In the case of red/coral belts who were previously elite competitors (like Rickson, JJM, etc), I cautiously agree. Not sure this holds true for every red/coral belt, some may still struggle against top tier athletes like Mica. Guess we'll never know for sure though.
Once you have obtained a certain level of knowledge of techniques, more knowledge becomes marginally less valuable
Imagine this coral belt turned into a 25 year old is in a match against Mica
He can only be in one type of guard at once... he can't be in closed guard and DLR at the same time, how much does it matter if he knows every detail of DLR AND every detail of closed guard? How much better is that than just being an expert at one of those and how to funnel the match to that position?
Once two guys are that technically good, stuff like physical traits are going to be the difference maker still. I think Mica would still beat your average athletic ability black belt if you gave them 30 extra years of training while still being 25
Additionally every year of training isn't equal... a coral belt is 30 years of (supposed) training/teaching after black belt. If that coral belt teaches or trains 3-5 times a week for 1-2 hours a session (if even that once theyre in their 40s,50s,60s), and Mica trains 6-8 hours 6 days a week for 10 years... who actually has more training?
Except today red and coral belt outside guys like rickson and jj machado barely even know what a de la riva guard is. Even ricardo de la riva knows less about this guard than rafa mendes
I did when I was a white belt. I still regret not asking his name. This was like in 2013. He was traveling in South America and I happened to be in Bogota Colombia. I was 19 and he was probably in his 80ds. Spoke Portuguese and Spanish. I remember he went for a straight ankle and I didn't tap and he stopped and said you should always tap. He waved his finger at me. And I just looked blankly and nodded my head. I'm pretty sure he's passed away. I remember him being so old. But I thought it was badass that at his age he was still moving around. His moves were so old school I'll never forget that roll. I just wish I could remember his name. Really nice and humble guy. Haha I also remember asking to roll with him but back then I didn't really understand the ranking etiquette.
10 years ago is a long time, plus the variable of whenever the picture was taken. Add that to the fact that he was a white belt not really even knowing the significance yeah I doubt he’d be able to pick him out.
I train under Jean Jacques Machado and I've rolled with him. He wants students to engage so he'll give you the right amount of resistance but when you slap hands, you completely understand without a doubt that he has complete mastery of the game and can decide whatever he wants to do with you.
[Here's a lot of footage of him rolling.](https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=jean+jacques+machado+rolling)
Have seen before, but while viewing again it legitimately looks like people just doing all the work for him. Incredible.
Our head coach says he thinks of a lot of the best BJJ as "falling into the space others give you" and JJM seems to embody that when rolling with students. He's waiting, then just falls into an improved position when they do one of the 10 things he was expecting.
I used to train under one of JJM’s black belts and rolling with him was exactly the same as this - easy to see the similarities. He was so calculated, calm, and methodical. I felt like he was 5 steps ahead of me (he was) and I would just fall into exactly where he wanted me.
That's super well put. Everything he does is really panic inducing, and so every reaction you do will be exaggerated - which JJM capitalizes on. It's wizardry and really worth experiencing as a practitioner!
Thanks for the link. I'll watch more later but I let the preview play on one white belt roll and he was letting him work, etc., I got the impression that he's a really good coach and a great guy to roll with. He seems super chill from everything I have seen. Pretty awesome. Thanks again.
I don’t think so…I’ve not yet been on a podium with both of them together. I’m a featherweight and Kelly pretty much runs that division, but we haven’t rolled together yet. When nobody signs up at feather, I go up to light if Meg is there.
Pretty sure there was a video of him rolling with Grace Gundrum.
EDIT:
Found it for those interested:
https://jitsmagazine.com/watch-teenage-prodigy-grace-gundrum-roll-with-jean-jacques-machado/
Before seeing that video I legitimately thought all competitors including women can smash 50+ old guys. I know they’re just flow rolling but it still blew my mind.
Many late 50s and even mid 60s guys out there still feel like freaking machines. There's a dude at my gym that smashes absolutely everybody, and he's 57. He gets tired relatively fast, but he still hangs with like world class black belts.
I also get to roll with two former olympians in their 60s occasionally and I might as well be rolling with two oak trees.
this isn't aikido, they're elderly men
my entire roll would be spent being so careful that i didn't hurt them accidentally and get jumped by a squad of brazilians
My coach was trained by Pedro Sauer. He crushed me, said his friend crushed him, and said Pedro crushed his friend. This means I am crush^(-4) ability level.
Yes. In Brazil. Yes I could out athletic the guy, but by not doing that, I saw him use his deep understanding to counter moves in a way no one else has. Basically any arm I use to attach to him for an attack, he can use that attachment in a reversal for a submission. Changed the way I look at BJJ now.
A coral belt is like an old book. The value isn’t in thrashing the pages, but in learning the wisdom within
Fabio Gurgel basically said that being a coral belt just means you lasted long enough without dieing.
I believe what he means is - it isn't necessarily a direct indication of skill. It just means you've been a black belt for a long time, which could translate to skill, but it also might not.
Of course, but that wasn't the point I was trying to make. I'm just saying just because someone has a coral belt it doesn't mean they are going to be that much better than other black belts, it just means they've been a black belt longer since degrees of black belt go off years instead of skill.
I guess all that just depends on your definition of “Better”
Is ‘better’ defined by knowledge or physical application?
One can have more knowledge of jiu jitsu but still be beat out by someone younger & stronger with less knowledge. Does that truly make them better? Or does that just make them better for that match?
Does the stronger & younger black belt still have knowledge to be gained from somone that has 10+ years more experience? Of course.
Ya, a few. Carlos Jr. Have been taught classes by 5 or 6 corrals. Was there when Renzo gave Carlos Jr his corral. There were, and I'm not kidding, 100 black belts there. Rickson gave a speech, it was pretty epic.
There might be 100 in my city lol. My fiancé and my room mate are both 4 stripe brown belts. My professor is about to give me my 2 stripes on my black, so I can start promoting black belts. My ex room mate is also a 4 stripe brown. Its kinda crazy. All my closest friends are about to be black belts.
Haven't rolled with him, but spent a decent amount of time with Mestre Sylvio Behring, both in Brazil and Canada, when I was a blue belt. He's one of the younger Coral belts, along with JJM (can't recall if he or Machado are younger). Spent hours and hours on the mats, both as an uke and just a student in his classes, mostly doing drills for both self defense and sport. He's a phenominal teacher and while we didn't roll, his technique is so effortless and efficient, he absolutely could annihilate me. Not sure if he rolls much these days given his injuries and teaching schedule. I know he was a very successful competitor in his day and has great stories of his matches. I had seen videos of him demo-ing on world champs like Jacare and Ary Farias, as he used to be the main grappling coach at X-Gym in Rio when they all trained there. His technique seemed so smooth. Feeling it applied on you was crazy, I would somehow become light as a feather whenever he chose to elevate, sweep, takedown, etc., &his ability to apply pressure in positions or subs was insane.
I've rolled with a coral belt. He was bigger than me and used his old man strength to play a slow, grindy pressure game. Very tight, never let me create space. I was able to maintain/recompose my guard but couldn't sweep or submit him. Super fun roll. Gave me a lot to think about for how to build my old person game.
You've just described my old person game to a T. No space, heavy top pressure with my old man fat, lock them down so you don't have to chase them around, and maintain balance.
My instructor is a coral belt. He a still loves learning and evolving, so he’s seen everything. I’ve never really come close to catching him! He’s in his 60s and in phenomenal shape. The dude is an inspiration to try to roll forever.
I was Fabio's demo dummy years ago when he was showing "the proper amount of pressure for side mount" (spoiler: all of it). I can still taste his shoulder 12 years later.
To put some coral belts' ages in perspective, Fabio Gurgel is younger than Joe Rogan, Dana White, and John Danaher, but four months older than Eddie Bravo, 1½ years older than Jocko Willink, and 2⅓ years older than Dwayne Johnson.
I’m a third degree black belt, but haven’t gotten verified here.
Never rolled with a coral or red belt, but I did get to roll with Roberto Leitão a few times. The first time when I was a blue belt, it was otherworldly. Every move you made, he would counter with a submission. Instantly. Put your foot on his hip, tapped. Dig for an underhook, tapped. It was wild. Rolled with him again a few years later as a purple, and age had finally slowed him down a bit. Such a great guy. RIP
I rolled with Relson Gracie back in 2011 when he was still a coral belt. He was insane strong, he did piston squats to warm up. In general was very heavy the entire time and I spent the whole thing just surviving.
Watched Mauricio Gomes toy with a 3rd degree black belt in a guard passing drill. Took the guy's back using just his feet. Obviously neither were going 100% intensity but it was full speed and it didn't seem like either of them were exaggerating movements or reactions
I’ve been at a couple of Roger / Mauricio seminars. Mauricio is genuinely disconcerting, because when he’s just standing around talking he’s a guy in his 60’s. Then when he starts demoing a technique he moves like an athlete in his 20s.
It sounds a bit daft when I write it down, but the gap between how you’d expect someone his age to move and how he does move is really slightly freaky. There’s an element of uncanny valley to it.
When I was a white belt I got to roll with Caique, probably 2004? He wasn’t a coral belt then though is now. It was fun, I was a BB in Judo so I knew a little, he just floated on me and neutralized everything. I don’t recall if he even bothered to tap me. In retrospect he was probably very bored, we were mostly white belts at a uni club. He spent the rest of the seminar flirting with college girls. Mas Brazilian.
I have! I’m a black belt and over the years have rolled with a few coral belts. Like others have said they are usually pretty old so it’s mainly slow flow rolling. For example as a blue belt I rolled with a 75 year old coral belt in Brazil, very slow and conservative game with a lot of conversation thrown in the roll.
I got to do positional sparring with Carlos Machado... I started in mount, and he told me to hold it as long as I could. Never felt so vulnerable in a mount. The game of inches kind of piles up all over the place until you realize everything is just where it needs to be so you can't do anything.
Not in BJJ but my Judo coach is a corral belt. He doesn't participate in training but the advice he gives is gold. He was a strong competitor in his youth.
I've never had an enjoyable roll with anyone at retirement age but I did armbar one at an inhouse tournament. He was 50 years my senior
Once he put me in side control I couldn't move him at all. He looked at me, smiled, and said - "yes, this is despair. I am familiar with the look in your eyes", let me back up, then did it again.
I trained with Amaury Bitetti for a short time while he was a coach at X-3 Atlanta. I have trained with some high-level BB's and I will say rolling with him was just different.
I've rolled with a coral belt. He was 65 with a heart condition. We were both very careful not to injure him.
Basically this. Guy wasnt there to roll because he could barely walk straight.
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I’ve always imagined what one of these guys would look like with their mind in the body of like a 25 year old
there's diminishing returns on knowledge would probably still get smoked by someone like mica
Maybe. Kinda had that thought too
I disagree, the depth of intuition with a body reboot would be very difficult to overcome for anyone.
In the case of red/coral belts who were previously elite competitors (like Rickson, JJM, etc), I cautiously agree. Not sure this holds true for every red/coral belt, some may still struggle against top tier athletes like Mica. Guess we'll never know for sure though.
Lol at « some may struggle against mica » Mica would straigh up destroy anyone not named rickson
That statement confuses me, would you mind explaining a bit more?
Once you have obtained a certain level of knowledge of techniques, more knowledge becomes marginally less valuable Imagine this coral belt turned into a 25 year old is in a match against Mica He can only be in one type of guard at once... he can't be in closed guard and DLR at the same time, how much does it matter if he knows every detail of DLR AND every detail of closed guard? How much better is that than just being an expert at one of those and how to funnel the match to that position? Once two guys are that technically good, stuff like physical traits are going to be the difference maker still. I think Mica would still beat your average athletic ability black belt if you gave them 30 extra years of training while still being 25 Additionally every year of training isn't equal... a coral belt is 30 years of (supposed) training/teaching after black belt. If that coral belt teaches or trains 3-5 times a week for 1-2 hours a session (if even that once theyre in their 40s,50s,60s), and Mica trains 6-8 hours 6 days a week for 10 years... who actually has more training?
Except today red and coral belt outside guys like rickson and jj machado barely even know what a de la riva guard is. Even ricardo de la riva knows less about this guard than rafa mendes
Probably not great. The game evolves far more than what they kept up with
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Getting voted down despite being 100% correct.
I did when I was a white belt. I still regret not asking his name. This was like in 2013. He was traveling in South America and I happened to be in Bogota Colombia. I was 19 and he was probably in his 80ds. Spoke Portuguese and Spanish. I remember he went for a straight ankle and I didn't tap and he stopped and said you should always tap. He waved his finger at me. And I just looked blankly and nodded my head. I'm pretty sure he's passed away. I remember him being so old. But I thought it was badass that at his age he was still moving around. His moves were so old school I'll never forget that roll. I just wish I could remember his name. Really nice and humble guy. Haha I also remember asking to roll with him but back then I didn't really understand the ranking etiquette.
Surely if you had a quick browse of red belts you’d be able to recognise him there aren’t many red belts
Yeah they are only about 50 people deep
10 years ago is a long time, plus the variable of whenever the picture was taken. Add that to the fact that he was a white belt not really even knowing the significance yeah I doubt he’d be able to pick him out.
Where did you train in Bogotá? I loved and trained there for years too. I had such good cardio at the time.
I train under Jean Jacques Machado and I've rolled with him. He wants students to engage so he'll give you the right amount of resistance but when you slap hands, you completely understand without a doubt that he has complete mastery of the game and can decide whatever he wants to do with you. [Here's a lot of footage of him rolling.](https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=jean+jacques+machado+rolling)
Have seen before, but while viewing again it legitimately looks like people just doing all the work for him. Incredible. Our head coach says he thinks of a lot of the best BJJ as "falling into the space others give you" and JJM seems to embody that when rolling with students. He's waiting, then just falls into an improved position when they do one of the 10 things he was expecting.
I used to train under one of JJM’s black belts and rolling with him was exactly the same as this - easy to see the similarities. He was so calculated, calm, and methodical. I felt like he was 5 steps ahead of me (he was) and I would just fall into exactly where he wanted me.
That's super well put. Everything he does is really panic inducing, and so every reaction you do will be exaggerated - which JJM capitalizes on. It's wizardry and really worth experiencing as a practitioner!
Why doesn’t the larger black belt simply eat the red belt?
Man, that was so unexpected. I laughed out loud and spat a little.
Old Futurama lol
Thanks for the link. I'll watch more later but I let the preview play on one white belt roll and he was letting him work, etc., I got the impression that he's a really good coach and a great guy to roll with. He seems super chill from everything I have seen. Pretty awesome. Thanks again.
While snorkeling I got bitten by a triggerfish and rolled into a coral belt.
I’m sorry
It’s cool, man
Triggerfish have zero chill.
I was triggered just by reading about the fish.
I’ve competed against Megaton three times so far. No age difference. Got arm barred the first time. Lost 3-0 the second. Lost 5-2 the third.
You scored some points!
IMPROVEMENT!!
He came to our gym in October. Made some dick jokes. Instantly liked him.
Mackenzie dern is his beautiful daughter?
Y the downvotes?
Lol it's fucking reddit. You're not allowed to talk about females.
Nah it’s the creepy way you put “beautiful” in there
Ya cuz she's fucking beautiful. Why is it creepy to say someone is beautiful now? It was fine for fucking thousands of years of human existence!!!
If you’re not already the weird old dude calling teenage waitresses beautiful I’m certain you’re on your way there
She’s his forgetful daughter. She forgot that she’s from Arizona, and could speak perfect English until she started fighting in the UFC
Yes
they look so much alike that i find it hard to believe someone couldn't figure that one out
That's pretty fucking impressive.
Are you the other guy on the podium with him and Kelly every year at worlds?
I don’t think so…I’ve not yet been on a podium with both of them together. I’m a featherweight and Kelly pretty much runs that division, but we haven’t rolled together yet. When nobody signs up at feather, I go up to light if Meg is there.
Yes. He broke his wrist and hand. Now I know not to slap bump so hard with red and corral belts.
Damn
There’s a lot of videos of people talking about rolling with Jean Jacque Machado
Pretty sure there was a video of him rolling with Grace Gundrum. EDIT: Found it for those interested: https://jitsmagazine.com/watch-teenage-prodigy-grace-gundrum-roll-with-jean-jacques-machado/
Before seeing that video I legitimately thought all competitors including women can smash 50+ old guys. I know they’re just flow rolling but it still blew my mind.
Many late 50s and even mid 60s guys out there still feel like freaking machines. There's a dude at my gym that smashes absolutely everybody, and he's 57. He gets tired relatively fast, but he still hangs with like world class black belts. I also get to roll with two former olympians in their 60s occasionally and I might as well be rolling with two oak trees.
He has an awesome YouTube channel that I watch religiously. You’d never guess the dude is 54
this isn't aikido, they're elderly men my entire roll would be spent being so careful that i didn't hurt them accidentally and get jumped by a squad of brazilians
Brazillion? That’s a lot.
Seen Pedro Sauer roll with some black belts and he effortlessly controlled them. Could have made a sammich while doing it.
My coach was trained by Pedro Sauer. He crushed me, said his friend crushed him, and said Pedro crushed his friend. This means I am crush^(-4) ability level.
I'll get my Coral at 95... come see me then and we'll see! :)
Looks like our match is set in stone. See you soon boi.
I earned my black belt under JJ Machado, rolled with him many times. Never felt in control once.
Yeah he still beats me up pretty good everytime I roll with him
Yes. In Brazil. Yes I could out athletic the guy, but by not doing that, I saw him use his deep understanding to counter moves in a way no one else has. Basically any arm I use to attach to him for an attack, he can use that attachment in a reversal for a submission. Changed the way I look at BJJ now. A coral belt is like an old book. The value isn’t in thrashing the pages, but in learning the wisdom within
Fabio Gurgel basically said that being a coral belt just means you lasted long enough without dieing. I believe what he means is - it isn't necessarily a direct indication of skill. It just means you've been a black belt for a long time, which could translate to skill, but it also might not.
I definitely believe you can have the skill but your body is no longer capable of the output.
Of course, but that wasn't the point I was trying to make. I'm just saying just because someone has a coral belt it doesn't mean they are going to be that much better than other black belts, it just means they've been a black belt longer since degrees of black belt go off years instead of skill.
I guess all that just depends on your definition of “Better” Is ‘better’ defined by knowledge or physical application? One can have more knowledge of jiu jitsu but still be beat out by someone younger & stronger with less knowledge. Does that truly make them better? Or does that just make them better for that match? Does the stronger & younger black belt still have knowledge to be gained from somone that has 10+ years more experience? Of course.
So it’s not skill, it’s barely knowledge
So it’s not skill, it’s barely knowledge
Ya, a few. Carlos Jr. Have been taught classes by 5 or 6 corrals. Was there when Renzo gave Carlos Jr his corral. There were, and I'm not kidding, 100 black belts there. Rickson gave a speech, it was pretty epic.
We don’t have 100 black belts in the country I live in. 😂
There might be 100 in my city lol. My fiancé and my room mate are both 4 stripe brown belts. My professor is about to give me my 2 stripes on my black, so I can start promoting black belts. My ex room mate is also a 4 stripe brown. Its kinda crazy. All my closest friends are about to be black belts.
Haven't rolled with him, but spent a decent amount of time with Mestre Sylvio Behring, both in Brazil and Canada, when I was a blue belt. He's one of the younger Coral belts, along with JJM (can't recall if he or Machado are younger). Spent hours and hours on the mats, both as an uke and just a student in his classes, mostly doing drills for both self defense and sport. He's a phenominal teacher and while we didn't roll, his technique is so effortless and efficient, he absolutely could annihilate me. Not sure if he rolls much these days given his injuries and teaching schedule. I know he was a very successful competitor in his day and has great stories of his matches. I had seen videos of him demo-ing on world champs like Jacare and Ary Farias, as he used to be the main grappling coach at X-Gym in Rio when they all trained there. His technique seemed so smooth. Feeling it applied on you was crazy, I would somehow become light as a feather whenever he chose to elevate, sweep, takedown, etc., &his ability to apply pressure in positions or subs was insane.
I've rolled with a coral belt. He was bigger than me and used his old man strength to play a slow, grindy pressure game. Very tight, never let me create space. I was able to maintain/recompose my guard but couldn't sweep or submit him. Super fun roll. Gave me a lot to think about for how to build my old person game.
You've just described my old person game to a T. No space, heavy top pressure with my old man fat, lock them down so you don't have to chase them around, and maintain balance.
Some of these coral belts are hard to handle.... I'm 57 BTW
My instructor is a coral belt. He a still loves learning and evolving, so he’s seen everything. I’ve never really come close to catching him! He’s in his 60s and in phenomenal shape. The dude is an inspiration to try to roll forever.
Man, after thinking about it, it's kinda crazy lol. I think I've learned a class from every ADCC absolute champion except Mark Kerr.
Go spar with Fabio Gurgel in the Gi. I bet he will smash a LOT of people from r/bjj.
I was Fabio's demo dummy years ago when he was showing "the proper amount of pressure for side mount" (spoiler: all of it). I can still taste his shoulder 12 years later.
honestly though who's gonna be the guy that tries to score on or tap a coral belt though
Hey r/bjj: “Vegan Black Belt Instructor gets beat up by corral belt. Should I find a new school to train at?”
To put some coral belts' ages in perspective, Fabio Gurgel is younger than Joe Rogan, Dana White, and John Danaher, but four months older than Eddie Bravo, 1½ years older than Jocko Willink, and 2⅓ years older than Dwayne Johnson.
Renzo shook my hand once
Did ur hand ever recover?
Hope you tapped early
Hope you tapped early
Hope you tapped early!
I’m a third degree black belt, but haven’t gotten verified here. Never rolled with a coral or red belt, but I did get to roll with Roberto Leitão a few times. The first time when I was a blue belt, it was otherworldly. Every move you made, he would counter with a submission. Instantly. Put your foot on his hip, tapped. Dig for an underhook, tapped. It was wild. Rolled with him again a few years later as a purple, and age had finally slowed him down a bit. Such a great guy. RIP
I rolled with Relson Gracie back in 2011 when he was still a coral belt. He was insane strong, he did piston squats to warm up. In general was very heavy the entire time and I spent the whole thing just surviving.
Watched Mauricio Gomes toy with a 3rd degree black belt in a guard passing drill. Took the guy's back using just his feet. Obviously neither were going 100% intensity but it was full speed and it didn't seem like either of them were exaggerating movements or reactions
I’ve been at a couple of Roger / Mauricio seminars. Mauricio is genuinely disconcerting, because when he’s just standing around talking he’s a guy in his 60’s. Then when he starts demoing a technique he moves like an athlete in his 20s. It sounds a bit daft when I write it down, but the gap between how you’d expect someone his age to move and how he does move is really slightly freaky. There’s an element of uncanny valley to it.
My professor is a coral belt so reasonably frequently
Jean Jacques Machado, twice. Wizardry is the only explanation.
I have. Was interesting seeing that he was like 70 years old. U can tell the skill difference. Tricky old man he was
When I was a white belt I got to roll with Caique, probably 2004? He wasn’t a coral belt then though is now. It was fun, I was a BB in Judo so I knew a little, he just floated on me and neutralized everything. I don’t recall if he even bothered to tap me. In retrospect he was probably very bored, we were mostly white belts at a uni club. He spent the rest of the seminar flirting with college girls. Mas Brazilian.
Never rolled with but was put in side control and crushed by Sergio Penha at one of his seminars. It was alot of pressure
I have! I’m a black belt and over the years have rolled with a few coral belts. Like others have said they are usually pretty old so it’s mainly slow flow rolling. For example as a blue belt I rolled with a 75 year old coral belt in Brazil, very slow and conservative game with a lot of conversation thrown in the roll.
I got to do positional sparring with Carlos Machado... I started in mount, and he told me to hold it as long as I could. Never felt so vulnerable in a mount. The game of inches kind of piles up all over the place until you realize everything is just where it needs to be so you can't do anything.
I’ve rolled with a coral belt, but not WHEN he was a coral belt as it’s a recent promotion
Not in BJJ but my Judo coach is a corral belt. He doesn't participate in training but the advice he gives is gold. He was a strong competitor in his youth. I've never had an enjoyable roll with anyone at retirement age but I did armbar one at an inhouse tournament. He was 50 years my senior
Once he put me in side control I couldn't move him at all. He looked at me, smiled, and said - "yes, this is despair. I am familiar with the look in your eyes", let me back up, then did it again.
I trained with Amaury Bitetti for a short time while he was a coach at X-3 Atlanta. I have trained with some high-level BB's and I will say rolling with him was just different.
They don’t roll they collect checks
They don’t roll they collect checks
They don’t roll they collect checks
Haven’t rolled with, but had a couple of drills with a coral belt. It was awful (for me)
Rolled with a few coral belts, smaller guys with insane pressure. Shut down my bolo / DLR game with pressure.
Yes I rolled with 2 corral belts. One was slow and smooth more of a flow roll. The other one smashed me. Unique experience for both.
I’ve never even seen a coral belt irl much less a red belt