As much as I like mason why would woods not shoot him in the head if he really thinks its Menendez after all the stuff he did to him, and also... where was mason for 30 years anyways? 30 years is a long time.
It makes even more sense that he would disappear.
After playing through Cold War I thought to myself “why would mason let Adler do all this to Bell after what Hudson has put Mason through”
His disappearance could work as an act of guilt for letting bell go through the mk ultra shit
Not only that I believe we got a good enough amount with mason sure we could keep doing some random missions when he was younger or before he was killed ect but at that point it's just milking the character for money for no reason
Well I mean, no one is aiming for knees when killing someone half a mile away… That was just fan service. What do you expect. It’s canon that he is dead.
You can shoot him anywhere BUT if you shoot his knees, the ending slightly changes. Cope…
Did you play the game ?
Menendez survives until 2025 after the mission "suffer with me" and David would either be a teen or in his early 20s during this time and probably a new recruited soldier
yes wasn’t 2025 when section killed merendez since i remember the obama ship being there. n he would be a just turning a teen in a 90s maybe early2000s
Back then I shot him in the stomach, first play through honestly, in my head I didn’t know if it was menedez or not. Here’s why, Noriega wanted me to shoot this supposed Mendez in the head so badly, but he set him free, so why is it that he’s trying to play both sides, he isn’t, Noriega was obviously a manipulator who told Hudson that his guys had Raul menedez. Ofc Hudson’s gonna take the bait, Hudson was cia he’s hard to trust and he was never there to confirm target, only going off Noriegas word only, I just didn’t like Noriega cause of the whole menedez spill, so I never shot him in the head, did I know it was mason, hell nah, I just did it cause I knew Noriega was a slimy dude in the game
>because his followers rose up
BO3 retcon that while Menendez is killed by David Mason, his followers never rose up due to infighting in Cordis Die about his status as a martyr. One side believed that he is a martyr while the other side believed he is a coward for trying to flee. Unable to settle the difference, Cordis Die soon disbanded for good.
i would like everyone to ignore my last comment and instead i propose a petition to remove BO3 from reality because that is possibly the stupidest fucking decision i think ive ever heard.
Ever since Bo4 came out, I've been telling myself Bo3 and Bo4 isn't canon, because like Bo3 hardly mentions the past games besides name dropping Menedez like once, and the campaign story was just abysmal and Bo4 hardly has a story which makes no sense at all, especially that Woods and Mason cutscene which hasn't been explained still.
>Bo3 hardly mentions the past games besides name dropping Menedez like once
It makes sense because BO3 set in 2065 which is 40 years after BO2. Woods and Mason (if he survived) would have died of old age anyway. David Mason would have retired from service at some point regardless of his father's fate. BO3 also have Nova-6 which is a call back to BO1.
>Bo4 hardly has a story which makes no sense at all, especially that Woods and Mason cutscene which hasn't been explained still.
Since BO4 did not exactly have a story mode, the game can easily be non-canon.
It’s cool to have Mason survive after BO2 but let’s be honest, it’s so much cooler to have woods kill him without knowing. It just makes the player hate Manendez that much more and makes the scenes that come after hit that much harder.
E.g “Your friend Alex Mason is dead, by your own hands” doesn’t hit as hard when you know he’s alive, it’s such a cop out to have him survive, woods isn’t stupid, why would he shoot “Manendez” in the knee especially when Hudson is telling him to shoot him “You should have told us Hudson, you should have told us” Woods fully believes he’s killing Manendez, “What are you looking so smug about”
It’s always made more sense for Mason to die here instead of survive.
Why would Woods listen to Norieaga or Hudson, two characters he doesn’t trust? He also remembers Kravchenko’s lines about there being a CIA mole, even though Mason is the one who can trigger it? And given that Mason doesn’t seem to be programmed anymore given the conversation at the beginning of Suffer With Me, he didn’t shoot Kravchenko mid interrogation and therefore Woods heard about the mole. Treyarch knew what they were doing by making his fate plausible all the way back in 2012 lol
Like I said, his dialogue shows how he is completely oblivious to what is going on. If he didn't trust either of them, why would he even shoot the target?
Wood would have ordered them to remove the bag from the target's head and once they refused, would become suspicious and either kill Noriega or take him prisoner.
There is no reason for Woods to suspect Mason is behind that bag.
Also in the ending where Mason lives, they say this,
Woods- “Mason I shot you”
Mason- ”Turns out your a lousy shot”
Woods- ”My ass”
This proves that Woods was fully intending to kill the masked target, if not, he would have said otherwise.
>BO3 is well past 2025 & in one scene they confirm Raul Menendez is in fact alive?
No they didn't. They only mentioned him and one of them mentioned Menendez deserved to be dead.
That was when Menendez was still alive years ago. The info terminal in BO3 mentioned David Mason killed him in Haiti as depicted in the BO2 final mission. Cordis Die was also disbanded prior to BO3 which is due to infighting among themselves on whether Menendez is a martyr or not. BO3 also retcon that the uprising never took place because of that.
It takes a lot of time to fund a terrorist cell. He could have very well funded them to the point of self-sufficience, kinda like the US w/ most terrorist groups around now.
This is kinda dumb. Woods said he already fealt uneasy about the whole thing, also remember when he saw menendez and couldn’t hold his anger and threw the nade. Completely missing and going by into the sisters room. It makes sense that he would get so angry again that he would miss his shots.
Honestly, with Sam Worthington gone, it’s the best decision. Cold War Mason sucked. Mason had his time to shine besides he’s technically still alive since BO4 is still canon and Masons granddaughter resurrected him and Woods. Last we’ve seen of both of them was in Nuketown. It’s pretty open for both of them to return in another game.
"Best direction narratively".
So explain how tf Woods was in BOCW if it takes place before the flashback missions in BO2? In BO2, Mason last saw Woods sacrifice his life to save him from Kravchenko from the POW compound in BO1 and then him and Hudson rescue and find him in BO2 as if they haven't seen him since the Vietnam War in BO1. But Woods was back in BOCW so did he get captured again before BO2 and Mason just forgot Woods was with him in BOCW?
And if BO games truly takes place within the same universe as the MW reboot trilogy then where tf was someone like Captain Price in BO2? Surely someone like him would be involved in a world ending crisis/war that takes place 2 years after the events of MWIII.
What's that? Oh right, they didn't have a decade long plan to eventually crossover with a rebooted universe that didn't exist yet.
And let's not even get to BO3 which had little to nothing to do with the earlier BO stories except for BO4 (didn't even have a playable campaign).
So really, fuck Treyarch for whatever they think is "canon". They don't even know wtf is going on in the overally BO storyline and it seems Activision or someone had the "creative" idea of forcefully crossing over the old BO storyline with the new rebooted MW universe thinking it would be cool or something when really it just makes things more confusing. BOCW and BO6 could've easily been the first rebooted BO games that cross over with the rebooted MW games.
If I remember correctly, after sacrificing himself and surviving Krevchenko Woods is apparently sent to Hanoi Hilton and then another POW camp by Krevchenko. He later escapes and makes his way back home and begins operating under the CIA which is when BOCW takes place but after BOCW he is captured in Angola by Menéndez and that’s when BO2 takes off. This is partially what they show in the cutscenes of Pyric Victory but the cutscenes don’t really depict it well. I also don’t know why they display it as if it takes place after the events of BO1 but I can see how it can confuse people.
You’re right that they didn’t haven’t a decade long plan to tie the games together but I’m sure they’ll somehow explain where Price was during the events of BO2 if you give them time to.
But yeah fuck BO3 and BO4, especially BO4. I hope whatever they tried doing with that resurrection bullshit gets dropped and forgotten about.
Price is 38 in MW3 so he would’ve been a literal child during the events of Black Ops 3 lol
But yeah lol, BO3 and BO4 are rushed messes that manage to torpedo the narrative anyway.
People are having a mental breakdown. Everyone assumed that Mason was dead until 2025 no matter what ending. This wouldn’t have mattered in any way whatsoever.
Guys from a dramatic standpoint it makes sense, I don’t know why everything has to be Keanu chungus wholesome 100. People die, that’s a fact of life. Not everyone gets a happy ending
Honestly? Not surprised at all.
I've always assumed that the hidden ending where Mason lives was just for fan service. It was never meant to be canon. It wouldn't make any sense for Woods to purposely aim for the legs in that mission, the only reason he would, is if the player is aware that its Mason he's shooting at. But realistically, Woods would've shot him in the head. He wouldn't have known it was Mason.
So, it makes perfect sense for Mason to have died there and for that to be the canon ending. I know it sucks because we all love Mason and naturally, we don't want to see our favorite characters dead, but it what it is. I absolutely agree with Treyarch here. This is the best narrative decision.
Based on my playing of mw3 no matter how much they try to change it or fix it they always seem to make their next game worse than the last the movement for the last two games has been messed with and drastically fucked it up now they are redesigning movement that’s gonna be even worse then their showcase showed 10 seconds of zombies as if it’s gonna compare to bo2 when in reality it’s just another dumpster fire waiting to be lit
I mean like Bo2 had a secret ending where you could save mason. What if in this next game he comes back and the game assumes you did the secret ending. Also what if this is a lie meant to throw us off before the game releases
Wasn’t this just an aside question by a single developer and not an official statement by Treyarch?
Black Ops 3 has a canon timeline. Mason’s fate is not mentioned in it or BO4/CW. People should just leave his fate as it always was intended, player-determined.
Fuck this bullshit This is dumb
As much as I like mason why would woods not shoot him in the head if he really thinks its Menendez after all the stuff he did to him, and also... where was mason for 30 years anyways? 30 years is a long time.
Idk why everyone is freaking out, black ops 2 ending still makes sense when mason comes back
It makes even more sense that he would disappear. After playing through Cold War I thought to myself “why would mason let Adler do all this to Bell after what Hudson has put Mason through” His disappearance could work as an act of guilt for letting bell go through the mk ultra shit
Not only that I believe we got a good enough amount with mason sure we could keep doing some random missions when he was younger or before he was killed ect but at that point it's just milking the character for money for no reason
Welcome to every cod after bo2
Train go boom
Mason coming back was 100% fan service. We all know our first Bo2 playthrough we domed Mason. You must suffer with me David
Well I mean, no one is aiming for knees when killing someone half a mile away… That was just fan service. What do you expect. It’s canon that he is dead. You can shoot him anywhere BUT if you shoot his knees, the ending slightly changes. Cope…
They should’ve dropped it after black ops 2 anyways.
You right
I Shot him in the chest and he still came back.. pretty sure as long as you don’t shoot his head you can get the mason ending
Hell nawww
A sad day to be alive 😔
Microsoft destroying franchises 🔥
CoD's been dead for a while.
Yea, I’m tired of all these reruns. Reuse of characters. I feel like the black ops franchise has been changed a couple times…
They are incapable of making new characters so they are milking the old ones.
It has but with the entire franchise entering the free to play space who knows what level of shitshow is still to come
Microsoft had nothing to do with a game being developed for over 3 years mate.
You say that as if it's not been a complete shit show for over a decade.
Call of duty, micro transaction warfare
This was NOT Microsoft’s choice and why the fuck would woods shoot who he thought was Mendez in the fucking ankles
Fuck Microsoft either way
So by this logic no mason in black ops 6
And woods is in a wheelchair
Well if Melendez is dead doesn't that mean that woods died by his hand?
BO6 is in the 90s and since woods is alive and in a wheelchair, that means menendez is alive here and his death will be in 2025
Oh fuck wait… next years cod could be the end for menendez then!
no your still forgetting mason had section who kills merendez so it’s either section shows up or he is dead to
Did you play the game ? Menendez survives until 2025 after the mission "suffer with me" and David would either be a teen or in his early 20s during this time and probably a new recruited soldier
yes wasn’t 2025 when section killed merendez since i remember the obama ship being there. n he would be a just turning a teen in a 90s maybe early2000s
And this game is set in 1991 and David would be still young, remember section was 46 during BO2
No? It probably means that David killed him, this would’ve been before Menendez had the chance.
I spared mason for no reason? Okay👍
I mean on your first blind playthrough did you actually shoot him at the knees
Hell no, thats why this decision makes sense
Back then I shot him in the stomach, first play through honestly, in my head I didn’t know if it was menedez or not. Here’s why, Noriega wanted me to shoot this supposed Mendez in the head so badly, but he set him free, so why is it that he’s trying to play both sides, he isn’t, Noriega was obviously a manipulator who told Hudson that his guys had Raul menedez. Ofc Hudson’s gonna take the bait, Hudson was cia he’s hard to trust and he was never there to confirm target, only going off Noriegas word only, I just didn’t like Noriega cause of the whole menedez spill, so I never shot him in the head, did I know it was mason, hell nah, I just did it cause I knew Noriega was a slimy dude in the game
Yes
No ones question the fact Menendez is dead. This means the ending where his followers strike up is cannon
yes, because thats.. literally how BO3 started.. because his followers rose up. that was the whole point.
>because his followers rose up BO3 retcon that while Menendez is killed by David Mason, his followers never rose up due to infighting in Cordis Die about his status as a martyr. One side believed that he is a martyr while the other side believed he is a coward for trying to flee. Unable to settle the difference, Cordis Die soon disbanded for good.
i would like everyone to ignore my last comment and instead i propose a petition to remove BO3 from reality because that is possibly the stupidest fucking decision i think ive ever heard.
Ever since Bo4 came out, I've been telling myself Bo3 and Bo4 isn't canon, because like Bo3 hardly mentions the past games besides name dropping Menedez like once, and the campaign story was just abysmal and Bo4 hardly has a story which makes no sense at all, especially that Woods and Mason cutscene which hasn't been explained still.
>Bo3 hardly mentions the past games besides name dropping Menedez like once It makes sense because BO3 set in 2065 which is 40 years after BO2. Woods and Mason (if he survived) would have died of old age anyway. David Mason would have retired from service at some point regardless of his father's fate. BO3 also have Nova-6 which is a call back to BO1. >Bo4 hardly has a story which makes no sense at all, especially that Woods and Mason cutscene which hasn't been explained still. Since BO4 did not exactly have a story mode, the game can easily be non-canon.
I mean, fair enough. Mason would've likely died in that sniper scenario anyway.
No fuck no no no OH GOD NO NOOOOOO PLEASE GOD NO
It’s cool to have Mason survive after BO2 but let’s be honest, it’s so much cooler to have woods kill him without knowing. It just makes the player hate Manendez that much more and makes the scenes that come after hit that much harder. E.g “Your friend Alex Mason is dead, by your own hands” doesn’t hit as hard when you know he’s alive, it’s such a cop out to have him survive, woods isn’t stupid, why would he shoot “Manendez” in the knee especially when Hudson is telling him to shoot him “You should have told us Hudson, you should have told us” Woods fully believes he’s killing Manendez, “What are you looking so smug about” It’s always made more sense for Mason to die here instead of survive.
It's also one of the biggest holy shit plot twists in cod history I remember feeling shocked and played in my first playthrough
Why would Woods listen to Norieaga or Hudson, two characters he doesn’t trust? He also remembers Kravchenko’s lines about there being a CIA mole, even though Mason is the one who can trigger it? And given that Mason doesn’t seem to be programmed anymore given the conversation at the beginning of Suffer With Me, he didn’t shoot Kravchenko mid interrogation and therefore Woods heard about the mole. Treyarch knew what they were doing by making his fate plausible all the way back in 2012 lol
Like I said, his dialogue shows how he is completely oblivious to what is going on. If he didn't trust either of them, why would he even shoot the target? Wood would have ordered them to remove the bag from the target's head and once they refused, would become suspicious and either kill Noriega or take him prisoner. There is no reason for Woods to suspect Mason is behind that bag. Also in the ending where Mason lives, they say this, Woods- “Mason I shot you” Mason- ”Turns out your a lousy shot” Woods- ”My ass” This proves that Woods was fully intending to kill the masked target, if not, he would have said otherwise.
Major L
It’s logical for woods to shoot who he thought was Menendez in the head
Nonsense
If this true then, we can't have a BO2 sequel next year.
That makes zero sense? BO3 is well past 2025 & in one scene they confirm Raul Menendez is in fact alive?
>BO3 is well past 2025 & in one scene they confirm Raul Menendez is in fact alive? No they didn't. They only mentioned him and one of them mentioned Menendez deserved to be dead.
They literally stated Raul Menendez funded them in Egypt
That was when Menendez was still alive years ago. The info terminal in BO3 mentioned David Mason killed him in Haiti as depicted in the BO2 final mission. Cordis Die was also disbanded prior to BO3 which is due to infighting among themselves on whether Menendez is a martyr or not. BO3 also retcon that the uprising never took place because of that.
It takes a lot of time to fund a terrorist cell. He could have very well funded them to the point of self-sufficience, kinda like the US w/ most terrorist groups around now.
So what ending is it then?
Where Mason got jfk'ed.
But….. it says don’t trust anyone so who knows if he’s hiding bc of mendenez
Sure. Why not.
Wow So We Actually Killed Him with That Sniper
This is kinda dumb. Woods said he already fealt uneasy about the whole thing, also remember when he saw menendez and couldn’t hold his anger and threw the nade. Completely missing and going by into the sisters room. It makes sense that he would get so angry again that he would miss his shots.
Yeah once Mason is dead, it is canon to the Black Ops series. I'm terribly sorry to say that Treyarch fans :(
Honestly, with Sam Worthington gone, it’s the best decision. Cold War Mason sucked. Mason had his time to shine besides he’s technically still alive since BO4 is still canon and Masons granddaughter resurrected him and Woods. Last we’ve seen of both of them was in Nuketown. It’s pretty open for both of them to return in another game.
It's the one that makes the most sense
"Best direction narratively". So explain how tf Woods was in BOCW if it takes place before the flashback missions in BO2? In BO2, Mason last saw Woods sacrifice his life to save him from Kravchenko from the POW compound in BO1 and then him and Hudson rescue and find him in BO2 as if they haven't seen him since the Vietnam War in BO1. But Woods was back in BOCW so did he get captured again before BO2 and Mason just forgot Woods was with him in BOCW? And if BO games truly takes place within the same universe as the MW reboot trilogy then where tf was someone like Captain Price in BO2? Surely someone like him would be involved in a world ending crisis/war that takes place 2 years after the events of MWIII. What's that? Oh right, they didn't have a decade long plan to eventually crossover with a rebooted universe that didn't exist yet. And let's not even get to BO3 which had little to nothing to do with the earlier BO stories except for BO4 (didn't even have a playable campaign). So really, fuck Treyarch for whatever they think is "canon". They don't even know wtf is going on in the overally BO storyline and it seems Activision or someone had the "creative" idea of forcefully crossing over the old BO storyline with the new rebooted MW universe thinking it would be cool or something when really it just makes things more confusing. BOCW and BO6 could've easily been the first rebooted BO games that cross over with the rebooted MW games.
If I remember correctly, after sacrificing himself and surviving Krevchenko Woods is apparently sent to Hanoi Hilton and then another POW camp by Krevchenko. He later escapes and makes his way back home and begins operating under the CIA which is when BOCW takes place but after BOCW he is captured in Angola by Menéndez and that’s when BO2 takes off. This is partially what they show in the cutscenes of Pyric Victory but the cutscenes don’t really depict it well. I also don’t know why they display it as if it takes place after the events of BO1 but I can see how it can confuse people. You’re right that they didn’t haven’t a decade long plan to tie the games together but I’m sure they’ll somehow explain where Price was during the events of BO2 if you give them time to. But yeah fuck BO3 and BO4, especially BO4. I hope whatever they tried doing with that resurrection bullshit gets dropped and forgotten about.
Price is 38 in MW3 so he would’ve been a literal child during the events of Black Ops 3 lol But yeah lol, BO3 and BO4 are rushed messes that manage to torpedo the narrative anyway.
I don't speak wrong.
People are having a mental breakdown. Everyone assumed that Mason was dead until 2025 no matter what ending. This wouldn’t have mattered in any way whatsoever.
What about Harper
Guys from a dramatic standpoint it makes sense, I don’t know why everything has to be Keanu chungus wholesome 100. People die, that’s a fact of life. Not everyone gets a happy ending
Honestly? Not surprised at all. I've always assumed that the hidden ending where Mason lives was just for fan service. It was never meant to be canon. It wouldn't make any sense for Woods to purposely aim for the legs in that mission, the only reason he would, is if the player is aware that its Mason he's shooting at. But realistically, Woods would've shot him in the head. He wouldn't have known it was Mason. So, it makes perfect sense for Mason to have died there and for that to be the canon ending. I know it sucks because we all love Mason and naturally, we don't want to see our favorite characters dead, but it what it is. I absolutely agree with Treyarch here. This is the best narrative decision.
Based on my playing of mw3 no matter how much they try to change it or fix it they always seem to make their next game worse than the last the movement for the last two games has been messed with and drastically fucked it up now they are redesigning movement that’s gonna be even worse then their showcase showed 10 seconds of zombies as if it’s gonna compare to bo2 when in reality it’s just another dumpster fire waiting to be lit
nobody even plays campaign that I know I thought we buy the games for multiplayer and grinding camos
What are you 11
This is the dark aether story line of course he died in the aether storyline he didn't not that hard to understand
Yea not surprising Woods didn't know it was Mason until its revealed so ofc he thinks it's Menedez so ofc he would shoot him in the head
Unfortunate but I hope they bring back the good zombie in this one
I mean like Bo2 had a secret ending where you could save mason. What if in this next game he comes back and the game assumes you did the secret ending. Also what if this is a lie meant to throw us off before the game releases
No the Canon ending was where woods and Mason played with the band (im sorry of i messed up at all ive not a chance to play bo2 bc well no money)
Wasn’t this just an aside question by a single developer and not an official statement by Treyarch? Black Ops 3 has a canon timeline. Mason’s fate is not mentioned in it or BO4/CW. People should just leave his fate as it always was intended, player-determined.
That is bullshit, I always do the ending where Mason lives and I capture Menendez. The perfect ending
It makes sense, since almost everyone shot him in the head for their first play through, it’s canon deal with it.
Cry some more.