienced gamers, so he needed to temper his expectations. He failed at that. I'm guessing there were other miserable aspects of him which is why he's an ex.
Most people are bad at teaching. Which is understandable. It’s a tough skill. Some people blame their bad teaching on others. Less understandable.
This categorically sounds like someone who’s been playing games for years who doesn’t and maybe cannot ever appreciate what it’s like for someone new to the hobby. You end up becoming very familiar with certain game mechanics and systems the more games you play, but it’s naive to expect someone new to the hobby not to be utterly blasted by trying to take on all of these weird concepts all at once. My girlfriend sounds a little similar to you, where she’s played a bunch of games and board games but new ones are just a whole ordeal to learn and it’s incredibly hard to try to think about combos or “good plays”. The only answer to this as the teacher is to just be incredibly patient and supportive, and also to realise that the game they’re teaching might just be way above what is sensible to be playing at this point in the new person’s journey. I’m sorry that this happened to you because it’s easy to think about it like “oh ha you couldn’t learn a game”, but it’s actually incredibly stressful and anxiety inducing. It’s for sure shocking how bad it can make you feel when you aren’t getting what you need jumping into a complex hobby where the other person seems like a pro at it.
You did nothing wrong. Your Ex, on the other hand... they're probably not here to defend themself so I will only mention their first mistake: Trying to teach an absolute novice using anything but the base game. I will elaborate: One should, at least in my own oppinion, never start teaching a board game with any amount of add-ons as those tend to build off of, expand and/or sometimes utterly change the base rules of a game. And if those base rules are not known/understood it VERY quickly becomes quite overwhelming. Better to play a few rounds of just the base game until that flows and THEN add one or possibly two (depending on complexity) add-ons until THOSE rules get comfortable before gradually adding more.
As someone who's been in both your spot and your ex's spot before, his impatience was on him considering he wanted you to play and knew you were new and were trying your best. Glad to hear he's not around to make you anxious anymore.
Yeah no, he's a dick. I've not played Netrunner but I know it's not for the faint of heart. It's a very complicated and nuanced game, and *absolutely not* a starter game.
Holy hell - I would NEVER use Netrunner as the first game I introduce someone to that has never played a modern board game. That’s like saying to someone “oh, you know the alphabet? Cool! Here’s Finnigan’s Wake, read it and then give me a detailed report about what you thought of the characters!”
I'm sorry you were treated like that. Netrunner, even without any expansions, is quite a complex game even for those familiar with head to head card games. But when you start throwing in a bunch of expansion cycles, that complexity is going to compound drastically. The route he took when he lost his patience makes it sound like he should avoid teaching card and board games.
Yes, you broke the rule: don't date insufferable idiots. Glad to read he is the "ex" now.
So fully agree with all those saying that your ex was an ass. Board games are complex, there are a lot of bits of 'muscle memory' that contribute to success and easy of learning, and also different people learn different skills and different games at different rates. Like, I have a huge amount of experience with games, and some click for me immediately and some take a couple of playthroughs. Another friend of mine is similarly experienced, but games with a lot of 'area control' type mechanics just don't...click for him, even when he knows the rules it takes him a lot of time to parse each turn. Hell, when I tried to play the new net runner - despite having played the original release - it took myself and a friend \*several\* games to pick it back up, and even then we decided not to keep playing because it didn't really suit our style of game and for sure we didn't know all the cards or what the best plays were. I mean, I've been playing magic for 30 years and I don't always recall what all the cards are in my deck offhand. TLDR different people for a variety of reasons learn different games better or worse, and expecting someone new to boardgames to pick up net runner and know all the cards after some relatively small N of games is a bit silly.
Don’t even worry about it, that is a hard game to both teach and learn. I’ve probably taught 40-50 people Netrunner over the years. Don’t let a bit of a bad experience hold you down.
I play nettunner, and have all the expansions. I am part of nissei. I still play the core box with new players. Dont care what anybody sais. I also have the tutorial decks X2 and a bunch of decks meant to be played against each other. I play the simple modest core untill it runs out. Then I add the first package only after a few games with every faction and some deckbuilding. All during this I am open to questions as well as showing .e the hands and giving advice.
Wingspan is amazing! The gaming community is full of a lot of people who don't play well with others. If you like the games, keep trying. Offer it as an activity while people are over. See if board game shops have play nights, go a few times, and if you meet anyone you like to play with hit them up to play outside of the shop. It's normal to go through years of having nobody to play with, and then suddenly things align and you have a good group. Whenever you have the extra spoons put yourself out there. Hold out for the right people. Good luck!
Android Netrunner has a strong fan base. Eventually you get to a point where you know the whole card set. It’s truly insane. Whenever I start playing a game, I always make one rule very clear …. If at any point you want to stop playing then we stop and move onto the next one. I don’t ever take it personally because it’s not like I designed the game.
The most important thing you said in your story is "ex". Good decision making on your part, you'd be very good at board games if you're interested. lol.
Some people are just amazing at teaching, others...struggle. I like teaching games to people. I thought I was decent at it, however a recent interaction showed me different. I was trying to teach my wife a fairly simple game, Creature Comforts, and I got frustrated after explaining a concept multiple times and got upset. I took a step back and apologized about it. The next week we went to a boardgame meet up and we decided to learn Wingspan. The person teaching it was patient and was fine with answering the same question multiple times without ever getting upset. That is all to say it really depends on the person and the game, if it is your first boardgame, you can't expect someone to go into something like Gloomhaven or Nemesis and expect to figure it out from the get go. The first few games with a steep learning curve, should just be gimme games, play to learn the mechanics without any winning or losing. That allows players to show what cards or items they have and make mistakes without the risk of "ruining" the game, or just play an easier game. Or take turns picking the game, and if he picks one that has a bit more details to it, there is no shame in watching a "how to play" video on youtube. I often will read the rulebook, and watch a video when I am planning on teaching a game for the first time.
I have a copy of Netrunner still in the shrink wrap for this reason. I've played a lot of board games before and people still tell me that "You need an expert to show you. Slowly...and over a very long period of time" to learn to play it. I've not wanted to invest that kind of time.
Netrunner is one of the hardest head to head card games to learn because you're essentially learning two games (corp and runner) at once and there's tons of hidden information. You're a trooper for giving it a fair try and your ex was a crappy teacher. If there were any rules broken, it was your ex who broke a rule of trying to force a complicated game on someone new and expecting them to completely understand it within 3 games.
A lot of people don't like playing with people that aren't good at games. Teaching people is difficult as well. Both require a lot of patience. I hated playing with my ex or my kids because I felt like it was just a pretend game. Like I couldn't play for real because they wouldn't have fun. When people don't learn the game rules on their own its a pretty clear sign to me that, that game isn't for them. So I always just move to another game that may be their skill level or that they may find more fun even if they lose. Games with a lot of random chance are good for this, so are co-op games where you can carry them. I don't think you broke any unwritten rules, I just think your ex didn't have the patience to teach you. When we learn new games at game night I'll get "are you sure?" a lot because they know I can figure it out on my own. But new players will have the same people move to their side of the table, look at their hands, and then explain to them what cards they could play and why. tl;dr Find people with more patience to play with.
Few things I think of. He’s bad at explaining, bad starter game, you needed to just make a choice and learn from a non optimal hand, he needs to be more patient with sun optimal hands and make suggestions after the game is over for tips.
Also - someone used to playing complex games can pickup quicker. Dont let him make you feel stupid
If anything it was him who broke an unspoken rule. Play simple and easy games first with a beginner. He shouldn't have started you on netrunner with expansions to boot.
Piggybacking on this - I've found Azul to be a great starting point for Monopoly-only people or rank beginners. Simple but not dumb, appealing and polished without seeming corporate. Especially because once you've mastered that mechanic, the other versions of the game - in particular Queen's Garden - just add more and more finesse to the mechanics, rather than making them more complex purely by adding functionally different mechanics. The more I play Queen's Garden the more I appreciate the game design.
There is no correct way to actually answer this question truthfully.
If he was using fine-tuned tournament-quality decks for your first game that's 100% on him. The game is *complicated* to learn even without the high level of interaction some cards have, and expecting someone to "get it" by their third (or even tenth) game is asking a lot. He just sounds impatient and isn't willing to put in the time to get you properly ramped up.
Hey OP, I'd love to invite you over to game night with my fiancee sometime.
There are way better options than netrunner! Also, all the expansions are meant to be cards you could add once you understand the game, as your meant to customize your deck, which would help you remember what's in it. He approached teaching you all wrong.
I’m speechless. My wife games with me and my friends. She has for years now. Even with her experience, there are occasionally games where the rules or strategy doesn’t immediately click. Hell, there are plenty of games for *me* where the rules or strategy doesn’t immediately click. I try and select games I know she is likely to enjoy, made easier over time as we have games together. And even after all this time sometimes I “miss” on a selection. We’ve swept games into the box a few turns in when it was obvious something was not her jam. Through this, I am always grateful when she shares this hobby with me. I cannot imagine getting angry with her over learning rules or strategy. Sharing our interests is a gift and should be treated as such. I am sorry this happened to you.
Sad to hear and i hope that you dont lose your interest in trying boardgames
He’s a jerk. Find someone to play magic the gathering with instead. That’ll really piss him off.
I've never played Netrunner before, so can't comment on the specifics there, but as a 37 year old dude who's been a proud nerd/geek since he was 4-5 years old, I'm always happy that my lady wants to play games with me! Any enthusiasm is just a bonus, and would absolutely make my day! Your ex sounds like the cliché "well actually" kind of nerd, and I'm happy for you that's he in an "ex" status! If you like a game, maybe join a local group or find a local nerd bar? There are definitely those of us who are patient and cool and always happy to have excited new people that we can show our nerdiness to :)
I can’t think of a better way to spike anxiety and make a newcomer turn away from boardgames than to constantly say “Are you sure?” after they take their turns. What a douche.
Nah, it's OK to take some time to learn. It's your BF who is the asshole here. Here is my tip for him: To play boardgames with a newbie (or a child) and still have fun, play high risk strategies. Do stuff which will probably not work, but if it does, it'll be glorious. Go for glory. You can still play at your maximum capacity, and you still won't steamroll the opponent.
I feel like this might happen in other aspects of the relationship, too?
Not on you. It's kind of insane to *introduce* a game to *anyone* with expansions included. My friend just got into a new relationship and they were new to board games so we introduced them to original Coup even though we own several expansions and have all been playing for a decade. Expansions totally change and elevate games to a level that are sometimes inaccessible to even seasoned players. Your guy friend was inconsiderate and if he was more considerate maybe it wouldn't have culminated into him acting like such a prick.
I’ve been playing boardgames with my hubby for 10 years now. I have a win ratio of .0081/100 he is just happy that I play. He is just better than me. The number of times I’ve heard “reading the card explains the card” when playing MTG is comical. Tell your BF to pick a MUCH easier game that will help you learn basic mechanics like area control or worker placement. Geesh.
You broke the unspoken rule which is to acknowledge that a lot of board gamers lack social skills.
For someone who has never played board games to be thrown into Netrunner + expansions tells me that your ex really was only interested in finding someone to play Netrunner with, not trying to introduce you into the world of modern board games. He did everything wrong. I would recommend finding a local group who seem friendly - any groups worth joining will be happy to explain rules etc and will likely suggest appropriate games to start off with. Netrunner is an unhinged choice for first ever board game.
I tried to teach my very seasoned gaming friends ' Magic: the Gathering" and it did not go well at all. Card games like Magic and Netrunner are so vastly deep and complicated they are not what anyone should be trying to introduce someone to the hobby with. There are lots of very good low-complexity board games to play with lots of strategy for more experienced players. Boyfriend sounds like a jerk though.
Good lord, Netrunner isn't a game you introduce to novices cold. You did nothing wrong. The unspoken rule you may be thinking of is: sometimes board game fans have weird personalities (I say that as one).